₦airaland Forum

Zikkyy: ? Please provide examples of indivisible tithe-able items the Jews had issues with and resorted to paying equivalent.

people gave tithes of money from their income . And people also redeem tithes with money. It's not every plant,crop or animal God accept for such money is given.

Leviticus 27:31
And if a man will at all redeem ought of his tithes, he shall add thereto the fifth part thereof.

Concerning other income ,Luke 18 is clear on this

Luke 18:12
I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

They tithed from all possessions and income.

Luke 18:12.( Amp)
I fast twice a week and tithe on all my income. '

Luke 18:12 (message)
I fast twice a week; I give tithes of all that I gain.

Luke 18:12 ( GWT)
I fast twice a week, and I give you a tenth of my entire income. '


They pay tithes of their income.


Matthew 23:23 (NLT)
. . . For you are careful to tithe even the tiniest income from your herb gardens, but you ignore the more important aspects of the law—justice, mercy, and faith. You should tithe, yes, but do not neglect the more important things.

Matthew 23:23 (message)
. . You keep meticulous account books, tithing on every nickel and dime you get, but on the meat of God's Law, things like fairness and compassion and commitment-- the absolute basics!-- you carelessly take it or leave it. Careful bookkeeping is commendable, but the basics are required.

Zikkyy: No dispute sir, the reason i said 'some' agric produce. Thanks for the 'clarification and amplification' (so readers don't end up more confused) .

It's only devoted things that can't be redeemed. For example if an animal is devoted and it's not fit just like the case of the first fruit. You will replace it with another animal because God can't accept unfit aniimal but that unfit one can't be redeemed back , you will kill the unfit one and the new replacement. Because its already concentrated .

Leviticus 27:32-33
And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto the Lord. 33 He shall not search whether it be good or bad, neither shall he change it: and if he change it at all, then both it and the change thereof shall be holy; it shall not be redeemed.

Enigma: ^^^ Bros, correct but clarification and amplification as below.

The only time that tithe was authorised to be converted to money was when the place to go for worship was too far to carry the agricultural produce and livestock that were the tithes; in that case it was acceptable to sell the "tithes" (livestock and produce) and convert it to money ----- but then the money was not to be given to anyone (whether G.O., pastor, papa, pope or whatever); instead the "tither" was instructed to use the money to buy whatever his heart desired and generally to jollify himself and his family together with widows, orphans aliens etc. )

That's a different one , it's a love feast. It's not the annual tithe . This is a special tithe of tithes every 3 years that they bring together to eat as a feast and the individual contribution can be converted to money as well and used to buy things for the feast

Tithe generally was substituted with cash. Not every thing is acceptable in the temple that's only a part. People gave tithes of all things . There's things that are indivisible . You only tithe from its equivalent.

Genesis 14:20
And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And he gave him tithes of all.

Luke 18:12
I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

Tithes of all were given in cash. Cash is a general medium of exchange

Kenyan 28: .
Having a baby without a uterus is magic not miracle for God created the uterus to hold the foetus. Its like telling me that somebody is seeing with their hands instead of the eyes. Wake up from this dream plz Pastor Joagbage!

Healing maimed cut off hands must have been magic too , isn't it? Since the maim had new body parts created.

Matthew 15:30
And great multitudes came unto him, having with them those that were lame, blind, dumb, maimed, and many others, and cast them down at Jesus 'feet; and he healed them:

SirJohn: @Joagbaje,
Can you show the world just one case in the bible where someone got healed by Jesus and later relapsed? Just one please

Every thing is not written in the bible ,but it's obvious from christ word. It's a spitiual principle.



John 5:14
Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.

Matthew 12:43-45
When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none. 44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished. 45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first.

Jesus obviously spoke from experience, Some times Jesus had to commad a devil not to come back. It's based on his experience with demons. They can come back.

Mark 9:25
When Jesus saw that the people came running together, he rebuked the foul spirit, saying unto him, Thou dumb and deaf spirit, I charge thee, come out of him, and enter no more into him.


We have personal responsibility to miracles. Nuella shared an example here the other about Peter. At the command of Jesus he walked on the water,but when he observed the wind , fear came and the miracle failed , even in the presence of Jesus . He started sinking. It's the same thing for salvation. If someone lost his salvation ,you can't blame the minister who led him to christ, we have personal responsibility.

Kenyan 28: Anger is not sinning, as long as I dont take a day with it

It's not the feeling of anger I'm addressing, it's the display of your anger I'm talking about . You used to insult people on this forum concerning your miracle . You have deleted the posts , but I cautioned you those days.

I cant remember breaking any of the 10 commandments. I cant remember fonicating,comming adultery,killing, idol worshiping(like u do to Chris Pastor) etc....Which sin did I commit??

Your still a baby christian . ( not insult but observation). What has 10 commandment got to do with this. What kind of church do you attend? The problem is getting clearer now. Obviously you are not attending a faith teaching church. This is one of the reason certain people are told to attend a christ embassy church for at least a month after healing school. To build their faith more before going back to their churches

A woman once got healed in a Benny hinn meeting. of cancer or so. She had constant pain every day. But when Benny him prayed for her, she got healed . Medically and bodily. Every pain left. She attended his church for few days and told him she wanted to go back to her old church,he told her to stay for more weeks to build her faith more but she insisted ,saying "people love me over there and they are missing me". He reluctantly agreed . But when she returned the pastor asked if the rumor is true ,she affirmed ,and he said "Give the glory to God ,anybody can be healed ,once your mind is alert". He talked down on the miracle. About 6 months or so later she began to experience symptoms of pain. She ran back to Benny hinn , he asked what she was told over there, she narrated . He asked , you've been sick all these years , was there any day you didn't experience pain? She said No, and when you were prayed for ,pain stopped. She said yes. He lamented . " six month of faith gone" because She went to dwell in the atmosphere of unbelief . You got healed , but you lost it dear, and you're not helping yourself at all.

Kenyan 28: And stop dwelling on this woman alone, EXPLAIN THE DEATH OF THE 4 WOMEN I TOLD U. 1 .

You don't want to talk about a woman who's pain and evidence of cancer had disssapeard but you want to dwell on those you claim lost their healing . That's dishonest .

Kenyan 28: Again @Joag,I told u earlier and repeat that that lady has never gone back for medical check up after the HL session infact, she assumes she is healed. and like I said, al be here to tell when she dies of the same coz it wont take long.
.

You cannot be wishing another person. Evil just because you failed to keep yours. What about the thousands that have been healed for years . What about those who got miracle baby without medicine.

A couple from Canada ,wife had no uterus ,got pregnant and gave bith is that palabo illusion?

Kenyan 28: Drugs are working perfectly for my baby,

Well enjoy your DRUGS

2good: You still did not show where bible said you can substitute money for tithe. You are deducing your claims personally in order to satisfy your interest

Pls don't let us go in circles. God doesn't accept unclean,blind,maimed,animals as offerings and tithes. Same principles bind the two. Such animals were redeemed by cash . To redeem means to buy it back . To buy it back means you pay money value of than animal. Not only that. People have the choice of giving money value for tithe.

Leviticus 27:30-31
"One- tenth of what comes from the land, whether grain or fruit, is holy and belongs to the LORD. 31 If you buy back any part of it, you must add one- fifth more to it.

Leviticus 27:30-31
"A tenth of the produce of the land, whether grain or fruit, is the Lord's, and is holy. 31 If anyone wants to buy back this fruit or grain, he must add a fifth to its value.

So the difference is, if you're paying money value ,you will add interest of 20% on it.

CrazyMan: Tithing is an old testament law...pastors revived it in our generation to scam members.

Did Jesus pay tithe...NO

Did his disciples pay tithe...NO

Did Jesus specifically tell us to pay tithe....NO

Did Jesus say we should love and assist our brethren...Yes.

So if we must love our brethren and assist those in need, why should I pay 10% of my sweat into the life of one rich billionaire?

Why wouldn't I just use it to assist my brethren in need.

Don't be deceived bro Joe...tithing is a scam.

That's not the point. The question here was if money was used for tithe and I've cleared that

Because offerings and tithes were redeemed with money. they were based in the same principles. God doesn't accept unclean things as tithes or offerings .

Leviticus 27:31
And if a man will at all redeem ought of his tithes, he shall add thereto the fifth part thereof.

Hope you're clear now

Kenyan 28: Nonesence, u should be asking how long it took me to find out that HIV had not gone anywhere from my system not about other pple's "miracle" which am not sure that they even got.
Good enough I'll be here to tell when they die of the same.
Again, explain about the 4 dead women I have talked about earlier who thot they got the miracle from the so called healing school.

Healing can be lost through sin. You have issues with temper. I still remember talking to you those days about the kind of anger you display on this forum insulting those who doubted your healing. Healing can be lost by unchecked sin such as these .you ought to humble yourself to be helped. What you needed to do is to have seen a minister to help you deal with It . I would have ministered to you on you on the phone but i felt one on one would be quicker I made arrangement for you to see the Kenya pastor ,you agreed but didnt show up,

Drugs can't solve your problem. , but you were sure you were healed. I called you that time not to give false testimony. how could symptoms of HIV cease and medical test fom he same hospital where you once tested positive change . Even if your healing was based on Sirjohn palabo effect or whatever ,it will not escape medical test. What is the church gain here. You didn't pay for the healing. Church didn't use your case for "advert" what is the church gain. You are the one who use your mouth to come tell us here you were healed. You even gave your Dr your Nairaland password to testify here.

It's your responsibility to keep your healing . You were taught in the healing school how to maintain healing. You were told counter attack may happen based on bible principle .

These are one of the reason healing may be lost.

John 5:14
Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.


Matthew 12:43-45
When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none. 44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished. 45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first.

but it's not a death sentence. It's a fight of faith. I have dealt with it in my health and others too. There is no healing ministry such things may not happen. Instead of playing hero to doubters here you had better save your health.When you are through playing hero here,everybody will go home but you're left with what you're left with. If you enjoyed heal from 8year long HIV and symptoms suddenly stop for over a year. Medical record shows you clean, your doctors were surprised, YOU WERE HEALED BY JESUS. The healing is still in you . You only need to stir it up by faith. Remember your lady friend is still enjoying her healing from stomach cancer. You told me she is even interceding for you but you seem to have lost your faith. How can prayer work.

Sirniyeh: Mr. Joe, open your bible and tell us where it is stated that people gave money as tithe.

People gave money for tithe or offering in the bible days for several reason. God accepted tithes of crops ,plant and animals for two reasons, 1. The people were predominantly farmers by default. 2.those items were needed in the temple.

But it is not every plant ,crop,and animals God accepted. Some are unclean animals. You can't imagine someone bring pig ,marijuana plant , dog, Carmel and all manner of unclean beast into the holy temple.

Those who rear unclean things have to substitute them for money either for tithe or offering. It is called redemption. You redeem it with money to fulfill the tithe purpose.


Leviticus 27:27
And if it be of an unclean beast, then he shall redeem it according to thine estimation, and shall add a fifth part of it thereto: or if it be not redeemed, then it shall be sold according to thy estimation


Leviticus 27:31
And if a man will at all redeem ought of his tithes, he shall add thereto the fifth part thereof.


In a clearer translation (GWT)

Leviticus 27:27
But if it is an unclean animal, it must be bought back. The payment will be its full value plus one- fifth more. If it is not bought back, it must be sold at the value given it.

There's a special tithe of tithes also which is eaten with the priest and the poor . If you can't bring your animal to the temple ,you can convert the tithe to money also and used it for the purpose of the feast in the temple.

Deuteronomy 14:24-25
And if the way be too long for thee, so that thou art not able to carry it; or if the place be too far from thee, which the Lord thy God shall choose to set his name there, when the Lord thy God hath blessed thee: 25 Then shalt thou turn it into money, and bind up the money in thine hand, and shalt go unto the place which the Lord thy God shall choose:


Generally money is a medium of exchange. People gave money as tithe. Tithes is not limited to plants and animal only .People gave tithe of all their possession. Income earners give tithes as well. Everyone tithed . Because tithe belongs to God. Is a mans way of recognizing God as his source.

2 Corinthians 10:10
I know that someone is saying that my letters are powerful and strong, but that I'm a weakling and a terrible speaker.

Hope it's clearer now..

People have always given money as tithe right from bible days

Bidam: Now my question is: what is the difference between vocation, calling,occupation and profession? A mature christian response is needed here pls.

Some ministers have calling into full time ministry some have calling into lay ministry. Those who are called into full time have to resign from their jobs while those called into lay ministry can still do their jobs and businesses. That's the case of most pastors under a ministry. So for the full time ministers it's their vocation and jobs . But lay ministers have their secular jobs .

obalola7: Please rephrase that comment in bold. Paul was the most eloquent and most read of all the apostles.
So dont say that in public that Paul wasn't eloquent. of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;"[/b]

Bible evidence reveals paul wasnt a gifted or eloquent speaker like other Learned speakers of his day.

1 Corinthians 2:3-4
And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling. 4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom,

2 Corinthians 10:10
For his letters, say they, are weighty and powerful; but his bodily presence is weak, and his speech contemptible.

Acts 17:18
Then certain philosophers of the Epicureans, and of the Stoicks, encountered him. And some said, What will this babbler say? .

Similar testimony was shared in ph by a brother who's car was ridden with bullets from Ak 47 . Robbers or assassins . But he wasn't hurt.

@sir john

I'm still waiting for your email though I know joagbaje may have discouraged you from writing me but its okay, I'm still here by Gods grace and will be waiting.

It's sad that you don't know the kind of person I am. I can't do that. I stand for truth here. And truth is in Jesus . If there's anyone concerned about her matter . I am , I called the pastor of Kenya to minister to her . Because there is still hope . Healing can be attacked . You have to stay in faith to deal with it. I have share my testimony here before of how I got healed of regular malaria , eye defect and cold . After my healing of the regular malaria , symptoms came again and I have learnt how to use word if faith. I dealt with it . I shared 2 years ago or so . I will try to find that thread so there's. No big deal .if you have been healed . Healing is still n your . Stir it up . The way she's going now can make it challenging to even help her

@ Kenya 28
Pls let's deal with fact . I know you're angry . But you're still a christian. How long has this woman been healed of cancer . 1 year 2 years. 3 years? Pls be honest

Kenyan 28: BY THE TIME SHE WAKES UP FROM THE BAD DREAM,SHE WILL FIND THAT CANCER HAS SPREAD ALL OVER HER BODY.

How long has her healing been now? How many years or months. Pls be honest

Zikkyy: Because you must justify tithe, you continue to rubbish Christ's priesthood. How can you say Christ is replacing Melchizedek in office? You have succeeded in elevating Melchizedek and ranking him alongside Christ. I wonder what you hope to gain by this?

Hebrews 7:17
For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

Christ is high priest in after order of Melchizedek . I didn't write the bible. Or is there a christ order. Ok let's say christ is high priest in the order of Jesus . Is that ok with you ? Since you can't accept the bible.

pastormustwacc: ^^^Dont mind them, them no fit talk on my thread
No more tithing

Did anybody care to read the thread ?

BERNIMOORE: joagbaje will quote from New living translation NLT (2007)for you now, by Kenneth taylor specially designed for pastors by kenneth taylor (in his preface) to suit pastors who branded the earlier Living bible and king james version (1611) unsuitable.

When I quote paul you guys will say we exalt Paul above Jesus , when I quote Jesus ,you say it's under the law. When I quote a simple grammer translation you attack the author.

@kenya28
You told me about a lady in Kenya who got healed of stomach cancer . She got healed before you got healed. Did her cancer come back? Please answer me in all honesty.

Pastor Anita
Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the
great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; Who gave himself for
us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto
himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works (Titus 2:13-14).
There’re those who ignorantly weep over the sufferings of
Christ on the cross for us, lamenting what pain and
humiliation He suffered for our sakes. Yes, Christ suffered
for us on the Cross, but that suffering brought us eternal
life, and ushered us into everlasting victory. It was God-
ordained that Christ should suffer and the result of His
suffering be glory, victory, success and prosperity for us
all: "Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of
Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified
beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow" (1
Peter 1:11).
Rather than lament, we ought to celebrate that Jesus died for us; we ought
to declare, everyday, the victory of His death. Jesus didn’t die for nothing; His
death gave mankind victory over sin and its effects. By hanging on the Cross,
as God’s sacrifice for sin, He took your place and gave you the victory. Now,
God wants you not only to proclaim that victory, but to live every day in the
victory of His death, burial and glorious resurrection.

@op

the fact that you visit a church doesnt mean you know everythinhg they preach there. some churches teach in series. so it depends on the series they were on or topic they were dealing with. such as marriage, fsithfulness,stewardship,soulwinning,prayets, studying, spritual growth,finances.dominion over sin etc.

you cant preach everything in one service. one church is teaching on yhe gifts of the holy spirit another one is teaching on end time. you cant come into a conclusion by one service. of course some churches msy empasise on certain truths more thsn the other . you dont criticise them. find a church that suits you. if you want to hear about sin everyday just look for a church that preach "you sinner" and enjoy yourself there. some people actually enjoy the message of condemnation . it makes the cry and repent every day. follow your heart.

saintvc: I am concerned about the whole issue of church leadership. Are all ministers qualified to be preach at the pulpit.

every christian is qualified to preach Gods word. it doesnt have to be at the pupilt . there is a diffedence between ministring to the world ( siners) and ministring to the body of christ. we can all edify one.another and exhort one another' you musnt be a pastor to do that.

What qualifies one to minister Gods word, elevated to point of pastorate or leadership in the church.

Preaching Gods word.and pastorate. are two diffrerent things. Leadership and preaching are two different things. to teach Gods word . you must have a deep hunger for knowledge and study. but pastoring is a responsibility and a calling. it can be by delegation too to a great extent. so we have two kinds of pastors. some are called and chosen by christ and some are given such responsibility . they dont necessarily have to recieve a special call by vision or voice.

For other profesion,from enginers to doctors,you should pass some trainin to show u poses d skill necesary to be a licesd profesional.
How does this work for the pastor? How is he certified a pastor? Any qualification?

God doesnt need human skill to use you in ministry. paul wasnt an eloquent speaker. infact he was a bad communicator. but its not a bad idea if a minister takes some lesson to polish himself anyway.

There is need for ministerial training but thus training is not like lecture. its a character training. it comes by service. when you serve an older minister, youre being trained. your attitude and.character are being dealt wirh. the preaching at the pulpit is the smallest part of.ministry. anybody can preach. the major training of a minister is. attitude ,character and in the holyghost. and also your oversight , how to have genuine care for people. ministry is responsibility. washing other peoples mess, so one shoukdnt be driven by the desire to mount.pulpit but desire to serve .

A man must have served in some lower capacity responsibility in a church and prove his faithfulness before he ascend to higher respinsibility

Boomark: hahaha.

And one of the more important things is giving to the poor. It is under loving your neighbours and more important than your tithe

Giving to the poor existed under the law, so why don't you assume it's wrong now in the new testament?