₦airaland Forum

Dapo777: ohh please,if they announced a false news on tv it won't take long before they announce again that it was a false news,that is why I believe them. What will it profit them if the news have been lying about boko haram killing? Will it increase their salary or what?

But I don't believe miracles shown on tv,unless I witness them myself from a clear angle,because definitely the pastors have a lot to gain if they can fake miracles on tv that would make plenty people attend thier church,so u see y they show miracles on tv?

And i then asked, what effort have you made to witness miracle yourself? You dont draw conclusion on what you have not authenticated its falseness or truth.

JESUSchoice: @JMANOS5 ..Thanks 4 d comment,.. actually u have taken ma mind far back,.------Have read couple of gospel buks with great Authors i bliv so much in,and they seem b writing in different perspectives and blivs, i kept saying in ma mind "since God truly lives in dis pple den y will dey b writin seperate stuffs".....why is catholic,christ embassy, deeper life etc...divided and believin in differnt practises..., since i attend redeem, how am i sure am in d right sect?,......as far as i can rememba, dat's how i startd havin doupts!.

It is not being in a church that takes people to heaven. It is being in Christ Jesus. Always be like the Bereans in the book of the Acts of the apostles. After Paul's teaching they go back and search whether what he taught them was in line with the scriptures. Make the bible and the Holy Spirit your guide. After listening to teachings pls pray God to guide you on the truth. This is where you need the Holy Spirit. His work is to guide you into all truths. Man cannot lead you into all truth. So dont rely only on the books that people wrote or sermons. Ask God for the Holy Spirit and make your personal research in the bible. Forget about if you are in the right church. When the Holy Spirit takes full control he will guide you and if you are in the wrong place you will know.

Dapo777: Which Bible are u using? Where in the Bible is it suggested that the Israelites don't believe in God?

You can see that you dont even know the content of the book you are arguing about.

Dapo777: Well I haven't seen a miracle with my own eyes except some I have watched on tv, so I won't in my right sense believe such which I do not witness,or which have not been verified. Point to the evidences around me,I want to see them,it seems you have a better sight than I do,s help me.

you are not being sincere. Are you saying that you have never watched something on tv and believed until you witnessed it or verified it? All the news you ve watched about accidents, wars in countries, discoveries etc you never believed any except you witness them or verify? And if you have watched miracles on tv, what effort did you make to verify the authenticity? Or you just want to be an armchair critic.

efficiencie: what do you think will make a man leave his extended family and embark on a journey without a map? what do you think would make a city man become a nomad? It's FAITH...Abraham believed God and saw his power.

...If you won't BELIEVE GOD today, you won't have believed him even in the days of old!

Thanks for all your responses my brother. There are a lot of churches where great miracles are happening. In my church it happens regularly though we dont make noise about it. God is still showing himself in this miraculous happenings today but they wont still believe him. They are always looking for a way to justify their unbelief and they keep failing.

sambisa5: well spoken.......u've said it all!

Thanks dear

Gombs: Still counting down to the next 4month...when I'd dig up this thread, and I'd savour its stench of failure

One thing is to print, another is to distribute, another is for those who collected to read and digest it. Nigerians are poor in reading. A good number of the people that will collect the tract may end up throwing it into the next waste bin after collection. Ordinary reading a long post here is a problem for most people then think of holding a long message in a tract and spending some minutes to read it. Naija people wey dey in a hurry all the time? Lets see how it goes. My prayer is this- If the message in the tract is from God let it prosper, but if it is not from God then may it fail. Amen.

frosbel: defending God ? Did the scriptures say that God killed Jesus ?

lol

And what has been my reply? God knew it and approved it. It was in the whole package of God's redemption plan from the foundation of the world(according to the bible). The approval is the main thing because if he did not approve, they wouldnt have killed him. So everything boils down to God. . You are talking as if God had no hand in the whole process at all. Thats defence you know?

frosbel: God knew they will kill him, he did not kill his Son but in the killing of his Son God's plan came to fruition.

Its still the same thing. God knew they will kill his son, he had the power to save him from being killed but left him to be killed. Even when his son wanted to opt out, he still prayed- not my will but thine. This means that Jesus surrendered to the will of God and the will of God played out- he was killed. Everything boils down to God. You dont need to paint it. Thats what it is. Sometimes i laugh when i see you defending God. Its not your job pls. Just state things as they are in the scriptures and leave the defence to God.

Reyginus: Lol. The way you attacked me with your previous comment I thought I was really lying. You made it seem like an obvious case of a mentally deranged man getting applause for mental stability for a display of wit. I have known him to be like this.

alexleo, let's face it, frosbel is controversial. I hope it has nothing to do with his understanding of the Catholic Church?

Sorry dear i thought you were defending him. You are right, he is controversial. He is my friend though and i like him, yet i dont keep quiet when i see him go wrong.

frosbel: ^^

By the way God did not kill his Son, Evil men and women did - Matthew 21:38


Read :

1 Corinthians 15 : 16-19

That is the hope of the whole world.

Whether people killed him or not, The bottom line is that God approved of it. It was God's plan. No?

UyiIredia: @ Umoh: The more I think about life, the more I realize that God has left man to make his choices. The first thing that evidences God is the human spirit and its capacity to love (even hate). Even your worst thoughts have been second-guessed by God that's why God made Jesus die for you. I will end with the words: only believe in God despite what atheists and all others say and the storms of life you will pass through. Ciao typed while listening to Sarkodie's Adonai Remix)

OP pls take this advice. This guy is talking to you from experience, God bless you Uyi Ireida.

Tgirl4real: OMG!

It's worse than I think. Are you reading your bible at all? Is what you put up there the summation of the gospel of Christ?

I ask again, can what you put up there give you a right standing with God?

Where do you put Ephes 2: 8-10 in the post above?

Dont be suprised that someday to come frosbel will tell us that Jesus never died. And the question he will ask us then will be- how can a loving God kill his son? The guy is drifting by the day. I am not against love though.

Tgirl4real: Really bad! Any pastor who does not focus on sound doctrine will surely fleece the sheeple.

yea you are right.

Scyllapatron: seriously, something has to be done to save these innocent victims of pentecostal christianity. my neighbor has never been restless in her life as she is today. restless, unhappy, afraid, aggressive, etc. she shouts holy-ghost fire at everything that passes by her side, even a fly
... pathetic!!

Most Nigerian christians follow their pastors like mumu. They prefer to obey their pastor instead of obeying the bible. They exalt their pastors as high as God. Even when pastor is lying they will still say that it is God speaking through him. I feel so bad when I see these things. And some of these pastors are taking advantage of them. Too bad.

nora544: I hear this from friends and this new churches brought more harm to nigeria.

I hear also that since this new churches are in nigeria the corruption gets higher from year to year because no pastors is asking from where the money comes and he takes also a thief as his minister when he brought much money into his church.

You are right and its quite pathetic.

Reyginus: I don't understand you now, bro. Are you saying that frosbel has not always been in support of doctrines he considers to promote looting, or that he is just new to it or never?

I could still recall about a year or so ago when an atheist said something similar.

When he came into nairaland newly he preached the truth without sentiments and his preaching was sound, a few years ago he developed sentiments in his preaching and he started giving out adulterated messages( a mixture of truth and lies). That's why I'm against a blanket approval of his teaching. People should be bold enough to tell him where he is wrong. Some people here don't have such courage to tell him that's why they put up hypocritical defence and its bad. That's just my point.

Reyginus: Not at all. Frosbel has always been like this.

You are lying. Frosbel has not been like this. All these hypocritical defence that you people are putting up here is just uncalled for pls.

PastorKun: I have known frosbel for years on this forum and I clearly understand he is far from being agnostic. He is in fact a fierce defender of the true christian faith.

Your defence is irrelevant. He said he is talking from experience. Have you been an atheist to experience how the process starts? Bro Keep your defence one side pls. You cannot tell much about frosbel and there is no strong basis to believe you. You cannot also tell the process of becoming an atheist better than an atheist(except if you had been one before). This guy may not be wrong after all.

klbakare: do you mean Satan now answers prayers prayed in the name of Jesus? why don't you leave God who answers this prayers to judge
that.
!

Remember the case of- Paul I know, Jesus I know, who art thou? That prayer was made in the name of Jesus. No? So you mean that Jesus can tell us to love our enemies, pray for them and bless them that persecute us and still turn around to aanswer a prayer that runs contrary to this instruction?

klbakare: This thread is opened to all dos who are confused abt MFM's die prayers...kindly ask all ur questions here. AM AN M.F.M MEMBER.
Dear nairalanders, i ve seen so many of ur wrong allegations against mfm and their prayers.I will devote my time to answer ur questions carefully,one after d oda.God bless you.
To start with i will like to ask the following questions.
1 does God answer die prayers,prayed in the name of jesus? (yes)
2 does God judge the intent of one's prayers? (yes)
3 can God kill the enemy of his children? (yes)
4 does God answer wicked prayers? (no)

so,if God answer prayers and some of those answered prayers results in the death of a witch,wizard,or a witchdoctor. Definitely dos individuals desserve such death,remember GOD ALMIGHTY is a great judge. If the laws and judges of this world allow death for certain offences...HOW MUCH MORE THE ALMIGHTY?
kindly keep ur questions coming in pls.

If according to you God answers your die prayer, why don't you then pray for your enemy to repent or does it mean God cannot answer that one too? If you cant pray for his salvation that means you are praying a wicked prayer. Let me tell you that it is satan that answers such wicked prayers. Jesus said we should pray for our enemies(with love) and BLESS them that persecute you. He didn't say we should pray against our enemies so any prayer against your enemy is an error before God and God cannot comply with error, it is satan that does that.

Bidam: You are on point sis, nice one.You don school frosbel for this one.

Yea she really did well. Other friends of frobel(FOF) will not have the gut to tell him this truth. They ll prefer to hide. Talk about bad friends.

sambisa5: Alex
Frosbel is a muslim.....the earlier you belive and accept it the better.........the Holy spirit isn't there to explain the scripture to him.....so he can never understand...

Remember they have their own believe about paradise......and the 72 virgins awaited them,they don't drink wine on earth cos they believe the best wine is awiating them in paradise and all that.....

They do not believe in hell cos their quran didn't teach them that way of truth....

He lied to be a follower of christ.....but the Holy spirit just ministered to me that he is not:......

My dear, we saw this coming much earlier sometime last year or two years ago. Some of us warned about his drift but from what i can see today, he has drifted far more than what we saw in those days. Lets just be praying God to help him out because i dont see him following Christ anymore. I hope he doesnt land in atheism as some of the unbelievers here are already saying. it could be that they too passed through a similar process before landing into atheism hence their comments. God will help him. Amen.

frosbel: Sorry brother I am firm believer in God, the difference between me and you is that I am no longer under the process of brain washing and control of MEN, I now independently verify the authenticity of my belief, call it rationalization.

And you are also a man like those people you are condemning. Which means that if you think they made mistakes then you too can also have places where they are seeing errors in your independent whatever. Already your independent search is contradicting the scripture.

frosbel: ^^
God will be proud of me thats why he gave me a brain so that I do not follow follow the doctrines of MEN.

Obviously thats where your problem lies. The atheists read the bible only with their brains thats why they cannot comprehend the mysteries therein just like you cant comprehend some of the mysteries in the scripture. The scripture is not a "book of logic" so you dont use only your brain to read it. The Holy Spirit always have a place in our study and in most cases the mysteries of God's word runs contrary to human logic, it sometimes appear foolish in man's eyes thats why you are now seeing those mysteries and hard truth as foolishness. I tell you God is not proud of you. May God help you.
I am not also saying you should be doing follow follow. However, not doing follow follow does not mean that your so called independent search will produce the right result.

frosbel: I repeat, the god that sends people to eternal torture is SATAN and not Almighty God, check up bro because you may be operating under deception.

Thanks.

I had earlier posted a detailed response to this but let me still repeat my little advice. You are simply interpreting the scriptures with sentiments(especially in this area of God's judgment/wrath) and this is wrong. Even if you preach this from now till another century, it wouldnt change the fact that sinners will suffer eternal damnation if they dont repent. There are certain things that argument cannot change and this issue is one of them. Watch it bro, I see satan deceiving you in this issue but God will deliver you. Amen.

frosbel: Let's use our brains for a small moment, shall we ?

We have 2 Men, Mr.A and Mr.B.

Mr.A has faith that God exists but is not necessarily a Christian, out of this faith and reverence ( remember Job ) he loves his neighbour as himself ( remember the good Samaritan ), he ensures that his children also revere this one great God, he forgives quickly, never bears a grudge , helps the poor etc but when he dies it all counts for nothing, he is plunged straight into the abyss of fiery brimstone and fire forever and ever with no chance of escape or relief from his immense pain. Why ? Because he did not know Jesus or hear about him, so he has no chance of salvation.

Mr B has faith in God through Jesus Christ, he is now born again but sometimes he gossips, commits lust, lies, is harsh and arrogant, does not help others outside his congregation, is hostile to all those ( including his family ) who do not share his belief, he even kills someone through manslaughter and asks for forgiveness. He dies and goes straight to heaven in a bliss of glory forever and ever, never to experience any pain etc.

Now you tell me what kind of God will reject Mr A who had faith in him even though he did not know about Jesus but exhibited the fruits of the Spirit and accept Mr B who knew Jesus but lived like the Devil ( like 90% of so called Nigerian Christians ) ??


Secondly, what kind of sick 'god' will torture ( despite him supposedly being against torture ) his creatures because they did not believe in Jesus or hear about him , not for one day or two, not for one month or two, not for one year or two, but for endless ages into endless ages with immense pain and suffering, no alleviation of this suffering, also with full knowledge that 80% of his family is in the same situation. I tell ya, this is not Yahweh but SATAN.

This is precisely why the so called church is packed full of selfish, harsh, judgemental, arrogant and bullish individuals who see themselves as superior to all other creatures made by God , despite their wickedness. Sorry keep your 'god' , I will run to Yahweh who alone posses salvation and his Son Jesus Christ who is my redeemer.


Go figure.

I smell gradual drift to atheism or something related to it. May God help you bro. It seems what OLAADEGBU warned about you is trying to be a reality now but may God deliver you. Even the unbelievers here are smelling that you are gradually becoming one of them.

All those who love our brother frosbel pls lets remember him in our prayers that God should not allow this plan of the enemy to succeed in him. AMEN.

I say this with all sense of concern and love for you.
I'm not trying to abuse you or make mockery of you. God forbid. May God help you bro.

frosbel: no chance

I am a follower of Jesus/.

Jesus said in the scriptures "except a man be born again he cannot see the kingdom of God" while your own Jesus says it is good works that will make one inherit the kingdom of God.

Jesus in the scriptures said that- broad is the way that leads to destruction and MANY follow it while few follow the narrow way of eternal life. While your own Jesus tells you = how can many people follow the way of destruction?

Surely your Jesus is different from the one in the scriptures.

My dear watch the decline- from preaching salvation you have now declined into preaching good works as key to the kingdom. Interpreting the scriptures with sentiment is the worst thing that any christian can engage in. It leads to watering the hard truth of God's word down as we can see you do in some issues. God help you. Amen

loveroftruth: Yeah! On the red ^, there is hope on your understanding of the used of the word Hell.

That Jesus did not make used of the word 'Hell'.

Anyone that said Jesus made used of the word 'Hell' is a liar.

And liars will not inherit God's kingdom.

I simply left that option for you so that you dont derail my main point which is- the description that Jesus gave about hell fire. The torment is the main thing. The name that the place of torment is bearing is not very relevant for me to be concerned about.

Tgirl4real: Indeed!!!

What are the things Jesus Christ laid down about salvation? Is there another way a man can be saved other than the name of Jesus?

From your post on this thread, I doubt you are a follower of THE Jesus of the bible.

Well spoken.

Dux01: frosbel you need to really pray and fast to understand this issue of the existence of Hell.hell is real.i tell u again.and there is fire there unquenchable fire read isaiah 66 Vs 24 and please can you list some characteristics of the religious Jesus that you don't believe in.

Also Matthew 3;12

12 His winnowing fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clean out His threshing floor, and gather His wheat into the barn; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.”

Mark 9;43

43 If your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter into life maimed, rather than having two hands, to go to hell, into the fire that shall never be quenched— 44 where

‘Their worm does not die
And the fire is not quenched.’[d]

45 And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life lame, rather than having two feet, to be cast into hell, into the fire that shall never be quenched— 46 where

‘Their worm does not die,
And the fire is not quenched.’[e]

47 And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye, rather than having two eyes, to be cast into hell fire— 48 where

‘Their worm does not die
And the fire is not quenched.

loveroftruth: I belief you went to school going by your writing here.

Hence, please, answer this. Did Jesus speak emglish language ?

What language did Jesus use if he did not speak English language ?

Do you know the meaning of the word 'Translation' ?

Wht words are translated as Hell and what are its meaning

I have said it before and I"m saying it again- the most important thing is the description that Jesus gave about hell or whatver you choose to call it. Its a horrible place to be. A place of torment. I don't care about any other thing you are saying about it. You can go ahead and preach no hell fire or no lake of fire or no eternal torment message. Those who know the truth will not believe you. Even if people believe you it doesn't stilI change anything. I don't interprete scriptures with sentiment.

loveroftruth: If you are reasonable, which is not a bad thing.

Please, which language did Jesus speak ?

Did Jesus made use of the word "HELL" ?

If no, what words or word did he make used of ?

The reality to the questions above will aid you to come back to your senses.

If you are sensible you will also know that the description that Jesus gave about hell is that of a place of torment and that is what matters most. Go and read what Jesus said about hell and you ll come back to your senses.

frosbel: Brother, Jesus spoke about Hades not Hell Fire.

Do some homework on what Hades and Sheol stand for and then we can chat, dont be afraid

Bro, Jesus spoke about hell fire in Matthew 18:9 and Mark 9:47. In some other places Jesus decribed hell as a place of torment. I don't need any other external study to understand it. I am not also afraid of hell as you are insinuating. I would ve been afraid of hell if God did not provide an escape route(Jesus) for us. I would ve also said that God is wicked if he had not provided this escape route for us. The problem is that you are using sentiment to interprete the scriptures and it doesn't work that way. That's why you are using God's love to interprete his wrath. This two nature of God are seperate and they are eternal. God has always used the price that Jesus paid on the calvary to describe the greatness of his love for us. He has never used the duration of hell fire/lake of fire to describe his love for us. It is you that is doing such description and it doesn't work. Jesus said- " greater love has no man than this that a man laid down his life for his friends. There is nowhere in the scripture that God used the duration of lake of fire to measure his love. It has always been the cross so pls desist from using lake of fire/hell fire to measure God's love. Its unscriptural. Love and wrath are God's nature and since God is unchangeable, the same yesterday, today and forever it simply means he can never ceased to be the God of wrath just as he cannot cease to be a loving God and cannot cease to be the omniscient, omnipotent and omnipresent God. Its only a display of sentiments when we try to paint him as a God that will expunge wrath from his nature at some point in time. Sir we don't need to defend God. It makes a mockery of him when we do so. For the fact that he consdered the severity of his wrath(which is eternal) and made a redemption plan for us which made salvation so free and easy to get is a great show of love. If someone chooses to go the way of God's wrath and neglect this escape route then God is not to be blamed. God is not in any way wicked.