₦airaland Forum

Military issues are not to be shared with you bloody civilians.

You want the government to announce on tv that they got so so cache of weapons? Who does that?

lawani:
In Abrahamic religions,especially Judaism, the God is fidgety and running after people for worship. In Christianity and Islam, the God is not only fidgety and reactionary but also violent and sadistic for burning people in hell for unbelief. In Ifa, the God is the onlooking father of all trying desperately to see us through, guide us, show us secrets like a father and that God is not fidgety neither is he agitated and he takes no sacrifice from anyone. Once you take sacrifice or DEMAND worship, you are a deity, hence orisas, eeguns and etc are all deities and not God. God in Yoruba thought is not god, there is only one God who asks for neither sacrifice nor worship or bribe. Orisa, eegun and etc are not gods, not all English words can be translated to Yoruba and vice versa. Orisa are notable people while Eeguns are ancestors, ori is yourself, then there are other natural things trees, rivers, ocean, mountains, forest and etc all deified and are deities but they are not God. God is Olodumare. Thanks.

to you Deity is not God right?

9jacrip:
By default, everybody belongs to Obatala until you then decide to pick or through Ifa you figure out what Orisa suits you but before this, your Ori is next to Olodumare.

Ori eni ni a ba bo, a ba fi Orisa sile. I'm sure you've heard that.

As for Egungun, how about towns where Egungun plays little to no role like Ife? (I'm sure there are other towns).

Keep in mind it has been Olodumare - Ori - Orisa from inception till Sango introduced Egungun. Except your version of Egungun is not the costume wearing town parading type.

I never said you mentioned Ifa praises Egungun. I only translated what you said to Yoruba 'Awo yin Ifa, Ifa yin Olodumare'.

When you praise Ori, it praises Olodumare.

When you praise Orisa, it praises Olodumare.

Likewise when you pray to or make ritual propitiation (ori bibo) to do Ori, it takes it to the Olodumare not to the Egungun, same way when you pray to Orisa, it takes it to the Olodumare.
(The former is known to be much more potent and faster than etutu, ebo riru, oogun, aseje or any other thing.)

Ori picks Orisa because in each Odu contains each person's journey (ups and downs) through life (which makes up one's Ori) and in each Odu an Orisa played or was the dramatist personae - hence, the Ori picks an Orisa in order that the owner of the Ori may live like - do the etutu, wear the colours, eat the types of food, marry the type of wife etc like the Orisa in this Odu did.

In a nutshell, Ori picks an Orisa to enable the owner of the Ori wade through life with ease/guidance not for the Ori to worship the Orisa.

You have answered my question to some extent but I am not agreeing with larger part of your reply. True Orisha guides one through his life journey.

On the first note, we do not belong to Obatala. True, Obatala made the body but Ori is made by Ajala and from there transfered to Eledumare abode where it choose it destiny while on it knee.

Ori is made by Ajala. Tradition had it that Ajala is a drunkard and a cronic debtor. I dont know where you get this Ori is next to Eledumare. How is Ori next to Eledumare? In what sense is Ori eni close to Eledumare? Do you mean in the sense relentless support it gives to person?

Ori eni la ba bo comes in play because Ori stands firm with one in every condition while Orisha do not. So in the right sense, one needs to go for that which stand firm with us rather than go after that which support one within a space of time and condition. Esu will not bless one without sacrificing to it but Ori eni will always be there for us. Same goes with Charm (Ogun). Charm is there for trouble times but Ori serve us for everytime time. This does not mean we should disregard charm because it is there for some period of time and condition.

Another adage of the Yoruba is Orisha bi Iya eni ko si. Iya gives conditionless support to her child. Iya is there in the time of pains and trouble, joy and happiness. ko ni gbo ekun omo re ki o ma tati were. This cannot be said of Orisha not because they cant give more support than Iya but they do base on condition.

Eegun is the custom attire (eku eegun) but Egungun is more than clothing ceremony you are reffering to here. Egungun is a contiual living spirit (Eleda) or Ori of one parent. When condition warrant, Awo would ask a person to appeal to his parents Ori for blessing. In the case where the parent is alive, he will be asked to appeals to his Ori for the sake of his heir. This is what we call Ogungun here.

Orisha ti o gbe ni bi Ori osi. Ori is to this world as Orisha is to the spirit world. Ori has to appeal or praise Orisha before it can guide us. Orisha will not just be picked like robot but appeal must be made to it before it journey with us. The appeal is done by Ori

9jacrip:
Awo yin Ifa, Ifa yin Olodumare.

I still haven't grasped egungun and its relevance in Yoruba religion.

Egungun as a system was instituted by Alaafin Sango in rememberance of Oranmiyan. Egungun's concept is to remember dead ancestors or dead relatives.

How does one praise Ori and Ori goes to praise Egungun when Ori precedes Egungun as far as existence goes?

Ori supersedes Orisa as well.

Ori is next to Olodumare.

It is the Ori that picks whatever Orisa that suits it.

I do not necessarily see where Egungun comes in, really.

Ori picks Orisha for what? For Orisha to serve it or for it to serve Orisha for blessing and more protection?

From what I learnt actually, One praise Ori while Ori praise Egungun. This is not and I did not say Awo praise Ifa while Ifa praise Egungun. I said awo praise Ifa, ifa praise Olodumare. But when one praise Ori, ori praise egungun while egungun praise Orisa and Orisa praise Eledumare.

Ori yeye ni gbe omo. . .Ori yeye is Egungun.

A father Ori is praised for his heir to guild and favour them in their journey in earth.

PastorAIO:
Meeeennnhh! You dey fall my hand for here o! Olodumare nor dey the same level with Oosa. Lai Lai.

Egungun can never be supreme to Ori, neither can Orisha. You should check out Eji Ogbe. Ori da mi re. Ori puts every thing and every orisha in it's place. They all challenged Ori and Ori threw them down.

You missed my points.

I didnt say anywhere that Eledumare is in the same level with Irunmole. What I said is Irunmoles too are Gods. Just like the Egungun and Ori are Gods. This makes Orisha system a polytheistic religion as against monotheistic which lawani is claiming.

I even claimed Eledumare is supreme to all. However, my hierachy is base on and the steps it take before it reaches Eledumare. One praises Ori, Ori praises Egungun. Egungun praises Orisha while Orishas praises Eledumare.

In the morning, Babalawo will praise Ori, ori will praise Ifa, Ifa will praise Eledumare.

lawani:
Unless you have an answer to the simple question 'What is Olodumare?' Olodumare is God, a non jealous God that does not accept sacrifice, that is not a deity. Or what do you think Olodumare is? Is Olodumare equal to Eeguns, orisas and etc. There is a problem of English language here. Orisa is not God or god but a deity. Dont confuse yourself. Olodumare is not a deity. The number of deities are infinite whereas Olodumare is one making the practice monotheistic. No need for you to view things from others' perspective. May Olodumare guide you. Ashe.

Olodumare is God just like the other Irunmoles are God.

Olodumare is one of the Irunmoles. 401 is more than one hence Orisha system is polytheism.

Everyone is supreme in their own domain. Eledumare is the supreme of ALL just like Brahman.

Ori is the supreme in ones life.

Egungun is supreme to Ori.

Orisha is supreme to Egungun.

Eledumare is supreme to ALL.


Ori, egungun and orisha are Gods. Stop mistaken deity as a separate thing from god. They are same thing.

lawani:
Every prayer is ended by Olodumare's Ase. Nobody contends power with Olodumare. We are all reflections of imoles who are uncountable. The 401 irunmale rules everything. The number of deities is infinite. Eegun and orisas are deities. Oke, ile, osan, oru, ojo are all deities. I do not know the 401 and neither do I think anyone knows all. If you say Ogun is there. You are free to do so, then osin means first in ancient Yoruba like Osinbajo, Osinyemi and etc osin imole means the first imole. Do appreciate that deities are not 401 but infinite. The 401 is a council. You can't deny the recognition of only one God which is Olodumare who is not a jealous God and who does not want worship and who is not in competition with anyone. That is monotheism.

A monotheism of a totally objective and non jealous God. A perfect God who passes the buck. That is Ifa monotheism unlike the Muslim Allah who with his Prophet does everything without help and who demands worship. The Christian God also apparently has a council of 24 elders despite being in a trinity. So Ifa monotheism is a monotheism. You may also call it anything you want but for recognising only one God a gentleman, it remains monotheism as well. A ruler does not have to become dictatorial or irrational to be recognised as head.

Prayers and sacrifices are made to Orishas according to their kind. Obatala accept snail and white chalk. Ogun accept dog, blood and cola with cold water. Eleye accepts kidney and fresh meat. What is the sacrifice which Eledumare accept?

Every Ebo are made through Eshu. Ifa says Eshu ni gba ebo be ni ko mo IFA da. Eshu takes 5% of every Ebo and gives the rest to Orisha or eleye that owns it. There is no particular one sets for Eledumare. So tell us how every prayers and sacrifice ends with Eledumare when he does not partake in receiving any Ebo from anybody.

God is not just one in Yoruba religion. The Irunmole which Eledumare is one and part of are first and primodial forces. These Irunmoles are Gods. A 401 Gods is not monotheism because they are more than one. 401 Gods equals polytheism.

Apart from the Irunmoles, there are Egungun, Oro, Ebora, Ori and other divinites in their infinite numbers. Every natural entities have it Ori. They are just there in their countless number and are all Gods. I really dont understand how infinite number of Gods made up to what you call monotheism.

Also, Deity and God is very much the samething. There is no clear cut difference. Eledumare is Olorun and Olorun is not Orisha. We only have One Olorun and 200 Orisha. However, we need to note that Olorun is one of the Irunmole. The Irunmoles are Gods which is polytheism.

The 401 are the primodial forces. Eledumare is one of them. And they are all deity/god because some form of worship are attributed to them. This makes the case of Irunmole differ from Jehovah or Allah. ELEDUMARE care less about worship and do not ask for one unlike Jehovah/Allah. Eledumare do not accept sacrifice or have any form of sacrifice set for him unlike Jehovah/Allah. The other Irunmole, to the Ebora, to Ori are been worshipped unlike 24 elders and queen of heavens and jinns.

In monotheism, a god is belief and worshipped only. Orisha system encourage belief in many numbers of Gods and worshipping of them. Onifa or any babalawo has Ojubo Eshu, Ogun, Olokun and lot others in his "office". This is a symbol of polythesim and nothing more

lawani:
The most important deity the Yoruba ask you to worship is your head, your ori, yourself. Does that make the practice atheistic?, it is after paying due attention to that that you may now worship any other thing and they are infinite under Olodumare, not 401 as people say. 401 are the irunmale in council, they are not deities.

Yoruba religion system is a home abode for every form of theism including atheism. The only form that breaks away or fail to fall into Yoruba religion system is monotheism because many other Gods are present.

One Ori is a deity. This deity is personal to oneself and does not need other people to gather and worship on your behalf. Orisha are been worshipped unlike Ori by more than one person. Orisha is worshipped among family, society, group and village. This cannot be the case of Ori.

However, the fact you should note here is that there is more than one deity pesent in Yoruba religion system. Deities here are infinite. This is mega-polytheism just like hinduism.

Every individual are knoted to Ori and at least one Orisha. The fact that most people dont worship their orisha doesnt mean they should ne written off.

Irunmole is a Deity. Irunmole mean Irun-Imole. Irun is irinwo which is 400 while Imale are primodial spirits. They are what you call Orisha today. The english word for Orisha is god/deity. This shows that there are more than one god been worship which makes Yoruba religion system a polytheism

lawani:
What is your definition of monotheism? The Yoruba know only one God who heads a council of 401 irunmales. The Muslims know Allah who made jinns and has Angel Gabriel and etc. The Christians have the trinity, twenty four elders and etc. If you see those as monotheism then why do you say the Yoruba practice is not monotheism. No two God other than Olodumare the owner of all Ashe. I want to know your criteria though I am not saying deism, polytheism or anything is bad.

Monotheism is the belief in a single all-powerful god, as opposed to religions that believe in multiple gods.

Orisha religion system does not recognise a single all-powerful god but 401 Irunmales who govern the earth and the ancestors realm. Eledumare is one and part of the Irunmoles. Despite the fact the he owns all the Ashe (Energy), his subordinates in 400 Irunmoles are also Gods that are been worshipped in Yoruba religion system.

Ogun lakaye Osinmole is the chief of Irunmoles. Ogun is the deity of strength, war and Iron/metalic elements. Lakaye means the one whose influcence spread around the world (both physical and spiritual realm) while Osinmole from collison of Osin awon Imole meaning the one Imole worship and sees as head.

Allah could made jinns, Jehovah could form trinity and elders numbering 24 in the councils of heaven where queens of heaven, gods (Psalm 82:1) and sons of God congregate but the fact you failed to see is that no muslim worship Jinn and also no christian worship any of the elders, angels or queen of heaven. No one pray to the angels or gods. No one bow in prayer for Jinns. The muslim world admits there is no other god except Allah just like christians no other God is worthy of worship except Jehovah. Allah and Jehovah are single all powerful God to muslim and christian respectively. This makes Islam and Christianity a monotheistic religion.

Yoruba religion system is different entirely in the cases of Abrahamic religion (Christianity and Islam). The 400 Irunmoles and Orishas are been worshipped. Ones Ori is a deity which have a dedicated shrine/altar, prayed to and scarifices made to appeals to it. Egungun (dead living ancestors) are been worshipped in a dedicated shrine among families. This does not end with worshipping but a belief that these deity are closer to one and are powerful. The case of a single all-powerful God is ruled out here. This is polytheism.

On the other round, Eledumare is not been worship in Yoruba religion system. Eledumare does not have a dedicated shrine, ordain a special prayer or ask anyone for sacrifice. He does not seek for our faith. He only set everything in motion and interfare not in the system of things. This is classical deism.

Yoruba religion system could have been tagged Henotheism but there is no record that Eledumare been worshipped directly.

Now you need to understand what polytheism really is. Polytheism is the worship of or belief in multiple deities/gods usually assembled into a pantheon of gods and goddesses, along with their own rituals. In most aspect, the gods and goddesses are representations of forces of nature or ancestral principle, and can be viewed either as autonomous or emanating part of a creator God.

All the Orishas are representation of forces of the nature and are been worshipped as part and constellation of Eleduamre. This is polytheism not only in the number of God but belief in the existence of a specific pantheon of distinct deities called Orisha or Imole.

Yoruba religion system is far from been monotheism

How is a spiritual system that recognise 401 Irunmoles a monotheistic religion?

How do you translate the word Orisha? Is Orisha a god to you? We have billions of Orisha (god) out there and you still call Ifa a monotheistic religion?

Ifa is polythiestic. It is a divination system created by Orunmila. Orunmila is an Orisha (God of wisdom). He is the Omniscient part of Eledumare. Eledumare does not even interfare in the affair of things among we humans. He set everything in motion and doesnt look forward for our prayers or sacrifce. So we can call Orisha religion system Deism.

It doesnt matter what the western world tag us. Been polytheistic or deistic is not a bad attribution. Eledumare is Olorun and as well one of 400 Irunmole. In Yoruba religion belief, we have 401 Irunmole. That is polytheistic considering the number of Imole (Divine ones) are more than one.

All Onifa worship all the Orishas esp Eshu, Ogun, Yemoja, Sango, Obatala and Appeal through scarifices to Eleye. This is polythism and far different from monotheism.

This is restoration of Nairaland political section genius.

Nairaland was once a learning platform. A school and institution of learning. GEJ supporters almost killed this platform with their sentimental and biased estimations. Politics section was filled with hatred, bitterness, bigotry and intolerance. This section was nearly turned to rascals hub. But thank goodness. . . .tuale4u signalling the their is hope in the youth

The Change Tsunami blowing greedy marketers holding Nigeria to ransom away fast.

Subsidy thieves are been thrown out of the window. Oil cabals are loosing on their toes, the heat is getting hard and real.

God Bless PMB.

God bless Nigeria

Journalism is completely grounded in Nigeria. Some particular newshub are paid only to lie and cripple the government by feeding the mass with false information. Dailypost copied this lie from breakingtime word by word, line by line.

All the cells, organisations, society, group and people that wish and propell negative information in the name of painting the government black will have their lives hit hard with negative impression. Everyone that promote terrorism either by financing or promote dubious information shall die

Those guys did a great job in taming insurgency. Kudos to them for sacrificing their live for other citizens.

Change Tsunami sweeping Rivers state House of Assembly

kettykings:
The same judiciary that APC is relying on to upturn elected state officials of PDP is what they are choosing to disobey by not granting bail or outright release of the Ipob, radio Biafra director Nnamdi kanu despite the fact that the court has discharged and acquitted him.

And you want people to take such a government serious.

I repeat elected officials of the PDP should stop obeying further court injunctions or ruling on electoral cases

Your Dilector is a criminal and has lot of cases to answer. When after he do this, the DSS will release him.

Now I repeat, any sacked PDP legislator that disobey the court ruling will be bundled around by the police like a petty criminal.

The NIMASSA DG public embarrassment will look like child play that day

kettykings:
PDP elected officials should stop obeying further court injunctions or ruling

Those who disobey court ruling will be drag around like a criminal

kITATITA:
I'm getting confused. Election petitions used to terminate at Court of Appeals except for Presidency. Now who goes to Supreme Court and who stops at Appeals Court.

Lawmakers stops at Appeal court.

Governors stops at Supreme Court

Great people, great nation

MCFRESH:
pls how did u manage to fill in ur website?.....ystrdy i tried opening crackavenue but when i get to website space,as i tried filling in a popular website like that thou not my own!i was told invalid.My qustn is this, how did u manage cross the bridge.

Put http://then follow by a popular p. orn site

Crakrevenue approved registration late in the night yesterday. I now have both adworkmedia and crakrevenue. The itch now is what to do next after been approved.

Can someone explain in detail what to do to make my first dollar. I dont care sharing turns 50/50.

Old recycled picture

DSS has not done with him yet.

He is still in the dungeon where the sun dont shine

Thanks OP for bringing this tutorial here.

I registered and was approved on adworkmedia. I was so glad my approval mail came in late in the night while I registered. It was simple and very direct considering their are guilds that lead me to a success registration

I will like to know how to continue from after the approval. How to make money and what to do to make money.

Thsnks

cyberguy72:
honestly d NA shld hv used tear gas and rubber bullets. Haba! Hw can they just kill defenseless citizens in cold blood. This is d height of callousness. UN shld investigate this. Buruntashi shld resign

You expect a soldier to move around with tear gas? What is he going to use that for when he is under attack?

When you become rich and have a body guard, ask him to guard you with rubber bullets.

Soldiers are always loaded with live weapons. It is their best companion and should move around with it in case of any attack or threat. Soldiers are not civil defense that move around with tear gas.

I respect you pal

This is wasteful spending. What does he need 10 exotic cars for?

These are the people boko-haram and Biafrans should face. Come to think of it, which road in the entire East is he going to ride these vechile on? He should channels this wasted fund on building road in his regional zone and people will enjoy the benefits from his seat but he is here buying 10 cars that would add nothing meaning to himself and the entire south east.

Boko-Haram should blow the legislative house up. They've got my support here. They look away from innocent life wasted and face these political robbers in Agbada and suit.

Thousands of graduates are jobless. Umployment is on the rise on daily basis. The economy is fast crumbling and business are folding up faster than anyone could think. Social amenities is grounded. We dont have good road, water, hospital or power supply. Millions of people are suffering and someone think it is befitting to get himself 10 exotic cars will millions dont even know what to eat because they have no money to afford food.

Nigerians need to wake up. We need to protest and chase this pigs in the legislative house out. They are not serving the people or creating law for the interest of the mass but are there only to embezzle billions while the hardworking citizens of this country suffer.

Thanks for returning this token Sir/madam.

Evidence holds that there are more than you have refunded. Can we pls have them before 31st Dec 2015 or we can release the one eye hawk of law to hunt you done.

ishiamu:
Shut up... you. wetin you know?? You think media prosecution is same as one of law court?

EKPA.

Your future has been stolen, shared and eaten by the politician you are here supporting.

You wake up in a dark room, poor structured and very dirty environment without a good water for drinking, sound health, standard road and access to uninterrupted suppy with which the money meant for all these have been looted, shared among the elites, siphoned into foreign investments and makes you live in abject poverty.

Dasuki bought houses abroad with access to best facilities while that is defending him is nothing compare to church rat.

You better grow out of this asslicking mentality.

I still dont understand why the more relevant oppositiong parties like KOWA, HOPE, PPM and SDP are not lending there voices as situations which the nation is is in need of them most.

PDP is dying and loosing ground in the scheme of things in this country. PDP is not relevant and have no integrity, not to be taken serious congregation of crooks and pen robbers.

I no gbadun this new APC spokeman. He sure needs some work to do so that he can meet up the standard of Lai

dokiOloye:
were U there or are talking based on what U heard from the NA which spews more propa than Liar Mohamed nowadays?

Ogbeni shattap.

The video of how the army chief beg and how he was rounded up is there online on youtube for al to see.