₦airaland Forum

This probably explains the delay for the NAF:

"However, the PAF announced in early 2017 that another 12 Block IIs would be built in 2018 to bridge the gap in production caused by delays to the more sophisticated Block III"

http://www.arabianaerospace.aero/dubai-airshow-pakistan-jf-17-returns-to-dubai.html

Henry240:
4 more units of the Bell 412 might not be a bad idea.

Aye.

tdayof:
VIP seats + EO= ISR in less dangerous areas such as kaduna express roads.


EO PODs + something like this = Multiple casualties to BHT

I suppose it would have taken more time to do so and it is after all a utility heli so transporting VIPs and soldiers are part of the package.

Odunayaw:
Could this have been better off with the Army

Let's hope the army will get theirs with the much delayed Army Aviation assets.

Henry240:
They have added the Survelliance camera.

Most definitely. Hopefully more surveillance work than VIP �

camera installed

Aeroplane dey come o!

The Chief of Air Staff added that the service had constructed residential accommodation and upgraded the apron at 105 Composite Group, Maiduguri, to accommodate the increasing number of war planes.

Sadiq explained that the projects were designed to provide enabling environment and decent accommodation to improve the wellbeing of the servicemen.

“The Federal Government has approved more aircraft for us and we are thinking ahead to see that we have the accommodation for those coming with these helicopters and aircrafts the government has procured for us.

“With more aircrafts you have to expand the parking space; we have reactivated a quite a number and more are coming, what we thought was to quickly expand the apron so that we have enough space for the aircrafts that are coming to be able to park.

“For us in the Air Force; we are always working, training, expanding infrastructure, building capacity for both the pilots, technicians and engineers”.

https://www.today.ng/news/nigeria/26784/nigerian-air-force-raids-degrade-boko-haram-insurgents-cas-sadique-abubakar

NAF

.

HISTORY23000:
I probably know more about any military force on earth than you.
nigeria has no military.
I think the usa police could defeat the nigerian so called military in an all out war.

Why don't u educate me then o great one with worldwide military knowledge?

HISTORY23000:
Don't waste your time on the nigerian "military" it has no futuure except as a proxy force for foreign powers. The nigerian "military" is nothing but a mercenary unit at the service of foreign powers who controle the state of the unit.
This document which you are quoting is irrelevent, go to london and see the real thing there.

p

Bro, this is a military thread and not the politics section.

Henry240:
The Flanker is one of the world's best air superiority fighters. The Indians have repeatedly proven this when pitched against Western air superiority fighters, however i don't believe our defence before the Tucano deal is best served by an Su-30 because i felt with the high number of combat sorties we fly each year our budget will be strained.

The Tucanos deal allows us to go for a twin engine fighter as most of the brunt of the light combat sorties can now be under-taken by the Tucano. My problem now comes with our purchase history. With our purchase history, i don't see the possibility of additional fighter aircrafts seeing that we have gone for 30 combat aircrafts, Tucanos, MI-35m and armed drones.

The Air Force might instead want to go for a medium weight aircraft instead, remember our G-222s are old and only 3 are flying. The C-130s are old too, for medium weight we have had to add an additional role to one of the ATR-42, Light transport.

So except if we actually get the 3 ordered JF-17s as budgeted, our chance of getting any other type of fighter aircraft is bleak.

This is what i think.

The below future NAF plans is culled from the current Air Forces Monthly:

"Published in last year's edition of the NAF's Airman journal, it's strategic goal for the 2009-20 planned for a future 44 squadrons and an aircraft complement including 75 UAVs. Projected numbers were not disclosed, but two squadrons of fighter interceptors; two of multirole fighters; three of CAS/ground attack aircraft; eight of attack helicopters, including two trained for maritime operations; one of light utility and recce helicopters; nine of transport/utility helicopters were envisaged. In addition, 4.5 squadrons would fly light aircraft and three more MPAs, while 15 units would operate the UAVs. The transport force would comprise three heavy-lift squadrons, three medium lift squadrons and 4.5 squadrons of light transports".

Just goes to show how much the previous CASs deviated from the plans.

LTGEN:
OGA RKA
You dey work overtime o aah I go give you one point and kill and some nice palm wine to wash am down o
man dey busy nahim i see say oga Henry wan jump comot Lekki Bridge wey you grab am over this JF17 pele make we hold Heny down make i go get one of my fine Lagos sister help am a little bit.
OGA HENRY kilode now wetin happen wit this jf as you spoil face like this
MYNAMAR wey order before us nefar get them ting the people dey tell them say scheck dey for mail, Naija wey buy the Engine for 2016 nahim these people come dey tell us shey nah block 1 or block 2 wey we want, make una relax self una go get your pepeye naw
The A29 complete separate matter nah them go give us this one because of them President, naija wey raise $1b Eurobond ( oversubscribed) in one week shey nah 600 be them problem.
Shebi PMB talk to them p.m last week eeh make we siddon look them go sort am out nah there im go school im sabi them mekuna chill.
i beg left those oder people alone them no matter wetin concern agbero wit load.

I beg make u help am. This aeroplane wahala nah wah. Person don scatter keyboard dey search for better news sef

Odunayaw:
or naira land spec ops brigade can run a covert op to sabotage the F7s

I will look the other way

LTGEN:
Thank you RKA2

You're welcome

Henry240:
Jake, bye bye JF-17.

Have faith

"Meanwhile, Congress recently approved the controversial sale of 12 Super Tucanos to Nigeria following the US State Department’s green light in August. The estimated $593 million foreign military sale includes the aircraft, weapons, training, spare parts and facilities to support the programme. The Obama administration had put a hold on the sale following the Nigerian air force’s bombing of a refugee camp on the border of Cameroon in January 2017, but President Donald Trump restarted the approval process in the spring. With Congressional notification complete, the USAF is drafting a letter of acceptance to present to the Nigerian air force."

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/afghan-air-force-adds-six-more-super-tucanos-to-fle-442559/

tdayof:
Apart from the pictures released by BHT, they also released a video propaganda in which I personally have seen years ago and is still very much present on Sahara reporters YouTube page.


Bokoharam got jokes.

No be small. People too easily swallow what these terrorists propagate.

As people are very quick to post supposedly bad news, I will just drop this one here.


https://theeagleonline.com.ng/nigerian-army-denies-killing-of-30-soldiers-by-isis/

SSBN:
Calm down, I am not just blabbing about corruption, I am screaming about it. Corruption cost lives. You arm chair analyst making excuses for the myopic incompetent people we have in charge of our nation's security is the reason corruption might never end. If those goons had not siphoned $2 billion to secrete offshore accounts and buy second crap who knows maybe half of those 30,000 Nigerians killed might still be alive.You are yapping about contract Senate bladabladabla. That's not an excuse, its incompetence and out right treason. Russians and Chinese arms manufacturers are pragmatic, they will sell you an aircarft carrier and have it delivered to your doorstep in a month if the price is right and we are desperate enough. Forgive the hyperbole, but you get my drift. Any other country in a decade long war with the resources of Nigeria would have been armed to the teeth by now. Super Mushank or Embrae should not stop us from modernising our forces to meet present and future threats In line with proof of external interference. Corruption and bureacratic bottlenecks have demystify the might of the once feared Nigerian army. Not sure you realisge the Import of this. Weakness encourages aggression. We are weak and stupid, and they know it. We are in for a big surprise if this continues.

Take a chill pill. You are ranting about what everybody knows has already happened. Look to the future. What part of this present crop of service chiefs efforts are you not happy with? Don't start quoting from the past.

bidexiii:
These is not ones opinion or propagative.

These are matter of visible threats. And u don't wait and fold ur arms till it get to u.

This is why I said it is your opinion which you are entitled to. Nobody has ever said we should hold our arms and do nothing. Previous governments did nothing. Give this one time to finish what they started which began with welfare etc and lets see where they end. That's all I'm saying.

bidexiii:
I totally disagree with you on these.

10years ago who can boldly beat is chest that a terrorist group named BH will be menance.

Cameroon and Chad are possible treats .

That is your prerogative.

[quote author=SSBN post=61139417][/quote

Government to Government contracts and negotiations take years (look around the world for major contracts and check time lines from initial negotiations to contract completion). Example - agreement for supply of Typhon jets by Oman back in 2012 are only now being delivered in 2017.

No short cut through rogue contractors. Why don't you write to the NAF heirachy to find out more instead of bleating about corruption etc as if you know more about threats we face than DHQ.

While you are at it, write to the Senate and ask them about competing demands. Do you think Insurgency is going to end with BH? See what is happening in Mali, Niger, Libya and you are here talking about fancy toys (which will come when the time is right). Should we also throw in Submarines right now because we could be invaded by Cameroon, Angola, South Africa. Abeg, make I hear word.

My moniker is not "that guy" and you won't find anyone one on this forum saying we don't need air defence fighters. What we actually need are multirole fighters and nobody on this forum can categorically say what is on order (apart from jf-17) or what is planned. The super tucano is a more urgent requirement as we stand.

I didn't see you guys moaning the last decade when there was a complete failure to invest in the military. No surrounding country can successfully invade this country, period.

Henry240:
I agree with all you said apart from the comments about who we are defending against and a feel good factor.

We need proper 4 Gen multi-role fighters To Help our pilots familiarise with modern equipment and tactics. There are roles were it might not be convenient to deploy the Tucanos this is where an aircraft like the JF-17 comes in.

During Operations AFISMA in Mali, we deployed jets in Niger, and Offcourse we could not fly the Alpha jets at night. A jet like the JF-17 would have been very ideal.

There is significant frustration with the delay in delivering the JF-17, a number of factors might be responsible for this, we can only speculate. However i for one fear the possible worst.

I know where you are coming from and I know we need a 4th gen fighter, which I have stated. My point was to do with the urgent need for an aircraft in the super tucano category and I only mentioned the feel good factor (it would make me feel elated when the jf-17 arrives ) to buttress the point that it is not as urgent a requirement but is needed. Just like the case with OPVs and Submarines if you get my drift.

I would also like to point out that propeller airrafts with suitable avionics etc can also be used to simulate training to fly a modern fighter aircraft - lead-in fighter training.

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/pc_21/

homerac7:
You're disappointed mostly because you got the whole thing twisted.

Can you please show any credible reference anywhere that the Tucanos have been referred to as front line jets?

Ground support is an aspect that we never really had, probably because our doctrine has been strictly conventional all these while. Thus we never had assets to fulfill that role. By the way, the regional threat assessment likely will be seeing more of counter insurgency sort of operations than conventional one, so the Tucanos are very very very required.

Again, where did you see that we acquiring the Tucanos foreclosed acquisition of other combat keys? Isn't it after the much publicised confirmation by the US govt that we all had the snippet from minister of defence himself that Nigeria is considering YAKs and Migs?

Gentleman, please save your emotions. You aren't more patriotic than anyone her, bro. By pls note, the fact that the honorable minister said it doesn't mean they're gonna do it (sooner). I understand that part of frustration.

My whole point is that;

1. Tucanoes are very good strategic acquisition,

2. They weren't acquired to fill front line role

3. Having then doesnt prevent us from acquiring front line aircraft's

4. No any aircraft currently in NAF inventory can play CAS effectively and efficiently like it

5. Please CALM DOWN

I think you have quoted the wrong person

I give up. You explain one angle and then a history lesson follows as if we don't all know what we need for our national defence. I am no politician and support nobody, but at least there is a government in power that appears to be planning long term for the military and not just rushing out to buy the latest toys without a thought for through life maintenance/upgrades or trying to be self sufficient.

What, alas, happened to the Jaguars and MIGs without this forward planning? How have the current crop of Alpha jets been kept air worthy if not for R& apart from the ones recently purchased, which will also benefit?

Who, for crying out loud, has ever suggested that a super tucano be used to intercept Flankers. Whose Flanker are we intercepting? I didn't realise that the country was in grave danger. Na wah o!

SSBN:
Why do we Nigerians sometimes choose to dig our heads in the sand and celebrite mediocrity. By any streatch Nigeria should not have a subsonic propeller driven aircraft as our frontline fighter. We are not Gabon or Suriname. This is Nigeria for crying out loud. The cultural and economic superpower of Africa who have been in a state of war for 15 years straight. Boko Haram is a spent force, no amount of desperate cowardly suicide bombing can change that, unless they can take back the Sambisa. Nigeria needs to modernise and stop putting the cart before the horse. We cannot have the most advanced ISR capable platforms in Africa, the most ambitious and expansive Space program in Africa..and yet fly vintage Mig-21-s and celebrate Embrae Super Tucano, an aircraft that will not survive a lightly defended airspace much less protect Nigeria's airspace. There is something wrong with out military brass in Abuja.Since 2015 we have been waiting for, not a squadron but three JF-17 fighters, the number is enough to make someone cry, but waiting three years and counting?

Oga, can you mention one person who has advocated for the Tucano to be our front line fighter?

A multirole aircraft is still needed along with the tucano. The delay is from Pakistan who take priority. Ours is not through China.

At the end of the day, a COIN aircraft is more important at this stage. Who are you defending against as we speak with a 4g aircraft apart from the feel good factor?

nemesis4u:
wasn't the 500 million dollars which is being used to compensate for the tucano deal, stolen Nigerian money stashed in US ?

I also read that somewhere, although I can't remember where, so can't really confirm. Anybody got any info on this?

overhypedsteve:
Oga don't write point of correction. You are writing your opinion not correcting anybody. Except you are one of the decision makers that know everything about the deal, the deep and the lows or Air Force Spokes Person then you have no justifiable intellectual bearing on this matter to be correcting anybody. Just write your opinion and leave am like that.

Secondly.
the conditions under which these planes are coming are too humbling, too expensive and they are too over rated. The Tucano is the perfect COIN aircraft but outside COIN what benefits does it offer?

Why buy twelve attack planes that we can only operate within Nigeria apart from insurgency are we planning to go to war against ourselves?

12 turboprop attack planes That Won't see the Air in a contested airspace for 600mils. What the Tucano does now future developments in Air technology would see drones and unmanned planes doing them within the nearest future so what's with the 30years thing.

The C130 is no longer the ultimate cargo plane but it fulfils it role well and nobody doubts that. It's now obvious there was no plan to phase it out when it was being procured.

But why buy a plane that have been in use for seventy years now and say you want to operate it for thirty years to come. Dude when you talk you think oh. Do you want your kids future to be protected by super tucanoes? You want your kids to live in a country whose national security is guaranteed by turboprops. When nations of the world are already partnering for future fighter programs you are telling me you want to operate Tucanoes for years. Even the SU-25 and the fair child republics A10 warthog will soon be replaced by better systems and drones.

Just watch. Even those many story about the aircraft been expensive cus of PGMs , training consoles and maintenance will soon change we will soon be faced with some frightening but unavoidable truths about this deal.

Boko Haram that you chased out of Sambisa with Alpha jets now you want to buy PGM' s and tucano to do what? When you needed it we nor see. Now it's time to re-build the military into a standard conventional Armed Forces after all the tweaking to our doctrine that came with us fighting a non conventional force, you say you want to buy 12 turboprops to chase terrorists which terrorists?

You want border patrol platform buy drones. Those saying it would be used for border patrol where are you getting your info from. Did the airforce specify it would use it in that role?

We ve tried to buy the Tucanoes for almost 6 years unsuccessfully what that means is there have been a gap all this time that needs to be filled. At this point in our war against terror even a C130(A) would be a threat to the disorganised and disoriented terrorists but it's now that we are buying an expensive plane meant for "COIN alone "

A plane that you won't even contemplate calling up if there is a convoy of terrorist moving with some serious anti Aircraft Guns. If a ZSU can bring down a russian SU25 then the obvious can be the truth about our expensive "sophisticated " turboprop trainers when they go against anti aircraft guns. With those birds in the sky the terrorist confidence of survival will be improved. They now have the confidence that the bird in the sky can be brought down, it is no longer a mystic iron clad angel of death. It's just a super tucano that we can shoot down if we are lucky.

Oga, I know we don't have to all agree, but the Super Tucano is a good aircraft even though people have raised concerns about the cost of everything. Even in the West, millions are spent on infrastructure/equipment when a new p!at form is introduced.

Ghana, Mali, Angola etc know the value hence they have gone for the Tucano as well, which is a different aircraft and provides a light, cost effective aircraft for COIN and other operations.

The DSCA said that the proposed sale “will support Nigerian military operations against terrorist organizations Boko Haram and ISIS West Africa, and Nigerian efforts to counter illicit trafficking in Nigeria and the Gulf of Guinea. The Super Tucano is a sustainable platform for counterterrorism, counter-insurgency, border surveillance and illicit trade interdiction operations. Nigeria is an important partner in the U.S. national security goal to defeat ISIS, including its branches in Africa, and this sale is part of the U.S. commitment to help Nigeria and the Lake Chad Basin countries in that fight.”



https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/defense/2017-08-09/sale-embraer-super-tucanos-nigeria-likely

Even the Americans are looking at a cheaper way to carry out this sort of warfare and the Tucano is on their list for a light attack aircraft.

https://theaviationist.com/2017/08/16/its-not-a-fly-off-competition-u-s-air-force-tests-process-and-planes-at-light-attack-demo/

This does not in anyway detract from the need for a multi-role aircraft like the JF-17, MIG 29/35 etc

jakeporeshenko:
I want to know the story, plus is that a NaF roundel

Not a NAF roundel as it is green, white & blue. Sierra Leone Air Force Alouette III.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2&v=Lnk9qjB6g9U


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lnk9qjB6g9U