₦airaland Forum

Michael547:
The blood of Abel also cried. So where does the Bible teach in Revelation and Genesis that it was a 'spirit' that was crying?

Are you deliberately trying to discredit the scriptures?

The Bible says that souls were crying under the altar! Souls of martyrs.

Michael547:
Oga can't you also see the catholic version? Were you not the one that said that hell and Hades means the same thing?

Ecc
9:10
Bible

Smith's Literal Translation
All which thy hand shall find to do, with thy
strength, do thou; for no work and
understanding and knowledge and
wisdom, in hades where thou goest there

Catholic Translations
Douay-Rheims Bible
Whatsoever thy hand is able to do, do it
earnestly: for neither work, nor reason, nor
wisdom, nor knowledge shall be in hell,
whither thou art hastening

Solomon is talking about the grave. Physical pit.

Michael547:
Oga below is Ecclesiastics 9:10.....I did not use my hand to write it.

Ecc
9:10
Bible

Smith's Literal Translation
All which thy hand shall find to do, with thy
strength, do thou; for no work and
understanding and knowledge and
wisdom, in hades where thou goest there

Catholic Translations
Douay-Rheims Bible
Whatsoever thy hand is able to do, do it
earnestly: for neither work, nor reason, nor
wisdom, nor knowledge shall be in hell,
whither thou art hastening

My dear, where did Solomon say hell?

Michael547:
Oga below is Ecclesiastics 9:10.....I did not use my hand to write it.

Ecc
9:10
Bible

Smith's Literal Translation
All which thy hand shall find to do, with thy
strength, do thou; for no work and
understanding and knowledge and
wisdom, in hades where thou goest there

Catholic Translations
Douay-Rheims Bible
Whatsoever thy hand is able to do, do it
earnestly: for neither work, nor reason, nor
wisdom, nor knowledge shall be in hell,
whither thou art hastening

I am seeing Hades, not hell. And we know it's best translated hell.

MaxInDHouse:
When talking about Hell/Grave in illustration it means a condition where such ones are rendered inactive before God so Jesus is talking about the condition Pharisees found themselves when the Christ is around, humble Jews who always beg for spiritual food now have it in abundance from Jesus while the Pharisees to whom common Jews do go now found themselves in a condition where they become inactive as John the baptist and Jesus of Nazareth kept telling them that they need to drop their positions if they want to be saved that's the meaning of the illustration!

My friend, dead martyrs complained to God in the book of Revelation!

MaxInDHouse:
Can you quote where Ecclesiastes mentioned physical pit?

Ọmọ the scriptures said: the realm of the dead or grave! Ecclesiastes 9:10

Did you not say Ecclesiastes said grave? Is grave not physical pit or are you now trying to change mouth?

Michael547:
So are you saying that the apostle Peter disagree with Solomon that there is no consciousness in hell?
If you are a Bible student, you would know that the Greek word in 2 Peter 2:4 is not hades which is also known as hell....but Tartarus. Is Tartarus and Hades the same?

Solomon didn't say there's no consciousness in hell, neither did Peter!

Michael547:
So the context in Ecclesiastics does not allow for grave to be translated as hell and Hades? Or what are you talking about? Can't you see that your so-called hell and Hades is also grave?

Abd I've asked you if hell is grave. Peter said that Jesus preached to spirits in hell. Do spirits dwell in the grave?

Jesus said in Revelation 1:18 that He has the keys of death and hell, does grave have keys?

Michael547:
Quote the verse na where Peter said the spirits were in hell.

Quoted several times and even broken down. Quote it to counter me!

MaxInDHouse:
Jesus used an ILLUSTRATION it's not real event that's why he never mentioned any good done by the Lazarus not evil deeds of the rich man.

Death: Dead ones not burial.
Hades: Dead ones buried.

If it doesn't happen in reality, that illustration has k leg. Don't you think so? How can Jesus be saying dead people are speaking from hell when they do not do so?

Michael547:
Where does the Bible teach that the spirits were in hell which refers to grave?

Don't ask me stupid questions please.

Peter said Jesus preached to spirits in hell. If hell is same as grave, do spirits reside in the grave?

Michael547:
Oga can't you see that the Word 'grave' is also translated as hell and Hades?

I am waiting for you to prove those translations are manipulative translations.

Ecc
9:10
Bible

Smith's Literal Translation
All which thy hand shall find to do, with thy
strength, do thou; for no work and
understanding and knowledge and
wisdom, in hades where thou goest there

Catholic Translations
Douay-Rheims Bible
Whatsoever thy hand is able to do, do it
earnestly: for neither work, nor reason, nor
wisdom, nor knowledge shall be in hell,
whither thou art hastening

Catholic Public Domain Version
Whatever your hand is able to do, do it
earnestly. For neither work, nor reason, nor
wisdom, nor knowledge will exist in death,
toward which you are hurrying

King James Bible
Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it
with thy might; for there is no work, nor
device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the
grave, whither thou goest.

It's does not matter the translation. In all cases you look at context. Without that one is just being foolish as a Bible reader.

Peter pressed to spirits in hell. Do spirits reside in the grave?

MaxInDHouse:
‭Ecclesiastes 9:10
Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with all your might, for in the realm of the dead, where you are going, there is neither working nor planning nor knowledge nor wisdom.NIV‬

Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest. KJV

Ecclesiastes is talking about physical pit. Peter was talking about a spiritual place where spirits are imprisoned!

Michael547:
Oga hades is clearly the grave....your teaching is wrong!
.
Ecc
9:10
Bible

Smith's Literal Translation
All which thy hand shall find to do, with thy
strength, do thou; for no work and
understanding and knowledge and
wisdom, in hades where thou goest there

Catholic Translations
Douay-Rheims Bible
Whatsoever thy hand is able to do, do it
earnestly: for neither work, nor reason, nor
wisdom, nor knowledge shall be in hell,
whither thou art hastening

Catholic Public Domain Version
Whatever your hand is able to do, do it
earnestly. For neither work, nor reason, nor
wisdom, nor knowledge will exist in death,
toward which you are hurrying

King James Bible
Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it
with thy might; for there is no work, nor
device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the
grave, whither thou goest.



Is the grave in the spirit realm?

Why was Jesus preaching to spirits in the hell if hell is the literal physical pit? Do spirits reside in the pit?

MaxInDHouse:
Surprisingly the so called CULT has better understanding of certain scriptures than you and your pastors because the word:

Hell (15th century English)
Hades (Greek)
Sheol (Hebrew)

Means GRAVE!

Absolutely not!

MaxInDHouse:
This is what Revelations 20:13 ssys

The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done. ‭NIV‬

And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. KJV

And the sea gave up the dead in it, and death and the Grave gave up the dead in them, and they were judged individually according to their deeds. NWT

So Mr Cruise Hell, Hades and Grave means the same thing!

If they mean the same thing, why was the rich man talking from hell? Why did Jesus say He has the keys of death and Hades in Revelation 1:18? Does the grave have keys?

You must answer both questions please.

Michael547:
Oga which one is literal Hebrew view again? Don't run oo...come and post your own.

You have been exposed....is there consciousness in hell and Hades as stated in Ecclesiastics 9:10?

What are you inferring here? You and who are discussing Ecclesiastes 9:10? Ecclesiastes 9:10 is talking about the grave. The literal pit where dead body are placed.

Peter was not talking about the literal pit. What sort of manipulation is this?

Michael547:
Oga hades is clearly the grave....your teaching is wrong!
.
Ecc
9:10
Bible

Smith's Literal Translation
All which thy hand shall find to do, with thy
strength, do thou; for no work and
understanding and knowledge and
wisdom, in hades where thou goest there

Catholic Translations
Douay-Rheims Bible
Whatsoever thy hand is able to do, do it
earnestly: for neither work, nor reason, nor
wisdom, nor knowledge shall be in hell,
whither thou art hastening

Catholic Public Domain Version
Whatever your hand is able to do, do it
earnestly. For neither work, nor reason, nor
wisdom, nor knowledge will exist in death,
toward which you are hurrying

King James Bible
Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it
with thy might; for there is no work, nor
device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the
grave, whither thou goest.

Hades, hell is not the grave! This is the literal Hebrew view.

Check the Hebrew Bible for the same verse. I'm busy now. Can't post it here.

Michael547:
Thank you for admitting your mistake...that is the importance of questions.

Oga the spirit is the 'life-giving force' not 'life' itself.

You have still not shown us where Peter mentioned 'souls' as those who were disobedient oo.

Please quote the scripture and show us how peter didn't mention souls as those were disobedient. I've already shown you by breaking down that scripture for you!

Michael547:
🤣🤣🤣....kindly quote a verse that supports that statement.

So is Hades in the spirit realm? Is the lower regions of the earth where christ descended to in the spirit realm?

If it wasn't the spirit realm, what was He doing there preaching to spirits? What were the spirits doing there?

MaxInDHouse:
No wonder Satan told Eve:

“You certainly will not die" Genesis 3:4

Na wah o!
So God lied to Adam and Eve but Satan told them the truth that instead of dying they will only change accommodation!

The death God told Adam and Eve are two types:

1. Spiritual death: Separation from God which was instant.

2. Physical death: Separation of the spirit from the body which was gradual.

MaxInDHouse:
Ironically the Bible says the spirit returns to God {Ecclesiastes 12:7} and that the spirit leaves the body at death! Psalms 146:3-4

So how can Jesus who spent three days in the grave have anything to do with such spirits when spirits are not included in the grave?

You guys have a lot of confusion going on around your demonic theology. One has to teach you the foundations of faith for you to understand anything.

Only dead bodies stay in the grave, not spirits. Hades is not grave. Hades is the underworld. A place where spirits of dead men dwell.

Michael547:
Oga are you saying that a 'dead person' and the 'life-giving force' is the same?

How can a dead person and the life-giving force be the same?

A dead person is someone who has been translated into the spirit realm until the day of resurrection.

MaxInDHouse:
So the spirits means the people?

Read the scriptures again. It was written in simple English!

MaxInDHouse:
•And in this state he went and preached to the spirits in prison, who had formerly been disobedient when God was patiently waiting in Noah’s day, while the ark was being constructed, in which a few people, that is, eight souls, were carried safely through the water. 1Peter 3:19-20 NWT

‭
•After being made alive, he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits— to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water, 1 Peter 3:19-20 NIV‬


•By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. KJV

These are three different versions of the Bible!

I can see all of them mentioning the people that were disobedient in the days of Noah. Please which of them me tied the angels in Tartarus?

Michael547:
Lol.....the bible clearly states that dead men are in hades....but show us where the bible states that the 'spirit' of dead men are in hades.

So at the bolded, why asking hypothetically questions?

Can you show us the difference between dead men and the spirits of dead men? If dead men are in Hades, what are these dead men? Are they spirits or 'spiritala'. Hilarious. Waiting for you!

Michael547:
Kindly show us where Peter said that it was 'souls' that were disobedient in Noah's days.

So, you didn't read it in my post? I pity you.

Kindly show us where the bible says that the 'spirit' of every living thing is in the blood.

The life of every living thing is in the blood. Upon checking the scripture, I found I made a mistake by saying "spirit". The scriptures say 'life.' Leviticus 17:11. But it still follows because the spirit is the life-giving force of the body.

Michael547:
The only thing my question does to you is to expose your teaching. If you can't provide answers to those questions, your teachings has no biblical basis.

Your questions don't expose anything but your ignorance and lack of confidence to state your own opinion.

By the term I ask your your questions in reverse such as by saying "Which scripture says that men dead men are not in Hades, etc? Your question will look stupid. If you have any opinion, state it or get out!

MaxInDHouse:
This is all i need here!

The angels in Tartarus are the sons of God who left heaven to come down and have SEX with female humans {Genesis 6:1-5} so it's the children born through that UNNATURAL mating that became a menace during the time of Noah. Jude 1:6

Please go over my post again, and go over that book of Peter again. Peter didn't say the angels that impregnated women were the ones Christ preached to. He said the souls that were disobedient in the days of Noah while the longsuffering of God waited for them to enter the ark. Please point out from that scripture where Peter mentioned Tartarus or fallen angels.

It's not the dead people because God told Adam that he will die and nothing was said to remain after Adam's death so Satan and his demons have been deceiving people by pretending to be dead people all along!

We have addressed this issue already and I've shown you that dead people can be alive spiritually unto God. I cited Abraham, Isaac and Jacob as an example. I also cited the case of Samuel. The case of Abraham, Lazarus and the rich man is also there. We also have the case of martyred souls who cried to God from under the altar in the book of Revelation. Even in Genesis, after Cain slew Abel, his blood cried out to God. Blood has no mouth or voice, so we can deduce that what cried out was his spirit. Even the scriptures say "the spirit of every living thing is in the blood."

Your assertion is wrong. There's no scripture that says men are silent, inactive and unconscious in the grave.

You quote only Ecclesiastes 9 where the silence and the memories that wee spoken about was about the status of dead people on earth and not in tje grave. They do not know what goes on on earth anymore. Everyone forgets about them, the memories of them are forgotten.

Michael547:
Oga where does the Bible teach that the prison is in Hades?
Where does the Bible teach that when a man dies his spirit goes to Hades?
Where does the Bible teach that there is consciousness in Hades?
Kindly bring out a Bible verse to support those claims.

I'm not here to answer your questions. If you have anything against what I've said, counter it or get out of here.

MaxInDHouse:
Why not quote the exact post instead of hiding part of it to suit yourself?

I didn't hide any part! I screenshot what you said according to what my screen could capture. Do not be dishonest in your dealings! You know I didn't hide anything!

The dead are unconscious and they can't do a single thing in the grave where they are going! Ecclesiastes 9:10

Here is what you typed



My response was sarcastic because the dead are unconscious and Jesus knew that for three consecutive days he is going into a condition where he will be lifeless something that has never occurred to any spirit son of God before.

So while he is still alive he cried and begged God because once he is dead he can't know what is happening around him anymore it's this condition that served as warning to fallen angels who rebelled against God during the time of Noah {1Peter 3:19-20} that's what the Bible means by PREACHING to the spirits in prison those fallen angels are in Tartarus {2Peter 2:4} a condition where they have no direct dealings with God anymore in other words they have been DISFELLOWSHIPED from the midst of God's spirit sons!

So it's fallen angels who are in Tartarus that Peter was talking about not spirit of dead people and Jesus who was dead can't speak to them but his condition speaks in volumes as one of the angels who for the first time died something they thought is impossible!

In spite of it all, I'll still answer you purposely because I don't want you to mislead others into believing the doctrines of demons on this forum. I just pray that you will open your eyes and recover yourself from the quagmire in which you now find yourself.

Let's break down 1 Peter 3:19-20:

This is the whole Scripture:

"By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison; Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water."

1. "By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;..."
Here, we do not know yet who the spirits are, but we know He preached to them. However, we also know that Jesus has ONLY a ministry to MAN and not to any other beings in the universe. Hence, we can first deduce that Jesus went to preach to the spirits of dead men in Hades. However, we need further confirmation before settling down to this conclusion. Hence, we have to read further.

2. So, who are the spirits Peter was talking about? Peter said the spirits are those "...Which sometimes were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water."

Now, we know the spirits! They were the spirits of those who were disobedient in the days of Noah and who stubbornly refused to enter the ark that was PREPARED to save them, instead, the ark saved only 8 SOULS. God therefore gave THE DISOBEDIENT SOULS OF NOAH's DAYS a second chance by the preaching of Jesus.

Peter clearly stated the spirits Christ preached to!

Why You are Wrong

1. The angels in Tartarus have no connection with Noah's ark. Noah never preached to them, hence they could not be said to have been disobedient to Noah's preaching.

2. God created the ark for men, not for angels or fallen angels.

3. The longsuffering of God that waited in the days of Noah was for men to enter the ark. God was not expecting angels in the ark.

3. The eight souls that were saved were men. The souls that were not saved were also men. Angels have no souls. Hence, the souls that were disobedient and refused to enter the ark cannot be angels.

4. Jesus has no ministry to angels or fallen angels, hence, He couldn't have been preaching to them in prison.

MaxInDHouse:
Ọmọ i never said Jesus was crying at death he cried prior to his death that's why i quoted Hebrews 5:7 so if you don't understand what i meant it's your problem!

Why did you avoid the questions? I can see through your deceit.

Here is it again:

Do you now agree that dead people are conscious and that Jesus was there preaching to imprisoned spirits?

And the screenshot of what you said is reattached so you can tell us how you didn't mean Jesus was crying in His grave. I am ready to unearth your whole posts to expose you on this.