₦airaland Forum

asalimpo:
murder is justified,if there is no God.

There is a God, created in Man's mendulla.

That God is just some few men idea. . .and it is passed down to sheeps who become indoctirnated.

orisa37:
My God is the Boss of Satan the evil spirit and the exclusive purveyor of the Holy Spirit. He is jealous but doesn't want us to be jealous like Him. Consequently, He can murder by instructing any demon of Satan to kill you because you're a sinner, you deserve to be punished and He is the Almighty Authority. Atheists have no focus, no aims and no objectives.

Murdering either directly or by proxy makes your God a muderous monster

Rilwayne001:
This is just too masterful.. Well done sir.

GEJ admitted that elections from 1960 till 2011 was rigged in favor of some aspirants from a party.

Here is his words:

President Goodluck Jonathan yesterday said that there had not been any free and fair elections in the country since Nigeria’s independence in 1960, as what had been happening since then was that people have been “buying and selling votes.”

http://www.vanguardngr.com/2015/01/weve-buying-selling-votes-since-1960-jonathan-admits/

Yaradua was not left out in admitting that the election that brought him into power was rigged.


Everyone know the implication of election rigging. We know what happened in Uganda in 2006, Kenya in 2007. We know how it turned out in the western region and a play back in 2011. And here a man who chose to reiterate what internation communities have said, warning against electoral rigging and fraud is blackmailed, his words twisted and outrightly nailed for political gains. Who knows what could have happened if Orubebe get his way last year? Is Macof going to blame Buhari again?

Electoral violence is ignited by rigging and fraud. It is associated with a huge cost. A cost which must be paid by every souls.

I know Macof is pan-Yoruba. He propagates anything that will make Yoruba as a nation thrive. He will give support to GEJ because he promised to implement one Confab report - something Afenifere was lured with. But one thing Afenifere lacks is foresight. A man who marginalised your people comes to lure you with a greek gift when election was near. How many of his promises did he fulfilled? So why should we believe he will implement his scam confab report?

Macof can support any political sides. That is his right. But he just like IPADs are taking opposition politics too far. They are sowing seed of hate. This would have been ok if there hatred will come with some genuie reason but no, they hate Buhari because he is Fulani/Muslim. That is madness

If Buhari fails, we Nigerians - Yoruba, Hausa and Igbo will suffer it. Buhari has called for making him stand on his toes. He accepted criticism, a constructive one. When every political parties are doing there token to criticize and support FG policies, PDP and it thugs are seeding hatred, sparking ethnical tensions, religion division, political war and deploying every evil devices to bring or make the govt fail.

orisa37:
He who God wants to kill, He makes mad or drunk first before sending assailants after them.

Your God is a murderer.

macof:
tribalism fuels unity and patriotism. not all these things you are saying

Tell us how.

How Igbo hating Hausa/Fulani fuel Unity and Patriotism.

History has shown that the civil war that took millions of lives in Nigeria, Rwanda and many African countries was sparked by ethinical division. So tell us Mr, how Ethical divides brings Unity.

macof:
I don't particularly concern myself with Israel/Palestine. .

I used that as a case study.

macof:
wars will always exist in this world

I thought the nations of the world are ever calling for peace. I cant really say of NK.

macof:
and Today the world's largest religions, the greatest nations and empires have been Great due to the tribalism of its people. ...
it becomes bad when there's bigotry involved

Show us how tribalism has made Oyo kingdom great.

Tell us sir how tribalism has made Igbo traditional religion popular because they hate Fulanis.

macof:
oh and I simply asked when has Religion ever been without bigotry? especially the popular religions
all this long talk not necessary

Religion today are forming congress and bridging divides. Wande Abimbola should have been stoned to death in Vatican but the world has moved away from bigotry. The long story is essential for the Felas that hate Buhari because he is a muslim.

macof:
and to conclude, I resent Buhari for his behavior not his ethnicity or religion
a man who can say "the dogs and baboon will be socked in blood" if he doesn't win an election cannot get anything less from me

This is lie. You are just beclouded with irrationality and not very fair with your judgement. Picking a twisting, heavily distorted and cheap blacmail just to prove your hatred wont help.

Buhari did not mention anything like losing or not winning election. What he said was that "dog and baboon will be soaked in blood if election is rigged".

The statement is not provocative to those who are objective. He indeed stated facts. . .electoral violence in the western region of Niegria was ignited after election was rigged. We know what happened, how many live was lost and properties destroyed back then. Rigging election will make the nation burn. Ivory Coast case is near. This is plain statement and not provocative.

"Dog and Baboon soak in blood" is a Hausa idiomatic expression. The relative Idiom in Yoruba is "gbegede a gbina" which mean "Gbegede will be set on fire. The transiliation of the expression to english change the meaning entirely. To get the message he passed, get the audio record from the internet, play it to anyone who understand Hausa and you will see that transiliation of that statement was what brought new meaning into it.

Rotimi, CPC spokesman and Lai, ACN spokesman have argued it out with Doyin Okupe. It is evident from this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcZVwA3WcZU&feature=youtu.be that Doyin was just applying some coloration to win political points and he was far from the truth.

In short, when you tell your contender that za a yi kare jini biri jinni, it simply means the battle will be fierce. In the case of Buhari, he was promising his supporters from Niger State that 2015 elections will be fierce; or put in another way, the PDP wIll not have it easy. Simple.
http://www.premiumtimesng.com/opinion/5195-buhari_vs_pdp_the_dog_and_the_baboon.html

The issue was taken to the court. It is Justice Ahmed Lemu who had everything settled by ruling that PDP’s rigging machine provoked the violenve. So where does Buhari statement comes in?

You do not understand Hausa language. You do not listen to the audio record in Hausa language. You even went far lying on the person of Buhari. You are running around looking for false, dubious and cheap blackmail to have your hatred justify. What a bitter heart.

Didnt Asari threatened war if GEJ lose? Why are you not hating Niger Delta and the person of Asari for making provocative statement?

Didnt Wike, Fayose, Gani Adams and those thugs you are supporting today incited supporters against political opponents?

US, UK, and the international communities warned against rigging election. America stated that would bring end of Nigeria. Tinubu even said rig and roast refering to old western region electoral violence during Osun/Ekiti poll. How is Buhari different?

You are just hating Buhari for no reason just like the Ipads you are embracing.

macof:
Why should anyone not be tribalist? so loyalty to one's tribe and ethnic group is bad?


and when has religion ever not been about bigotry?

Tribalism fueled hatred, division, disunity, unrest, war, non progression among society and evil.

What you are simply encouraging is the palestine/Israel like scenario when Palestinians kill Israelis officials and launch attack on their citizens. I believe you like it when people are kill in ethnic war. Afterall, it is loyalty to one ethnic group. It is loyalty to hate the fulanis because they have a sitting president. What has Buhari done to warrant your hatred from you, Afenifere and IPOD?

Religion by definition is an institution that bind people. Hating on others because they practise another religion is simply madness. The world has moved away from bigotry. . .this is why we have organisations bringing different religion head under one umbrella. What is Wande Abimbola, a Babalawo doing in Vatican, a sacred city of the catholic? The world has done away with seeing Islam as evil just because one belong to another religion. The world has moved away from lashing other religion member with harsh word in internet forum just because they do not practise your spirituality. Religion is not evil, evil is embelled in individual heart. Buhari can be a muslim but no one care. He shall be judged not by the religion he belong to but by his personal behaviour.

MonPro:
You are wrong, Buhari is still a monstrous bigot who have succeeded in turning the better south into a 'vigilant conservative people' whom you now mistake as Bigots. Buhari's Bigotism abd tribalism begets even greater Ethno-religious conservatism, we'll need it in the better south to keep his co-bigots and zombies like you at bay.
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Buhari turned to a monsterous bigot because he defeated Otueke Jesus which you tribal bigot took as your adopted son. One need to add Igbo stupidi.ty as one of the wonders of the world just after the dancing plague that struck England in the 14th and 17th century. This wouldnt have been an issue if this bitter that creeps out of your erosion red mud soil is personal but it is obvious out there even to outsiders that this hating madness and inferiority complex among the Igbo is a ethnic disease embelled right in your gene. I thought Ohaneze are making moves to meet the same Buhari you love to hate. . .

That said, I am a Yoruba son but I see myself as human first. We are not brought up to hate people because of their skin color or tribe they come from. And I need to inform you that I am not a muslim neither am I a christian. I am an atheist who lean toward traditionalism. Your parents have beclouded your mentality with bigotry and backward thinking. You have been sent back to the medieval age where hatred thrive among the people. This is a new age dude, you need to grow out of your madness.

Better start now changing your perspective to live. Hatred brings division and non-development. Fayose is a Yoruba man but his people careless about him. You are the one crying more than the bereaved, insulting everyone that do not agree with your stance. You better do something fast with your time. Contribute to the development of your land and let other people do carry their cross. Buhari will spend his four years as the president ruling over your useless life and people and land as a whole. Your bitterness changes nothing.

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MonPro:
Has your buhari grown beyond Sharia and anti-Eastern sentiments?

Yes.

And are you in anyway admitting that you are a religion bigot and tribalistic mofo?

asalimpo:
You are preaching your own religion here. Humanism.
And you say you are irreligious! Atheism is a religion.

Yoruba tradition spiritualism is not a religion. Just like spirituality is never and cannot be a religion. So how can you say I am promoting a religion? Have you heard this connation "being spiritual but not religion"? That should give you a hint about the difference between religion and spirituality.

And on the othernote, I am a spiritual atheist. Atheism is not an organised instution, has no basic law, guides, philosphy, doctirnes or followership. So how can atheism be a religion?

Religion cause a lot of division in human society. Religion set boundaries for those in and outside the institution. That is we why fellow human hate themselves. That is why christian hate muslim. That is why quran ordain muslims to kill jew and christians. That is why Muslims attack everyone in the world. They is why we dont respect people who do not share out belief. That is why we don not allow adults from different faith to mingle or marry. Religion breeds hatred. That cannot be said about spiritualism that sees the world and everything inside as one.

A spiritualist does not care about the sect you belong to. Ogun worshipper serve Sango today and tomorrow eat with Obatala believer. We are need oursleves to keep human race alive.

A Babalawo does not care if you are marrying a Monk or Catholic Priest. He does not feel concern if your husband is a white or blue in skin. They sometime choose concern in family but outside that, you can marry even a beast. It is no one business but yours.

MonPro:
What do you actually gain from ridiculing your yoruba brother in favour of a fulani brother? Are you a yoruba muslim? The ones that believe that fulani muslims are greater than them?

Can you guys grow pass religion bigotry and tribalism?

Should religion be the basis for marriage?

Alot of Babalawos out there give chances to their wives and children to practise other religion out their traditional spiritualism. Some even encourage reading of bible, quran and vedas. Some pratice Islam and Christianity with their spiritualism. No one will ever stop you from exercising your freedom and fundament right.

Love looks beyond religion differences. Marriage is all about togetherness in one bond. Differences are scrapped and we are bonded by love and compassion.

I guess the Niger Deltans are more about pollution of their land more cleaning it hence their relentless effort to blow up pipelines. Afterall, it is their land, river and people who will bear the consequences of their senseless action.

Why are they telling us? For God forsaken sake, we dont want another Sokoto who will drag the federal govt and DSS to court. You people should kill one of those captured, feed his flesh to pigs and let other watch how the pigs feed fat with their fellow flesh. Since pig is haram in Islam, feeding them to pig will lead them to Hell straight away. Do these everyday and let them watch pig feeding fat on their colleagues till we have them no more in our country

malvisguy212:
I need verse were God anoint israel.

Psalm 105:15 reading from NIV;

New International Version
"Do not touch my anointed ones; do my prophets no harm."


The question to raise there is who are the anointed ones? How do we define anointed ones?

Some actually mistook annointed ones in that context as pastor, kings or judges. Well, the bible will provide the actual answer here.

Reading from the same verse from a different version.

New Living Translation
"Do not touch my chosen people, and do not hurt my prophets."

We got to know that the anointed ones are the chosen people. And by definition, anointed one is the same as chosen one. Now the question that rise after is who are the chosen people?

Deuteronomy 7:6
New International Version
For you are a people holy to the LORD your God. The LORD your God has chosen you out of all the peoples on the face of the earth to be his people, his treasured possession.

Isaiah 44:1
But now, listen to me, Jacob my servant, Israel my chosen one.

A very similar verse is Deuteronomy 14:2. In 1 Chronicles 16:13, Israel is called "His chosen ones": David wrote Psalm 33:12; 105:6, 43. And Isaiah records these words from the Lord: Isaiah 41:8-9; 43:10,20; 44:1. In Isaiah 48:12, the Lord refers to them as "My called." And Daniel calls them "His chosen people" (Daniel 11:15). From the above, it can be seen that the phrase, "chosen people" definitely applied to Israel.

malvisguy212:
the different between jesus and the rest anointed king, it was God, Himself who anointed jesus, All other kings were anointed by prophets/priest.

Ogbeni take your lies to those who do not understand bible.


God himself choosed and annoited Israel as a nation of priest. Even Jesus called them the chosen ones. So tell us sir, are these chosen ones or annoited ones not Christ? Are they different from Jesus?

ifenes:
Where did you know me from?

Nairaland of course.

Back then, you were very polite and choose your words carefully in every argument. This brought respect to your person. But now, you are just bitter, throw insult here and there. What went wrong?

ifenes:
You are a fool

Is this the Ifeness I know long ago? This guy has really changed

MizJanet:
FOLYKAZE thanks, I admire ur contribution. But as u indicate above the problem lies in the word ALL.

GOD over all indicates the Supreme being or highest authority. For example at Ephesians 6:4, the verse said the Father is God over all... Does this not indicate supremacy? If so why do xtians have to Change the meaning of God over all at Romans 9:5,?

I think all there is simply the nation of men, or church, or believers.

It does not necessary mean Jesus is the supreme God

MizJanet:


All this twisting and whining doesn't appeal to commonsense , you said Jesus have a God this automatically means he can't be God over ALL (or don't you know God over ALL means supreme being? ) Something is wrong with ur Bible at Romans 9:5,


Am not surprised though

I think you have made up your mind here. You seriously dont want to listen to the other people argument but only here to ridicule, heat up argument and lash out on the christians.

Ayoku stated that there are many Gods. He could believe in the trinity but I see that as polytheism. He acknowledge that Jesus is God but there is still another God which is supreme. Apostle Paul stated in 1 Cor 8:5 that there are many God both in heaven and earth. Even Jehovah himself acknowledge that there are other Gods.

Now, the problem here lies in the word 'all'. The all there does not mean totality of both the heaven and earth. All there is simply the church or total believers

Anyone with any common sense will recognize that each religion claiming to have the only telephone line to god

Wrong Number Wrong Number

too much of PK dey worry OP

Christ is not essentially Jesus. Christ is from the word chi which the Yoruba people call Ori or simply consciousness.

On a general note, Christ mean the annoited or chosen one. This is a title and not necessary refer to Jesus. Even though Christians to interchange the word Christ for Jesus, Jesus is not the only annoited person.

And yes, ye are Gods.

wheredemdey:
You just showed the online world that you are bereft of any known values and good tidings....of all the people or things to hv respect for it is this irredeemable passive unreliable she-male abagworo that you claim to hv an iota of respect for...shame on you

I dont know respect for person and attribution of value for something has to be from your scope of view.

You need to work for your own respect. You are nobody here

Brs abeg no make me lose my respect for you. What you posted up there is arrant non-sense.

So can we now share some wines?

Quincyolarks:
I read everything. Nice read! I hope my fellow countrymen will pick a few lesson from this epistle.

It is an epsitle but it worth reading. I saved the article in my phone some years back and I never get bored reading this very article. It capture the tolerance part of Yoruba spirituality.

I remember when I was a kid. Growing up in a multi cultural/religion society gives me the best of experiences. I have friends which family are majorly hunter and blacksmith, these people worship Oogun. Some family friend worship Osanyin. Some were worshipping Imole while some worship Ifa. The Igbo counterparts do bring out their masqurades. The Urhobos celebrate besides the river-bank in their festival called Egbe. The Hausas are not left during the Salah festival. The customs, colorful dresses, drums, beautiful dance steps and the great love in air are all what can not be forgotten. What makes this lot interesting is the celebrants who happen to be Christians, muslims and secularists. Tolerance was embelded in everyone heart.

I grew up in C/S church. My parents did not stop me from moving out with pagan friends. I eat and sleep with muslims. When my friends and their dad were going for hunting game, we follow them, keep dead animal in bag and move into huts to spend the night. When we return home, we eat, worship Ogun and on sunday flock to church. This church thing followership includes muslim friends. We turn mosque to playground and excuse when it is prayer time. Our parents did not complain. . .tolerance begat love. . . .a very strong one.

Even for the fact that Yoruba spirituality tolerate these new imported religion, it faced lot of attacks from them. Church preaches against our spirituality. They call it demon cult. Mosques raised voice against it. Enmity was breeded into the society. Christians attack with crusades, witch-hunting campaign and destruction of shrine sites. Muslims attack with jihad. Love was lost. Love was killed. Christian family do not relate with Muslim family. Muslim hate on Pagans. However, Yoruba spirtualism look beyond religion sect. . .it look at human nature.

I took a friend to a Babalawo. This friend complained he cannot do some rituals because he is a christian. The Babalawo replied him that Ifa does not look after religion but nature. When we were born, there is no tag on us that indicate we would become Christian or Muslim or Pagan. Even though if we join any religion, Tolerance is the ultimate where love, compassion and peace will reign.

lepasharon:
What happened to paragraphs....SHET

Heelo Dear. Sorry for the difficulties you encoutered while reading the article. I posted the article using my phone. I have applied some paragraphs and I hope you will enjoy reading it now.

Pastor, do you know this guy before or there is something else about him that pissed you off? Bros, you are becoming too raw on him. I have never seen you loose your cool. It is just an argument. . . .your points are what we need. You dont need to drag with a pig in the mud.

http://saharareporters.com/column/religious-intolerance-lessons-yoruba-%E2%80%98paganism%E2%80%99

If you are Yoruba and you are older than the Facebook or Twitter generation of Nigerians, if you are struggling to cope with expressions such as LOL (laugh out loud) , LMAO (laugh my ass off) OMG (Oh my God), and 9ja (Naija) in emails and texts you receive daily from Nigerians in their
teens and twenties, chances are you grew up in a village in Yoruba land where life is suffused in culture, tradition, and a panoply of ancestral rituals and spiritual observances, all instances of man shaping order out of primordial chaos. Chances are, growing up, you partook – as audience or celebrant– in a very colourful tapestry of ancestral liturgies: Ogun festival, Sango festival, Imole festival, Egungun festival, and, of course, Oro festival, the fear of which is the beginning of wisdom for Yoruba women.

Chances are you enjoyed the atmospherics of these observances, partook of propitiatory offal, sang, and danced to a host of inspirational choruses and processionals welcoming the ancestors and the orishas into the realm of unworthy mortals at each spiritual enactment. Chances are you remember the sombre baritone of the officiating Ifa priest chanting: “Orisha Yoruba o, e ma ku abo o”; you remember him chanting: “Aji gini, arin gini, l’oruko Orunmila, Orunmila Baba Ifa, Ifa la o pe, Orunmila la o bo”; chances are you remember the solemn chimes of his
bell as he intones: kango kango, mo ma gb’ohun agogo, kange kange mo ma gb’ohun orisha o;chances are you
remember one of the most famous of these inspirational choruses: the processional canticle of Oro:

Oro ile wa la wa nse o (2x)
Esin kan o pe (oh eh)
Esin kan o pe ka wa ma s’oro
Oro ile wa la wa nse o

It’s been years now and memories flood through the grey mist of time as you remember these hymns. You know that you dare not insult any of the hymns with a translation into English. No European language is deep enough to bear the full weight of these songs without doing irreparable damage to them. After all, the poverty of the English language is what made Wole Soyinka abandon his dream of translating
all of D.O Fagunwa’s novels. The poor Soyinka held a rapid dialogue with his legs after translating only one of them!
But you know that the Oro canticle is too crucial to the lesson that the belief system of the Yoruba has to teach
contemporary Nigeria to be left untranslated. You know you must attempt to capture the soul and spirit of the hymn,
while hoping that the ancestors will not fine you twenty-five cows for this miserable result in English:

Behold Oro! The ritual of our forebears!
Oro hampers no faith
Let no faith hamper Oro
Behold Oro! The ritual of our forebears!

You probably sang this song throughout your childhood and early adulthood; you got acquainted with new versions of it that were mainstreamed into Yoruba popular culture by the likes of Alhaji Chief Professor-Master General Kollingto Ayinla, Alhaji Agba Chief Dr. Sikiru Ayinde Barrister, Ambassador Oodua Abass Akande omo Rapala, and so many other fuji musicians; you sang versions of it that were funkified by your kegite “Il y a” while you were a “wokedly carried” undergraduate savouring “holy water” on campus without the knowledge of your parents. But through all these renderings, not once did you ever pause to examine the song for its philosophical ramifications. Not once did you really listen to what it tells you about the cultural fount from which it sprang. You never analyzed the hymn because you are probably not used to doing a close reading of your culture. You probably never even thought of it as a hymn. Right now, if you are a Christian, you are probably wincing in horror at the “blasphemy” of my calling a “pagan” Oro song a hymn or an inspirational chorus.


If your ecumenical anger allows you to continue reading, consider this powerful line in the hymn: Esin kan o pe k’awa ma s’oro. I have translated what it says and what it leaves unsaid but implied: Oro hampers no faith. Let no faith hamper Oro. Here, we encounter the first indication of the
intrinsic humanism of Yoruba spirituality: the valuation of pluralism. We encounter consciousness and validation of the spiritual essence of the Other. Indeed, we are in the presence of the accomodationist ethos of the Yoruba worldview. For what this Oro canticle hints at and acknowledges is the presence of other faiths in its own spiritual space of actuation. Oro is demonstrating its awareness of the politics of otherness unleashed by the intrusion of two foreign faiths into the Yoruba world. Oro is acknowledging the presence of Christianity and Islam.
These two newcomers are the “esin kan” that are being subtly referenced and advised to live and let live and not hamper older forms of spiritual expression. Oro will not bother you for there is room enough in the sky for birds to fly without colliding. Oro is extending an olive branch to one
religion that claims to be a religion of peace and another that claims to have been founded by the prince of peace himself.


From their history – or, rather, the history of how their pacific essence has been twisted and bloodied across centuries by ignorant and intolerant adherents – we know that Christianity and Islam are strangers to the cosmopolitan and accomodationist graciousness of this Oro processional. For no sooner had the two religions been “let in” – a la Stanley Meets Mutesa - than they began to invest in a sanguinary politics of otherness in Nigeria and other parts of Africa. One began to manufacture infidels who must be put to the sword via purificatory jihad and the
other, tolerating no alternative paths to spirituality, decreed itself the way, the truth, and the light. The draconian take- no-prisoners philosophy of these two religions could, of course, only eventuate in their total blindness to the accomodationist humanism of Oro.


Because Christianity and Islam insist on spiritual rebirth as the only path to God and Allah, forgetting is a fundamental element of their creed. Forgetting is, in fact, the most significant aspect of their faiths that haughty European and Arab invaders sold to Africans as they scrambled to win “pagan” souls all over the continent. That newly-minted born again Christian or Moslem must forget his or her former “pagan” and “fetish” self. Where the Christian forgets to forget the old self, Enoch Adeboye and Chris Oyakhilome are on hand to remind him of the importance of
forgetting: “for old things have passed away and all things have become new” (2 Corinthians 5:17). Only this new self, born in Christ or Mohammed and approved by Europe or Saudi Arabia, is worth remembering. Nigerian Christians go a step further. This new creature must be as white as snow in the burning tropical heat of the Lagos-Ibadan expressway where he constitutes a nuisance to public order.

What kind of self did the born again Yoruba Christian or Moslem have to forget in order not to come short of the glory of God or Allah? The cosmopolitan, pacifist, and accomodationist self in that Oro processional hymn is what is forgotten and sacrificed. Centuries of pluralism and
communalism went into the cultural construction of that self. That self was raised by a culture that taught it to always see the humanism of the other as an extension of its own humanism. That self was socialized by ancestral sayings and adages that always celebrated difference and
privileged pluralism. That self was taught that several roads lead to the market. As that self was being socialized into adulthood, no elder in the village ever told it that there is only one way, truth, and light leading to the market of spiritual efflorescence.

This explains why that self could partake of Oro festival today, felicitate with and share the dog meat of the Ogun worshipper tomorrow, and dine with the adherents of Sango next week. Where this self was a devotee of Osun, it was unthinkable that it would try to convert or kill the worshipper of Ogun. This accomodationist ethos, in a cultural context where difference is valued and otherness celebrated, is what Christianity and Islam benefited from when they arrived, only to insist that the self rooted in that worldview was pagan and must be forgotten. When this self
humanized by and into traditional spiritual democracy is forgotten, the new self that is born into Moslem zealotry can only see an expendable infidel in every Christian. Likewise, the new self that is born into Christian fundamentalism can only see a hell-bound unbeliever in every Moslem. For old things hath passeth away…

Forgetting the old self – which African Traditional Religions insist we must remember - is perhaps the worst damage that Christianity and Islam did to the African psyche and we are paying the price in human lives in Nigeria today. For these two religions repressed the humane, urbane,
cosmopolitan, pluralist, and accomodationist self in the old order and replaced it with a narrow-minded, ignorant, egotistical, proselytizing, and modern Christian or Moslem self that can only scream: my way or the high way! This partly explains the murderous political Islam that holds sway in northern Nigeria and insists on being lubricated annually with the blood of our people; this partly explains the murderous Christianity in the south-south that needs the blood of children branded as witches to feel cool. Welcome to the Islam of Boko Haram and the Christianity of Helen
Ukpabio. Their motto, according to Wole Soyinka: I am right, therefore you are dead! Boko Haram kills people in the name of Islam, Helen Ukpabio murders “witch children” in the name of Christianity because the accomodationist self that could see and value the humanity of the Other in traditional religion has been forgotten. For old things hath passeth away…

Because Oro and other Yoruba forms of spiritual expression spring from an ethos of life and democratic spiritualism that admits of pluralism, otherness, and difference, they were crucial to the survival of Yoruba people in the New World who, unlike their fundamentalist Christian and Moslem cousins in Nigeria, understood right from the bowel of the slave ship that they could not afford to forget the self. They got to Brazil, in Bahia de Salvador, and the white slave master insisted they forgot themselves by converting to Catholicism. The same thing happened in Cuba. But the slave master did not reckon with the accomodationist and adaptive essence of the religion of these Yoruba slaves. The slaves took whatever they could from Catholicism, blended such with Yoruba religion, and gave the world the religions of Candomblé in Brazil and Santéria in Cuba. By simultaneously enacting Catholic and Yoruba rituals in Candomblé and Santéria, the Yoruba of the New World are screaming esin kan o pe k’awa ma s’oro! In Candomblé and Santéria, the Virgin Mary lives in peace with her neighbor, Yemoja; Ogun does not grumble about the goings and comings of Saint Peter; Jesus Christ does not label Obatala a pagan deity. Candomblé and Santéria are inscriptions of the old self into new things. For old things hath passeth away…

Harmony. Harmony. Harmony. Do the Christian and Moslem fundamentalists of the old Yoruba land in Nigeria know how to listen to these things from their “pagan” cousins in the Americas? Sadly, the Yoruba who know the meaning of Hubert Ogunde’s warning, “Yoruba Ronu”, are few in Nigeria. They are mostly in Brazil, Cuba, and Barbados. As long as Nigeria is peopled mainly by selves alienated from the accomodationist and pluralistic humanism of their own cultures; as long as these lost selves refuse to listen to what their cultures have to say about the validity of the multiple roads leading to the market of spirituality, Nigeria will never know peace. I have encountered that pious Hausa Moslem who knows nothing about what his pre-Jihad Habe culture had to say about pluralism and tolerance before Othman Dan Fodio arrived on the scene and decided to rid those cultures of pluralistic and accomodationist values which he demonized as mixing Islam with impurities. This Hausa Moslem even got angry that I asked him about pre-Jihad Habe culture, something he considers haram. For old things hath passeth away…

I have encountered that puny Igbo noise maker on the net, whose deranged mind is so twisted that he spends his entire life railing against every non-Moslem Nigerian who rejects his blanket hatred of Islam. He deliberately takes the murderous political Islam of a lunatic fringe in northern Nigeria for the whole religion and impugns Islam in language dripping with such venom and hate as to make Osama Bin Laden’s language sound like a nursery rhyme. Let us assume, for the sake of argument, that Islam is one blanket enemy that this undiscriminating fool makes it out
to be in his listserv fulminations. What does his Bible tell him? “Ye have heard that it hath been said, thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you” (Mathew 5:43-44). Our friend’s convenient Christianity is blind to this inconvenient Biblical injunction. His Christianity is so skewed by hate that he wastes his educated mind on such brain-dead intellectual quests as trying to determine the exact statistical percentage of Moslems a Christian society needs to accommodate for there to be peace! In all that, our ‘Christian’ friend doesn’t realize how close he is to Nazi Aryanism or Afrikaner puritanism and how far he is from his Igbo culture which advises him to let the eagle and the
kite perch. For old things hath passeth away…

I have encountered that sophisticated and westernized Yoruba who frowns in horror at the mere mention of Oro or Ogun festival. This educated but foolish Yoruba is the first to perorate about “the backwardness” of Yoruba “idol worship”. Combine the lost selves of these three tragic
characters in one African nation-space and you get the combustibility of Nigeria. Am I implying that Christians and Moslems in Nigeria have to jettison their faith in order to recover their lost selves and save Nigeria the spectre of one and the repeated bloodshed? No. After all, I am a practicing Catholic and I have never liked the argument of traditionalists who believe that a Yoruba follower of Enoch Adeboye must literally return to the shrine of Ogun to recover his lost self. The Nigerian traditionalists who push such absolutist positions commit the same error of
authoritarianism and intolerance as Christians and Moslems. They forget the fundamental spiritual democracy of the Yoruba worldview which allowed people to elect which deity to serve and make theirs. The Yoruba who elects God or Allah is in line with this spiritual democracy.

But this Christian must know to draw the line if Enoch Adeboye insists that the selves humanized by Yoruba culture are nothing but idolatrous dominions, powers, and principalities that must be routed into oblivion by onward Christian soldiers; that Moslem must know to draw the line
if his Imam tells him to go and destroy the “pagan shrine” of Moremi in Offa. Loss of the self is a price that only foolish people pay to buy modernity. The Chinese, South Koreans, and Japanese who today make Europeans and Americans look like boy scouts in the arena of techno-rational modernity did not achieve that feat at the expense of their cultures and selves. It is, in fact, Western man who has had to quickly and wisely upgrade his palate and make it compatible with Sushi, Bi Bim Bop, and General Tso’s chicken in order not to be left behind by progress.

Recovery of the self implies an unconditional acceptance of the fact that everything you need for the accomodationist efflorescence of your humanity is logged in your culture and whatever version of Christianity or Islam you embrace must accept and respect those values, notcondemn them. The humanism and pluralism which our forebears valued and celebrated are not mutually exclusive with Christianity and Islam. Esin kan o pe k’awa ma s’oro espouses an ancestral dictum of tolerance that Nigerian Moslems and Christians need to learn from. Will they ever be sufficiently humble to admit that they have anything to learn from spiritualities that the most obdurately ignorant among them still label paganism? For old things hath passeth away!

Pastoraio pls take it easy on that Christilad. The uppercuts is too much for him

9jacrip:
Egbon yi lasan, ari'ku 'yeri niyin o.

Emi na o mo o.

Egbon longest time o.

Na something wey I know I go talk about o. I no fit dey form Sabino.

I have read some articles from the AA who are into Iseese which discuss Orisha and their representaion in Stars, gallaxy and solar system. I think this is all new thoughts.

As Amoye Agba, you should be able to provide us answer.

gatiano:
I got a question Bro. I am not asking to test, but to know and understand.
What are the Yoruba words of the planets in our solar/star system?
What are the Yoruba words for the 12 constellations.
What is the Yoruba word of where we come from which is the First-Earth in the universe? It is Sirius, I read in some place that is called "Irawo Oko", can you verify this?

I know Orion is Oranyan (Correct me if I'm wrong).

I have learnt what few of these planets and few other star-system is called in few other Afrikan langs.

Br=s make I no lie you. I dont know anything about what your question. I dont have answers either. Maybe I should call on Macof, 9jacrip. I believe they will help you with answers.

Ire