₦airaland Forum

BetaThings: But the same US allows death penalty
I also hope that you know poly amorous relationship/open marriage as well fa.,orty is lawful in the US and that is against Christian teaching

Remember what I said, some of it's laws have Christian foundation. The United States doesn't allow death penalty - Individual States are responsible for their own laws and a Jury decides (regular people) if the crime committed warrants a death penalty or not. This is only in some States and not all. The issue of gay marriage is even at the Supreme Court right now, some States have passed laws to allow it and other States it is illegal.

So why do Christian principals beat up muslim students wearing hijab in public schools
Is it Christian law or secular law that is so breached by those students?

Not that I don't believe you. However, please provide some evidence. Is it an isolated case? I can definitely tell you that if you harm another person(s) i.e. assault, you will face the authorities. Obviously, it is a secular law.

In this day and age, it is difficult to know what is going on in Iran. Some are true, some are propaganda

Fair enough but that doesn't rule out persecution of religious minorities

The country is a theology
On paper, it is death penalty. Some Saudi have converted from Islam

What theological system is in place? Can you provide links to the Saudis that have converted and tell us if they are still living in Saudi Arabia?

I agree, but you also know that the Vatican has evolved. Popes of old approved killing for heresy
Now has christian rules changed or secularism has become more voluble and influential?

See the reaction to the Pope's clampdown on those eccentric "nuns" in the US. Is he no longer the head of the church?
I support the Pope though. If you want to do charity, you don't have to be a nun to do it
But you cannot stand on charity to oppose Christian doctrines from within catholicism

I agree

BetaThings: Asking me to shut up is a way to allow your lies to go unchallenged
Show me a truly Christian state and I would show you the discrimination
Even when the war in Iraq was to be fought, Palin called it a task from God. What is that and WMD?
Even some Christians discriminate against non-Christians cadets at West Point
Read this. Imagine if this guys had their own Christian country
http://harpers.org/archive/2009/05/jesus-killed-mohammed/



You repeated what I said. And Turkey is not secular because of EU. Kermal Ataturk died before the founding of the EU. Afterall when did EU come into being?
Please when did Tunisia experience the effects of Islamic extremism?
Every theological state precludes practice of other religions
You can practice Christianity in Iran. It is not a crime
Please stop feeding people lies




Just like it is illegal to chew gum in Singapore!
Can I abuse Awolowo freely in Ikenne or Ojukwu in Nnewi
I cannot debate the holocaust in several countries in Europe even as an academic exercise as a student
So every country has its rules. You can show affection in public - no kissing though and no public intimacy
Saudi is a theological state. And there is no mosque in the theological state of the Vatican

Incorrect. If they were using Christian laws, abortion, homo.sexuality etc would be illegal
Even saying Jesus is not God would be a crime - blasphemy which was the case in Britain when they were using Christian laws
They are not using Christian laws, Sir
Please let us state facts

There is no true Christian State, the US is a Secular state - I mentioned that but most of it's laws are based on jeo/christian values. For example, it is illegal to marry more than one wife in the US. That is a Christian teaching. The point I am trying to make here is about freedom to practice whatever religion you believe in.

So I am lying that Iran cracks down on religious minorities abi - http://www.foxnews.com/world/2013/03/22/nursing-mothers-imprisoned-un-report-details-iranian-persecution-non-muslims/. In this day and age, you can't deny such mate.

Saudi is an Islamic State, I never spoke about building a church - I talked about religious minorities worshiping freely without arrest. The right to congregate, the write to believe in anything than Islam is a crime there. It's a death penalty to convert a muslim. No one will kill you for been a muslim or worshiping Allah in the Vatican or converting a Catholic to Islam

lacum: @alex, i dont like comnenting here because u pentecostals wont like to blive even after seeing d truth. jesus wouldnt have put all authoeity on d bible alone(as we have it today)because in his time they were other sacred writings which were used by d jews since jesus was a jew and d earlly xtians. in mat.28 jesus sent his church to go and preach and dat he will b wit dem till end of d world. so d authority should be on d church not bible. i know dis will b difficult for u since u feal dat d church's teachings are wrong but d truth is dat d church is not wrong because of d promise of christ. if bible alone is d authority st. paul wont have told us to stick to tradition(Gods words and d deeds of d apostles passed down by wors of mouth no written).
DID MARY ASK US TO PRAY THROUGH HER?
most of d teachings in d bible were never direct. for instance, jesus never opened his mouth to say"i am GOD" but we believe he is God since d bible said so using oda things he said, like"i and d father are one" so mary's intersection also come from d bible as well as tradition (d wedding at cana is a good example). u must forget those who say mary is dead like DESIKA because it means dat anybeing not physically alive is dead when d bible says otherwise. pls see d truth and not argue blindly

No one is arguing blindly mate. The physical Bible wasn't even compiled when Jesus was alive. The topic at hand is that the Bible is an invention - to that I disagree. That is my point

BetaThings: There is no religion that does not treat people differently based on their religious leanings
Christians tell me all the time that I will go to hell
A land of Islam is not necessarily a country that has a majority muslim population, otherwise Turkey or Tunisia would be
A land of Islam is ruled by Shariah
Tell me how non-Muslims are treated so poorly when you can hear Igbos spoken freely on thew streets of Dubai and they live voluntarily and happily in Saudi Arabia
A lot of non-Muslim Nigerians remained in Libya even after the war started
Now show me a country governed according to rules of Christianity and tell me how they treat non-Christians

Christians killed Jews for centuries, blaming them for all ills
Please don't spread misinformation - it belittles Christianity

Stop surface quoting and playing pretend. I will address you statements one at a time and gently disarm them

1. There is no religion that does not treat people differently based on their religious leanings. Christians tell me all the time that I will go to hell - By Christians telling you that you will go to hell, means they are treating you differently? Christians tell one another they will go to hell if they die in their Sin. So, how is that treating you differently? You are free to worship Allah and go to your mosque in secular states like the US because there is religious freedom (Are you treated differently based on your religious beliefs?) but it a CRIME in Saudi Arabia to worship in a Church. Omo, stop talking because you have a mouth. If you don't have anything important to say then shut-up.

2. A land of Islam is not necessarily a country that has a majority Muslim population, otherwise Turkey or Tunisia would be land of Islam is ruled by Shariah = Turkey is a democratic, secular, unitary, constitutional republic; it is not an Islamic state. It wants to join the EU so it can't be an Islamic state. Tunisia has tasted the effects of Islamic extremist so it's not up for it either. However, Saudi Arabia, Iran and other Islamic republics have made it a crime for other religion to be practice in their land based on the teaching of the Quran

3. Tell me how non-Muslims are treated so poorly when you can hear Igbos spoken freely on thew streets of Dubai and they live voluntarily and happily in Saudi Arabia = I worked in Dubai, Dubai relies on foreign workers from Technology to construction. However, there it's illegal to show affection in public (Which kind freedom be that). In Saudi, it's a crime to own a Bible or go to church - so what freedom are you talking about?

4. Now show me a country governed according to rules of Christianity and tell me how they treat non-Christians = The US, UK, Australia; even though they are secular nations, their laws are based on Christian principles. Any muslim is free to worship without treat of arrest, death or imprisonment.

So, wetin you dey talk?

mojibbz: holy prophet Muhammad never ordered people to be killed.. instead he showed mercy and when the pains and suffering endured from the disbelievers of Makkah was getting out of hand, he took permission from Allah(SWT) to fight in the battles of uhud and badr... you should know more about something before interfering!!!

Do you read the Quran at all? What about the Hadith? You posted here and didn't even think you should back up what you posted. Oya, let me give you some Islamic and history teachings

According to Islamic scripture, Muhammad lead an amazing twenty-six battles, a full military career by any standard. The most common Islamic excuse is that they were "defensive" battles. Think about that for a second. Muhammad must have lived in some insane parallel universe were all humans went berserk

Historically, warfare has often revolved around survival / pragmatic Darwinian scenarios. Its usually a careful calculation were risk / reward is paramount. After all, their lives are at stake, so it better be worth it.

So Muslims want us to believe that, despite the fact that Muhammad was not the possessor of any natural resources, nevertheless, the mere sight of him and his flock made people go berserk and attack constantly abi? So all the wars and battles he fought was defensive, he never fought or attacked anyone abi?

After one of these battles, Muhammad ordered that eight-hundred of the captured be beheaded. This is almost certainly the greatest mass beheading in human history (see Ibn Ishaq's description of the killing of the Banu Qurayza). I suppose that was "defensive" mass beheading. - I have highlighted by source in BOLD. This is just one example oh! I have plenty plenty more for you

chukwudi44: The doctrine of 'bible alone' more commonly known as sola scripture

Sola Scriptura is not a denial of other authorities governing Christian life and devotion. It simply demands that all other authorities are subordinate to, and are to be corrected by, the written word of God. How is that different from say the Law of Moses?

matrix789: Jesus made the laws he gave to Moses,but when they came to him that they caught the woman in adultery.
What did Jesus do?
he had to respect the laws of the land.You cannot take life.

A muslim can only kill for a justifiable cause. The question is what is the Justifiable cause.
the sentence it is subjective(application to the human)So what is Justifiable to me to kill a fellow human being?

Islam divides the world’s population into two camps, Dar Al-Harb (House of War) where Jews and Christians live, and Dar Al-Islam (House of Islam) where Muslims live. That means, they treat you differently based on your religious leanings

maclatunji: This is ignorance at its peak. At the beginning Boko Haram were targeting and killing Islamic scholars who spoke against their ideology. Their attacks on churches may be spectacular but it is safe to say that a lot more Muslims have been killed as a result of Boko Haram activities.

People just say things and hold them as facts in Nigeria even when they aren't true.

How is it safe to say more muslims have been killed? Where are your facts and source? I agree that BH is targeting and killing both Muslims and Christians.

chukwudi44: Sola scripture or sola bible is a doctrine invented by martin luther.Christ or his apostles never instituted this doctrine as the biblical canon didn't even exis during their time

Which doctrine(s) exactly are you referring to?

chukwudi44: Bros what do you really understand by the term bible? You really think the bible had existed in its present form from time immemorial? The books of the bible had existed seperately and not as a collection of scriptures.

These books were not the only sacred writings existing therein.There were over 100 writings in circulation until the catholic church deemed it fit in the fourth century to select a canon of the scriptures for christians.This is how the bible came to be.

By 'bible alone' was invented by martin luther, I meant the teaching that everything done in church must be in the bible was a teaching invented by martin luther.

Going back to KJV bible,that edition only came about in the seventeenth century.The first bible per say would be St Jerome's latin vulgate translated more than a 1000yrs before King James even lived.

I never said it existed in it's present form. I am saying the contents of the Bible - The Jewish laws and events, Christ teachings wasn't an invention. These are not doctrines contrary to what you stated.

chukwudi44: It seems you do not understand simple english abi? Is there any where I claimed catholics wrote the OT?

My point is that catholics decided what books should be in the bible.and mind you the king james edition only came on board after about 1200 yrs after the bible was compiled by the catholic church

Here are your words - Bible alone is a doctrine invented by martin luther. It is not a scriptural injunction so don't come and foist it on us - Perhaps you don't know the implication of this statement - it means the entire Bible, both old and new, were invented.

If it is not scriptural or if it was invented as you claim - how come it tallies with the dead sea scroll that predates this invention?

Which manuscripts was KJV compiled from?

chukwudi44: If you have nothing else to say I suggest you bury your head in shame.Bible alone is a doctrine invented by martin luther.It is not a scriptural injunction so don't come and foist it on us.

I really don't know how to intelligently engage you. So, the KJV was written by the Catholic Church? If yes, why is there doctrine of confessing sins to the Priest not in it nor the worship of Mary? Are those not doctrines of the Catholic Church

The laws of Moses and the prophets of the Jews run through the Old testament? They are confirmed in the Dead Sea Scrolls. So Martin Luther and the Catholic Church wrote those as well abi? Goooosh!

chukwudi44: My friend go and research history of the biblical canon.The canon of the christian scriptures did not exist until it was created by the catholic church in the fourth century @ the synod of hippo 393CE and council of carthage 397CE.prior to that the bible did not exist.Even some biblical authours quoted and reffered us to books outside the canonised canon.

Cha Cha Cha Cha! So, how many Catholic priest wrote the Bible?

tintingz: Jesus hate the jews, he cursed the jews, he condemn the jews, he want the jews killed but he had little followers(as he wish the jews to be killed)..... Dont forget Jesus said the disturbing believers should cut of their hands and pluk out their eyes

Oh i thought Jesus was Jehovah in old testament or was he not??

Did you read my last response or is your brain in denial mode again? Were did he want the jews killed - Can you provide some evidence before you make yourself look dumb again

Disturbing believer should cut off their hands and pluck out their eyes - THIS "JESUS" YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT SOUNDS LIKE YOUR MOHAMMED OH

Vidamia: Religion bigot.........religion fanatic.........i hope all these muslim haters ain't live with muslim.........

Nobody has issues living with muslims - it's muslims that have issues living with others. Case in point. Boko Haram and Ansaru in Northern Nigeria. Tell them to live in peace with others. Abi, isn't Islam a religion of "PEACE" after-all?

sino: Ha! very good, how beautiful you explained the Jesus Violent verses in the bible(mind you, there are more violent verses in the bible and yes, yes, i know its the old testament lol), it wasnt so hard was it? And you didnt feel anyway disturbed that i might not totally accept what you are saying shey? but you really want me to, cos you believe its the truth abi?

The verses were written in simple english na, how come you need to quote from other parts of the scripture to explain? How come you need to tell me a story about a king and his servant? Why in the world did you need to tell me that it was a parable?! Why can't i just take the statement as it is?

Now next time you want to post verses from the Qur'an that supports violence, you should think about your own posts about jesus preaching violence in the bible and this my post too

Before you misconstrue my submission, let me simply inform you that, those verses are commands to fight no doubt, but there is a context, there is a history, and there is a shariah(rulings) as regards to interpretation of those verses, and it would do you a lot of good if you go study a little about Islam from Muslims perhaps you start from the link posted by tintingz.

Thank you.

And the context is from the Hadith - do you want us to explore the Hadith to get the entire/true meaning of those verses?

tintingz: i will ask you again was Jesus all peaceful in the bible??

I can quote out the hatred Jesus had for the jews...all the curses and condemnation and dont forget the OT bible is full of Jehova's war victory

Oh yes the jews are still doubting if Jesus(as) was the one cruxified cuz it look silly to them to kill an innocent man... As the Quran said it was made shown to them as if he(Jesus) was killed but Jesus son of Mary(as) was not killed!!

The christian crusaders are out there you didnt condemn them... Lol MEND the new crusaders are planning to attack mosques, Killing imams...

Bros watchu saying again...?

So, where in the Bible did Jesus order his followers to cut off the feet and those of His enemies. Stop the Crusader nonsense - it's old story. Tell us where Jesus raided Caravans, tell us how many battles He was engaged in. Until then, focus on the topic and stop going all over the place. While you are at it - tell us from the BIBLE where Mary was 9 as you CLAIMED

Why do we have to emulate him (SAW) precisely?
I can have an MD as a mentor but it does not mean I have an official car and driver
An exemption is an exemption

Why do you guys not get your fact rights or conceal some burden he (SAW) bore
He (SAW) did not marry 20 wives
He (SAW) married only widows, apart from Aisha. You don't mention this fact
He (SAW)had to pray at night compulsorily. I am exempted from that you guys don't mention it

I will emulate his (SAW) manner of prayer, fasting, giving voluntary and mandatory alms, hajj procedures, seeking forgiveness, paying the workman promptly before hie sweat dries, not looking down on the poor, thanking Allah etc

So the rules don't apply to the MD? If the company pass a policy and say S.EX.UA.L HARASSMENT is against company policy. By your explanation, your MD is exempted but the rules apply to everyone else abi. He can se.xu.all.y harass all women in the company and it will be alright but if others do it - it's a crime right. You will only find such 6th century cave-man thinking in Islam. Where is your common sense mate? I mean - really

He married a 6 year old child and consummated the marriage with her at age 9. Should all muslim men do the same?
Some muslims argue was actually older than 9, but I am not even going into that
100 years ago in America a man could lawfully marry a 13 yr old girl. Today none of those who did are being called pae.do.phi.le
How come Mohammed (PBUH) deadly enemies never accused him of being a pa.edop.hile if he was one?
Do you know the tradition of that society
At what age did Joseph marry Mary?

Since you know the age Mary got married, please tell us. It has jumped from your MD marrying a kid to Joseph marrying Mary now abi? Comparing apples to oranges. Please tell us Mary age - we are waiting.

Do you read your Quran/Hadith at all. Aisha father objected to the marriage. The little girl carried her toys with her when your "Holy" prophet married her. In what society does someone marry a child against the father wish?

The Prophet engaged me when I was a girl of six (years). We went to Medina and stayed at the home of Bani-al-Harith bin Khazraj. Then I got ill and my hair fell down. Later on my hair grew (again) and my mother, Um Ruman, came to me while I was playing in a swing with some of my girl friends. She called me, and I went to her, not knowing what she wanted to do to me. She caught me by the hand and made me stand at the door of the house. I was breathless then, and when my breathing became all right, she took some water and rubbed my face and head with it. Then she took me into the house. There in the house I saw some Ansari women who said, "Best wishes and Allah's Blessing and a good luck." Then she entrusted me to them and they prepared me (for the marriage). Unexpectedly Allah's Apostle came to me in the forenoon and my mother handed me over to him, and at that time I was a girl of nine years of age. (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Volume 5, Book 58, Number 234)

Read my earlier post on this - You and any nation have the right to defend itself if you are attacked (irrespective of religious leaning). I have the right to defend myself if someone breaks into my home. When you go to bed at night - you lock your doors and windows - that is common defensive sense. You have the right to call in the Police when a crime is been committed and the right to defend yourself if your life is been threaten. So, the basis of defense is when you are attacked - not offensively attacking another. There is a clear difference.


Prove to me that the Bible permits a Christian to fight back!
And if you are so permitted, what are the rules of engagement?
And why have Christian countries mostly attacked firsts

Which Christian nation attacked your Muslim countries? When Sadaam invaded Kuwait - it was a Christian nation that sent him abi? When Osama and your Muslim brothers blew up the world trade center - it was Jesus that told them abi? Keep putting your brain in a dust-bin when you talk history.

chukwudi44: Why don't you show me from the bible where all we do in church should be from the bible?

Is the word bible even in the bible?

The bible did not even exist until it was created by the catholic church of the fourth century.

Sola bible is not a teaching of the scripture but a teaching of martin luther

Are you deluded?

Where in the world did you learn the bible was from the Catholic Church? Na wa oh!

deSika: u tell a moslem his religionn advocates violence he tells u prove it
u show it to him in the quran he says its defensive
u tell him to show u how its defensive he turns table at u and say Jesus is violent too....

wetin concern boko haram violence with Jesus being violent.[their think:if Jesus had somthing to do with violence then violence in islam is justified]

Many Muslims are trained to habitually disregard factual world history when it conflicts with the Quran. The last time, he tried to defend his prophet marrying a 6 year old child and consummating his marriage with the girl at 9 by saying Mary was 9 years old or 12 years old as well. I ASKED HIM TO PROVE IT - AS WE SPEAK - HE HASN'T. His response was, the Catholics said so.

I don't take him serious because he lacks credibility.

tintingz: ^ The prince of peace will got angry and scatter the money changer trades?

The jews never believed in Jesus(as) nor died for them...they dont even know if he was the one that was cruxified

Typical Islamic tactic again, focus on your Jihadist in Northern Nigeria. If you read where Jesus told his disciples and followers to cut off people feet and toes, then you can open your mouth and talk about violence in Christianity. You are living in denial. It's the same way you claimed Mary was 12 but has never proved it

I never told you the Jews believed Jesus died for them, I said they admit/believe he was crucified - BIG DIFFERENCE. Learn to read Oga.

Tell us why Boko Haram is bombing churches, killing Christians. Why Ansaru killing foreigners in the name of your God.

tintingz: mo o tigbo o

I wonder why Jesus used that as his parable

Maybe Jesus christ was all peaceful in the bible...

John 2:15
[Jesus] made a whip out of cords, and drove all from the temple area, both sheep and cattle; he scattered the coins of the money changers and overturned their tables.

prince of peace

So it seems I have answered your 1st question. I wouldn't play the blame the other party game with you. VIOLENCE in Islam is spiritual and it's real.

Accuse Jesus of violence all you want - It's no surprise; Muslims are trained to habitually disregard factual world history when it conflicts with the Quran. Take the fact of Christ's crucifixion. Even the Jews agree he was crucified, but the Quran says it was a case of mistaken identity. So Muslims reject the universal record of history and the Bible, but believe the Quran is true - THAT IS THE SAME LOGIC YOU ARE APPLYING HERE

For you to tell us why your Muslim brothers are killing Christians without any provocation - you are here trying to CONNECT Jesus with violence. Try harder mate - much harder because it's not working

For your education and your record:

Jesus cleansed the temple of the money-changers and sellers of merchandise because of His disgust at what they had made of God’s house of prayer and His zeal to purify it from the abuse of ungodly men. Judea was under the rule of the Romans, and the money in current use was Roman coin. However, the Jewish law required that every man should pay a tribute to the service of the sanctuary of “half a shekel” (Exodus 30:11-16), a Jewish coin. It became, therefore, a matter of convenience to have a place where the Roman coin could be exchanged for the Jewish half shekel. The money-changers provided this convenience, but would demand a small sum for the exchange. Because so many thousands came up to the great feasts, changing money was a very profitable business and one that resulted in fraud and oppression of the poor.

Similarly, according to the Law, two doves or pigeons were required to be offered in sacrifice (Leviticus 14:22; Luke 2:24). Yet it was difficult to bring them from the distant parts of Judea, so a lucrative business selling the birds sprang up, with the sellers gouging the faithful by charging exorbitant prices. There were other merchants selling cattle and sheep for the temple sacrifices as well. Because of these sellers who preyed on the poor, and because of His passion for the purity of His Father’s house, Jesus was filled with righteous indignation. As He overturned the tables of the money-changers, He condemned them for having turned God’s house of prayer into “a den of thieves” (Matthew 21:13). As He did so, His disciples remembered Psalm 69:9, “zeal for your house consumes me, and the insults of those who insult you fall on me.” Jesus was deeply wounded by the reproaches on God by those who would bring shame upon the temple.

SO IN YOUR MIND THIS IS VIOLENCE ABI? Ignorance is not good oooooooh!

mojibbz: Surah Muhammad, Verse 21:
Obedience and a gentle word (was proper); but when the affair becomes settled, then if they remain true to Allah it would certainly be better for them.

And your point?

tintingz: donted must you insult before asking question? Nut-brainy read your bible well...
Matthew 10:34
"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword."Luke 19:27
"But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither,and slay them before me."

Christ Jesus said it in the bible

Chaaa! Some people want to desperately associate Jesus with VIOLENCE. Hehehehe

Let me give you some Bible Study tintingz. Jesus never taught violence, never endorsed it. To prove it, when Jesus was about to be arrested, Peter drew his sword and cut of the ear of one of the priest guards. Jesus REBUKED him and healed the mans ear. That is a practical example that Jesus never supported violence.

Secondly, let me give you some education on Luke 19:27. I don't know if you know what a parable is, but let me define it for you so you can use your secular knowledge to grasp the meaning - A simple story used to illustrate a moral or spiritual lesson, as told by Jesus in the Gospels

Read Luke 19:11-27. Jesus was talking about a parable (He was giving an illustration) - This is called the Parable of the pounds. Jesus was illustrating a king that gave money to his 10 servants, some of them invested it with returns and one of them didn't. He kept it in a cloth and told the King:

Luke 19:20-21 = Then another servant came and said, 'Sir, here is your mina; I have kept it laid away in a piece of cloth. [21] I was afraid of you, because you are a hard man. You take out what you did not put in and reap what you did not sow

The King replied:

Luke 19:22-23 = "His master replied, 'I will judge you by your own words, you wicked servant! You knew, did you, that I am a hard man, taking out what I did not put in, and reaping what I did not sow? [23] Why then didn't you put my money on deposit, so that when I came back, I could have collected it with interest?'

The King continued:

Luke 19:24-27 = "Then he said to those standing by, 'Take his mina away from him and give it to the one who has ten minas.'

[25] " 'Sir,' they said, 'he already has ten!'

[26] "He replied, 'I tell you that to everyone who has, more will be given, but as for the one who has nothing, even what he has will be taken away. [27] But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them--bring them here and kill them in front of me.' "

SO BEFORE YOU CLAIM JESUS ENCOURAGED VIOLENCE, LEARN TO READ ABOVE AND BELOW THE VERSE TO GET THE THEME OF THE MESSAGE. This was an EXAMPLE OF A KING and how he reacted to a servant that was stingy. IT'S A PARABLE, AN EXAMPLE, AN ILLUSTRATION.

How do they say it in Yoruba - Do you understand - Shoti-gbo?

mojibbz: let me ask you something... did the holy prophet Mohammed ever teach, or propagate violence

Let me answer your question by asking you another question - Did the prophet Mohammed ever ordered people to be killed? Did he personally engaged in battles? Remember, we have the Hadith and Quran to fall to.

BetaThings: No Muslim has the right to read the Qur'an and make any meaning he likes out of it!
Muslims are required to enter Islam completely; He is not allowed to hold an opinion that contravenes that of the Prophet (SAW)
The Prophet (SAW) was sent to convey the Qur'an and teach it
The prophet (SAW) is the perfect example. He (SAW) spoke out of revelation, and not out of personal desire
So following him (SAW) is true Islam

That is actually a problem. So if there is no permission to fight, there will be no guidance on how to fight. So when people get angry and decide to fight, they do so without limits!

Are all muslims then to follow the life example of the prophet literally? The Quran teaches we should marry 4 wives but the prophet received a "special" revelation for himself only to make him exempt and married over 20? Since he is the perfect example, should every muslim do the same?

He married a 6 year old child and consummated the marriage with her at age 9. Should all muslim men do the same?

That is actually a problem. So if there is no permission to fight, there will be no guidance on how to fight. So when people get angry and decide to fight, they do so without limits!

Read my earlier post on this - You and any nation have the right to defend itself if you are attacked (irrespective of religious leaning). I have the right to defend myself if someone breaks into my home. When you go to bed at night - you lock your doors and windows - that is common defensive sense. You have the right to call in the Police when a crime is been committed and the right to defend yourself if your life is been threaten. So, the basis of defense is when you are attacked - not offensively attacking another. There is a clear difference.

hayubee: State d versed@ alexi I'm really curious

I have already mentioned 2 of them. Here are more:

Surah 2:216 - "Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not."

Surah 4:74 - "Let those fight in the way of Allah who sell the life of this world for the other. Whoso fighteth in the way of Allah, be he slain or be he victorious, on him We shall bestow a vast reward."

Surah 5:54 - "O ye who believe. Take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors. They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them. Verily God guideth not a people unjust."

Surah 8:12-17 - "Remember thy Lord inspired the angels (with the message): "I am with you. Give firmness to the believers. I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers. Smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger tips off them. This because they contend against God and his apostle. If any contend against God and his apostle, God is strict in punishment ... O ye who believe. When ye meet the unbelievers in hostile array, never turn your backs to them. If any do turn his back to them on such a day, unless it be a stratagem of war ... he draws on himself the wrath of God and his abode is Hell, an evil refuge (indeed)."

Surah 9:29 - "Fight those who believe not in God nor the Last Day nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by God and his apostle nor acknowledge the Religion of Truth (even if they are) of the people of the Book, until they pay the Jizya [religious tax] with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

There are just too many verses that JUSTIFIES violence. Again, the author of the Quran should have made it clear if these were defensive or offensive situations. If he was talking about the past or the present. He DIDN'T

hayubee: @ alexi I don't say muslims don't no abt it muslims my be part of it I don't know who did it bt if it we're a muslim don't blame oda muslim, whos is blaming christians 4 wat d crusaders did so don't blame muslim 4 wat oda muslims do!

I think you are been honest, I really do. And you are right - I shouldn't blame one person for the action of another. And I don't. My issue is this - The Quran allows justification based on numerous verses in the Quran. So, while some muslims can read those verses and understand it to mean defense, others can read it to mean attack/offense without provocation. The Quran didn't make it clear - it should have. That is the basis of the justification

The crusades is another topic hayubee . It happened hundreds of years ago. You can't use that as a basis to justify violence in Christianity. Jesus Christ never taught violence, never killed, never taught we should fight or attack anyone.

maclatunji: Maybe we should invite the Governor for a meeting on Nairaland to educate people on this.

That would be a head-start. Please go ahead Oga. I personally have a couple of questions for the Governor

St.latyv:
dats layman meanin. Jihad means doin sumthing mainly 4 d cause of Allah. U ar alowed to kil in islam wen u ar bein attacked. Walai u ar neva permited to kil jst cos u ar tryn to convince d oda person to acept islam. Muslims wil tel u dat bokoboys ar nt muslims cos they know wat it takes to b a muslim nt only sayin Allahu akbar. Thanks

Thank you for your post and honestly. I like the fact that you said "Walai u ar neva permited to kil jst cos u ar tryn to convince d oda person to acept islam". Can you provide some evidence from the Quran to back this up?

tintingz: Correct!!

The christians dont know the fact that the bible contains war and slavery.... Christ Jesus who said i only came with sword to the earth not peace and kill my enemies who doesnt want me to reign over them. . . . is not calling for war against his enemies??
Christians need to use their brain

Oh shut-up, are we talking about Jesus Christ in this post or we are talking about your brothers in Boko Haram? Common Islamic tactic to avoid the obvious and blame others.