₦airaland Forum

Goshen360:
@ Gombs, vooks and BabaGnoni,

What post did Gombs drew my attention to an old thread? U tried going back on the pages but can't find non. Can anyone point me to it so I can address it.

drumb, you for send PM na! Gombs was harshly criticized for posting same thing drumb pulled out. There is God oh.

nlMediator:
You guys need to up your game big time. If these are your best shots, we might as well call it a day.

Even night brother, not only day. Majority of these fellows are just grumpy grumblers, murmurers and complainers. With nothing to offer except criticism and cheering their fellow complainers.

Gombs:
Excuse me! A pm? Really? Reading and comprehension problems has been persistent in your camp. If for threads past, vooks still think image123 is feminine or that he was too in a haste to criticise, that he forgot I made the post, then, my friend Babagnoni, I think common sense has failed you too.

I should PM him abi? Now public rebuke did not sound ok as you lot advocate? I was waiting for this moment for someone to remotely him private correction, and here you are, meek and pious. I did not rebuke him, not correct him, I simply wanted to show how reading and comprehension has been in deficiency in your camp. Call the to order, send them a PM.

Thanks. Happy Sunday.

Hahahaha, lol. Thanks jare Gombs.

BabaGnoni:
Have it your way. As you wish, however your insinuations are up there in black and white (e.g. i've NEVER seen this (LAUGHTER) in Nigeria) for all to read

You're a disappointment to grace. You clearly made a mistake and exaggerated in falsely accusing me of saying " NONE of these fakeries and detestable acts happen locally." You also lied about me putting up wrong time, you've glossed over that, but you have links and youtube videos of other men's mistakes and failings stored up to gloat over. Accept your mistake/error and move on, or better still, list the fakeries and detestable acts and the place/places where i ALWAYS say none of these fakeries and detestable acts happen locally. Yes, i still maintain that i have NEVER seen this (LAUGHTER) in Nigeria. That is my personal experience, if you have seen it, say. Post YouTube too, simples.

Gombs:
Certainly, reading and comprehension skills is a deficiency with some folks here. Image, you were really waiting?

i was waiting oh, was hoping he'd repent of his lies and exaggeration.

trustman:
The Christian of today (Image123 note) needs to know that not every directive in the OT pertains to him or is to be observed by him. 
He therefore needs to know which directive still applies to him in the church age and which one doesn't. 
A quick start is to see if the Apostles have anything to say about it. 
 
So, when it comes to GIVING what can the Christian glean from the lives and writings of the NT to Christians. 
Is it anything like we find in the OT, which had varied forms of giving whether pre-law or after the Law was given, or is it something completely different. 
What objective conclusion can the Christian come to?

One of the conclusions today's Christian can easily come to is that the NT has enough to say about the Christian's relationship with the OT. 
Another conclusion he can arrive at is that KEY issues relating to the Christian way of life are spelt out in the NT. Believers are now under the New Covenant of Grace, and are subject neither to pre-law customs, such as in Abraham’s day, nor the ordinances of Mosaic Law. 

One of the key things regarding Christian GIVING is that it is to be a gracious response to the grace of God the Christian has experienced. There is no compulsion in it. There is NO DEMAND placed on the Christian to give. He can choose what to give. He can equally decide HOW to give. Christian giving IS NOT . No burden is placed on the Christian regarding giving. 

Therefore, when a church directs,insists manipulates OR COERCES members to give (whether it is freewill offering or tithe) that makes it anti grace. 
In the same vein when a Christian gives apart from a grace expression he is giving with a wrong motive and that giving is also anti grace. 

Sadly much of what goes for giving and tithing today fall under acts done with wrong motives and do not fall in line with the NT prescription for giving. Tithing in particular is propagated through coercion. What you find is a resort to the OT to justify it when NO SINGLE word in the New even suggests it for the Christian. 
For majority of those who tithe, if they are to be honest with themselves and open to others, their reasons for tithing is either to escape a possible negative consequence which is driven by fear (fear of some physical loss, loss of heaven, etc), or on the other hand a belief that God can be made (tricked?) to give back a physical reward to the giver. None of these is a genuine motivation to give. 

Those principles in the law still required for today are certainly found in the New Testament epistles. And in the epistles we find that tithing, like Sabbath observance and animal sacrifices, is never imposed on the believer. To the extent that tithing IS NOT PRESCRIBED ANYWHERE IN THE NEW TESTAMENT EPISTLES we can safely say that it is no longer compulsory for the Christian today.

To insist that the Christian (not the Jew or Israel) is required to pay tithe today when no portion of the Bible states so is a great perversion of scripture. To seek through all kinds of gimmicks to force the believer to do that which God himself has not stated is nothing but downright EVIL.

Fable. i still give tithes, God is not complaining. Jesus says it ought to be done.

MarkMiwerds:
not being hypocritical at all. I quoted a verse of wisdom. Totally different than a preacher lying to his congregation, telling them God requires tithe of money or they are cursed.

Oh, Malachi is not a verse of wisdom when quoted? Cherry picking.

BabaGnoni:
^^^
Ghen-ghen delivered at 2:03am October 26
- I dont know why you put the wrong time up there, the time was 2:02am and not yet 2:59am October 26.

"Please point out one or two places i so said. i'm alive and here oh" by Image123

Is that not you in BOLD?

Your time is wrong, are you in Sierra Leone?
You delivered zero. None of those my posts say NONE of these fakeries and detestable acts happen locally. You understand English i'm sure?

BabaGnoni:
Your wish is my command siree. Soon come. OK

2:59am October 26. Your time starts, lol.

BabaGnoni:
Can see you learned from the best. Also good to see you noticed distracting the thread

You should also see the discrepancy in what you wrote. Jesus is the best na.

BabaGnoni:
It grieves the heart, especially when Image123 has the cheek to always say none of these fakeries and detestable acts happen locally

To be honest, I don't know how all these self confessed & so-called WoFs on NL get to peacefully sleep at night, knowing all these extremely wicked things carried out here. Cruel acts committed whilst faking healing, staging healing or pretending to heal

This is bad, not good at all, a lot are going to be taken in by this now. SMH

i just noticed this, unfortunately not many were taken in as you predicted. You accused me as always saying none of these fakeries and detestable acts happen locally. Please point out one or two places i so said. i'm alive and here oh.

MarkMiwerds:
I didn't threaten you. I posted a verse showing foolish choices. Giving to the rich and taking from the poor.

An act you defend.

If you didn't threaten me, then 'Malachi preachers' aren't threatening. They're just reading verses. See your life for outside? You're being hypocritical and double tongued. i defend giving to God, which is what every tithe and offering should be.

BabaGnoni:
It becomes necessary for the point to sink.
You believe wrong, it is pre, it is that and is post that
Who is seen gloating, other than the one gloating about owning $16,000 dog, buying Mercedes, Lexus and convertible for his kids
Misleading people with staged and fake leg lengthening acts misrepresented as healing. Is that worth mollycoddling or condemning?
Naming and shaming is not condemnation but serves as a deterrent or used to discourage others thinking of straying into those kinds of activities
You can't have your cake and eat.

There you go again. So you're into shaming not gloating? Shhh, never mind. We're distracting the thread i guess.

BabaGnoni:
It is a small thing ooo, because when we were tackling these things, we were told off because some disapproved of publicly "naming and shaming" sacred cows

OK, we relented, and with some degree of censorship became less severe or intense (i.e. by not being 100% in name mentioning)
but then the disapproval shifted and turned to, it is about dead people, it is about acts involving unknown names, the grotesque or bizarre laughs is unheard of locally, the odd and ludicrous fake healing acts don't happen locally etcetera

Business as usual, WoFs on nairaland (i.e. its officers plus its rank and file) would keep quiet, they would:
1.) turn a blind eye to this and other similar wrong things
2.) look the other way to deliberately ignore something as bad as this that is happening
3.) rather this is covered up and strong on preventing people from telling others what they know about these odd, ludicrous and fake healing acts
4.) ignore behaviours or activities that are wrong, and pretend that what others have noticed is not happening
5.) would do nothing or wouldn't say anything, to stop it or at least warn others about it
6.) ignore evidences or avoid unpleasant facts about it when presented to them
7.) pretend nothing unusual is happening and also pretend all is hunky-dory
8.) fabulate to divert attention away from the exposé, in doing this, trying to get people forget about the exposé and hopefully have it fizzled out.

You don't have to be verbose, saying one thing as eight. Two, learn to be more accurate in your reports. i believe you're referring to https://www.nairaland.com/1790500/word-faith-movements-doctrine-proponents/5 plus and minus two pages. What we were against is condemnation and gloating which Jesus Himself is against. We're not against speaking or corrections. i also had to give you guys a sense of direction and purpose when you all were missing it, beating about the bush. Like around https://www.nairaland.com/1790500/word-faith-movements-doctrine-proponents/6#24868462 your fellows seemed to have a phobia for known names around.

MarkMiwerds:
interesting... So you are admitting

1. You oppress the poor to increase your riches

or

2. You foolishly give your money to a rich pastor

Read again. i admit you're quoting the old testament
to threaten me. You're no much different from those you condemn for using Malachi to threaten others, only poorer perhaps.

christemmbassey:
I thought u're a Nigerian?

So? i thought you were a professing Christian?

Bidam:
i never no say shdemidemi aka demisquare get vinegar for mouth like this. Chei..Image123 don suffer persecutions for nairaland o. Imagine calling some one a love-vendor? Na christians una be so?

hahahaha, truth is bitter.

MarkMiwerds:
Proverbs 22:16 (KJV) 16 He that oppresseth the poor to increase his [riches, and] he that giveth to the rich, [shall] surely [come] to want.

Amen. Ironically you're quoting the old testament to threaten me. Try giving to God.

trustman:
Sacrifices are biblical in the sense that they are in the Bible but are christians still required to offer sacrifices today?
The answer is No. Why not?
Something better has replaced them.
So when you guys use the 'it's biblical' or 'it is by faith' and other excuses to tithe when you try to hide your real intentions you are really being dishonest.
Ask yourself a simple question - "What is the New Covenant all about?"

What replaced sacrifices? Any bible verse that says that?
What replaced tithes? Any bible verse that says that?

Zikkyy:
How come you are not offering burnt offering? is burnt offering not biblical?

auntie me me me. Rubbish.

TheShopKeeper:
Yes you're right Jews don't believe in Jesus, because they still held on to some of their laid down laws and tithing is not one of them.
They even paid their tithes during the time of Jesus, so Image123, what has not believing in Jesus got to do with tithing.

What has what Jews do got to do with what i do?

MarkMiwerds:
but it sure is missed by the extortioner behind the pulpit

i don't know, i wonder how you know. What i know is that some tithe preaching and accepting churches have a lot of money and that hurts you despite your not giving them a dime. Your tithe is not missed in heaven or earth.

christemmbassey:
Oga Image123, wetin happend? Them doon carry ya tithe box?

Oh wrong post, i've edited it. i'm not your oga BTW. You have no issues calling me oga or master but you'd squeal and pant if others are called daddy or father.

edited.
wrong post.

nlMediator:
Looks like you don't know our good brother. He'll respond that he does not preach experience; only the Word of God. Then, he'll go into some mumbo jumbo about the Greek version of particular words, armed with Strong's or Vine's Dictionary. I only hope he does not do damage to the unwary.

You sabi that guy very well, even his pin code.

TheShopKeeper:
A question to the pro-tithers' camp.

Do the present day Jews still pay their tithes (monetary or agricultural) & also do they still have to give firstfruit offerings?

Whose business? They don't even believe in Jesus the last time i heard.

Zikkyy:
Whose tithe are you paying? God's or pastor's tithe.

I know pastor's tithe require some bit of calculation e.g. tithe of gross income, tithe of net income after deducting PAYEE, tithe of net income after deducting PAYEE, Pension, and even loan e.t.c



....since a tenth is 10% of a whole, therefore tithe = 10% of a whole.....

God's tithe is not a fixed 10% (ranges from 0 - 10%) so the above is not applicable. It should be applicable to pastoral tithe which starts at 10% (for stingy tithers).



am not trying to win an argument. just having fun with ma free time. Thats all.



Now i know why you are not happy. Because i refuse to forget ya past blunders. Are you saying you want to start with a clean slate? This will cost you 10% for the next 6 months. since you are ma friend, i will give a discount of 2%. What sayeth thee?

have fun. Others continue to understand and give the tithe without giving themselves an headache. Your tithe hasn't been missed in heaven all this while.

BabaGnoni:
^^^
If wishes were horses, then beggars would ride
Fact is, it sure caused a hullabaloo, adjusting or straightening ties and fidgeting

What is your take on what "Baba" meant when effectively announcing prophesy is fulfilled and declaring at the 2.13 minutes that:
"... this is the first time we've HAD the full manisfestation of that anointing..."

I don't give a damn, lol.

BabaGnoni:
Hacker's Tsunami - hackers hacked the server and deleted the uneasiness data.
but intrigued by what "Baba" meant by announcing prophesy is fulfilled and effectively declaring at the 2.13 minutes that:
"... this is the first time we've HAD the full manisfestation of that anointing..."

convenient testimony.

Zikkyy:
Basic maths? you rely on basic maths for ya tithing practice? So it is basic maths that says tithe is 10% of a whole? You can keep ya definition of tithe, we will go with the bible's definition. If you ever bothered to read the bible you will see that God's tithe ranges from 0 to 10%. Let me help you....

Leviticus 27:32 (NIV)
32 Every tithe of the herd and flock—every tenth animal that passes under the shepherd’s rod—will be holy to the Lord.

God said every 'tenth animal' that passes under the shepherd's rod belong to him. if there are only 9 animal, there is no tithe (0%), and if you have 19 animals only one gets to pass under the shepherd's rod resulting in a tithe of 5.2%. It obvious that God was not considering percentages when he was defining his tithe.

How is tithe calculated in any age or form without basic maths? Do you rely on common sense when you read or write? Tithe is a tenth and a tenth is ten percent of a whole. Anyone understands that, stop being ridiculous in your attempt to win an argument. Also, quit your selective reading, comprehension and memory retention of what you've read from me on tithes. At least, you exhibited uncommon awe at my posts made months ago, enough to quote them continuously. Link them together, make good use of that God given brain of yours.

dp

BabaGnoni:
EXCERPT
Please note that of course, there are loads of others, that had equally taught, received, allowed or taken part in this activity known as the "HOLY GHOST LAUGHTER along with slain in the spirit" doctrine (e.g. Oral Roberts, Paul Crouch of TBN, Kenneth Copeland etc just to name a few)
the thread at this juncture is singling Hagin out with this doctrine because of the following:

1) First as a result of his prominent Father of WoF position.
2) Second, from the word go, this doctrine like every other doctrine in WoF, had started with Hagin (i.e. he had been in the forefront of the "HOLY GHOST LAUGHTER along with slain in the spirit" doctrine) along with new-WoF-kid-on-the-block Howard Rodney-Brown who earlier had got into the action (i.e. as like they mostly do with every other WoF doctrine) brought the doctrine up another notch or level up to the point of ludicrous
(e.g. as like was done with name-it... claim it, financial posterity etc doctrines)
3) Lastly, he had prophesied that there will be waves of God's glory never witnessed before sweeping across the country and world at large

As regards #3, simple research on Hagin or if one had been following Hagin, one would have noticed that he had previously "prophesied" (i.e. this prophecy he made, is captured on video) about a new wave of anointing that will sweep and move across the country and the world at large.

This "Holy Ghost laughter and slain in the spirit" thing is what Hagin declared to be the first filling demonstration of the new spiritual anointing he said God had promised him.

Hagin usually starts with quoting scriptures also along the line, in other incidents, he usually gets his music director to sing the "laughing song" repeatedly over and over, to get attendees worked up for the frenzy (i.e. this can be seen done in other videos)

The lyrics in the songs are for example: "Laughing, laughing, laughing is so much fun..." etc. He also says, when the spirit moves, just jump in, as in, laugh along (i.e. fake the laugh, until to make or start to laugh)

You see, Hagin, been an Apostle that he claims he was, had prophesied (i.e. this is captured on video) that God promised Him that a new wave of special anointing will sweep across the country and beyond.
EXCERPT

HOLY GHOST LAUGHTER along with slain in the spirit:
https://www.nairaland.com/1790500/word-faith-movements-doctrine-proponents/7#24937905

Hear "Baba" announcing prophesy is fulfilled and effectively declaring at the 2.13 minutes that:
"... this is the first time we've HAD the full manisfestation of that anointing..."

Where's the so called uneasiness you claimed it caused?