₦airaland Forum

ok pls do......

anonimi: I never said anyone should be given free houses so STOP twisting my words

If you don't understand about wage disparity that I raised simply say so and I might consider educating you thereon for free, ok

......and the problems back then are still the situation today? Or the population back then are still the same today? Is the cost in real and nominal terms still same?

What will the sentiment of your wage disparities solve in the behemoth of housing gaps. Even if all the level 8 officers in Lagos are given house free of charge, how many have benefited in the larger scheme of things.

I still maintain that you are so jumpy to layout flawed assumptions with little provision for deep reasoning.

anonimi: Just a simple response to you-

- Go and find out the profile of the original buyers of the bungalows & houses built by the LASG in Surulere in the 60s and 70s.

In doing so you may find out the wage DISPARITY between civil servants & PUBLIC servants back then and why our people did not have to go into socio-economic EXILE and be second class citizens in oyinbo lands as we clamour for now.

Firefire:

anonimi:
Just so we are all sure of what we are talking about:

How much is the salary of a Level 08 Officer in the lagos state civil service

For university graduates, the entry point is between N54,000 - N58,000 per month.

GL08 – S1 will receive N648,656 and on attaining S15 will receive N696,000.Per Annum.

So, how can the above GL be able to afford a Room and Palour from the Lagos state scheme

E&OE

The danger of a limited analysis borne out of either ignorance or reasoning deficit from you both is that you present a miniscule part of the big picture, then go to town with jaundiced implication. Can you give us in the forum the demographics of the workforce in Lagos, the stats of Government to Private workers, the number of the over 20m population working for the civil service? Sticking your argument to level is simply not addressing the big picture.

Let me engage you a little along the line through which you seek to argue

1. Is the population of Lagos workforce consist of only level 8 civil servants alone? Please tell me the ratio of Level 8 workforce in all the Lagos State Civil service to the ratio Level 8 in other industries and sectors combined (Banks, FMCGs, Insurance coys, Manufacturing, Private Education and many more). Are you tell me they are not Lagosians and do not deserve access to the housing scheme?
2. Even when talking about level 8, do you expect a level 8 fresh graudate to afford any of these houses from the get-to-go? where is that obtainable anywhere in the world even with running housing schemes? I expect a Level 8 Officer in the Civil service to first commit to a savings for a period of a minimum of 3years. I expect that he'll have access to bonuses at work, loans, housing grants etc which he can add to his savings. I expect that by the 5th year he'll been in Level 9-10 pay grade and his savings capacity will improve. I expect that he starts the scheme and 10years later he'll be in Level 13-14, by then he can sell off his house and buy a bigger one
3. I have laid submissions here in the past that except we want to stay on a one-sided limited views, there are many ways even the market or street based couples can afford the 4.3m housing scheme. I made assumption that such would have been in business for a period of 5years and made committed savings as such will be able to afford 1million naira or more. I dare tell you that the average market man or woman in a typical Lagos Market can compare favourably with working class in terms of take home net (I assume how each decides to spend it depends on the individual).

Rexyl: Lets be sincere. Much of what is ongoing is as a result of the heat of election. Whether he is sincere with the projects or not the eyes that could observe closely will see the hand writing of election presure on the governor. Hope the State‘s treasure is not over blown recently sha.

1. What sincerity are you alluding to when facts on ground shows that these major projects had commenced almost 2yrs ago.
2. I am tempted to believe you're part of a collection of group thinkers who just lay falsehood without backing it up with facts.
3. Ok my take from your post, yes, you went to Osun, and you were shocked to discover that the Aregbesola that you lot had so much derided had been delivering value all the time. ...

Rexyl: I wonder why Ogbeni is overwhelmed with massive road construction at the tale end of his tenure. Hardly you won't see construction works going on at popular areas throughout Osogbo town and other major cities around. What surprised me during my brief journey through Osun State is massive construction with lots of partitions which should question the sincerity of having the projects completed. You see machines and men at work at different intervals and roads may not join together within some Months. Some of those constructions may not be completed within the next 4 years if truly the roads are to be linkedt.

Am neither saying Ogbeni is not working nor criticising him, but some of the projects I saw over their are what I could call 11th hour projects. He should have completed most of the projects earlier.

1. You are laying false information in ignorance. Just because you visited Osun at a time close to election does not translate that these project just started close to election.
2. Secondly you just layed out your ignorance with your analysis of the technical aspects. Which road construction is done starting from a point and just going on straight ahead? Do you by any chance know stuffs called surveys, alignment, water crossing etc.
3. Nutshell, your facts are erroneous and false

For the records, miracle centers and gross examination malpractices are in all places. It must be condemned and stamped out. I was made to understand that one of Kayode Fayemi's "sins" was his clamp-down and wipe-out of miracle centers in Ekiti State.

@ ILIDEFI, making reference to National Common Entrance Exams, that in itself leaves a sour taste in the mouth. My daughter wrote the National Common Entrance Exam and scored 159 out of 200. It was needless going for the interview, since we had already made a choice and paid the school fees in one of the 5 schools she was offered admission. Her cousin that went for the interview came home with sorry tales, that they were actually dictating the answers to them in the exam hall. We have suddenly resorted to outbid each other in examination malpractice.

ILIDEFI: For those trying to nullify the achievements of Anambra state in WAEC, NECO & JAMB as a result of this news, I ask these questions:

1. Do special centres also account for the fact that the overall best candidates in the past 2 years have been from Anambra? - Yes they can account for it, it's no brainer.

2. What about the performance of Anambra pupils in Unity schools entrance exams? Is it also a result of special centres? - Same, Miracle centers can account for that as well

1. Miracle centers are one of the most virulent attack on our educational system. Serious parents are loosing hope in the Nigerian education system and their kids are simply writing these exams for the records. Parents are now more disposed to opting for the IGSCE and the likes

2. Instead of celebrating a questionable achievement of Anambra state in WAEC, NECO and JAMB exams, we must jointly condemn miracles centers in its entirety. 486 Miracle centers is a cry shame and alarming....

Labaran Maku had thanked Jonathan for "bringing Facebook to Nigeria"

darqly: Oh, okay, she personally guided the planes through air traffic control abi? And the govt appreciated her with bulletproof BMWs if I recall
I'm sure you also think team GEJ gave Nigeria Facebook and Google?

Dense than you? For starters, you accept that you are dense, a glaring and indisputable reality......So it is irrelevant to reason with you. ........

bemagnify: and u ar mor dense dan me...so ansa me wia in d world do da mak presidential debate mandatory prio to general election! Dnt u tink wit ur head! It cn b optional..shekena! I no won debate wit u na by force..if oda pple debate and u wana vote 4dem fyn, dnt vote 4me

bemagnify: Wia in d world do da mak debate mandatory for presidential aspirants... It cn b conductd tru d free wil of d aspirants bt cmpulsory NO! NO!! NO!!!

Unfortunately dolts like you came in this generation? you cannot not be less dafter

Ironically, PDP presidential candidates have avoided presidential debates from Obasanjo - Yar Adua - GEJ, with one flimsy excuse or the other, if it's not clashing with one useless campaign as in the case of OBJ, it is health related as in the case of Yar Adua and lack of "expo" as in the case of GEJ.

The painful thing is that if some folks here on NL cannot condemn this out rightly, then what do me make of this generation? better still we deserve the quality of leadership we get

We should protest and reject this.......

This is where you know that some of you are simply daft and bereft of basic reasoning. Akabueze challenged Koro to an open debate to discuss all the issues (2 helicopters, Sunburn yatch, LCC buy-out, Jeeps etc) real-time, yet you're still saying Akabueze could not answer Haba!!! are you that full of deficit

It's simple, Akabueze not only challenged Koro, but as well all his consultants. He even reminded them to do their homework before coming.....

Goddex:
The Alausa criminals were also asked to tell the whereabouts of the two Helicopters procured by the Lagos State govt. Akabueze could not answer but instead is vomiting the ramblings of a child thief caught in the act.

The success in co-habitation is not as a result of former capital......far from it. It is as a result of the hospitable nature of the hosts, lots of opportunityies for commerce and dynamic pattern of Administration in the State.

EagleNest: If all ethnic groups as well as people form adjoining west African countries have thrived and co-habited successfully in Lagos for over many years - perhaps b/c of Lagos former national capital statue, I kept on wondering why we find it difficult to repeat same in other states and at the national. A food for thought for all.

Dumbo.........
I think some of you are simply clueless..ok.why didn't Fire Service, Emergency Rescue teams, etc not save almost 2000 people that died in 911 saga?

adconline: About $60bn spent since 1999 by LASG, yet fire service fleet had no water to put out fire that killed over 20 people and burnt businesses at Berger Suya? Naija is irredeemable!

I remember a fellow on CMS @ d bus - stop opposite CSS bookshop. After getting high on weed, will come near the bus and start talking lots of jargons on politics.

Are you sure you're not same?

1. Except you were still in your dipers, Lagos State conducted a state cencus during the era of Obasanjo. The Census ran on the same dates with the federal cencus, each Lagos resident was enumerated twice, 1 by the federal and the other by the state. Naturally the result will be annouced. Lagos State gave the scientific basis of the results which included headcounts, arial photomaps etc......

2. It is just a share waste of time for me to make you reason beyound your confort zone. Land mass is not a direct indicator of population in all cases. Check the records - Russia has the biggest landmass in the world, yet Nigeria's population is more than Russia's. Argentina, Austrialia, Kazakstan and Sudan are in the top ten in terms of landmass yet are farther down the pecking order on population. So your common sense espoused in some ridiculous gas laws is probably limited to your reasoning alone

3. Lagos has a far higher population than Kano. Kano is an arid region, accessibility to waters are far off........Lagos is globally acknowledge as one of the top 3 fastest growing cities in African and will be by 2025 onward. Population growth is one of the key indicators.

My brother you're simply arguing amiss in the face of glaring evidences. Whichever school you're currently in, you'd take time to study well enough than display ignorance here....

incrediblestev: You are yet to furnish us with a verifiable source to your own 20million claims of Lagos state population yet you question my random use of 2million houses in Anambra state, don't you see how hypocritical you sound?

And please get my argument right before bandying global demographics standards of population statistics, my argument is that an increasing population will be felt more in a small land space when compared to a larger one.

It is common sense that is even espoused in gas laws, when you take thesame figure and spread it in a much larger area like Calabar or Kano, you might come off with a different impression of thesame population, that is the reason why I was not too surprised when it was claimed in the last federal government census that Kano has a higher population than Lagos , though heavily flawed but it is an indicator as well.

Kano is heavily populated as well, probably more than Lagos but because most part of Lagos is dense as a result of its small landmass, one can make the mistake of thinking Lagos has a higher population than Kano..... Being heavily populated is very different from having a higher population.

This is another I'll informed assertion that has faulty basis. I think we need to state these infrastructures you guys so lazily brandied. ....

The bridges - Eko and 3MB, yes. Virtually all the high rise are sold out. The average lifespan of a road is less than 15years, factor that into the time capital was moved away from Lagos and you can imagine what is left of this so called Federal roads. The mile 12 to Ikorodu portion Ikorodu road is undergoing total rebuilding. Oshodi to Tin -Can consistently is a headache, Badagry express is being rebuilt, Lagos Abeokuta Expressway is another headache. .....So which infrastructure? Nutella building sold, ikoyi secretariat is at its relics. ...humor me....truth is we have gone past the Lagos as a former capital argument.

I avoid argument on Lagos IGC because many of you come short in even understanding that even the current IGR is inadequate for the quantum of work left.....and please leave me out of the Tinubu/Fasholas hate

ketoprofen: Yes, as a former capital, it was built and equipped with infrastructures that attract populations and corporate bodies, embassies, high commissions, etc.
That's y it has much population.
And don't forget the British made it their base and put those companies there.
These are not fasholas doing.
.
What we are asking is what and how he and tunubu have spent Lagos allocations plus IGR.
With Lagos being small in size and previously developed by the fg, y are there no standard public sch, all round good roads, sanitation, etc.

Lagos was FG capital and so what Is Lagos current "rent" from Abuja same as other states? Is there any state that has the current Lagos populations...... you're simply irrational and you sound like dont even demonstrate the capacity to decipher the key issue

ketoprofen: stop comparing Lagos to other states cos that will make it even more pathetic.
Lagos was a fg capital, it is small in size and boasts of a high igr from fg investments, foreigners and non indigenes in the state.
Comparing it to kebbi is irrational.
The worst is that propaganda against other states and ppl go on in that same state

1. there was a verifiable census activity that was embarked upon by Lagos State government. It ran parallel to the Federal government recent cesus exercise with equal staffing and arrangements. That was where the over 4million housing figures came from. Please supply us the basis of over 2million buildings in Anambra with veritable facts. Else I'm tempted to belive as many do here you just went intellectually berserck just in desperation to argue.

2. The Census measured only residetial building, so the 4million+ is net of office complexes. O boy! we may need to audit somethings in you....

3. You should not also forget that by global demographics, population increases is not by land mass, but by other factors like proximity to internation waters and trade routes etc.....

4. I think you need to do simple search before needless assumptions

incrediblestev: If we were to go by number of residential buildings, we can say thesame for places like Anambra states with over 2 million residential 4 storeys not to talk of the other varients, should we now conclude and say Anambra has a population of 10-15million people?

You argue as if every house in Lagos is for residential purpose, abeg, you guys should calm down with the ridiculous claims of Lagos having a population of 20 million.

People should not forget that because the landmass of Lagos is very small compared to the population it has, every part of Lagos will densely populated giving a somewhat exaggerated impression of figures. Spread thesame population in a state like cross river or Niger state or Kano, you will get a different impression.

Apart from wild and unfounded guesses, there is hardly any respectable authority that makes such preposterous claims, let's be moderate with our assumptions and guesses so we can be taken seriously, I live and work in Lagos too

I have been on 2 weeks vacation. I have gone round pretty much of Lagos, safe for places like Epe and Badagry. I will do a piece on some of the things I've seen.

In reaction to the OP, it is either you're less informed, Lazy or laying ascertions which are not true.

1. Very poorly planned Urban Center - this is the flaw of many years and it simply should some reasoning deficit to lay it at Fashola's doorsteps. Poor Urban center planning had always been our a national malaise. Even El-Rufai's stint in sanitizing Abuja is Urban Center planning is still receiving flaks from people that are ignorant and simply unwilling to embrase change. When Fashola's government pulls down places that are not in conformance with the urban centre planning,(Shanties, Market, Buidings on drainages etc) is it not the same you lots that cry that he's against the poor? or the bruhaha our Igbo folks threw up here when he almost shot down Ladipo for good comes to mind. My submission is simply that the refocussing Lagos Urban Center planning will take a longer time, come with its price and we should be ready to pay. But if you are well informed you will know that Fashola's government had just concluded a 10year Urban Center planning for Lagos, a project led by Ben Akabueze. This is even a platform for the next government to build on.

2. Lack of cheap mortage or low-cost housing. - You almost lost me here, as your arguement are at best not coherent. Are you advocating for slums or cheap mortgage? First off is that except we want to be economical with the truth, Jakande's scheme, even if replicated today, at an extrapolation of inflation rates and others, will still not come as cheap as many of you think. Secondly a mortgage scheme of any sort will only be assessible to gainfully employed people whose data is somewhat captured by the state and registered tax-payers. Thirdly, the mortgage can only be accessed by those in the income bracket that can afford it. When you put all these together, then you need to rethink your assumption of cheap mortgage or low-cost housing. Educate me? what in your opinion should be defined as cheap and low cost? Lagos state government have put in place a scheme. I dont think you know the details at all?

For me I'd rather government continue to partner with the private investors that can actually run the mortgage scheme and let's not fool ourselves. That man on the street is probably better off buy a modest land in Mowe, Ibafo, Ikorodu, Igbogbo etc, putting a small apartment that will not cost more than 2.5m cummulative and he'll build it over 3years, than getting locked in a mortgage scheme, that his irregular income cannot sustain, and will lock him in for a longer period.

3. Roads still poor. - This is another fallacy and we need to put things in proper perspective. Roads are massively being built and rebuilt. A lot more thoughts are going into roads and an outsider like me can see. We definitely cannot land all the road projects in a day. We have a heavy vehicular (especially heavy trucks) presence in Lagos more than any other states. It is imperative to take all the major and feeder roads out of the equation and that is what i see being done. I was in Surulere - Adeniran Ogunsaya, Bode Thomas, Aguda Axis, Eric Moore, I went to Ikorodu - Mile12 to Ikorodu round about, Ibeshe, Ipakodo and inner roads; I was in Ikeja - GRA roads and drainages, Mile 12 - Ajelogo axis, Inner Mile 12 road with a bridge. I was in Iddo - Yaba to Iddo, lots more many of these areas either have new roads or roads heavily under construction. I don't need him to do all the roads in Lagos in his time. I need him to consistently fix the ones we have and open up new ones.

4. State schools still in bad shape. - It depends on what you mean "in bad shape". I have my opinions too but the hydra-headed monster in the education sector is not this simple. What did I notice in the schools I visited? Mostly hade at least a block or two recently added by Lagos state government. I think this is not enough, but it's something.....I think we need an education summit to relook the Education sector in Lagos. What I saw during my vacation tells me we need to do a whole lot more about the teaching of the average Lagos Student.

5. Under-performing waste management - Don't just go there...... tell me which state or federal government that has the Waste Management has robust and organized as Lagos State? this even deserves no need for me to waste time with you on.......keep sweeping ignorance under the carpet if you like

You have "loss" me with this your "ibon
"

You guys av just wasted time, bandwidth space and near sanity on the forum. Someone opened his mouth and said GEJ is his mentor,and you engage that kind of person in discussion of any sort? Instead of calling Yaba left to ascertain the completeness of their patients head count.

When I read some of the appaling statements made by some people here, then I resign to fate that some reasoning capacities are just basic at best.
1. If the Intent of this Airport had been limited to which one is better, which one deserves to have Airports, which is rural or not, Eastern states or Western states, then many of you would have been in leadership. But alas, your technocracy is simply rooted in the shallow abyss of NL pages where you demonstrate crass ignorance, albeit with arrogance.

2. Are these the kind of arguements we should be having? are they lofty? are they enriching our intellect? are they making things better?

3. Flash news. MKO Airport is already built. Deal with it.

4. For me, Any state that marshals a well thought out developmental blue-print is well within her right to execute it. Taking projects in isolation and asking idiotic questions like "is it what the state need" or "how will it affect Osun Farmers" is as pedestran as it comes.

5. It is imperative to understand that as long as cities exists and people live in it, Cities are bound to be built with relevant infrastructures. As long as commerce goes on in Osun state, then the leadership is bound to explore opportunities for wealth and prosperity. If UAE had been docile 20years ago as some of you are reasoning today, then will we have Dubai as both business and tourism hubs today.

6. Is the Airport needed. Absolute yes. It is a different ball game entirely how it will be run. That itself is another issue for credible debate. The issue of other Airport in Ibadan, Akure, Ogun and Lagos and why Osun not latch on that is relative. If the analyst had done the economic trending over 25years and the numbers tells that it is better to build one, so this is a better option. Besides there are lots of scenarios that would have been painted - Economics of scale, Proximity, Socio-Political, Identity etc.

7. For me the critical questions starts with the operation of the Airport. what the is Operations Business Model? Will we still rely on our corrupt customs and immigrations agencies that makes the country loose revenues with their ineptitude? or will it be privatized or concessioned? What bilateral/Trade Agreements are in place with countries/Agencies Aregbe had visit to the extend that some locked-in trade agreements are in place to make a minimum through put use of the airport. Are there provision for FTZ within the proximity of the Airport? Are there going to be Business Hub/Villages with close proximity to the Airport?

I would like to see for starters the following
1. Exportation of Agric Products like Beef, Leather, Cheese, Milk products and Agric products straight from Osun to place like China, Malasia, African Regions.
2. A situation where Osun and other regional states like Enugu, Akwa Ibom, Kano, Borno can have quick trade exchages of fast moving products cutting the lag time in road and rail transportation
3. A situation where people can fly straight to Osun for business and Holiday/tourism, from anywhere in the world. A situation I can fly to my state on friday from work and land in less than 30mins.

Future implications of these are;
1. A prospective business will factor the Airport as possitives to bring the needed customer.
2. Private Schools with World class facilities will start springing up in Osun as Landed property and running costs will be relatively cheaper than Lagos, Ogun, Abuja, PH etc
3. Cost of Goods could be cheaper as they could be sourced directly. Our Igbo brothers would fratenizing with Osun as you can come together and airfrieght critical goods and rail-transport it to other destinations.
4. A typical DHL may set up a regional Hub in Osun, since the runway can accomodate their Big planes
5. The list is unlimited.......we can only continue to fill in the spaces

..and which party? APGA

Obiagelli: I Tell you this area boys (agberos) are making it big. I would love to see another party win lagos polls in 2015(definitely not pdp) as the ACN seems to be helpless with this area boys wahala.

@topic lagos is really doing great but I would love to see more

Reference: Hmm. You plan to buy the house from an owner you have never seen before. What is the name of this drama? Phantom Menace?

@ OP
1. I sincerely empathize with you and your family in your plight.
2. I also think it's juvenile and ridiculous for you to display crass ignorance here. "If the government had done what they are supposed to do..." like what exactly? quit blaming the government for faults of both you guys and the Landlord. I dare sare that it is only an irresponsible citizen than will not pay taxes.
3. I believe your dad will be in the best position to explain what can be done in this situation to you. How the landlord conned you guys into inheriting the accumulated land use charge and other accumulated bills are sad. It was just simply Lagos State government clamps down.
4. Options include get a lawyer, go to LSG, negotiate your option to opt out of the tenantship of the house and allowance to move out your property or factor the O/S cost of the property as sunk, if you like the property then buy outright, regularize all documents and pay all taxes then you can live in peace.

;Dwas thinking same.........

But on a more serious note, I believe this is the dividends to LSSTF......

mustaphagreens: No need for the long sermon bro, i get it, you have a bro who's currently a police officer

Why don't you jump on a bus to Osun and request?

anonimi: Has Ogbeni Aregbesola taken care of the BASICS of education already such as

* Adequate ratio of teachers:students
* Total enrolment of all children in schools i.e. no kids roaming the streets of Osun STATE during school hours
* Adequate ratio of classrooms:students
* Adequately paid teachers

@ Slizbeat,

I hope you're not reasoning from somewhere else other than the thinking faculty. Opon Imo is a study aid, it is not a replacement for classroom learning, but a complement. If you ask me, giving teachers the tablet is simply a luxury, except it is customized for teachers. Opon Imo consists of e-copy of textbooks and past questions among other things. these are pertinent needs of students and not teachers.

Then all the questions you possed here are simply 2years late and had been answered then. My only advise that you simply "announce" your ignorance rather than display it.

Slizbeat: Aregbesola....Why didn't you provide for the teachers first na?? How then were the students studying??

Well, too late to start complaining, just finish what you have started but then I ask, what if a student breaks the screen of his/her own Opon Imo, what are the solutions?? And are they allowed to take it home?? If No, how are they going to be reading on their own(In the case where they used to have textbooks)

Again, is the Opon imo a total eradication of the use of textbooks??

..and promise is a medical Doctor, if my memory serves me right

SmashingM: He studied Applied Chemistry

Abi o we suffered........... I lived in Ikorodu between 03 and 2010/11......and

1. I remember the days of "biking" on the express from Ikorodu to Ketu or even as far as Ojota.
2. I remember always racing to get out of Ikorodu on a typical Saturday by 6.00/6.30am and wanting to return either b4 12noon or 11.00pm
3. I resisted every urge to buy any land in Ikorodu, even if offered free......

But...

with the new Mile12-Ikorodu roundabout road currently ongoing, I believe those that "persevered" will "enjoy" going forward

eluquenson: Infact, am dancing skelewu to them now, if they give me free 3bedroom to stay at ikorodu, I will rather reject it cos living in ikorodu now is the beginning of high BP

Then stay in your village

Niseamaka: Lagos is the most chaotic city I have ever visited. The perenial traffic jams, over-population, noise and air polution made Lagos very unattractive to live in. An ABC reporter once described Lagos as a disgrace of a city.