ORIENTATION101:
you think electricity is free in Europe and America
You guys dont know people pay high bills for electricity in develop countries compare to nigeria

asuustrike1:
The people are not willing to pay even though they make lip service

Divit:
No mind them bros. I tire for these clueless people.

It costs $177 a month to maintain a 24/7 constant electricity supply for a two bedroom apartment in garry, Indiana. That’s roughly 61k NGN here.

Monthly postpaid data and cellular subscription of 30gb costs $80 monthly on verizon! That’s about 29,740 NGN! 30gb on Glo costs 16k here. If you’re ready to pay for services you wish to utilize, I don’t see any reason for it not being rendered. So we are actually enjoying fair services in Nigeria, our real problem is that we are too poor to afford them.

yommen:
You didn't want PHCN. You wanted privatisation. Why are you now complaint. Why will I hold back my product from someone who I won't have to disturb with ladder before he pays me?

These customers actually appreciate Electricity more. Many of them have traveled abroad and are able to compare cost of 24 hour Electricity abroad to how much they pay in Nigeria in comparison with cost of running their generators.

ADMAF:
Go to the UK or U.S and say this. Even d ppl u speaking on behalf of will look at u like a glutton. If we ever want efficient power delivery in Nigeria, we'll have to pay for it, simple. In the Developed Countries we often cite as good xamples, ppl pay precious money to use light. We re too used to free things, we won't develop like this.

Do people in Nigeria earn the same wages as those in developed countries? Let us start by comparing salaries across board in Nigeria, and those foreign countries first, before mocking electricity consumers or users, in this country.

Seyeblessed:
I think you are making a mistake here. The cost structure or model that resulted in the figures you are quoting has to factor in the cost of labour and services that the said electricity and telecoms company procure in order to function properly. I think the minimum wage in Indiana is $7 per hour, that is, NGN 2,500 per hour (NGN 20,160 per 8-hour workday and NGN 403,200 per month). The federal minimum wage in Nigeria, even with the recent increase is NGN 30,000 per month. Did you consider this in your analysis?

Electricity cost in china and India is 8 cents (NGN 29.2 per Kwh), Argentina is 1 cent per kwh (NGN 3.65per kwh) these are countries with comparable minimum wages.... Apples to apples man

Thank you sir, for putting everything in context and telling them the truth. May the wisdom God put in your head, continue to increase!

Exponental:
How much do they pay per Kwh?
I want to put this straight..... With N24.97Kwh we pay, electricity cannot be stable. There are many IPPs in Lagos, non collect less than N50.00kwh. How many people pay N24.97 righteously? How many people don't bypass with the poor tariff? People who pay, don't leave electricity unused.
The question is.... Are you ready to pay 'at least N20,000 per month' for electricity of 12hrs daily?
How much do you pay monthly to run your generator for 12hrs daily for a month?
Electricity is expensive!
Those who really want it, pay heavily!!

Hello ....in some estates in Lagos Island, the residents pay Eko Disco (EKEDC) over 30, 000 per month in each household, as electricity bills, and yet they do not have power supply of 12 hours per day. So please don't say what you don't know!!

Exponental:
Corruption is everywhere. That corruption was possible cos the electricity was available that time. More so, Discos only distribute what was given to them, they dont decide it's availability 100%.

No sir, Discos reject power from the Gencos. The Gencos have complained about this, several times..

frankmoney:
not trying to justify anything , but the truth is most nigerians don't pay for electricity

Who are the "most?" Did you do a survey to ascertain before you arrived at this conclusion or you are just repeating the junk that the Discos have been chanting like parrots, over the past few years?

asapeola:
Oga just stick to ur gas supply! We talking nation wide stuff here not gas in KG. How is much is ur own gas per KG? ur like someone supplying diesel and ranting abt refineries not working.

Natural gas used for power generation is sold in scf (standard cubic feet) and not in kg.

CeterisXVII:

No sir, Discos reject power from the Gencos. The Gencos have complained about this, several times..


Who are the "most?" Did you do a survey to ascertain before you arrived at this conclusion or you are just repeating the junk that the Discos have been chanting like parrots, over the past few years?

most don't pay bills , a whole lot of people in my area bypassed the prepaid meter and aren't paying what they are supposed to pay , the rest who don't have , usually settle the phed officials when they show up for disconnection . It happens in other states as well z yes most Nigerians don't pay bills

CeterisXVII:

The telecoms industry should never be compared to the electricity sector. Both of them are totally different from each other.

The barriers to entry in the power sector are infinitely higher, than those in the telecoms sector. The mode of operations are different, and even the returns on investment are poles apart.

It would take the power sector about 6 times the number of years it would take the telecoms sector, to upgrade and overhaul its' infrastructure.....not to mention the prohibitive cost of doing so.

I could have sworn they are under the same utility and as such conform to the same competitive pricing modulation

CeterisXVII:






Do people in Nigeria earn the same wages as those in developed countries? Let us start by comparing salaries across board in Nigeria, and those foreign countries first, before mocking electricity consumers or users, in this country.



Thank you sir, for putting everything in context and telling them the truth. May the wisdom God put in your head, continue to increase!

Wages has no direct relationship with cost of electricity unless the country is subsidising power generation.
Cheap electricity in China has more to do with their abundance of hydropower & coal. Their energy mix is also driving the cost down despite their obvious demand pressures

CeterisXVII:






Do people in Nigeria earn the same wages as those in developed countries? Let us start by comparing salaries across board in Nigeria, and those foreign countries first, before mocking electricity consumers or users, in this country.



Thank you sir, for putting everything in context and telling them the truth. May the wisdom God put in your head, continue to increase!

Is electricity cheap in other African countries? The true be told, many Nigerians are not willing to pay for this service.

asuustrike1:

Is electricity cheap in other African countries? The true be told, many Nigerians are not willing to pay for this service.

Oga, do a comparison of what professionals in other African countries earn, compared to their Nigerian counterparts. Doctors, lecturers etc in South Africa, Kenya, Botswana, Namibia earn more than their colleagues in Nigeria. Even professors in Togo & Senegal earn more than professors in Nigeria.

jaybee3:
Wages has no direct relationship with cost of electricity unless the country is subsidising power generation.
Cheap electricity in China has more to do with their abundance of hydropower & coal. Their energy mix is also driving the cost down despite their obvious demand pressures

Yes, these other countries generate more power from different sources, but wages also affect their ability to pay for such power.

The electricity workers in their own energy sector, earn higher wages too, and this in turn forms part of the cost of production & distribution of electricity.

CeterisXVII:

Oga, do a comparison of what professionals in other African countries earn, compared to their Nigerian counterparts. Doctors, lecturers etc in South Africa, Kenya, Botswana, Namibia earn more than their colleagues in Nigeria. Even professors in Togo & Senegal earn more than professors in Nigeria.

There is no relationship between wage rate and electricity bills.

frankmoney:
most don't pay bills , a whole lot of people in my area bypassed the prepaid meter and aren't paying what they are supposed to pay , the rest who don't have , usually settle the phed officials when they show up for disconnection . It happens in other states as well z yes most Nigerians don't pay bills

You are right. The discos are ready to supply to customers that are willing to pay for their service. Why do you think some areas have electricity than others?

asuustrike1:
There is no relationship between wage rate and electricity bills.

Please go and do your research. The workers in the electricity sector within those countries, earn wages that form part of the cost of electricity production and distribution. Or do you think the energy sector in those countries are not driven by people?

The consumers of electricity also earn high wages, that enable them to pay for power they consume. Ability to pay is important.

In Zimbabwe, there was a riot several months back, because the fuel stations had petrol, but the masses could not afford it.

If you cannot grasp this simple correlation between a product/ service and the people's ability to pay, then I cannot help you.

jaybee3:

I could have sworn they are under the same utility and as such conform to the same competitive pricing modulation

They do not conform to the same pricing formulation. Do your research. How much does it cost to set up a Base Transceiver Station (BTS) in the Telecoms sector? How much does it cost to set up a substation in the power sector? How long does it take to set up a BTS site by telecoms engineers? How long do electrical engineers spend in setting up a substation? Do the math.

frankmoney:
most don't pay bills , a whole lot of people in my area bypassed the prepaid meter and aren't paying what they are supposed to pay , the rest who don't have , usually settle the phed officials when they show up for disconnection . It happens in other states as well z yes most Nigerians don't pay bills

Stop saying what you do not know. Have you gone round the whole of Nigeria to do a survey, before jumping to this conclusion?

Do you realise that most of the prepaid meters now carry a software, that cuts off power supply, if you attempt to do such things, or if you attempt to tamper with the meter? Are you aware that firms like IKEDC and EKEDC now put their meters on long poles away from the reach of the consumers?

Those who bypass their meters are very few compared to those who pay in full.

And for customers who receive estimated bills, the Discos collect their readings from the transformer supplied into the area. And then they share cost of the power among residents in the area. That is why you see people complaining of high bills, that do not correlate with their usage.

asuustrike1:

You are right. The discos are ready to supply to customers that are willing to pay for their service. Why do you think some areas have electricity than others?

that's true , where I previously lived started Experiencing constant supply when everyone was issued prepaid meter and very few were bypassed . This discos are private companies and will give to who is willing pay

CeterisXVII:

Please go and do your research. The workers in the electricity sector within those countries, earn wages that form part of the cost of production and distribution. Or do you think the energy sector in those countries are not driven by people?

The consumers of electricity also earn high wages, that enable them to pay for power they consume. If you cannot grasp this simple correlation, then I cannot help you.

You are still ignorant to be relying on research that has so many flaws. One of the criticism of that research is the fact that they rely on dollar rate which is unstable in many countries.

frankmoney:
that's true , where I previously lived started Experiencing constant supply when everyone was issued prepaid meter and very few were bypassed . This discos are private companies and will give to who is willing pay

Exactly! The cost more to rely on fuel. Allow these discos to set their price like what happened in the telecom sector then watch how electricity will improve. Someone was even comparing the wage rate to electricity using developed and developing countries but he forgot that gsm services where expensive years back.

asuustrike1:

You are still ignorant to be relying on research that has so many flaws. One of the criticism of that research is the fact that they rely on dollar rate which is unstable in many countries.

Oga, everything in the industrial and energy sector in this country has a dollar component. Are imported components used in generating and distributing electricity, not sold to the Gencos and Discos in dollars? Yes.

Do the wages of the electricity workers, not form part of the cost of producing & distributing electricity? Yes.

Are wages of consumers denominated in dollars? No. Is ability to pay for a product or service, not a vital consideration in business? Yes.

If consumers or users of such products and services lack the ability to pay for it, how would the producers of such goods recoup their costs? Oga, he else do you want it to be broken down for you?

Oga, everything in the industrial and energy sector in this country has a dollar component. Are imported components used in generating and distributing electricity, not sold to the Gencos and Discos in dollars? Yes.

There is a dollar element no doubt however researchers had criticized the use of dollar to measure the standard of living. This is because of the fluctuation and devaluation of currencies.

Do the wages of the electricity workers, not form part of the cost of producing & distributing electricity? Yes.

There is a difference between wage and salary. Wages are paid according to the level of input a worker puts in. Do electricity companies pay their workers per hour over here?. Do not confuse wage with salary because they are not exactly what they are.

Are wages of consumers denominated in dollars? No. Is ability to pay for a product or service, not a vital consideration in business? Yes.

Have you considered the availability and quality of service which consumer ask for? Have you compare the cost of fuel to the cost of electricity?. Have you also considered the target market?.

[quote]If consumers or users of such products and services lack the ability to pay for it, how would the producers of such goods recoup their costs? Oga, he else do you want it to be broken down for you

Have you heard of the word market segmentation?

asuustrike1:
There is a dollar element no doubt however researchers had criticized the use of dollar to measure the standard of living. This is because of the fluctuation and devaluation of currencies.

There is a difference between wage and salary. Wages are paid according to the level of input a worker puts in. Do electricity companies pay their workers per hour over here?. Do not confuse wage with salary because they are not exactly what they are.

Oga, whatever amount the workers are paid in the electricity sector, such figures are captured as part of the costs of providing electricity to the populace. Yes or No? So stop all the semantics of wages and salaries. Staff costs constitute part of the cost of production and distribution of energy, everywhere in the world.

Have you heard of the word market segmentation?

Yes, and so? What the Discos are doing is not market segmentation. It is called robbing Peter to pay Paul. They are not distributing any extra load produced by the Gencos.

What they are doing is taking the limited amount they can transmit from the Gencos, and distributing it to high paying customers, at the expense of other customers with prepaid meters, who have also loaded credit into their meters, ready to consume electricity. Note: this set of customers have paid money into the account of the Discos for power supply, they are not likely to get!

They are also depriving customers on estimated billing platform, who have paid or are ready to pay their bills once it arrives, but cannot get power supply, because it has been rerouted to other rich, high tariff paying customers. Meanwhile, those estimated bills are NOT likely to come down o, whether or not they get electricity supply!

This is the height of cheating and sharp practices. Please do not call it market segmentation.

Ile lapoti n joko de idi.... No one will not die, we shall see

Oga, whatever amount the workers are paid in the electricity sector, such figures are captured as part of the costs of providing electricity to the populace. Yes or No? So stop all the semantics of wages and salaries. Staff costs constitute part of the cost of production and distribution of energy, everywhere in the world

The answer is No. You need to ask an accountant how the wages/salaries are prorated instead of assuming what you don't know.

Yes, and so? What the Discos are doing is not market segmentation. It is robbing Peter to pay Paul. They are not distributing any extra load produced by the Gencos.

What they are doing is taking the limited amount they can transmit from the Gencos, and distributing it to high paying customers, at the expense of other customers with prepaid meters, who have also loaded credit into their meters ready to consume electricity. Note: this set of customers have paid money into the account of the Discos for power they are not likely to get!

They are also depriving customers on estimated billing platform, who have paid or are ready to pay their bills once it arrives, but cannot get power supply, because it has been rerouted to other paying customers.

This is the height of cheating and sharp practices. Please do not call it market segmentation.

[/quote]
The electricity companies segmented their market into different categories.
1. 33kva 24 hrs line
2.33 kva 18 hrs line
3. 11kva 12 hrs line e.t.c. The tariff rates are low that is why you see estimated billings to cover up for other costs.

The residence of Magodo enter into agreement with the electricity distribution companies hence the slight improvement.

asuustrike1:
The answer is No. You need to ask an accountant how the wages/salaries are prorated instead of assuming what you don't know.

The electricity companies segmented their market into different categories.
1. 33kva 24 hrs line
2.33 kva 18 hrs line
3. 11kva 12 hrs line e.t.c. The tariff rates are low that is why you see estimated billings to cover up for other costs.

Oga, I cannot help you if you fail to see the obvious truth. Your running costs and operational costs, must capture your staff costs. And all these must be recouped from your cost of sales.

If your cost of production/distribution does not include staff costs, then you are a learner. You will operate at a loss. Please stop embarrassing yourself with these fake calculations.

The so called segmentation you are desperately trying to defend, is only a way of robbing Peter to pay Paul.

IKEDC is not distributing increased quantity of power, they are merely rerouting it to the high spenders, by depriving the masses (on the prepaid meter platform and estimated billing platform), of what should be allocated to them.

Oga, I cannot help you if you fail to see the obvious truth. Your running costs and operational costs, must capture your staff costs. And all these must be recouped from your cost of sales.

If your cost of production/distribution does not include staff costs, then you are a learner. You will operate at a loss. Please stop embarrassing yourself with these fake calculations

Weren't you looking at wage rate in general to determine the price of a product?. I agree with you on what you said however does this relate to setting price in country like ours?. Did the gsm operators considered wage rate when selling sim cards for N50,000 as at 2003?.

The so called segmentation you are desperately trying to defend, is only a way of robbing Peter to pay Paul.

IKEDC is not distributing increased quantity of power, they are merely rerouting it to the high spenders, by depriving the masses (on the prepaid meter platform and estimated billing platform), of what should be allocated to them.

Customers are not willing to pay. The rates are too low hence the diversion to other areas. The electricity companies are incurring more cost than the profit they are making. Few persons are using prepaid metres compare to other persons on postpaid. It is only logical that these companies estimate bills to recover cost however I don't support that because am affected as well. Probably Nigerians should shun these companies by not patronizing them in other for them to sit up. NERC is not functioning well compare to other government agencies. We need to strike a balance and be objective in this matter because Magodo is template for other areas to copy from

asuustrike1:

Weren't you looking at wage rate in general to determine the price of a product?. I agree with you on what you said however does this relate to setting price in country like ours?. Did the gsm operators considered wage rate when selling sim cards for N50,000 as at 2003?.

Customers are not willing to pay. The rates are too low hence the diversion to other areas. The electricity companies are incurring more cost than the profit they are making. Few persons are using prepaid metres compare to other persons on postpaid. It is only logical that these companies estimate bills to recover cost however I don't support that because am affected as well. Probably Nigerians should shun these companies by not patronizing them in other for them to sit up. NERC is not functioning well compare to other government agencies. We need to strike a balance and be objective in this matter because Magodo is template for other areas to copy from

asuustrike1:
Exactly! The cost more to rely on fuel. Allow these discos to set their price like what happened in the telecom sector then watch how electricity will improve. Someone was even comparing the wage rate to electricity using developed and developing countries but he forgot that gsm services where expensive years back.

Oga stop embarrassing yourself by comparing coconuts with cocoyam.

You are comparing telecoms sector with power, when both operate on different and parallel basis that are totally unrelated to each other.

The barriers to entry in the power sector, are several times higher than the barriers to entry in the telecoms sector.

The way their operations are structured are totally different. The markets they serve area also different. Glo as well as MTN and 9Mobile have customers drawn from different parts of the country, and each of them operates within the same territory as the other. So there is a form of competition. Unlike in the power sector.

Can a customer in Ikorodu get his power needs served by EKEDC or BEDC, instead of relying on IKEDC? No!

Your quest to defend the Discos has made you clutch at straws. In your view, those who pay estimated bills based on electricity supply they hardly ever get, should continue to get short-changed by the Discos, whenever such Discos want to play to the gallery by depriving them of power supply, simply because they are channelling such power to others who can pay arbitrary rates?

What about those with prepaid metres who have bought credit into those metres, in order to enjoy power, but the Discos have decided to short-change them as well, after collecting their money because they want to channel such power supply to others?

Have you ever heard of the concept of fair trade? Participants in the telecoms sector were forced to lower prices, because of competition. Each of them were competing against one another. But in the power sector, the Discos are a cartel. No competition exists in that sector. Will EKEDC ever be able to compete against IKEDC? No! Each of them serves a captive market.

Don't worry, one day the consumers will start venting out their frustrations on the Discos, when they can no longer tolerate their shenanigans.

You are comparing telecoms sector with power, when both operate on different and parallel basis that are totally unrelated to each other.

The barriers to entry in the power sector, are several times higher than the barriers to entry in the telecoms sector.

The way their operations are structured are totally different. The markets they serve area also different. Glo as well as MTN and 9Mobile have customers drawn from different parts of the country, and each of them operates within the same territory as the other. So there is a form of competition. Unlike in the power sector.

Can a customer in Ikorodu get his power needs served by EKEDC or BEDC, instead of relying on IKEDC?

It is either you are ignorant or you can't see beyond mode of operations. Those in support of borrowing a leaf from the telecom sector knew what they saw. This is their view" Allow these companies charge whatever fee they want to charge to recoup part of their cost and then bring down the price with time. If you continue to fix price for them you wouldn't get good results.

Your quest to defend the Discos has made you clutch at straws. In your view, those who pay estimated bills based on electricity supply they hardly ever get, should continue to get short-changed by the Discos, whenever such Discos want to play to the gallery by depriving them of power supply, simply because they are channelling such power to others who can pay arbitrary rates?

Many Nigerians don't pay electricity bills that is the fact. Very few do but unfortunately they suffer the consequences because many Nigerians by pass and trap electricity they didn't pay for. The truth be told, many Nigerians want good things but they are not ready for the sacrifice. You can see it in some of the thread created by many monikers on the latest cheat.

What about those with prepaid metres who have bought credit into those metres, in order to enjoy power, but the Discos have decided to short-change them as well, after collecting their money because they want to channel such power supply to others?

Those on prepaid are at advantage because they pay what they use unlike post paid customers.From the generation to the distribution house, each chain of production incur cost.

[i[quote]]Have you ever heard of the concept of fair trade?[/i] Participants in the telecoms sector were forced to lower prices, because of competition. Each of them were competing against one another. But in the power sector, the Discos are a cartel. No competition exists in that sector. Will EKEDC ever be able to compete against IKEDC? No! Each of them serves a captive market.

This is were you missed it. The idea from the telecom sector is to allow the discos charge whatever they deem fit after which the price begin to drop.

Don't worry, one day the consumers will start venting out their frustrations on the Discos, when they can no longer tolerate their shenanigans.

[quote]
Consumers are not ready for a change. Many of them only vent their anger on the media without proper action. These same persons would remain dumb when their oppressors bribes them

ADMAF:

I just laugh. I guess u think cos u prob use prepaid, it has to be same in every house? A disproportionate number of Nigerians try to cut corners to avoid paying, either by underpayment on the prepaid meters, illegal reconnection to the grid or lack of meters.
Likewise, power generation may be insufficient I admit, but If we all desire constant elect generation, we Can't help but make the kinds of comp made by residents of Magodo.

Exactly!

If Nigeria electricity turn to sectoral bidding then I think it's time to think of where to go for the rest of once life!
Oladeebo

CeterisXVII:

Oga, everything in the industrial and energy sector in this country has a dollar component. Are imported components used in generating and distributing electricity, not sold to the Gencos and Discos in dollars? Yes.

Do the wages of the electricity workers, not form part of the cost of producing & distributing electricity? Yes.

Are wages of consumers denominated in dollars? No. Is ability to pay for a product or service, not a vital consideration in business? Yes.

If consumers or users of such products and services lack the ability to pay for it, how would the producers of such goods recoup their costs? Oga, he else do you want it to be broken down for you?

lack ability to pay or were not forced to pay?
Even in the most developed country you will force to pay bill or taxes, why not in Nigeria.
Let's say all illegal connection were disconnected today and the installation of meter is order, can't we have uninterrupted power?
We lack political will power
Oladeebo

asuustrike1:
The residence of Magodo enter into agreement with the electricity distribution companies hence the slight improvement.

You call 24hours power supply for over 3 weeks now a slight improvement