₦airaland Forum

Bidam: @Gosh..lying has become your ministry this new year..Please could you quote where i said a christian is justified by the law as a means of obtaining righteousness?

If you can't quote where i said that then you forever remain a liar on this forum.

You? Na you dey talk like this? Isn't it written all over your law teachings? Abeg go sidon one side joor. I nefa get your time wella. Lemme continue my post. I go reply ya own post too.

Joagbaje: We are not tithing or giving offerings because the law says so.We have gone past the law. But the law contain foundationional principles and if anyone miss that he will end up in error. The law is a reference point.

Egbon, if you like fellowship with me, if you like don't. That's your personal decision and I can't hold you on that ground. This is new year and that's a thing of the past.

That being said, again, sin was in the world before the law and on that ground, the law doesn't always define sin. Sin is sin and we stand by the word of God on that ground as to what God called sin before the law and during the law. In fact, the law came to define sin and make sin worse, not to cure sin - Christ is the cure to sin, not the law. The tithing before the law is not a law for Christians. Get that truth into you, when you make tithing before the law a law for Christians, that's where we have problem.

Joagbaje: A Corinthian church member slept with his mother Inlaw . The Holy Spirit didn't tell him it's wrong. Until paul excommunicate the brother .
1 Corinthians 5:1
It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife.
On what ground did paul condemn this act which the holyghost didn't .because it's in the Old Testament scripture.
Deuteronomy 27:20
Cursed be he that lieth with his father's wife; because he uncovereth his father's skirt. And all the people shall say, Amen.
Gods principles hasn't changed

Some people may read what I'm about to say and misinterpret it but I will say it anyway. First, I do not teach nor support immoral lifestyle by God's word. Let that be very clear. Even when your pastor Chris said mastur.bation is not sin, we stood against such that it is a sin because if falls into the categories of "such fornication..." meaning, fornication is a wide range of acts of sin.

Now, here, Paul calls "that one should have his father's wife. fornication. So, we have wide range of acts under what is called fornication.

Now, did Paul placed the curses of the Deuteronomy 27:20 on those who committed such fornication? That's where we have problem here. Again, the law had defined sin but what Paul taught was, it is the Spirit, which you, Corinthians are temple of that convicts the world of sin. Those Christians in Corinth that did that, weren't cursed according to the law - punished for sleeping sleeping with their father's wife but Paul, through knowledge taught them, they are already washed, they shouldn't live a dirty live anymore.

I don't have time quoting scriptures this morning and responding to everything you said. Sin is sin and not until the law says so - the prove is from Genesis.

I knew this thread is sooooooooooooooooooo promising. Una never hear anything from my mouth una don start dey raise religious spirit and religious head again. Abeg na new year we dey, make una cool down joor, all scriptures will be dealt with. In fact, I wanted to start from how the post were posted (that is, from top to bottom) but I change my mind, lemme continue from (bottom to top).

Joagbaje: Romans 7:7
What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law:for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

We begin with context sir. The very purpose of the law is what the Apostle is saying here - to point out our sins to us, so we can see a need for Saviour in our captivity of sin.

2. The Apostle is saying law is not sin by or in itself but defines sin or tells you and me what sin means, that is, by the law, you know or have the knowledge of sin. So he went for with example, if not for the law, I would not have known what it mean to covet. So, we understand that the law defines what it means to commit a sin or the other.

Joagbaje: I'm amazed at the extreme we go in the condemnation of The law.the law is a foundation . The law contains principles of God . You can't throw the law away. It's a foundation .
Psalms 11:3
If the foundations be destroyed,
what can the righteous do?

The law defining sin is not a foundation for Christians and for those before the law. Christ is the foundation! And yes, Christians can throw the law away after they have come to Christ because, the law would have done its works, showing them how sinful they are in their sinful nature and the Spirit takes over from there.

6 But now we are discharged from the Law and have terminated all intercourse with it, having died to what once restrained and held us captive. So now we serve not under [obedience to] the old code of written regulations, but [under obedience to the promptings] of the Spirit in newness [of life]. Romans 7

Joagbaje: Let's look at the future of condemnation of the law .It's not just about the now.Today the argument is on tithing tomorow may be offering and next it will be about murder!

The truth is, the core Apostolic Christian doctrines are found in the new testament. We cannot return to the law just because we can find a doctrine in the new testament. The new testament doesn't support tithing for Christians as doctrines and so the Apostles never taught Christians to murder neither did Christ.

Joagbaje: The only things done away in the law were clearly spelt out. But the principles in the law remains as foundation .

Please be specific, what are the things done away with in the law that are clearly spelt out? Since they are clearly spelt out, kindly show them to us so we know how to discuss them. What are the principles in the law that remains as foundation if Christ is our Christian foundation.

New American Standard Bible
For no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Plus, what principles are we to take from the law if we already terminate all relationship and intercourse with it through the death of Christ? How can we, who through Christ take principles from the law we are dead to? Romans 7:6 and verse 4,

King James Bible
Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

Joagbaje: Someone may say its the Holy Spirit that tells me what is right and what is wrong . Another person says it's my conscience that matters.as long as your mind doesn't condemn you.
[s]All these a nice but without a foundation of rightness or wrong it will end in error.[/s]

The point is, the Spirit will not tell anyone to murder after the person, by the knowledge of sin through the law have come to know what murder is. E.g, Since I have the knowledge of covetousness by or through the definition of the law, the Spirit, through my knowledge on covetousness, will not lead me to covet or steal or kill etc.

Joagbaje: WHAT IS SIN?
We have enough issue with gay movement in the church today tomorow it will be worse.
We have already seen thread on this site where posters say fornication is not a sin. "As long as two of you feel right about it consensually etc.
Without the law homosexuality will be justified. "after all it's my body" without the you can sleep with your own daughter by consent if two of you feel good about it. May be soon with infants.

The problem we're gonna have here is, before the law defined sin, sin was already in the world and we know God wiped out the world before the flood because of gay\homo.se.xuals etc. These are also issues condemned in the new testament - the old, before the law were just references for us.

2. There's no one on this forum that ever said fornication is not a sin. Maybe that's your misunderstanding but we explored what fornication means. Even Okeyxyz might have learnt one or two things from some things he said (but I speak as assumption, not in total conclusion). I personally do not subscribe to the con-sensuality of two adult or whoever involved because, the simple analogy is, so if a married woman consent to an unmarried Christian, will that not mean fornication? Or if a prostitute consent, even with charges, will that not also mean fornication.

Joagbaje: We may give ourselves good excuses for our wrongs if we take away God standard of morality . Your conscience cannot be a guide without foundational knowledge . Conscience can be corrupt and there will be no guilt for wrong doings . Killing , stealing, murder etc will be justified by revelation . At the end of the day we will wonder where we find ourselves "does sin really exist " then we we will wonder what salvation really is. What are we bringing sinners out of. What's the difference between us and the world.

This ^ up there, I completely agree to the truth of the above words. There has to be a knowledge of sin and that's what the law does. However, sin was in the world before the law so where does those people before the law got the knowledge of sin from - knowing good from evil?

Joagbaje: Apostle paul knew the value of the law. I get amazed when Christians fight against principles in the law. And they fail to see how many times the early apostles quoted the law. It is more amazing to know that Paul was quoting these laws to Gentiles who didn't have a law! Time will not permit me to bring out all those references to the law by early apostles.
When paul told Timothy to study we should ask ourselves what scripture was he studying? Was it Mattew mark and luke? No it was the Old Testament they had as scriptures. The Gentiles were studying the Old Testament . The New Testament scriptures was based on the old.
Scripture in the early church was Old Testament that's why the apostles quoted them to Gentiles
1 Timothy 5:18
For the scripture saith, Thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.
1 John 5:21
Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.
Ephesians 6:2
Honour thy father and mother; (which is the first commandment with promise
All these were based on Old Testament Scriptures , there are many more . But let me just stop on these . You can add more for me.

What does the above teach us,

New International Version
We know that the law is good if one uses it properly.

New Living Translation
We know that the law is good when used correctly.

And also, as a Christian, if I honour my father and mother, by the indwelling of the Spirit that teaches me all things, please, what law do I still need to tell me that? In other words,

New International Version
We also know that the law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers,

New Living Translation
For the law was not intended for people who do what is right. It is for people who are lawless and rebellious, who are ungodly and sinful, who consider nothing sacred and defile what is holy, who kill their father or mother or commit other murders.

The New Testament scriptures was based on the old.

This is not true! The new testament is completely and entirely different from the old. It is not a continuation and the covenants are different. So, how can the new be based on old testament? Change has come and we must embrace God's change. God took away the old, so that He can establish the new. So, what new is based on the old when the old is already taken away?

Joagbaje: The only issue with the law now is that a man cannot recieve justification by the law. We are justified by grace through faith as a gift.

People like Bidam, Ihidinobi, Olaadegbu, Image123, Alwaystrue and others who exalt the mosaic law will not agree with you on the above. They use the law wrongly, they teach it as a means for justification and righteousness for Christians. They quote scriptures like, "Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law." especially Bidam but forgetting, "And the law is not of faith. . .". The law was given to bring man to the end of himself - it wasn't God's intention in the first place to introduce law to national Israel.

Joagbaje: But the principle in the law are Gods principles which haven't changed .

These principles you just dey hammer on eh, na whao. God is same yesterday, today and forever but his ways, acts, operations and so called principles changes.

DrummaBoy: And I can see that you are just warming up. Make I discharge and come back and watch you do your thing soon enough...

I always knew you're always in the Spirit, knowing what is happening. I dey gather momentum for the teachers of law plus grace, because whatever they can't achieve under grace, they rum to the law.

I wan scatter ground for this thread, it's gonna be the best of Goshen360, I promise you. I have been holding and waiting for a time such as this because the Spirit has been holding me on teaching some things, but I think the time is now.

Just sit back, relax and participate. It's gonna be Apostolic dimension of Goshen360.

MEILYN: Okay. Bye

goshen is out of his mind. Who cares what goshen says?

He doesnt understand the KJV, thats his problem.

Don't worry, you'll soon see something wey go make you sober again like I did to you on the other Melchizedek thread.

I can assure our readers, this thread is gonna be one of the best, aside of tithe threads that I will ever present Apostolic teachings on.

Gombs: The ceremonial laws including "clean" and "unclean" lists, sacrifices, dietary restrictions, ritual washings, etc.
The civil law regulating social behavior and specifying crimes, punishments and other rules
The moral and ethical laws, such as the Ten CommandmentsThe Pentateuch (the first 5 books of the Bible)
The scribal law - the 600+ rules formulated by the scribes that everyone was expected to obey
The Scripture as a whole



Drummaboy, if u read my post, u wud see that the LAW meant different things to different context. I listed em above... I and the op clearly stated that the Law couldn't justify anybody, that was why Jesus had to come. What u posted above was kike we are saying the law made one righteous

We are saying the law was not completely abolished like most of u think...the ethical and moral parts for example, stand till eternity, so are other principles...get the difference...later now, u go recommend ur blog for us..

Literally SMH.

Joagbaje: Maybe you didn't read my post very well . I never said we get justified by the law . I made it clear that the only weakness of the law was that it lacked the ability to make man righteous . We are justified by faith only . The point of the thread is about the importance of the foundational principles they contain .

Joe, my beloved brother, don't mind those who uphold the law more than faith in the finished works of Christ. Your teaching is clear enough, you have used the law IN THE WAY IT SHOULD BE USED but not everything you said in the opening post is true and correct, we will have fellowship together.

^^^

Relax mehn, we will have a wonderful time of fellowship. The thread has started already, it cannot be deleted until all issues resolved and thereafter, the thread remains for as long as this forum remain. Calm down mehn, you dig up, I dig up. Three people cannot stand in pairs. Welcome on board.

haibe: Na those oyinbo dey deceive you, kai

No, na KJV English dey confusion him.

We shall be having great time of fellowship here.

MEILYN: Obadiah ke....

Because of ona i go explain that Mathew for ona.

Precept upon precept.

Fables believing Christians....

Precept upon precept, I HAVE ALWAYS LOVED THAT for those who claim to know the word. The same way Obadiah777 ALWAYS go completely off track, panel beat scriptures AND GUESS WHAT, IT'S PRECEPT UPON PRECEPT.

I dey wait for your LINE UPON LINE.

However, lemme remind you, 3 people cannot stand in pairs and when precept falls on top of precept, na line upon line we go take solve the confusion o.

Ohun l'ohun Obadiah777, owo l'owo OP. A tunde l'ohun titun. A n fi isokuso bere odun titun.

gymer: Thank you for your response. I need some clarification in the following happenings in the New Testament:

1. Why did Jesus fasted for 40days and 40nights before he started his ministry? Note that the 100days declared by the church is less than Jesus' 40days and 40nights (in the church's guidance for this fasting, 30days and 30nights is equivalent to the 100days)

Who told you when Jesus fasted for 40 days and nights was the new testament?

gymer: 2. Why do you think Jesus told his disciples that some deeds cannot be done except through prayer and fasting?
Your clarifications will be highly appreciated.

Deeds like what will require fasting and praying for days BEFORE they can be done?

Gombs: [size=16pt] The truth He's talking about here is the truth in God's realm , which is different from fact. [/size]



Read the OP well, you'd notice the above bold...Please read the OP slowly this time. HNY bro

I wasn't contesting anything the OP said, I was stirring up something for our learning, changing the course. Okay, if he's talking about the truth in God's realm, how do I buy this truth in God's realm AND SELL IT NOT?

@ S'demi,

Sometimes, I will want to say to you, leave our religious brethren to continue in their understanding but sometimes, I consider teaching them the truth might help those who are open minded.

Many who don't understand the new covenant thinks God is still dealing with us based on our works, THOUGH THESE WORK ARE GOOD but God is dealing with the new covenant BASED ON HIS FAITHFULNESS AND CHRIST FINISHED WORKS.

1. Welcome to 2014 brethren.

2. The fact is, there was deadness and weakness of womb and body, Sarah and Abraham, father of us who are of faith. Truth is, he is a FATHER OF MANY NATIONS.

3. Lemme do the work of the angle in John 5:4, to stir the water and bring healing to the man at the pool.

"Buy the truth and sell it not", how do I buy the truth and sell it not IF CHRIST IS THE TRUTH?

shdemidemi: Study (be diligent, investigate and be distinguished), be eager and do your utmost to present yourself to God approved (tested by trial), a workman who has no cause to be ashamed, correctly analyzing and accurately dividing [rightly handling and skillfully teaching] the Word of Truth.

There are more LIES in the Church today than TRUTH; for the opposite of rightly handling and dispensing the TRUTH is to CORRUPT the Word of God....Beware of the Postmodern/Emergent preachers…

Any teaching that does not point to Christ and the finished work on the cross stands to be questioned.

#preachthegoodnewsnotgoodadvice

I'm Goshen360 and I endorse this message of TRUTH.

Welcome to 2014 brother.

MEILYN: Christ is a title, its not a name ....

I said you sabi something. He was already called\named Jesus at birth but "thou art CHRIST, the Son of the Living God" is a revelation not confirmed by flesh and blood but by the Father. Are you still confused?

@ Mr President,

Continue deceiving yourself you hear!

MEILYN: Mr President come and readdress this issue. Most people wont understand this

so you are saying Jesus wasnt a literal man in the bible? Asin, he existed as many people.

Or

are you talking about the title 'Christ' which means Messiah, Saviour.

In Conclusion.....

Are you saying there are many Messiahs

just answer for the sake of curious minds

shallom brother.

I know say you sabi something small but sometimes, over sabi dey worry YOU.

Jesus is not the same as CHRIST. You sabi something my fewd but no let over sabi worry you again mehn.

MEILYN: The heresy is in your mind Goshen

nobody is saying Melchizedec is Christ in human form. In Spirit thats what am talking about...

Never mind, happy new year to YOU! You'll be alright!

King James Bible
Righteousness exalteth a nation: but sin is a reproach to any people. Proverbs 14:34

We wonder why a nation is not established nor exalted, righteousness is far! Sin is always opposite of righteousness. Ladies & Gentlemen, we must return to right living and so shall be we established and exalted in Christ. This righteousness that is found, produced and gifted in Christ, is the evidence of our discipleship and all men shall see Christ in us. It produces Christ-like living to bring men into God's kingdom. It flows in Grace and the power of the Spirit of the Living God.

As we approach and get set to enter a new year, let every man across the globe come to Christ, forsake their sins and obtain the righteousness of God in the finished works of Christ by faith. Romans 3:25, Romans 1:17.

Finally, we can't walk the righteousness nature without the fellowship with the Spirit of God so we can grow in Grace through the study of the word of God. As we celebrate this new season, may we flourish in Grace and in righteousness. Happy new year to y'all.

# stepping down from the pulpit in my tuxedo suit #

Ministering now in the Power of the Spirit......

2014 message to all Nairalanders, to my beloved brothers & sisters, to the nation, Nigeria and to all across the globe.

In Righteousness shall thou be established.

King James Bible
For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him. 2 Corinthians 5:21

Any man who is in Christ acquires a new nature, from sin nature to righteousness nature. The righteousness nature is the nature made right with God, in and through Christ. You don't do sin anymore as easy as breath, you do righteousness as easy as breath. You're not made into righteousness to continue to sin as sin is direct opposite to the righteous nature, you're made into righteousness so that you can do right, so that you can live and act right, so that you can live out the Christ like nature.

This is the foreshadow and promise of Christ's righteousness to you,

King James Bible
In righteousness shalt thou be established: thou shalt be far from oppression; for thou shalt not fear: and from terror; for it shall not come near thee. Isaiah 54:14

When you walk in or live out the righteousness Christ had made you, the result is, no more fear, no more oppression, no more terror. Christ took this sin nature (the nature that craves after sin and have appetite for sin) and nailed it to the cross, giving you and divine exchange for the righteousness of God. In this coming year 2014, we don't need more of religious ceremonies and activities, we need more of righteous living in which Christ had made us, that's when our nation will be free from oppression, fear will be far from us and we will be established.

to be continue . . .

Holy Spirit inspired new year message . . . coming soon in one hour time. Glory be to God.

I will be ministering in the power of the Spirit here.

If the scripture says Melchizedek is a man and that he reigned or ruled as a king of a specific location, Salem and was a priest of the Most High. It will mean first, as a man, he was born of a woman and a man because the only man that was created was Adam and Eve from Adam, every other man is born, including Christ in His human nature.

2. It will mean, as a king, he rules in a physical geographical location and it will take physical human being to rule as king over a geographical location.

3. As a priest, he will be physically available to minister unto God.

If some teaches Melchizedek is Christ, it will mean Christ physically ruled on this earth before being born of a woman and we are no more talking about the second coming of Christ; we will be talking about the third coming because he would have first come as Melchi, come as Christ and then thirdly coming again - This is a destructive heresy!

Wherever Christ appear in types and shadows, the new testament testified to that truth and revelation; confirming that Christ fulfilled those appearance of types and shadows. When we read in scriptures like, "the Spirit descending LIKE a dove" Does that mean the Spirit IS A Dove? Christ AS the sacrificial lamb, does that mean Christ IS a lamb?

The controversial verse here is,

Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.

What we need is investigate this text so it doesn't appear contradictory to the other text. If some are saying, Christ IS Melchizedek, we all know Christ is born of a woman and means is WITH mother while Melchizedek is said to be WITHOUT mother. If Christ IS Melchi, why will ONE have MOTHER (Christ) and the other is WITHOUT mother (Melchi) and yet they are SAME person? Our solution is to investigate the text in Hebrew\Greek language AS IT IS UNDERSTOOD by those who heard these scriptures.

Without father, without mother . . . is a rabbinical phrase that means (in Greek) apatōr and understood to mean whose father is not recorded in the genealogies. How do you describe a man who you don't know his father? You either call him a bastard or a man whose father is not known or a man without father. Such phrase (without father\mother) was used to describe Melchizedek.

without descent . . . is the same rabbinical expression in Greek agenealogētos and it means, one whose descent there is no record of, without genealogy BUT we know Christ's as a man have genealogy - Matthew 1. So, if Melchi IS Christ, how could one have genealogy and the other don't? It simply means, they are not same person.

. . . having neither beginning of days . . . also a rabbinical text meaning, his BIRTH, understood as BEGINNING OF DAYS, wasn't known or recorded neither is his DEATH (END of life). BIRTH is the beginning of days, DEATH is the end of life as existence. All these information are missing in the genealogy and so, he was chosen to typify Christ's priesthood. So, what scripture is saying is when he was BORN (beginning of days) and when he died (end of life) was not known or missing in the Genesis genealogy. Therefore, he was COMPARED to the ETERNAL Sonship and Priesthood of Christ, not the PERSON OF CHRIST - made LIKE (not, that he IS) Son of God.

This is where I will end my argument on this subject. I'm not doing this into the new year. Happy new year to y'all in advance.

Bidam: I don't get his fixation on Man,Angels are also called Men in the OT. Let's see how he could wriggle out of this one..

King James Bible Genesis 18:2
And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground,


Genesis 19:1
The two angels arrived at Sodom in the evening, and Lot was sitting in the gateway of the city. When he saw them, he got up to meet them and bowed down with his face to the ground.

Hebrews 13:2
Do not forget to show hospitality to strangers, for by so doing some people have shown hospitality to angels without knowing it.

I have always known you that you too sabi scriptures and na so you dey always twist and go off track. Ever learning but no knowledge of truth. So Melchizedek is also an Angel that appeared in form of man? Where angels appeared as men, scripture says so, did you read Melchi as angel appearing as man or MADE LIKE the Son of God?

birdman: Sure he is a man.

Good, let those who can reason come along. If he is a man, how is he a man? Fall from heaven? Born of a woman? Just came into existence? How?

birdman: But a man without end or beginning.

What man on earth is without beginning and ending of life? Scripture says ALL men (including the man Christ) is born of a woman except only Eve that was made from man, Adam.

New Living Translation
For although the first woman came from man, every other man was born from a woman, and everything comes from God.

New American Standard Bible
For as the woman originates from the man, so also the man has his birth through the woman; and all things originate from God.

Amplified Bible (AMP)
For as woman was made from man, even so man is also born of woman; and all [whether male or female go forth] from God [as their Author].

If Christ in his man nature had to be born of a woman, who is Melchizedek as a man not to be born of a woman?

birdman: Obviously not a man like you or I.

Not a man like you and me? Please tell me, what kind of man he was? Angelic man like Bidam insinuated?

birdman: So, what would be your point of stressing the manhood here? Thanks for being patient

We will get to my point soon. It takes patience.

Is it Genesis 2 verse 15 or Genesis chapter 2 through 15? Which one?

Image123: RESPONSE TO REBUTTAL R5

We expect and do hope that our discussion would be progressive and that we are learning from one another in these discusses. i believe that the aim of the discussion is to clear the air and straighten views on why we all do what we do. When we keep going to the back, like we've not being clear or touched on certain things, it shows that we are either not paying attention, or we are not learning. Now to the response, we find it contradictory and incongruent with scriptures for our fellows to say that Christ did not tithe, and yet insist that tithe is of the law.

Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill.

Scriptures clearly teach that Jesus Christ did not break any of God's commands but was sinless. If indeed sin is the transgression of the law(1John3v4), we make bold to say that Jesus NEVER transgressed the law.
1Pe 2:22 Who did no sin, neither was guile found in his mouth:

This text (Matthew 5:17) is one of the most abused text by the law keepers and those who promote the mosaic law along with Grace for the new testament Christians. In the time of life, I will open or start a new thread showing how this verse is grossly misinterpreted and taken out of context to support law teachings in this dispensation.

I will also show how Christ broke the law and yet, he did not sin - sin is the transgression of the law but when a law doesn't exist, nothing is broken\transgressed. Image123 and his quote above is one of those who promote mosaic law along with the Gospel of Grace and as such, dilute the message of Grace and the Apostolic teachings.