₦airaland Forum

Hmm this matter strong oo.

I think lalasticlala should come and see what Seun and all these atheists here have caused. Seems like they are gaining converts by the day.
Atheism must not grow in Nigeria o. See the kind issue wey e don dey cause.

oxon:
well this would be the first pyem person am seeing its like the tribe is at the brink of extinction, you find one in out of a hundred, well am a pyem boy too but not being to gindri in a while now

Interesting. What part of Gindiri and what is d family name? Can u speak the language? where do u reside?

I think Igbos and their tribalism are the reason why Nigerian christian unity is impossible.

attackgat:
When Nigeria breaks up,via referendum, I see possibly 5 countries emerging

1) Oduduwa Repuplic consisting on the present SW with Kwara, Yoruba speaking parts of Kogi, Edo and possibly Urohbo and Itsekiri.

2) Arewa Republic consisting of the NW/NE and much of the NC

3) Izon Republic consisting of all the Ijaws in Rivers, Bayelsa, Delta and Ondo. Possibly with Ogoni.

4) Oyono Republic, should Akwa-Cross and Ogoja refuse to join Igbos in Biafra Republic, then they are most likely to end up as Oyono Republic

5) Republic of Biafra, consisting of the present dat SE, Anioma, the Igbos of the lower Benue, Rivers Igbos. Possibly with Igala/Idoma/Igede

You are very wrong with number 2.
There can be no Arewa country that will cover the whole north.
An arewa country will only include the whole Northwest (excluding southern kaduna) and North eastern states like Borno, Yobe, Bauchi and parts of Gombe. Niger state is the only state in North central that are likely to join hausas in Arewa republic. The remaining north-central states plus Southern Kaduna, Taraba and parts of Adamawa and Gombe will never and can never join Hausa-fulanis to form one country.
The North wil be more divided than the south and many of you dont know. Northern minorities especially the Christians can never join Hausa fulani in one country.

Even the Kanuris of Borno and Yobe may not join Hausas. They have had their differences for a long time.

GorkoSusaay:
Nowenuse, you should know that Lawani is a very thick guy.
He never lets facts, history and logic stand on the way of his childish mumblings.
Nice write-up on Ilorin, by the way

Abeg my brother, i hear u jare.
Some people should just be left to continue in their ignorance and self delusion.

I decline from responding to him henceforth. He does not even know the settings and division of Kwara state. He just continues saying one the same thing irrespective of the loads of fact i am dishing out to him.

lawani:
Nobody in Ilorin will ever say they are Hausa, at best they say they are Ilorin, the way I will say i am Ijesa. To me, they are Oyo, not different from Ogbomoso or Ibadan. Four of the 6 Ilorin ruling families know their founders as Yorubas, other two are Hausa and Fulani. The masses are Yoruba in everything. you see ebos here and there in Ilorin at junctions. Ajikobi, Alanamu. Magaji Aare, Baba Isale do not deny their Yoruba foundation. Gambari and Fulani dont deny their Yoruba heritage. so how do you think the result of a vote will look like?.

See, stop making generalizations for God sake, u are not from Kwara and neither are you from Ilorin emirate. Me i am from neither places and i dont make generalizations about the place because i have met Ilorin indigenes who claim fulani, nupe, yoruba and ilorin tribe itself.

Read this link below and confirm, it was written by Ilorin indigenes who believe they are yoruba because they are afonja's descendants and they clearly noted the fact that their city is in identity crisis and some of their friends claim to be fulani because they are fulani descendants

http://www.thescoopng.com/femi-owolabi-akeem-addio-ilorin-the-city-wrapped-in-a-crisis-of-identity/

Dont just sit in your room in Ogbomosho and be concluding facts you know nothing about. Hear from the horse's mouth!

This is just like someone claiming that the Anioma people of Delta state are 100 % igbos, that is very wrong. The people of Anioma are mixed, some beieve they are igbos and some do not, some still speak igala, yoruba and edo as their mother's tongue in Anioma till date.

Ilorin emirate is a mixed place and nothing can change that! I have met familes from Ilorin who claim they are fulani and Nupes and you have no right to deny them the choice of their ethnicity!

lawani:
I am speaking of Ilorin city, apparently, the pre Nigerian state of Ilorin contained some Nupe settlements. Those are not Yoruba, they are Nupe but Ilorin is Yoruba. Jebba is not under Ilorin and they are to the North 100km North of Ilorin, adjacent to them would be some Nupe. The state of Ilorin was signed under the British by balogun Ajikobi a Yoruba man. Nupe are not Yoruba, neither are Yoruba Nupe.

You are now confusing yourself. Ilorin city is part and parcel of Ilorin emirate, an inseperable entity. The king of Ilorin city is also the king of Ilorin emirate (the whole of Kwara central) and the people are all under one chiefdom and traditional identity, so what are you talking here?

The Jebba u are busy blabbing about here since is a 3rd class traditional chiefdom, because the Ilorin emirate (which is the head of Kwara state traditional council) refuses to recognise his supreme kingship of Jebba, with the claims that Jebba has always been under Ilorin and former kings of Jebba have always been coronated and turbanned from Ilorin and this is true!
The current Oba of Jebba is the 5th to assume the throne, showing u that the chiefdom of the town is not old.

Look at the picture of the so called Oba of Jebba below and you can see that he has no resemblance in culture to the usual Obas in yoruba land and this is because he receives his kingship staff of office and turbanning from the Ilorin emirate!

According to your theory, the Nupe speaking parts of Moro LGA (under Ilorin emirate traditional council and part of greater Ilorin urban area) are now yorubas.
Congratulations for that discovery @lawani

Ignorance is really a problem that sometimes defer treatment.

The most influential families and leaders from Ilorin have disclaimed yoruba identity publicly, deal with that @lawani

lawani:
Let them be! Face your own land!. Where are you from in North central? I repeat no single ethnic Fulani, Hausa, Malian or Nupe in Ilorin but there are people whose compound was founded by founders from those lands. Same applies to Ilesa, even Lagos but Ilorin came under Nigeria with Ajikobi signature, an Oyo prince.


But let them be. If Ilorin joins Kano or Mali, Jebba will not. So face your own issues. Dont be caught napping! Where exactly are you from?


Then having Emirs does not mean you fell under the Fulani. Even the Obaro of Kabba was wearing a tall crown in the past to resemble a turban, even the Attah Igala and etc. So the Borgu did not at any time fall to the Fulani jihad. No present Yoruba land fell to the jihad but a fulani descendant was made chief Imam now Emir in Ilorin but now removed, replaced by a Hausa descended man. If Hausa cant be Emir in Kano, they should be one in Ilorin pending when the show will come to an end.


Then if you are intelligent, you would ask

1. Is Ilorin contiguous with Fulani controlled territory? No

2. Is Ilorin ruled by a Fulani descendant traditionally? No.

3. Was Ilorin signed under British protection by Fulanis as is the case with Hausa land? No. Ilorin was put under Britain by Balogun Ajikobi an Oyo prince.

4. Is it possible for a Yoruba Muslim city totally surrounded by Yoruba traditional states and populated by Yorubas to identify as Fula or Hausa? No. Because the people are no different from Ibadan people and Ilorin was not the only Yoruba Muslim state in history.


Please park well.

Well, i dont think it makes any difference we arguing or wasting our time about this issue because whether we argue or not, there are some facts we cannot change!

I wish the Ilorin indigenes were here to speak for themselves so that we can hear from the horses mouth directly.
So far so good, majority of the most influential families from Ilorin have never claimed to be yoruba publicly, some like the Sarakis (the most influential family from Ilorin) have publicly disclaimed yoruba identity.

I dont know if u have ever studied the emirate system of rulership and how it functions, pls go and study more about this and use hausa land as a case study. The emirate system promote religion above ethnicity and cultural values. As long as Ilorin is concerned, the traditional leadership of the land will welcome a fulani muslim from Katsina more than the average yoruba from the Southwest when it comes to issues of paramount concern, this is something alien to yoruba culture at large.


Many Ilorin indigenes, leaders and big shots who the society look up to for leadership do not participate in Pan yoruba associations, they never speak on behalf of yoruba people or yoruba issues, they do not celebrate or believe in yoruba traditional festivals and rituals and they never take pride in yoruba culture, history and origin.

If the entire yoruba leadership can accept the extreme differences of Ilorin people and the fact that most Ilorin people will take the command of the fulani controlled Sultanate and oneness as supreme or first before any yoruba influence, then thats great and i wish them goodluck.

The question then remains, what do Ilorin indigenes think of themselves? Do they prefer to declare and identify with yoruba culture and identity or the hausa fulani ones? Which do they emphasize on more? Are they perfectly Okay with the northerner tag or they wish to be united with the southwest just as Okun and Offa (Kwara south) people have been wishing? These are the questions their leaders and elders must come out to answer, it is not by any of us sitting down in our rooms and punching our keypads to declare where these people stand when in true life the case may be different.

Alas, from what we can see so far, the most influential people and traditional leaders of Ilorin tilt towards the North and northern hausa-fulani islamic union and identity than the Omo Oduduwa union and identity and this is something we cannot wish away, it is the reality on ground.

@ lawani
I'd like to know, are u from Kwara?
I schooled with an Ilorin girl from Bello family, her mother is hausa, so she speaks yoruba and hausa fluently. She never for one day claims yoruba as her tribe. If u ask her her tribe, she just says Ilorin.

Late Abubakar Olusola Saraki, the elder statesman came out before the whole world and said that he is not a yoruba man even though his mother's tongue may be yoruba and that is how it has been with the whole Saraki family in Ilorin, as well as so many other big families and elites of Ilorin. Have u really met true indigenes of Ilorin emirate?? If not i doubt you will talk that way!
And pls when i say Ilorin indigenes, i dont mean Offa or other parts of Kwara south, i mean Kwara central (Ilorin emirate proper)?

lawani:
There is no Hausa or Fulani indigene of Ilorin. Just one Hausa compound and one Fulani compound by origin and not present identity. Both are Baloguns. Then you have Ajikobi and Alanamu who are the biggest Baloguns, then Baba Isale, Magaji Aare and etc who trace descent to Oyo, igbomina and etc

Let me pretend that i am not seeing this or probably am not understanding your point here.
All these Ilorin families e.g Saraki, Belgore, Kawu, Alimi, Gambari, Baraje, Jidda, Giwa, Bello e.t.c who are among the movers and shakers of Ilorin, are u saying they are all of yoruba origin from Oyo?
All the names of the families u see there are names of pure hausa and fulfude origin (pure or adulterated) and this clearly points to the origin of these people. That is why i said let me pretend to not see or understand this post, so that i can reply you in a corrective manner.

Some of these big Ilorin families of hausa, fulani and nupe origins still speak their native languages till date because many of them have been intermarrying pure hausa, fulanis and nupes from other states in the north. The emirate has also been encouraging the settling of pure hausa, fulanis and Nupes in Ilorin who are now accepted as indigenes of the city even though they are nor as famous as those big families who have been in the city for lineages.

@lawani, i never said that Ilorin is a fulani town! Ilorin is a mixed town and that is where i stood from the beginning.

Look at Lokoja for instance, Okun yoruba, egbirra, Kakanda and Bassa people can all claim indigeneship of the town because it cuts across all their territories. But the case of Ilorin is quite unique.
There are nupe speaking people who are part of Ilorin emirate and as Ilorin city grows, it will definitely encroach into these nupe parts of the emirates.

lawani:
Go and make research. Not all Hausa land fell to the Fulani jihad but majority did. However, no Yoruba land or Borgu land fell to that jihad, part of Nupe fell. The Oyo empire lost territory to the jihad but no present day Yoruba land fell to the jihad. No Yoruba land was signed under British protection by a Fulani descendant and the chief Imam of Ilorin now styled Emir is of Hausa and not of Fulani descent now. Then there are some Yoruba of Hausa, Fulani, Bariba, Nupe and etc descent even in Lagos as indigenes. that does not mean Lagos or Ilorin is not a Yoruba land especially when they are bounded by Yoruba states with Obas to the North and South. This Ilorin debate is a non issue. No depth. let us see how Ilorin is a Fulani town but Jebba is not.

First of all, as we continue this discourse, u should know that u are talking to an enlightened person well grounded in history and from the North central region, because i have observed that most yorubas on nairaland always feel that every person standing on an issue that affects them must be an igbo person, as if only yorubas and igbos are on nairaland.


First of all, i'd like you to list the parts of hausa land that did not fall to Jihad/Emirate rulership, because the last time i checked, every single part of hausa land has an emirate as a ruler and no traditional chiefdom.
The only group of hausa people who were able to escape the Jihad were the maguzawa people who have their largest populations in Katsina, Kano and Zazzau and these maguzawa hausas who most have converted to christianity today do not have their own independent kingship systems, their territories are still classified under emirates where they pay their dues regularly. Infact in the past they used to pay islamic tax (jizyah) which symbolises conquest.

After u finish listing the parts of hausaland that are not under emirates, i want you to move to Nupe land.
I really wonder if u know what you are saying!

Go and check history again, Mallam Dendo and his descendants succeeded in uniting all Nupe speakers under the Bida emirate by joinning Agaie and Lapai emirate together with Bida, that is why the Emir of Bida doubles as the Etsu Nupe (king of all Nupe people). Nupes in Kwara state are all under the rulership of Lafiagi emirate, an offshoot of Bida while all the Nupe speaking tribes in Kogi (excluding Bassa) are under the Maigari of Lokoja, an ordinary district head under Bida command!

As for the Bassas who are a nupe speaking tribe but are now somehow claiming a seperate ethnicity, of which is not out of place because they are the only nupe speaking group independent of Bida emirate. Many Nupes do not even see the bassas and other nupe speaking tribes in Kogi, FcT and Nasarawa as Nupes and vice versa.

How will u say that No borgu land fell to Jihad? Well, if u mean jihad by war, i agree because only hausa land and Adamawa axis fell to jihad by war of the fulanis in the real sense. But all Borgu people in Kwara, Niger and Kebbi states are under the rulership of emirates and the sultanate

lawani:
All Ilorin people are Yoruba people. Is that difficult to understand? They are under Yoruba culture, whether the founders of their family compound were Fulani, Bariba, Hausa, Portuguese, English does not matter. They are now Yoruba and even their DNA will say this! Quit going up and down. In a place like Kano, there are millions of Hausas from the Yoruba quarters of the town. Abeg wise up!

All Ilorin people cannot be under yoruba culture, because yoruba identity and culture is largely defined by a traditional system of rulership where the people are purely ruled, guided, directed and united by a common traditional system. This is absent in Ilorin!
Most Ilorin indigenes see islam more as a uniting factor unlike what u may observe in other parts of yoruba land where culture is the factor of unity and religion plays a second role.
The average ilorin muslims for instance will most likely prefer a hausa, fulani or any other muslim to assume positions of leadership in their land than a fellow indigene Ilorin christian.

Culture is not just about language alone!

If we even talk about dressing, about half if not majority of Ilorin people dress like Northernerns than normal yoruba dressing.
Their mentality is more like middlebelt and core northern muslims.

AjaanaOka:
You do know that people still regard all these places - Katsina, Kano, Zaria, etc - as Hausaland, and no one has a problem with that. Even other Fulanis, especially from the Northeast will readily tell you these places are in Hausaland.

What of Bida that also has a Fulani-descent emir and other elements of Fulani and Hausa origins? Has it stopped being a Nupe city because of that?

But you people want to make an exceptional case out of Ilorin, because of a handful of Hausa and Fulani elements that emigrated and settled in what was and still is essentially a Yoruba town.

Your bias and one-sided logic is showing.

Yes, northwest is still referred to as hausa land, but fulanis also have an equal stake in the region and can claim those places as part of fulani homeland.
Dont mind those fulanis from northeast, these are the same people who will claim that Buhari and Yar'adua are fulani men forgetting that these are northwestern hausanized fulanis and tomorrow they will say that all hausanized fulanis are hausas and that they are the real fulanis. Confusion.


See where u are making the mistake. As for the Nupes and the hausas, their whole lands are culturally incorporated into the Emirate/Sultanate system, hence this has become part of their culture and origin in entirety and they no longer have an origin independent of the emirates. This is very unlike the yorubas whom their majority populations have a traditional custom rulership as part of their culture, history, heritage and identity, so when u remove that in the case of only Ilorin, a big question mark appears as to where the identity of the people has to fall!

Teniolasmart:
exuse me cos there is something bothering my mind







is baking soda d same thing as baking powder

No, both are different

Hmm, so our brothers from the east have now moved to keeping sex slaves in the guise of christianity?

Ilorin city is not a yoruba city ethnically. U have yorubas, yorubanized hausas and yorubanuzed fulanis and pure fulanis and pure hausas who speak yoruba as a second language as co owners of the city.

Infact when u talk of Ilorin emirate which includes Moro and Asa LGAs, native nupe speakers are now included as part of Ilorin emirate. So Ilorin emirate which includes the 3 LGAs that make up Ilorin city + Moro & Asa LGAs is a multi ethnic kingdom.

Wulfruna:
So,Katsina is no longer historically Hausa because the elite and royal houses and bladiblabla are now Fulani?

Yes, thank God u said 'historically' hausa. Now, a new identity called Hausa-fulani has emerged and most hausas and hausanized fulanis are okay with their new identity.
Both pure fulanis, hausanized fulanis and hausas are now co and equal owners of katsina, so no single ethnicity has rights over the city

I really wonder why yorubas will be laying claim to Ilorin city. That is absolute nonsense!
Ilorin emirate which comprises 5 LGAs can not and never be an ethnic yoruba city. The spoken language there may be yoruba but that does not make the majority of the indigenes yoruba.

Most ilorin indigenes do not identify as ethnic yorubas especially the rulers, royal houses and elites of the city who are the movers and shakers of the city

vislabraye:
Why is Kwara not a pure Yoruba state ? Kogi and Benue are even closer to the North that Kwara, yet they don't have an Emir. (I stand to be corrected.).

This is not correct as such.
I am from the middlebelt. Kwara state is more connected to Niger state than Kogi or Benue and Niger state is the only middlebelt state that is purely controlled by islamic emirates and no single chiefdom.
So kwara is more likely to have a greater islamic influence

Much of the projects allocated to North central zone is for the development of our Federal capital territory (FCT).

Also, the landmass of the north is far far bigger than that of the south, so there is no way the project allocations can be equal. For instance, constructing a road joinning two towns in the north on the average may be two or three times the road between same towns in the south on the average.

Absolute nonsense.

Also wondered too

Joavid:
exactly. All this blocking of roads is happening in Igala land and by Igala's because they hate an Ebira man is governor.

outsiders won't understand this.

I am not igala, but truly Bello is wrong in every aspect. He is not the choice for Kogi ppl

This lady is a true representation of African beauty.
No skin whitening, no artificial hair......i love her

Guseh:
Yes, they from the western part of kogi state. Jemibewon is from Iyah-Gbede and he is a proud Okun-Yoruba man while Ogbeha is from Koton-kafi and has represented Kogi west in the senate for good two term'.
From your question, i trust you are not from kogi state?

That's interesting to know. No am not from Kogi, am from Plateau

With all these plans of developments, if the igbos fail to make their cities and towns hospitable enough to accomodate outsiders and foreigners, it would be almost as good as useless.
No place can experience true development without the presence of foreigners settling there and making it their home.

Guseh:
Important personalities for Kogi state also include;
1. Myself.... Guseh, Acidosis (Nairalander')

2. David Jemibewon ( former governor of old Oyo state and minister of police affair in 1999),

3. Tunde Ogheha (former Benue state minitary admi.), Pastor Sam Adeyemi of day star.

6. Prof. Sam Ale (national mathematical centre)

7. Pro. Oyinbo (great physicist)

8. Austin Oniwon(former group managing director NNPC)

9.Tunde Ayeni( Ntel and former Skye bank MD)

10. Prof. Eyitayo lambo( former Health minister)

11. kola jamodu (former minister for industry)

12. Bayo Ojo( former Attorney -General and Minister of Justice)

13. Jaywon, Y-Q, TUNDE EDNUT, Wizzy Pro beats, Lola Alao, SLEEK, father U-turn( artist'/celeb)

14. Smart Adeyemi (former NUJ president)

15. Muhamed Ado (former Attorney -General and Minister of Justice)

16. Shola and Sammy Ameobi, Juwon Oshaniwa, Gbenga Arokoyo( footballers)


The list is endless, you can add yours.


List of natural resources in Kogi State.: 1. Coal 2. Dolomite 3. Feldspar 4. Bauxite 5. Iron Ore 6. Tar 7. Limestone 8. Gold 9. Petroleum 10. Tin etc


List of Local Government Area In Kogi: 1. Adavi 2. Ajaokuta 3. Ankpa 4. Bassa 5. Dekina 6. Ibaji 7. Idah 8. Igalamela-Odolu 9. Ijumu 10. Kabba/Bunu 11. Kogi 12. Lokoja 13. Mopa-Muro 14. Ofu 15. Ogori/Mangongo 16. Okehi 17. Okene 18. Olamabolo 19. Omala 20. Yagba East 21. Yagba West.


list of higher institutions in Kogi state: 1. Kogi state university, ayangba 2. Federal university, lokoja 3. Federal polytechnic, idah 4. Kogi state polytechnic, lokoja 5. Federal college of education, okene 6. A.B.U. College of agriculture, kabba 6. Kogi state college of education technical, Kabba 7. Kogi state school of nursing, obangede 8. ECWA school of nursin, egbe 9. Salem university, lokoja 10. Health tech, idah etc

Wow, great list.
LoL @ the number one

The numb 2 and 3 are u really sure they are from Kogi? Does David Jemibewon really identify as an Okun kogite or as an Oyo man?

mandarin:
The Ogori Magongo people claim Ile Ife as descendants of Oduduwa. You can check their history out.
The Igala language is extensively close to YORUBA so so close and even more intelligible to other Yoruba tribes than even Akoko or Akoko Edo. These people I believe are distinct kinsmen of the Yoruba.
There are different clans of Ebira some of which have been Yorubanized, it all depends on where you are looking at, that is one of the funniest ethnic group in terms of fusion in Nigeria.
Very great work@op except for the Ogori Magongo error and fusing Igala and Igbo history. I think the only convergence, which of course is very important is the Umuleri Aguleri clan of the IGBO WHICH MAY HAVE HAD THEIR ROOTS IN IGALA.

Yes, u are very correct about Ogori magongo people, they have yoruba (ile ife) origins, but their language has really changed over the years, their language is not mutually intelligible to yoruba anymore, not at all. Only that most of them speak yoruba as a second everyday language.
As for the yorubanized egbirras, these are the ebira oloko who migrated yoruba land and are gradually becoming absorbed, many of them still speak their language though.

I am not fusing igala and igbo history. Historical facts and evidence have proved that igalas related with igbos in history more and even till date and this should be probably because egbirras migrated from kwararafa hundreds of years ago and completely cut off igalas from yoruba contact, if not i think igalas were closer to yorubas earlier.