₦airaland Forum

Mba weldone... I did not just want to give vooks these, for if he could not answer whether God revoked His covenant sealed with circumcision, after he's said all pre mosaic principles were anulled.

It's a sure sign, that these folks hardly know scripture, no wonder he keeps saying 'I feel' 'I think' etc. I did not want to give him the Animal Sacrifice part, but you already did. Guess what he now said? He asked what the blessing of circumcision is? Yet, he claims Abraham’s blessings are his.

I try to ignore him, I guess I'd put in more effort.

vooks:
My brother,
I need to look that up first. It is more involving and has a bearing on the place of Israel in God. Paul spent three chapters of Romans tackling it. But my feeling, and I may be wrong, is the covenant with Abraham is fully realized in Christ meaning any descendant of Abraham coming to Christ no longer needs circumcision. Circumcision now is a mere cultural practice with ZERO spiritual implications on the male Jew.

I note you never answered my question. For the last time I will repeat it and allow me to judge your spirit condemned with inconsistency over appealing to pre-Mosaic practices if you won't answer the question.

Why do you no longer offer animal sacrifices Abraham style?

I'm not interested in what you think or feel...give me scriptures. You haven't answered me but yet demand an answer? If I answer you now, you'd abandon my question and follow the answer in a desperate move to keep relevance.

Question is, did the covenant God sealed with circumcision, anulled too as you claimed all pre mosiac acts like tithing are annulled?

4 months don waka o

frosbel:
all still on track Pal

Ok o

frosbel:
I will continue this article in December when things begin to quieten down at work. Please forgive me for the long timeout. Life has been mega busy both at work and personally.

Cheers.

How far bros, that anti tithe tract nko? 4 months don waka no action...anyways, , till December. I can waith.

vooks:
I have answered your question.
ALL preMosaic practices, circumcision,animal sacrifices,tithing... that were included in Moses were effectively annulled when Moses was annulled. So you can't revive any of those by claiming they are somewhat 'eternal' and that only their 'regulation' was annulled

Am circumcised sir. African way none the less. By the river without shedding no tear., no flinching.But I did that to fulfil my culture not because Abraham was told to go after foreskins

Ok, what about the covenant sealed with circumcision? Was it annulled too?

When you are ready to answer me...I'd Continue. It's ok if you can't. Meanwhile, aint you circumcised?

But those who use this line of argument are at pains to explain why they no longer circumcise as circumcision similarly predates Moses.

Pastor Chris is on stage. See you in hours time.

vooks:
Yes. The answer to your question is yes.
The Law merely gave regulations? Let's test that;
1. Animal sacrifices predate Moses by the longest.
2. The Law,according to you, 'merely' regulated animal sacrifices.
3. The Law/regulation governing animal sacrifices was annulled but animal sacrifices remained

Why do you no longer offer animal sacrifices?

Bro, you said those that predated the law should be anullued, you didn't say why! Put the covenant in perspective, was it anullued too? God said it was permanent, and forever, from generation to generation. Did God lie by anulling the covenant sealed by circumcision?

vooks:
Tithing and circumcision predate the Law. Are both of these in the Law?

Good, they were and should be, because they came from their father, Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. The law merely gave regulations. Now that the law has been annulled, should those that predated it be annulled too?

Notice how I answered you. Answer me in like manner. Don't side step it if we are to continue as gentlemen.

vooks:
My brother,
What was annulled in that verse?

The law. Are tithing and circumcision having origin under the law?

shdemidemi:
If your problem is 'the ones brought him from outside'- they are his slaves Gentiles and not Abraham’s children (Christians).

Fixed

Now younare coming up. The confusion would soon cease.

vooks:
Let's play dating game; tithing was introduced into Christianity late into the 5th century, a good 400 years after Pentecost
Am really mad at Holy Spirit because he hid this revelation from the early church and left them to their own devices for fending off devourer

Younare really funny! You quoted a verse trying to anul circumcision, a verse that does not have any jurisdiction over circumcision and tithing, for these two came before the law.

Knock yourself out

shdemidemi:
[s]The covenant was sealed with the nation of Israel.[/s]

Abraham was made righteous by God before circumcision through faith. That is where you and I come in- through faith, complete trust in God. Paul said physical circumcision profiteth nothing for us, didn't he?

Read and see how you confuse yourself

Gen 17 MSG
God continued to Abraham, “And you: You will honor my covenant, you and your descendants, generation after generation. This is the covenant that you are to honor, the covenant that pulls in all your descendants: Circumcise every male.

Circumcise by cutting off the foreskin of the pe.nis; it will be the sign of the covenant between us. Every male baby will be circumcised when he is eight days old, generation after generation—this includes house-born slaves and slaves bought from outsiders who are not blood kin.

Make sure you circumcise both your own children and anyone brought in from the outside. [size=16pt]That way my covenant will be cut into your body, a permanent mark of my permanent covenant. An uncircumcised male, one who has not had the foreskin of his penis cut off, will be cut off from his people—he has broken my covenant.”
[/size]

vooks:
Faith, right motive, pure heart, not grudgingly don't make a Mosaic Law a Christian doctrine

Tithing has existed more than 400years before Mosaic law came about.

vooks:
circumcision is as relevant as animal sacrifices and if you have contrary opinion, please say so and explain that much in the fewest words

Hebrews 7:18 (KJV)
For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof. 19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.

Was circumcision before or after the law? Why the above verse?

Meanwhile, what about the covenant God sealed with circumcision? Did He annul it? Provide scriptures if you can.

vooks:
Why won't you circumcise Abaham style using the SAME faith?
Faith is commendable but no amount of faith can transform an expired practice into a sound doctrine. Try slaughtering Jesus a lamb

You know you've gone on with this circumcision thing, and I've tried to let you wallow in your knowledge but, a brief writ to get your mind alive. You call circumcision an expired practice? Ok, I thought it was a covenant between God and Abraham to be carried out in ALL generation.

Genesis 17 MSG from v9
God continued to Abraham, “And you: You will honor my covenant, you and your descendants, generation after generation. This is the covenant that you are to honor, the covenant that pulls in all your descendants: Circumcise every male. Circumcise by cutting off the foreskin of the p.enis; it will be the sign of the covenant between us . Every male baby will be circumcised when he is eight days old, generation after generation—

Please educate me, how did circumcision become an expired practice? Remeber we became the decendants of Abraham by faith in Chriist Jesus.

Put these in perspective. This was the covenant sealed with circumcision.

1. To make Abraham the father of many nations and of many descendants and give "the whole land of Canaan" to his descendants.[Gen 17:2-9].

2. Circumcision is to be the permanent sign of this everlasting covenant with Abraham and his male descendants and is known as the brit milah.[Gen 17:9-14]

3. Covenants in biblical times were often sealed by severing an animal, with the implication that the party who breaks the covenant will suffer a similar fate. In Hebrew, the verb meaning to seal a covenant translates literally as "to cut". It is presumed by scholars that the removal of the foreskin symbolically represents such a sealing of the covenant


Service has started! See you boys later! I know someone will quote Romans 2:29 and so on...

trustman:
No wonder you guys arrive at the conclusions you get to.

You take a passage about Abraham's unwavering trust in God, make your own meaning out of it, stamp that meaning into your tithing position and then run along 'exciting' yourselves that you are doing right.

If you tithe because you want to assuage your conscience, or satisfy your church or present a scorecard before others then you may succeed in meeting those goals. But only a right motive will please God. Anything, including TITHING not done in line with God's way becomes wood, hay and chaff before Him.

Well, let God determine that. Until he comes, I wikl keep tithing, be very much assured I do these with the right motive and a pure heart, not grudgingly and debates.

It Pays To Be Loyal - Sunday, November 23rd .

Pastor Chris

Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him: but I will maintain mine own ways before him (Job 13:15).

The above statement of trust and loyalty represents Job's affirmation of faith in God, in the face of daunting challenges. He was terribly afflicted; his condition got so severe and hopeless that his wife, in sneering aversion to his troubles, said to him, “...Dost thou still retain thine integrity? curse God, and die” (Job 2:9).

But Job, the Bible says, maintained his trust and integrity in the Lord, and wouldn't sin against God. His condition didn’t provoke him to make the wrong confessions (Job 2:10); how admirable.

Then in Job 13:15, despite his limited understanding and knowledge of God, he made a rather thought-provoking statement, saying, “Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him: but I will maintain mine own ways before him.” Job’s attitude teaches that no matter how critical or uncomfortable your condition might be, remain trusting and loyal to the Word. For the tenacity of his trust and loyalty to God, the Bible says God “...blessed the latter end of Job more than his beginning...” (Job 42:12).

Consider also the loyalty of Peter and the other disciples who chose to remain with Jesus after some of His disciples took offence at His teachings and stopped following Him. These rebellious disciples felt uncomfortable with some of the things they heard the Master say and reacted, “...This is an hard saying; who can hear it...” (John 6:60)? They thus walked away from Him.

Jesus then turned to Peter and the other disciples and asked, “Will you also go away?” Peter answered, “No Lord. We're with you for life, because we believe your message; we believe you're the Christ.”

He and the other disciples remained with Jesus. Guess what? Before the Lord ascended, He said to them, “...I appoint to you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed to me; That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel” (Luke 22:29-30).

It pays to be loyal. When things seem difficult and challenging, don’t join those who look for other options or the easy way out. Remain loyal and trust the Lord to turn things around in due time.

Prayer...
Dear Father, I thank you for giving me a heart that’s loyal, faithful and steadfast in your service and to your Word. Irrespective of daunting challenges and difficulties, I remain unperturbed, conscious that you perfect all that concerns me, in Jesus’ Name. Amen.

Further Study:
Colossians 3:23
And whatsoever ye do, do it heartily, as to the Lord, and not unto men;

Numbers 12:7 My servant Moses is not so, who is faithful in all mine house.

Daily Scripture Reading

1-Year Bible Reading Plan: 1 Peter 1:22-2:1-25, Ezekiel 29-30
2-Year Bible Reading Plan: Jude 1:1-11, Daniel 11-12

trustman:
No wonder!

Yeah

trustman:
Gombs,
How does this passage relate to giving or tithing?

When I give or tithe I stagger not at the promise of God through unbelief; but I'd be strong in faith, giving glory to God;

trustman:
What does giving in faith, [size=20pt]Abraham's faith mean?[/size]

[KJV] Romans 4:20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;:

Simple

trustman:
Can you please clarify the above.

I don't know how else.

Bidam:
With all pleasure.
I demand you apologize for calling me a liar.

It's like waiting for a plane at a seaport.

WinsomeX:
I am telling Bidam, whom I was discussing with before you jumped into the fray without understanding what we are even saying, to quote me correctly to relevant subjects!

We were discussing tithes, Galatians and Christian curses and seeing that the logic of his presentations had been soundly rebutted, he admits he cannot continue the discuss by making a statement that I had won (I wonder if it that was to make me happy or whar) and then brings issues of my criticising popular ministers. And I admit I criticize them within a context but I am pleading to understand how such relate to the subject we are discussing. If it is not another attempt to turn the tide.

Ok

Bro bidam, no need engaging vooks, ignore him to avoid derailment of a beautiful thread as this.

@OP

The world belongs to Him. But some in the world are His creatures, while some others are His children. He has a good will for all His creatures—everyone in the world—but more specifically, He has a divine destiny for His children—everyone who’s born again.

Nice words

WinsomeX:
Those are my words and I am sure you can see the context in which they were made.

Now how do those quotes relate to the subject of tithing, Galatians or even the matter of Christians and curses that we have been talking about?

Can you yourself see my point of how you evade issues by dragging matters into unrelated subjects?

I don't understand! Should we take in parts your words and ignore the rest? Huh?

trustman:
I hope you know that the word 'however' carries a lot of weight. 

What do you mean by that you "give by faith however"?

What do you mean by "Love propels me"?

I give my givings in faith, Abraham’s faith.... I give with love in my heart

^^
This was another of his classic

Which of the people did you say are not around... the WoF brood of vipers that litter the Lag/Ibad expressway , the ones on TBN or the ones whose billboard are all over our streets and television? Oh, if you mean Hagin, ah ... I get you. We don't need him. We have enough of him around to answer queries on his behalf, if they can.

https://www.nairaland.com/1939255/bankruptcy-prosperity-gospel-exercise-biblical/7#27281244

WinsomeX the righteous. He called fellow christians who gather to worship as brood of vipers... i don't want to quote the place he declare we are all going to hell.

trustman:
How did you decide; because you're trying to avoid a negative consequence of not giving or to make God feel obliged to give you some positive things?

Your true motive for deciding is what will determine if it falls in line with scriptural prescription or outside God's approved way of approaching it.

Let me ask you this: Does your basis of decision fall in line with 2 Corinthians 9:7?

Yes!
I give by faith however. Love propels me

trustman:
Not if he has "decided in his heart, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver.". 2 Corinthians 9:7

Good..But I have decided so, so has million others, why do some guys still hunt me for it?

vooks:
Nobody should prescribe to a Christian WHAT to give, they should give without compulsion (threats, manipulation) whatever they purpose in their hearts (not arbitrary FIXED percentages)

Should a Christian be forced to stop tithing?