Kobojunkie:

This is someone telling you of his experience down there . . . . .

Again, do not make it an NIN vs NID issue because not all NIDs share your story there. Some of us have experienced similar issues and have been able to get its dealt with without needing to resort to this. Not all Nigerians are agberos. No all Nigerians act like uncouth village elements . . . some are well mannered and know how to deal with authorities appropriately. Can we not paint every one with the same brush here?

You said "not all", and what if she was dealing with the "other"?

Was the video taped after she was beaten? Because I didnt exactly see that in the video. If after, was she approached and offered an apology AFTER the ordeal?
Why was her car in the gutter? Did that happen when she was trying to explain her ordeal to the other police?

Like I said before, I do not agree with her behavior, but I want to understand how she could have gone about it if she was a regular citizen. Think about the police force we're dealing with here.

She really went crazy. I do believe the video has been edited. How did the car get from the road to then be across the gutter, yet it was not on the video?


When she was saying they dragged her, beat her and took her phone I believe her 100% because of the way she said it and kept saying it in such anger.


She shocked me with her madness though, so different to how I would imagine her temperament to be, but then when you feel you have receieved a grave injustice it can incense a person.

Ileke-IdI:

You said "not all", and what if she was dealing with the "other"?

Was the video taped after she was beaten? Because I didnt exactly see that in the video. If after, was she approached and offered an apology AFTER the ordeal?
Why was her car in the gutter? Did that happen when she was trying to explain her ordeal to the other police?

Like I said before, I do not agree with her behavior, but I want to understand how she could have gone about it if she was a regular citizen. Think about the police force we're dealing with here.

I suggest you go to Nigeria yourself to understand the police for yourself. You have read of cases where Policemen have done their job as expected and cases of policemen acting like imbeciles. The same applies to the Nigerian populace. There are those who launch into tirade at will and those who take their time to make sure they do not make issues worse by their actions.

When I say not all, I mean not all Nigerians experience the same from the police.  


I do have a question to help you with what this is.

Let's turn this around a bit. Forget about the NIGERIAN FACTOR for a bit. You live out in florida . . . so I am guessing you know a bit more of the Florida police than I would. Would you, in your right mind, act in a similar manner or way with the police in Florida, knowing that you have just been unjustly persecuted?

Kobojunkie:

I do have a question to help you with what this is. You live out in florida . . . so I am guessing you know a bit more of the Florida police than I would. Would you, in your right mind, act that way with the police in Florida, even knowing that you were being unjustly persecuted?

Ileke-IdI:

In a stable society, an act like the one displayed by Ufoma would have justified her an arrest for public disturbance. She would have been branded a nuisance to the society.

Ileke-IdI:

I know that in my own space over here, if she acted the way she did, she would have been arrested for being a public nuisance.

As for your "not all" explanation, what if she was dealing with the "bad" ones that day? Would that justify her craziness?

Kobojunkie:

I suggest you go to Nigeria yourself to understand the police for yourself. You have read of cases where Policemen have done their job as expected and cases of Let's turn this around a bit. Forget about the NIGERIAN FACTOR for a bit. You live out in florida . . . so I am guessing you know a bit more of the Florida police than I would. Would you, in your right mind, act in a similar manner or way with the police in Florida, knowing that you have just been unjustly persecuted?

Good question to you FL  GATORS. You know and I know I know that the American cops are far more action-packed and hardedged than the regular NPF personnel.

They say a coward dies a thousand deaths, it is clear that certain internet warriors on Nairaland have died many times over.
Courage clearly deserted you a long time ago.
Let me jog your memory:

Courage helps you to tell the truth,
Courage helps you to do right,
Courage helps you to stand up for your rights,
Courage says don't turn the other cheek,
Courage says fight against them that fight against you,
Ufuoma, you are a credit to all right thinking Nigerians
Ufuoma, we salute you, we no dey carry last.
God bless you.

^^^^^^

Ileke-IdI:

As for your "not all" explanation, what if she was dealing with the "bad" ones that day? Would that justify her craziness?

Again, when I said NOT ALL, I meant not all Nigerians feel it is OK to act the way this woman did  . . . Ofcourse she must have been dealing with the bad police officers to have gotten the treatment she claimed she had gotten. But this is not the accepted NORM by Nigerians in Nigeria, no, not at all. NOT ALL Nigerians in Nigeria are treated the same by the police daily. Read @hercules07's post to understand. So, it is pointless to claim that this behavior is considered acceptable by all Nigerians in Nigeria. . . . it is not. There are pockets of stability in that same Nigeria. The problem is the majority of those in power and the ORDINARY Nigerians do not adhere to the rules or obeying the law. That is the problem.

Kobojunkie:

Again, when I said NOT ALL, I meant not all Nigerians feel it is OK to act the way this woman did  . . . Ofcourse she must have been dealing with the bad police officers to have gotten the treatment she claimed she had gotten. But this is not the accepted NORM by Nigerians in Nigeria, no, not at all. NOT ALL Nigerians in Nigeria are treated the same by the police daily. Read @hercules07's post to understand. So, it is pointless to claim that this behavior is considered acceptable by all Nigerians in Nigeria. . . . it is not. There are pockets of stability in that same Nigeria. The problem is the majority of those in power and the ORDINARY Nigerians do not adhere to the rules or obeying the law. That is the problem.

Understandable, but how could she have gone about this?
Why was she beaten?
If the video was edited, what more would they have done if she had gone to court to sue WITHOUT the raucous she caused? Wait first of all, what caused all these wahala and what led to her being beaten?

You have not answered the question I asked you of what you would do if the same or similar happened to you here in Florida. Stop trying to psychoanalyze that which you are not privy to and focus on what we know instead.

Ok the NL iron ladies have turned on themselves.Maq nobody put mouth for this mata b4 they turn on u

Kobojunkie:

You have not answered the question I asked you of what you would do if the same or similar happened to you here in Florida. Stop trying to psychoanalyze that which you are not privy to and focus on what we know instead.

I already indirectly answered your question. Check my previous post.

I don't see your answer anywhere.

Kobojunkie:

I don't see your answer anywhere.

Let's put it this way, I would not act like she did. Simple.
And that's knowing that I would be treated fairly with a Floridian cop, and if not, my case would be fairly heard in court without any illegal alteration of evidence [video tape].

Ileke-IdI:

In a stable society, an act like the one displayed by Ufoma would have justified her an arrest for public disturbance. She would have been branded a nuisance to the society.
.

Well that is neither here nor there, Basically she would have been arrested there and then for public disturbance in Florida.
She should have been handcuffed and arrested there and then by the Nigerian Police Force who unwisely gave her too much leeway.
It is even because of this unwise decision by the NPF that disgruntled elements here, based in Nigeria, are forming militant whereas the story would have been different if she had appeared in the media cowed and in handcuffs.

tensor777:

Well that is neither here nor there, Basically she would have been arrested there and then for public disturbance in Florida.
She should have been handcuffed and arrested there and then by the Nigerian Police Force who unwisely gave her too much leeway.
It is even because of this unwise decision by the NPF that disgruntled elements here, based in Nigeria, are forming militant whereas the story would have been different if she had appeared in the media cowed in handcuffs.

Why are you guys acting like I'm saying her behavior was mannerly?
All I'm saying is that if she had not made as much noise as she did, drawing witnesses, how much more of that tape would have been edited? And would she get fair judgment in court without everybody knowing what happened?

Ileke-IdI:

Let's put it this way, I would not act like she did. Simple.
And that's knowing that[b] I would be treated fairly with a Floridian cop, and if not, my case would be fairly heard in court without any illegal alteration of evidence[/b] [video tape].

Did you follow OJ Simpson's case or were you too young then? Anyway, American cops are the most corrupt in the world. Morally corrupt, that is. The fact that you are Black is a moral justification for them to treat you badly. I have seen it happen in Wisconsin, times without number! So don't give me that BS about American cops being less corrupt than Nigerian cops. They are all the same:One, more sophisticated at covering their tracks; the other, not so adept.

fstranger:

Did you follow OJ Simpson's case or were you too young then? Anyway, American cops are the most corrupt in the world. Morally corrupt, that is. The fact that you are Black is a moral justification for them to treat you badly. I have seen it happen in Wisconsin, times without number! So don't give me that BS about American cops being less corrupt than Nigerian cops. They are all the same:One, more sophisticated at covering their tracks; the other, not so adept.

Yes, they're corrupt.
But can they publicly beat you and ask you to strip unclothed in public? Do they kill for bribes?
As long as you don't walk on the dark side with them, you're fine and dandy. They cannot arrest you without proper justification.
I've been living without worrying about cops for a while now. 

But not trying to say America is Utopic, just saying that in Ufoma's case, she wouldnt have had to resort to that action if she was dealing with most Florida police [as asked by KoboJ]. Cameras are everywhere and it's illegal to distort them based on your own reasons, they can be used in court as evidence. So acting like a village woman in public is unnecessary.

Ileke-IdI:

Yes, they're corrupt.
But can they publicly beat you and ask you to strip unclothed in public? Do they kill for bribes?
As long as you don't walk on the dark side with them, you're fine and dandy. They cannot arrest you without proper justification.
I've been living without worrying about cops for a while now.

Are you sure you live in the same country I live in? Did you hear about the Beer Summit? What led to that?

Ileke-IdI:

Yes, they're corrupt.
[b]But can they publicly beat you and ask you to strip unclothed in public? Do they kill for bribes?[/b]As long as you don't walk on the dark side with them, you're fine and dandy. They cannot arrest you without proper justification.
I've been living without worrying about cops for a while now.

Go watch an episode of cops? And hang out with drug dealers a lil, you don't have to do drugs, and you will know how corrupt American cops are.

fstranger:

Go watch an episode of cops? And hang out with drug dealers a lil, you don't have to do drugs, and you will know how corrupt American cops are.

Honey, I watch cops all the time and still better than Naija police. So what are you trying to say?
Like I previously said, if you dont walk on the dark side with cops, you have nothing to worry about. So no need to hang with drug dealers, wtf?
Now, if you're a drug dealer, dealing with a dirty cop, that's another story.

fstranger:

Are you sure you live in the same country I live in? Did you hear about the Beer Summit? What led to that?

Explain how relevant that is to this case.

Ileke-Idi, I would advice you to drop the issue. You have made a very balanced point, but some people have a different view (whether right or wrong). I personally think your point of view is correct, but I will not force my views down other peoples throats.

One thing you can be certain of, the ability to argue endlessly doesn't mean that the point being made is correct. I see a lot of that here on NL.

Ileke-IdI:

Let's put it this way, I would not act like she did. Simple.
And that's knowing that I would be treated fairly with a Floridian cop, and if not, my case would be fairly heard in court without any illegal alteration of evidence [video tape].

But wait. . . . there are people here who believe they are not treated fairly by the police(we know too well of these class of americans who have either been raised to believe the police are their enemies or that the white man is out against them). Why do they themselves not act in much the same way?

fstranger:

Did you follow OJ Simpson's case or were you too young then? Anyway, American cops are the most corrupt in the world. Morally corrupt, that is. The fact that you are Black is a moral justification for them to treat you badly. I have seen it happen in Wisconsin, times without number! So don't give me that BS about American cops being less corrupt than Nigerian cops. They are all the same:One, more sophisticated at covering their tracks; the other, not so adept.

Oh wow! We seem to have a very good example of one of those who thinks that way among us. Do you think this one(@fstranger), when accosted by the police, say in whatever state in the US he resides, and finds that he is being maltreated, will act in the same way he encourages this woman to here? @Ileke-idi


Also . . .  see how you stated that your case would be fairly heard in the courts here. What makes you believe the same does not now apply in Nigeria? My point is we like to pretend things do not work because somehow THEY(We like to remove ourselves as much as we can) do not allow it work so there is no need for us to even bother with it. But in all honesty, we have most the same laws people have out here in the US, in Nigeria. We also have a similar system down in Nigeria. What is missing is the fact that our people rarely take advantage of that law to their own benefit but are quick to point accusing fingers at those in office, blaming them, without realizing they are part of the institution. We saw the move "WELCOME TO LAGOS" and how ordinary Garbage pickers used the same lagos courts to get justice for a man who lost his eyes in a fight. If that is not a good example for anyone who doubts that the system is not a failed on, then I don't know what else will be.

Kobojunkie:

  Oh wow! We seem to have a very good example of one of those who thinks that way among us. Do you think this one(@fstranger), when accosted by the police, say in whatever state in the US he resides, and finds that he is being maltreated, will act in the same way he encourages this woman to here? @Ileke-idi

.Of course not! Though I have their useless passport, it is not my country, and I do not see myself as an American. Never was, and will never be.  And when you live in someone else's country, the least you can do is to follow their rules and be calm. I would not act like this lady in the US because this godforsaken country is not my country of origin. I am here to make money, nothing more nothing less. However, faced with the same situation in Nigeria, I will do exactly what this lady did. As a matter of fact, when I go to Nigeria, I plan to go with a bulletproof vest and a gun, just in case I am harassed by anyone, police and non-police alike.

Why the change in behavior? Well Nigeria is my motherland and I will NOT allow anyone to mistreat me in my OWN country!

Kobojunkie:

Also . . . see how you stated that your case would be fairly heard in the courts here. What makes you believe the same does not now apply in Nigeria? My point is we like to pretend things do not work because somehow THEY(We like to remove ourselves as much as we can) do not allow it work so there is no need for us to even bother with it. But in all honesty, we have most the same laws people have out here in the US, in Nigeria. We also have a similar system down in Nigeria. What is missing is the fact that our people rarely take advantage of that law to their own benefit but are quick to point accusing fingers at those in office, blaming them, without realizing they are part of the institution. We saw the move "WELCOME TO LAGOS" and how ordinary Garbage pickers used the same lagos courts to get justice for a man who lost his eyes in a fight. If that is not a good example for anyone who doubts that the system is not a failed on, then I don't know what else will be.

You sound very idealistic, like a teenager, or someone who thinks TV=reality. I'll advise you to go live in Lagos, Eko akete, and get hit by a danfo, and let's see if you get the same treatment from Naija police as you would from American cops. The point is that there is no system in Nigeria! I believe in the dignity of every human being, that, put in the right environment, each person, and in this context, the ordinary Nigerian would do the right thing; that is, allow the law to take its course. However, the ordinary Nigerian has seen more than enough to know that nothing works. That the only language we understand is "Ogboju." If she had behaved like a lady, as you seem to be advocating, her rights would have been grossly trampled upon, and the court system is so overwhelmed that her case would never see the light of the day.

My point is that the system does not work. She did the right thing given her circumstance and that is how every sane Nigerianl should behave, under the same circumstance. It is better to die for something than to live like a 'second-class citizen" in your own country.

No be small thing!!

Na the cameraman wey dem swear for I pity!

fstranger:

You sound very idealistic, like a teenager, or someone who thinks TV=reality. I'll advise you to go live in Lagos, Eko akete, and get hit by a danfo, and let's see if you get the same treatment from Naija police as you would from American cops. The point is that there is no system in Nigeria! I believe in the dignity of every human being, that, put in the right environment, each person, and in this context, the ordinary Nigerian would do the right thing; that is, allow the law to take its course. However, the ordinary Nigerian has seen more than enough to know that nothing works. That the only language we understand is "Ogboju." If she had behaved like a lady, as you seem to be advocating, her rights would have been grossly trampled upon, and the court system is so overwhelmed that her case would never see the light of the day.

My point is that the system does not work. She did the right thing given her circumstance and that is how every sane Nigerianl should behave, under the same circumstance. It is better to die for something than to live like a 'second-class citizen" in your own country.

Sadly for you, I grew up in that same Lagos. The worst treatment I have ever gotten was from a molue conductor who picked my pocket and denied when I confronted him. I am sorry, it is the same Lagos and the same sun that shines on everyone in Lagos that shone on me all the decades I had growing up there and learning of how the system and the people are in collusion to make sure everything comes to ruin. I have had my run ins with the law and the one time I almost got locked up for fighting with a neighbor only I stood my ground and only had to explain my case to the Police head -- was later allowed to go since the man agreed that I was not the cause, nor was I at fault, and I was never bothered again on the issue.

I never paid a penny in bribe to police or just about anyone. I always told them it was against my belief and if they wanted to press harder, I would ask for a more senior officer, a name and more.

Ever wonder how those ajebos and middle class folks live and work in the same Lagos and never get hit or maltreated by the danfo drivers, police et all? Or are you going to tell me they do not live in the same Lagos?

Kobojunkie:

Sadly for you, I grew up in that same Lagos. The worst treatment I have ever gotten was from a molue conductor who picked my pocket and denied when I confronted him. I am sorry, it is the same Lagos and the same sun that shines on everyone in Lagos that shone on me all the decades I had growing up there and learning of how the system and the people are in collusion to make sure everything comes to ruin. I have had my run ins with the law and the one time I almost got locked up for fighting with a neighbour only I stood my ground and only had to explain my case to the Police head -- was later allowed to go since the man agreed that I was not the cause, nor was I at fault, and I was never bothered again on the issue.
Ever wonder how those ajebos and middle class folks live and work in the same Lagos and never get hit or maltreated by the danfo drivers, police et all? Or are you going to tell me they do not live in the same Lagos?

Stop saying system, there is no system in Lagos, or in Nigeria for that matter. Well, the case you sited is an isolated situation. And moreover, it really does not count because the "n" of cases like that is 1, making generalisation difficult. However, there are numerous cases of police brutality and it is collective knowledge that in whatever sutuation you find yourself, you have a better chance of getting off, scot-free, irrespective of your level of complicity, if you show some craziness. It is the way things work in Nigeria, not just on the street, but also at the very top, includinng at the NASS and Asorock ( remember how Turai held us all hostage with her shakara? )!

fstranger:

Stop saying system, there is no system in Lagos, or in Nigeria for that matter. Well, the case you sited is an isolated situation. And moreover, it really does not count because the "n" of cases like that is 1, making generalisation difficult. However, there are numerous cases of police brutality and it is collective knowledge that in whatever sutuation you find yourself, you have a better chance of getting off, scot-free, irrespective of your level of complicity, if you show some craziness. It is the way things work in Nigeria, not just on the street, but also at the very top, includinng at the NASS and Asorock ( remember how Turai held us all hostage with her shakara? )!

But wait. . . . there are people here who believe they are not treated fairly by the police(we know too well of these class of americans who have either been raised to believe the police are their enemies or that the white man is out against them). Why do they themselves not act in much the same way?

Those that are treated unfairly by the police can report it and expect to receive justice.
Tell me how frequent that happens in Nigeria. How many can afford lawyers?

Ileke-IdI:

Those that are treated unfairly by the police can report it and expect to receive justice.
Tell me how frequent that happens in Nigeria. How many can afford lawyers?

Hold on . . . . now you claim folks cannot afford Lawyers? WOW !!!!

uumm . . . in the Show "WELCOME TO LAGOS", how did those men afford the lawyers they got? If Garbage pickers can afford to get themselves lawyers, how much more so the average person living in the same Lagos? Gosh people!!!

fstranger:

Stop saying system, there is no system in Lagos, or in Nigeria for that matter. Well, the case you sited is an isolated situation. And moreover, it really does not count because the "n" of cases like that is 1, making generalisation difficult. However, there are numerous cases of police brutality and it is collective knowledge that in whatever sutuation you find yourself, you have a better chance of getting off, scot-free, irrespective of your level of complicity, if you show some craziness. It is the way things work in Nigeria, not just on the street, but also at the very top, includinng at the NASS and Asorock ( remember how Turai held us all hostage with her shakara? )!

I really didn't expect to hear anything else from you after reading your post on your life in fear in America, honestly. There is a system and Fashola can tell you that it works. Even this particular Ufoma will tell you that the system works, you just need to step out of your fear-filled cocoon to take advantage of it. Thousands in Lagos take advantage of it daily but I know for a fact that there are many more out there who would rather pretend it does not work and spread those instead of actually going out to test it to get facts instead of lies to spread.


Anyone who lives in Lagos will tell you that Lagos is NOT the same as the rest of Nigeria. You can still get a lot done in Lagos than many other places in Nigeria. It is a fact. The court systems in Lagos work more, in my opinion than the federal level. So, again, I suggest people actually TRY the system before they right it off completely.

@Ileke-idi, you for one need to TRY the system out before you run believing what every tom, manliness and harry who claims to live in Nigeria says of it. You just witnessed someone who lives in America tell you that he does not have a home . . . that ought to inform you on the sort of persons you are likely dealing with. Stop generalizing please.