₦airaland Forum

annyplenty:
EARTHQUAKE IN NEPAL, RIOTS AND VIOLENCE IN BALTIMORE, USA, XENOPHOBIC ATTACKS IN SOUTH AFRICA, the great tribulation has begun! RAPTURE IS IMMINENT!. Don't live in denial and unbelief. Search the scriptures and match with what is happening. Ask the Lord, if you are still in doubt.

Wash your garment in the blood of Jesus Christ and be made ready for His return.

JESUScoming

Rather these are the signs of the last days see Matthew 24. The Great tribulation will have the anti - christ and false prophet being very prominent. These are not here yet! see 2 Thessalonians 2.

Papist:
Rapture is a false belief invented by John Darby in 1830 AD. It is uknown to Christians before John Darby. Therefore it is a "new gospel" which is definitely not by Divine revelation.

But what would be said about 1 Thessalonians 4:17? darby too?

Heaven: the abode of all saints from the creation right up to the thief on the cross referred to the Third heaven - Paradise 2Corinthians 12: 2,4.
Heavenly places: The present manipulatory headquarters of the devil and his cohorts Ephesians 6:12 and Revelations 12:7.
Heaven: The place quoted by the OP is the One Jesus referred to as the Throne of GOD in Matthew 5:34. Without redemption by the blood of the Lamb, no one gets here.Hebrews 9:24-28
We must be able to differentiate one from the other.

btoks:
Re. 2 tim 3:16,this does not prove the NT is inspired. The NT was not in existence at the time.he was referring to the OT

What matters is that the books were inspired..

how can you tell from 2peter1.21 what books he was referring to?

Do read the entire epistle. Chapter 1 shows that the statement not only applied to the Old testament but to the Gospels, Chapter 3:15,16 further shows the extension to the epistles. 2 Peter 1:21 shows a criteria that the apostles did not come short of. Indeed, after them, God has raised up countless apostles and church leaders but since they were the first set, the inspired message giving to them remains the same for the Church for all time. Hence Jude 3 speaks of the faith once delivered to the saints. God is not the author of confusion. Inspite of the anointing on Joshua and the 70 elders, none of them attempted producing their own set of laws!

Going by your logic of deutero-canonicals not been quoted from (although not entirely true), how about songs of Solomon, Esther, Ecclesiastes.These were not quoted from either.

None of the books you just listed was written in the period when Divine revelations were halted.

Jesus did not list the OT books in Luke 24.[/quote
] Yes but the categories used would not leave His hearers in doubt! [quote]Deutero-canonical means 2nd canon as opposed to the apocryphal books.
Your conclusions are based on protestant tradition and does not prove that the deutero-canonicals are not inspired.

Rather the hebrews, who were the first reference and who have these occurrences as part of their history, were among the first that raised the issue of those books not being inspired.

MuttleyLaff:
cc Sibe007, Scholar8200, Sleekydee

You could be wasting your time about this with anyone lacking knowledge or information on this particular subject or anyone set in their ways.

Truth of the matter is, just blame the translators that deliberately left the ";", as it is in Greek without converting it to its counterpart version English punctuation

";" is question-mark in Greek, but instead of translating ";" to "?", which is question-mark as we know it in English, the translators feigned ignorance

Semi-colon means question-mark in Greek, but as we all know, semi-colon means something else, if or when used in English

You wonder why verses like Matthew 2:2 was translated properly along with the punctuation converted correctly but not 1 Corinthians 14:34-35

EXAMPLE:
( гдѣ єсть рождeйсѧ царь їудeйскій; - Matthew 2:2) ORIGINAL GREEK TEXT
(Where is the one who is born king of the Jews? - Matthew 2:2) ENGLISH TRANSLATION

Blame this on a hidden agenda to practice sexism and promote the oppression of women.

But is this also applicable to the reference from Timothy? I dont think so. And if they were promoting sexism then I guess prophetesses such at Deborah should have been excused. Do we also say then that the reference to man as the head was part of this conspiracy? Of course not. Yes, Deborah was a prophetess but neither she nor any woman ever tried to do the work of the Levites or priest.

Sibe007:
A woman according to the bible should not stand behind the altar preaching Really?? Where in your bible??
It says women should be silent, if you take it that way, they wouldnt even need to sing or even say anything in church.

The point of the post is to show something that was lost in translation from the Hebrew to English. Paul was responding to their letters they wrote to him.

so he quoted them, just as i quoted you and responded.

In the Assembly of the saints together,1 Timothy 2:11-12," Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection...I suffer not a woman to teach nor to usurp authority over the man , but to be in silence"

However note that they have their place among themselves in assembly of saints Titus 2:3,4," The aged women... That they may teach the young women ". Just as Moses led all Israel to sing Exodus 15:1, while Mariam led the women Exodus 15:20 You can examine the foregoing in the light of women in the early church. But when it comes to preaching outside the Church, evangelism... all are involved Acts 8:4 Hence a woman can be called as an Evangelist etc

Vs 29 and 34 both start with the word- let hence I doubt your claim that Paul was quoting the corinthians especially considering the fact of the reference quoted above.

I stand to be corrected.(from scriptures too)

btoks:
This is quite a claim here.How do you know the deutero-canonicals are not inspired?In a similar vein,how do you know any of the NT books is inspired?

First regarding your last question, 2 Timothy 3:16," All scripture is given by Inspiration of God" Also, 2 Peter 1:21," for the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man; but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Ghost"

The apocrypha was written at a time when there was a halt in Divine revelation for 4 centuries implying no prophets, visions etc (inter - testament period). The books thus written were more of the product of literary activity. You will notice that neither Christ nor any of His apostles referred to them.
After resurrection, Christ spoke about the things written concerning Him in , "the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms" luke 24:44. Conspicuously skipping the apocrypha!

shahydbinaliyu:
bro.. it's so glaring that Jesus is not biological son of God nor anybody is..

I believe the challenge lies in the academical/intellectual mind with which you are trying to understand this. But I will rather believe what God says of Himself.

The earth is such that we may research, apply biological/scientific principles/procedures over decades to make discoveries but the Creator cannot be discovered or understood with the same procedures!

Just like when Jesus told Nicodemus (a ruler of the Jews in John 3:1-12) ,"ye must be born again" nicodemus asked a similar question based on his understanding of the natural process of life," how can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?" but thankfully, Nicodemus sought the answer from the right Source (John 1:18) and he got the revelation Therefrom thus he believed & became a disciple! John 7:45 - 52;John 19:39,40 . If he had left reasoning and mocking, it will have been a different case but the real joke will be on him because it will be strange judging all things with something so limited as a dimly lit intellect.

We cant expect heavenly things (John 3:12) to follow the same order of discovery and understanding as earthly things!

shahydbinaliyu:
let me quote it for you in original Bible... .. 2nd Samuel.. 7:14

Alright then do link it with the Psalm 2:7. Note that in 2 Samuel God was speaking to David while Psalm 2:7 David was prophesying.

shahydbinaliyu:
quote the verse and prove it's not David... the verse is 2nd Solomon 7:14

But there is no book in the Bible by that name? David prophesied also of Jesus Christ and that's why after his resurrection, He spoke of ,"all things which were written in the law of Moses, an in the prophets and in the psalms, concerning Me"Luke 24:44. Perhaps you meant 2 Samuel 7:14? Then carefully read it in its context and note that there is no correlation between 2 Samuel 7:14 and Psalm 2:7(read this also in context).

shahydbinaliyu:
see my brother, if Jesus is the real son of God like you said, what about the other son of God In Bible and the other beggoten son of God (David)

David never said he was! Psalm 2 was referring to Jesus. Compare Psalm 2:9 to Revelations 12:5. also see Psalm 110:1 "The Lord said to my Lord,Sit Thou at My Right Hand" fulfilled in Mark 16:19, alluded to by Jesus Himself in Revelations 3:21.

Bakrabas:
I don't know what evidence we need to tell our Christian brothers.Jesus (pbuh) says "...only those who follow my paths shall see the kingdom of God". As some said Christianity was invented after the death of Jesus (pbuh) that is to say Christianity is not the path of Jesus.

Please what chapter and verse did you quote this from?

Why does the Catholic Bible has seven (7) more
books than the Protestant Bible?

they include the deutero-canonical writings- not inspired.

Why do these two Bibles have different versions of
the same books?

Bro, some versions are written in plain language to help those to whom english is not a mother tongue, others are perVersions developed by the devil( he was the first to twist the Word in Gen 3:4). Only the truth calls for his deceptive efforts.

Why are there so many mistakes and errors are
from the very first verse right up to the very last
verse?

Such as?

Why do 'Born Again Christians' teach concepts
that are not from the Bible?
There is no word "Trinity" in the Bible in any
version of any language

But the concept is clearly stated in Scripture. Just like the Lord's supper and the Eucharist refer to the same practice!. Any other extra-biblical concept apart from this?

The oldest forms of Christianity do not support the
'born again' beliefs

can you be more specific about the beliefs?

Jesus of the English Bible complains about the
'crucifixion'
(" Eli! Eli! Lama sabachthani? - My God! My God!
Why have You forsaken me? " ) [Mk 15:34]

That was the agony He bore on the Cross for you and me!

How can Jesus be the " Only Begotten Son" of
John 3:16? When in Psalms 2:7 David is God's
" Begotten Son? "

That psalm was not David's self eulogy! That was a prophesy Concerning Jesus (compare Psalm 2:9 to Revelations 12:5)

Would a 'Just' God, a 'Fair' God, a 'Loving' God --
punish Jesus for the sins of the people that he
called to follow him?

Now man with all his limitations and depravity will define justice to God!

What happens to people who died before Jesus
came?

Those who died in the faith of God's promise- Paradise, others who chose wickedness - Hell. eg Job lived b4 the law yet his piety and faith in God and, like Abel did, their understanding that only the blood makes atonement for the soul, shows that God revealed Himself to the people of those periods but not all served Him Romans 1:20,21.

What happens to those who never hear this
message?

but you might have heard! What did you do with the Message?

What about innocent children who die although
their parents are not Christian?

The Judge of ALL the earth knows what to do. It's apposite we should consider ourselves.

[quote]And what about God?
How can God create Himself?
How can God be a man?
How can a man be a God?
How can God have a son?
The Bible says "Seth (is) the son of Adam"
and that "Adam is the son of God." [Lk 3:36]

Yes. See, that believers in Jesus are called sons of God Through Christ today, is not a new idea of God's! It was His purpose right from creation and restored through redemption.

Can't God just forgive us and not have to
kill Jesus?

The devil was cast out of heaven because of sin (Ezekiel 28:15) man lost Eden because of sin. Once we choose sin, we choose it's consequence (proximate- suffering and ultimate- death and separation from God) Jesus came to bear these so that when we believe Him and turn from sin, we are justified.

Jesus did not even carry the cross -- Simon
Cyre'ne, a passerby did! [Mk 15:21]

Yes He bore it for sometime after which Simon did else He might have died b4 actual crucifixion: much blood was already lost through scourging!

Jesus of the Bible was NOT on the cross for
longer than six (6) hours -- NOT three days
-- (from the 3rd to the 9th hour) [Mk 15:25
& 15:33]

Who said HE spent 3 days in the Cross?!

Jesus of the Bible did not spend three days
and nights in the tomb -- Friday night -
until Sunday before dawn -- is not 3 days
and nights!

The reference to jonah was to point to a condition of being under God's judgement for that period; this did not start after He died, it started before He died (see Isaiah 53). Death was the ultimate consequence. Rather count 3 days and 3 night from thursday night.

Jesus DID NOT claim to be God - or even
equal to God!

He didnt need to claim, He was, is and ever shall be! Revelations 1:17,8,"... I am the First and the Last,... He that liveth and was dead; and, behold,I Am alive forevermore I Am Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the Ending. John 10:30,36 I and My Father are One...because I said I am the Son Of God.

shahydbinaliyu:
didn't moses said whoever follows him is on right path? didn't moses prophesied Jesus? didn't moses followers follow Jesus also? Jesus prophesied Muhammad.. so if you believe in Jesus, you must follow Muhammad..

you could see Allaha is what Jesus called God in Aramaic Bible

Let's keep it simple; let's keep to the verse you quoted in your lead post as our case study shall we? The bolded has been dealt with in other threads.

shahydbinaliyu:
1. These [things] Eashoa spoke, and he raised his eyes to
heaven and said, “My Father, the hour has arrived, glorify
your Son, as your Son glorifies you.

it's still the same thing bro.. son and father of Jesus used in Bible is idiomatic..

Can you articulately substantiate this in the light of John 1:18 and other parallel verses?

.. if Jesus is biological son of God, he will never answer to any other title than son of God..

The real concern arises when we, with our limited intellectual ability (such that we need generations of research to discover extant laws and phenomena) ,try to box God into our inferences else edit His Word!

besides, how can God give birth to a son? for your information bro, jews also called ezra son of God... Allah clarified it in quran.. HE said HE never begotten anyone nor anyone begotten HIM... it's in that verse i knew that jews also called ezra son of God..

Quran is the last and summary of every holy book...

But the original Bible you are quoting in John 1:18 refutes this! Ezra was so called by the jews, he never personally made this declaration like Jesus did in the verse John 17:1 and many others.

shahydbinaliyu:
if i didn't believe in Jesus, how will i believe in Prophet Muhammad? i believe and follow Jesus teachings... Jesus preached 1 God and following of Old Testament.. i follow it and believe in it ... besides, Quran tell us more about Jesus.. and he's very respected prophet..

I mean trusting Him to have Eternal life like the passage you quoted declared!

There is a difference between mental assent and trust. The former makes us acknowledge a historical or extant person or object while the latter makes us depend on the Reference (with a current dependence) with an assurance of safety while we do and danger if we dont just like the verse you quoted says.

shahydbinaliyu:
Father is different from God... it's not only Jesus that call God father In Bible... i have Aramaic Bible here with me..

John 1:1:18
. 18. No human [being] ever
saw Allaha, except for the only born Allaha, He who existed
in the bosom of his Father, [Who] proclaimed* Him.

where did you see ABBA O..
And father in context is an idiom. that father is same with Creator

That place reads God in English. Since you have an Aramaic Bible, Try quoting John 17:1, or any passage where Father is used. The bolded is ably contradicted by the verse you quoted!!! Else substantiate it. The coloured characters are also contradictory but I think the red character in the text should clarify this.

shahydbinaliyu:
Stephen Sarpong

The Aramaic Bible original with no changes

Aramaic Bible

John 3:16

For Allaha loved the world in this
way: so much that he would give up a Son, The One, so that
everyone who trusts in him shall not be lost, but he shall have
eternal life.

P.S. (where do you see is only begotten son in
this)

Then why not Trust in Him as The Son of God (and not just a prophet) and receive the Eternal life that transforms our lives on earth and, if we remain in that state, translates us to Heaven after death? No other system of belief claims to impart this Eternal life that was lost by Adam but restored by Christ Jesus. The verse you quoted clearly shows that any who doesnt so trust Him will be lost!!!

Jesus also called God Father(ABBA also Aramaic) and gave all that received Him the power (right/privilege) to become the sons of God whereby we cry, Abba, Father. Adam lost the Life when he and Eve fell. The result is shown Genesis 6- gross evil & wickedness. Jesus came as the Life (John 14:6), those who truly receive Him and come to God in repentance trusting in His sacrifice on the cross, receive the Life that Adam lost, enabling them to walk in righteousness and Holiness. As far a I know, no other prophet called God Father in the sense and with the depth of relationship that Jesus did. Pls refer to John 1:1,18 in Aramaic. God bless!

We pray this will remain what it is - a scare, not reality. However, having an option B is apposite. If you are interested in learning skills such as Forex trading, Digital Marketing, Web designing, do send me a mail on joab25@yahoo.com These are skills you can work with during break while in office and if the worst happens, you'll have a safe landing.

shahydbinaliyu:
despite Jesus telling us In Bible that he's a Prophet.. yet you don't believe in him... if Jesus isn't a Prophet, what is he according to Jesus himself.. quote with Bible

He is the Christ, The Son of God John 11:4,"... that the Son of God might be glorified thereby" Luke 24:44,46,"...that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning Me....thus it is written, and thus it behooved Christ to suffer and to rise from the dead..."
John 17 records a remarkable prayer of Jesus' before His death and resurrection. Do patiently read through:
17 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee:

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.

7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.

8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

13 And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.

14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.


Now, no prophet would or has prayed with similar words. None would say these in prayer to God if they were not true! Moses called Him a Prophet in the sense that the Spirit will be upon Him just like He was on Moses (see Numbers 11:25), though Jesus' was superior- without measure (see John 3:34), and that by the inspiration of the Spirit He will speak the very Mind of God.

shahydbinaliyu:
so your point is that Jesus is not a prophet of God abi

Yes. He was more than a prophet (Jeremiah, Isaiah, Jonah,Ezekiel etc)

Although Moses in Deuteronomy 18:18 prophesied of Him as a Prophet ( Who God will raise up from among the Israelites), Isaiah prophesied of Him Isaiah 9:6,7 Wonderful, Counsellor, The Mighty God and also as the Branch Isaiah 11:1,2 etc He was more than just another prophet. See this discourse in Matthew 16:13-17," Whom do men say that I the Son of Man am? and they said that . . . Jeremiah or one of the prophets...but Whom say you that I Am?, Peter...said, Thou Art the Christ the Son of The Living GOD... and Jesus answered, Blessed art thou . .. for flesh and blood has not revealed it unto Thee, but My Father Which is in Heaven." meaning this was not Peter' opinion but a revelation from the Father to Peter.

shahydbinaliyu:
Matthew 13:57 And they were offended in him. But Jesus said unto them, A prophet is not without honour, save in his own country, and in his own house.

This was just like quoting a common saying/proverb applicable to Him at that time. Of course we wont say He was also a Physician because He said Luke4:23,"you will surely say unto Me, Physician heal your self" Both are proverbs.

Luke 24:19 And he said unto them, What things? And they said unto him, Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, which was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people:

opinion of the two men discussing after His Resurrection.

Matthew 21:11 And the multitude said, This is Jesus the prophet of Nazareth of Galilee.

note that the multitude said this- their opinion,

Revelation 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

This verse does not say He is a prophet! Rev 19:11,13"and I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse and He that sat upon him was called Faithful and True . . .and His Name is called the Word of God" Revelation 1:5,8,"and from Jesus Christ,...the Prince of the Kings of the earth. Unto Him that loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood" John 13: 13 " If I then your Master and Lord..."

No prophet shares any of those. Note that the initial post on John the baptist was used because He was the greatest of the prophets and Moses was the lawgiver.

shahydbinaliyu:
i don't dispute that... Jesus is prophet of Allah.

Am The WAY, The TRUTH and The LIFE, no man comes to the Father but by ME" John 14:6 Of course this happened by the leading of The Spirit of Truth Whom Jesus said will come after His Ascension and urged the disciples to wait for in Jerusalem John 15:26, Luke 24:49, Acts 1:8

just like Jesus is the way, truth and the life is every other prophet too.. that verse acclaim every Prophet.

or do you want to say moses isn't the way, truth and the life?

Jesus himself said he's a Prophet of Allah


bro.. read Aramaic Bible... know the original scripture in which bible In English was intentionally misinterpreted...

there by yourself knowing the truth

Do you have scriptural quotes to back these affirmations? Neither Moses or any other prophet ever said so!

Even John the baptist declared John 1:30," This is He of Whom I said, After me comes a Man which is preferred before me ; for He was before me." John 3:30,31,36"He must increase but I must decrease. He that comes from above is above ALL . . . he that believes on the Son has everlasting life: and he that believes not the Son shall not see life"

In fact, Moses and the prophets prophesied of Him.

After years of countless research on earth and in outer space, scientists keep making discoveries and intra-/inter-, interplays between elements in both spheres ;discoveries of which are perfectly reasonable and makes sense. It beats me how all that will be by accident or strange self-arrangement (when some of what is studied are inanimate)! Furthermore, the fact that we need years of research to discover these things underscores how intellectually limited man is.

shahydbinaliyu:
do your research on it and find the truth.. may Allah help you see the truth

I have found The Truth already! Jesus said,"I Am The WAY, The TRUTH and The LIFE, no man comes to the Father but by ME" John 14:6 Of course this happened by the leading of The Spirit of Truth Whom Jesus said will come after His Ascension and urged the disciples to wait for in Jerusalem John 15:26, Luke 24:49, Acts 1:8

Deuteronomy 29:29," The secret things belong unto the Lord our GOD: but those things which are revealed belong to us. . . " There are mysteries revealed to us and there are some not revealed. The safest position to take is GOD's Omniscience as Scripture reveals it within each passage's context! Delusion starts when we apply one context's declaration to another context (sans the Leading of the Spirit), or when, in trying to gratify our limited, under-utilised intellect, we draw some inferences inconsistent with that which is revealed in scripture.

shahydbinaliyu:
oohk... have you ever read Aramaic Bible?

No.

shahydbinaliyu:
atlast.. i. met a sane reasonable Christian... drop your number let me add you to whatsapp religious group

I'd have loved to but I'm not on Whatsapp: nokia c1 does not work with the app.

shahydbinaliyu:
you want to tell me Christians don't hate muslims and Islam? you can say you don't hate.. many i have had dialogue with never understand Islam and Muslim and even they intentionally lie against Quran and even Prophet Muhammad

Note that I said - real Christian.

See first century Christians loved even their persecutors (the Jews and others) eg Paul who was stoned, scourged, misrepresented by the Jews etc still expressed his burden of heart to see these same people saved and even expressed the desire to be sent to hell for their sake Romans 9:1,2; Romans 10:1,2 (Consider that this was coming from one who was once the 'Shekau' of his time till he met Christ and was transformed!) !!!

Stephen while being stoned to death called upon the Lord to forgive his executors Acts 7:58 - 60 etc

Brother these, and many more which cant be here mentioned, are real Christians!

Sorry for the digression above. Like I said before, the best a Christian can do is to declare the truth from a biblical, holistic perspective. Insults and vitriolic vituperations against people or their religion are alien to the true Christian faith I know.

You need to realize that no real Christian hates simply because he has been transformed by Grace! Not all who comments with expletives against your religion or it's founder is a Christian. Personally I'm yet to see any command in the New testament encouraging such. The best is to declare the truth as I know it or write a balanced , factual apologetics where I believe you or any other are raising issues which I believe contradicts the view given by the Bible from a holistic perspective.

What would you expect to happen? These people were the ones that were influenced by Pharisees who hated and envied Jesus. They manifested this to Him calling Him an agent of Beelzebub, One born of fornication etc. It's all over the Gospels and Acts. These same people are the ones that bribed the soldiers and established a lie which the Jews still hold today! This is still done by those who hate Him today! Besides, these were the same people that claimed that , as for this Fellow (referring to Jesus) we know not from whence He is John 9:29 and then turn around to write His life's story! The Jesus I know is the One that astonished doctors of the law with His understanding at age 12.

Indeed op! Though a prostitute, her faith delivered her and her household but it also delivered her from a defiled lifestyle: she stopped being a prostitute and got married to Salmon. Faith is not passive assumption but active cooperation based on an understanding.