₦airaland Forum

noetic2:
Really? when? where?

Do u mind refuting and representing ur alternative here for all to see. . . . . . .

This goons accepts what he reads in ancient texts written by people who if he met them today he will not trust them with the time of day, much less the origin of the unverse. . . .That you believe in it does not make it true . . . .

OLAADEGBU:
We still use the language sunrise and sunset today, are we literally referring to the movement of the sun?

Another nonsense and disingenuous attempt. . .You delibtately left out the part that says it hurries back to where it rises. Pathetic. . . .

The Bible says:

"He appointed the moon for seasons: the sun knows his going down"  -- Psalm 104:19

God created the "lights" in the heavens "for signs, and for seasons, and for days and years" -- Genesis 1:14.  

We can now see and understand through the marvels of astronomy that a year is the time required for the earth to
travel once around the sun.  The seasons are caused by the changing position of the earth in relation to the sun. 

This is what the Worldbook Multimedia Encyclopedia wrote:

"astronomers can tell exactly from the earth's motion around the sun when one season ends and the next one begins."

We also now understand that a "month [is] the time of one revolution of the moon around the earth with respect to the sun"  -- Encyclopedia Britannica

How could Moses have known 3,500 years ago that the "lights" of the sun and moon were the actual determining factors of the year's length, unless his words were inspired by God?

My man Tudor has given you the answers for all these nonsense. . . . . . Does your god endorse astrology?. . . .

noetic2:
u never cease to amaze me with ur gullibility irked by ignorance, self denial and delusion.

1. there are historical non-biblical evidences/records that establish that Jesus indeed lived, died and resurrected.  That should be a cause of alarm for u cos u are definitely hell bound.

Please show me one historical evidence which shows that jesus actually LIVED, DIED and WAS RESURRECTED OUTSIDE THE BIBLE. . . You are the ONLY FOOL that I know who HAS EVER made that ridiculous claim. . . .

2. I have repeatedly asked u. . . where EXACTLY in the bible was it asked of christians to rape. kill and sacrifice virgins? why are u such a RIDICULOUS liar?

I didn't say it says that christians should rape. . . I only said that the bible was mostly written by people who thought it was right to scarifice virgins and burn entire towns as a burnt offering unto their god. . .they wrote it down for all to see. . . . 

"Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods.  In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully.  If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock.  Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt.  Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction.  Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you.  He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors.  "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him."  (Deuteronomy 13:13-19)

3. Do u know how much crime was committed in the name of atheism? which religious person killed as many people as Stalin and other known atheists. . . .You are a ridiculous hypocrite.  

Do you know how many people were killed during the crusades, inqusition, witch trail and all the other attrocites that were carried out in the name of jesus by people who used the cross as a source of inspiration? Stalin never said he killed any body in the name of atheism, he killed people purely based on political difference not because he wanted to convert them into atheism. . . millions have been killed in the name of jesus and yahweh. . . . . . You pathetic attempts to tie stalins attrocities to atheisn is very shameful. . . . he never preached atheism to any body. . . You brothers in the lord used the cross as a source of inspiration when killing jews and other non believers during the inquisition, witch trial and crusades no?

Everything about the bible is real. . . .
a. its prophetic revelations

Lets start with one false propehcy that NEVER happened. . . Ezekiel predicted Babylon would conquer Egypt and was wrong It never happened. Your lying bibloe says that Nebuchadrezzar will conquer egypt and that the nile river will dry up and the whole Egypt will be desolute for 40 years but it never happened. . .

b. spiritual accuracies

Like jesus christ being god and the same time sitting at the right hand side of god right very nice. . . .Or is it the nonsense tale that jesus christ being god was praying unto himself. . . . Nice spritual tale indeed. . . . 

c. historical facts

What historical facts exactly. . . the exodus that never happened or the fact that the writer of matthew and mark fail to agree on when exactly jesus was born? What about the lie written by matthew that babies were killed when jesus was born by herod that appears in no other book but in the gospel of matthew. . . a story that was not talked about by people that wrote almost every detail of herods like people like josephus that did not even like him. . . .

d. scientific notions et all.

Ecc 1:5  "The sun rises and the sun sets, and hurries back to where it rises." Or the fact that the bible says evil spirits causes diseases. . .  Is it the nonsense that says that there is a firmament that seperates the waters above and waters below. . . or the stupid lie that a person survived inside a fish for 3 days. . . can you use your basic knowledge biology to tell me how he was able to breathe and stay alive inside a fish for 3 days. . . .  Are these the scientific facts? 

That u choose to disbelieve the bible based on ur self inflicted ignorance, delusive mental disorder, denial, moral debauchiveness, intellectual incompetence and lack of a reasoning capacity does not dispute the fact that the . . .BIBLE is TRULY the WORD of GOD.

That you choose to accept the words of fools who say that it is OK to stone to death their disobedient children or fools who say women should keep quite and not speak in front of men and their hands should be cut off when they dare attempt to rescue their husbands from his attackers as the word of your god does not mean it is true. . . .The koran is the word of allah no?. . . . deluded fool. . . .

you keep missing the point. . .largely due to the fact that u do not have a brain at all. ur posts do not give any reason to believe that u have one. . or do they?  

I am not thinking within any box or attempting to defend any book or GOD. . .I am simply revealing the jejune inconsistencies and unsound postulations of urs. . .postulations a 5 year old should not be found saying as they lack a convincing intellectual capacity. . . .

Will you keep quite you dishonest and discredited fool. . . were you not the same fool that was trying to defend the passage in the bible that says that parents should stone to death their disobedient children by foolishly and ridiculously equating it to treason? Idiot. . .

again. . . .u like running around aimlessly to prove nihilant points.

1. My islamic posts reflect my disgust at the moral questions on islamic norms. Any idiot could have deduced that from my posts there.

As if your own religion has better moral norms. . . .

2. God has repeatedly revealed himself through Jesus. . . . . u have the choice and liberty to either believe or disbelief. u have irrationally and unintelligibly chosen to believe in the death and resurrection of Jesus. . .are u ready to live with the consequences. . .judgement is set.

Because you choose to believe that delusion does not make it true. . . . .Who is going to judge me you or the imaginary gods of the trinity. . . I laugh in tongues. . . . . . 

do u actually have a brain at all? how many times have u asked this question on this thread?. . .sounds like u have nothing new to say?

Actually the person that needs a brain is you. . . . . .

when and where exactly have u done so? u can repeat it right here. . .cant u. . . . .lying is not allowed.

So many times. . . . We have debated that long before you came to NL. . . .

That u hide under the cloud of science does not give credibility to ur rantings. . . . . if further reveals the gullibility and porosity of ur reasoning and thinking faculties. . . Gush. . . . . did u actually post the above?  

Bla bla bla bla bla what has science got to do with the fact that Paul said that it is OK for him to Lie for his god. . . . Idiot. . . . . . .Keep on believing their lies. . . . .

noetic2:
Depends on the circumstances involved. Do u actually know the meaning of the word miracle?

The lies you guys keep telling yourselfs so that you can feel happy. . . . .

does the above establish that amputees are unhealable. . . or does it deny the capacity of God to heal.
I think u should think before u open ur mouth.

How are they healed? So far despite all the healing claims we are yet to see your god heal any amputee and make his or her amputated limbs grow back. . . . . .

you are fast becoming a nuisance. How many times have I answered this question?

How many blind people have you healed? Do you believe in the promise jesus made to you?

Really? how come u cannot refute creationism or produce an alternative?

Your foolishness is pathetic. . . . I have done that so many times. . . . . .

noetic2:
1. first u call them lies. . . when u have no evidence or basis to establish that they are lies. This shows a deeply rooted angst and bitterness traceable to ur childhood

Of course they are lies. . . .that you believe them does not stop them from being the lies that they are. . . . You are my evidence that they are lies . . . .You call all the claims of the koran lies don't you? Where is your evidence to show that they indeed are lies. . . That you chose to believe in what some unknown people wrote about a jewish carpenter who once lived coming back to save you from himself does not stop it from being a lie. . . . .

2. who EXACTLY have I looked down on? how is it my fault that u are already CONDEMNED and a candidate of HELL and eternal damnation?
is ur conscience pricking u?

More pathetic and ridiculous nonsense. . . . because you believe in the writting of some people who say that thoseof us that do not share in their delusions are condenmed does not make it true. . .condemned of what exactly if I may ask? Is it not the same fools that wrote that it was right to rape and kill virgins and also scarifice them to the dememted deity the created? Thank goodness the world has changed if not I know goons like you will be in the forefront killing entire towns and scarificing them as burnt offerings unto your demented god as your wannabe ancestors(Moses, joshau and co) did in the bible. . . . . .My conscience is not picking me at all. . . . 

Last time I checked u also chose to believe the lies that the bible is not real. . . . .no problem with that, except that u use it as a justification to think that u are intelligent, objective and open minded. .  .on the contrary u are neither of all those. . . . u are deluded, uninformed, ignorant, misguided, unintelligent, naive et all, . .  , all of these are deducible from ur posts.

What is real about the bible? Because some ancient men wrote that their god used words to speak life into humans whom he made from dust does not make it real. . . .that you believe a jewishcarpenter is coming back to save your miserable ass from himself if you don't bow down and kiss his toes does not make it real. . . . Actually it's your post that reeks of delusion, stupidity, close mindedness, incompetence, irrelevance and utmost stupidity. . . .

This is a raw display of intellectual bankruptcy and laziness. . .you are simply mentally lazy and cannot think for ur self.
How many times have u repeated the drivel above?. . . , u now sound like a broken record.

It's ACTUALLY you that can not think for yourself. . . . little wonder you are always trying to rationalize(mostly through telling lies) the babaric writing of ancient goons who thought that it was right to stone to death disobedient children, cut the hands of women who go to rescue their husbands from their attackers or rape virgins and sacrifice them to the demented god the created in their own image. . . .

I am not defending any one. .  .on the contrary I am simply revealing the inconsistencies, fallacies and jejune claims of ur ignorant postulations. God is not defendable by any one. . . . .all I have done is to keep revealing the short comings of ur ridiculously impotent arguments.

What are my ignorant postulations? Aren't you all over the islamic section telling them that their god is dead and yours is alive. . . .If your god is trukly alive he will do it himself. . .he will not allow a know nothing and irrelevant slowpoke like you to do it for him. . . . . .Aren't you all over the place trying to show that the words and events talked about in the bible are true? Is the bible your word. . . . . why not allow the god you claim owns the bible to speak for himself and show people all the evidence himself. . . . The fact that you are the one doing it says that he does not exist outside of your deluded imaginations. . . . .

Arrant Nonsense.

I know this because it is written in the bible. ok now u agree that u were just a christian by name and not by deeds. .  , . . . christianity is not for the inane and egoic ones. . . .its a relationship driven by humility. , . , and the fact is YOU WERE NEVER A CHRISTIAN

Where is your personal contract between you and the jesus that you claim appears to you in your dreams telling you that he toldpeople to write the bible on his behalf? Will you stop talking about humility. . . . humility is what you lack completely. . . . . .Stop talking about it cos you lack it completely. . . . .

1. are u not ashamed of urself?  u cannot even substantiate ur claims or define ur beliefs. . .and u dare attack some one else beliefs. . .this is medically called LUNACY.

I have done that so many times. . . . .

2. God inspired men to write the bible. . . , u can exercise ur choice to either believe or disbelieve.

That you chose to accept their lies does not make it true. . .where is your contract with the jesus that you claim appears to you in your dreams telling you that he inspired them to write most of the things they wrote? Some of them(Like Paul) at least were honest to say that they can even lie for their god if it will promote him. . . . . The koran was inspired by another god too no? deluded an pathetic idiot. . . . .

OLAADEGBU:
"The wind goes toward the south, and turns about to the north; it whirls about continually, and the wind returns again according to his circuits." -- Ecclesiastes 1:6

"Modern science has confirmed that the air around the planet turns in huge circles, clockwise in one hemisphere and counterclockwise in the other." -- Richard Gunter

You want to play that way?. . . The sun rise and the sun sets and hurries back to where it rises Ecclesiastes 1:5.

Astronomy has debunked this lie. . . . .

jamiru:
Kai God bless ola for the way u logically answered mazaje.
mazaje i dont mean to state a win lose scenario, but please consider your consceince for once. i know its speaking to u that there is something u are ignoring. and above all i pray that God will have mercy on u so that u will flee the delusion satan has kept u captive via the medium of athiesm. God bless u

My consceince speaks to me and it tells me that I am very OK. . . .Who is satan? have you ever seen him? Did he tell you that he has kept me in captivity or are you just throwing the meanigless talking points you have been made to believe since childhood?? D . . . . . Keep enjoying the delusion. . . . .

noetic2:
Depending on the circumstances involved. . . .all of the above are indeed miracles.

So getting a job is called a miracle? 

Miracle is a function of three things
a. divine intervention
b. ur belief system
c. universality.

I am yet to see any divine intervention when it comes to the healing of amputees. . . . can your god perform such a miracle?

Miracles happen all the time to everyone regardless of the religious beliefs of the recipient. You have not said anything to discredit the credibility of miracles. . . or have u?

Only because you are lying to yourself. . . didn't the bible say that those of you that believe in jesus will have the ability to preform magic(miracles)? Do you truly believe what the bible says if so how many blind people have you ever restored their sights like jesus promised you will be able to if only you believe in him? Do you believe in jesus and have faith as tiny as that of a mustard seed? If you do then let me know how many blind people you have been able to restore their sights. . . . That will sway me and make a a christain once again. . . .

ever heard of creationism?

Creationism is the thoughts and ideas of how bronze aged men thought the universe and the earth came about. . . .Its nothing more than a false and ridiculous hypothesis. . .

noetic2:
why is there a problem with my choice to believe these writings. . . .when u also willingly made ur choice to disbelieve this writings?

Well actually there is NO problem at all if you believe the lies and let it end there. . . .you use the lies as a justification to look down on others and as long as you continue to do that then you should always expect a push back. . . . . .

why is it not a problem to you that u CANNOT substantiate ur beliefs? u have no evidence to support ur claims and beliefs . . . .and u dare call writers of the bible "deluded" and "barbaric"?

You are my evidence that your god exist only in your deluded imaginations. . . . .I have said it so many times no god that truly exist will rely on an irrelevant entity like you to make his case for him at all. . . he will do it himself. . . .As for the bible writers its only people that are deluded that will write that the sun moves round the earth. . . if stoning disobedient children and human scarifice isn't barbarism then pls tell me what is. . . .   

ur delusion and ignorance is much more obvious. . . otherwise, how EXACTLY do u intend to substantiate ur beliefs?

How many times will you have to keep repeating this drivel? You are now sounding like a broken record. ,  .

please save ut fairy tales for fellow minded ignorant and delusive atheists. You were NEVER a christian. .  . u only attended church for ur pleasure and never sought after God with all your heart.
It is IMPOSSIBLE to seek after God with all ur heart and never get a response. . . .save ur lies and dogmatic lines for ur congregation of atheists

How do you know this? because your deluded mind tells you? I onced seeked the imaginary god with all my heart and never got anything. . . .My deconversion was personally a very painfulprovessto me but am VERY glad it happened. . . .The human brain is a very complex organ. . . . . What you claim is response is just your mind playing tricks on you. . . . .Didn't you once say that jesus appears to you in your dreams? . We all know that people always dream about what preocupies their minds most of the time. . . .Pls how did jesus look like and what language did he speak. . . Is he really a black man as NO2atheism says he is?. . . , 

God has actually done all of the above. . . .all u have to do is to pick up the bible and educate urself.

Where is your contact with your god telling you that he ordered any body to write the bible on his behalf?

Atheism is an intellectually lazy dogmatic approach at attaining mental irrationality. atheism is the only means of saying 1+1 = 12 . ,  while hiding under mathematical knowledge and still not proving how u came about the answer.
atheism is an irrational disease that bothers on the mind and brain.

Again your deluded opinion and claims are of NO importance here. . . . . .Its good to rant sometimes so I will allow you do that. . .  . . .

Chrisbenogor:
I am tired of these kind of threads.

Chris how body. . . .

davidylan:
the only reason i'm "bothered" is when irrational and abusive folks forcefully hijack threads in their haste to show "concern" for our sheer stupidity in daring to beleive in a God they are not convinced does not exist.

Another lie. . . the reason you are bothred is because you can not stand the scrutiny. . . .no matter how you pretend you do not care. . .you actually care and you have said it so many times. . . . As for your imaginary god's existence. . all I can say is that I am more than convinced he exists only in your deluded imaginations. . . . .

davidylan:
you dont need to quote it, i already know. Infact that verse is fulfilled everyday with the likes of you. If you had any peace about there being no God you wont be here showing "concern". You'd be sitting in your corner shaking your head at our incredulity.

The verse that says that the biblegod will go about punishing those that do not believe in him and making sure that they have no rest? is that what is being fulfilled everyday with the likes of me? I am yet to see you god at my heels giving me a hard time for not believing in him as some passages in the bible say. . . .I have never said that I have any concern for any of you guys. . . . my concern is for my fellow atheist and to show that you guys have no arguments at all. . . .Are you concernd for the muslims you love attacking all the time?. . . .Are you disturd and without peace any time you go to show them the many many lies that exist in their koran? Guess what thats the same thing weare doing here. . . . Its just sad that you guys always love to cry and whine when you are giving a taste of your own medicine. . . . cry cry babies. . . . .

That's because you dont understand the word "fear" as used there. It simply means humility. But pls dont let me use facts to change your bias.

I said that your religiuon is fear and you have demonstrated that so many times already. . . .

davidylan:
Not so . . . it is for the exact lie above that i ensure i pepper my responses with plenty of bible verses. My opinion is of no consequence if it isnt backed up by the bible. The unfortunate fact is that for the majority of those here who claim to be "christians", a lot of their claims are not based on the bible but empty emotionalism. If the bible says so, then i believe it fullstop. I dont care what mazaje has to say.

Which bible verses do you actually use? Do you guys not always use the same bible when arguing against each other? Do the pastors that you labelled heretics whom so many people here on nairaland revere use the koran when preaching? . So davidylan's personal interpertation of the bible is the only one that counts and is right eh? . What a goon. . . . .

this is your own arrogant and baseless view of what God should or should not do.

I repeat No god will allow some unknown entities that can not even write a coherent story to tell the whole world that he wants save from himself do that on his behalf? If your god is real he will do that himself. . . . . .

note how his entire argument is based on "what I, mazaje, think God shld be like". As if an acceptable God would be mazaje's private puppet.

That's not true. . . . do you know why you guys are always the ones standing up for your god and doing everything for him? Because he exist only in your imaginations . . . . .Have you gotten any written agreemet with any god telling you that he inspired any body to write anything on his behalf? I repeat the fact that belief is MOST important to your god says that the tale is a lie. . . . how else will the writers of the many many lies that are in the bible that have no evidence what so ever make you guys believe in their nonsense if they do not place belief as the most important of all things. . . . . one thing that all religions have in common is the fact that belief in the nonsense that they say with out evidence is what counts most . . . .

but like you, they claim to be able to know how a "believable and true god" shld communicate with his people, create the world and where he shld send them all to. Any deviation from their own personal feelings is dumped out as "false".

Again this is false. . . .they only look at the arguments presented and show how porous and ridiculous it all is. . . . .You guys on the other hand always seem to know exactly what your god feels, likes, need and wants from humans. . . . No god will depend on you guys to do anything for him if that god truly exist. . . . he will do it himself. . .

Neither has any God ever told you in private that He didnt. It is your OWN ASSUMPTION that people wrote the bible and ascribed it to God.

Where is your agreement with your god telling you that he inspired any body to write the bible for him? Where you there when Paul was writing any of his letters? Did you know the exact reasons he wrote them? Where you there when the ancient jews wrote what they wrote down do you know why they wrote them? All you have are men writing down things and telling other men that god told them to do so. . . . .Some of them went as faras saying that you need to believe them because their god needs you to believe them. . . . NO god that created the universe will operate that way at all. . .the fact that you believe the writings of lairs who claim to know what their god needs, wants or desires does not mean that its true. . .

I know this because anyone who has ever TRULY encountered Christ does not feel as if he is talking to himself in prayer. Yes that was my past experience but God has been faithful to uphold me.

What eactly is prayers apart from just wishing and hoping. . . .Prayers as we know it have no effect at all. . . .If it does THERE WILL be evidence to show for it. . . .

Being raised in a conservative christian home and thinking that you are "obeying the commandments of the Lord" has no correlation with having a genuine personal relationship with God. Like a family friend would always say - God has no grandchildren.

What eactly is this personal relationship with god that you keep deluding yourself with? Personal relationship is a two way thing no?

That is all you need to be saved but you also need to WORK OUT YOUR SALVATION DAILY WITH FEAR AND TREMBLING

Again your religion is nothing but FEAR. . . . love god and fear him at the same time. . .I wonder how you guys reason such things out. . . . . FEAR is ACTUALLY the only thing that give religion credibility. . . .

this is false.

No its very true. . . . Very few people actually leave the religion they were born into or convert to another religion. . . . 95 percent of christians were born into the religion. . . . .if you were born into a muslim family from bauchi state you will be telling us about the koran instead of the bible. . . if Abuzola was born into a christian family from Imo state he would have been telling us about the bible instead of the koran. . . . .

Your own quote from a previous thread - When have i ever said that religion is of no concern to me? I am very concerned about religion because when ever i go to Naija and tell people that I am an atheist most of them feel very very uncomfortable with my position. . . . . . . .

Perhaps you shldnt exhibit selective memory. Your mission is irrelevant . . . and is further proof that you have an unhealthy "concern" for christianity. If truly you believe there are no arguments to support christianity then WHY DO YOU FEEL AN INORDINATE COMPULSION TO SHARE IT WITH US? Do we really care? why are you desperate to change our opinion? No those you know "afraid of atheists" are your family and friends so pls kindly go show your "concern" and address your "mission" to them. you're preaching to the choir here, 90% of whom dont even reside in Nigeria and could care less what an atheist had for breakfast.

Are you that dumb or are you really blind?. . . . can't you read?. . . When did I say that I was concerned for you guys? I cleary said I was concerned about religion because of what I experince when I tell people that I am an atheist back in Niaja. . . . how does that equate to me feeling concerned for you guys? Your pathetic attempts to always mix things up is really shameful. . . .

Again falling into the same godless trap of trying to define "god" by his own limitations.

If you have any personal contract with any god defining himself unto you pls let me know. . . . .

davidylan:
You're not saying anything we dont know . . . infact Christ alluded to this in the gospels - Matt 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

The unjust have been granted the miracle of breath in their nostrils . . . too bad they are taking it for granted while striding arrogantly into hell.

Another nonsense drivel. . .Should I quote verses from the bible were it says that the evil people and sinners that o not believe in yahweh will know no peace? as usual he displays that his only Religion is FEAR. . . . sorry there is nothing your imaginary god can ever do to me. . . .

davidylan:
the only "problems" i see are your own myopia, unbelief and desperation to force your opinions into the bible.

Mirror mirror on the wall. . . .Thats not true. . . .The person that is ACTUALLY always trying to force his opinion on others here is you. . . You are the one that is always telling other christains what you believe should be the actually interpretation of the bible as if you wrote any part of it. . . .You have been arguing with your fellow christians on NL long before atheist came on board and always trying to tell them that your own opinion and interpertation suppercedes theirs most of the time. . . . .    

He mentions it in the bible and the bible authors acknowledged it. Do YOU KNOW that God DID NOT tell/inspire anyone to write the books of the bible? Do you have a personal experience too?

. NO god that truly wants to "save" the world will allow the incompetent unknown writers of the gospel that can not even write a very coherent story to tell any body about him. . .according to the christian hypothesis god created the world and decided to punish all its inhabitants because some people that he hadn't given the knowledge of right and wrong eat from a tree of knowledge . . . he then came down to the world and the only place he can go to is a very little and obscured part of the world to perform wonders and magic. . . .after ascending into heaven from where he allegedly decended from stories were not written about him until about 40-45 years after his alleged ascension by unknown people. . . . . . . What a tale. . . .No god will behave in such an incompetent way. . . .the fact that your god relies heavily on belief more than anything else says that whole tale is false. . . .

Are you also not guilty of simply believing the writings of those who do not believe God and are desperate to do anything to "prove" that the bible is fallible and myths of mere mortals?

They at lest do not claim to be know what any god feel, knows, wants and needs from other humans. . . .

You are equally guilty of this. You only believe the web writings of those who want you to believe what they also imagine is the mythology of the bible. you have no PERSONAL PROOF that who you think is the truth!

No go has ever said he wrote or inspired any boy to write the bible. . . people wrote them things and asribe it to their god. . . .

The bottomline here is your own lack of understanding of the scriptures and nothing to do with Paul.

Same excuse everyday at lest he was honest enough to say it. . .

You knelt down and prayed but your prayers werent answered[b] because you werent saved[/b]. A lot of folks kneel down to "pray" forgetting that God is only moved by genuine repentance and not a false show of self-righteous works.

How do you know this? Didn't you once said that you almost threw the bible away? What exatly does it mean to be saved aoring to the christian hypothesis? All you need to be saved is to accept jesus as your god and saviour and obey the commandedments of the bible. . . I was raised in a very c

davidylan:
the only "problems" i see are your own myopia, unbelief and desperation to force your opinions into the bible.

Mirror mirror on the wall. . . .Thats not true. . . .The person that is ACTUALLY always trying to force his opion on others here is you. . . You are the one that is always telling other christains what you believe should be the atually interpretation of the bible as if you wrote any part of it. . . .You have been arguing with your fellow christians on NL long before atheist came on board and always trying to tell them that your own opinion and interpertation suppercedes theirs. . . . . .    

He mentions it in the bible and the bible authors acknowledged it. Do YOU KNOW that God DID NOT tell/inspire anyone to write the books of the bible? Do you have a personal experience too?

Are you also not guilty of simply believing the writings of those who do not believe God and are desperate to do anything to "prove" that the bible is fallible and myths of mere mortals?

You are equally guilty of this. You only believe the web writings of those who want you to believe what they also imagine is the mythology of the bible. you have no PERSONAL PROOF that who you think is the truth!

The bottomline here is your own lack of understanding of the scriptures and nothing to do with Paul.

You knelt down and prayed but your prayers werent answered because you werent saved. A lot of folks kneel down to "pray" forgetting that God is only moved by genuine repentance and not a false show of self-righteous works.

and? What has that proven? That the bible is a myth? Are there no muslim converts?

Actually you're wrong! Atheism has a god - SELF! That's why its sometimes called secular humanism. Religions have one thing in common - a central figure of reverence . . . for the atheist it is the human self. Dont keep deluding yourself, no human is a blank slate.

Just the same way you take it on your self to show forced "concern" for us?

Why shld He? Its ok for folks like you to go on deluding yourselves . . . no one will drop down from heaven to convince you.

[/quote]onservative christian home and I truly believed and abided by all those things written in the bible. . . .


[quote]and? What has that proven? That the bible is a myth? Are there no muslim converts?

Just as there are christian converts to islam. . .95 percent of christians are ONLY christains because they were born into the religion. . . very few people atually leave the religion of their parents thats why if people convert they are treate specially and talked about a lot. . . .

Actually you're wrong! Atheism has a god - SELF! That's why its sometimes called secular humanism. Religions have one thing in common - a central figure of reverence . . . for the atheist it is the human self. Dont keep deluding yourself, no human is a blank slate.

You are entittled to your opinion. . . . . .The fact that you keep trying to convine yourself doesn't make it true . . .

Just the same way you take it on your self to show forced "concern" for us?

When have I ever said That I show any conern for you guys. . . My only mission here is to show that christians have no arguments, support other atheist that have left christianity (which there are many here) and show you other Nigerians that are very afraid of atheist that it is very OK to be an atheist since christianity has no better argument. . .

Why shld He? Its ok for folks like you to go on deluding yourselves . . . no one will drop down from heaven to convince you.

You forgot that the people that wrote the bible said that he was once all over them leading in wars and in contest against other gods to show that he is real while all the other gods are false. . . . a simple contest between allah and yahweh will do. . .   , Why can't yahweh replicate the Elijah challenge?   ;DWhy is it that he decided to run away once men became more knowledgeble and aware. . . .

noetic2:
Are u saying that no christian has ever received a miracle? or what EXACTLY is the point in the post above? ??

It all depends on what you call Miracles. . . Getting a job in Nigerian is called a miracle these days. . .If you call surviving a car accident, having a safe journey, getting a good wife, living a healthy life without falling sick for decades, Going to the hospital and surving a terminal illness after taking some medication,having lots of money, or some how getting out of trouble when all odds are against you etc miracles then I will say that you don't really know what miracles as described by the bible really are. . . Atheist, muslims buddist all experience all these things. . .I personally survived a robbery attack in which some people were killed January this year in Abuja. . . That's pure luck not miracle(because I am NOT better than any of the guys that were killed at all) and so many people experience it regardless of their religious beliefs. . .When you talk about clear cut miracles like walking on water, healing an amputee and making their amputated limbs grow back. . .then I an tell you that NO christian has ever experiened ANY of them. . . . .What you guys call miracles HAPPEN to people ALL the time regardless of their religious beliefs. . . . .Atheist survive gun shot wounds. . . plane crash etc. . . Its just luck. . .

will u shut up?

whats ur explanation to the world as we see it today? how did man come about? the sun? the moon? the stars? animals and plants?
whats ur explanation for the source, origin and sustainability of life?

I don't have any real or true explanation for how the world and the universe came about neither do you the scientist and the ancient goons that thought it was right to rape young virgins and sarifice them to their deity as an offering. . . .NOBODY really knows exactly how the universe came about. . . the fact that you accept the lies of some ancient guys who believe that their god once drowned the earth an left behind a drunkard an his incestous family doesn't make it true. . . .

davidylan:
Actually i doubt if you understand yourself. What the Heavenly Father wants or thinks is written in the bible, you know that book you would rather convince urself is flawed. If anyone is in doubt he only needs consult the bible or go on his knees in prayer.

You see the problem. . .Did any "heavenly father" tell your personally that he inspired any bother to write the bible on his behalf? Are you not just believing the writings of people who wrote what ever they wante to write and ascribe it to their god?. . . . .You only believe the writings of those who wanted you to believe what they thought and imagined. . . at least some the gospels were sincere enough to write that they wrote down their accounts because they wanted people to believe in them. . . Paul uses words like "My gospel" and even gave the impression that it is OK for him to lie for his god. . .My deconversion from christianity was a very painful process to me  personally because I knelt down and prayed but I only reaslized that I was only talking to myself and just wishing away. . . If you were born into a hausa moslem family from bauchi state, I KNOW that you will be here telling us that allah's thoughts and wishes are all written in the koran all we need to do is read it with an open mind and pray to him. . . . .  

Why create a god so you can run around enslaving yourself to it? Seems to me like the "god" of atheism . . . you seem to be doing a lot of the donkey work for "him". dont you think he is powerful enough to convince us that christianity is false?

I actually believe that you guys need to ask yourselves that question. Atheism has no god no matter how hard you keep trying to convince yourself that it does. . . atheism actually is the direct opposite of your thoughts. . . .You are the ones that ACTUALLY DO ALL THE WORK for your god . . . You always claim to tell people what he thinks. . .likes. . .hopes. . . wishes. . .and dislikes. . . .I am YET to see any god do that for himself. . . If any god truly exists NON of you guys will need to say anything on his/her behalf. . . . . HE/SHE WILL DO IT THEMSELVES. . . .

noetic2:
u live in both denial and ignorance.

The person that ACTUALLY lives in ignorance and total denial is you.

That u choose to disbelief does not discredit the things we see as evidences.

What exactly are the things that you "see"? The bible talks about signs that will follow those that are christians so that people will see and believe no? It says once you believe in jesus you will be able to perfoem magic like healing the blind, healing the sick and rasing people from the dead just like the bible says your go did. . . . how many blind people have you ever healed? . Why is it that non of the christains around are able to perform this magic. . . . all we see are frudulent lies peddled all the time. . . . as toneyb always says is it because the whole tale is a lie?

God made heaven and earth. . . . and that includes all that u see and call nature.
proof? . . . . . .is there any other explanation to the world as we see it today?

That is your own claim and hypothesis. . .you and the people that wrote the lies that are in the bible, koran and other religious text out there. . . . your god did not create me. . .NOBODY knows for sure how the universe came about. . .all we have are different attempts by scientist, religious people (who always in the business of speaking for their various gods) etc trying to postulate how the universe  the earth and everything that is inside it came about. . . . I say the invisible pink unicorn that orbits the sun created the universe prove me wrong. . . .

Didn't pastor Adeboye claim to have driven on an empty tank for over 300km?. . . . He should be able to cure the people that are giving him money to buy a private jet of HIV so that they will keep giving no?

davidylan:
odd. My dad is real but does he have control over what i say or do not say?

. You are comparing apples to oranges here. . .you don't ALWAYS speak for your father do you? You don't ALWAYS tell people what your father wants and what he thinks. . .You don't ALWAYS tell people what they need to do to please your father or how to please. . . .If your father sends you on an errand and the person is in doubt all you need to do is call your father and he will come and do the rest himself. . . That is NOT the case with any of the many gods we always here about. . . People are the ones that DO EVERYTHING for them . . . No god has ever done anything for himself. . . reason is because people created all the gods hence they have to do all their biddings(write stories about them, tell others about them, fight for them, tell people what they like and dislike etc) for them

davidylan:
you just have to laugh at the way these guys think.

You think if yahweh is real he will allow you confused bunch who are yet to agree on his basic nature to tell any body about him?

davidylan:
which is kinda funny as that is what virtually all you atheists do. Quote websites, blogs, articles, wikipedia with no references. when i bring that up its because i'm stupid and when i do same you suddenly start grovelling for "references"? since when did that matter to you?

I was just trying to show you your own hypocrisy. . . you call wikipedia a godless site and quickly quote from it when ever it agree with your positions. . . when others quote from it you say that it has no reference only for you to not only quote from wikipedia but you quoted an article that had no reference at al. . . . . .

But you dont know . . . that is YOUR opinion. Josephus lived at least 1000 yrs before you were born, how do you know what sources he used to write his work? If all his works were based on myth how come his works are used as a basis for archeology?

I agree that's my own opinion. . . but I can back it up. . . .Where did I say that all his works were based on myths?. . . .  

Read the entire blurb on wikipedia about Josephus, the references are there. I cut out a lot due to space constraints.

The one you posted clearly said citation needed. . . .

noetic3:
what has this rubbish got to do with the thread?

Everything. . . . . you asked me to provide evidence to show that your god does not exist and I said the fact that you are telling others about him, and claiming he is alive while their own go is dead(Muslims) is enough evidence to show that he exists only in your deluded imaginations. . . .

davidylan:
this is totally irrelevant, i'm not sure what was being addressed here unless you were simply being ur usual abusive self.

My post was simply addressing this illogical comment from you - I am very concerned about religion because when ever i go to Naija and tell people that I am an atheist most of them feel very very uncomfortable with my position. . . . . . . .So I come here to show you guys that you have no arguments and that it is very OK to be an atheist. . . .

you falsely claim to be "concerned" about religion because when you go to nigeria and tell people (most likely your family and friends) that you're atheist, they feel uncomfortable. The absurd thing is that rather than confront those family and friends, you feel your best bet is to come on an online forum majority of whom live abroad NOT IN NIGERIA to tell us that we havent got any arguments and that its ok to be an atheist?

How do you know that I haven't confronted my family and friends? . . . . . . .Nigerians where ever they seem to find themselves are always some of the most religious people you will ever find around. . . .Even the Nigerians abroad feel it is not OK to be an atheist. . .I live in europe and I know exatly what I am talking about. . . .

hullo . . . how do you rationally square your problem with your prescribed solution? Did we have any arguments with you in nigeria that you have to come and debate? why are you not going to nigeria to go tell your people that "they havent got any arguments and its ok to be an atheist"? what has your personal issues with your family to do with us? Do we really care how your family and friends feel about you being atheist?

Do we know you? Did you encounter[b] us[/b] in nigeria and we presented any arguments to you?

Absurd.

Who are the "us". There are quite a sizeble number of atheist here no? I post here to support them in their atheism. . . .

noetic3:
How many times have I asked ur irrational, deluded, ignoramus and ridiculously illiterate self to present ur evidences that supports the non-existence of God?
I am not defending God. . . . I have no reason to.

is it too much to ask that u produce evidences to back up ur belief? or are so ridiculously brainless?

You keep bleating all over NL that your god is alive and allah is dead no? . If your god is alive and allah is dead don't you think it will be better for him to tell the moslems himself? The fact that you are doing this says he exist only in your deluded imaginations. . . . .I dont need to provide any evidence you are my evidence. . . that fact that you come to NL to tell christians that do not agree with you what you feel jehova wants is enough evidence for me that he exist only in your delusions. . no go will allow an irrelevant entity like you to speak on his behalf. . . .

lets get done with this first.
So u agree that the red sea was parted for the children of israel. .  , right?

.

davidylan:
Culled from Wikipedia.

Significance to scholarship

The works of Josephus provide crucial information about the First Jewish-Roman War and are also important literary source material for understanding the context of the Dead Sea Scrolls and post-Second-Temple Judaism.

Josephus includes information about individuals, groups, customs and geographical places. His writings provide a significant, extra-Biblical account of the post-Exilic period of the Maccabees, the Hasmonean dynasty, and the rise of Herod the Great. He makes references to the Sadducees, Jewish High Priests of the time, Pharisees and Essenes, the Herodian Temple, Quirinius' census and the Zealots, and to such figures as Pontius Pilate, Herod the Great, Agrippa I and Agrippa II, John the Baptist, James the brother of Jesus, and a disputed reference to Jesus. He is an important source for studies of immediate post-Temple Judaism (and, thus, the context of early Christianity).

A careful reading of Josephus' writings allowed Ehud Netzer, an archaeologist from Hebrew University, to discover the location of Herod's Tomb, after a search of 35 years — above aqueducts and pools, at a flattened, desert site, halfway up the hill to the Herodium, 12 kilometers south of Jerusalem — exactly where it should have been, according to Josephus's writings.[citation needed]

So all these scholars who trust Josephus are either jews or liars too?

Absurd.

Absurd indeed. . . you presented a quote from wikipeia that has NO reference at all. Josephus lived about a thousand years after the myth of the exodus, he only wrote about Moses based on stories he heard as a Jew nothing more. What has his writings about Hero an first centuary Palestine got to do with the fact that the Egyptian records does not mention Joseph, Moses or any of the stories in exodus like the plagues and the exodus it self.

davidylan:
and what has that got to do with us here? Why dont you go back to nigeria and go share your concerns with them? Why do you feel the need to come here to show us anything? Do we live in Nigeria? Are we the ones making you uncomfortable? Do we EVEN KNOW YOU?

Absurd.

Are you that self centered? Why does everything have to be about you? Do you know that nairaland is the biggest Nigerian forum on the internet? A lot of Nigerians(both inside and outside) come here. . . . . I can't help but call you an Idiot. . . .

davidylan:
yes they do. Infact Josephus writes a lot about Moses and its not in the torah.

Is josephus not a jew? . Was he not writing about the jewish history that he came to accept as the "truth"? The ancient Egyptians have no records of moses(grew in the house of the king) or joseph even though the bible says that there were very close to the kings an in the case of joseph even ruled along side the king. . . . . . .

davidylan:
that is a LIE! If you were happy you wont spend ALL YOUR TIME HERE insulting those who choose to keep their faith in Christ, you wont choose to remain here accusing me of falsehoods, you wont choose to spend 90% of your time on a religion that you're "happy to realize is a fraud and a lie".

I am very happy for realizing its all a lie and a fraud. I have told you why I am here. . . I am here to show nigerian  christians that they have no argument and that it is very OK to be an atheist. . . .I don't spen my time insulting people here the only people I insult here are you an neoti an that because insult are the only language you tow goons unerstand. . . . .You spend a lot of time on the islamic thread showing moslems what a lie an a frau their religion is you once said . . . thats the same thing I do here. . . .  

Like spikey said . . . if truly a religion is of no concern to you you wont dwell so much on it. She packed so much wisdom in one line than you have ever shown in 900 posts.

See why I keep calling you a fool? When have i ever said that religion is of no concern to me? I am very concerned about religion because when ever i go to Naija and tell people that I am an atheist most of them feel very very uncomfortable with my position. . . . . . . .So I come here to show you guys that you have no arguments and that it is very OK to be an atheist. . . .

noetic3:
of course u do. u delusively tell urself every day that there is No God, when u have little or no evidence to show for it.
u wax in ignorance and deception every day with little or no concrete basis for disbelieving the claims of the bible.
you are so helplessly ignorant.

How many times are we going to tell you that if there is a god he will not allow deluded, blockheaded and know nothing goons like you to defend him and talk on his behalf? The fact that you are telling people about your god says that he exist only in your deluded imaginations. . . 

how do u intend to dismiss the evidences that ESTABLISH that the red sea parted for the children of israel to pass?

. The many many lies these deluded goons keep singing to themselves just to feel good. . . .There was never an exodus in the first place. . . moses, joseph exist only in the lying torah. . . the egyptians have NO record of them. . . . .

davidylan:
it must have had a very lousy effect on you. It ended up producing a godless, immoral, angry sinner. I'll be praying for you.

Nah. . .I am VERY happy after I realized it was all a fraud and a big LIE. I am not an immoral person, am not an angry person that fact that you keep deluding yourself into believing that those that do not share your delusions are angry or sinners does not make it true. . . your deluded opinions are of no value here. . . . .

davidylan:
Just exactly the same way you also make declarations about christians that are not true. Shocking you only notice that when others make it.

My friends are a valid reference point for the millions who claim to be christians but for whom christianity is no more than a label. My facts are wrong to you because they destroy one plank of your ridiculous argument.

What exactly is christianity? Calling people you don't know monkeys(when you yourself look exactly like one) on the internet? Or talking about your sexual escapades on the sexuality threads? Is labelling others that do not agree with your own deluded interpretation of the bible fools and frauds what christianity is exactly about?