₦airaland Forum

honesttalk21:
Is Aramaic in use anywhere in the world presently?
I may have gone for Syriac but this too is a translation from a Greek text.
Did Jesus speak Greek?

If the glad tidings are not documented do we now say the glad tidings shared/announced by Jesus are documented?
His cousin John the Baptist also spoke tidings? Were these documented specially too?

Yes, Aramaic is in use. Check your history.
1. an ancient language of the Middle East, still spoken in parts of Syria and the Lebanon, belonging to the NW Semitic subfamily of the Afro-Asiatic family.
https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/aramaic
2. Aramaic has persisted into modern times, being spoken in the west in isolated villages of the Anti-Lebanon regions north of Damascus in Syria (by Christians in Ma‘lūla, by Muslims in Jubba’dīn and Bakh'a); and in the east in three areas [by Jacobite Christians in Tur ‘Abdīn, by Jews and Nestorian Christians ("Assyrians" between the Lakes Urmia and Van in Kurdistan and Azerbaijan, by Chaldean Christians in the region about Mosul].
https://www.encyclopedia.com/religion/encyclopedias-almanacs-transcripts-and-maps/aramaic-language

honesttalk21:
Now lets go closer into earlier texts.
According to your Bible:

Genesis 3:22-24
God bid man go out; told him he should no longer occupy and enjoy that garden: but man liked the place, and was unwilling to leave it, therefore God made him go out. This signified the shutting out of him, and all his guilty race, from that communion with God, which was the bliss and glory of paradise. But man was only sent to till the ground out of which he was taken. He was sent to a place of toil, not to a place of torment. Our first parents were shut out from the privileges of their state of innocency, yet they were not left to despair. The way to the tree of life was shut. It was henceforward in vain for him and his to expect righteousness, life, and happiness, by the covenant of works; for the command of that covenant being broken, the curse of it is in full force: we are all undone, if we are judged by that covenant. God revealed this to Adam, not to drive him to despair, but to quicken him to look for life and happiness in the promised Seed, by whom a new and living way into the holiest is laid open for us.


Ezekiel 18:20
The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.

Is the latter a contradiction of the former?

When you dont understand the Scriptures, ask the Christians!
LOL!!
In Gen 3:22-24 God expelled Adam and Eve out of Eden and he prevented them from returning to it
In Ezek 18:20-22 God says (to the children of Adam and Eve outside the Garden of Eden) that
- The persons who commit sins shall die
- The son would not bear the punishment for his fathers sins
- The righteous deeds of a righteous man would be attributed to him
- The wicked deeds of a wicked man would be attributed to him
- If a wicked man turns away from wickedness and live according to Gods status he would not die but live

In Christianity,
Babies go to Paradise
Matthew 19:14
But Jesus said, “Let the children alone, and do not hinder them from coming to Me; for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.”

UNFORTUNATELY
Islam says that Children may go to Hell: for no crime they have committed.
Sahih Muslim (6435 )
'A'isha, the mother of the believers, reported that a child died and I said: There is happiness for this child who is a bird from amongst the birds of Paradise. Thereupon Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: Don't you know that Allah created the Paradise and He created the Hell and He created the dwellers for this (Paradise) and the citizens for this (Hell)?

Sahih Muslim (6436)
'A'isha, the mother of the believers, said that Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) was called to lead the funeral prayer of a child of the Ansar. I said: Allah's Messenger, there is happiness for this child who is a bird from the birds of Paradise for it committed no sin nor has he reached the age when one can commit sin. He said: 'A'isha, per adventure, it may be otherwise, because God created for Paradise those who are fit for it while they were yet in their father's loins and created for Hell those who are to go to Hell. He created them for Hell while they were yet in their father's loins

Can you tell me the reason why a child who committed no sin is made for HELL Fire?
Did he inherit the sin of Adam?

If the Destiny of Allah cannot be changed, how can one be able to repent?

honesttalk21:
But the Quran says in Q7
22. So he lured them with deceit. And when they tasted the tree, their unclothedness became evident to them, and they began covering themselves with the leaves of the Garden. And their Lord called out to them, “Did I not forbid you from this tree, and say to you that Satan is a sworn enemy to you?”

23. They said, “Our Lord, we have done wrong to ourselves. Unless You forgive us, and have mercy on us, we will be among the losers.”

In Q7:35
O Children of Adam! When messengers from among you come to you, relating to you My revelations—whoever practices piety and reforms—upon them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.

Who lured Adam and Eve out of the Islamic paradise?
Was it satan?
If the Destiny of Allah cannot be changed, how can one be able to repent as in Quran 7:35 you quoted?

honesttalk21:
Which Gospels did Waraqa translate? Were this the Gospels of Jesus or the Gospels according to Mark, Matthew, Luke and John who certainly never met Jesus?

We should ask you Muslims this question?
Waraqa never met Jesus too: which Gospel was he translating?

Hafs never met Mohammed, but here you are using his RECITATION as your Quran. Who are you fooling?

Please, Lets call it a day.
If you have any question or rebuttal to the Christian faith, please open a thread for it, I will surely and gladly join you!



The topic for this thread had been:
Who Deleted This Verse From The Perfectly Preserved Quran Of Muhammad?
The verse of ten times breastfeeding and the five times breastfeeding including stonning for adultery are not found in the Quran of hafs: who removed them?

LordReed:
What has this got to do with whether Mary and Jesus are in the Quran?

The fact that Christians, Mary and Jesus are in the Qur'an is in the context of forcing them to Pay the Humiliation Tax (Jizya) to the Muslims!



Quran9:29:
"Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture (Christians and Jews) - [fight] until they give the jizyah (Humiliating Tax) willingly while they are humbled."


What is the Offence of those who do not believe in Allah to Muslims?

Should Muslims follow this command of Allah or ignore it as part of Allah's command to Muslims?

RevenuesBoost:
My husband obviously knew that I had call our doctor.
He jokes usually, I know he meant the exact opposite of what he said.


I asked that question because I want to know peoples' opinion of how they would have reacted to such issue.
Would they have called their doctor or go to church and pray?


You've said your own opinion, it's cool, I'm not judging you, every human is entitled to his or her own choices

It is okay my sister: no offence intended!

I assumed you were asking the question as a "wannabe atheist" on Nairaland.

Shalom!

RevenuesBoost:
Can you see how stupid the statement of your husband is.

Read my write-up again and confirm the word "jokingly"

I saw the word "jokingly" : I reacted because you seem to take the jokingly serious by asking us the relating question


You said:

If you were in my shoe and you needed medical
help, who will you call?
God or Your Doctor?

LordReed:
It will only be surprising if you aren't familiar with the Quran and the fact that Jesus' birth is in it.

Quran9:29:
"Fight those who do not believe in Allah or in the Last Day and who do not consider unlawful what Allah and His Messenger have made unlawful and who do not adopt the religion of truth from those who were given the Scripture (Christians and Jews) - [fight] until they give the jizyah (Humiliating Tax) willingly while they are humbled."


What is the Offence of those who do not believe in Allah to Muslims?

Should Muslims follow this command of Allah or ignore it as part of Allah's command to Muslims?

Pierocash:
Real Muslims, and Islam as a religion don't have any issue with Christians and Christianity as a whole. It is the Nigeria northern Muslims and brand of Islam that is a strange islam. They are violent, intolerant, full of hate towards others.

Northern Muslims brand of Islam is the problem, not the real Islam

The real Islam is the Islam that turns me into ISIS or BokoHaram. Moderate Islam is a watered down Islam suitable for Taqqiya and Modern inclusive living

RevenuesBoost:
I woke up feeling pain in a part of my body.

I complained to my husband, he jokingly told me, go to church and pray. I smiled.
But I gave it deep thoughts.

Do I have to pray to God to take away the pain or I should just call my doctor to prescribe the right medication for me to take to rid me of the pain?🤔

I thought about the realities of life and decided to call my doctor instead.

...

If you were in my shoe and you needed medical
help, who will you call?
God or Your Doctor?

And you think your husband is wise with his statement !?
SMH!

If you need an Architect for your Building design, do you call a Doctor?

If you need a welding job done, do you call a Lecturer?

If you don't have food in your house, do you call the President Tinubu?

Can you see how stupid the statement of your husband is.


If you have a spiritual problem, it makes sense to CALL God: especially if you think that your health problem is spiritually induced.

I conclude that it is either this your post is a Quark or you are as Intelligent as your husband!

honesttalk21:
And hold firmly to the rope of Allah all together and do not become divided. And remember the favor of Allah upon you - when you were enemies and He brought your hearts together and you became, by His favor, brothers. And you were on the edge of a pit of the Fire, and He saved you from it. Thus does Allah make clear to you His verses that you may be guided. [3:103]

You stated perfect man repeatedly.
Perfect man ≠ likeness of a man/appearance of a man

Καὶ μετὰ τὸ παραδοθῆναι τὸν Ἰωάννην ἦλθεν ὁ Ἰησοῦς εἰς τὴν Γαλιλαίαν κηρύσσων εὐαγγέλιον τοῦ Θεοῦ

Did Jibril have the hands of a man, the tongue of man, the spittle of a man, the kidney of a man etc

If Jibril (as a perfect man) was examined, would he look different from an human being?
At that time did he stop being an angel?

honesttalk21:
Tidings=announcement of an event or occurrence not previously made known; a piece of news

When did Aramaic language become Amharic? Amharic is the Ethiopian language my dear, so how did الإنجيل have it's roots in Amharic?

According to Allah, the Good Tidings is the Word bestowed upon Mary is JESUS himself
Quran 3:45
"[And mention] when the angels said, 'O Mary, indeed Allah gives you good tidings of a word from Him, whose name will be the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary - distinguished in this world and the Hereafter and among those brought near [to Allah ].'


Do you now know more than Allah?

honesttalk21:
Is this like town crying? Now you see why maybe the book was not documented. Jesus ministeres for 3.5 years or so? There was no wisdom to document what he was saying due to large resistance from the Jewish leaders? This now becomes a legend thought to be recorded decades to centuries after his apostles have fled from prosecution?
What do you know? A legend is a story that's purported to be historical in nature but that is without substantiation.

Unfortunately for you, if you are correct with this your history, Allah and Mohammed are BOTH in Error!
1. Mohammed says Waraqa used to translate the gospels
2. Allah says the Torah and the Gospel are in our hands.

Which gospel did Allah refer to in his Qur'an : the non existent Gospel (that wasn't written down in the life time of Jesus) or the ficticious Gospel in the hands of the Christians.?

honesttalk21:
The gospel of Jesus Christ is often referred to as "good news" or "tidings" because it brought a message of hope, love, and salvation to humanity. However, the early teachings of Jesus were not recorded in a written form like the gospels that we have today. Instead, they were transmitted orally from one generation to another. This oral tradition allowed Jesus' teachings to be shared and spread widely among his followers, but it also meant that they were subject to potential alterations or omissions over time.

No sir.
If you are correct, then Allah and Mohammed are dead wrong. Do you agree with this?


The Gospel of Jesus Christ is the Message of the Way of Salvation as a free Gift of God.
It is called Good News also because even we Gentiles who were not under the covenant of Abraham are included. The summary of the good news is this: The Messiah has come to Save us from Hell!

Let's call it quit here as you will not answer my questions.

Have a nice day sir!

honesttalk21:
To your highlighted Yellow, what language did Jesus speak and what language did the Israelites to who he was sent to speak?

You can be predict perfectly as you did not answer my highlighted questions in yellow.

Jesus spoke Aramaic and Hebrew.

Can you please tell me how the book of Allah given to Jesus is titled Injeel (from Greek interpolation) and not in Hebrew or Aramaic!
Why!?

honesttalk21:
Get your facts right first did Jibril become a man or appear in the form of a man? Study the arabic and translate.
One who is already confused will not confuse me insha Allah

Quran 19:16-19
وَٱذْكُرْ فِى ٱلْكِتَـٰبِ مَرْيَمَ إِذِ ٱنتَبَذَتْ مِنْ أَهْلِهَا مَكَانًۭا شَرْقِيًّۭا ١٦ فَٱتَّخَذَتْ مِن دُونِهِمْ حِجَابًۭا فَأَرْسَلْنَآ إِلَيْهَا رُوحَنَا فَتَمَثَّلَ لَهَا بَشَرًۭا سَوِيًّۭا ١٧ قَالَتْ إِنِّىٓ أَعُوذُ بِٱلرَّحْمَـٰنِ مِنكَ إِن كُنتَ تَقِيًّۭا ١٨ قَالَ إِنَّمَآ أَنَا۠ رَسُولُ رَبِّكِ لِأَهَبَ لَكِ غُلَـٰمًۭا زَكِيًّۭا ١٩
Quran 19:16-19
16. And make mention of Mary in the Scripture, when she had withdrawn from her people to a chamber looking East, 17. And had chosen seclusion from them. Then We sent unto her Our Spirit and it assumed for her the likeness of a perfect man. 18. She said: Lo! I seek refuge in the Beneficent One from thee, if thou art Allah-fearing. 19. He said: I am only a messenger of thy Lord, that I may bestow on thee a faultless son.


Here is your evidence.
Answer my question!

honesttalk21:
Jesus is said to have met Elijah and Moses who were recognised by Peter although it is not stated how Peter came know them?

Furthermore the Bible or is it Christianity that upholds reincarnation? Isn't Christianity rooted in the belief of a single life, with the ultimate goal being eternal salvation
How come Elijah came again and wasn't recognised?

If you think this was a reincarnation, so be it.

How can you dodge answering my question on this. Elijah was recognised and not recognised at the same time.
Answer my questions!

honesttalk21:
Tawheed, also known as monotheism, is a fundamental belief in Islam. It is the belief in the Oneness of Allah and the acknowledgement that there is no deity worthy of worship except Allah. In the Quran, the concept of Tawheed is emphasized and explained in various verses, highlighting the importance of this belief in the life of a Muslim.

The Quran repeatedly emphasizes the concept of Tawheed, asserting that there is only one God and no partners or associates with Him. For example, in Surah Al-Ikhlas (112:1-4), it states, "Say, He is Allah, the One. Allah, the Eternal Refuge. He begets not, nor was He begotten. And there is none like unto Him."
The concept of the Trinity is a fundamental belief in Christianity that is not explicitly mentioned in the Bible. The term "Trinity" refers to the belief that there is one God who exists in three distinct persons: God the Father, God the Son (Jesus Christ), and God the Holy Spirit. While the word "Trinity" does not appear in the Scriptures, there are numerous passages that suggest the presence of these three entities .
Oneness of Allah is not a suggestion it's specifically and severally stated.

So, Taoheed is neither in the Qur'an nor the Hadiths!?

honesttalk21:
Unfortunately I don't follow any sect but follow the Quran.

Shia and all other Muslims share a common faith.
Their differences stem from their divergent interpretations of Islamic teachings. Majority of the Muslims believe in maintaining the established traditions and practices of the Prophet Muhammad, as well as adhering to the teachings of the Quran.
Shia Muslims acknowledge an additional hierarchy after the Prophet's death, following the leadership of his family, particularly Ali ibn Abi Talib. They differ on the concept of Imamate, which is the idea that leadership of the Muslim community is to be held exclusively by the descendants of the Prophet Muhammad through his daughter, Fatimah, and her husband, Ali which contrasts with the Sunni belief in the concept of Caliphate, where leadership is seen as a collective responsibility and can be held by anyone from the wider Muslim community. This is more of a political difference that Christendom isn't immune from.
Unlike you neither would exactly categorise the other as non muslims but appreciate the difference in their views. You have categorically said Catholics are not Christians and most probably hold same view with Arians that don't believe in a trinity.

See your hypocrisy?
You wanted me to hold the views of the Adrian's but you don't want to suscribe to the Shia! SMH!

Did not Mohammed say you would be divided into 73 sects! Which of the sects are you.

honesttalk21:
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser

Eventually the almighty will fairly judge and non but our individual selves will bare our ends

Very interesting showing. I bid you farewell!

I wish you the best too.

It is the lies of Muslims that is causing all these problems. Your records expose the lies. But, I invite you to the Messiah for the salvation of your soul.

honesttalk21:
2 Corinthians 11:19

Comprendé

The scripture doesn't apply to you or does it?

Unfortunately, it doesn't free you from your quest of fleeing away from the consequence of lies told by Muslims before you. In the Court of law, a Liar is discovered by questioning : this I have done.


You seem to be AVOIDING the Question :

A person can either be literate or illiterate (this has nothing to do whether he is learned in the scripture or not)

Is your prophet Literate or Illiterate ?


Cc:
BroOptimist
hakeemhakeem

hakeemhakeem:
The Quran verses were given to PM on based on occurrence/event or let me say tactical approach given to him to solve a particular problem facing him and his companion.there are verses that go against killing of an insect not to talk of human.

So the Qur'an is not for modern day people as it is no more applicable!?

This is Takiyya Mr hakeemhakeem

BroOptimist:
Can you also give us explanations to these Biblical verses by using Holy Spirit ���

1 " go now and kill the people of Amalekit. Kill men and women, kill infants, young and old. Kill Dog, goats, cats, cows, donkeys camels etc. Don't ever spare anyone of them... " 1 Samuel 15:3.

The aggression of the Amalekites towards the Israelites is mentioned in Exodus 17:8-16, during the time when the Israelites were wandering in the desert. The Amalekites attacked the Israelites, and Joshua led the Israelite army to fight against them. This was the reason for warring against them in the time of the command "an eye for an eye.."

So, what is the Offence of the infidels against you Muslims to warrant execution?

BroOptimist:
2 " A sword is sharpened polished to flash like a lightening and to be put in a hand of a killer" Ezekiel 21:11.

When all you do is copy-paste! SMH!
Prophet Ezekiel was profesying by God's instruction showing the seriousness of the Calamity of judgement coming against Israel because of their sin.
Ezk 21:11

So, this is Israel's judgement and punishment o

BroOptimist:
3 Your Bible reports that Jesus says that " all my enemies that don't want me to reign over them bring them here and slay(kill) them. The book of Luke 19:27.

Did Jesus say this!?
Did you read Luk 19:12!?

Luk 19:11-12:
"And as they heard these things, he added and spoke a parable, because he was near to Jerusalem, and because they thought that the kingdom of God should immediately appear. He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return."



No, you didn't : you only did copy-paste!
SMH!!

BroOptimist:
4 Also, according to your Bible claim to be word of God, Jesus says " don't ever think I brought PEACE to this World, I didn't come to bring PEACE, rather a SWORD". This can be found in the book of Matthew 10:34.
Now, I want you and your likes to use Holy Spirit to explain or Interprete those biblical verses to us.

If you have read the chapter properly, you would have noticed that it is CHRISTIANS that would be killed and imprisoned and tortured by the world and NOT the other way round.

Mat 10:16-18,22:
"Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the middle of wolves: be you therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will whip you in their synagogues; And you shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles. … And you shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endures to the end shall be saved."

The Jinn of mindless copy-paste seem to have possessed you

BroOptimist:
This is just the beginning. The more you people say rubbish about Islam, the more I expose you.
Make unna continue!!!

Now that you have been answered, can you please respond to the OP's question?

By the way,
I have a question for you too on my page.

Is Mohammed literate or Illiterate?

Sheik honesttalk21
You seem to be AVOIDING the Question :

A person can either be literate or illiterate (this has nothing to do whether he is learned in the scripture or not)

Is your prophet Literate or Illiterate ?


Cc:
BroOptimist
hakeemhakeem

honesttalk21:
I am not afraid of your questions and have answered severally.

You are dreadfully afraid of answering my questions: this is exactly why instead of answering them, you ramble about other things that has nothing to do with the questions.

This is why I have to repost the question a thousand times with no response from you: the Questions are highlighted in Yellow for you again


Till tomorrow only Muslims know the Jesus was given the Injeel.
In what language was the Injeel of Jesus revealed in?
Muslims with terrible fabrications


I REPEAT :
Why are you afraid to answer my Questions?

I Challenge you to truthfully Answer these three Questions!
1. Jubril is an Angel who became a perfect man. While Jubril was a man, did he stop being an Angel?
Is this not Duality?

2. Jesus is the Word, the Spirit and the Man. While Jesus was a messanger, did he stop being the Word of Allah or did He stop being the Spirit of Allah?
Is this not Trinity?

3. When Mohammed went to heaven, and he met Abraham, Isaac, Jesus etc. Was this real or a figment of his imagination?
If it was real and it wasn't yet the time of Resurrection, does this not show that these prophets have a physical body (in their graves) and a spiritual body?
Is this not Duality?



DO YOU KNOW WHY YOU WON'T ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS?
The Reason is because
The mantra of Muslims is:
Don't confuse me with the Truth because I have already made up my mind!

honesttalk21:
It is no lie that some form of a Trinitarian belief was already in existence when Muhammad pbuh began prophethood. People are warned against it as well as being warned against all forms of associating any deity as co divine with Allah.
This may be what the Arians are against however Islam further establishes that Allah is not such as to beget his creation.

Your truth my opponent is more confusion more so that you shy away from defining or explaining it in clear terms.

What a lame argument. Why don't you follow the Shia sect of Islam. Is Ali not close to the foundation of Islam enough to take his sect serious?

Using this your argument : Why are you not a Shia Muslim sir

honesttalk21:
Another interesting thing if you will answer?
Is Jesus the only word of God?

In the Bible God is called the WORD!
In that sense, God is the Word by which everything was created.
John 1:1:
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

Do you know ANY other Being in the Universe Man, Jinn or Angel that is the WORD?

honesttalk21:
The formal doctrine of the Trinity was not fully articulated until the 4th century, at the Council of Nicaea in 325 AD. The question then arises isn't this concept of a God trinity simply a man made philosophy?

When was the concept of Taoheed formulated? It is not in your Quran and neither spoken by Mohammed in your Sahih hadiths: do you agree that the concept of Taoheed is man made philosophy ?

honesttalk21:
You say Moses wasn't given the Torah? Oh it's another jumbled up book of the bible.
At least you will ageee he was given the commandments? This is not the Torah?
What does the Tanakh say of the messiah?

Mr know it all that plays around and doesn't say. Are you composed of only your flesh? Have you advanced to the point of transferring souls from one body to another?

Angels descending by Allah's permission is simply a manifestation of his word and them obeying his command.

Your obsession with how Jibril appeared to Mary. He appeared to her in the likeness of a man. Did the Quran say specifically that he became a man or appeared like a man?

Indeed you don't know this difference between an appearance like and what actually is.

The Torah is Five Books.

Can you please tell me how this verse below was given to Moses
Exo 4:28:
"And Moses told Aaron all the words of the LORD who had sent him, and all the signs which he had commanded him."


The Ten commandments is not even up to a quarter of a chapter in the Torah. Is the Torah the Five Books or a chapter written in stone tablets?
Till tomorrow only Muslims know the Jesus was given the Injeel.

In what language was the Injeel of Jesus revealed in?
Muslims with terrible fabrications







Why are you afraid to answer my Questions?

I Challenge you to truthfully Answer these three Questions!
1. Jubril is an Angel who became a perfect man. While Jubril was a man, did he stop being an Angel?
Is this not Duality?

2. Jesus is the Word, the Spirit and the Man. While Jesus was a messanger, did he stop being the Word of Allah or did He stop being the Spirit of Allah?
Is this not Trinity?

3. When Mohammed went to heaven, and he met Abraham, Isaac, Jesus etc. Was this real or a figment of his imagination?
If it was real and it wasn't yet the time of Resurrection, does this not show that these prophets have a physical body (in their graves) and a spiritual body?
Is this not Duality?



DO YOU KNOW WHY YOU WON'T ANSWER THESE QUESTIONS?
The Reason is because
The mantra of Muslims is:
Don't confuse me with the Truth because I have already made up my mind!

honesttalk21:
Q2:87 And We did certainly give Moses the Torah and followed up after him with messengers. And We gave Jesus, the son of Mary, clear proofs and supported him with the Pure Spirit. But is it [not] that every time a messenger came to you, [O Children of Israel], with what your souls did not desire, you were arrogant? And a party [of messengers] you denied and another party you killed.

Was Moses Moses given the Torah?
The Torah is five books of History written by Moses and his secretaries.
So, what is your evidence: the verse you quoted came almost 2000 years after the Torah. The Jews don't even say that their Torah was revealed as it wasn't.

honesttalk21:
Identity who is the Pure spirit in the above verse?

Quran 2:253
We have chosen some of those messengers above others.Allah spoke directly to some, and raised some high in rank. To Jesus, son of Mary, We gave clear proofs and supported him with[b] the holy spirit.[/b]If Allah had willed, succeeding generations would not have fought ˹among themselves˺ after receiving the clear proofs. But they differed—some believed while others disbelieved. Yet if Allah had willed, they would not have fought one another. But Allah does what He wills.
And the Holy Spirit here refers to who?

Quran 97:4
The angels and the Spirit [i.e., Gabriel] descend therein by permission of their Lord for every matter.

You don't know who the spirit is : even Allah doesn't know. If they did, Allah would have told Mohammed that the Spirit is Jibril.

If Jubril is an Angel, explain how how the Angels and the Spirit descended by Allah's permission.
Is this not an error?
By the way, Quran 97:4 did not say the spirit was Jubril. Did it?
This is Muslims adding words to the Qur'an.

honesttalk21:
Did God say his name is Jesus or did Jesus say his name is God?
Doesn't Isaiah 43:10 say But you are my witnesses, O Israel!” says the LORD. “You are my servant. You have been chosen to know me, believe in me, and understand that I alone am God. There is no other God— there never has been, and there never will be?

In your comparison of Jibril a.s to Jesus you choose to ignore the fact that Jibril was never conceived, didn't pass through gestation, get born and grew up eating, drinking etc? Or did he?
Did angels appear to Abraham and Lot? In what form did they appear?
Do you say Jesus is also an angel?

As Jesus is the word is he the same here?
KJV Psalm 147:15
He sendeth forth his commandment upon earth: his word runneth very swiftly

Let's reason together here.

Quran 15:29 And when I have proportioned him and breathed into him of My [created] soul, then fall down to him in prostration

My soul here is who's?

You think your Quran is any proof?
It is only a proof to you not to me.

Why are you afraid to answer my Questions?

I Challenge you to truthfully Answer these three Questions!
1. Jubril is an Angel who became a perfect man. While Jubril was a man, did he stop being an Angel?
Is this not Duality?

2. Jesus is the Word, the Spirit and the Man. While Jesus was a messanger, did he stop being the Word of Allah or did He stop being the Spirit of Allah?
Is this not Trinity?

3. When Mohammed went to heaven, and he met Abraham, Isaac, Jesus etc. Was this real or a figment of his imagination?
If it was real and it wasn't yet the time of Resurrection, does this not show that these prophets have a physical body (in their graves) and a spiritual body?
Is this not Duality?

honesttalk21:
Useless indeed. Did your translations follow and transfer the rules from one language into another?

Have you referred the explanation given on verbs and object the verb acts on the arabic language experts who disagree with explanation?

In Greek haven been translated from Hebrew or Aramaic:

Mark 1:1
Ἀρχὴ τοῦ εὐαγγελίου Ἰησοῦ [a]χριστοῦ.

Mark 1:14
Καὶ μετὰ τὸ παραδοθῆναι τὸν Ἰωάννην ἦλθεν ὁ Ἰησοῦς εἰς τὴν Γαλιλαίαν κηρύσσων τὸ [w]εὐαγγέλιον τοῦ θεοῦ

Another translation in English says:
And after the delivering up of John, Jesus came to Galilee, proclaiming the good news of the reign of God

Or
Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God

Please be articulate with your questions as I don't know what you are saying : as Christians, we don't dodge responding to and answering Questions.

MightySparrow:
Where then did you get your information?
One of many false claims of Islam?

This is exactly why they said that the Jews claimed that Uzaiah/Ezra is the Son of Allah.

Till tomorrow we are still looking for any proof or document in history!

Without LIES , Islam Crumbles!

honesttalk21:
Yes Jibril is of the spirit of Allah. Knowledge of which mankind is only given little. Do you claim that mankind is as a wise God?

If this was true, how come when the Jews asked Mohammed about the Spirit he did not say
"The Spirit is Jibril!"

To burst your lies:
Is Jibril an Angel?
Let's agree that Jibril is a spirit: are all angels spirit?

honesttalk21:
Have you considered the arguments of the Arians? Not saying they are correct although they have been against the promotion of a divine nature of Jesus.

Arianism holds theological position that arose in the fourth century regarding the divinity of Jesus Christ. Arius, the principal figure of this movement, put forth several key arguments against the belief in Jesus as fully divine. Firstly, he emphasized the unity of God and believed in a strict monotheism.
Arius argued that if Jesus was truly divine, it would undermine the oneness of God and introduce a form of polytheism.
Secondly, he claimed that since the Father is unbegotten, Jesus could not have been eternal or co-eternal with God.
Arius believed that Jesus, as the Son, was created by God at a certain point in time and therefore had a beginning.
Lastly, Arius pointed to biblical passages that appeared to portray Jesus as subordinate to God, undermining the idea of his full divinity.

How many times would we Christians tell you that we believe in ONLY ONE God!?
Do you know a single Christian that believe that God is TWO or THREE or MORE?

How many times?


But then, we ask you basic theological questions to teach you the concept of Trinity BUT like a Mule you wouldn't listen.
I Challenge you to truthfully Answer these three Questions!
1. Jubril is an Angel who became a perfect man. While Jubril was a man, did he stop being an Angel?
Is this not Duality?
2. Jesus is the Word, the Spirit and the Man. While Jesus was a messanger, did he stop being the Word of Allah or did He stop being the Spirit of Allah?
Is this not Trinity?
3. When Mohammed went to heaven, and he met Abraham, Isaac, Jesus etc. Was this real or a figment of his imagination?
If it was real and it wasn't yet the time of Resurrection, does this not show that these prophets have a physical body (in their graves) and a spiritual body?
Is this not Duality?


But, you will come out to feign IGNORANCE thinking that such behaviour will sweep the truth under the carpet!?

honesttalk21:
How wrong am I here that you are unable to make a comment? Is this a lie?

As usual you singularly pick words out of a verse, how can this give meaning? We have shown you the fallacy in your previous translation to Quran 9:31 yet you still persist in singular translations?
Do you think Arabic is not a complete language and borrows from everywhere and anywhere like English language?

Any language that cannot be translated into another language is a USELESS language.


Quran 9:31 was perfectly translated from the Arabic. Your problem is that you wish that it would say what you like and not what it says.

Suppose it is we Christians that argue mindlessly by reinterpretation of what is plain with different meanings, what will you say?

If the Quran is plain and simple to understand as according to Allah, then it shouldn't be given a different meaning from what the Arabic says.

honesttalk21:
Quran 3:
45:[And mention] when the angels said, "O Mary, indeed Allah gives you good tidings of a word from Him, whose name will be the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary - distinguished in this world and the Hereafter and among those brought near [to Allah]
46:He will speak to the people in the cradle and in maturity and will be of the righteous.
47:She said, "My Lord, how will I have a child when no man has touched me?" [The angel] said, "Such is Allah ; He creates what He wills. When He decrees a matter, He only says to it, 'Be,' and it is.
48:And He will teach him writing and wisdom and the Torah and the Gospel
49:And [make him] a messenger to the Children of Israel, [who will say], 'Indeed I have come to you with a sign from your Lord in that I design for you from clay [that which is] like the form of a bird, then I breathe into it and it becomes a bird by permission of Allah . And I cure the blind and the leper, and I give life to the dead - by permission of Allah . And I inform you of what you eat and what you store in your houses. Indeed in that is a sign for you, if you are believers
50:And [I have come] confirming what was before me of the Torah and to make lawful for you some of what was forbidden to you. And I have come to you with a sign from your Lord, so fear Allah and obey me.
But when Jesus felt [persistence in] disbelief from them, he said, "Who are my supporters for [the cause of] Allah ?" The disciples said," We are supporters for Allah . We have believed in Allah and testify that we are Muslims [submitting to Him].

Do we replace word with command to get a different meaning or you are like those who persist in disbelief mentioned in the paragraph above?

It is even worse if we replace word with command.

Quran 3:
45:[And mention] when the angels said, "O Mary, indeed Allah gives you good tidings of a word command from Him, whose name will be the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary - distinguished in this world and the Hereafter and among those brought near [to Allah]

Is Jesus the command from God?

If it is, then would you admit that by Jesus Allah created everything?

honesttalk21:
For Christians,the Bible is considered the word of God, containing divine instructions and commandments for humanity to follow. It serves as a guidebook for believers, providing guidance, wisdom, and laws to lead a righteous and fulfilling life. The scriptures, from the Ten Commandments in the Old Testament to Jesus Christ's teachings in the New Testament, guide believers in morality, ethics, and faithful living. By adhering to these commandments, believers learn to love their neighbors, practice forgiveness, show mercy, and seek justice, promoting harmony, compassion, and community.

The Bible also serves as a source of guidance and wisdom, offering practical advice on various topics such as relationships, finances, work, and family. It is viewed as authoritative and unchanging throughout generations, a testament to God's eternal nature and divine plan for humanity. By adhering to the commandments, believers strive to live a life pleasing to God, nurturing love, justice, and compassion within their communities. In conclusion, the Bible serves as a divine roadmap to salvation and fulfillment, providing guidance, moral principles, wisdom, and unchanging authority for believers.

KJV
Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

NKJV
By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible.

NIV
By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.

New Living Translation
By faith we understand that the entire universe was formed at God’s command, that what we now see did not come from anything that can be seen.

In the last two versions you see the word revised as God's command.

I don't understand what you are getting at: is it that God didn't create everything by His word?

AntiChristian:
Even the Bible doesn't know much about Matthew, Mark, Luke and John!



What the bible knows about each of them will not be up to two or three sentences!

BUT
This is the truth: does Allah know about the gospels of Mathew, Mark, Luke and John?

AntiChristian:
Injeel of Course!

If I get you right, Allah gave Jesus a book with the Name Injeel
Is Injeel an Arabic Word or a Hebrew word or Aramaic?

Qur'an 14:4:
"And We did not send any messenger except [speaking] in the language of his people to state clearly for them, and Allah misleads [thereby] whom He wills and guides whom He wills. And He is the Exalted in Might, the Wise."

AntiChristian:
Jesus was sent to the Israelites not me! So i have no business in the Book revealed to him other than to believe it existed and was inspired from the creator!

You need to go back in a time loop to get that info!

So you agree that this is contrary to your make-believe statement saying :

The New Testament you have today does not exist back then as you have it today!

1. If Waraqa translated the Injeel into Arabic, where is your EVIDENCE it is different?
2. Allah and his Mohammed seems to have a contrary opinion to your wishful thinking

Can Islam survive without regularly manufacturing LIES?

MightySparrow:
Haa! So the Quran didn't mention any New Testament apostles?
Mo is the progenitor of Antichristian and the coming antichrist.

The Qur'an doesn't know anything about even Mathew, Mark, Luke and John. Another signature that it is a book of limited Arabian man.

AntiChristian:
Samson was mentioned in the Bible. When he was filled with the Holy Spirit he could tear the mouth of a lion!

But na woman conquer am with all the Holy Spirit!

Who do you expect to be mentioned in the Qur'an from the New Testament?
The New Testament you have today does not exist back then as you have it today!

What is the name of the non existent book given to Jesus by Allah?

Can you state just one verse from it?

What was the gospel Waraqa used to translate into Arabic?

MightySparrow:
Oh , I thought Luqman surah 31, is the biblical Luke. Mo is a fraudster per excellence

Luqman is mentioned in Surah Luqman (Chapter 31) and is presented as a wise and pious figure who provides advice to his son.

I wonder what concerns Allah with Lukman! Stories from everywhere scattered all over the Qur'an in a disjointed manner

DerKlassiker:
We took his word for it and placed the order. A big mistake.

She made the payment on Thursday. The payment was made to 8528492642,
Kizito Oguizu, @Sterling_Bankng. He promised she would receive the package on Friday or Saturday.

After waiting all through Saturday, we decided to check back on Sunday to know why the phone has not been delivered yet.

He complained about the vehicle bringing the phone breaking down somewhere and the need to fix it.

He promised to deliver on Monday or make a refund.

Please go to his bank and report the account showing Evidences. The bank will block the account until he resolves the case.
You can also report to EFCC. They like this kind of case. They will milk him dry

All these because you have ZERO answers to my Questions!?

The QUESTION AGAIN
If Jesus is not a trinity in The Qur'an, can you explain how
1. Jesus is a Human being and Messanger of Allah
2. Jesus is the Spirit of Allah
3. Jesus is the Word of Allah

Note:
A spirit is not a human being and the Word of Allah is not the same as the Spirit of Allah!

honesttalk21:
By the word of the LORD the heavens were made, their starry host by the breath of his mouth. Do you worship the heavens?

BY THE WORD shows how the world was made sir.
It is NOT a Word FROM ...which is what Jesus was!

No matter how you twist it, Mohammed was just copying the Christians

Simple English

honesttalk21:
O People of the Scripture (OP especially), do not commit excess in your religion or say about Allah except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was but [b]a messenger of Allah and His word which He directed to Mary and a soul spirit [created at a command] from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers.[/b]
Christians love to mis-represent the phrase Ruhullah and consider it to deify Jesus pbuh

Is it TRUE that "Arabic Ruhullah" translates to "رُوحُ الله" which means "Spirit of God" in English and NOT Spirit FROM God?


Is it TRUE that "Arabic Kalimullah" translates to "كلمة الله" which means "Word of God" in English and NOT Word From God?

Why do you find it so convenient inserting words into the Qur'an Allah didn't say?

It is actually you Muslims that love to misrepresent words

honesttalk21:
Q3:45
(And remember) when the angels said: “O Maryam! Verily, Allah gives you the glad tidings of a Word from Him, whose name ‘Isa Masih (Jesus Messiah), the son of Maryam, held in honor in this world and in the Hereafter, and one of those brought near to Allâh.”

The conveyed word of Allah is the Good Tiding, AND Jesus is the name of this WORD from Allah!

Allah says:
1. I am sending a good news
What is the Good News
A WORD from Allah
What is the name of the Word?
Isa Masih (Jesus Messiah), the son of Maryam

Even if you don't like it, it is the black and white word of Allah in the Qur'an.

It's too clear no matter how you wish to twist it sir

honesttalk21:
Verily, the likeness of ‘Iesa (Jesus) before Allah is the likeness of Adam. He created him from dust, then (He) said to him: “Be!” – and he was.

Was Adam human or God? He is the first messanger of Allah to mankind as the offspring born of him. Adam was moulded and Allah gave him of his spirit saying be and he came alive.

According to Allah, Was Jesus created by BE?

Is Breathing into the private part of Mary the same as BE?

honesttalk21:
Q19:16. And mention in the Scripture Mary, when she withdrew from her people to an eastern location.

17. She screened herself away from them, and We sent to her Our spirit (رُوحَنَا/ angel Jibril) , and He appeared to her as an immaculate human.

18. She said, “I take refuge from you in the Most Merciful, should you be righteous.”

19. He said, “I am only the messenger of your Lord, to give you the gift of a pure son.”

20. She said, “How can I have a son, when no man has touched me, and I was never unchaste?

21. He said, “Thus said your Lord, `It is easy for Me, and We will make him a sign for humanity, and a mercy from Us. It is a matter already decided.
Q36:82
Verily, His command, when He intends a thing, is only that He says to it, “Be!”– and it is!)
The saying of Allah is his word or not?

Isa a.s in defence of his mother says:
Quran 19:
30. He said, “I am the servant of God. He has given me the Scripture, and made me a prophet.
(Is this not a statement of being a messenger)
31. And has made me blessed wherever I may be; and has enjoined on me prayer and charity, so long as I live.

Was Jesus given a book?
What is the name of the book of Jesus?

Allah says we sent to Mary our Spirit , Is the Spirit of Allah Jubril?
What is Allah's spirit?

Please be careful in answering these questions o!

Naijaboy18:
Christianity is idolatry that’s why your more worried about criticizing the messenger than the message

1. You Muslims kiss the Black stone

2. You Muslims hope for the Intercession of the Black stone

3. The Muslims pray facing the black stone.

Tell me if this is not Idolatry!










Why couldn't you answer my Questions?
Using your argument about Trinity , are you saying that the concept of TAOHEED too does NOT exist in the Qur'an!
If the concept of Taoheed exist in the Qur'an, then the concept of Duality and Trinity exist in the Quran.


1. You agree that Jubril was still an Angel while he was a perfect man visiting Mary.

This is Duality my friend.
Jubril was both Man and Angel at the same time.

Of course, only God can do this simple miracle. LOL!

2. You agree that Jesus is the Word of Allah, the Spirit of Allah and a Human messanger all at the same time.

This is Trinity my friend.
Except you can prove that the spirit and word of Allah is exactly the same thing. And also that a Human being can be the Spirit of Allah!

Jesus was the Word, the Spirit and the Human messanger at the same time.

Of course, only God can do this simple miracle. LOL!

3. Let me ask you another question.
When Mohammed went to the seven heavens and met with Adam, Moses, Jesus, Jacob etc.
a. Did he truly see them or it was a figment of his imagination
b. If Mohammed saw them, did it mean that these prophets body resurected to heaven?

If these prophets were not yet resurected, doesn't it mean they have two simultaneous existence : one in the grave (their bodies) and one in paradise?


Is this not Duality?

AntiChristian:
I have told you that he was unlettered! So fill in the gaps!

The question wasn't about whether Mohammed was a scholar (learned in the scriptures) or not: the question was whether Mohammed was Illiterate or Literate.

A person can only be one of the two: either Literate or Illiterate.
Why is the Question difficult to answer truthfully?
What are you afraid of?

AntiChristian:
The hadith above is unclear! 'Ali was the fourth Caliph after the Prophet died, so how did he die and the Prophet was still alive? This must have been remixed in the Bible through the Holy Spirit! Reframe the lie

You didnt even check the reference whether it was true or not!? SMH!
I truncated the long hadith so that it wouldn't be a boring read.

Let me help you out:
1. `Abdullah bin Shaddad came to Aisha AFTER Ali was murdered by you Muslims
2. Aisha Asked Abdullah the Question about the number of the people whom ‘Ali killed
3. The report was about what Ali did while he was Alive with the Mohammed
4. The event reported was when the peace deal was made between Mohammed and the Quraish people
4. As part of the deal, Mohammed WROTE:
`In the Name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.`
Let me quote the whole hadith for you

Musnad Ahmad 656
It was narrated that `Ubaidullah bin ‘Iyad bin `Amr al-Qari said:
`Abdullah bin Shaddad came and entered upon `A`ishah when we were sitting with her, as he was returning from Iraq during the time when ‘Ali was murdered. She said to him: O `Abdullah bin Shaddad, will you tell me the truth about what I am going to ask you? Tell me about these people whom ‘Ali killed. He said: Why shouldn't I tell you the truth? She said: Tell me about them. He said: When `Ali corresponded with Mu`awiyah and the two arbitrators gave their verdict, eight thousand of the pious rebelled against him and camped in a land called Haroora`, near Koofah. They criticised him and said: You have taken off a chemise that Allah caused you to wear and a title that Allah gave to you, then you went ahead and asked people to issue a decree concerning the religion of Allah. There is no ruling except the ruling of Allah, may He be exalted. When `Ali heard about their criticism of him and the reason why they had split from him, he told his caller not to admit anyone but those who had memorised the Qur`an. When the house was filled with people who had memorised the Qur`an, he called for a large Mushaf and put it front of him, and he started tapping it with his hand, saying: O Mushaf, tell the people. The people called out: O Ameer al-Mu`mineen, how could you ask it? It is only ink and paper, but we could speak on the basis of what we understand from it. What do you want? He said: These companions of yours who rebelled, between me and them is the Book of Allah, and Allah says in His Book concerning a woman and a man: `If you fear a breach between them twain (the man and his wife), appoint (two) arbitrators, one from his family and the other from hers; if they both wish for peace, Allah will cause their reconciliation.` [an-Nisa 4:35]. The ummah of Muhammad is more important with regard to life and sanctity than a woman and a man. They got angry with me when I wrote a document between me and Mu`awiyah and wrote `Ali bin Abi Talib [without adding the title Ameer al-Mu`mineen]. But Suhail bin `Amr came to us when we were with the Messenger of Allah at al-Hudaibiyah, when he made a peace deal with Quraish, and the Messenger of Allah wrote, `In the Name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.` Suhail said: Do not write, In the Name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful. He said: What should we write? He said: Write: `In Your Name, O Allah.” The Messenger of Allah said: Write `Muhammad the Messenger of Allah .` He [Suhail] said: If I knew that you were the Messenger of Allah (ﷺ), I would not have opposed you. So he wrote: This is what was agreed by Muhammad bin `Abdullah with Quraish. And Allah says in His Book: “Indeed in the Messenger of Allah (Muhammad) you have a good example to follow for him who hopes for (the Meeting with) Allah and the Last Day` [Al-Ahzab 33:21]. So `Ali sent `Abdullah bin `Abbas to them and I went out with him until we reached the middle of their camp. Ibnul-Kawwa` stood up and addressed the people, saying: O bearers of the Qur`an, this is `Abdullah bin `Abbas . Whoever does not know him, I know of the Book of Allah what can tell you about him, He is one of those concerning whom the words `they are a quarrelsome people` [Az-Zukhruf 43:58] were revealed. Tell him to go back to the one who sent him and do not discuss the Book of Allah with him. Their spokesmen stood up and said: By Allah, we will discuss the Book of Allah. If he says something sound and true that we recognise we will follow him, and if he says something false we will reject his false argument. So they discussed the Book with ‘Abdullah for three days, and four thousand of them recanted and all of them repented, including Ibnul-Kawwa`. He took them to `Ali in Koofah, and `Ali sent word to the rest of them, saying: You know the turmoil between us and our opponents. Stay wherever you wish until the ummah of Muhammad is united. The deal between us and you is that you should not shed any blood that it is forbidden to shed or commit acts of banditry on the roads or do wrong to any Non Muslim under Muslim protection. If you do that, we will declare war, for Allah does not love those who betray. `A`ishah said: O Ibn Shaddad, did he kill them? He said: By Allah, no sooner had he sent this message to them but they committed acts of banditry, shed blood and regarded it as permissible to harm Ahludh-Dhimmah (non-Muslims living under Muslim protection). She said: Do you swear by Allah? He said: I swear by Allah besides Whom there is no other god that this is what happened. She said: I have heard that the people of Iraq are talking and saying dhuth-thuda, dhuth-thuda [i.e., the one with a deformed arm that looks like a breast]. He said: I saw him and I was with ‘Ali (رضي الله عنه) when he was examining the slain. He called the people and said: Do you know this one? How many of them came and said: I saw him praying in the mosque of Banu So and so, and I saw him praying in the mosque of Banu So and so. And there was no proof of who he was except that. She said: What did `Ali say when he stood over him, as the people of Iraq claim? He said: I heard him say: Allah and His Messenger spoke the truth. She said: Did you hear him say anything other than that? He said: No, by Allah. She said: Yes, Allah and His Messenger spoke the truth. May Allah have mercy on `Ali : it was his habit, if he saw something he liked, to say: Allah and His Messenger spoke the truth. But the people of Iraq fabricated lies against him and added words to what he said.

So, the report was when Ali was Alive with your prophet at the treaty with the Quraysh people.

and the Messenger of Allah wrote, `In the Name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.`

AntiChristian:
He wanted to write? What did he wanted to write, Letters or symbols? This is not an evidence at all?

Muhammad couldn't read or write BUT he REQUESTED for a pen with which to write (not dictate) for them!

Sahih Muslim 1637 c
Ibn Abbas reported:
When Allah's Messenger was about to leave this world, there were persons (around him) in his house, 'Umar b. al-Kbattab being one of them. Allah's Apostle said: Come, I may write for you a document; you would not go astray after that. Thereupon Umar said: Verily Allah's Messenger is deeply afflicted with pain. You have the Qur'an with you. The Book of Allah is sufficient for us. Those who were present in the house differed. Some of them said: Bring him (the writing material) so that Allah's Messenger may write a document for you and you would never go astray after him And some among them said what 'Umar had (already) said. When they indulged in nonsense and began to dispute in the presence of Allah's Messenger, he said: Get up (and go away) 'Ubaidullah said: Ibn Abbas used to say: There was a heavy loss, indeed a heavy loss, that, due to their dispute and noise. Allah's Messenger could not write (or dictate) the document for them.


Musnad Ahmad 656 showed exactly what Mohammed wrote!
and the Messenger of Allah wrote, `In the Name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.`

Sahih Muslim 1637 c showed that Mohammed was known by his companions as able to write.
Allah's Apostle said: Come, I may write for you a document; you would not go astray after that.


When two different hadiths converge on an issue, you can as well trust them.
The first hadith above is VERY clear!


It looks like you are promoting the idea of partial literacy!
Unfortunately, the second hadith nullifies such a notion.

AntiChristian:
Hadith does not contradict the Qur'an!

There is NOT a single place where Allah spoke of the Bridge of Sirat in the Quran: if this is untrue, the floor is yours.

The Hadith goes against the Quran. The Quean says you SHALL enter Hell Fire!

AntiChristian:
The last one you quoted read "....brought to the Hell fire.." How is this "unanimous"? Is "brought to" a place the same as "entering" it?

Please, from
Quran 19:72 -
Then We will save those who feared Allah AND leave the wrongdoers within it, on their knees."
If the wrongdoers would be LEFT inside Hell,
Please from where will Allah save those who feared him?

From within the fire! It is simple grammar.

AntiChristian:
Abeg enough of all this nonsense biblical Holy Spirit exegesis. We Muslims are passing over (a bridge on) Hell! This is what is meant by verse 71! Non-Muslims won't be involved in this as they are going directly in to hell!

Unfortunately Allah never made any bridge over the fire.
I have shown you categorically and clearly.
Quran 19:72 -
Then We will save those who feared Allah and leave the wrongdoers within it, on their knees."

Will the evil doers also be ON the Bridge of Sirat?

1. The word THEN (means "After that.." ).
Do you think it means After Muslims have passed over hell or passed by hell? Or after Muslims are in Hell

Don't fool yourself, the word of Allah is very clear in the Quran and your tafsirs agree with it. There is NO bridge anywhere

AntiChristian:
The siraat is a bridge that will be set up over Hell; it is narrower than a hair and sharper than a sword. People will pass over it according to their deeds. Whoever used to hasten to do good deeds in this world will pass quickly over the siraat; whoever was slow to do good deeds and whoever used to mix righteous deeds with bad deeds, and his bad deeds were not forgiven by Allah, may slip into the Fire; may Allah protect us.

People will vary in the ways in which they pass over the siraat. Some will pass in the blink of an eye, some will pass like lightning, some will pass like the wind, some will pass like swift horses, some will pass like fast camels, some will walk, some will crawl, and some will be thrown into Hell. No one will pass over this siraat except the believers only. As for the disbelievers, they will not pass over it, because on the Day of Resurrection they will be driven directly to Hell.

If Muslims will pass over the fire, why does verse 72 say:
Then we will save those who fear Allah!
Allah will Save them from what? : From the bridge?
And the evildoers too would be left on the bridge!?

There is NO bridge Anywhere my brother: it is an invention to dilute the fact that you will enter the fire!

AntiChristian:
Hell is not a simple place like the bridge close to your house? It is complicated. You should read how people will pass over it above!

If Allah had spoken about the bridge, you may have at least a fighting chance but NO!
There isn't any bridge.

AntiChristian:
The unbelievers will be lead to hell where they'll abide therein forever before the believers are brought to it!

This is indicated by the report narrated by al-Bukhaari (6573) and Muslim (182) from Abu Hurayrah, who said: Some people said to the Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him): O Messenger of Allah, will we see our Lord on the Day of Resurrection? The Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “Do you have any trouble seeing the sun when there are no clouds in front of it?” They said: No, O Messenger of Allah. He said: “Do you have any trouble seeing the moon on the night when it is full and there are no clouds in front of it?” They said: No, O Messenger of Allah. He said: “Similarly you will see Him on the Day of Resurrection. Allah will gather all the people and will say: ‘Whoever used to worship anything, let him follow it.’ So those who used to worship the sun [will follow the sun], those who used to worship the moon [will follow the moon], and those who used to worship false gods [will follow the false gods]. There will remain this ummah, including its hypocrites. Then Allah [may He be blessed and exalted] will come in a form other than the form which they know, and He will say, ‘I am your Lord.’ They will say: ‘We seek refuge in Allah from you. We will stay here until our Lord comes, and when our Lord comes, we will recognize Him.’ Then Allah will come to them in the form which they know, and will say, ‘I am your Lord.’ They will say, ‘You are our Lord,’ and they will follow Him. Then a bridge will be set up over Hell.” The Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “And I and my ummah will be the first ones to cross it, and the prayer of the Messengers on that Day will be: ‘O Allah, grant safety, grant safety!’ On it there will be hooks like the thorns of as-sa‘daan (a thorny tree); have you seen the thorns of as-sa‘daan?” They said: Yes, O Messenger of Allah. He said: “They are like the thorns of as-sa‘daan, except that no one knows how big they are except Allah. They will snatch the people according to their deeds. Some of them will be doomed because of their deeds, and some will be cut [by those thorns] then they will be saved.”

Al-Bukhaari (7439) and Muslim (183) narrated that Abu Sa‘eed al-Khudri said: We said: O Messenger of Allah, will we see our Lord on the Day of Resurrection? The Messenger of Allah (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) said: “Do you have any trouble seeing the sun or the moon when there are no clouds?” We said: No. He said: “Then surely you will not have any trouble seeing your Lord, may He be blessed and exalted, on that Day, just as you have no trouble seeing either of them.” Then he said: “A caller will announce: ‘Let every people follow that which they used to worship,’ then those who worshipped the cross will go with their cross, and those who worshipped idols will go with their idols, and those who worshipped any [false] gods will go with their gods, until there will be left those who used to worship Allah, righteous and evildoers alike, and the remnants of the people of the Book. Then Hell will be brought, and will be shown as if it is a mirage. It will be said to the Jews: ‘What did you worship?’ They will say: ‘We used to worship ‘Uzayr the son of God.’ It will be said to them: ‘You are lying, for Allah has neither wife nor son. What do you want?’ They will say: ‘We want You to give us to drink.’ It will be said: ‘Drink,’ and they will fall into Hell. Then it will be said to the Christians: ‘What did you worship?’ They will say: ‘We used to worship the Messiah, the son of God.’ It will be said to them: ‘You are lying, for Allah has neither wife nor son. What do you want?’ They will say: ‘We want You to give us to drink.’ It will be said: ‘Drink,’ and they will fall into Hell. And then there will be no one left except those who worshipped Allah, righteous and evildoers alike. It will be said to them: ‘What are you waiting for? All the people have gone.’ They will say: ‘We kept ourselves away from them and now we are the most in need of Him, for we heard a caller calling out, Let every people follow that which they used to worship. We are waiting for our Lord.” Then al-Jabbaar [the Compeller] will come to them in a form other than the form in which they saw Him on the first occasion, and will say: ‘I am your Lord.’ They will say: ‘You are our Lord.’ No one will speak to Him except the Prophets, and He will say: ‘Is there any sign between Him and you by which you will recognize Him?’ They will say, ‘The Shin.’ So He will lay bare His Shin, and every believer will prostrate to Him, whereas everyone who used to prostrate to Allah by way of showing off will try to prostrate, but his back will become solid. Then the bridge will be brought and set up over Hell.” We said: O Messenger of Allah, what is the bridge? He said: “A slippery place, in which there are hooks and spikes and thorns, like those in Najd that are called as-sa‘daan. The believer will cross like the blink of an eye, like lightning, like the wind, like the swiftest horses and camels. Some will cross safe and sound, some will be scratched then let go, and some will be piled up in the Fire of Hell, until the last of them crosses it by crawling…”

No amount of wishfull thinking will change the fact that there is no single bridge over hell: it is a FABRICATION

Leaving the Unbelievers AFTER Allah has removed you Muslims is the last straw that nails this.

Muslims ALL without exception enter the Fire of Hell at least for a Duration.
What if this was A GRAND deception and the Duration become ETERNITY!

There is no bridge sir, Jesus said: those worthy of Hell would be THROWN into it

Mark 9:47
And if your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into hell,

Rev 20:15
Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.



AntiChristian, you are warned o!
Once you enter hell, there is no coming out of it o: don't say I didn't warn you