₦airaland Forum

2. The practice of repeatedly calling "Holy Ghost fire" (fire-for-fire and back-to-sender) on your enemy(ies).

As we continue our series, today we look at the above topic and how it applied to Christian. Many Charismatic and Pentecostals engage in the practice of repeatedly calling Holy Ghost fire to burn their enemies, spiritual and/or physical thinking they have a witch somewhere that hinders their success in life. The word of God says, if any man be in Christ, such is a new creation; old things are pass away and all things are become new. The word also says, "Greater is he that is in us/you (Christians) than he that is in the world".

First, who are enemies of Christian? Our enemies are spiritual and physical. We have spiritual enemies who is mainly the devil but he uses demons to torment God's people. Christ had already defeated the devil but we (Christian) exercise victory our the devil BUT we are in constant war with demons. Hence, this scripture rings a bell,

New Living Translation (©2007)
For we are not fighting against flesh-and-blood enemies, but against evil rulers and authorities of the unseen world, against mighty powers in this dark world, and against evil spirits in the heavenly places. - Ephesians 6:12

I love my New Living Translations. It is second to the Amplify Version. The above scripture clearly highlight that we, Christian have a physical enemy which it called "flesh and blood" enemies. It also says we have spiritual enemies - evil rulers and authorities of UNSEEN world; mighty powers in this DARK world and evil spirits in the HEAVENLY places. The same scripture makes it clear that even though we have physical enemies, we care less about fighting them because our battle with them is not the ultimate battle but doesn't mean they should not be defeated also.

For each of our enemies, Christians have specific ways of defeating them. In other words, you cannot be applying the ways to defeat the spiritual enemies to that of the physical enemies. It doesn't work that way. How then do we defeat the spiritual enemies?

The immediate verse of Ephesians 6:12 says that,

New Living Translation (©2007)
Therefore, put on every piece of God's armor so you will be able to resist the enemy in the time of evil. Then after the battle you will still be standing firm. - verse 13..

The ways to defeat the spiritual enemies is to put on the WHOLE, not some armour of God. These armours are then listed in the same context of Ephesians 6:14-18.

New Living Translation (©2007)
Stand your ground, putting on the belt of truth and the body armor of God's righteousness. For shoes, put on the peace that comes from the Good News so that you will be fully prepared. In addition to all of these, hold up the shield of faith to stop the fiery arrows of the devil. Put on salvation as your helmet, and take the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God. Pray in the Spirit at all times and on every occasion. Stay alert and be persistent in your prayers for all believers everywhere.

These are the weapons. Herein we do NOT have the "Holy Ghost fire" among the weapons and not given to be repeatedly called on spiritual enemies. Fire is reserved for judgment of devil and his angels/demons. Calling Holy Ghost fire on devil and his angels/demons is an exercise in futility. It doesn't do anything to them until the appointed time for the judgment by fire. Fire is also for trial and purification.

New Living Translation (©2007)
But on the judgment day, fire will reveal what kind of work each builder has done. The fire will show if a person's work has any value. - 1 Corinthians 3:13

Nowhere in scripture did we see the practice of calling Holy Ghost fire on spiritual or physical enemies by the Apostle. Such practices does not answer to scriptural practices with the New Testament believers.

How to defeat your physical enemies by fire but not calling fire on them

New Living Translation (©2007)
Dear friends, never take revenge. Leave that to the righteous anger of God. For the Scriptures say, "I will take revenge; I will pay them back," says the LORD. Instead, "If your enemies are hungry, feed them. If they are thirsty, give them something to drink. In doing this, you will heap burning coals of shame on their heads." Don't let evil conquer you, but conquer evil by doing good. - Romans 12:19-21

In the KJV, verse 20 says: "Therefore if your enemy hungers, feed him; if he thirsts, give him drink: for in so doing you shall heap coals of fire on his head".

The scripture give us (Christians) the proper way to defeat our physical and herein is wisdom. The wisdom of God is foolishness to people of the world. You can bring fire on your physical enemies without repeatedly calling Holy Ghost fire to burn them by following the scriptural context of Romans 12:19-21. That is how to defeat you physical enemies. When the Holy Ghost fire came on the Apostles on th day of Pentecost, it didn't come to burn them, it came to purify and empower them neither did they fall under such Holy Ghost fire. Stop calling Holy Ghost fire on your enemies, spiritual or physical; it is an exercise in futility.

.....to be continue

@ bro. seriallink and my dear sister JeSoul,

Thanks for your comments.

^^^ Okay bro.

Pastor Kun: Even if you reduce the sales price of your rubbish book to N100, I can guarantee you the sales would be poor as God is currently setting the [size=15pt]tithe captives[/size] free.

Oga Zikky......I have to confess, without any contradiction, the below is a master piece. May God increase you in his knowledge. Our tithe brothers can't simply get it and refused to get it - The law was given for a purpose and had since completed the purpose for which it was given. We do no longer need the law since it was given to lead people to faith and Grace. Below is masterpiece!

Zikkyy: It is very much 'legalism'. Adherence to the law is usually because the law requires it. Take the case of the father lays down certain rules for the son (defined as expected behavior), i.e. "you must do your homework when you come back from school" (punishment might be the son will be denied of his favorite program on t.v.); "you must go to bed by 10p.m., no late night t.v"; "if you must go out with friends, i want you back latest 8.00p.m". Now we know parents do this out of love for their children, but the reaction will be different from the child's end; It's most likely a stubborn child that requires these rules. without these rules, it's possible the child will not be doing his homework as required, and keep late nights. Consider a situation where there is a strong relationship between son and father, where son understands the love and wishes of the father for him; a relationship where the son 'trusts' the father's guidance; where the son knows the father want the best for him, the son will not be needing the set of rules to the right thing. He knows the father wants him to excel, there will be no rules for doing the homework; he is not going to wait for threats from the father, he will do his homework and put in extra efforts to get good grades.

So what can we say is the purpose of the law?

"According to Paul, the law has a negative purpose: It was added because of transgressions. Paul has already demonstrated what the law does not do: it does not make anyone righteous before God; it is not based on faith; it is not the basis of inheritance. So if the law is divorced from righteousness, faith and inheritance of the blessing, to what is law related? Paul says that the law is related to transgressions. A transgression is the violation of a standard. The law provides the objective standard by which the violations are measured. In order for sinners to know how sinful they really are, how far they deviate from God's standards, God gave the law. Before the law was given, there was sin (see Rom 5:13). But after the law was given, sin could be clearly specified and measured (see Rom 3:20; 4:15; 7:7). Each act or attitude could then be labeled as a transgression of this or that commandment of the law......

.....In order to clarify the relation of the law to the promise, Paul poses a contrary-to-fact hypothesis: If a law had been given that could impart life, then righteousness would certainly have come by the law. The very way that Paul phrases this hypothesis (as a contrary-to-fact conditional statement) indicates that he does not for a moment think the law can impart life. By life Paul means living in right relationship with God: "that I might live for God". If the law could empower one to live in a right relationship with God, then righteousness would certainly have come by the law. This was in fact the position of the rival teachers in the Galatian churches. They were promoting the law as the way to live for God. It was actually their position that set the law in direct opposition to the promise; it contradicted the gospel. For as Paul has already said, "if righteousness could be gained through the law, Christ died for nothing!"......

.....By reducing all to the level of sinners, the law prepares the way for the gospel. But neither should the law be viewed as if it were the same as the gospel. The law has a negative purpose: it makes us aware of our sin. But it does not, indeed it cannot, set us free from bondage to sin. The promise of blessing comes only through faith in Christ.The Law Is a Jailer and a Disciplinarian....

.....The Mosaic law was given not only as a permanent standard for all humanity but also as a temporary system to supervise a particular people. As we read through the Mosaic law we are impressed with a complex system of laws that were set in place to guide the conduct of the Jewish people. According to Paul's imagery, the law functioned as a jailer to lock up the Jewish people in a vast system of legal codes and regulations. But that lockup was meant to be only temporary...."

The above is an extract from another argument, i lifted some portion that has to do with the purpose of the law as i see it aligns with my thoughts. You can find the full article here - - - > http://www.biblegateway.com/resources/commentaries/IVP-NT/Gal/Understanding-Law

Stipulating a fixed % of giving was required because the Israelite would not have supported their brothers from the tribe of Levi. We have gone beyond just complying with the requirement of the law. You need to look at the underlying source of the law, which just as stated by Christ is love. The reason Christ in Mathew 5:23-24 made the comment below:

Therefore, if you are offering your gift at the altar and there remember that your brother or sister has something against you, leave your gift there in front of the altar. First go and be reconciled to them; then come and offer your gift.

If a tither had not adopted a legalistic approach to the law, why would he/she abandon (or pass by) a brother/sister in serious need and render his tithe first (on the ground that the tithe is more important)? A behavior that does not align with Christ comment above.

The law for us as Christians is not in the form of written codes, our connection with God is not based on a list of dos & don'ts, it is based on our relationship with Christ. We fulfill the law by trusting in Christ and allowing the spirit of God to lead us.

Romans 8:14 (NKJV)
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.

Today, I begin a teaching in the series - "The End-Time Church With non-apostolic Practices". The early Apostle are men with the mandate to commence the church of Christ and hitherto spread the good news of the Kingdom of God. They laid the foundation for the Church and that foundation was rooted in Christ. Today, we (the end time church) cannot lay any other foundation other than what was laid by the Apostles. Our mission to the world is to build on the foundation that was already laid following the examples of the Apostles. However, the end time church had become so perverted and corrupted with many non-apostolic practices that one will begin to wonder what had happened to the church of Christ over the ages. Today, I present to you the gospel of power and the power of the gospel as I unveil some non-apostolic practices.

1. The Practice of Pleading the blood of Jesus.

New International Version (©1984)
In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, in accordance with the riches of God's grace - Ephesians 1:7

There are some Charismatic and Pentecostals that use the practice (now a cliché) of pleading the blood over people that are unsaved and things they want cleansed or delivered. Just about anything gets the blood pleaded over it. But this is an unbiblical practice; nowhere do we read of the apostles "pleading the Blood". We see no such practice by the apostles or instructions in the epistles to do any such sprinkling or pleading of Christ's blood on anyone (even those demon possessed).

In the Old Testament it was a physical act by the priest to put the blood on the altar, not moving it from one place to another. It is the same principle in the New Testament, one cannot move it on to those people or things for cleansing by speaking, (pleading it). The blood represents the life of the person; we cannot plead His life on others? Only the high priest handled the blood to go on the mercy seat for the forgiveness of sins, Jesus is the one who sprinkled His blood, not us. We can’t physically touch it today nor can we apply it somewhere else spiritually, since we are not the high priest, Jesus is.

He said this is my body pointing to the Passover lamb motif in the Old Testament as a type and shadow. He was given as a lamb on a specific day and time for a specific purpose. If it was done any other way or day it would not have been acceptable. Just as John the baptizer introduced him as "the LAMB that takes away the sins of the world". Christ fulfilled all the Old Testament types and shadow including the scapegoat but it was the Passover lamb that is of the most importance. He was judged instead of us, so he passed over our judgment and we go from death to life.

Hebrews 9:7-14 has a deep revelation on Christ sacrifices and his blood. Scripture makes it crystal clear the blood of Christ unlike the high priest type in the OT did was offered once and for all, not repeatedly like the OT. Hebrews 9:11-12. By His death He poured out His life and died for our sins we would be reconciled by it. This was done as a propitiation to the Father almost 2,000 years ago and is still effective today. The atonement was for man and unto God the Father. Propitiation for sins is always toward God, not toward man. The Father accepted His payment for our sins. We ourselves do not touch the blood, it is applied to our lives by the high priest who is Christ when we believe in faith to receive his Atonement. Eph.1:7; Col. 1:14 says "in whom we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins". and Rev. 1:5: "To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood". This occurred almost 2,000 years ago.

Stop pleading the blood in a religious manner because the blood had already being pleaded and shed for the remission of sin. There is no magical power in an unending application of the blood of Jesus for the numerous uses it is applied for today. It was for our redemption, cleansing and forgiveness of sins only. To use it as such is to have a distorted view of its application today and an irreverent understanding of it being precious, incorruptible and holy.

...to be continue

Okay brother. Well done! Keep doing the work of the kingdom, opening the eyes of them that sit in darkness.

Pastor Kun: @Goshen
Abeg no put sand for my garri oooo!
Na hustle I dey oo.

You know say I no dey wan hear seed matter as I specialize in that area.... . The seed is the word of God!

ijawkid: I don even forget say today na 12-12-12....

I been hear some people dey say something go happen.....the thing never happen??.....

Just leaf this people make them dey deceife themselves and allowed to be deceived! Today being wednesday is absolutely not different from last one and the one coming. Anyway, I'm going to Rod Parsley church today with my TOMATO SEED and Groundnut seed. I'm trynna get cassava seed inclusive so that my harvest will be bountiful in 2013....

My dear brother and friend Pastor Kun,

This kind trade no fit you at all. Abi you don come USA come learn this trade from Rod Parsly ni .... Today is 12-12-12 miracle seed and prayer cloth service in the world harvest church, Ohio with Rod Parsley.

Our God is not a kalo-kalo God. Let those who continue to sow seed keep doing that in faith since whatsoever a man sows, that he shall reap. Let them sow seed and go to sleep without working. Let them sow seed without cultivating and removing weeds and still expect harvest. As for me and my household, God had freely given us ALL THINGS that pertains to life and godliness.

You didn't read the scriptural verse very well and if you did, "maybe" you didn't understand or you understood but overlooked the point. This is the point again,

"Yes, people sinned even before the law was given"

The latter part says,

"But it was not counted as sin..."

Do you understand it now

Okay Bishop Wale Oke. I know I love you and have been blessed by your very own ministry when I schooled at Federal Polytechnic, Offa in Kwara state, Nigeria on one of your radio transmitted in Offa.

With due respect sir, I'll like to comment on this arrogant statement of yours perhaps you may be reading:

MAYOWAAK: The bishop stated this in a release made available to Tribune Church. “We are being criticised for buying jets! But they forgot that before we started to buy jets, we were winning souls in thousands and millions, turning men and women from darkness to light. We were transforming lives, giving them beauty for ashes. We were empowering people, equipping them with the revelation knowledge of God’s word that lifts men out of the pit of poverty, to the pinnacle of grace and dominion! We were empowering the poor, not only giving them fish to eat but also teaching them how to fish. We were building schools that were giving quality education to the people, empowering them mentally to become prominent (these include those throwing stones at us now!). We were building universities. We were transforming our society, and changing our nation, one soul at a time,” he said.

http://www.tribune.com.ng/news2013/index.php/en/business-package/2012-10-29-11-36-27/taxation/item/755-expect-more-jets-wale-oke-lashes-out-at-critics

This is nothing but an arrogant statements. So it has become you guys (MoGs) who wins the soul and no longer the Holy Spirit? It has become you and your colleague who empowers the poor and yet many Nigerians are still living under $2/day? It is no longer God who work through you as a vessel Your statements are filled with self achievement and doesn't answer to scripture sir. Even the universities built, how many of the members in their economic state can afford the tuition aside the rich. You boast of transforming lives and yet, life itself is not in the abundance of what man owns but quality.

Jesus said, "I have glorified you on the earth: I have finished the work which you gave me to do", John 17:4 and Apostle Paul said same thing in 2 Timothy 4:7. When Jesus and the Apostle made such a bold statement, Jesus had not even died and yet he said, "he had finishED the work". What then is the finished work when he had not died? He had REPRODUCED himself in a generation of men that will work according the same work he had done. Today's MoG are busy expanding their empire, not the kingdom and REPRODUCING collection centers called "church branches" whereby they can accumulate more money to acquire their earthly possessions. How many of Adeboye's Pastor have their private jets How many of Ayo Oritsejafor's branch pastor have the their own jets Or are they not all called to preach the gospel

Again, nobody is envy of your private jet since we now know you are also beginning to covet after your own private jet hence you must come out to defend MoGs with private jets. The real critics is the means by which the private jets are acquired. When MoGs use all sort of gimmicks to milk the sheep in order to acquire wealth is the real issue sir.

^^^ Welcome bro.

The faith of the Son of God - The OT faith wasn't born again. They never were able to use the name of Jesus saying "in the name of Jesus". They were never filled with the Holy Spirit. Theirs was based on shadows, ours on substance. What was the promise? It is Christ! "In your seed shall all the families of the earth be blessed". They never accepted Christ as their Lord and Saviour. They never became the body of Christ and the church and many more promises etc.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel.- Acts 2:16

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
This is that Moses, who said unto the children of Israel, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall you hear. - Acts 7:37

Here is the answer to this thread, Inbreeding.

New Living Translation (©2007)
Yes, people sinned even before the law was given. But it was not counted as sin because there was not yet any law to break. - Romans 5:13

We call it inbreeding today a sin because it later became a law that if broken, it is a sin.

Yes, I will have a joint account as well as personal account and my wife also her personal account. Joint account primarily for joint projects and family expenses while private accounts for personal savings.

In his message tithe "God's verdict on reckless church leaders" that "it is the people that patronize these fraudulent preachers that are to be blame. When the people stop patronizing and giving undeserved money to these fraudulent preachers, they will be out of business". - Tunde Bakare

We shall continue to preach, pray and prophesy until revival hit that nation, Nigeria and the fraudulent preachers put out of business.

New International Version (©1984)
But godliness with contentment is great gain.

New Living Translation (©2007)
Yet true godliness with contentment is itself great wealth. - I Timothy 6:6

I won't even have a second thought before I return it to the rightful owner since the contact is therein.

Image123: It is hard to meet a spirit filled Christian male or female anywhere. They are scarce.
Luk 18:8 I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?
Pro 20:6 Most men will proclaim every one his own goodness: but a faithful man who can find?
Luk 13:23 Then said one unto him, Lord, are there few that be saved? And he said unto them,
Luk 13:24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.

I disagree bro. They might be scare or even very scare but doesn't there are none or few of them out there.

@ OP,

ChopUrMoni: Hi everyone,

I grew up and live in Australia. I would love it if the man that i end up marrying is a Nigerian. However I find that it is so hard to meet Nigerian men who are committed to God. Any idea why that is? Or maybe it's just the once that I've met. I don't mean this as an insult... I really would love to meet a spirit filled Nigerian man. Maybe I just don't attract the Christian once. Ideas, thoughts all welcome!

You might be right on the highlighted in red. That might be one of the reasons. As the Lord liveth, you shall come in contact with your heart desire in due season according to the time of life. Also, being committed to God doesn't EQUAL Spirit filled - it can be both or one minus the other. On the highlighted in black, kindly work on that area and make yourself attractive.

Let us hear the conclusion of this matter at hand,

KrissKringle: Personally I have nothing against this man as a businessman, a visioner, a motivational speaker [size=20pt]but as a purveyor of the Christian doctrine, Hell NO![/size]. I love my alma mater, no doubt, but somethings have to be cleared about this man who many people worship.

Christians have to remove the coloured veils from their faces and the cotton wools in their nostrils to hold their leaders responsible. Wake up and smell the goddamn coffee!

God bless you. I used to be member of the LFC, Badagry Chapel but I had to exit. Many times, I laugh when I listen to Bishop Oyedepo when he preaches and brag about many things. I shake my head with tears in my heart for the members who are there in sincerity.

Joagbaje: I've always been consistent with my stand. The reason I don't commit murder. Because its agianst Gods principles. Not because the law say so. But in the law these principles are revealed.

There's no contradiction. What do you say of Paul whom we are quoting as concerning the abolishiment of the law yet the same Paul quotes the law and calls it the law of God. Pls get the balance like Paul. The principles of God are forever . The christian is not under the law . He has no law to obey.

Did you make this statement in error See, I love you as a brother but when you say we are not under the law, you need to be consistent please. I do not have much time today going into why would Paul argue in the book of Galatians that the law has ended but will still quote the law. That will be for another time please.

Image123: Heb 7:6 But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.
Verse 5 and verse 6 are comparing and contrasting as i previously just said. verse 5 is And they(the Levi priests). verse 6 is But He(Melchizedek). they both received tithes. Note the tense used in verse 6, He receiveD tithes. It was a past action, unlike the Levi priests who were still receiving as at the time of writing. He(Melchizedek) received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises. He received tithes and blessed. Genesis 14 records that He blessed Abraham, and Abraham gave tithes. There is no tittle of the Word that does not have a reason for why it is there or arranged that way.

Thank God I read your statement very well. There is nothing like Abraham tithed and Melchizedek then blessed. It is the later part of the highlighted of your statement that is correct. This proves the truth that, even under the Abraham and historic Melchizedek account in Genesis 14, Abraham was blessed before he gave the tithe. The false teaching of tithe by MoGs is that, it is when Christians tithe that they will be blessed. Abraham was pronouced blessed BEFORE he tithed. It wasn't the tithe that made Abraham blessed or rich. Hence, the later part of your statement....(Genesis 14 records that He blessed Abraham, and Abraham gave tithes) is correct not the former...(He(Melchizedek) received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises. He received tithes and blessed).

Image123: A point we can pick from this is that God wants to bless His people, whether before tithing or after tithing. Abraham had the promises before he met Melchizedek who blessed him.He was blessed already, and he was also blessed after this encounter. God truly desires to bless us, and uses every opportunity to. When we give, when we pray, when we worship, when we fellowship with other brethren, when we obey God, it is an opportunity and avenue for God to bless us more. A christian is blessed whether he tithes or no, a christian is blessed whether he fasts or not, prays or not, goes to church every sunday or not. But we should not be weary in doing well as there is that extra blessing for doing well.

This is a good talk and message. This is what the NT is all about. Unfortunate, our MoGs don't accept this truth you just said. Even in Shiloh, I heard Bishop Oyedepo when he was teaching on last night of Shiloh 2012 on Friday night on the Spirit of Breakthrough that tithing is required for breakthrough. This is a false teaching from the Bishop. A Christian blessed weather tithe or not as tithing doesn't make a Christian blessed. Our money is only encouraged on giving in the NT.

Hebrews 7:8 in the Amplified version,

8 Furthermore, here [in the Levitical priesthood] tithes are receiv ed by men who are subject to death; while there [in the case of Melchizedek], they are receiv ed by one of whom it is testified that he lives [perpetually].

Image123: So, Melchizedek received tithes of Abraham,and blessed him.

Again, this statement is scripturally wrong! Melchizedek pronouced Abraham blessed BEFORE Abraham gave tithe. Not that he received tithe first and then blessed Abraham. To say this is probably to mean one will not be blessed until one tithes. This is a wrong gospel.

Hebrews 7:9-10, Amplified version

9 A person might even say that Levi [the father of the priestly tribe] himself, who receiv ed tithes (the tenth), paid tithes through Abraham, 10 For he was still in the loins of his forefather [Abraham] when Melchizedek met him [Abraham].

Is this statement literal or spiritualized You answer will determine the importance of this statement to what the writer is saying. If you don't understand the relevance of this statement, then you don't understand the whole of Hebrews chapter 7. I await your answer.


I will continue later, maybe tommorrow or during the week; anytime from monday. I have to attend to other assignment for now.

Image123: @Opening Post contd...

Heb 7:1 For this Melchizedek, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;Melchizedek was a king and a priest. he was a priest of the most high God. Just like believers today are kings and priests.

Rev 1:6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen

1Pe 2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should show forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvelous light:

We are kings and priests because we are joint-heirs with Christ who is our Head. We are the kings, and He is the King of kings. We are the priests and He is our High Priest. Our elders, leaders, pastors, bishops, and shepherds take the place of chief priests, with a mandate to give account of us.
Heb 13:17 Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you.
Christians/Believers are sheep, their elders are shepherds while Jesus is the good Shepherd and Bishop.
1Pe 2:25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.
1Pe 5:4 And when the chief Shepherd shall appear, ye shall receive a crown of glory that fadeth not away.
Act 20:28 Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

First, If you are teaching us that Melchizedek is a king-priest and believers are NOW made kings and priest unto God. Abraham tithed to a king-priest NOT to a High Priest. Should we (believers) then tithe to ourselves since we are now the king and priests and it wasn't high priest that Abraham tithed to but a king-priest. The priesthood of believers is another aspect that nullifies the example of Abraham tithing to Melchizedek in the New Testament in the sense that believers are now the king and priest at the same time and Jesus being our High Priest.

Jesus did not attain the position of High Priest until after death whereby He makes intercession for us according to the same writer of Hebrews. When the high priest of OT ministers, they do it often and often but Christ did it once and for all. This is a better High priesthood in whom we have redemption by His blood. What you have succeeded in doing here unknown to you is that, the priesthood of all believers in Christ (if considered) nullifies tithing to any religious organization. If tithe need be; as believers are NOW MADE kings and priests unto God, he/she should tithe to him/herself.

Image123: Melchizedek was the only king that was also a priest in all of the old testament. Old testament kings were not allowed to minister as priests.
2Ch 26:18 And they withstood Uzziah the king, and said unto him, It appertaineth not unto thee, Uzziah, to burn incense unto the LORD, but to the priests the sons of Aaron, that are consecrated to burn incense: go out of the sanctuary; for thou hast trespassed; neither shall it be for thine honor from the LORD God.

I hope you tell Bidam this truth on the underlined because both of you teaching tithe aren't saying the same thing. Bidam on the other hand enjoys a copy and paste job.... . Bidam says OT priest can be both.

Image123: Melchizedek, being a priest, had the pre-requisite/requirements/qualifications to receive the tithes and offerings of God. So also, Christ our High priest is qualified as a priest and a King. He is also of the order of Melchizedek. Nothing stops or disqualifies Christ from receiving tithes if truly Melchizedek was made like unto the Son of God.

Was it Christ that was compared to Melchizedek or Melchizedek compared to Christ If nothing stops Christ from receiving tithe that writer of Hebrews will not later tell us,

13 For the One of Whom these things are said belonged [not to the priestly line but] to another tribe, no member of which has officiated at the altar. 14 For it is obvious that our Lord sprang from the tribe of Judah, and Moses mentioned nothing about priests in connection with that tribe.

Christ will break the law if Christ receives tithe because according to the law, no other tribe have the commandment to receive tithe according to the law. When Christ came, he never demanded tithe under the law. Remember he was born under the law and subject to the law. Since you started your exposition and went into comparison; you should also understand that "made LIKE the Son of God" is NOT the same as "is the Son of God". It is still comparison. Is Jesus Melchizedek or is Melchizedek Jesus You said you will not delve into that for now. Let's leave that aside then.

Image123: Heb 7:2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; [size=15pt]first being by interpretation[/size] King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;
It was to Melchizedek that Abraham gave a tenth of ALL. ALL of course doesn't refer to the wives of people or to other people's property. it is wrong to give tithes of other people's property. Other people's property is theirs. Abraham didn't take Lot's goods and give tithes, neithe did he take the king of Sodom's goods according to the passage. Yet, it is recorded that he gave tithes of all. tithe is simply a tenth part i.e 10% as seen from Hebrews 7v2. A tenth is 1/10 of a whole.

First we must understand what the write meant when he said Melchizedek's name is "first being by interpretation". Being by interpretation means when his "name" not his "person" is translated. It will mean what it means. It is called "rabbinical hermeneutics or exegesis" with the Hebrews. Since you are saying it wrong for someone like Abraham to tithe from other people's property, how then does this tithing of Abraham becomes an example of tithing for Christians You also forgot to add that the "ALL" was limited to "spoils of war" in verse 4 of Hebrews 7. Clearly, the tithing example of Abraham from spoils of war to Melchizedek is wrong in itself because those spoils doesn't belong to him as you agree. How then shall Christians follow such examples If tithe as you mentioned is a tenth part and in the case of Abraham, a tenth part from where or what - Abraham's income or personal properties or spoils of war We have to be specific please when we deal with the things of God.

Image123: Melchizedek was/is first King of righteousness. What a title! What a position! The priest of the most high God, and King of righteousness. What man can be King of righteousness? This is truly made like unto the Son of God, who is the Sun of righteousness(Malachi 4:2), and the Lord our righteousness(Jeremiah 23v6 and 1Corinthians 1v30).
melchizedek is also King of Salem, which is, King of peace. Salem is Jerusalem the city of the great King. The great king is by the way, Jesus Christ, the Lord of David. Jesus is the Prince of peace. He is the Lord our Shepherd that guides us besides still waters.
Psa 76:2 In Salem also is his tabernacle, and his dwelling place in Zion.
Psa 87:2 The LORD loveth the gates of Zion more than all the dwellings of Jacob.
Whenyou read the passage, every other thing is supposed to pale in significance, compared with Him with whom we have to do. It is actually (Heb 7:13) He of whom these things are spoken (that) pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.
The writer is not throwing light on tithes or on anybody but Christ.

Are you saying Jesus is Melchizedek or Melchizedek is Christ Please be very clear.

Image123: Heb 7:3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.
For time and space, i'll be more brief ihope. Here is an awkward verse if looked at literally. Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life are the features in Melchizedek used to connect Him to Christ. This features make Him like unto the Son of God. In reality, the Son of God as the name suggest has a father(God) or physically (Joseph to the Jews), a mother(Mary), descent/pedigree and geneology well stated by Matthew 1 and Luke 3, beginning of days(Bethlehem) and end of life(Golgotha). So actually, the writer goes into something above the normal, apparent here. An issue that brings up debates on whether Christ is melchizedek and whatever, an issue i'm not delving into anytime soon by God's grace.

I wish we could delve into this for real - If weather Christ is Melchizedek or Melchizedek is Christ. But from what you said, it appears to me that they are not same because one has father, mother, genealogy etc but the other doesn't. It will mean that if they are same, they should both be on same page and record. Anyway, let's still put that aside as we continue.

Image123: Nevertheless, it is agreed that Melchizedek and Christ are being aligned in this passage as of the same [b]order[/b].

Now, we agree they are in the same "order" and not same "person". What this means is that the historic Melchizedek established an order. David used that order in the Messanic psalms and the writer of Hebrews used it as a fulfilled of the "order" - it was a type and shadow.


I will continue on "Opening post 2" in my next post.

@ Image123,

I will be back to address many things you said. It might take me some days but permit me. I might return during the weekend or next week, throw questions at you for an answers. Thank you and stay blessed bro.

@ Joagbaje,

I will rather listen to Image123 than listen to you because your teaching are so water down by what you learnt from Oyakhilome's teachings and are not pure in honesty. Only few of your teachings are genuine. This is the truth I have observed about you. You may not like me for telling you this but I will say it anyway. The same you said The Law has been abolished - meaning it is gone.

The next time we place you under scriptural scrutinies, you will run to the pre-law concerning tithing. Is tithing not part of the law you said was abolished The pre-law tithing, was it commanded for Abraham or was it commanded for Christians I hate with passion your dishonesty with the way you handle the word of God. The law has its God given purpose and here is the purpose of the law,

New Living Translation (©2007)
Before the way of faith in Christ was available to us, we were placed under guard by the law. We were kept in protective custody, so to speak, until the way of faith was revealed. Let me put it another way. The law was our guardian until Christ came; it protected us until we could be made right with God through faith. And now that the way of faith has come, [size=15pt]we no longer need the law as our guardian.[/size] For you are all children of God through faith in Christ Jesus - Galatians 3:23-26

I cannot teach God's people that the law is abolished and yet, I single out only tithe and say tithe is not abolished. The better way we draw closer to God sharing our monetary with God's kingdom is by giving and the NT Christians is NOT limited to a certain percentage - it is according to the Grace of every man and how he so purpose in his heart, not a legalistic giving of a certain percentage according to the law. This is the truth Joagbaje, let it live with you.

OYINBOGOJU: Most of our Pastors have lost their moral and selfless value.

GBAM. 1,000,000 likes

Welder: “This cannot be justified; it amounts to taking a portion of their situation. Your promise, if I may remind you, was to give rest to the sick, distressed and unsaved. If we are focused on making money only, a large slice of life will pass us by.”

Prophet TB Joshua, castigated ‘men of God’ who are living large at the expense of their followers.

“We should spend less on ourselves and more on others,” he said.

They that peddle the word of God for profit should hear this loud and clear. Jesus said, "feed my sheep", NOT "feed FROM my sheep" - The church people are NOT customers to the church CEOs.

Goshen360

^^^ Thank you my brother. We argued the author so well in the past on this thread. I have come to agree and conclude that the author will always be a debate and we can never agree on who the author is. However, the book is deep and the exposition great. If many believers can study this book, they will certainly be delivered from mixing old and new testament together, they will focus on Jesus - The Author and Finisher of our Faith!

New International Version (©1984)
The LORD was grieved that he had made man on the earth, and his heart was filled with pain. Genesis 6:6

For the first time in the Bible, the Lord regretted something that He had made. However, His regret did not stem from something He had done wrong, but rather what humanity was doing wrong. The fact that people had become totally preoccupied with evil grieved Him in His heart, much as Israel's sin would later grieve Him (Ps 78:40-41; Isa 63:10).

^^^ I believe Apostle Paul wrote the book with many proves from the book. The change in style of writing is to capture the heart of the Jewish believers in order to let them know God is done away with Judaism. Let me try find the thread I did and pull some hints for you. I'll be right back.

truthislight: lol,
seed ke?

Why is it that those sowing the seed are not the ones buying the Jets sef?

Mehn, you are weird bro.....lolz. But you dey talk true sha but raw like me...lolz. If the Bible says whatever a man sow that shall he also reap. Why are these people always sowing and not the ones reaping....me think they should change and start sowing like mango seed, orange seed, apple seed etc. Maybe that might work.....

We can say alot about the book of Hebrews and the Pastor who wrote it. This is my personal favourite book of the Bible. The book connects the Old and the New while it teaches the Old is gone. It's a book that set the NT Christians free from the manipulations of some pastors. Any Christian that study this book will love it because it exposes many false teachings of our days. It tells you what the Old Testament was meant to do and had done it. The New is here and God no longer operates in the ways he operated in the past - God operates and has now spoken in Christ.

New International Version (©1984)
1. In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways,

2. but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe.

Hebrews 1:1-2

These two verse is what was divinely expanded all through the end of the book of Hebrews. I love this book so much. Glory to God!