₦airaland Forum

jomarq:
Think about this nairalanders and speak your opinion

This is any interesting topic but it has always ended in insults when the one asking discovered that his/her question is getting a convincing answer.
Well before i proceed i will like to know if you want me to participate in the ongoing discussion.
I'm Maximus one of Jehovah's Witnesses!

Unprofitable argument starts when each commentator feel like arguing aimlessly without thinking of the benefits of what they want to say.
Nobody has seen God before says John (a disciples of Jesus) in one of his books! John 1:18
So if truly nobody has seen God at any time then instead of arguing on what was written in religious books why not ask questions about the benefits of each religion as in how your religion is solving societal problems facing mankind in general?
If your religion can't provide any solution to problems erupting from human factor first within your own religion how can such a religion benefit those outside your religion?
I have resolved to ignore unnecessary arguments rather i keep presenting the one and only religion that's uniting people of all races as God's approved religion.
Whatever is found written in any book is useless if the God behind such a book failed to unite his/her/it worshipers with love and peace!

chimex38:
Does this special co-rulers by any chance also refer to the 144000 people in Rev 7 who are different from the greater multitude.? Or are they the 4creatures & 7 spirits constantly mentioned throughout revelation?

According to God's word they supposed to be Jews as in all of them, they are the few to be chosen as Christ's corulers and millions of faithful people earthwide must recognize them to be saved {Zechariah 8:23} Jesus referred to them as his brothers {Matthew 25:40, 45} they are Christ's brothers because they are partakers of the same nature with him just as God declared Jesus as His Son this ones are also declared as God's Sons.
But the Jews failed woefully to meet up with the requirements as majority among the Jews refused to put faith in the Christ so God rejected that nation after picking just a few among them and began choosing from faithful people of the nations who accepted Christ! Matthew 22:2-14
If you carefully cross-check the original names of the twelve tribes of Israel as listed in Exodus 1:2-5 and compare to the names listed in Revelations 7:5-8 you will see clearly that Revelations was using a figurative name for the born again brothers of Christ.
This means the first 500 Jews makes the beginning of the list when the remaining were chosen from other nations.
So their total number according to God's word is 144,000 corulers who will be taken away to heaven as Christ's corulers!

Ken4Christ:
Only corulers are born again? Where is it stated in the Bible? Give at least 2 scripture references.

Jesus only said this once and to only one person who is a member of the Jewish high court a ruler among the Jews, he never repeated it as teaching throughout his ministry.
But you can point to another case where Jesus said the same thing to any of his disciples.

Ken4Christ:
But Jesus also taught that you must be born again. Are you teaching this also? And how can one be born again?

I have told you this thing several times but for the benefit of other followers of this thread i will repeat it again.

Only corulers with Christ are born again and Nicodemus wish to be a coruler with the Christ, that's the wish of all members of the Pharisee and Nicodemus is a prominent member of that group that's why Jesus told him that he can't join that class unless he is born again but as for millions who will live as subjects of God's Kingdom they only need to practice what Jesus taught them that's why Jesus told the first group of disciples that he has other sheep who are not of the first fold {John 10:16} only members of the first fold will rule with Christ. For your information faithful servants of God from Abel to John the baptist aren't qualified to be counted among the born again {Matthew 11:11-12} only God selects these ones among those who had been taught by the Christ. Matthew 20:20-23
Jesus referred to this group as the little flock {Luke 12:32} nobody can decide to become a born again Christian it's not by wish God alone chose them from among faithful disciples of Christ.
That's why Jesus said many are called but few are chosen {Matthew 22:14} they will practice the thing Jesus taught all his disciples but God choose whoever He wants. Matthew 20:23
So there's no criteria for teaching anyone to become born again Christian that's where you people are getting yourselves confused!

It's OK everyone is entitled to his opinion but in my own religion we all have the same line of thought regarding faith in our God:
"I have given them the glory that you have given me, in order that they may be one just as we are one" John 17:22

Now I urge you, brothers, through the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you should all speak in agreement and that there should be no divisions among you, but that you may be completely united in the same mind and in the same line of thought. 1Corinthans 1:10

Thanks for your time!

CreatedtwoRule:
Lol....well understood sir, but if so, then we are not going to have constituted authority. Well I think we are all correct but viewing it through different theological lens! It's a case of two people saying a jar is half full or half empty, both are correct but still have different view points!

Jamestaiwo:
Read the post text very well, it is clearly written there

You are chatting with a Witness of Jehovah, wẹ study the Bible word by word not just swallowing what someone say.
So if you can't quote where Jesus said:
"I am God" or "Worship me" then forget it Jesus is one of God's spirit Sons in the heavens, that's what he claimed throughout his life and ministry.
Thanks for your time!

Jamestaiwo:
The problem you have is You read the Bible just the way English version put it to you.
You need to sit where they sat to understand what they understood. When Jesus said I and God are One in John 10 vs 30, why did the Jews want to stone?
Your answer to this matter a lot

That's not why they wanted to stone him he claimed he existed before Abraham and only spirit beings can say that.

As for being one with God Jesus also said his true disciples will be one with God too.
Does that makes all his disciples Gods?

Jamestaiwo:
The guy is a bad listener, Dr Abel Damina will never make a claim that He doesn't believe in Heaven. The guy was hearing Something else. Nonetheless, that is not the focus here, you just brought that in to create a distraction.

Well i don't know Abel Damina but one thing i can assure you is that there is no single verse in the Bible where Jesus said "i am God" or "worship me"

Ken4Christ:
What did Jesus teach them?

LOVE for God and for neighbors {Mark 12:29-31} as they continue preaching and teaching people in their neighborhood they are expanding the LOVE zone so that everywhere they go brothers and sisters in the faith awaits them like one global family {Mark 10:29-30} that's what God promised faithful people in the Old Testament {Isaiah 2:2-4} and Jesus came to fulfill it! Act 1:8

So if you can't boast of fellow worshipers in all the nations around you then your religion is false not of Christ Jesus who promised us that the first sign of our salvation is a global brotherhood then God will bless us with everlasting life! Matthew 19:28-29

All these you don't know only Hellfire you carry on your head as if there is no good thing Christianity ought to achieve other than threatening people with Hellfire!

CreatedtwoRule:
Yes, pls I would love to learn!

In the Old Covenant Israelites were told to pay ten percent of their profit that's a tenth of their sweat and Levites who were given the office of priests collects it from them but in the New Covenant only the HighPriest (Christ Jesus) is now a life saving spirit {1Corinthans 15:45} who doesn't need our money so it's our time Jesus is demanding.
A wealthy Jew once asked Jesus what he must do to enter into God's Kingdom {Luke 18:18} to this young politician Jesus would ask for financial assistance which he would gladly consent to but he was shocked when Jesus asked him to go and keep the commandments of God {Luke 18:20} he told Jesus everything he has kept from childhood {Luke 18:21} next Jesus told him to forgo everything he has acquired and become one of his disciples! Luke 18:22
This means the wealthy young man must join Jesus' group of preachers and teachers of God's word knocking people's doors from house to house! Matthew 10:11-13
Such a task will be so difficult for wealthy people or celebrities who always live like idols in the society so the young man left as he was highly disappointed! Luke 18:23
So the tithe Jesus is demanding from his own followers is sparing their time to go preaching and teaching from house to house which humbles true believers something 99.9% of people claiming Christians can't do!
In view of this assignment Zephaniah said foretold that whoever wants to escape the impending vengeance of God must seek two things:


before the decree takes effect and that day passes like windblown chaff, before the Lord’s fierce anger comes upon you, before the day of the Lord’s wrath comes upon you. Seek the Lord, all you humble of the land, you who do what he kicommands. Seek righteousness, seek humility; perhaps you will be sheltered on the day of the Lord’s anger.
‭Zephaniah 2:2-3 NIV‬

Note the highlighted in blue!

Whoever is not humble can't obey Jesus' command to preach from house to house and whoever is not seeking righteousness will find it hard to knock on people's doors because you don't know whose door you're knocking.

Do you think someone claiming President, Governor, Senator and so on could be a true Christian if they are to do what Jesus commanded his disciples?

Ken4Christ:
I am shocked that you are still defending this evil cult. The early church preached Christ. What are you preaching?

Failure!
They preached what Jesus taught them:

The Kingdom of God! Matthew 10:7

It's OK everyone is entitled to his own personal opinion after reading the Bible!

chimex38:
For broader context
{from John 24-27}
Jesus first appeared to his disciples in Thomas absentia..
Thomas refused to believe that whom they saw was Jesus until he physically pierced Jesus marks on his hands and sides.
On Jesus' second appearance in the same place at probably the same hour of prayer, I think it seems quite natural to admit that Thomas would have accepted and become convinced that this person he had earlier doubted that his fellow disciples saw( probably a ghost or a different spirit) is actually "my Lord" and for a second time with the word "my"-->my God.
(....whom he had actually walked with while alive).
Note: This happened about just 1week apart...not much time frame.
The discussions and arguments and doubts must have been ongoing within the days leading to Jesus' second appearance. Hence I tend to think the expression is more personal and admittance than just exclamation.
#Justmythought

The only thing that replaced tithe is much harder than the tithe that's why you will see many churchians prefer the tithe.
In the Old Covenant the tithe is brought into the temple and the HighPriest will see to it that each Levite gets his portion but in the New Covenant our HighPriest is Christ Jesus who said:
"Freely you have received so you must give freely" Matthew 10:8
So whatever service we render to people if it's under Christ's assignment it must be free. That's why Tithing in Christianity was completely ruled out.
Offering differs from tithing.
Offering is what was used in building and maintaining the temple (place of worship) so no one should be left out that's why the widow offered everything in her purse:
Now as he looked up, he saw the rich dropping their gifts into the treasury chests.  Then he saw a needy widow drop in two small coins of very little value, and he said: “Truly I say to you that this poor widow put in more than they all did. For all of these put in gifts out of their surplus, but she, out of her want, put in all the means of living she had.” Luke 21:1-4
Tithe is according to your profit but offering is whatever your heart compels you to give for the glory of the house of God.
When it comes to offering this is what God's word says:

Let each one do just as he has resolved in his heart, not grudgingly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. 2Corinthians 9:7

This one doesn't leave anyone out even an orphan or widow who loves God's house will not like to be left behind.

CreatedtwoRule:
Yes, very right sir also it's volitional today generous giving has replaced it!

Will you like to know what replaced the tithe?

chimex38:
Ok.. A sudden exclamation.
But it's debatable..
For me, the appearance of the "my" word twice, sends a stronger signal towards the "deity" to whom Thomas saw rather than just an exclamation.
Ok.. Understandable.. I agree
Ok. demarcation noted.
Thanks for sharing.

The word "my" also applies when a Yorùbá man or woman sees something amazing they will say.
"Olúwa Ọlọ́run mi ò"
Exactly the same way Thomas said it:
"my Lord and my God"
So there's nothing special!

LordReed:
Canaan is not the centre! Bwahahahahahahaha!

OK you're just trolling.
Ọmọ do have a good day!

chimex38:
My questions are:
1) Why didn't Jesus rebuke Thomas for showing act of worship just as the Angel did to John in Rev 22:9 & Rev 19:10

When reading the Bible we need to open our mind and heart in order to get the clear picture of what happened.
Thomas was amazed and when people are amazed what comes out of their mouth is an exclamation like:

"O my God!" (English man)
"Olodumare!" (Yorùbá)
"Ayélála ò!" (Ìlàjẹ Òndó State)
"Osanobua!" (Edo State) and so on.
This exclamation doesn't mean they are seeing deities but a sign of amazement.
That's exactly what happened to Thomas so Jesus who knew that his friend was amazed has no reason to rebuke him.

chimex38:
2) Based on the context of what happened, is the blind man putting his entire Faith in Jesus not synonymous to worship?
Is our salvation not also hinged on Faith and believe in Jesus as well? John 3:16.

Jesus is our Master, Lord and King.
This means no human can please God with any kind of righteous deeds {Isaiah 64:6} unless we follow Jesus' footsteps closely {1Peter 2:21} because he is God's Son who has come to replace Adam {Luke 3:38} through whom we are supposed to relate with God. 1Corinthans 15:45
Adam transmitted sin and death to all his descendants {Romans 5:12} so we are all as good as walking corpses {Romans 3:23} but by the faith and obedience of Jesus {1Corinthans 15:22} whoever imitate this man in thoughts words and actions has qualified to relate with God {Matthew 17:5} as a child of God {John 1:11-12} so believing in Jesus differs from worshiping Jesus {Matthew 15:8-9} it means accepting that no act of righteousness can earn God's approval unless you make Jesus your role model! John 3:16

chimex38:
3)How do one go about his daily life having faith and believe in Jesus and yet reserve worship to God alone?

Jesus is the person who taught us how to worship God acceptably so we must do everything manly possible to do what he says {Matthew 17:5} and when we are gathered together as children of God what should come to our minds is that Jesus is our chairman in such a gathering {Matthew 18:20} so whatever we want to do in that gathering should be centered on how to do the work Jesus assigned us {Matthew 28:18-20} but when we are in need of anything then each person must enter into his inner room to pray to God {Matthew 6:6} so just as Jesus prayed to God we can also approach God in prayer because He Jesus' father and our father Jesus' God and also our God! John 20:17

LordReed:
LMAO! Canaan is not the Bible don't be a clown. Bwahahahahahaha!

God's aim has been accomplished!

LordReed:
LoLz. What part of this is FAKE are you not understanding? Your fairytale doesn't change anything, Canaan is not the centre of anything.

Go out there and stop billions of people throughout the world buying, reading and studying the Bible!

How Should Churches Fund Ministry?

Fee-based models?

Donations?

What About the Poor?

Does demanding tithes burden struggling believers?

The Bible never condemns tithing—but it never commands it for Christians either. What is clear?

How does your church teach giving?

Before God rescued the Israelites from Egypt there was nothing like tithing for God's people it was established as a law before they entered the promised land.

WHY?

God wanted to lay down rules regarding pure worship in the land of Canaan that is why a tribe (Levites) were excluded in the sharing of spoils they got when they entered Canaan. Numbers 18:20; Deuteronomy 10:9
Moses was a Levite too so there was no agitation after all it's his own tribe that's excluded.
What God commanded the remaining 12 tribes is to make sure that at the end of every three years each person should calculate his gain, divide it into ten parts and bring one to the temple this is what Levites will share among themselves {Deuteronomy 14:27} Levites too must pay tithe and who will benefit from the tithe paid by Levites? That's when orphans, widows and stranded travelers comes to mind (Deuteronomy 14:29} so orphans, widows and stranded travelers are completely excluded from paying of tithe.
This system continues until the nation splitted ten tribes followed Jeroboam and only two tribes remain to serve Rehoboam as their king! 1Kings 12:21
The ten Northern tribes were called Samaritans while the remaining two was called Judah. The Levites were confused so some remained with Judah in Jerusalem while those who joined the North were stranded as the temple in which they supposed to officiate can't be splitted. So in order not to loose his own kingship Jeroboam built another temple in the North but it was not recognized as the people there don't know how to worship in an acceptable way so idolatry started in Northern Israel.
Judah and Benjamin (Jews) remained with the old covenant and God favored them.
But later the inhabitants of Judah and Benjamin also turned to idolatry and God allowed Babylonians to take them to exile just as Samaritans had suffered the same fate decades before then.
God later rescued the Jews (Judah and Benjamin) from exile in Babylon and they returned to their home land to establish pure worship again.
But later they forgot the temple and the tithe they supposed to bring as stipulated in the law that's why God sent Malachi to warn them! Malachi 3:8-12

All these have nothing to do with Christianity because Christ gave us the privilege of services freely so the law of tithe ended with the old covenant! Hebrews 7:5-12

Jamestaiwo:
Calm down, what is the teaching of Dr Abel Damina on heaven that is not agreeable?

The guy who quoted me said Abel Damina doesn't believe there is a place called heaven yet he came to accuse JWs for not agreeing with Abel Damina who believes in heaven that's why i told him to go and convince Damina first before coming to Jehovah's Witnesses!

Ken4Christ:
Doing what? Do you preach the gospel of our Lord Jesus or another gospel? There's a curse placed on those who preach another gospel - Galatians 1:6-8.

What was the purpose why Jesus commissioned the preaching and teaching work?

If you don't know then whatever you're preaching is heresy!

LordReed:
That fairytale still doesn't make Canaan the centre of anything. LoLz.

Whatever you think but the reason why the Bible God chose Canaan i've told the person who wanted to know and it obvious that He (Bible God) achieved His aim!

Brahamimo:
Your members consume beer like they are drinking water.

My favorite is stout either Guinness or Legend and sometimes i take Baron hope you don't have any problem with that because if you do that's your own cup of coffee my own God never said it's evil o!

Brahamimo:
Majority of people know the bible, yet very mean and unempathetic towards fellow humans.

Haha!
I think the picture is now getting brighter and clearer.
You just registered this account yesterday and you are complaining about Bible people being mean and unempathetic.
Now i know who is behind this moniker.

Don't worry you can get what you want from others if Bible carriers refuse to give you!

LordReed:
Bwahahahahahaha! Not falling for your change of topic. Canaan was NOT the centre of anything, your storybook is not evidence.

The God who chose Canaan as the center of ancient world has been known globally today while your Chinese gods or Indian gods refuse to move from their villages!

Brahamimo:
Then don't ever mention me or refer to me as far as religion is concerned. You're always trying to force people to see things the way u see it from your Jehovah witness lenses

Guy please let the person i'm discussing with respond nah!
If you're not interested in knowing true Christianity that doesn't mean others will not be interested so chill and go get a cold beer.

Brahamimo:
I don't share in your religious ideologies please. Keep them to yourself and members . Thank you

Ọmọ i don't care what you share or not i am talking to someone else but used your comment to show him why it is necessary to IDENTIFY the one and only true Christian organization.
So this has nothing to do with you!

musicwriter:
Jehovah's witness was founded in about 1870's, and you want me to believe that non of the Christians that believed your so called Jesus was a real Christian until Jehovah's witness was founded?

I thought you want to know the truth!
The name "Jehovah's Witnesses" is what God kept for thousands of years away from false religionist so they continue to pick different group names just to gather people but after the International Bible Students Association met the requirements of pure worship in the year 1931 God revealed that name to them! Isaiah 65:15

Borrow a leaf from this comment:

Brahamimo:
Majority of people know the bible, yet very mean and unempathetic towards fellow humans.

False religionists are carrying the Bible but don't understand what Jesus taught because if they go preaching from house to house knocking on people's door uninvited which Jesus commanded how can they be mean or unempathetic towards those they must talk to? Mark 12:29-31

musicwriter:
The answer is probably why you're hated by other so called body of so called Christ.

Wow! Well that's the more reason why i became one of Jehovah's Witnesses!
Jesus said his true disciples will be hated by all religionists {John 15:18} because they are no part of the world empire of false religion! John 17:14-16

Jesus never agree that he's worshiping the same God with religionists who refused to have the same line of thought with him so don't expect anything less from his real followers! Matthew 10:24-25

musicwriter:
What makes you a true Christian and the others non-true Christians?

The GROUP Jesus handed over the work to go preaching the Kingdom of God from house to house and door to door! Matthew 28:19-20
Any religion whose members aren't doing this work have nothing to do with Christianity! James 2:18, 26

DeepSight:
Adam never existed.

Says you!
Mr Blocker who said he blocked my posts yet runs after me again to start quoting me!

chimex38:
I get you. He's figuratively speaking onbehalf of God kind of...
I have always believed in just one God. But it's difficult to remove the divine nature of Jesus and what to make of him.
He is above Angels and all heavenly beings, yet below God Almighty.
What do we make of Him?
Some say Honour, like probably our parents, apostles, etc but that seems low for his status.
Thanks for your exposition nonetheless.

Let those claiming they are worshiping Jesus prove they know him by obeying his command to go out there and make disciples! Matthew 28:19-20

Note that making disciples differs from gathering people it means turning them into preachers and teachers of God's word who will also go out to preach and teach.

Only Jehovah's Witnesses are doing this that's why all these so called pastors are scared of Jehovah's Witnesses because they know we have what it takes to make real disciples.

Yesterday i met one young man who said he loved listening to Damina but after our discussion he realized that the man is just another deceiver looking for followers on Instagram and Facebook!