₦airaland Forum

Eko Ile:
texazzpete, I don't have time for you and your silly and meaningless conmess nonsense. I've trashed your lies and that crap before. It's pointless.

it's okay, bro. We all know how you evade logical discussion by whining about 'lies' and 'crap'.
I don't hold it against you. We all have to make a living, don't we? What you lack in intelligence, you certainly make up for it in persistence and sheer nuisance value. Your paymasters/puppetmasters in the Lagos State Government will be reasonably pleased with your service.

Tunmi:
And this amount is per month! Hmm, just how much is medical school? I still love that Fashola is talking with these people and not just sacking them outright. He's a lot more cool-headed than Tinubu, that's for sure.
Thanks for the info Eko Ile.[/b][/color][/size]

Note that this amount is before tax and should not be taken as gospel truth (apparently the taxes being paid are also a point of contention between the Lagos State Government and the doctors).
it's also worth noting that the so-called 'junior doctors' have spent 6 years in University + one year in Housemanship. That's a total of 7 years.
For people who spend 7 years studying an intensive course and then work in a challenging environment like Lagos state, how the heck can you call a take home salary of around 120K (after taxes) 'greedy'?.

Just for the record, Lagos State doctors are some of the most overworked doctors in Nigeria. it is said that some doctors see up to 60 patients daily.

So much ignorance in this thread!

The doctors are asking for the same salary scale (CONMESS) as their counterparts employed by the Federal Government. The Federal Government that approved it, is it composed of aliens?
Ekiti State, Osun State and many other states pay their State doctors on the same scale as the Federal Government doctors. But no, rich Lagos state will not do so.

I can only pity those of you who are siding with the likes of Tinubu. Of course he cares nothing for the plight of the doctors. Do you think he or any of his family members will be caught dead in a state hospital?

Eko Ile goes about painting a picture of doctors greedily asking for more money and going on strikes even after salary increase. But all the doctors have asked for is to be paid on the same scale as their counterparts in LUTH. They played very prominent roles in getting the Federal Government to sign the CONMESS salary scale only to be frozen out of the promised land by their 'working Governor'.

Very Nice of Tinubu to confirm that he calls the shots in Lagos, though

vinmol:
@texazzpete  he needs the extra 5 billion to Laminate not give permanent cards!

read it write up very well, i have laminated mine a lot of people have done same so wats he talking about?

thief!

kalokalo:
It is only in Nigeria that procuring goods on a very large scale increases the unit cost by over 400%. I have laminated a single ID card before at N20 but INEC / Jega wants to laminate 80 million voters cards at approx N73 per unit Where is the bulk discount or economy of scale?



Bloody Criminal Thieves!!

I have posted three links that show that Sun's reporting was wrong; the money is meant for printing the permanent voters card and not for lamination. I posted this TWICE!!
what the hell is wrong with you people? Can't you read?

oyb:
dude, it SHOULD have been captured in the original scope

you and i are engineers, and we know the ned to ensure EVERYTHING IS CAPTURED in a project from conception

as it is, i'm sure jega will still have more requests in the not so distant future. . .



i don;t think you are on any inside track, i think you're sympathetic to jega in large part because you're from an academic background, and you see him as one of the more competent members of the ivory towers.

but in this case, the man is not performing.

Even if it were covered in the original scope, would it have made a difference? This is an incremental cost. If Jega had spent half of what he spent in the registration process (say, 40 billion Naira) would that have realistically reduced the cost of printing the permanent voters card? What's the difference between 5 billion then and now?

Also there's a flaw in your logic; the permanent voters card is exactly what the name implies. A permanent card to replace the temporary one issued during the registration process. So how was Jega supposed to accurately estimate the number of people who would come out to register so as to know how many permanent cards he'd print? What if he had made a budget for 50 million permanent cards then, would you have been amenable to him requesting for additional money?

Waiting for the numbers to come in before making the cost estimate was the wise option to pursue IMHO.

monkeyleg:
Can either of you tell us if the whole thing has been a success, and if you accept it is not, why should we not critisize or ask very serious questions, after all that is what would be done in progresssive societies, and dont forget that Nigeria has a reputation of being one of the most corrupt countries in this world.

67 million Nigerians registered. It's been expensive, but yes, it's been largely successful. You paint this as a monumental failure but I hardly think that being very expensive marks this as a failure.
You have a right to criticize and ask serious questions, but i expect you to know that some of your comments can easily be construed as defamation of character. My honest opinion.
Jega was tasked to register eligible Nigerians. He did so at a huge cost (which he went to some length to explain away). Does that make the whole exercise 'rubbish'?

monkeyleg:
£400 Million for voters registeration (The most expensive), and all we get is some cheap card, and a begging bowl? Nigerians are in ther right to demand and ask serious questions

Cheap card? Please clarify.

monkeyleg:
Where did I call him a Thief? I am questioning the whole process, and if I have reason to believe things arent straight, I will say so.

Please stop holding brief, for people when you have no evidence to suggest that all is well.

Jega has been a disaster, and that is the truth, the sooner Nigerians (Including you and I ) start learning to face up to the truth, the better for everyone. This whole administration has been careless with our money, and I will talk.

In your own words

This is plain fraud.

I will be verhimently suggesting at some stage that Jega steps down and a proper audit is done. Nigerians have been duped once again

This is just fraud, another avenue to fleece dry the already Mugu Nigerian public

Kobojunkie:
^^^ Dude, it is just my observation. I just feel relieved that someone else noticed it.

Please stop making excuses for INEC . . . let those WHO KNOW MORE OF WHAT IS GOING ON provide answers to the people on this. STOP telling people what they can or cannot ask for.

You don't have to join the bandwagon . . . . heck, I myself HAVE NEVER SAID ANYTHING OF JEGA being corrupt, but in YOUR BLINDNESS you have OVER AND OVER NOW, accused me of believing him corrupt, yet never really answering any of my concerns . . . . does that remind you anything of the tactic used by our known nairaland attack dogs   


You don't need to join the bandwagon, I HAVEN't. BUT that don't mean you need to make yourself DEFENDER OF JEGA even when it is clear you know nothing of what is going on.

For pete's sake, this has been the most expensive Voter's registration exercise so far, and the numbers are still climbing.

I can't recall making that accusation. if i did, then i apologize. My comment was directed at the people who have made the 'corrupt' accusation here including the hilarious fellow who talked about shooting Jega.

I have admitted that Jega leaves himself open to accusations of incompetence. And that may well be true. You can be a competent Vice Chancellor but an incompetent INEC chairman. I have put more effort into defending the man from knee-jerk accusations of theft.
It isn't fair to say i know nothing of what is going on, We are discussing a particular topic concerning Jega's presentation to the Nigerian Senate. The information is in the public domain. Details of the first budget from last year should also be in the public domain too. I've worked with what data is available to any ordinary citizen out there and if i come to a different conclusion from others, should i not share it?

I have agree multiple times that this has been very expensive. But so far it is not looking like a failure. With appropriate data post-processing, this data collected could be worth its weight in gold, especially if it is used to revolutionize law enforcement in Nigeria.

In summary, I am not glossing over the negatives, but i am also not glossing over the positives. The ultimate aim is to provide reasonably free and fair elections in April. If INEC fails at this, I swear i will be the first to call for Jega's head.

monkeyleg:
Exactly my point

Your point?!
Oyb never called him a thief. You did.

monkeyleg:
@Tezzapete,

I am not going to bother reading your post, I am sick and tired of people like you, who rather than face the truth are prepared to defend the indefencible
This whole things has been an expensive sham, and Nigerians must not accept it.

let me be the first to say it, Jega and his boys have been a monumental failure, and I doubt we are likely to have good outcome come April.

Translation:
Texazzpete, I don't care what you say. Jega is a thief and a fraud. I am tired of Nigerians like you that will not join the smear campaign.
*sticks tongue out*

monkeyleg:
@Tezzaspete,
Neither do you have evidence to suggest Jega did not take from the university coffers, so stop passing that one off, it wont wash

LMAO!!!!!!
What happened to 'innocent until proven guilty'? So if you have no proof that someone didn't steal, it means the person stole abi?
Goddammit, man! You're supposed to be educated. You sound educated. How can you justify this kind of logic?

PS: Remember when Jega was appointed to that role?
http://www.nigerianbestforum.com/blog/?p=50242
The NBA, ASUU, PDP, ANPP, ACF, CLO, the Save Nigeria Group and many more hailed his appointment, praising him as a 'good' man. So you may call him incompetent or a poor planner. But you may not call him a thief without any proof.

Kobojunkie:
If anyone's been knee-jerking, it's been you. Quick to deny issues ONLY for you to then pretend they were non-issues in the first place. 

By the way, I didn't say you quoted any 'inside line either'. You may be reading someone else's script there.

I am sorry that my OBSERVATION, especially of your defense of Jega, HURTS YOUR FEELINGS but the fact is, you have been ON THE DEFENSE for quite sometime now. See, I am not the only one here who noticed.

What other interpretation could there be for 'The tone is now more of that of an INSIDE man now'? or 'someone in the "know", like @beaf and @babapupa'?

I've slammed INEC earlier for the high costs of the DDC machines, for the choice of zinox and the chinese as suppliers.
Even in this same topic I said this

texazzpete:
I also agree that Jega is making himself look bad by these repeated requests for money. All these should have been built in in the first budget. We'd have screamed bloody murder at first, but we'd have long forgotten it by now.
It's truly a pity. I may not join the bandwagon of those who claim Jega is corrupt, but he isn't painting himself as a competent planner and organizer at all.

Please look at the part in bold and tell me if those are the words of someone paid by INEC.

So many posts in this topic and yet so few sitting down to logically dispute my opinions. I've posted reports that this sum is for the permanent cards to be printed later in the year and all other subsequent posters have glossed over them, preferring to make grave allegations of fraud without any proof.

oyb:
the issue is either honesty or competence

you and i know - if one is running a  project , submits a budget and before the project is half way gone returns to ask more more funds more than once  , one would have ones competence called into question by his bosses.

*sigh*
As i've said before, the budget jega submitted before was for the voters registration exercise.

The 5 billion Naira required now is for printing the permanent voters card AFTER the April elections, much later in the year.
Check the links i earlier posted. While the OP insinuates that this sum is for laminating the cards already in our possession, these indicate that its for the permanent cards to be printed by INEC and redistributed.

http://dailytrust.dailytrust.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=12629:permanent-voters-card-project-suffers-set-back&catid=1:news&Itemid=2
http://allafrica.com/stories/201102230402.html
http://thewillnigeria.com/general/7615-Jega-Cautions-Senate-For-Slashing-INECs-Budget.html

If you remember, INEC told Nigerians a while ago that the card we received was a temporary card. This 5 billion is for the permanent card to be printed later. I assume he's asking for it now because it has to be included in his 2011 budget.

Kobojunkie:
Time and time again . . . . you almost get the sense the dude has been contacted and is working for a team now . . . . lol

The tone is now more of that of an INSIDE man now . . .  someone in the "know", like @beaf and @babapupa . . . . lol

This is insulting and very offensive.
I stood on a line to register for over EIGHT hours (5 am to 1:30 pm) just to register near my house to vote. I did not come here complaining because unlike you i try to understand.
I have not quoted any 'inside' line. I have not posted anything that is not available via a simple Google search. I have thought about all the issues, read through some other reports concerning his 5 billion naira request and presented my opinion here. All i have discussed was the unit cost of the permanent voters card and my reluctance to entertain knee-jerk accusations of fraud and corruption against Jega.

I have never been anyone's mouthpiece on Nairaland. I have no plans to start now, sorry.

Stancee:
An Igbo Proverb says, "He who climbs an iroko tree should fetch more firewood because people dont climb Iroko tree always" That is what Jega is doing. He is cutting his own cake NOW because he dont know what the next day will hold

Dude, he was a Vice Chancellor. He climbed an Iroko tree then and didn't steal. Proverb fail.

Sometimes I wonder how many of you are Nigerians. Do you know how many tens of millions of Naira ordinary bursars steal, not to talk of Vice Chancellors?
If he didn't steal then, why would he steal now?

Given his past antecedents, is it too much to ask for 'Innocent until proven guilty'?

monkeyleg:
No Texazzpete, there is absoultely nothing wrong with my attitude for not taking rubbish. Maybe if Nigerians had taken such a stand long time ago, we may not be in the mess we currently are. I really dont give a sheet about what money is for, and hence your analysis, my point remains, that Jega and the bunch of clueless idiots have shown theye do not know what they are doing. there is no sane person who would accept the voters registerations process as it stands as a success. i like being critical where there is a need to be. And I have far past the stage where I am prepared to accept wanton unchalleneged theft from anyone. This whole process stinks, probably you are the only one who doesnt see it.

As I said some post above, this money is meant to print the permanent voters card. It was not included in the budget last year.
INEC has made it known for a while now that the voters card issued at the registration point was a temporary card. How could it be otherwise? The DDC machines were meant to print out cards at registration points using ordinary printers. There's no feasible way that the permanent cards could have been issued at registration.

Now INEC Is submitting a request for funds so they can print the cards after April 2011 elections, not before. The initial report of the money being used to laminate your existing voters card is apparently false.

INEC has to submit a 2011 budget, and their budget includes this item. What's so terrible about this?

You're just having a knee-jerk reaction over this. My initial estimation of 73 naira per card isn't so terrible.

The voters registration exercise has not been an unqualified success. But it isn't the failure you're getting increasingly desperate to paint it as. Accusing Jega of theft (when you have no proof) is not a decent path to take. So far i have seen no evidence that you have pored over all the contracts and read through all the budgets to spot serious anomalies.

You  people will definitely paint me as a 'defender of Jega' for this, but i am very reluctant to paint a man of proven integrity as a 'thief' and a 'fraudster' without any hard evidence.

PS: My 'proven integrity' comment refers to the fact that as a Vice chancellor, Jega could have stolen tens of millions of Naira. Unlike many of our other Vice Chancellors, there are no allegations against him (as far as i know).

Same old story.
These people keep voting in crooks into power, crooks that will happily pocket all the money heading to their states. If Alams could happily steal 50 billion Naira, why will his successors be any different?
The only hope for the Niger Delta people is for them to take their destiny into their own hands and demand accountability from their leaders.
Under our own noses the money in the ECA was frittered away with nothing to show for it. There's no limit to the greed of the Nigerian elite.

Don't get me wrong. More money in the system is good. Money spent well is even better.

lastpage:
@texazzpeteThe highlighted parts refers:
Whaaat?
This is day-light somersault!
I hope you re-read yourself and come out honestly that your comments were "ill-considered"?
There is NO WHERE in your original post where you said or implied that you were referring to an "incremental cost".

Its no easy to do "fuzzy mathematics" nowadays, people have simply become smarter!

1025's calculation was done on ALL the money Jega had collected till date. (87b + 6.6b + 5b)/67 million people.
I calculated only on the 5 billion the story referred to, which we saw as an incremental cost to the 93.6 billion already consumed by this exercise.

What's difficult to understand about this? Didn't I make this clear in my first post? How does 5 billion divided by 67 million become the Unit cost to register one Nigerian?

Please learn to re-read your posts before hitting the 'Reply' button. it helps.

Read these, people

http://dailytrust.dailytrust.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=12629:permanent-voters-card-project-suffers-set-back&catid=1:news&Itemid=2
http://allafrica.com/stories/201102230402.html
http://thewillnigeria.com/general/7615-Jega-Cautions-Senate-For-Slashing-INECs-Budget.html

Only Sun Newspapers make the claim that the cost is for laminating your existing cards. These other sources I've posted say it's for printing permanent Voters card.

INEC has stated several times (since last year) that the cards issued at the registration point was only a temporary card and a permanent one would be issued out later on. The 5 billion here he's requesting is apparently meant for printing the permanent cards.

The money he requested last year (and up until late January this year) was for the voters registration exercise only. This money he is asking for is for his 2011 budget for INEC. Two separate things.


This is why we should no be in too much of a hurry to condemn without doing some fact checking. As long as this is for the Permanent voters card, Mr. Jega is perfectly in line here.

monkeyleg:
This is the problem with our people.

Was this project not properly scoped from begining? would properly securing  the cards not have been an integral part of the whole process in the first place? It really get my goats when Nigerians start defending this rubbish.


This is plain fraud. How much have we now spent on this whole thing, in a country where a masssive proportion live on less than $1 a day.

I will be verhimently suggesting at some stage that Jega steps down and a proper audit is done. Nigerians have been duped once again

And i suggest your attitude is the problem with Nigeria.
Your comments about people 'defending this rubbish' can only have been directed at me. If you cannot see that all i tried to do was to evaluate the unit cost of laminating one voters card, you need to stimulate your brains further.

dave2:
The solution is mass protest.
It yielded results in Tunisia and Egypt and is yielding result in Libya.

All those countries have one thing in common: They aren't Black African countries.
We're too cowardly to take such steps in Black Africa.

LoveKing:
oh you do think so? funny.

INEC's official figures, dumbass.

1025:
@texazzpete,
in your wisdom, one will expect you to do the first thing first which will be to divide N87b by the 67 million voters registered in line with the photocopied papers then add the N6.6b.
do u know what it means asking for money everyday? first it was N87b, then N6.6b and now N5b. these are some of the steps in defrauding this useless country by pdp.
jega knew what it means telling us to release N200b which is his target at once so the best option will be to commit us and then since jonathan is this desperate to remain in power, whatsoever jega asks will be given.
a well organised jega/inec shld have come out with a run down estimate of what it will cost us to organise the next selection(sorry election) so that we will discuss that before getting involved.

You're talking of two different things here. The calculation you've done is to estimate the unit cost to register one Nigerian. And i agree with you that it's rather high.
My calculation was done on the incremental cost and the reason for the cost. All I did was a simple analysis to determine if the plastic card cost was inflated. And it doesn't seem inflated at all.

I also agree that Jega is making himself look bad by these repeated requests for money. All these should have been built in in the first budget. We'd have screamed bloody murder at first, but we'd have long forgotten it by now.
It's truly a pity. I may not join the bandwagon of those who claim Jega is corrupt, but he isn't painting himself as a competent planner and organizer at all.

jookco:
This Jega is a pure fraud and must have made billions from this exercise.

If Jega was honest enough not to loot tens of millions during his stint as a Vice-Chancellor, why would he start stealing now?
Until concrete evidence/proof is tendered, it's morally wrong to start accusing this man of fraud/theft.

pro01:
I don't see how this is the real issue. The REAL issue is: is it true or false that Justhief Salami has been communnicating with the afore-mentioned people (especially Bola Tinubu)? ? ? That is the real gaddem issue. If it is true, then I dont give a damn how the call logs were obtained; the end justifies the means in situations like this - given that Justhief Salami was acting squeaky clean and holier than thou all these while by slinging mud at the Chief Justice. He who comes to equity must come with clean hands; you don't throw stones when you live in a glass house. It is now clear why Justhief Salami did not want a promotion to the Supreme Court.

Then you're short sighted.
Obtaining your call logs without a court order is a criminal invasion of privacy. the fact that a third party like the PDP can easily obtain your call logs, position and location data etc without a court order is frankly frightening. Today it's phone logs tomorrow it's the PDP planting wire taps in your house without your permission.

Justice Salami is to be considered innocent until the PDP can legally prove otherwise. There is no legal route for the PDP to have detailed copies of call logs for many citizens.

[quote author=Paca-Z link=topic=358286.msg7708525#msg7708525 date=1297379923]Honestly i dont understand, this post is not made for people to express what they will do as PRESIDENTS. OR wat nigeria shuld do with its money or so on

IT IS 2 APPRECIATE THE MILITARY!!!! END OF STORY!!!! TAKE your ISSUES TO ANOTHER FORUM
THIS IS FOR NIGERIANS TO OBSERVE AND APPRECIATE, INFORMATIVE COMMENTS N PICTURES!!!!![/quote]In other words, you think this post is meant for sycophants, praise singers and butt kissers.

Sorry bro. but this is a public forum. If you don't like it, take a hike buddy.

INEC registered approx 67 million people. Dividing 5 billion naira by this number of people gives a unit cost per card of 73 Naira.

I don't think 73 Naira per card is too terrible a sum.


I'm not trying to defend INEC, but this is nowhere near as scandalous as the article paints it.

Salami should sue MTN ASAP. Providing your call logs to a third party is illegal as hell, especially as this has nothing to do with a criminal investigation.

johnie:
Even if offered millions of USD/GBP/Euro or Rands, I would not do such an advert.

Yeah right.

Apart from the 'Giant of africa' comment, there's nothing wrong with the advert.

[quote author=frgy_ link=topic=608920.msg7778169#msg7778169 date=1298363518]True
But the question is , why did we go through so much trouble and spend so much money on the voter's registration, if on election day , there will be no credible means of verifying the authenticity of these cards ?
u must have seen one if u don't have one,these 'cards' are just laminated strips of ordinary paper (many nigerians ,including me, laminated it themselves)
What stops anyone from mass producing these cards since there will be no means of checking them on the D day? (You know better than to say manual register I hope )
What are we doing ?[/quote]I'm going to say it anyway. The manual register

I agree with @obailala.
INEC never said they'd use the DDC machines for the general elections. In fact, when addressing the senate, Jega specifically told them that electronic voting was not going to be used.
The DDC machines were used to capture relevant data. The data is supposed to be screened for anomalies and/or fraud and then printed as a manual voters register.

I don't understand this sudden anti-Jega vitriol. Can any of you provide a link or source to where Jega promised electronic voting to anyone.

And she's praying for God to grant Amaechi the strength to bear the loss. That's strange, i could have sworn no one from his household was among the dead.

doja:
Why are u taking palliative drugs for someone else's headache? We have not asked for you for money. If u are not interested in supporting this message just ignore and create a thread for your candidate where you can feed people with like minds with falsehood.

You opened a thread imploring all Nigerians to donate to Ribadu. Last i checked, i was a Nigerian.
If I have been spreading falsehood, why not refute all the points I made against Ribadu? If you cannot make an intelligent contribution, keep your mouth shut.

ayo84:
Having a people funded campaign strategy, even shows nigerians that nuhu ribadu is techy and in touch with new advanced ways of doing politics, GEJ which i assume is your number fan is runnig the dirty,old corrupt politics system,where big multinationals and corrupt people like ibb are funding his campaign,at the end of it all, he has to answer to them

That is precisely why you people are setting up this drive. Not because he needs the money (ACN is well funded with tainted money just like PDP) but just to sell a contrived image of Nuhu Ribadu to Nigerians.
This is the reason why your man will always fail to impress discerning folk. We see that much of this man's appeal is carefully constructed hype. We need substance these days in Nigeria.

As for your other point, please note that I am no fan of GEJ. I am ashamed of the man's actions even with a Ph.D.
As we speak, I am yet to decide on who to support in this upcoming election.