₦airaland Forum

Nihilist:
How the hell does running stat show that Matic is in position? See yarns

The only things that show a players position is the heat map and the touch map. I've never heard anybody say running stats = positional awareness before now.

Matic is the second most dribbled player in the whole squad. Coupled with his relatively low rate of tackles and interceptions, it's difficult to see how he is being particularly useful 'in position'

Midfielders are the most dribbled players in any team so telling us he is one of the two most dribbled players means nothing. He is one of only two midfielders!

Running stats was only to counter Bigkesh assertion of him strolling. In Matic case I know that's how he positions himself from visual observation.

That aside, we have to be more intelligent on the meaning behind stats. There are pertinent stats and there are stats meant for the dustbin. Tackling, Interceptions, Dribbling is meant for the dustbin because there is no high volume and you don't know how they record the stats.

For example, a whole team between all 11 players might record only ten tackles in a game yet the opposition lost the ball 30 times. If you are running at me and I put my body between you and the ball and rob you of it, do you know they don't count that as a tackle?

So tackling stats etc only tells you about a players style of play, not the efficiency of his play. While players like Kante, Ramires may go to ground to tackle you because they lack size, someone like Matic or Mikel will just step across your body and block you from the ball. The outcome is the same but tackle wont be recorded for Matic or Mikel.

So we have to be intelligent about our use of stats. Personally the only stats I consider are goals, assists, kms per game and passing stats. Let us not bring dustbin stats into the arena of intelligent discussion.

As another example, you will see a winger dribbling all game, yet when you check the stats you will see only 3 dribbles recorded. Tell me, what are they recording, do you really know?

I personally watch Messi dribbling 20-30 times per game, yet Opta will be telling me he only completes 3 dribbles per game. Tell me in all sincerity why I should bring dribbling stat into a debate as a metric for comparison?

raumdeuter:
Gudjonsen played most of his career as a support striker and very few games in midfield. It was actually in Barcelona that he was pushed more to midfield

You mean fabregas carried Matic. The Fabregas that was throwing record high assists from CM. 19 league assists.

Chelsea scored 73 goals Fabregas scored or assisted 22 of them from Central midfield. Na that person you dey talk say dem carry?

Thats why I am an advocate of show us what you did on the field not hiding behind awards and nomination

Gudjohnsen started playing midfield right from Chelsea.

Chelsea was not playing 4-4-2 so almost all games Gudjohnsen played for JM was in midfield.

Matic did the bulk of the work defensively, that's why he was named EPL DM of the year.

raumdeuter:
I am amazed o. The same thing Ibime lampooned Ramires and Oscar for

C'mon now. No need for games. I'm disappointed.

Nihilist:
Running stats.

I didn't realise we are an athletic club now.

Maybe you prefer Mikel who would be blowing gasket and leaving holes all over the pitch.

What do you prefer looking at? Tackling stats that tell you someone makes 1.2 tackles per game vs another who makes 0.9 tackles per game? How una dey reason sef?

That running is the reason why Matic is in position. 90% of DM and defender work is positional, not telling us Makelele makes 0.7 tackles per game while Ramires makes 2.3. That is meaningless.

I told you many years ago and repeatedly since that the only stats I look at for defenders and DMs is running and passing. The bulk of my assessment is visual cognisance of their positioning

The best one on one defender in the world is not the best defender in the world. He may be horrible positionally.

Nihilist:
Matic actually makes less passes and key passes than Kante. I'm out eating now otherwise I would have posted it.

3 of Matic 6 assists are flick ons from corners so it's not like Matic is creative. As you can see in the stats, Matic posts less key passes than Kante, Moses and Alonso.

What is it that Matic really does sef? Give us the stats let us see.

I have posted running stats. Did you miss them?

Matic makes more passes per 90mins than Kante.

raumdeuter:
Gudjonsen was more of an attacker and a support striker while Lampard according to you was playing as an Attacking midfielder

You concedded 2 goals, 1 a penalty and 1 an inspired take from Dinho. Basically Makelele did the bulk of the job by himself, I believe Kante can do the same, We all know Matic cant.

E for good make Kante go greet him grandfather in Mali for 3-4weeks so Olofinjana can defend his salary

When Matic was carrying midfield of Fabregas and Oscar to title who was doing the bulk of the work?

BTW, Gudjohnsen and Lampard both play CM and AM.

raumdeuter:
You see the lineup I gave you vs one of the best attacking side of their time

Na you talk say Lampard dey play AM. So in the lineup I posted basically Makelele was doing all the work by himself cos ninnies like J.Cole, AM like Lampard and attackers like Duff cant help in midfield

Still searching for what Matic is contributing to that midfield o

Joe Cole was playing wing. It was Maka, Lampard and Gudjohnsen in midfield. We conceded twice in that game you will recall. I'm sure you won't know that Lampard was the marathon man of the Premierleague for 10 years. Don't think Maka was playing with no Fabregas type player.

Nihilist:
Sqwuaka stats is not based on just tackling. Our defence is based in numbers. Cahill and Calamity Luiz are members of that same tight defence. We saw what they looked like in a back 4. We saw what Matic looked like in a back 4. Bigkesh's point infact is that even in this community defence, Matic does not seem to be pulling his weight in relation to his team mates. He doesn't make enough tackles, doesn't make enough interceptions compared to Kante He doesn't create enough chances compared to Kante.

What is he doing?

Matic is making more passes and assists than Kante. You are comparing two different styles of players.

Your squawka stats is weighted to tackling, even interceptions. Those are no metrics for looking at DMS cos if they were Ramires would be the greatest DM of all time.

CONTEDDICTED:
You are the one holding on Matic of 2014

Matic of 2016 has conceded 5 goals in 16 matches and is trusted by our miracle working manager to whom you are addicted. You are the one holding on to 2015. Let go of it.

raumdeuter:
Community defending dey really protect some people. Half Matics wage he suppose dey give Kante and the other half to Kantes children

When Makelele was commanding midfield alone in this same Chelsea, remove Matic put Fabregas and nothing will change defensively actually output offensively might increase as those Fabregas to Costa wire transfers will increase

BTW is Matic the new Mikel?

This is the Chelsea team that beat Barcelona in 2005, How many workers do we have epping Makelele in midfield
Cech, Paulo Ferreira , Terry, Ricardo Carvalho, Gallas, Makelele, Cole, Lampard, Duff, Kezman, Gudjohnsen

Makelele mostly played with Essien, Ballack and Lampard, three of the hardest working midfielders in history.

Matic was running 13km per game at certain stage. You want give Mikel heartattack?

This all goes back to your defence of Ivanovic. In that case blame the RCM. Matic cannot be coming over from LCM to protect your boy. Those isolation of Ivanovic came because it was too easy to penetrate Fabregas side.

Nihilist:
I purposely did not post any defensive indices, just the overall defence score in comparison to other members of the defensive side of the team. He came of worst in that comparison. OK maybe he's not the best at defending, maybe his job in the team is support attacking functions...again his overall attacking score was the lowest of the defensive side of the team.

What passes is he making? Makes around 20 passes less than Kante who still manages to post the same pass accuracy. He makes fewer key passes than Alonso, Moses and Kante. He's not playng defence splitting throughballs, his pass length is roughly the same as those other guys I posted...

So what exactly is Matic adding to the team if at every parameter there are at least 3 people better than him

Squawka defensive stats is based on tackling.

A DMs job is to press and make the opposition pass sideways till they run out of options.

He is doing his job perfectly defensively.

We dont want no Lee Cattermole or Granit Xhaka in our midfield making slide tackles.

A central midfielder stays on his feet.

So what is the purpose of comparing with wingbacks whose job is to isolate wingers on the touchline and tackle them. That's an inane comparison.

Makeleke never tackled anybody. His squawka defensive stats would be rubbish.

Central midfielders defensive job is to stay in formation and press as a unit, blocking space for throughballs. He is doing that perfectly.

DM is in your team last 16 matches and you can count the goals conceded on one hand. One hand, not two hands. And you are still carrying 2015 matter on your head, typing God knows what.

Those of us who know what to expect from DM are satisfied. Conte who took the team from 10th place to 8 points clear is satisfied. Do you think you know more than him on midfield play?

As at end of October, Matic was strolling his way into 3rd place for ground covered.

Nihilist:
Matic isn't really bringing much to the table offensively or defensively.

Those squawka stats don't apply to DMs. Strength of DM is not in making tackles.

Matic just strolling in midfield according to Conteddicted.

raumdeuter:
Kante is really covering some peoples A$s

If only Kante had gone to play for Mali we for dey see the Serbian Olofinjana dey run or ruin things

There is no midfield where one man does all the work. Most midfield have 2 solid workers, some even 3.

Matic cannot carry Fabregas defensively for 4 years. He needs help too like most midfielders.

CONTEDDICTED:
You have got the wrong person here
Have been supporting Pedro as long as it's Pedro Vs Willian... I have nothing against him

Who 4th season help?? Like Ramires and Oscar didn't stay that long
Matic does Nada


We saw a midfield of Fab and Matic against Bournemouth,Fab was running, marking and controlling the midfield while Matic was doing strolling aimlessly

Fab no be Matic mate

Ramires and Oscar. Did any of them make PFA team of the year?

Matic has been great for 3 of his 4 seasons. Stop yarning 2015 yarns when everyone was shocking.

CONTEDDICTED:
I don't know why most people think Matic makes us better defensively than Fabregas does


Matic is zero for me, he is good for nothing ....He doesn't win tackles and he misplace passes with ease

No one can convince me Matic is a better option Vs Whoever

My friend cool it. You have been yarning Matic, Matic upandan all season just like you were yarning Pedro, Pedro. They are making you eat your words. Matic who is making 88% of his passes is what you call misplacing passes.

Matic is now in his 4th season with Chelsea. He has been a stalwart for 3 of those seasons. Stop yarning 2015 yarns.

Go and table your frustration with Conte and stop disturbing us.

Senegal are playing Cameroon in AFCON QF on Saturday.

Lets all pray for Sadio Manes success so he doesn't return for next Tuesdays match.

In other news Burkinabes and Bertrand Traore have topped their group and are through to the QF. Aubameyangs Gabon don comot with 3 straight draws.

Griffon:
Could it be Barca's style of play helped him? Zizou never played with a team who were all about ball retention.

He WAS Barcas style.

I'm sure Zizou never planned on going into any match with the intention of not dominating possession and to play on the counterattack like some water carrier.

TBH, Zizou should he compared to his fellow AMs, not CMs. AMs cannot dominate possession like CMs. They have to wait to receive the ball.

Griffon:
Does stats agree with this? Cos that's an area most folks rush to draw conclusions.

Yes, Xavi central midfield dominated possession in every match from 2008-2014.

donjazet:
Barcelona to have more corners than eibar.

Keep the bet going

Griffon:
Ibime who'd you pick between Zidane and Xavi for your midfield duties and why?

Xavi always. No one dominated him at his prime. People dominated Zidane.

Nihilstjnr:
Who be that black fool wey weave that ball?

Oumar Niasse. He just came from Everton. I know say typical Hull player no fit fall asleep at set pieces like that.

Cassaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaavvvvvvaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!

Hull done dey ball. This their new manager sabi football

I need goal from Pedro for FPL o. This Costa goal dey make me lose.

Nihilstjnr:
Maguire is a boss defender abeg. We really need to sign this guy

I dey notice the guy since you mention am. The guy too much. £15m will do it.

Dieeeeeeeeegooooaaaaaaaaall!!!!

PietroRico:
despite all the off ball movement, he's still not renowned for his work rate.

Who told you that? One must not run everywhere tackling everything like Essien or Kante before you know he is working hard.

PietroRico:
ask them his strength, they will start yarning some esoteric shít about right place and intelligence.

Attacker that cannot dribble, has neither pace nor power and is not renowned for passing either.
I'm not even sure where his original position is. I don't know of he's a striker ,central attacking midfielder or wide man
To think that he was valued at such an insane fee, when van Gaal reportedly tried yo sign him... sigh

Some even went as far as saying he was better than prime wazza.. Smh

What was Rauls greatest strength?

Some players are not easily detectable by the eyes. No one watches football to follow off the ball movement, but 90% of work is done off the ball.

Pep better not lose this o.

2nd coming of Jesus halted by offside flag

Chei, party don spoil. No wa, na still to hug that 6th place na him sure pass.

This week no pure so far. . . and to think I was gonna sign Firminho but decided to save my transfer for this week. . .