₦airaland Forum

4;93
But whoever kills a believer intentionally - his recompense is Hell, wherein he will abide eternally, and Allah has become angry with him and has cursed him and has prepared for him a great punishment.

intentionally killing a believer [obviously the believer was wrongly cut down]. The condition for remaining in hell is that Allah becomes Angry and cursed the killer who intentionally killed a believer. One will expect that whoever God is Angry with, curses from Him and great punishment can be expected. Now Allah does not say He will show anything on this killer but remaining Angry at him.

11;106-108
Those who are wretched shall be in the Fire: There will be for them therein (nothing but) the heaving of sighs and sobs: They will dwell therein for all the time that the heavens and the earth endure, except as thy Lord willeth: for thy Lord is the (sure) accomplisher of what He planneth. And those who are blessed shall be in the Garden: They will dwell therein so long for all the time that the heavens and the earth endure, except as thy Lord willeth: a gift without break.

the dweller of fire here is unlike the one above because of different crimes they committed. While the one above intentionally killed a believer, the group below here is just wretched but not killer of believer intentionally.
The time he will spend in hell is described to the amount of time earth and heavens endure. No one can get to heavens to measure it so we will analyze the time the earth is here today.

The reality is that we do not know for sure how old the earth is because there may be at least a single variable that is so deep in the core of the earth or in the earth atmosphere or some other place under the heavens that man will never discover to be able to say this is how old the earth is, today.

But who knows how long man will remain more from today on the earth? More factors: For sure man will die off completely before the earth will be ended. What will be the amount of time before God destroys the earth after man has died off without a trace of once dominating the earth? Further, who knows the yardstick of how Allah will measure a day which could be as long as 50,000 earth years. What if Allah multiples each day of the earth existence which we dont know now and what it will be when it will be destroyed by 50,000 years?

Can anyone really wants to spend a day in hell? Is it not a known observation that a person experience great difficulty often say it is eternity to him during the difficulty which he does not know the time it will end in the future? A man dipped in hell for a moment and brought forgot that he had ever seen any good in his existence. So considering human experience on earth, eternity is when you see an ending.

God says He can make exception for the group here, showing His Quality of His Unlimited Ability to show Mercy. This people if you notice God did not curse them and has not became Angry with them. The difference of one permanent eternity as in above and the one here is according to Will of Allah, never forgiving the first group and may forgive the later group at some point, earliest time in this is the length of time the earth and heavens endure.

@Op:

by The OP(m): 9:02pm On Aug 16

chipmunkey: Is it valid that prophet Muhamed (mhsrip) learnt most of his teachings from certain jews during his early days of travels, hence the similarities with biblical teachings.


Islam claims to be an abrahamic religion so what do you expect; that his teaching would be similar with the teaching of sango?.

Abraham had one religion: it was not judaism. it was not christianity. both religions were after Abraham had died. The religion of Abraham was the same of Adam, etc, Moses, Jesus and finally Muhammad [sa].



@Chipmunkey:

chipmunkey: Is it valid that prophet Muhamed (mhsrip) learnt most of his teachings from certain jews during his early days of travels, hence the similarities with biblical teachings.

An illiterate from early days of travel could never produce the like of Quran, except its all from God. No professor or early travelers with all the jews floating around now can produce the like of the Quran. No jew, no christian and definitely no one or group can produce something that will have spiritual impact like the Quran.



@Chipmunkey:

by chipmunkey(m): 9:25pm On Aug 16
Scolars make this claim and i am convinced that he tailored his teachings to the Arabs according to what he learnt from the jews during his travels.

(Quote) (Report) (Like)
Re: What Does The Islam Religion Say About Satan? by Abd'Hafeez(m): 9:29pm On Aug 16

chipmunkey: Scolars make this claim and i am convinced that he tailored his teachings to the Arabs according to what he learnt from the jews during his travels.

Are you implying that muhammed wrote the Quran?

If you wager with your assurance in bold, you will be losing plenty of money, considering that no one accused Muhammad [sa] from the jews about what you are saying from your own desire and no base for it.



@sweetcheeks:

by sweetcheecks(f): 9:45pm On Aug 16

Abd'Hafeez:

but Muhammed didn't learn his teachings from the jew as he was unlettered.Muhammed's teachings are contained in a book called the hadith. The Quran was NOT written by muhammed but was delivered to him from God through the Angel Gabriel.

This is interesting what were the do's and dont'nts that render you a follower of this "creature made of fire"We all know the Christian side to this already mentioned above.

worshiping gods for sure renders you as follower of satan.

By the way, ( you can just add next to this to make it simple please)
1. Who is it written by if he did not write it?

Ali bin Abi Talib, Zaid bin Harith and others [ra]. he dictated it and they wrote and everyone memorized it. Just like the way illiterate grandma writes grandson in London.

2. What constitute truth from a lie? ( Maybe the scriptors added their own info because he could not read it)

each of the men was dedicated to islam the reason t was easy for them to migrate. there is no way any would betray him own faith. no of them was a betrayer like judas, a denier like peter and none of them was writing by himself like paul and satan did not invade any of them like the disciple jesus said 'get behind me, satan', to. finally, Angel Gabriel and Muhammad [sa] recited to each other during the fasting month. No way to write what God did not revealed.

3. Are there any witnesses to this Gabriel? You know the bible mentions that when Jesus came to His disciples there was anumber of them present but also shew Himself to Maryet al.?

everyone say Angel Gabriel during his coming to teach the muslim in the hadith titled "He came to teach you your religion". They saw him in madina in the war of khaiba or the other jewish tribe.

4. Did he really verify that this is Gabriel? As in they bible they say Thomas put his finger in His wounds becoz he was doubtful but was then satisfied?

during the first revelation, Gabriel before he disappeared into heavens, he covered the horizon and said "i am Gabriel" and you are "The prophet of God". you seem to be comparing real apple to fake orange [tangerine]. did any angel showed himself in the Bible? Gabriel showed himself n full angelic physical appearance to Muhammad [sa].

5. How is he sure? Was he awake? Asleep? Who helped him verify this?[quote]even as a little boy, people witnessed Angels coming to him. As a prophet, he was awake and his companions believed him. he did not have doubters around him.


[quote]6. Was there any other sighns to confirms this?

revelation was for 23 years, so what do you think. go do research, woman.


@sweekcheeks;

by sweetcheecks(f): 9:53pm On Aug 16

Abd'Hafeez:

but Muhammed didn't learn his teachings from the jew as he was unlettered.Muhammed's teachings are contained in a book called the hadith. The Quran was NOT written by muhammed but was delivered to him from God through the Angel Gabriel.


the shiaton sorry if spelt wrong, how does he mislead? Coz many people now know who he is especially Christians and Muslims through their respective scriptures.
Is it possible that he posses himself as others? Humans, Spirits or Angels?

shaytan suggests and you accept his suggestion.

@Frosbel:

by frosbel(m): 2:40pm

CrazyMan: I wonder if John 10:10 exists in their quarn.

Cos the islam we're experiencing these days, I doubt of they have any page about the devil in their quarn.

Reason with me here...if they (muslims) say the devil comes to kill and destory. I don't need to begin to count the number of churches they have destoryed.

If they say the devil comes to kill, then they would be cowards because believe it or not islam is the most violent religion on this planet.

So if at all the muslims have a devil in their quarn, then its obvious that they're clearly serving him and doing his will.



You have said it ALL .

So what do you say about the destruction by the christians; in all the wars, world wars, even crusade on Iraq? The devil does not have control on man but suggest to man what is evil.

@Abd'Hafeez:

by Abd'Hafeez(m): 6:04pm
Satan is known as shaitan in arabic.He was an angel of Allah before the creation of Adam,but due to his arrogance before God,he was expelled and downgraded from being an angel to the status of a devil.

He was not an angel but a jinn. Angel are obedient and do not have freewill. Jinn have ability to obey or disobey like man, because both have free will. Angels were created from light while jinn were created from smokeless fire and man from earth/sand.

His mission on earth(God granted him that) is to mislead the children of Adam,incite them to do evil because his confirmed abode in the hereafter is hell and therefore he wants people who can join him there.
This is just a summary.

Allah granted him time that he asked; till the last man dies off. Because of his envy of Adam, then Adam and Eve, he openly declares enmity against the children of Adam, waylaying man from the front, back and the right and left sides. Leading man astray by suggestion and when man err he says I fear God and I am free of you because you do it of your own free will.

if you notice he does not have the ability to waylay man on the top because he can stop the prayer of man from rising to heaven and can not stop the Mercy of God from descending on the one who seek forgiveness, mercy, etc.

@Frosbel: You need to be put down ones and for all. How is Allah same with man God Jesus who is a massiah Isa bin Maryam [as]?

How is Allah same with ghost God nameless who is Jibril [malaika] [as]?

How is Allah same with father God who gets tired and needs to be refreshed, not full of knowledge as he discovered after events he regretted?

Frosbel, Allah Rabbi Alamin, Rahman, Rahim, AlHayy, AlQayum, Al Alim, Al Hakim, etc.

Please stop showing us that you have One God because from your mouth, you dont. You do have 3 Gods, though.

Koran 5:116, represents Christians as worshipping Mary which is a historical error. Given the fact that the pagan Arabs did worship Mary’s idol in the Kaba, and that history records no group of Christians had ever worshiped Mary at this time,

What did the pagan arabs did to constitute their worship of Mary? Please describe them/it. Thanks.

My question is would you please name the sect of Christians who worshiped Mary at the time of Muhammad?

Even today, the catholic worship Mary, in similar fashion the Jesus worshipers of today do. I do hope that when you kneel down in from of something and or simply beg it, petition it, it is a worship; the way the idolater do to their idols. If you say you dont worship what you beg or petition, then you are a denying worshiper or ignorant that you worship what everyone else see you worship.

Muslim's reject the doctrine of inherited sin of Adam but teach the Immaculate Conception of Mary. The reason the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception was invented was to remove inherited sin.

the two are not connected and it is only in your idea that you can connect both. While it is true that Mary did not have sex to have a baby, I will not be punished for the mistake of Adam [as] who must have been forgiven by now, or is your God not forgiven oft returning in mercy? Allah is my God.

My question is: since you reject the doctrine of inherited sin and believe all men are born without sin, why do Muslim's teach the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception of Mary?

Its not a doctrine, its an event and we do not hang on it more than an event that brought about Jesus [as] to life from the womb of a believing woman young virgin Mary.

In Koran 7:125, death by crucifixion is stated to exist at the time of Moses in 1500BC. Yet Encyclopedia Britannica, in harmony with all records of history, reports that crucifixion did not exist any earlier than 500 BC.

Maybe you need to research egyptolgy to know that it does exist during the period Moses was struggling with the tyrannical Pharaoh. Its a fact from the records of ancient Egypt.

evidence of crucifixion in OT and even before the israelites settled down

Deuteronomy 21:22-23

New Living Translation (NLT)
Various Regulations

22 “If someone has committed a crime worthy of death and is executed and hung on a tree,[a] 23 the body must not remain hanging from the tree overnight. You must bury the body that same day, for anyone who is hung[b] is cursed in the sight of God. In this way, you will prevent the defilement of the land the Lord your God is giving you as your special possession.

Crucifixion Or 'Crucifiction' In Ancient Egypt?
www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Contrad/External/crucify.html

. . . . CRUCIFIXION IN ANCIENT ASSYRIA

Perhaps one of the best examples of the variation of crucifixion in the form of impaling the enemies comes from the times of the Assyrian ruler Shalmaneser III (859 BCE - 824 BCE). Figures 1 and 2 show people being impaled or suspended by a stake through their private parts and chests, respectively. . . .

. . . HIEROGLYPH FOR CRUCIFYING OR IMPALING A PERSON UPON A STAKE

The first thing to establish is whether there exists any hieroglyph that mentions impaling people on stakes. The best place to start is Die Sprache Der Pharaonen Großes Handwörterbuch Ägyptisch, a concise Egyptian-German dictionary. The hieroglyph depicting impalement on a stake is shown below.[63]. . .

. . .EVIDENCE OF IMPALEMENT IN ANCIENT EGYPT

In order to analyze and interpret the evidence of crucifixion by impaling people on a stake in Egypt, we present a simplified chronology of ancient Egyptian history containing royal names associated with the period for easy reference. Unless otherwise stated, specific dates for particular Dynasties and Kings that we quote within this paper are taken from Nicolas Grimal's book, A History of Ancient Egypt.[66] Please note that the exact Egyptian chronologies are slightly uncertain, and all dates are approximate. The reader will find slightly different schemes used in different books. . .

My question is: to how do you explain this blaring historical error, and do you just disregard the history of the world merely because the Karen says otherwise?

When you go and conduct the research you will know that Quran is correct.

Muslim scholar, Tabbarah, said in his book, The Spirit of Islam, "Moslems do not worship the Black Stone, but only show special reverence and veneration for its dignity and they kiss it only after the example of the Prophet and to keep their Covenant with God to obey His Will and avoid His disobedience." (Tabbarah, The Spirit of Islam, p. 173, Muslim).

Focusing on Tabbarah’s key phrase of showing reverence and veneration to the Black Stone,

My question is do you see any difference between the Muslim practice of kissing showing reverence and venerating the Black Stone and the Catholic practice of pope John Paul II kissing the statute of the Virgin Mary with reverence and veneration?

I do not have to kiss the black stone. The catholic can not but praise their popes or kiss whatever they kiss of them.

Informed Christians know there is no passage and the Koran that says the Bible is lost altered or corrupted.

woe to those who have altered the book or change the word from its place so that they gain something by it, yet claim its all from God without man's influence and desire.

My question is would you please list all the passages you know where the Qur'an says the Bible that was in the hands of the Christians at the time of Muhammad had been corrupted?

002.079 YUSUFALI: Then woe to those who write the Book with their own hands, and then say:"This is from Allah," to traffic with it for miserable price!- Woe to them for what their hands do write, and for the gain they make thereby.

Both the Samarqand MSS is in Tashkent, and the MSS housed in the Topkapi Museum in Istanbul are written in the script style called "Kufic". And not the earlier style known as Ma'il or Mashq. This fact is the reason Muslim scholars date these manuscripts no earlier than 200 years after Muhammad died.

you have indicated that Ma'il or Mashq is earlier to prove that it must be earlier that 200 years the date you assigned to the Kufic style. What you need to tell us now why was a Ma'il or Mashq except some Quran[s] at least a Quran was written by such a style: Ma'il or Mashq? You defeat your own opinion of argument here.

My question is: leaving aside blind faith and wishful thinking, what evidence do you supply that these MSS were written any earlier?
The British Museum in London has an ancient copy of the Koran written in the Ma'il style of script, but practicing Muslim scholar Martin Lings, who is the former curator for the manuscripts of the British Museum, dates this manuscript at 790 AD.

the 790 AD is definitely early than 200 years of the passing of the messenger [sa], who passed in 732. This is less than 60 years and it is not an indication that nothing was written before it, considering that Quran was written as a complete single Book, first during Abu Bakr, then repeated from it 5 Quran[s] in the time of Uthaman Affan. What you call manuscript is A complete Quran whereas you call parchments, leaflets manuscript as well you are talking about the Bible.
Is Complete Book of Quran the same as pieces of leaves, parchments and leaflets of Bible the same?

My question is: Apart from just making the claim, what evidence do you supply that this MSS were written any earlier?

ets just assume for a moment that nothing was written, ever. The muslims memorized it as they do, today. The muslims used the memorized Quran then as they use it today: for prayers, for islamic ceremonies, gathering, etc. It is incumbered on muslims to memorize as much he or she is capable to for personal use everyday. This was the case even during the lifetime of the messenger [sa]. In the lifetime of the messenger [sa], the Quran were written down as soon as any revelation is completed. His scribes were from the community: Ali, his beloved cousin was one of them.

The community write their own so that they can memorize it/them. The scripts you spoke about were developed for the benefit of the wider muslim communty whereas the arabs who were there during revelation didnt need any of the scripts. After all it is their tongue the was coming in and they had they master there who received the revelation, learning directly from him, even as they used it in daily prayers, etc, further making its writing down ok, but not absolutely essential in their case. Again, Uthman burned the earliest parches, pieces from the individual upon arriving at standard text for every community. Oral document that is recited very frequently does not lose its authenticity just because it is not written down.

I have seen many yoruba people writing Harbiorlah, instead of Abiola. Does her grandmother who calls her Abiola everyday need the written down of either version before she knows how to pronounce it and for Abiols the grand daughter to respond to uneducated lady?

The text of the Koran in 37:103 reads "they had both submitted their wills (became Muslims)" while the Arabic text of the Tashkent MSS gives the exact opposite meaning, "they did not submitted their wills" (they did NOT become Muslims.)

if you are talking about Ibrahim and Ismail [as] we know that they were muslim. The recited verses from memory is a sure bet confirming that there is no doubt what they were in faith. Sometime, the printer may not print so clearly. I assure you, the Quran will correct your tongue by stopping you if you say it wrongly meaning yo cant say just what you want, but what is revealed must be said.

My question is: have you actually read the Tashkent MSS for yourself in this passage and how do you explain this textual variation given your comments on the miracle of the perfect Koran?

Quran is oral. That is enough to correct any mistake. If I write Aaabisiola instead of Abiola, the woman will say thats not her name but Abiola is her name.

Qur’an 18:9, makes into real history, the second century myth of 7 Christian youths who were persecuted for their faith and went to sleep in a cave for 300 years and then woke up with no ill effects. In the original myth the hero is a Christian, but in the Koran the hero is a Muslim.

No place it is stated that true followers of Christ have a religion called christianity. Jesus was a muslim [submitting to the Will of God] so his true followers must be muslims too, worshiping and submitting as he did. And since everything is not correctly and accurately recorded in the Bible, what occurs out the Bible may actually individual truth of "myth".

My question is: in the absence of any copyright laws when the Koran was written, are you at least prepared to pay compensation to the living relatives of the author of this myth? If not, would you be in favor of going starting up a charity fund to compensate for damages of copyright infringement?

Even if Muhammad [sa] who could have made a mint if he had claimed it was his own genius mind, while he died a poor man. I proposed to you and those who you are advocating on their behalf that God revealed to Muhammad [sa] what he knew not: The Whole Quran. So if you want to actually act as an advocate for others, with deceit of mind, then petition God and what for His decision on you. If you are sincere and you want to be an advocate for yourself and others in truth, then turn to islam and it is through it you will receive Mercy of God.

You Muslims claim, that the many different translations of the English Bible will render a single text with many different words and phrases. You said this was proof the Bible is corrupted and that the Koran reads exactly the same way everywhere in the world in Arabic.

our concern is not the english or other language translations of the bible. we want you to show us the original Bible that Jesus preached in his language. Then we will begin to dialogue. if not we have nothing to talk about.

My question is: Since the many English translations of the Koran also render a single text with many different words, does that proof that the Koran is corrupted?

Quran is in pure arabic only.

Muslims believe the word Allah was used by Jesus when he hung on the cross. The Bible records that Jesus said "Eli Eli lama sabachthani", but you say Jesus really cried out to Allah and said "Allah, Allah lama sabachthani"[/Ellah is what the syriac language says and not Eli, because Eli does not make sense and its a name of the son of Samuel New Living Translation (©2007)
Now the sons of Eli were scoundrels who had no respect for the LORD.

God will not have such as His Name.



[quote]My question is: Would you please explain why you would use this argument when you don't believe Jesus ever hung on the cross?

Because Jesus was not killed or died on the cross is our belief and that is not the reason that whoever was on the cross, if he called on God, he will simply say Ellah, instead of calling Eli the son Prophet Samuel.

And second, since Jesus was quoting Ps 22:1 on the cross, isn't rather unlikely that both the Hebrew Old Testament and the Greek New Testament are wrong using Eli, a Hebrew word, rather than Allah, an arab word?

You can not prove that Psalm 22:1 is evidence for christian take on Jesus unless Jesus was the only one ever on the jewish cross? Eli is not just a hebrew word, its a name of the son of Prophet Samuel. Allah and syriac Ellah are similar and you can get Ellah from Halleluyah. But cant get Yahweh or Jehovah or Eli from it. Yahu Ellah.

You Muslims chide Christians because the earliest complete copies of the Bible were written 300 years after the originals of the first century. Yet Muslim scholars state the earliest copy of the Koran was written no earlier than 150 years after Muhammad died.

No muslim scholarship that its grain of salt will discount the Quran put together as a full physical book during the time of Abu Bakr [ra], few years after the death of the messenger [sa]. Or the Uthman Quran that were produced after the reign of Umar [ra], before the reign of Ali [ra]. All the muslims agree on the present day Quran day Quran called Uthmanu Quran. There is no Bible that all the christians agreed upon. And never will there be such a bible, so 300 years of writing the Bible is irrelevant. The problem is that you do not have anything you can authentically trace back to Jesus. Period.

My question is: in light of this fact, how could the Koran possibly be better than the Bible and would you please state the name and location and date of the earliest Koran you believe to be in existence?

read about Quran made to a book in the time of Abu Bakr because the community was losing large numbers of those who memorize it to enemies of Islam who were killing them.

You Muslims claim, that a proof that the Koran was from God is that it contains scientifically accurate information about Embryology, yet in 86:6-7 the Koran says, "man was created from ejected liquid- Proceeding from between the backbone and the ribs". This echoes the scientific error of Hippocrates who believed Fluid originates, from the brain down the spinal chord, before passing through the kidneys and finally out of the body. (Hippocratic Writings, Penguin Classics, 1983, p. 317)

we can from this bold eliminate that hippocrates was the one Muhammad [sa] copied hs material because he would have spoken about the brain, too. So we have 2 more professors to throw out so that you will believe Muhammad [sa] was not copying from anyone but received revelation and nothing less.

But let us talk the fluid "ejected liquid which proceeds from between the backbone and the ribs". One thing that you and I will upon is that male fluid does play a role on the female egg that becomes fertilized to produce man. When the two meet and become what will be man, they combination is so small that it may not be visible to the eye of everyone without a microscope. I remember a doctor on nairaland arguing that at some point in the development of the human fetus the organs that finally become involved in the male ejected fluid process are all in the place that Quran says; between the backbone and the ribs. To disprove the Quran, you will have say to us that there was no time that these organs package was not between the backbone and the ribs.

Heck, even if you go further, you will say that the admixture of egg and sper.m was a full man, already if he develops to its fulness.

My question is: do you reject modern science and believe the Koran when it says Fluid originates from the mid-gut section of a man's body.

Modern science mega textbooks to simply explain a one liner in the Quran. Quran is the Syllabus in the hand of the Professor. Modern science is the tutor who helps the student to understand what the professor touch on in the lecture.

Muslims quote an article written in 1957 by the Jehovah's Witnesses who stated there were 50,000 errors in the translation of the King James version. My question is: Even if this were true, (which of course it is not), how does this prove there is corruption in the original Greek MSS from which the King James version was translated?

does it make science that the Obi of Onisha spoke to his people in his palace in Onisha dialect and some guy says he captured it in Ghana's Twi language and says it supersedes what the Obi said in his language? Ironically, the Christian Bible has not settled down with a copy yet, that is good for all 'protestants', if we concentrate only on protestants in this discussion. what we see is Bible with generational revision, edition, etc. its your book and you have live with it and live on it, running your life, at least the spiritual life by what is not firmly formulated, yet. Is that the truth to hold on to the grave?

@Muhammad:

by Muhammad___: 12:04pm
Ok You Muslims claim, that proof the Koran was from God, is that it contains scientifically accurate information about Embryology before man discovered it for himself.

However, all the information in the Koran regarding Embryology is copied from three sources, 1. A Greek doctor named Galen, who lived of 150 AD. 2. A Jewish doctor named ~~Samuel ha-Yehudi~(?) who lived 150 AD. 3. the Greek father of medicine Hippocrates who lived 400 BC.

My question is: in light of the fact that all the information contained in the Koran was already in print by these three doctors, will you retract the argument on Embryology?

lets look that it from the point that the 3 names you listed did what you said they did and it was established fact by Quran spoke about embryo.

Your problem will be to prove that Muhammad [sa] in isolated Makka and a true scientific illiterate was able to get the materials of these professors and copied them, made it public and no one called him on it that it was plagiarized material? You are talking about an arab illiterate speaking in his pure arabic tongue that this quality of arabic language is now the highest form of arabic. Have you ever translated any material in one language to another and the new material retains the same level of message or even higher, in case of the Quran its higher?

Let us now look that the God that allowed man to have knowledge which the 3 professors demonstrated, unless you dont believe that God played vital in their knowledge? The point therefore is that in either way, whether you believe God or not making the professors writing possible, we have to agree that a makkan who produced something similar which he didnt claim was of his scientific prowess but from God will be at least be respected for not personal humbleness. But no one accused him until the arrival of accusers in the last 2 centuries or just a little more or even less.

The detail has been in the Quran for 14 centuries and more now. So for 12 centuries no one challenged him, while alive and even his death. No one challenged the muslims for 12 centuries. What are reasons or a single reason for the passiveness of the critics, since everyone will have preferred the 3 to be in an exclusive club of their own? Did any of the 3 copied from any of the other 2? so why do you think Muhammad [sa] has to be the one that must copy from any of them? Do you have a valid reason or just throwing darts like all the other people?

If not, will you supply one detail revealed in the Koran about Embryology, that was not already revealed or that was new?

first, if each of the 3 former scientists produced perfect material has need to improvement, the material in the Quran would therefore be revealed so that the each of the 3 earlier scientific findings was a confirmation of the fact that God support this non scientist man who did not take a single credit or say he was a genius in science. Further, if what is in the Quran is not weaker that any of the 3 from the scientists, it is another proof that God is the One Who revealed it to Muhammad [sa]. Further, if what is in the Quran is better than what each of them individually produced, then it is yet another proof that God is the One Who revealed it to Muhammad [sa].

It this uneducated man [sa] was to have copied from the materials of any of the professors of medicine, what he produced should therefore be word for word like what he copied since it will be difficult to edit the highly scientific material, unless you claim now that Muhammad [sa] was a professor and i will now challenge you why he denied this great professorial quality about himself? he could have made money because his people appreciated wealth and he will not be a poor man. Yet he died poor, very poor.


The "chewed up" phenomenon was far better and completely accurate about the stage it represents.

@Ihedinobi

by Ihedinobi(m): 7:25am On Aug 12
Didn't know this discussion was still running :O

More grace to you, Bro Olaadegbu.

why greasing his elbow when he cant produce a single verse from the bible to show that Jesus is the God Who created all things, the God that spoke when no one answered?



@Frosbel:

by frosbel(m): 12:16am On Aug 14
common guys, you know the end of this discussion will be no agreement, what's the point grin

Come on? Thats after start the wahala.

@Cyrexx: If Muhammad [sa] was getting his ways from The God he made up, tell me how The made up God says to the messenger "be conscious of your Lord" in Surah Ahzab?

How is this made up God was capable of telling Muhammad [sa] "your frowned, turning your face away" in Surah Abasa?

How is it that Muhammad [sa] refused to accept the "position" that the Makkans, wanted him to accept and drops his prophetic mission, preaching against idolatry, etc?

Below are what the makkans presented:

1]. Oh Muhammad become our king, if you want. We will make you the king.

2]. Oh Muhammad become our master, if you want. We will give you all authorities over us.

3]. Oh Muhammad become the wealthiest among us, if you want. We will give good portions of our wealth so you will be wealthiest right there and then.

4[. Oh Muhammad become the one that has most wives, if you want. We will give you the most beautiful women from each of the tribes in Makka.

With all of these, Muhammad [sa] turned down each of them and recited to them Surah Kafiruun [read it]. He also told him uncle that if the sun was placed on his right hand, and the moon on his left, he will not stop the his mission, unless God make a Decision.

Muhammad [sa] ran away from his place the city of his bloodline, the place he was born, just the same way Moses did in his time, the very same thing Jesus did in his time, too.

I wonder if you think the video of the "humanist" is a response appropriate to the challenge proposed?


many of you humanists are just as heartless under the same circumstances as us the theists. Its human nature to fall off, sometimes. The difference is that when each picks himself up from mistakes and go into correction mode, the humanist have to clear reason for not remaining in the place of evil, while the theist, especially the muslim he does it for the sake of God Who he realizes is in control of his affairs and can forgive him, wiping off the bad deed from the kept record.


For the humanist to propose that we should live like cattle the same way he is living his life in the tunnel vision of sleep, wake up and do whatever including eat and go back to sleep is not acceptable to us.

Wait a minute. This humanist has a job, a means of ability to get the resources that he need to survive. If he works in the business of other person, does he not obey the rules of the owner and his business in order he gets his weekly salary, refusal to obey will mean he is punished by not being able to collect salary from this establishment that will continue to survive?


Is the chairman not his boss?


Even the chairman is limited in his power because he will no power over anyone who does not need his business. Those who are on the premise of the business are from my point of view should see the place as a microcosm of this earth of ours. Hence the One Who controls the earth has right in macros-comic dimension if the owner of the business supporting city has power over those of his worker when at work.


The humanist does not like God why is he still human that God created? If the humanist does not like God, why cant leave the earth of God [i know he cant leave. he is powerless except that he is arrogantly hiding this fact].


abeg cyrexx stand up and make a better challenge instead of you presented from your comrade.

While other religious books seem incomplete or partially out of date to those who claim that these are the most secret texts, The Quran is the opposite. The muslims upon having some knowledge of Islam accept every verse of it without change, however with varied possible interpretations because the absolute knowledge of the Quran belongs to God.

Let me make my specific point here: Few years ago, i was talking to muslims of varied backgrounds and cultural differences. On the matter of who can be married, which we all agreed that first cousin is part of those while sibling is not was our discussion.

I remembered an american saying that he has stopped fraternizing with beautiful cousin the moment he realized she is a potential wife.

Another american said there must be an amount good in it since God permits its possibility, although he will not marry his cousin because of many factors, apart from the fact there might not be any or she is very old, health issues of the offspring, etc.

I remembered how close i am with my female cousins, from both my parents' bloodlines. I could not marry anyone of them because of my own personality. I do not any of my family members to fall into the category of in laws. This is just one of the many reasons for me.

There was a guy from Benin who became muslim in the most odd place called the west whereas there is good chunk of edo population that is Islamic. I couldnt bring myself to ask him why discovery of Islam in America? The following year I met Muhammad, a core Igbo man and many others who are Calabar citizens.

Again, the edo man was just like me: We dont do family because there is plenty of non family to pick who to do from.

The point here is that Islamic textbook, the Quran, each of its verse is accepted except the hypocrite who will reject even a single verse.


Allah says Muhammad [sa] is a messenger. We accept it.

In the christian Bible, Jesus said he was a prophet, a son of man [and it obvious here that Mary was the specie called "man" in the creation], not capable to do anything, he has the same Lord Who is One God of everyone [and it is obvious when he made prayers all night long and in numerous places ask for help, favor, protection, etc including forgiveness in the Lord's prayer in the "forgive us our sins. . ."].

The disciples of Jesus were those who were with him during his years of inviting people to what God had sent him with. This group of persons lost a member so they were 11 about the time was lifted up to heavens. The 11 must be from the group who truly knew Jesus. They must be better than those who came later. If only in the matters of ability to describe him and if they have good memory they will collectively remember each of his messages, in idea if not word for word.

If Jesus spent 3 years preaching and never once said that he is God The Most High, then whoever proposed it later had been unjust to Jesus.

There is looseness in the whole bible in usage of son of God. God will have no need of any son because only people have children to take over their human duties after the have completed their lifespan and gone. If angels dont have children why would their God have any? If catholic priests and nuns see having children do not fit their dedication to God, why will God not at least be as dedicated to His Own Position instead of coming lower and stoop to my level about children?

The description of how God the Holy Spirit on behalf of God the father made Mary pregnant as foretold by the angel is nothing less than the process of human copulation.


The yorubas always say "dont let us count the slaves". The reality is that those think that they are not slaves will be counted as slaves when the counting done.

by MacDaddy01: 10:51pm On Aug 15
lolololol.....

None of them have evidence. they rely on mysteries(god of the gaps) or fallacies to prove God.

God of the gaps/mysteries

-We dont know how the first life on earth came- therefore, God created it!
-What caused the big slam? Dont know-God caused it!
-Where do we go afer we die? Dont know- We meet God!


Fallacies
-The bible says it, therefore it is true
-If I am wrong, nothing happens, if you are wrong, you go to hell!

none of them has evidence? Did you read my post, asking if the op knows if the devil exist and if he knows what the mind is if he can't point to it for us to see? Or the op does not have a mind of his own? Do you have a mind, macdaddy01 and can you show us this mind, if have it and if you dont have a mind, just say so? I guess you learn the hard way, this you seem to be so obtuse. You you have a mind because i wanna see how deep the empty gap in your body is, or are you a fallacy, non existence? If you do not exist, i will accept with no explanation if you say you have no mind. If you walk around and seem to indicate tangibility, then you need to explain to how you come to the conclusion if you say you have no mind. If you say you have a mind, please where is it?


do you have answer for any of this, if God has no impact on each?

-We dont know how the first life on earth came- therefore, God created it!
-What caused the big slam? Dont know-God caused it!
-Where do we go afer we die? Dont know- We meet God!

you may need to read the Quran to learn about creation.
to learn about big ban,g, since "Be" [The Command of Action] must be contrary to "wimping".
to learn about what makes death a reality. I always ask; which keeps the other alive; the body or the soul?

do you have a soul? where is it?

@Roger Ede:

by Roger Edet: 10:04am
I would like all theists to present, in this thread, whatever empirical evidence they have to demonstrate that their god is more likely to exist than Ganesha the elephant-headed god of the Hindus.

Step right up theists, and show us what you've got!

i guess this guy does not believe that the devil exists? or does he believe tthat the devil exists and does stare people to do evil, or do they do it out desire? how does desire occurs in the heart of man, since you will not believe man has a mind since it is not something tangible you can see, even if cut the man open?

ogaga will be a good witness for devil just about now, if the you deny that there is no devil that will factor in when man does evil.

let me go out for air, since it is raining and the air will be moist and will not be as dry as the always humid or bone dry summer air.

I hope to read the response to this later from you.

^ a real arab looking dude in that video, nose and all. his loo is so authentically arab, instead of the fake, non arab looking [specifically the egyptian type of look] pastor joseph sitting next to him. or the type of fake look of sam shamoun that is not found in kuwait.

i wonder what arab country he is from, thailand or lebanon?

could anyone show another arab man who like the speaker so that i can darn the types of sam shamoun and pastor joseph for not claiming their asiatic bloodlines?

so this man is tidytim? you fall my hand, big time.

he can enter church because i have made Islamic prayers in many churches.

But he can not participate in the funeral ceremony of non muslim. He could have easily went there. remained outside the church or request that they let him visit them at home to express his condolences as the face of the nigerian government, if he truly wanted to be there instead of a christian officer in the secretariat.

Mr Anony is calling me his friend. Is your right. And I also have my right so not quite your friend because we have nothing in common. Nothing.

@Mr Anony:

by Mr_Anony(m): 11:14pm On Aug 14

Sweetnecta: @Mr Anony:

While Mr Anony is deceiving himself as "son of God", Jesus was wise to take the position of a slave, the very same position we muslims take.

Mr Anony continue in your deceit because you are even less than Paul who says he is a slave of Jesus, who himself is a slave like I am to the same God, you are claiming to be your father.

But Jesus has already answered you in your deceit by telling you that he will tell you to get away from him because he does not know you, you doer of iniquity.

I see that you have posted some bible verses to prove your point. I'll take it that you believe those bible verses to be true. Now let us examine them:-

Bible is not my thing, but it is your thing so I am using it as evidential source in our dialogue. Let me say this; When you dispute the verse[s] in your Bible, to me you have fallen out of christianity, you just dont that is the case.

New International Version (©1984)
James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, To the twelve tribes scattered among the nations: Greetings. James 1:1

1 I, Paul, am a devoted slave of Jesus Christ on assignment, authorized as an apostle to proclaim God's words and acts. I write this letter to all the Christians in Rome, God's friends Romans 1:1

Why do Paul and James refer to themselves here as servants of God? Let us continue...

were the not is the question for you?

"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. “Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ ” -Matthew 7:21-23

I just added verse 21 which you omitted to show you that Jesus is the Son of God and not servant.

Will verse 21 you added going to render the above invalid?

New Living Translation (©2007)
You must have the same attitude that Christ Jesus had.

Jesus was also a slave/servant of God, said his 11 disciples after he was lifted up to heaven and after the demise of Judas Iscariot.

Though he was God,

Did Jesus say he was God while God was not shy to say that He is God and demanded he be worshiped, even as Jesus also fell into the category of those who worshiped this very bold God? Please show us where Jesus said he was God and thereby deserved to be worshiped, while he worshiped God, all night long? Do you think Yahweh worshiped Jesus as Jesus worshiped Yahweh? Who is the real God here if you are sincere?

he did not think of equality with God as something to cling to. Instead, he gave up his divine privileges; he took the humble position of a slave and was born as a human being. When he appeared in human form, Philippians 2:5-7

Make up! This is similar to Big Apple circus promo! When did Jesus give this about himself, while he was on earth for 3 years, preaching? If Jesus did not say this to anyone while people could hear his voice among men, how can we believe what was said about him from a person who he did not meet? Interestingly to note that Jesus was reported to have shouted "My God, my God . . . " and was reported to have been lifted to heaven by God. Not by himself. But by God Almighty Whom he worshiped and Whom he said is the Real Power making things happened because Jesus was powerless.

I have added verse 5 and 6 which you omitted so that you can know that Jesus is God[/quote[Jesus aint God. You hear me, while you are playing yourself? There is Only One God and He aint Jesus son of Mary!


[quote]but He humbled Himself as a servant and was born a human being.

Crappola. There is no evidence that Jesus said to anyone what you just quote, because he was prophet who was "not recognized in his own town" and "son of man" among indicators that he was no God but 100% man! I will chalk this up as one of the many ideas that became prevalent that the another comforter [sa] corrected and the correction is in the Book that corrects; The ALQuran.

When he appeared in human form, Philippians 2:5-7

Did God ever appeared to anyone in Human FORM? No, because no one can see God and live. No one has seen God at anytime, said Jesus! Continue to say for Jesus what Jesus didnt say for himself.

I have added verse 5 and 6 which you omitted so that you can know that Jesus is God but He humbled Himself as a servant and was born a human being. We are also encouraged to be humble like Him and that is why you see the disciples referring to themselves sometimes as servants.

Who do you think you are driving on the wrong lane? Who told you to humble yourself like Jesus humbled himself? Did Jesus tell you that? Did Jesus say he is God? Is Yahweh subject to all that are human that Jesus was subject to like the rest of us? Did Jesus receive worship from Yahweh and Yahweh obviously received worship from Jesus? Where is any evidence that Jesus is God, except what Paul who is unknown to Jesus was writing? If Jesus was anything other than being a human prophet of God, why were the true disciples of Jesus against Jesus, so much so that Paul resorted to arm strong tactics, using the authority to suppress "Other Gospel"?

Human prophets [as] were all humbled before their God: All of them prostrated, ate, etc. Tell me whats different in what Jesus did, even his obeying the laws and the prophets and warning you that these must be continued, a thing that Paul threw out, unceremoniously.

You can look up these verses in a bible for yourself so you know I am not making things up. Remember it was you that originally came up with the verses and not me.

do you now rendered the verses that I posted useless by your own "explanations" from what Paul said? Is your argument sensible to you? If it is, then what the nl surrogate of the Nigeria is saying about him crushing Boo Haram in June is what he accomplished while we know he is passive about Boko Haram, which has becomes an international sore.

Who will speak most clearly about Jesus from this list:
1]. Mr Anony by his explanations, above?

2]. Paul by his letters?

3]. Jesus by his red lettered verses?

Please permit me to show you other verses of scripture:


Yet to all who did receive him (Jesus Christ), to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God — children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God. John 1:12-13 NIV

Who is the speaker, here Jesus or somebody else?

contrast the above to the below?. Who has said the truth about Jesus, Jesus below who has a Lord Who is God of all or the unknown author of the above verse in John, since it is clear that no everything in the gospel was said by Jesus and there are more that one gospel, anyway, and there in no uniformity is even a common story to all or some [list of fathers in the genealogies are simple evident of inconsistencies and you cant trust inconsistency].

hear yea, oh Israel; your Lord, our God is One God [said Jesus in the letter verses]

(you can read the whole of John 1 for yourself to be sure)

i have had enough of it the reason i talk about Islam to people.

So you have not received a spirit that makes you fearful slaves. Instead, you received God’s Spirit when he adopted you as his own children. Now we call him, “Abba, Father.” Romans 8:15 NLT

the master himself, Jesus son of Mary say My God, my God [In his name tongue: Ellah, Ellah]. Whoever said "abba" [father] has you written is clearly in error and Jesus disagrees with him. You can not find any agreement so you have to throw one out.

But which one, Mr. Anony?

(this is Paul speaking to Christians here...again feel free to read the whole chapter yourself so you see if I am twisting it out of context or not)

I no send am. Jesus no send am. The true disciples have been hood winkled, gagged, muscled.

God loves us so much He prefers us to become His sons that to continue being slaves. God's doors are open for us my brother. Please don't turn your back on Him. We are also encouraged to be humble like Him and that is why you see the disciples referring to themselves sometimes as servants.

and Jesus will disowned you first before the throwing into the lake of fire? is this the end of "true" sons? Wake up, man.

You can look up these verses in a bible for yourself so you know I am not making things up. Remember it was you that originally came up with the verses and not me.

Please permit me to show you other verses of scripture:


Yet to all who did receive him (Jesus Christ), to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God — children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband's will, but born of God. John 1:12-13 NIV

who is speaker here: Jesus or somebody else? It is easy to say Jesus said this or that after he was gone by the permission of God. What did Jesus say but saying he is powerless, a slave, a servant, messenger, prophet? What did the 11 preached before came on the scene and took over everything? Jesus was a messenger of God and we must expect the Another Comforter soon at some point in the future, just like Jesus was to return while the some of the 12 disciples will still be alive, and now 2000 years plus and we still have to count some more.

(you can read the whole of John 1 for yourself to be sure)

So you have not received a spirit that makes you fearful slaves. Instead, you received God’s Spirit when he adopted you as his own children. Now we call him, “Abba, Father.” Romans 8:15 NLT

did Jesus mentioned The Name of God? In the Bible, just once; On the cross if we accept it to just present a definite argument. The Name of God to Jesus of the cross is Ellah and there was no father/son relationship mentioned by Jesus when this is the most crucial place he should truly revealed his position. Incidentally, it is God/messenger we can deduce.

(this is Paul speaking to Christians here...again feel free to read the whole chapter yourself so you see if I am twisting it out of context or not)

God loves us so much He prefers us to become His sons that to continue being slaves. God's doors are open for us my brother. Please don't turn your back on Him

let Jesus speak for himself!

I was sent to only the house of Israel because they are lost sheep.
I am a prophet.
I am a son of man.
I can do nothing of my own power.
Hear ye oh Israel our Lord is One God.
Your Lord is my Lord and He is One God
There will be an another comforter after me. He will speak to you. You will hear his voice. He will correct your mistake which would be assumed to be the truth at that time. He will remind of what truth that came from me and rebuke you of the lies you would have spoken about me, saying that I had uttered. He will glorify me as a true christ. He will teach you new things because presently, your faith is too little to hear the full blast of absolute truth.

Did Muhammad [sa] ever spoke to the children of Israel? Yes.
Where? Yathrib, now Madina.


I have tried, within the effort of Jihad to bring you the truth. My brothers in faith have done the same. each of them has done better and they have the energy to continue.

I dont have the same energy that they individually have. It is your choice to accept guidance now, or sometime in your future. No one can do more that this type of advise; dialoguing you.

I will not respond to your post, again. I need to concentrate and talk to others who are not etched in stone. may God help us all.

@avicenna: since you say you can recite Quran, read Surah Hijr [chapter 15], verses 39 to 42 if you can read much more than that and see the work of the unseen devil.

Alhamdulillah you are till on earth, young and all of that.

whats risky in it? are his parents violent people and so he has to deceive the them? how about this muslim girl that he is also deceiving? that dude is a deceiver and if he is a yoruba he should tell us a yoruba family that killed one of their own because he/she left the family religion? even the pagans who do human sacrifices will not kill a family member!

that man avicenna is dishonest and God help his future patients for his trickery.

there were youth in my family who abandoned religion when i was growing. i sill have people who openly go to church in my family. no one ever is holding the non muslim to not satisfy his/her religious experience. i have a beloved niece who woke up one day and see she is now a christian. her retired military father has not gunned her down yet. when they told me, my heart bled. all i did was talk to her and she said this is what she wants, and i cant force her. her heart is hers, alone and i respect her position.

hiding your truth from others is the height of spinelessness. what truth can come from a person who is hiding his own reality?

@iv4fb:

by iv4fb: 7:24am
@sweetnecta, so what has the president got to do with religion? So even your religion support insulting the president in the name of religion? I see! I guess u enjoy insulting every other person who aint worshiping ur god! Have u ever insulted osama for the lives he wasted?

read my opinion about osama. its also clear that the head of nigerian government is the president, who lobbied for the job and has been shoddy about the job description. obama is younger than jonathan, though not by much, but the "on the job" effort of obama is miles ahead of jonathan.

I sure won't argue with u, someone who just modify his/her intimate orientation from 'f' to 'm'; I'm sure can never say the truth!

what gives you the inkling that i ever claimed being a woman? is it the sweet in my name and you expect bitter for man? or it the necta and you expect glue for a man? my desired name was sealed nectar. but i can not bear it because it is reserved for my master in faith, Muhammad [sa]. Never will i be a woman. Never!

I understand from the PMs I got that that's what you do for a living, so I wouldn't allow you drag me to your level. Apparently, you win! So worship your islam/mohammed/allah-its ur business, u know?

whats a pm? whoever told you what i do for my livelihood has lied to you. no one on nl knows me enough to know what i do. since islam is my religion,i am shy about it.

You said I knew nothing, sure you were right, but I guess you know everything, right? Interesting! U might be educated but I'm not sure u are academically inclined for your points were so baseless, but since this aint a debate, its not my point against urs. How can someone say the west is.

i live in the west. i guess from my experience living in the west is a factor here. there are sayings that we let you know that its all about the money: "its all by benjamins", "your money is good with me", "in God we trust. the rest is cash" and many others. have heard any of then and you are saying its not about money when wealth is what everyone crave in the west.

All about money and so they suppress islam? Don't they oppress the christians too? Someone asking for source evern when I made it clear my statistics were my views and opinions...

after 911 everyone just have to have a say about islma. i know. i experienced it and the residue is still here. well, the jesus factor is not letting the suppression of christianity become a full blown issue like what 911 has done on islam.

You don't defend ur god by bashing someone else's religion, remember "I can of myself do nothing"

and i see how your respect my God and religion by writing the bold.

( I guess mohammed can do everything starting by marrying someone quite older who employed him earlier) and so to me I'll rather serve my God to someone who 'serve'(ibo way) someone and marry the person afterwards, who's wives(es) were so many, who lost a tooth in battle while enforcing his belief, married a teenager, those were my point, where're yours?

first ibo are not homogenous in anything including religion, considering that they used to be animist, while many say they are jews. now that they are christians, we clearly see authenticity of judaism is not be a christian. and we now have "ibo" [igbo] muslims on nl and in my family, too. if i give you 'point' [points] i will upset myself even more that you will be upset because i love Jesus more than you, for sure. You say you love and follow him, but refuse to do any of core of how he worshiped God, while i do exactly what he did. and it is not a sign of God is against the one who lost a tooth or many teeth in battle about his conviction. even those who died on their beliefs, you christians say a saints. death is worse than loosing teeth.

the wisest person in the bible, King Solomon had 700 wives and please add another 300 concubines. Abraham the father of faith, you christians say you on his faith [you are not not for real, because it was after his death that christianity began] had more that 1 wife. So was Jacob. so was Kind David. You people that God of abraham, isaac and jacob [2 of 3 had multiple wives] ad you say Jesus was from the house of david; the same david with more than 1 wife and you guys say that David was a wife snatcher and killer of her husband for good measure. You never stop reading his psalm for protections: see the hypocrisy?

For the records, my point is, whoever want to worship God, let him be, whoever want to worship allah, let him b and whoever choose not to worship any, its his choice; even our constitution supports all.

so what you worship is now God? you must be joking! you worship 3 gods, so count them with me: Jesus is one god. holy ghost is another god. and father sitting on a chair is another. so how do you say you worship God instead of gods, while I worship Who does not have a partner, was not begotten, does not beget and there is none like Him? your writing allah instead of Allah does not change the reality.

Mr. Sweetnecta, this is my last post to u, so u win, go ahead and insult as much as you like(I'm yet to see a muslim who don't resort to insults and even violence when their religion is argued on), spill ur junk and when you're done, push the log out button and have a nice life!

while you can lay false claim to yourself as a person with impeccable morality, the reality is seen in your posts. I simply respond to you so that you don't think we did not notice you. I can say that I have never seen a christian who doesnt think that he/she is better than muslims and is guaranteed paradise already. but since i have not met every christian, i will not so and in view of what Jesus said to the fact that he will deny many a christian is an indicator that what comes from the mouths of the christians may not always be the correct position.

Instead of Mr Anony disputing the Bibles where we find Jesus the slave. then servant by the accounts of his lifetime disciples who new him. also son of God and God by Paul who never knew him. and Jesus never knew Paul for sure. Paul has based his position on what was unconfirmed illusion or delusional appearance of Jesus to him. There are jinns, the evil kind that minister to the heart, presenting fallacy as reality. This is what happened to Paul.

The fact that Paul disagrees with the likes of Peter shows that if Paul was not the Another Comfort the good spirit from God [according to Jesus was to correct his community and stare them from the wrong that will be prevailing, teach them knew things, the things Jesus didn't teach them because of their little faith, reminded them of what Jesus actually said instead of what people are erroneously saying that Jesus said, and abiding with them forever in what God gave him, if God did not commission Paul on these as He had commissioned Jesus on his limited mission so that the Another Comforter must come to complete and no one else will after him], then Paul must not to be believed, especially when Jesus is completely opposite what he said Jesus is.

We read that Jesus said "Ellah" twice [my God, twice] and not Abba!

The one who God put His Word in his mouth is the one we follow and you can read many 10s, maybe 100s of God saying to Muhammad [sa] "say", and Muhammad [sa] harkened to the commandment and "said" to the people, immediately what he was commanded to say. And each chapter of the Quran started wit "in the Name of God. . . .", except Surah Taubah, where in Surah Naml starts with In the Name of God . . . and then a verse in this Surah contains "in the Name of God . . . .".

After the night of power that i am entering now, i will respond to you tomorrow, Mr Anony. My brothers in faith have done good job for the pleasure of God against you by using your Bible to tear away at your empty facade of weak presentation. Call Jesus what you want. It will not change his place with God. He is a prophet, a human and slave like you and I. He said it in saying he is a prophet. A son of man. and we know God is not the man in that son of man. A slave servant who was sent to the children of israel, not any other people. And he was not the seal of prophetic messenger. He said Another comforter will come. So we see Muhammad [sa] arrived and Muhammad said by his Lord that he is the seal of Prophet-hood, the last messenger.


To the Muslims, I pray that Allah give each the reward of this magnificent Night. Amin and by it for give us all our sins. The ummah will not agree on lie by what is true.

Avicenna:

by Avicenna: 4:05pm

Purist: @Avicenna:

Sorry to bother you, but I'm curious: have you been fasting this Ramadan period? If yes, how have you managed to keep up so far? If no, how have you managed to avoid detection from your Muslim brothers?


Yes, I have been fasting when I'm home. Praying(salat) regularly with them. This does not mean anything.
You must understand, I need to keep up the act for now. It is risky not doing so.
Days when I'm in my place, no fasting at all. I never fast when I'm alone. I see no reason to starve myself.
One more thing,if I decide not to fast when I'm home, no one complains but the youngest of my brothers fast. People use this against you as some form of insults. I don't intend to get into an argument with such fellows , so I fast with little snacks when no one is lookinggrin

Avicenna. Avicenna. Avicenna. How many times have I called you? Man should be man. You are falling my hand man. You dropped the ball, even with stick'em in your gloves. Deceiving your parents is below the belt. You should man up and say "I am not a muslim, but you people are and its your ramadhan not mine!" Then they will respect you that you are honest and accept you if they wish or reject you and tell you to stay away because they do not want you and your deceit.

I used to like you until I see that you are a chronically incorrigible. Who will trust a child who deceives his parents? Even atheists should have morals. Oh. Well. They don't because there is no reason, yardstick or compass to guide them to it. Its all about id/the lowest part of animal instincts: wake up eat and sleep.

@Mr Anony:

“Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’ ” -Matthew 7:22-23

New International Version (©1984)
James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, To the twelve tribes scattered among the nations: Greetings. James 1:1

New Living Translation (©2007)
Instead, he gave up his divine privileges; he took the humble position of a slave and was born as a human being. When he appeared in human form, Philippians 2:7

1 I, Paul, am a devoted slave of Jesus Christ on assignment, authorized as an apostle to proclaim God's words and acts. I write this letter to all the Christians in Rome, God's friends Romans 1:1

While Mr Anony is deceiving himself as "son of God", Jesus was wise to take the position of a slave, the very same position we muslims take.

Mr Anony continue in your deceit because you are even less than Paul who says he is a slave of Jesus, who himself is a slave like I am to the same God, you are claiming to be your father.

But Jesus has already answered you in your deceit by telling you that he will tell you to get away from him because he does not know you, you doer of iniquity.

by MacDaddy01: 8:51am
Omnipotence is a self-contradicting phenomena.


Omnipotence = ability to do all things

However, the ability to do all things would also require the ability not to be omnipotent! lipsrsealed

there are people who say God has a son and or God has partners.

God in Islam responds to both in actually the same way, with best clarification each. The answer first: It does not befit the Majesty of God.

Clarification:
a]. If God were to take a son there are better beings [angel for example] than to chose a human son. What is less is not worth of choice over more.
b]. All that are in [heavens, earth, in between and beyond] are individually slave of God. Slave can not be partner.


In view of the above, to respond to the questioner, it is not befitting the Majesty of God to move, lift, carry or conduct duty in manual "labor"..
God conducts His Duty as the Creator by command "Kun" [Be].


What the questioner did not put into account because he is in a hurry to proof the supposed incapability of the Creator is that he has already rendered the rock in the creation category where it belongs. Creator is always The Master of the always subjected creation which the rock will be one of.

The history of Jesus in the quran
www.aimer-jesus.com/e/history_jesus_quran.php - France


. . . . Angels announcing JesusBehold! the angels said: "O Maryam! Allah giveth Thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Al-Masih 'Isa. The son of Maryam, held in honour in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah; [46] "He shall speak to the people in childhood and in maturity. The history of Jesus in the quran


And he shall be (of the company) of the righteous."47 She said: "O my Lord! how shall I have a son when no man hath touched me?" He said: "Even so: Allah createth what He willeth: when He hath decreed a Plan, He but saith to it, `Be', and it is! Quran 3.45 ( Surat Alimran , verse 45.47). . . . .

@MacDaddy01:

by MacDaddy01: 10:49pm On Aug 12
You people are brainwashed to the fullest.

Was Muhammad an illiterate?

Where did Imam Ali learn all these things that are claimed about him;

-numerology
-theology
-law
-poetry
-philosophy


Or are these exaggerations? A warrior and a scholar and a religious man tied all into one.

It is called miracles. That means sign from God. Its a phenomenon. Tell us their professors, if you know any apart from God Who you ignorantly deny.

By the way, you must have to assume that somebody got up one day and took up a pen to write. Who taught that person to pick up a pen and write? If it was not inspiration from God, tell me what inspired the person then and did not inspired him long before?

Use the same thinking cap when you are answering subject matters on Islam. Muhammad [sa] said he was a prophet. It is not a new thing that there be a human prophet.

He had a book of revelation with laws and instructions, etc. Thats not new, either. Your problem is that you have arrogantly wore prideful garment and you dont know how ridiculous you are to others.

Carry go and gerrraaotu from eeeha.

Prominent Northern Muslims elders, represented by Alhaji Usman Faruk, a former military governor of North-West State during the General Yakubu Gowon regime, have dismissed the threats of the leader of the Niger Delta Volunteer Force (NDVF), Mujahideen Dokubo Asari, telling him to go and brush up on his History of Nigeria.

The response came yesterday at the Sultan Bello Mosque in Kaduna wher Faruk, a frequent face at the Sheik Ahmad Gumi’s Ramadan sermon, was asked to speak, from the elders’ perspective, on Asari’s threat to Northern Nigeria.

A source at the event related to SaharaReporters that Alhaji Faruk first commented that the elders had waited to hear whether President Goodluck Jonathan would say something about Asari’s threats to cut off the North and his bragging about the armoury under the NDVF, but that no such response had come.

Of the elders, he then noted that they were the ones that fought the civil war. “We conquered them including their Bayelsa and gained victory, the answer I will give him is he is not the first to fly the kite.”

Faruk said that before the start of the civil war in 1967, his government set Chief Obafemi Awolowo free from prison although it was another government that had put him there.

“Eventually when the war was to start with Biafra, [Awolowo] went to Ibadan and gathered all Yorubas that they should know the war about to commence was between the North and the East, and the Yoruba in the West were not part of it,” he said.

“We received this with shock and the whole Northerners met in Kaduna and we issued them a warning that we heard they (Yoruba) were not part of it and we agreed but we have one demand,” he said.

That condition, according to him was the establishment of a One Mile Corridor. “From Offa which is in our region, from the rail line to the sea (wharf) we declare One Mile Military Corridor, meaning all of them who built houses within One Mile, we will crush down their houses. And nobody will stop our vehicles and vessels from accessing the sea, this we told our Yorubas in Ilorin to tell them. And from that time we never hear them. This is Military Corridor, we of the past hope our children will carry it,” warning that nobody could stop the people of the North, whom he said number 120 million, from accessing the sea.

“If he doesn’t know let Dokubo go and read history,” Faruk said. “Awolowo attempted he failed talk less of one boy.”

He also disputed the Nigeria’s population according to religion, blaming Obasanjo for refusing identification by religious faith in the 2006 census in order to avoid proving that Muslims are populated than the rest. “Today, our population is as Muslims is 120 million and the rest are 50 million,” he said. “Because of this, if census will be conducted again they must be column for religion.”

The two bold indicate that nigerians do not truly see issue of conflicts from religious prism.

From the ethnic point of view this ignorant northern elder had spoken against his own Muslim brother Dokunbo, who if both died, it is incumbered on the one alive between the two to make the islamic prayer on the dead and on the Day of Judgment that they end up in Islamic paradise.

I don't think Faruk will pray that he ends up in the day heaven or so of christian Gowon, though northerner. Arrogance of ignorance i say permeates the ethnic bravado being paraded as religious firmness of people in corridor of influence.

To see this buffoon of northern leader talking like this in public about his muslim brother is unbelievable. Is Islam not one brotherhood, destroying ethnic division and forbids pride?

^^^^ While your own holy spirit as in Another Comforter [look up his duty from your Bible] is an invention. It is supposed to be a prophet, teacher based on test the spirit to see if it is from God.

My own Holy Spirit is Angel Messenger; Gabriel [as]. If I ask you give me the name of your holy spirit [title], you know you will not be able to, because it does not exist.

But if I ask you give me the name of Christ [title], you will quickly say Jesus because you are sure Jesus is the christ.

If I ask you give me the Name of God [title], you will say Ellah from the lips of Jesus, Yahweh [not Yah] from the jews, Jehovah from other guys.

@Bella3:

by Bélla3(f): 7:23pm On Aug 12

Sweetnecta: @Bella3: get for me Jehovah or Yahweh from it. And if you cant, because I w you cant, let me give you Allah from it: "Ya Allahu"


what language is that because thats not arabic? if you think i speak hausa or fulani or gambari or any of the northern nigerian languages, you have to rethink.


the name of his blood parent.


where did i say i am a female? be careful yourself o. the word spouse is used for a wife as well as a husband. i am full blooded male and not female about me, abeg.


@talk2me If i shud describe my God on this thread, it wil take years and years.
So u think it is truth to insult Jesus bt it isnt okay for me to say the truth?

son is always sired and your bible described what the holy ghost will do to Virgin Mary to bring about a baby: He will overshadow her and overpower her. If that was not some se.x when pregnancy was the result, i dont know what else it is.

Luke 1 verse 35: New International Version (©1984)
The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God.

Is the holy spirit not your God anymore and is Jesus not called son of God above brought about as a result of holy spirit connecting with Virgin Mary or its all a child's play and we should not take that verse as it is written? Didnt the holy spirit acted as above?

Dont run away o, woman.

so you mean your holy spirit fornicates? Wow.

the verse above talking a male figure coming up and overshadowing a female figure so that a baby is born from the Bible. Not from the Quran. I am a muslim who subscribes to the Quran. How is my holy spirit, who is Angel Gabriel [as] fornicating here, instead of your holy spirit who is a God in Trinity?

Pls describe the virgin birth in the qur'an for me. If Jesus was concieved by virgin birth, who is his Father?

003.059
YUSUFALI: The similitude of [the creation of] Jesus before Allah is as that of Adam; He created him [Adam] from dust, then said to him [just as He says to conceiving of Jesus later]: "Be". So he was.

HALLELUYAH= YAH means God in Aramic, ask around.

If Yah is God in aramaic, what is the meaning of HALLELU? You see Ellah in there if you reverse it, because Jesus of the cross didn't say Yah, or anything else buy "ELLAH"?

I didnt say 'YA SALAMU GA HARAMU' 4 ur sake i was shocked!

I do not know the meaning of what you said was my point.

Pls, you nt dat important.

I already know that. But you still have to tell me what HALLEU means if Yah means God in HALLEUYAH?

i do think it is necessary for a person to think before speaking out because it may offend the sensibility of others, especially when what is is said is completely baseless and illogical.

As I accept Allah as the proper Name of God, I will not argue that Yahweh and or Jehovah and others could not be His Name as Olorun is to Oluwa in my native language.

Does God have a Proper Name? Yes. Allah is That Very proper Name.

Does God have other descriptive Names? Yes. ArRahman, ArRahim are just 2 obvious from the official list of 99.

Yet there are other like Sultan, etc. Each must be unique and full in its essence.

When Natash came up with his toilet issue among others, I wonder if he does not know that the better people to know the behavior of muslims are the muslims themselves. While it is popular believe that one need to stoop to urinate, it is so to prevent the impurity from contaminating the clothing. in the same line the orientation of the direction of the toilet potty is not to face the direction of prayer. however if it faces it, you as the user can orientate yourself away from the direction or just shut the door, which prevents continuity of the orientation and you are fine.

Islam is not rigid and there are exception to rule and it can be exercised in abnormal condition.