alexleo:


Sometimes we give them answer just for the sake of other readers who have open hearts to read and digest the message.
As for the likes of Dapo, your answers might be falling in a stony heart.

Who made my heart stony?

DavidKissinger:
Hello Xcapist,

First off, I must commend your writing. Nothing 's had me glued to Nairaland other than your journal. As a matter of fact, daily, I practically look forward to a new post from you. And when I eventually get one. Voila! My day is made! And No, it's not just something I read to idle away time, but something I read in a serene environment, something to reflect on.

From your diction to how you present your views, it's simply captivating. I read your entries and I see an older version of me (the religious stance sidelined, of course). But wholeheartedly, I say 'Thank You', you inspire me.. in far more ways than you'll ever know.

However, I'd like to know, what happened to your faith? What could have happened to a God-fearing, Church-loving, offering-giving, scripture-memorising, spirit-filled 'christian' that he'll suddenly turn 'bad' ? Was it a dreadful experience you had with your maker? Or is it all framed upon 'enlightening' books you've been reading?

I'd really love to hear from you.

And I apologise for my approach, I earnestly contemplated mailing you, but felt it was a tad too rigorous a process to follow. And if you will, I'll modify this post as soon as I get a reponse from you. Once more, I apologise

Thank you.

Well, well, well....your post above is definitely the best thing that has happened to me since joining Nairaland. It's so unbelievable. I'd never in my wildest dream imagine I was having such an effect on another person, especially not through my journals. So reading your post was so surreal. Thank you David. It really means a lot.

Now about your question, I hope to chronicle the answer in my journal in great detail. But, for now, it all boil down to knowing more about the history of the faith I once treasured so dearly. This was set in motion by a burning desire to really, really in all earnestness know God more, through a more rounded personal knowledge of his word guided, as I believed then, by his spirit. God I fasted!! Lol 21 days at the beginning of each year But as I got more knowledgeable and my mind grew, the pesky little nagging doubts that were once manageable became serious pointers to a grand foul play. My little curious self just couldn't let it go, I kept digging, favoring christian apologetics and theological writings at first but their answers were like band aids over cancer. So I decided to sincerely see things from the 'other side', putting my rose-tinted glasses down for a moment and what I saw and realised then was heartbreaking! It was like I unravel a murder mystery only to trace it to my father as the murderer...but I was no longer blind to the blindspot most Christians have so I didn't protect my 'father' - the murderer - but painfully turned him in if you get my drift.

I wouldn't mind talking some more if you want to.

Just know that I appreciate what you wrote. Thanks again.

Xcapist:


Well, well, well....your post above is definitely the best thing that has happened to me since joining Nairaland. It's so unbelievable. I'd never in my wildest dream imagine I was having such an effect on another person, especially not through my journals. So reading your post was so surreal. Thank you David. It really means a lot.

Now about your question, I hope to chronicle the answer in my journal in great detail. But, for now, it all boil down to knowing more about the history of the faith I once treasured so dearly. This was set in motion by a burning desire to really, really in all earnestness know God more, through a more rounded personal knowledge of his word guided, as I believed then, by his spirit. God I fasted!! Lol 21 days at the beginning of each year But as I got more knowledgeable and my mind grew, the pesky little nagging doubts that were once manageable became serious pointers to a grand foul play. My little curious self just couldn't let it go, I kept digging, favoring christian apologetics and theological writings at first but their answers were like band aids over cancer. So I decided to sincerely see things from the 'other side', putting my rose-tinted glasses down for a moment and what I saw and realised then was heartbreaking! It was like I unravel a murder mystery only to trace it to my father as the murderer...but I was no longer blind to the blindspot most Christians have so I didn't protect my 'father' - the murderer - but painfully turned him in if you get my drift.

I wouldn't mind talking some more if you want to.

Just know that I appreciate what you wrote. Thanks again.

Reads too much like my journey out of Islam

AgentOfAllah:


Reads too much like my journey out of Islam

Lol If seun gives u d opportunity yo change ur handlers name,What would u change it to?

Xcapist:


Well, well, well....your post above is definitely the best thing that has happened to me since joining Nairaland. It's so unbelievable. I'd never in my wildest dream imagine I was having such an effect on another person, especially not through my journals. So reading your post was so surreal. Thank you David. It really means a lot.

Now about your question, I hope to chronicle the answer in my journal in great detail. But, for now, it all boil down to knowing more about the history of the faith I once treasured so dearly. This was set in motion by a burning desire to really, really in all earnestness know God more, through a more rounded personal knowledge of his word guided, as I believed then, by his spirit. God I fasted!! Lol 21 days at the beginning of each year But as I got more knowledgeable and my mind grew, the pesky little nagging doubts that were once manageable became serious pointers to a grand foul play. My little curious self just couldn't let it go, I kept digging, favoring christian apologetics and theological writings at first but their answers were like band aids over cancer. So I decided to sincerely see things from the 'other side', putting my rose-tinted glasses down for a moment and what I saw and realised then was heartbreaking! It was like I unravel a murder mystery only to trace it to my father as the murderer...but I was no longer blind to the blindspot most Christians have so I didn't protect my 'father' - the murderer - but painfully turned him in if you get my drift.

I wouldn't mind talking some more if you want to.

Just know that I appreciate what you wrote. Thanks again.

Chaiii,But to the eyes of these Christians you were never a true believer,and you never had a personal relationship with God and you never knew Why you believed......

The truth is very bitter ......

Xcapist:


Well, well, well....your post above is definitely the best thing that has happened to me since joining Nairaland. It's so unbelievable. I'd never in my wildest dream imagine I was having such an effect on another person, especially not through my journals. So reading your post was so surreal. Thank you David. It really means a lot.

Now about your question, I hope to chronicle the answer in my journal in great detail. But, for now, it all boil down to knowing more about the history of the faith I once treasured so dearly. This was set in motion by a burning desire to really, really in all earnestness know God more, through a more rounded personal knowledge of his word guided, as I believed then, by his spirit. God I fasted!! Lol 21 days at the beginning of each year But as I got more knowledgeable and my mind grew, the pesky little nagging doubts that were once manageable became serious pointers to a grand foul play. My little curious self just couldn't let it go, I kept digging, favoring christian apologetics and theological writings at first but their answers were like band aids over cancer. So I decided to sincerely see things from the 'other side', putting my rose-tinted glasses down for a moment and what I saw and realised then was heartbreaking! It was like I unravel a murder mystery only to trace it to my father as the murderer...but I was no longer blind to the blindspot most Christians have so I didn't protect my 'father' - the murderer - but painfully turned him in if you get my drift.

I wouldn't mind talking some more if you want to.

Just know that I appreciate what you wrote. Thanks again.

you are always on point bro...
your writing skill is brilliant
your use of logic is great

you are one of those guy that made nairaland a place to be

Dapo777:


Chaiii,But to the eyes of these Christians you were never a true believer,and you never had a personal relationship with God and you never knew Why you believed......

The truth is very bitter ......

Exactly bro, exactly. Because if they accept that I once genuinely believed then it'll falsify Jesus' claim that all that the Father has given him can never be plucked from his hand. So which one is easier to accept, me being the liar or Jesus? You guessed right - me.

Dapo777:


Lol If seun gives u d opportunity yo change ur handlers name,What would u change it to?

I'll not change it...it's a useful reminder of where I came from, and how far I've come!

AgentOfAllah:


I'll not change it...it's a useful reminder of where I came from, and how far I've come!

Alright

Xcapist:


Exactly bro, exactly. Because if they accept that I once genuinely believed then it'll falsify Jesus' claim that all that the Father has given him can never be plucked from his hand. So which one is easier to accept, me being the liar or Jesus? You guessed right - me.

They Ar other countless lies that Jesus told in the Bible apart from that....
He is a confident liar,he even said we can move mountains with the words of our mouth Through faith......lol

Dapo777:


Chaiii,But to the eyes of these Christians you were never a true believer,and you never had a personal relationship with God and you never knew Why you believed......

The truth is very bitter ......

there u go .

Dapo777:


Chaiii,But to the eyes of these Christians you were never a true believer,and you never had a personal relationship with God and you never knew Why you believed......

The truth is very bitter ......

Those who experienced God personally and genuinely cannot be deceived that there is no God. It is the ones who see God through the eyes of their pastors and churches that have the tendency of being deceived that there is no God.

There is a difference between a christian who slacked back in his/her walk with God yet believes in God and the one who slumps into atheism.

alexleo:


Those who experienced God personally and genuinely cannot be deceived that there is no God. It is the ones who see God through the eyes of their pastors and churches that have the tendency of being deceived that there is no God.

There is a difference between a christian who slacked back in his/her walk with God yet believes in God and the one who slumps into atheism.

Lol...classic! Quick question: Have you experienced god "personally and genuinely"? If so, how does it look? Has it got a gender? Did it talk to you?

I feel the need to set the record straight at this point. I've said it some place else but let me repeat myself here. I DO NOT discredit the concept of a 'creator', at least not yet. I've not reach that point in my journey where I absolutely disbelieve the "existence" of a "god", I don't know if I'll eventually take that path or not but that's inconsequential because if there's a creator God, it's not your unstable, unsubstantiated Yahweh. End of story.

alexleo:


Those who experienced God personally and genuinely cannot be deceived that there is no God. It is the ones who see God through the eyes of their pastors and churches that have the tendency of being deceived that there is no God.

There is a difference between a christian who slacked back in his/her walk with God yet believes in God and the one who slumps into atheism.

Is it not speaking it tongues and being pushed by the holy ghost that u call experiencing God? I have experienced God If that is What it means to experience God,It's not deceit that God doesn't exist,It's evidential in the Bible itself. Reading the Bible alone with a plain mind is enough to make someone disbelief the existence of God,with all the contradictions, evil acts and stupid statements in it.

I refused to be brainwashed, I refused to be blinded by faith,I refused to pursue an elusive perfection and holiness the Bible ask us to pursue after making it clear That's It's not possible to attain perfection and holiness,What an irony,[color=#770077][/color]

asalimpo:


there u go .

Go Where?[color=#770077][/color]

Xcapist:


Exactly bro, exactly. Because if they accept that I once genuinely believed then it'll falsify Jesus' claim that all that the Father has given him can never be plucked from his hand. So which one is easier to accept, me being the liar or Jesus? You guessed right - me.

sorry bro. Aint tryna bother u.
But wat i said to dapo777 probably applies to you.
You dont know sb , say ur spouse,then doubt their existence.
You can divorce your spouse, Demas turned his back on God and returned to d world, but not arrive @ doubts about their existence.
Som people do d activities religiously, church-attendance,fasting,praying (in church),but on their own No.
Wen d strms of life hit,their tru beliefs come forth.
Wen a prayer is delayed or severe tragedy strikes , they get offended in God and giv up.
Mayb i shud say,ppl like this hav no deep roots in God.
(The parable of the Sower).
You are responsible for determining how deep your roots in God go.
Not God.
In the parable of d sower,the hearts tht proved God,i.e bore fruits, are those tht stayed with it.
The held on to d end.
Job held on to d end and proved God. God didnt look like he existed wen Job lost his wealth,status in society, health and family.
But Job held on.
Job's wife advised him to quit God. Curse him and die.
Joseph proved God.
Ruth proved God - wen d other woman turned back.
It seems u got hit. Then u gave up.
This is all part of d game.
But nothing has happened to you,
no doubt has befallen u tht hasnt befallen others. Yet, while som will fail and turn back, others will forge on .

asalimpo:


there u go .

I think you were the one that made the stupid statement that it is right for babies to be smashed against the rock.
Let me help u out of ur illusion........
Open ur Bible to Ezekiel 18:20 here God is telling us that a son won't be punished for his father's sin ,Which is a normal sense of justice......
But several places in the same Bible innocent babies are killed for the sins of their father and you call that right? are you sure you are Ok? Are u in ur normal state of thinking at all?
Can you see just one of the thousands of contradictions found in the Bible...........
Is it that Yahweh can't keep a simple promise of Ezekiel 18:20 or that yahweh is a blatant liar ?

None of the above............

Yahweh simply doesn't exist,man created Yahweh to give ancient people something They could fear,So at least They would be a little bit of order........

Are you still confused? Do you need more examples?

This is to all the Christians here not just you alone......

Dapo777:


But that doesn't answer my simple question.
Who made me imperfect?

you were born in sin.
Your spirit is dead to God.
You need to b born again, ur spirit recreated and ur mind renewed with d word of God - then you will know what ur inheritance is in Him (Jesus)
and the riches of being a christian.
Do u see tht there's work involved?
It takes time to bag a phd too.
U can get born again yet ur mind un renewed. Thats wats plaguing d average Nigerian christian.

asalimpo:

you were born in sin.
Your spirit is dead to God.
You need to b born again, ur spirit recreated and ur mind renewed with d word of God - then you will know what ur inheritance is in Him (Jesus)
and the riches of being a christian.
Do u see tht there's work involved?
It takes time to bag a phd too.
U can get born again yet ur mind un renewed. Thats wats plaguing d average Nigerian christian.

Since I was born in sin,So how is it my fault? Why should I be struggling to change the very nature in Which God created me? Is it my fault, why didn't Dey born me in holiness?

asalimpo:

sorry bro. Aint tryna bother u.
But wat i said to dapo777 probably applies to you.
You dont know sb , say ur spouse,then doubt their existence.
You can divorce your spouse, Demas turned his back on God and returned to d world, but not arrive @ doubts about their existence.
Som people do d activities religiously, church-attendance,fasting,praying (in church),but on their own No.
Wen d strms of life hit,their tru beliefs come forth.
Wen a prayer is delayed or severe tragedy strikes , they get offended in God and giv up.
Mayb i shud say,ppl like this hav no deep roots in God.
(The parable of the Sower).
You are responsible for determining how deep your roots in God go.
Not God.
In the parable of d sower,the hearts tht proved God,i.e bore fruits, are those tht stayed with it.
The held on to d end.
Job held on to d end and proved God. God didnt look like he existed wen Job lost his wealth,status in society, health and family.
But Job held on.
Job's wife advised him to quit God. Curse him and die.
Joseph proved God.
Ruth proved God - wen d other woman turned back.
It seems u got hit. Then u gave up.
This is all part of d game.
But nothing has happened to you,
no doubt has befallen u tht hasnt befallen others. Yet, while som will fail and turn back, others will forge on .

Brother, I get your point. Because unlike you, I've been on both sides of this divide and I can see where the two view points often collide. Ahmm, well if you'd read one of my previous posts on this thread you'd known that I'm not one of the typical "I'm-angry-at-god-so-I'm-gonna-say-I-don't-believe-in-him-to-get-back-at-him" sort. Few atheists are actually.

If your only knowledge of god comes from one book written thousands of years back do you think you have a well rounded view of the issue? Do you know that just a few centuries ago people use to believe that the earth was flat like a table top and it has edges that one can fall off from? Archaic right? If you claim you've "experienced" god personally based on a sense of peace he gives or the joy or warm glow in the heart, then you're yet to be acquainted with the full capability of the human mind. Ask devout Muslims, and Mormons, and Buddhists, and you'll be shocked that your "feeling the presence of god in this place" is not unique to the Christian experience. People have been having strong convictions about weird things since time immemorial.

That said, I think your analogy is quite flawed. If I had a wife, understand that I've seen her, touched her, spoken to her, argued with her, made love to her...she's a substantial person that everyone can see and experience in a similar way. Mortal. Matter. Having weight and occupying a definite space. But is that so with god? Have I seen him, touched him, and have audible conversations with him? Have you? ...everything is about faith, faith, faith. Do you believe Muhammed also received the word of God? Why or why not?

Your analogy would have been better able to hold water if you used a non physical entity, say an imaginary wife instead. Some kids have imaginary friends and people may think it's cute but if they grow in to adults still carrying their imaginary friends around, that's a mental illness known as schizophrenia and sooner or later they'll be committed to an institution or....will you take any adult with an imaginary kangaroo buddy seriously? You catch my drift?

sheunfemix, you've been sighted! How're things going on your end? How was service today.

Oops, hope I don't get banned for derailing my own thread

Dapo777:


I think you were the one that made the stupid statement that it is right for babies to be smashed against the rock.
Let me help u out of ur illusion........
Open ur Bible to Ezekiel 18:20 here God is telling us that a son won't be punished for his father's sin ,Which is a normal sense of justice......
But several places in the same Bible innocent babies are killed for the sins of their father and you call that right? are you sure you are Ok? Are u in ur normal state of thinking at all?
Can you see just one of the thousands of contradictions found in the Bible...........
Is it that Yahweh can't keep a simple promise of Ezekiel 18:20 or that yahweh is a blatant liar ?

None of the above............

Yahweh simply doesn't exist,man created Yahweh to give ancient people something They could fear,So at least They would be a little bit of order........

Are you still confused? Do you need more examples?

This is to all the Christians here not just you alone......

i said tht (within context of course) and it wasnt silly as u say.
The babies were killed before growing up.
I stated a reason,though not biblically supported-there's no scripture explaining God's position on the matter so my explanation is a conjecture.
- the babies are decimated because it is better tht they b killed then than that they grow up into evil spawns before they are contained.
I also stressed about the perversion of d babylonians. The old testament and even historical records support d points i made.
Secondly, God has the property of seeing into d future. While man doesnt, the decision he takes may not sit well with humans who don't see the big picture.
Two, God has the prerogative over creation because He created everything. If a potter is making a vessel, he can choose to destroy the vessel while on d spinning wheel and remain faultless in the eyes of the law.
He can because he is the owner of d clay,the wheel etc.
The clay can't sue the potter to court.

Please,wipe out of ur mind the picture of modern day democratic legitness.
God is a Sovereign. He could very well do anything He likes and still b legally correct.
And there's nothing you or man can do or say! But he has isnt wanton. Because of His very nature-LOVE.
Suprised. Yeah. But love doesnt mean sentimentallity . Love does what is right and just.

Let me ask you- if God ordered d killing of Hitler,osama bin laden, boko haram founder at infancy what wud you say?
He's wicked. Right. Tht innocent hitler baby, tht cute osama child.
You'd judge pre maturely until
the abuja bomb blast. 9/11 , ww2.
Until widows and orphans wish such people were never born.

You don't know enough to judge God.

Oga m.

I'm not here to argue with you.

Nor to convert you to Christianity.

I'm here to know why you keep talking about this God that you don't believe in.

Does it make sense to create posts and spend hours talking about something that does not exist?

Why not do your thing and let Christians and their God be?

Honestly the fact that you keep talking about God makes it impossible to believe that you are atheist truly.

Tallesty1:
Oga m.

I'm not here to argue with you.

Nor to convert you to Christianity.

I'm here to know why you keep talking about this God that you don't believe in.

Does it make sense to create posts and spend hours talking about something that does not exist?

Why not do your thing and let Christians and their God be?

Honestly the fact that you keep talking about God makes it impossible to believe that you are atheist truly.

Tallesty1 finally posts a non on my thread. Yay! It only gets better.

I'm not sure if this is originally addressed to me, but seeing that the description fits me lemme answer.

This is an online forum bro where people can hold conversations in the form of posted messages on what interests them. The conversations are held out of individual free will, and no one is compelled to participate. To the best of my knowledge I'm not trying to hurt or harm any person by my involvement in this discourses. If my participation however hurts someone, I apologise... and there's an "unfollow" link underneath \/ \/ \/, fell free to use it.

If I tell you that religion is an interest of mine, is that wrong. I'm here for the same reason you have atheists as professors of theology and bible history. It's a free world. God bless.

Xcapist:


Brother, I get your point. Because unlike you, I've been on both sides of this divide and I can see where the two view points often collide. Ahmm, well if you'd read one of my previous posts on this thread you'd known that I'm not one of the typical "I'm-angry-at-god-so-I'm-gonna-say-I-don't-believe-in-him-to-get-back-at-him" sort. Few atheists are actually.

If your only knowledge of god comes from one book written thousands of years back do you think you have a well rounded view of the issue? Do you know that just a few centuries ago people use to believe that the earth was flat like a table top and it has edges that one can fall off from? Archaic right? If you claim you've "experienced" god personally based on a sense of peace he gives or the joy or warm glow in the heart, then you're yet to be acquainted with the full capability of the human mind. Ask devout Muslims, and Mormons, and Buddhists, and you'll be shocked that your "feeling the presence of god in this place" is not unique to the Christian experience. People have been having strong convictions about weird things since time immemorial.

That said, I think your analogy is quite flawed. If I had a wife, understand that I've seen her, touched her, spoken to her, argued with her, made love to her...she's a substantial person that everyone can see and experience in a similar way. Mortal. Matter. Having weight and occupying a definite space. But is that so with god? Have I seen him, touched him, and have audible conversations with him? Have you? ...everything is about faith, faith, faith. Do you believe Muhammed also received the word of God? Why or why not?

Your analogy would have been better if you used a non human entity, maybe an imaginary friend. Some kids have those and people may think it's cute but if they grow in to adults still carrying their imaginary friends around, that's a mental illness known as schizophrenia and sooner or later they'll be committed to an institution or....will you take any adult with an imaginary kangaroo buddy seriously? You catch my drift?

i get ur drift. But dont agree with all of it. Ofcourse, being tht ur going of the grid (of God) we wont necessarily agree.

The stand tht a book written 1000s of years ago is outdated is a wrong assumption.
In other words, the bible needs revising.
The bible is a book not on fashion trends or style Guide but on something more permanent.
God, man's relationship with Him, man's relationship with man,
sin, the state of man, origin of evil, the future of the world,
daily living guide etc.
The essence of the message of d bible is timeless. Som of its imagery is understandably dated but not its message. We dont use oxens on farms. We dont move in chariots anymore . But the bible principles are so applicable tht all successful nations model their legal system on it-though they won't admit it.

E.g the bible says Employers shouldnt delay in payg labourers their wages. Is there in a 1000 years a better instruction than this?
What of anger management?
The bible says anger rest in d bossom of fools (wanton anger of course. Cuz theyre times wen anger is necessary)
that sombody who can't control his anger is like a city with broken down walls?
- the bible on friendship and making friends says,
He who wants friends must show himself friendly!
- what of on money issues?
It says he who loves silver (money) will never b satisfied with it?
- money answereth all things has entered everyday language.
- if u wait for perfect conditions, you wont sow ur seed

in disputes with others?
- it is the nature of prince to overlook small things (paraphrased)

- wat of on talkativeness?
Be swift to hear,slow to speak.
A wise man watches his words a fool says watever comes to his mind (paraphrased)

one doesnt even need to b born again to use som principles.
Many parts of d bible ar closed books to me but overall,
it is a very rich book.
As a matter of fact it is edifying.

Yes,the physcal feeling of peace is very reassuring. But the bible explicitly states that the peace of God is different from d peace of the world.
This peace isnt automatic though,
christians still need to know how to operate in it and yield to it.
Do muslims hav peace?
Then why are they so blood thirsty? Do suicide bombers get driven by peace?
The devil can create counterfeit feelings. But remember, peace in d bible isnt just a feel good thing,it is suppose to b the abiding and directing atmosphere of d heart.
Two peace is based on a foundation. An assurance.
..
In another place it says,
"Casting all your care upon him for he cares for you".
(now 99% of christians dont practice this as they shud. I included. But
its good and assurg.)
You hav peace because you are assured tht God will handle the situation. Tht He will never leave you. Tht you will not face life's challenges alone.
This peace of God is an anchor to the christians soul.

Xcapist:


Exactly bro, exactly. Because if they accept that I once genuinely believed then it'll falsify Jesus' claim that all that the Father has given him can never be plucked from his hand. So which one is easier to accept, me being the liar or Jesus? You guessed right - me.

Jesus' claim?? I know that "once saved" is not "always saved". So where's this claim?

BreezyRita:


Jesus' claim?? I know that "once saved" is not "always saved". So where's this claim?

That's what you know. This is what Jesus said:

John 10:28-29:
And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Other scriptures shed light on a christian turning back:

Jesus also said:
"no man having put his hand to the plow and turns back is fit for the kingdom..." luke9: 62

a christian can backslide:
Demas a co worker with paul quit the ministry - 2Tim4:10

if you reject him he will reject you.

2 Tim2:12
"if we endure,we will also reign with him.
If we disown him,he will also disown us"

Hebrew6:4-6
says something about som1 who once knew God but fell away.

these scriptures answer your question. You can walk out on the relationship.

asalimpo:

i get ur drift. But dont agree with all of it. Ofcourse, being tht ur going of the grid (of God) we wont necessarily agree.

The stand tht a book written 1000s of years ago is outdated is a wrong assumption.
In other words, the bible needs revising.
The bible is a book not on fashion trends or style Guide but on something more permanent.
God, man's relationship with Him, man's relationship with man,
sin, the state of man, origin of evil, the future of the world,
daily living guide etc.
The essence of the message of d bible is timeless. Som of its imagery is understandably dated but not its message. We dont use oxens on farms. We dont move in chariots anymore . But the bible principles are so applicable tht all successful nations model their legal system on it-though they won't admit it.

E.g the bible says Employers shouldnt delay in payg labourers their wages. Is there in a 1000 years a better instruction than this?
What of anger management?
The bible says anger rest in d bossom of fools (wanton anger of course. Cuz theyre times wen anger is necessary)
that sombody who can't control his anger is like a city with broken down walls?
- the bible on friendship and making friends says,
He who wants friends must show himself friendly!
- what of on money issues?
It says he who loves silver (money) will never b satisfied with it?
- money answereth all things has entered everyday language.
- if u wait for perfect conditions, you wont sow ur seed

in disputes with others?
- it is the nature of prince to overlook small things (paraphrased)

- wat of on talkativeness?
Be swift to hear,slow to speak.
A wise man watches his words a fool says watever comes to his mind (paraphrased)

one doesnt even need to b born again to use som principles.
Many parts of d bible ar closed books to me but overall,
it is a very rich book.
As a matter of fact it is edifying.

Yes,the physcal feeling of peace is very reassuring. But the bible explicitly states that the peace of God is different from d peace of the world.
This peace isnt automatic though,
christians still need to know how to operate in it and yield to it.
Do muslims hav peace?
Then why are they so blood thirsty? Do suicide bombers get driven by peace?
The devil can create counterfeit feelings. But remember, peace in d bible isnt just a feel good thing,it is suppose to b the abiding and directing atmosphere of d heart.
Two peace is based on a foundation. An assurance.
..
In another place it says,
"Casting all your care upon him for he cares for you".
(now 99% of christians dont practice this as they shud. I included. But
its good and assurg.)
You hav peace because you are assured tht God will handle the situation. Tht He will never leave you. Tht you will not face life's challenges alone.
This peace of God is an anchor to the christians soul.

Bro, I totally get you. I've used the same paradigm of thought in the past so believe me when I say I understand. You are still a christian and an "insider", I don't mean this in a condescending way but you show a deficit in understanding any view outside what you're accustomed to - your bible.

You should note this; I'm not the demon who's been released from the pits of hell to attack your faith , just a fellow journeyer on this trip called life trying to make sense of the experience. So I invite you to keep an open mind.

You've quoted some scriptural verses that present noble thoughts. But have you ever come across the horrendously ugly ones? Ones so horrendous that they can not have a place in today's modern world whether Christians like it or not. Will you ever consider stoning your own son to dead for being stubborn? Will you stone a girl to death because she was raped? Will you ever smash a baby on a rock because god ask you to? Will you kill people because they lied about their offering money? Do you feel we should turn the other cheek for Boko Horam to retweet slaps? It's all in your bible...

Bro, I think you're a tad prejudiced in your view of Muslims. Some of the best people I've met and contributed to my life are Muslim. They're not all terrorists. What will you say about the crusades, the witch hunts and even the contemporary genocide of Muslims by Christians in Central Africa? Christians are not innocent of these atrocities. I now believe we only have good people and bad people. Simple.

And it's obvious you've not met genuine spiritual people from other faiths. You are not them, you can't ascertain the genuineness of their experience since it's their experience not yours. How will you feel if I told your glossolalia (aka speaking in tongues) is fake without first experiencing it myself?

Xcapist:


Bro, I totally get you. I've used the same paradigm of thought in the past so believe me when I say I understand. You are still a christian and an "insider", I don't mean this in a condescending way but you show a deficit in understanding any view outside what you're accustomed to - your bible.

You should note this; I'm not the demon who's been released from the pits of hell to attack your faith , just a fellow journeyer on this trip called life trying to make sense of the experience. So I invite you to keep an open mind.

You've quoted some scriptural verses that present noble thoughts. But have you ever come across the horrendously ugly ones? Ones so horrendous that the can not have a place in today's modern world whether Christians want it or not. Will you ever consider stoning your own son to dead for being stubborn? Will you stone a girl to death because she was raped? Will you ever smash a baby to the world because god ask you to? Do you feel we should turn the other cheek on Boko Horam issue? It's all in your bible...

Bro, I think you're a tad prejudiced in your view of Muslims. Some of the best people I've met and contributed to my life are Muslim. They're not all terrorists. What will you say about the crusades, the witch hunts and even the contemporary genocide of Muslims by Christians in Central Africa? Christians are not innocent of these atrocities. I now believe we only have good people and bad people. Simple.

And it's obvious you've not met genuine spiritual people from other faiths. You are not them, you can't ascertain the genuineness of their experience since it's their experience not yours. How will you feel if I told your glossolalia (aka speaking in tongues) is fake without first experiencing it myself?

dude asalimpo vouched for the smashing of babies skulls' as ordained by "god" in the bible so he pretty much is very delusional...