₦airaland Forum

[quote author=tpia. link=topic=386084.msg5369970#msg5369970 date=1264201619]why do people find this look and these mannerisms attractive? [/quote]What i think the OP is trying to say is that pentecostal pastors are notorious for speaking Jargons like the boy was saying in the video.

Joagbaje:
You guys are diverted the focus of this thread. If a pastor commit murder,he is a murderer likewise if he kidnaps ,he is a kidnaper and should face the law not necessary as a pastor but as a muderer or kidnaper repectively.Now many Pastors are been labelled ignorantly as theivesnot because of any crime but because they teach principles from bible and people give money in churches. Based on the scriptures i gave , which backs up what they do in discharge of their duty and ministry , is it proper to call them thieves for teaching what is based on the bible.
Your argument for or against should be bible based with reference to the scriptures i quoted in the opening or any relevant scriptures of yours.

This should be intelectual discussion and not the agbero style of " you they craze ,you dey mad , you dey gbongbolo siga"

On the contrary to the highlighted above they twist scriptures from the bible to deceive believers into giving money to them. The emphasis of christian giving in the bible is to give to the poor and the needy and NOt greedy men parading themselves as men of god.

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=383422.msg5374863#msg5374863 date=1264292647]Did he steal from Christ Embassy?[/quote]I don't think so, even amongst thieves there is honour.

Azibalua:
Wonderful, the truth really hurts,its you who needs help can't you see that the god of this world has so blinded your eyes to spiritual things as simple as this.
But thanks be unto god who in his infinite mercy has made it possible for the likes of you to come to the knowledge of his word.

Well as a christian i ought to put you on the right path, go and search your scriptures well and you would discover the emphasis on christian giving is to the poor an the needy and not to the church or pastors. Christian teachings are the teacchings of christ and the apsotles in the bible and NOT old testament [judaism] teachings that preachers now smuggle into christianity and twist for  their benefit. Contrary to your false assertions that you only get blesssed when you give to these false prophets that teach these heresies Jesus specifically taught that giving to the poorand needy is giving to him and the reward is the Kingdom of heaven which such people would be admitted to. Tithing, first fruit and seed sowing are NOT christian teachings but rather Judaism, those teachings are not applicable to christians as doctrine as the apostles never taught them to the church and it was never a practise of the christian church founded by the apostles. Below is what christ as to say about giving to the poor and needy + the glorious reward that awaits those who do it.

Matthew 25:31-40:

The Final Judgment
   31 “But when the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit upon his glorious throne. 32 All the nations[b] will be gathered in his presence, and he will separate the people as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will place the sheep at his right hand and the goats at his left.
   34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the Kingdom prepared for you from the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry, and you fed me. I was thirsty, and you gave me a drink. I was a stranger, and you invited me into your home. 36 I was naked, and you gave me clothing. I was sick, and you cared for me. I was in prison, and you visited me.’
   37 “Then these righteous ones will reply, ‘Lord, when did we ever see you hungry and feed you? Or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 Or a stranger and show you hospitality? Or naked and give you clothing? 39 When did we ever see you sick or in prison and visit you?’
   40 “And the King will say, ‘I tell you the truth, when you did it to one of the least of these my brothers and sisters,[ you were doing it to me!’

If you still want to pursue this argument with me kindly post at least one scripture in the new testament in it's proper context were believers are taught to give to their pastors and preachers as a means for receiving blessings. Just one scripture abeg!!!!!

The church is supposed to lead the way in helping the needy and the down trodden, unfortunately the church has allowed the "secular" world to far out do them in this area of their supposed core competence. See what those who are considered "unbelievers" [hollywood stars] are doing to help the needy and the down trodden[christ, ref : matthew 25: 31-40]


[size=20pt]All-star Haiti telethon raises $57 million, so far[/size]

By NEKESA MUMBI MOODY, AP Music Writer
Sat Jan 23, 4:18 PM PST

Organizers for the all-star "Hope for Haiti Now" telethon say the event raised $57 million — and counting.

"The public has set a new standard of giving for a relief telethon with 'Hope for Haiti Now,' and the donations continue to come in," Lisa Paulsen, president and CEO of the Entertainment Industry Foundation, said in a statement released Saturday. The group is helping to oversee the funds gathered from the event.

The two-hour telethon aired Friday night on the major networks and dozens of other channels, including MTV, Bravo, and PBS, and was also streamed live online. Stars like Brad Pitt, Beyonce, Madonna, Bruce Springsteen and more used their presence to encourage donations for Haiti, following a Jan. 12 earthquake that killed an estimated 200,000 people.

The total released Saturday includes money raised by phone, text and the Web. It does not include donations by corporations or via iTunes, where people are able to buy performances of the event for 99 cents each, or the entire album for $7.99. Those funds also go to Haiti relief.

The "Hope for Haiti Now" CD is the biggest one-day pre-order in the site's history and the new song "Stranded (Haiti Mon Amour)" by Jay-Z, Rihanna, Bono and the Edge, debuted during the telethon, is the No. 1 single on iTunes.

People can donate via text, phone or through the "Hope for Haiti" Web site for the next six months. Among the organizations who will receive funds from the telethon include Oxfam America, UNICEF, and the Clinton-Bush Haiti Foundation.

http://tv.yahoo.com/news/article/tv-news.en.ap.org/tv-news.en.ap.org-20100124-us_haiti_telethon

[quote author=Tudór link=topic=386661.msg5375594#msg5375594 date=1264317162]How is that an EXCUSE for you to strap on bombs and go blow up innocent people? [/quote]any excuse would do, the fact that you are not a muslim is enough reason to blow your brains off!

[quote author=Azibalua link=topic=383412.msg5372607#msg5372607 date=1264261284][/quote]Whoever you are,you desperately need help to be freed from the shackles of the anti -christ and satan.

Uncle Sege is definitely by far the best president this country has ever had no matter what all the ill informed people on this forum say. despite all his short comings, [i agree he had plenty sef] baba was still highly commited and he gave his best to the development of this country. Also under him we witnessed massive economic growth even though some haters would deny that but the facts and figures are there for all to see that is apart from the fact that it was obvious the economy had gained a lot of strength under him. I sincerely miss baba in power, i really wish his third term ageanda had sailed through , i am sure we won't be in all the mess we are today.

toba:
My ques to mr kunle.We have all admitted dat we need to give offerings&tithes/alms.Now how&what are we suppose to give? Our produce or our product? The moslems give sakat which is money,so as xtians what are we to give

I have never admitted it is ok for christians to tithe becos as far as the bible is concerned it is an anulled practise [hebrew 7:12&18] and the wway we understand and practise tithing today is wrong and contrary to the scriptures also bearing in mind that the type of tithing practised today is a man made version different from the way it was described in the bible in deut 14:22-29. However if a christian having come to the knowledge of truth about tithing and he knows in his mind that he still wants to give a portion of his salary towards the gospel be it 1% , 10% or whatever he/she chooses then there is nothing wrong with that. But there is everything wrong with preachers twisting God's word to extort tithes and first fruits money from the flock. I won't bother to address the question you asked as i see chukwudi as already done a very good job on that. All that i would add is that the emphasis of christian giving as taught in the bible is giving to the poor and needy the "church" comes second after that contrary to what ever impression you have been given before now. If you are in doubt do a research on all the christian teachings on giving in the new testament and read it in their proper context then you would get the picture

Joagbaje:
Annunaki

Food was not twisted to mean money,Money is our medium of exchange. They gave of fruits ,crops etc then, but not all were acceptable, Unclean animals were unacceptable, You cant bring pig to the temple,or backside. Even in the Old testament , there is provision to redeem with money equivalent of animals that are unworthy and for man.

Leviticus 27:11-13
And if it be any unclean beast, of which they do not offer a sacrifice unto the Lord, then he shall present the beast before the priest: [12] And the priest shall value it, whether it be good or bad: as thou valuest it, who art the priest, so shall it be. [13] But if he will at all redeem it, then he shall add a fifth part thereof unto thy estimation.

Besides we work primarily for money, So money is the harvest, You pay tithe from the harvest.(MONEY) A man can still give materials if it will be of use in the house of God. If someone gives me 10 laptops. I can send one to the church. It will be of use but Icant send ice cream to church.So if a man deals on cassava, instead of bringing cassava as tithe he sells it and give money equivalent.

Even though i have addressed this issue several times on this forum i would repeat it again for the benefit of annunaki and others who might be deceived by the twisted logic you posted above. It is a blatant lie that food was a medium of exchange at any time in the biblical times in fact in the original scriptures where the commandment of tithing was given in the bible[deut 14:22-29], money was mentioned so obvious money was alredy in use at that time and it was NOT tithable as the money in question which was proceeds from farm produce to be tithed was still instructed by God to be used to purchase food items to be eaten by the tither. Now if Tithe was meant to be money God would not have given the instruction to the tither to use the money to bu food stuffs and still eat it himself with his family. This lie that food items was used as tithes then becos money was not in existence has gone on for to long and it is on the basis of this lie that the whole tithing fraud is predicated on. There were a lot of other professions then and people earned money from various vocations but no one was ever asked to tithe from their income in the bible it was always strictly produce. even in the new testamen when Jesus made reference to the pharisees tithes it was mint and cumin which were farm produce as welll and we know for a fact that shekels [money] was already widely in use at the time of Jesus. The extent to which you charlatans go to twist the scripture is really nauseating i really wonder if you fear God at all or you are just in the pastoring profession becos of all the filthy lucre you derive from your churchsect. For the benefit of those who might not know i would post he deuteronomy passagewhich proves that money was in existence then and was not acceptable as an alternative to tithes becos your tithes had to be eaten by yourself and you cannot eat money.

Deuteronomy 14:25-26:
25 If so, you may sell the tithe portion of your crops and herds, put the money in a pouch, and go to the place the Lord your God has chosen. 26 When you arrive, you may use the money to buy any kind of food you want—cattle, sheep, goats, wine, or other alcoholic drink. Then feast there in the presence of the Lord your God and celebrate with your household.

Joagbaje:
A pastor is a man that forsook everything to answer the call of God, Some resigned from great positions turned their back on offers and opportunities so as to answer Gods calling. They changed men lives for the better , heal the sick cast out devils and brought the best out of people by the teaching of Gods word , He labours in prayers and intercession for the members and others.

I am yet to see any pastor that forsook everything thing as you wrongly assert above. That apart pastoring as now become one of the most lucrative and easy professions in Nigeria and all it's take to get called especially in the pentecostal fold is to just wake up one day and claim God has "called" you. Besides nobody has said all pastors are crooks, but any pastor who willfully twists the word of God for the benefit of his personal greed is most definitely a crook. This categorizes all pastors who preach tithes, first fruits and seed sowing as big time crooks. Infact this would mean all pastors in the pentecostal business are crooks since they all preach one or more of these heresies. There are several warnings in the bible against false teachers and prophets who would use the gospel to make money from us and they were described as "wolves in sheep's clothing", Frauds, hypocrites and "destined for destruction" so if the bible already condenms them we are perfectly in order to describe them as crooks. That apart we owe it a duty to our true christian brethen to tell them the antics of these wolves in sheeps clothing cos they are very hard to detect. Most of them are really smooth talking and sweet mouthed like a$$himolowo and that bleached crook called oyakhilome so we have to continually warn christians against them less they destroy more lives. The bible even says that even the God's chosen ones, the very elect would almost be deceived by these criminals how much less the average Nigerian christian who doesn't study his bible and falls for such glaring scams like tithing due to lack of knowledge. Bros i would continue to call a crook a crook as long as the person in question shows the fruits of a crook be it pastor, bishop, G.O or whatever. a crook is a crook.

What you fail to realize is that most pentecostal churches are one man shows established for the sole benefit of it's promoters. They see there churches more as their personal business though they claim to be spreading the "gospel"> asking them to unite would be akin to tell them to give up all the filthy lucre they rake in through their business churches i don't they would be ready to give up such a lucrative "calling"

selencious:
@ Kunle!!! U sound so dumb. I had better listen to the dogs bark than argue with you.

Evidently you are the daft and brainwashed brain damaged dumboron that can't read the bible for herslf and understand it. You have to wait for wolves in sheep's clothing to twist it for you b4 you can understand it and you have the Audacity to come here and accuse some one much more enlightened than your miserable self of being dumb. 

selencious:
@ Kunle! Belve whatever you wanna belve and stop making up fake epistles, Its your life right??

Which fake epistle or am i the one that wrote deuteronomy 14:22-29 which exposes tithing in our churches today as a fraud it is either you believe the word of God as it is written in the bible or you believe the twisted interpretation which some corrupt preachers have come up with. It's also your life if you choose to be deceived and live under the yoke of false preachers.

blackcypha:
`@tonye
and who told u i want2 drink 2 stupor, ?
@kunle
the stuff is not on wikipedia just checked the link now, it only listed the contents.

Just google "sixth and seventh books of moses" and "kaballah" you would find the answers you need there

deuter

toba:
I disagree with u sir. The bible says jesus rode on a donkey/camel to jerusalem. that was then becos if there had been cars, Jesus could have boarded same. Like wise agriculture was subsisting then now we have capital economy or cash economy. So those of us that use biro and computers as trade shd now take out product to church as tithes? No sir Things have changed

Paul wrote letters to timothy, Philemon and others but we dnt know how they were transmitted. If it were now it would have been done by the internet.

Sir times have change

That is the usual lie pastors tell to justify their twisting of the Malchi scripture, i would repost the deuteronomy passage were the instruction of tithing was given and explained and you would see even from that passage that tithe was clearly not money and money could not be substituted for it cos tithes was food meant to be eaten in the house of God by the tither himself + his family. Mention of money was also made in that passage, that provides clear evidence that money existed then but it was NEVER directed by God to be used as tithes as the purpose of tithes was different.

Deuteronomy 14:22-29:

22Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year.

23And thou shalt eat before the LORD thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the LORD thy God always.
24And if the way be too long for thee, so that thou art not able to carry it; or if the place be too far from thee, which the LORD thy God shall choose to set his name there, when the LORD thy God hath blessed thee:

25Then shalt thou turn it into money, and bind up the money in thine hand, and shalt go unto the place which the LORD thy God shall choose:

26And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth: and thou shalt eat there before the LORD thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household,

27And the Levite that is within thy gates; thou shalt not forsake him; for he hath no part nor inheritance with thee.

28At the end of three years thou shalt bring forth all the tithe of thine increase the same year, and shalt lay it up within thy gates:

29And the Levite, (because he hath no part nor inheritance with thee,) and the stranger, and the fatherless, and the widow, which are within thy gates, shall come, and shall eat and be satisfied; that the LORD thy God may bless thee in all the work of thine hand which thou doest.

You can see from verse 25 above that money existed then but God still instructed the tither to use the money to buy food stuff which he and his family would eat in the presence of God. Now if money was meant to be tithable, God would have simply told the tither to give the money to the levites but he didn't he asked the tither to buy food for himself and his family. If you are to review the above passage very well, you would discover that the principles behind the biblical directives on tithing is totally different from the man made version practised today. If pastors want us to practise tithing today the best way would have been to tell us to buy food stuff and bring it to church were we would eat of it with our families and also give out of it to the needy and the clergy as exemplified in the bible. At least we still eat today so you can't say that times have changed. the example of Jesus riding a donkey has absolutely no bearing on the subject matter. If situations today is different from biblical times the list we can do is still uphold the principles of the teaching and not twist it to suit our own objectives

Zikkyy:
Oga Tonye-t, which church are you talking about now? or do you mean temple? tithe was not used for church maintenance. Are you saying that Abraham was also paying tithe to a temple? Where you dey buy your bible BTW? We need to examine that your bible so we can confirm if it's an approved/authentic version.

If you be pastor you go suck your congregation dry. Tried to picture you on the pulpit preaching the good false news, the image that keeps recurring in my mind is that of Count Dracula. Am serious.

@Ogajim
Preachers like tonye-tithe and agbaje who gleefully twist scriptures have existed since old testament times, read what God has to say about such preachers below and the reason they twist scriptures:

Jeremiah 8:8-10:

    8 “‘How can you say, “We are wise because we have the word of the Lord,”
      when your preachers have twisted it by writing lies?
    9 These wise preachers will fall
      into the trap of their own foolishness,
   for they have rejected the word of the Lord.
      Are they so wise after all?
   10 I will give their wives to others
      and their farms to strangers.
   From the least to the greatest,
      their lives are ruled by greed.
   Yes, even my prophets and priests are like that.
      They are all frauds.

toba:
May God continue to bless and increase your Knowledge. The Judgement of Pastor, Bishop, Prophet Iman and Alfa rest with God and not in the hands of their followers.God said pay tithes and offerings in Malachi3 8-12 that there may be food in the house of the lord. So if the pastor use it any how, Let God judge them and not us

Key word in the above being food, i am still yet to see the scriptures or know who gave our preachers the authority to change the word of God written in the bible from food produce from yearly harvest to money from monthly/regular income. If this is not twisting the word of God what is? And the bible makes it crystal clear in the passage below that preachers twist the word of God becos of their greed. A word is enough for the wise:

Jeremiah 8:8-10:

8 “‘How can you say, “We are wise because we have the word of the Lord,”
when your preachers have twisted it by writing lies? 9 These wise teachers will fall
into the trap of their own foolishness,
for they have rejected the word of the Lord.
Are they so wise after all?
10 I will give their wives to others
and their farms to strangers.
From the least to the greatest,
their lives are ruled by greed.
Yes, even my prophets and priests are like that.
They are all frauds.

Mavenb0x:
Quote by KunleOshob:
@KunleOshob: Sincerely, I must say that it is YOU that surprises me. In my experience, lawyers have been known to make attempts to quote people out of context, and the onus would lie on the observer to consider the initial conversation from which the particular quote was referenced! I am entirely amazed to see you jumping to conclusions when you know a LAWYER is involved and I'm not the lawyer.

The thread is also my current signature, so you can see how the discussion started from the matters of salvation.

[size=13pt]So, tell me sir, DID YOU READ THE DISCUSSION?[/size] Of course you didn't because if you did you would see that

[b]1. I already said there that Hades was a weak translation for the grave, as the ancient Hebrew words insinuated that if you keep climbing upwards and out of the atmosphere, you will proceed into the "heavens" and if you dig deep subterraneously, you will enter Hades. I made it very clear on that thread that there are physical and spiritual aspects of places like Hades, where a spiritual entity causes a physical experience called death and/or the grave. I made it clear that "spiritual locations" are not places that can be described by compass bearings.

2. My point, which has been graciously distorted in Deep Sight's post above, had to do with the story of Lazarus viz a viz how Jesus said that "Today you would be with me in Paradise" to the thief on the cross.

3. The conversation had to do with the person of Christ, who said that no one else had entered into Heaven (the presence of the Father) except him who came down from there, while Deep Sight was arguing that the ancient prophets before Christ were in heaven (rendering Christ's coming as of no effect), and going on to discuss Elijah and co.[/b]

Caveat Emptor: You should KNOW that I don't talk to people on Nairaland the same way. Yourself, Viaro, Deep Sight, Ogaga4luv, The_Seeker, Mazaje, Image123, JeSoul, Olaadegbu ALL hold various worldviews and the way I discuss the matters with each person is different. If I were discussing with YOU, for instance, I believe you understand the sacrifice of Christ (or maybe I am assuming wrong there too?) so I won't bother explaining how Christ had to lead captivity captive when he swallowed up death (a.k.a Hades) and proceeded to heaven.

It would do you a lot of good to read the initial discussion thread in its entirety if you have the time, and post your views there IN LIGHT OF WHAT HAS BEEN DISCUSSED THERE rather than jumping to a billion fragmented conclusions on another thread.

P.S> By the way, if you have a problem with Oyakhilome or Ashimolowo, I suggest you take it up with them. Screaming their names at every instance - the way you do - will solve nothing. I don't attend either church (or any other you may probably have in mind) by the way, in case you are wondering. I just don't believe in talking about people in a negative way behind their backs. Where's your courage, sir? 

    i am sorry aunty, i didn't read the previuos thread i guess i was just jumping the gun. It really ticks me off when i hear people preach that "jesus went to hell to defeat the devil" which is based on wrong bible translations. Reference to a$$himolowo and oyakhilome was becos they are fond of preaching the heresy which is another glaring evidence that they are false teachers as no true teacher of the word can ever make such a glaring mistake.

Joagbaje:
@KunleOshob
Be a honporable and honest man. [b]This is tithe not temple tax. The Temple taxes were strictly for the maintainance of the temple.not for welfare of priest.[/b]The only portion the priest have was tithes and offerings of the people.
[b]
TEMPLE TAX KO, TEMPLE TAX NI

Even after showing you scriptures to show you that it was a paltry Temple Tax [and not tithes] that approved for the running of the temple, the legion of marmon demons within you would push you to dimiss it as if it is not biblical. commonsense would dictate to you that maintance money of a building, temple in this case would include the salaries and wages of the workers that work there which was the levites in the biblical case. Tithes was NEVER meant for the upkeep of the levites as it was food meant to be eaten and the levites tithes was only given once in three years. If the levites were to wait for three years before they receive their share of the tithes i am sure they would be long dead from starvation before then so evidently it was the temple tax that was being used to sustain them and not tithes as you wrongly claim cos no where in the bible was tithes ever recorded as money but temple tax was.  Trust pentecostal pastors to dismiss parts of the bible that does not favour their love for filthy lucre and marmon worship.

[quote author=Tonye-t link=topic=307798.msg5355697#msg5355697 date=1264005074]Kunle,

If you boldly and shamelessly come here to say Paul only taught Timothy and titus about running the church without lessons of making a living for themselves from the same gospel. then i'll say you are all men most hypocrite!

1 Cor 9:
>>> 13 Don't you know that those who work in the temple get their food from the temple, and those who serve at the altar share in what is offered on the altar?

>>>14 In the same way, the Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their living from the gospel.
NIV

I wish the day you'll wake up from this self delusion of deceit and rantings and embrace the simple truth in God's word[/quote]I have never for once said preachers should not earn their living from the gospel, what i have been consistent in saying is that this frauduent doctrine of compulsary tithing is wrong from the biblical perspective and it is a doctrine from the very pits of hell. Any preacher of the gospel should at least be honest enough to preach the gospel correctly and not twist it becos his god is his belly, as Jesus said you cannot serve God and marmon. That aside the scriptures you quoted were not directed to timothy or titus so what point are you trying to prove? It is not on record that Paul gave them any teachings of making a living for themselves whilst preaching the gospel. For all you know hey could have been following paul's example of working for a living and giving[not receiving] of their substance to the less priviledged in the church as Paul taught.

@Poster
This question as been thouroughly discussed and well explained on this forum before, i suggest you go through the thread below and you would find all the answers you need. Read especially ost #9 poted by black_revo. it really puts things in a clearer perspective.

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-310975.0.html

Mavenb0x:
Deep Sight! Deeeeep Sight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Wetin be this wan?

Did I say Paradise is IN hades, or did I say that prior to Christ's ressurection, paradise was in Hades?

No put words for my mouth, na beg I dey beg you.

Maven i am suprised that despite all your knowledge and exposure you could make this kind of statement. The problem is that most christians are just tooo closed minded when they read the bible and when something doesn't seem right they try and force other meanings into it. The issue of paradise being in hades is just a case of simple mis-interpretation of the bible. Hades is wrongly translated to mean hell were as in the ancient texts it was written in, it meant "land of the dead" or "grave" so when the bible says Jesus was in "hades" it has nothing to do with paradise or hell, it simply meant he was in a grave. I am also aware that this wrong translation as been the cos of several wrong teachings and doctrines especially amongst IKT preachers like A$$himolowo and crook Oyakhilome. A simple use of a bible concordance and they would have avoided this error. Yet the twarts claim that the "holy spirit" talks to them, i wonder why the holy spirit didn't tell them t stop preaching heresies based on wrong translations of the bible.

Joagbaje:

1 Cor. 9:13-14
Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? [14] Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

What was Paul refering to here using the priest as exaple ?

Malachi 3:10
Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

Paul could also have been referring to temple tax as money ordained by God for those who minister in the temple, below are some scriptures that deal on that.

2 Chronicles 24:6:

  6 So the king called for Jehoiada the high priest and asked him, “Why haven’t you demanded that the Levites go out and collect the Temple taxes from the towns of Judah and from Jerusalem? Moses, the servant of the Lord, levied this tax on the community of Israel in order to maintain the Tabernacle of the Covenant.

Apparently it was temple tax being used to maintain the temple and NOT tithes as some scammers would like us to beleive and the passage above makes it clear it was a commandment of moses and not God.

Nehemiah 10:32:

  32 “In addition, we promise to obey the command to pay the annual Temple tax of one-eighth of an ounce of silver for the care of the Temple of our God.

Above make us realize that this tax was an annual one [not monthly or weekly], it was a flat fee not based on income and it was a relatively very small amount of money. [probably why the scammers don't quote it   ]

Matthew 17:24-28:
24 On their arrival in Capernaum, the collectors of the Temple tax came to Peter and asked him, “Doesn’t your teacher pay the Temple tax?”

  25 “Yes, he does,” Peter replied. Then he went into the house.

  But before he had a chance to speak, Jesus asked him, “What do you think, Peter? Do kings tax their own people or the people they have conquered?” 26 “They tax the people they have conquered,” Peter replied.

  “Well, then,” Jesus said, “the citizens are free! 27 However, we don’t want to offend them, so go down to the lake and throw in a line. Open the mouth of the first fish you catch, and you will find a large silver coin. Take it and pay the tax for both of us.”

The passage below shows us that even though our Lord Jesus christ was recorded to have paid this paltry temple tax, he did not regard it as important and he only paid it to avoid trouble with the pharisees

Joagbaje:

1 Cor. 9:13-14
Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar? [14] Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

What was Paul refering to here using the priest as exaple ?

Malachi 3:10
Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

My friend stop trying to be clever, if Paul was refering to tithes here he would simply have said so to differentiate it from normal offerings known to be collected in the temple as he was writing to corinthian peoplewho weren't familiar with the obsolete Jewish law of tithes. That aside we all know that biblical tithes is not money but food stuffs meant to be eaten in the presence of God, so Paul could not have been referring to food stuffs when he was talking of living of the gospel. The problem is that itis the greed of man pushing forward this tithes doctrine. God as already made provisions for preachers through voluntary offerings but their greed would not make them content with that hence theytwist scripture to extort more from the sheeple.

Back to the topic.  Who is this Melcizedek?

The Order of Melchizedek

"The Lord hath sworn, and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchizedek." (Psalm 110:4)

The importance of this intriguing verse is indicated both by the fact that it is the central verse of a great Messianic Psalm (quoted at least 12 times in the New Testament) and also because this one verse constitutes one of the main themes of chapters 5-7 of Hebrews, where it is quoted no fewer than five times (Hebrews 5:6, 10; 6:20; 7:17, 21), and where Melchizedek himself is mentioned nine times.  It refers to the fascinating personage glimpsed briefly in Genesis 14:18-20.  Melchizedek (meaning "King of Righteousness" is said to have been "King of Salem" (or "Peace", but there is no record, either in secular history or elsewhere in the Bible, that there ever was such a city or earthly king.  He was also called the "priest of the most high God" (Hebrews 7:1), and he suddenly appeared, then disappeared as suddenly as he had come.

Where was i when this fallacy was posted  Mr olaadgbu, for a pastor your are doing a very poor Job and your knowledge / understanding of the scriptures is just too weak and shallow, i sincerely sympathize with the sheeple you pastor. A simple examination of a good bible concordance would tell you that "salem" in the scriptures above which you quoted is the same as "Jerusalem" "salem" was an old name for Jerusalem. So definitely Melchizedek was  the King of and earthly Kingdom and NOT what you are trying to make him out to be. 

Joagbaje:
Even though if the gentile were never under the law of Moses, Tithing was part of Abrahamic covenant. We are seed of Abraham . Law or no law is insignificant.
Worship of God came before the law , should we stop worship because we are not under law.
why is it the giving part either of offering or tithe that is paining you guys.

Another lie, tithing was never a part of the Abrahamic covenant. His act of tithing had nothing to do with God as he was merely following a babylonian custom [were he came from] of his time. It was a one off occurence and it was from war booty. Absolutely nothing to do with his covenant with God.

Joagbaje:
Paul was not a Pastor over a local Church . He would not recieve tithes from them. People give tithes in the local assembly where they recieve the word of God. They had pastors in these local churches that recieves the tithes , The local churches send money and gifts to Paul.

Kindly quote one single scripture were it is recored that local churches collected tithes. It is also note worthy that most of the new testament churches were established by Apostle Paul, in the epistles written to Timothy and Titus, Apostle paul wrote clear instructions on how to organize an run the church the practise of tithing was glaringly missing in these epistles. [For those who don't know, titus and Timothy were church bishops trained under Paul. His epistles to them was to establish the basic standards for running their churches and what was expected of each church] It was also in these epistles that Paul warned them that ministers of the Gospel must not love money unfortunately our mordern day ministers are not heeding this warning, ministriesand churches are being set up for the love of money of which tithing is one of the major scams being used to generate this money loved by the scammers sooo much.

marvis joy:
kunle,i think i support your idea on tithing,most of this pastors dont even call out to the jobless members among them to be prayed for.

You are not current on this forum, pastors pray for jobless members amongst them the only problem is that they charge these poor Jobless people heavily for their prayers that would probably not be answered. For more on the tori check out this thread : https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-380651.0.html

@Post
Why don't you google it up? It is available free on the internet. Whilst you are at it you can also do some studies on Jewish mystism [kaballah] which is closely related to these books. Literature on it is also available on the internet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sixth_and_Seventh_Books_of_Moses

@Chukwudi /Tonye-t

Not all the books claimed to be demonic by the church is actually demonic. Some of the secrets in them were actually revealed to Moses by God and that was the source of the miracles he did in freeing the children of Israel from Egypt. He was also allegdly directed by God to teach only a wise few these secret knowledge as this knowledge would be open to abuse if it was thrown out in the open. It is the on the basis of this that cults were built around these knowledge to preserve them. Cults such as AMORC / Rosicrusians are thought to have been started based on these knowledge. It is also common knowledge top members of orthodox churches[including the priesthood] especially the RCC [that are notorious for hiding information] are members of these so called cults. They are only labelled demonic to scare of people and monpolize the knowledge inheren in it.

marvis joy:
Lets come to think of it is it written in the bible that pastoring must be a full time job?

Abi oh after all the founding fathers of christianity [the apostles] used to work and they stated it clearly in the bible that it should be an example to other ministers and christians.

Acts 20:33-35:

33 “I have never coveted anyone’s silver or gold or fine clothes. 34 You know that these hands of mine have worked to supply my own needs and even the needs of those who were with me. 35 And I have been a constant example of how you can help those in need by working hard. You should remember the words of the Lord Jesus: ‘It is more blessed to give than to receive.’”


Acts 20:33-35:

33 “I [Paul]have never coveted anyone’s silver or gold or fine clothes. 34 You know that these hands of mine have worked to supply my own needs and even the needs of those who were with me. 35 And I have been a constant example of how you can help those in need by working hard. You should remember the words of the Lord Jesus: ‘It is more blessed to give than to receive.’”

2 Thessalonians 3:6-9:
6 And now, dear brothers and sisters, we give you this command in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ: Stay away from all believers[a] who live idle lives and don’t follow the tradition they received from us. 7 For you know that you ought to imitate us. We were not idle when we were with you. 8 We never accepted food from anyone without paying for it. We worked hard day and night so we would not be a burden to any of you

[quote author=Tonye-t link=topic=307798.msg5354277#msg5354277 date=1263994757]KunleOShob et al,

Christianity is a concept that got its birthing in Antioch therefore the act and name began in Antioch, If It began in the day of pentecost at least Jesus could have said "you will become Christains after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you". Its not always right to jump into saying what you barely know.[/quote]I am not suprised at the hogwash you wrote above, you have always demonstrated very poor understanding of scriptural things