₦airaland Forum

UK time is still Naija time at least for the next couple of weeks.

Orimili:
(1.) The bill is vital. . . in destroying the value of the US dollar. Bailouts don't work. By passing this bill, we added tons of dept, adding to the already bad inflation we're experiencing.

(2.) Do people not see that solving a credit crisis with more credit is a horrible idea, no matter who it's backed by? A recession is unavoidable, and by simply papering over it over the past decade made the bubble worse. Let the recession happen, but no, we must keep up with our bad spending and escape any consequences.

(3.) If AIG couldn't handle $85 billion without getting in a worse state, how what is going to happen with this $800 billion? By passing "No Banker Left behind", a depression is all but guaranteed.

Spoken like a true novice.

It is OK skimming over the topic with elementary knowledge, but lets get specific here:

(1.) I have already addressed the negative effects of the bailout including National Debt, falling dollar, inflation etc. Tax cuts also increase the deficit as does war so what are we getting at here?

(2.) Wrong Question! The question is not whether the economy needs more credit. It certainly does! The question is whether the bailout will succeeed in providing this credit by easing up the freeze. This is fundamental - The movement of money is vital for the function of an economy. It keeps companies operations going. We have had many recessions before without Government intervention so that is not the issue here. Credit is the lifeblood of capitalism. Every new venture starts with a loan. Credit[b] IS[/b] the economy. This bailout is simply to take away the cause of 'fear' which stops banks from lending to each other. That cause of fear is the subprime mess. Banks fear that other banks suffered more losses than they claim so they do not want to loan them money. Take away the fear and the economy can start the recovery process. In times of economic stress, cash is King. Banks certainly do not want to let go of their liquid assets because anything could be around the corner. A lot of these banks have enough to survive - but they do not necessarily have it in liquid form, which is the problem right now. Government has always tried to exert some influence on the credit markets through the fed funds rate and overnight credit lines so your assertion that Government should not be concerned about credit is simply untrue. I am not speaking to you from a position of lacking knowledge. Trust me, my knowledge of the markets is very broad. Now, this bailout has entered the political sphere and every Joe Public has an opinion on it, based on their political view. What is the practical view?

The practical view is this: AT&T, Caterpillar, McDonalds and numerous others have been denied loans recently. Loans they would normally recieve. This is not new - within the markets, Banks have been denying each other loans for the past year. This is just the first time it has hit Main Street. It's been on Wall Street for a year already. Banks have folded just like companies would fold without credit. The virus is spreading. Anything that Government can do is essential.

(3.) How is a depression guaranteed by "No Banker left behind?". Please show us the economic model that shows that this $700 bailout bill will lead to a depression. This is absolutely silly and completely ideological. We have tax cuts totalling $1.3 trillion till 2012. Does that not add to deficit? A trade deficit is not necessarily a bad thing. It depends on what you borrow the money for. Do you borrow it to grow your economy or to spend on Social Welfare or other irredeemable projects? That is the question.


An astute mind would read some things into my posting about the JP Morgan-Lehmann credit withdrawal namely:

Ibime:
(1.) The giant American bank is alleged to have frozen $17 billion (£9.6 billion) of cash and securities belonging to Lehman on the Friday night before its failure.

(2.) The funding lines provided to Lehman to finance its everyday operations amount to $188 billion, according to court filings.


(3.) Lehman’s collapse is fast emerging as the single biggest event of the credit crunch, sparking a number of unexpected effects.

The unravelling of the firm’s prime brokerage operations has already forced a number of hedge funds out of business.

Olivant, the investment group run by former Abbey boss Luqman Arnold, revealed last week that its 2.8% stake in UBS was held through an account at Lehman in London which the firm’s administrators are refusing to release.

Previous court documents have suggested that JP Morgan was owed $23 billion by Lehman in secured loans.

In London, Price Waterhouse Coopers, the administrators to Lehman Brothers in Europe, is wrangling with more than 60 stock exchanges and clearing houses around the world to recoup up to $3 billion that it says is owed to the defunct bank.

(1.) Just shows how simple lack of credit could turn a sick patient into a dead one.

(2.) A medium-large size bank like Lehmann brothers requires $188bn just to maintain it's operations daily. How much would a larger bank need to maintain daily operations? i.e Credit must flow in order to maintain daily operations. If you do not get it, all you have to do is understand this. It will make the picture clearer: Many banks borrow billions overnight and return it in the morning. We are not talking about 5-year loans here. We are talking about one-day loans, one-week loans etc, just to keep operations going and moving money around to where it's needed. Credit is their modus operandi. This alone should explain why maintaining credit fluidity is vital to the economy. If someone calls in a loan at the wrong time and you do not have liquid cash to meet it, you could go bust there and then. Hedge Funds ran on Bear Stearns asking for all their loans back. Lack of credit crippled them at that vital moment.

As I showed before, Goldman Sachs made money from the subprime mess, yet the vultures were hovering two weeks ago due to lack of capital/credit to maintain their operations. It wasn't till Warren Buffet invested $4billion in Goldman Sachs that investors started throwing money into them, easing their capital needs. I also gave the same example with JP Morgan and you can say the same for every other bank who did not lose from the Subprime mess. Many banks did not lose from subprime but they are still affected. I am still waiting for a counter.

(3.) Just shows the domino effect and how other parties get hurt. The banking sector is like a hub in the middle of a bicycle wheel. If the hub falls, all the spokes fall. Full stop. Almost every other sector is simply a spoke in the wheel. If they break, the bicycle keeps moving. Thats why Govt didn't step in during the tech crisis of 2000/2001.


I don talk my own finish. I no get time for hardheadedness.

Cabali is a natural pessimist.

Anyway, fingers crossed for today.

Simply put and for the last time, there is nothing wrong with the bill, especially the initial one. . . .the bill is vital. . . . but these pork scratchings do nothing for the bill's popularity.

Here is the statement I made a few days ago:

Ibime:
Make no mistake, bailout or no bailout, the market is determined to root out the weak ones from amongst it so more banks will fail. Certain banks like Barclays, JP Morgan, Santander and even Citigroup see this as an opportunity to grab more market share and carry out more horizontal and vertical integration by taking over failed banks.

And this is what is in the Sunday Times this morning:
[size=14pt]
[center]
JP Morgan ‘brought down’ Lehman Brothers[/center][/size]
[center]Iain Dey and Danny Fortson[/center]

JP MORGAN has been accused by its Wall Street rivals of dealing the final hammer blow that forced Lehman Brothers into collapse in a sensational claim that threatens to spark a colossal legal battle.

The giant American bank is alleged to have frozen $17 billion (£9.6 billion) of cash and securities belonging to Lehman on the Friday night before its failure.

According to Lehman’s biggest creditors, this was what precipitated the liquidity crisis that embroiled the firm, forcing it into Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection on the morning of Monday, September 15.

The allegations have been raised in a filing at the bankruptcy court in New York, lodged late last week. Lehman’s biggest creditors include almost every big firm on Wall Street, most of Europe’s heavyweight banks and insurance companies as well as a slew of Japanese and Chinese institutions that are owed several hundred billion dollars.

The funding lines provided to Lehman to finance its everyday operations amount to $188 billion, according to court filings.

The creditors are now demanding that JP Morgan open up its books to the bankruptcy court to allow the transactions to be assessed.

“The creditors’ committee understands that LBHI [Lehman Brothers Holding Inc] had at least $17 billion in excess assets which were held at JPMC [JP Morgan Chase] on the Friday going into the weekend before its bankruptcy filing,” the documents said.

“The creditors’ committee further understands that, on September 12, 2008, JPMC refused to allow LBHI access to its excess assets and instead ‘froze’ LBHI’s account. In freezing LBHI’s assets, JPMC was purportedly holding all of LBHI’s assets as a potential offset against any claims JPMC may have had against LBHI.”

The filing goes on to claim that “as a result of JPMC’s actions, LBHI suffered an immediate liquidity crisis, that could have been averted by any number of events, none of which transpired”.

Lehman’s collapse is fast emerging as the single biggest event of the credit crunch, sparking a number of unexpected effects.

The unravelling of the firm’s prime brokerage operations has already forced a number of hedge funds out of business.

Olivant, the investment group run by former Abbey boss Luqman Arnold, revealed last week that its 2.8% stake in UBS was held through an account at Lehman in London which the firm’s administrators are refusing to release.

Previous court documents have suggested that JP Morgan was owed $23 billion by Lehman in secured loans.

JP Morgan said: “These assertions raised by the creditors’ panel are unfounded conjecture. We will address them at the appropriate time in bankruptcy court.”

In London, Price Waterhouse Coopers, the administrators to Lehman Brothers in Europe, is wrangling with more than 60 stock exchanges and clearing houses around the world to recoup up to $3 billion that it says is owed to the defunct bank.

LCH Clearnet, the clearing house, has returned £217m to PWC in recent weeks and Eurex is also thought to have returned some funds.

The cash was held as margin – money that exchanges require in case a company goes bust.

LCH is one of the largest holders of these reserves, reflecting Lehman’s standing as the biggest trader on the London Stock Exchange.

An LCH spokeswoman said: “We have already given the administrators £217m of the margin we held for Lehman and it would be imprudent of us to return all the remaining margin until this has been completed.”

Tony Lomas, the lead administrator at PWC, said “constructive discussions” were continuing with other exchanges.

The art on the 30th and 31st floors of Lehman’s Canary Wharf headquarters in east London has been removed after appraisers valued it and is being stored in a “safe place”, Lomas said.

It will “be dealt with on another day when we have resolved more pressing matters”, he added. The works, which include oil paintings and bronze sculptures, are understood to be worth millions of pounds.



http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/banking_and_finance/article4882281.ece

[size=40pt]LMFAO!!!![/size]

A Leopard cannot change it's spots.

What does Obama have to do with the bill? Did he sponsor it? Did McCain not vote for it? Get the phock out of here!

Most of those pork barrels were even added to entice Republican senators. We know they all love pork scratchings. 

I never knew Davidif was an infant till today.

If you are going to come with stuff against Obama, please come with valid talking points, not the soundbites concocted by the Republican campaign to persuade the simple of mind.

I don't know where to start in dissecting your post so Ill just leave it there.

China undermined confidence in their own products by


(a.) Creating a submarket for inferior goods. China tend to create the same good twice. One for the Western Market and another for the African and developing markets.

and

(b.) Allowing piracy to run wild

It depends on what you think the bailout is for. It is simply to stop a recession from turning into a depression, nothing else. The bailouts primary purpose is to spur private capital into action. That will take some time to come because confidence is more tentative than fear.

Ron Paul predicted this disaster? I guess that makes Ron Paul some kind of expert on the way forward for the financial markets Never get your economic information from politicaians. As a general rule, you will be misled. The only reason I have a modicum of confidence in this deal is because Bernanke and other experts are behind it. I predicted this disaster back in 2003. It was quite easy to figure out that many people were taking loans that they couldn't pay back and someday, somehow, the lenders will suffer from it. Even in my infantile mind, I could see the problems ahead. So I guess that makes me just as qualified as Ron Paul to comment on this situation.

Japan implemented a similar bailout in the late 1990's after the crash of 1997 and whilst it did not help them get out of the recession whih still lasts till today, it saved them from a depression. This bailout is just the first step on a very long road to recovery. Many economic policies have to be fixed after this.

What is up with people calling MEND's name everywhere? Why do people feel the need to hold MEND to a higher standard than other Nigerian parastatals? Are they not products of the same environment? FYI, MEND have killed more than 22 Cameroonian soldiers in Bakassi.

The slow down in the NSE is caused by loss of trust in accounting practices, not by anything that is happening in Wall Street.

The Bailout bill has been passed. The Dow Jones Industrial dropped 200 points from +260 to +50 for the day as soon as the bailout was passed by congress. What do you think about that? I await your comments. 


I see the Democrats are quick to pass the credit for the passing of the bill to Obama. They shouldn't. That is a politically risky manouvre. There is no guarantee that we will see the benefits of this bailout within the next 12 months. Certainly not before the elections. Come November 4th, we will still be flooded with bad news about the economy. Recent news is that unemployment has increased by 800,000 this year. Traders will soon be looking at earning figures for the third quarter of 2008 just finished to determine whether to buy or sell. They should not sell this bailout as the end of our problems because it will affect Obama in November when people see no immediate changes to their pocketbook. Obama and McCain should distance themselves from this bailout for now. That risk is somewhat less for McCain because more Republicans voted against. Like I said, Democrats need to chill and keep Obama's name out of this. This bailout is just to stop leaks, it is not gonna bear fruit on Main street level anytime soon.

Yeah, you're right. Drogba has had some injury problems.

But the Drogba I remember could come back from 2 months injury and jump back into his old routine, no problem.

Owen Hargreaves routinely misses months and weeks at a time, but still returns like he never left. It's called natural fitness, maintained by hardwork.

The Essien I know can also come back from injury and be back to his game almost straight away.

Bosingwa missed almost a month before the start of the season and jumped back into his first game running like a madman.

A lot of times, it depends on how your body used to work before the injury.

I can assure you that if Yakubu has a bad injury, he will struggle to return because his body has not been used to hard work for the last few years.

If Drogba had not reduced his workrate about a year and a half ago, do you think he would have struggled to return from injury as he has over the past year?

The Drogba I remember used to be able to chase the whole opponents defence from left back to right back, harrying them into conceding possession. The Drogba from last year even struggled to chase from one centre back to another, talkless of the whole back four.

Ibime:
You must be the Primitive since you do not know how idigenous land rights work in civilised countries.

mon amie:
Is Nigeria one of those? Olodo!

If you admit that Nigeria is a primitive state, then your primitive reasoning fits right in. Yet, you dare say that WilyWily is living in the primitive era for demanding true fiscal federalism and a repeal of the Land and Petroleum acts.

mon amie:
, although I have every reason to believe you and wilywily are one and the same person. Multiple Personality Disorder!!! Caword.

It is coward, not caword. I am the moderate face of the Niger Delta.  WilyWily's is the face you don't want to see. . . . . especially on a dark night in the creeks. 

Bloody parasite! Wilywily, abeg give bros a taste of the medicine for me.

As Dayo would testify, Drogba who scored less goals created a whole heap by sheer nuisance factor. That Drogba used to cover the whole opponents half by himself, chasing fullbacks, bullying centre-halves, you name it.

Akolawole:
Can you read your comment again.

According to you, Drogba need to prove he's not one-season wonder AND

You prefer Drogba that score less goals than that "season wonder"

Drogba needs to prove he is not a one-season wonder in terms of goalscoring.

I can stomach his decreased workrate if he is scoring goals. Otherwise, he is no use to me because his first touch is too poor for my liking.

Do you think Drogba's work ethic is the same as in 04/05, 05/06 and the early part of 06/07? Has he lost anything physically or mentally? Answer these questions honestly.

Is the Drogba of Egypt 2006 the same Drogba of Ghana 2008?

The Drogba of 04 and 05 can never let Jonathan Woodgate outjump him to score from a corner twice.

Anyway, lets see what he has to offer this season. Maybe he can return to his previous levels of fitness. I haven't seen that work ethic since Jan 2007.

Orimili:
(but I guess it's cool to ignore that, because we're such elite democratic supporters, right?)

Where do you guys get this nonsense from? If we are going to talk about elitists, there is only one party that applies to. The party of the rich. So please stop all this buffoonery. Just because a party embraces intellectuals doesn't make them elite.

Militants do not get arrested without a gunfight. They should release those boys ASAP before they become radicalised. That will just create another 400 militants. FG just went into the townships and picked up unemployed boys. Unemployment is not a crime.

mon amie:
See your screen name sef. It says it all.

Maybe you can show landers a copy of payment receipt which your acclaimed 'forefathers' sought to have bought the ND region and passed it down to your kinsmen as inheritance. If you have got none, just spare us all the long history. How could anyone just wake up and claim total ownership of an entire coastal region that has been in existence for centuries and was never concessioned or allocated to anyone for any consideration what so ever. This is the 21st century not the primitive era. Wake up!!!

You must be the Primitive since you do not know how idigenous land rights work in civilised countries.

Where is Kobojunkie?



Anyway, let me take her place:


(1.) How much percentage of Albino's have been killed? How does this compare with the murder rate amongst people of other skin pigments?

(2.) What percentage is Albino-on-Albino crime and what Percentage is Black-on-Albino crime and how does it compare with Black-on-Black crime?

(3.) What is the level of crime against Albinos in foreign countries? Does it compare favourably with the murders against Albinos in Burundi and Tanzania? If so, how can we jump to the conclusion that these Albinos are being killed simply because they are Albinos?


I think we should examine the facts before crying foul for the Albinos like it is their birthright to cry foul at being the target of witch doctor killings. I think it is wrong to generalise and say that all Burundi witch doctors are biased toward Albino body parts   

I am still waiting for Drogba to prove that he is not a one-season wonder in terms of goalscoring. I liked the Drogba who didn't score many goals more than the Drogba who does because that Drogba was better for the team. The game against Liverpool was the only time he really impressed me last season.

I still remember tthe Drogba of 2004 and 2005. That Drogba would not let you rest. He would chase every ball, putting defences under constant pressure and allowing Chelsea to dominate possession and creating opportunities for the midfield. He used to miss chances then but I loved him. After he reached 20 goals in 2006/2007 on his way to scoring 33, he slowed down his workrate and he got carried away. Drogba from January 2007 has not not worked anywhere near as hard as he used to before. Once your body gets used to not working as hard, it is hard to recover previous levels. Just ask Gattuso.

[quote author=davidylan* link=topic=178491.msg2886589#msg2886589 date=1223001129]How come people like Joe Biden don't win presidential elections and George Bush does?[/quote]Cos Americans are stupid people. . . . . the shit sold to Americans can never be sold by politicians in Europe. . . .

Sarah Palin represented herself well. At least she made no major gaffes neither did she lose confidence. Her Republican base will love her for this but questions will still remain in the minds of Independents. On a negative notes, her sentences have no full stops, only punctuations. She also focuses on a narrow range of talking points, namely Energy and tax cuts.

Biden though was in a class of his own. That was a masterclass. Great choice by Obama. He is more qualified to be President than Obama, McCain and Palin. I always loved this guy. And he sure shut down the maverick crap.

@ Topic,

You know how it is. As soon as you drop arms, all your demands are swept under the carpet. What can we do? I guess we have to play the role of the defeated till next time. You are right that the issue is fundamental to the state of the nation. No group of people have stood up to demand the constitutional changes required to make Nigeria a true federation apart from MEND. On the other hand, the struggle was degenerating into different splinter groups which started involving themselves in criminal activities. What can we do?


Off topic,

400 'militants' have been arrested in the Port Harcourt townships of Aggrey Road, Creek Road, Bundu Waterside, Lagos waterside, Borokiri, Amadi-ama, Abuloma etc.

These are areas I grew up in and am very familiar with. Maybe, I would be arrested if I was still in PH.

How many of these are actually militants? I bet not more than 40.

Nobody has been arrested in the creeks.

The real militants are either lying low or have made their escape.

Too often, we see Nigerian police round up innocent civilians in the name of doing something without any detective work.

Human rights groups and leaders in Niger Delta must ensure that everyone is accounted for and has a fair trial.

Where is Gani Fawehimni? 

Join us, come with us, we are on our way/
Education for all, by the year 2000/

No be today wey Government start to sell us false hopes about the future. I will believe in Vision 2020 when they start to fight corruption seriously.

frag:
Absolute disaster,

You haven't seen anything yet.

Thank God that Ariaria has improved 

The Ariaria I remember when I used to go there in the 1990's was completely waterlogged. Ariaria waterside as we used to call it. If you drive your car down the road, the water will seep in through the bottom of your car into the car to the point that you have a good few inches of water inside your car. Your car sef will break down in the middle of the road and you have to get out to push or pay some boys whose sole occupation is to push cars stuck in the water. The water sef will almost come up to their waist 

Any Aba man can testify to the nightmare of Ariaria waterside 

Pastors should shut the hell up and keep their nose out of politics.

We see clear tribal divides when celebrating this country called Nigeria. Growing up in the South-South, we never celebrated Independence day. The South-East definitely do not celebrate Independence day either. Anyway, happy birthday to Naija for whatever that's worth.

Cluj should not be underestimated. I mean, they beat Roma 2-1 in Rome. I was impressed watching Dinamo Bucharest in the UEFA Cup the last couple of seasons. They even knocked out Everton. And if Cluj is better that Dinamo, then we can expect them to be somewhat solid. If you take the mix of Chelsea's players being undermotivated and Cluj being underrated, then the draw will not be a surprise to you.



Anyway, check this out:



INTER Milan manager, Jose Mourinho has sensationally revealed the identity of the man behind the Nigerian consortium bidding to buy crisis-ridden Newcastle United, just as the group has confirmed that it has presented its bid to the club.

Toon owner, Mike Ashley is desperate to sell after becoming public enemy number one for failing to keep manager Kevin Keegan at the club.

According to Monday's edition of The Sun of UK, Mourinho believes Magpies' Nigerian-born striker Shola Ameobi, is leading the takeover bid! Other than this, however, the former coach of Chelsea refused to make further comment.


http://odili.net/news/source/2008/sep/30/614.html





Abi Mourinho dey try diss Nigerians or wetin?








Check this out as well:


Jose Mourinho offered to let a lively Italian reporter the chance to select the Inter team for their Champions League game against Werder Bremen on Wednesday.

"I would if you gave me part of the nine million euros you earn," said the scribe. Mourinho shot back: "It's not nine, it's 11 and with sponsors it comes to 14." (Daily Mirror)



This guy is doolaly. Don't be surprised to see InterMilan players asking for £200,000 a week very soon. 

Doyin3 or Jakumo would be the best for the job.

The moderator must be literate and moderate but also tolerant of extremist views.

Controversial threads generate activity which in turn generates $$$. Thats why "We are all Monkeys" is on Nairaland front page.

The politics section needs less regulation, not more regulation. However, the moderator should know when to delete controversial threads. In other words, let them ride for a day or two before deleting them.

A moderators main function is simply to delete threads such as "Make money from Forex while sitting on ya ass and sipping a pina colada." Nothing more.

Relax, it is just a measure implemented so that anyone who distributes polluted water can be traced.

Look, no need to be surprised. From the first ten minutes I could already see that the boys were uninterested in the game. Aston Villa on Sunday, lets focus on better things jare.

Drogba lost his fitness last season, not just this. As soon as Mourinho left, he was uninterested. That affected him physically. We even saw it in ANC 2008.

As for Anelka and Malouda, I have given up.