₦airaland Forum

bidexiii:
You are funny dude ,then if u r in ur so-called ratel or badger where u r being hit u hust stay in right there and so it wouldn't hit fuel or ammo do u think ur fucken enemy don't know ur week point on ur ratel, when RPG knocks out abram u r talking of Ratel, who d hell knows ratel !
And secondly don't u try and face any fucken AFV/IFV with a rifle grenade luncher. Its only a mad man would try and do that ! I would rather prefer an anti-material/particle beam riffle from a well and camouflaged distance !
And last but not the least never compare a ratel with a (2000) BMP-2, its only an armature would do dat !

Even if fuel or ammo is hit, it is not stored in the troop compartement like the BMP2. In the case I spoke about the ratel did burn and did explode. But not before people escaped. In a BMP serries you prety much dead if the armour fails.


Rifel grenads give every solder the means to fight a tank. And they could enough to deal with T55, T62 and any AFV of simlare or weaker protecstion. They can be carried by any troop a has a extra.

bidexiii:
; did u just call or categorize "rifle grenade" lunchers anti-tank weapon ! And secondly I dissagree with u on the bmp-2'yeap its small but what matters is the armor platting protection for ratel's !
Then whens d thickness of ratel armor plate ?

What do you think rifel grends where made for? In SA the two used here can deal with 350mm of RHA (the one fired from a R1 or FN Fal) or 250mm RHA (the one fired from a R4). The bog standard RPG7 used by most african countries has 350mm pentrastion.

Ratel is 20mm with it being sloped up front. But even then it still not enough to stop a RPG.

BMP 2 armour is from 6mm to 33mm.

Size does matter. The ratel is bigger. You could hit it with a RPG and get through the armour but not hit anything vital like fuel or ammo. With the BMP 2 you going to hit Fuel or Ammo.

agaugust:
Okay, no wonder South Africa cannot defeat Seleka and Rhino poachers, your military can only fight against nations like the one you lost to Cuban girl soldiers
.

We fuckedd seleka up 5 ways to sunday along with the cubans.

Rhino poaching is SAN parks not SANDFs job.

bidexiii:
Even the abrams; av read true events of high kenetic RPG partially knocking out or disabling the abrams !
www.janes.com/article/39550/iraqi-abrams-losses-revealed

But the crew lived.

Henry120:
An RPG can kill anything from MRAPS, IFV's, and light skinned tank.

Success depends primarily on the tactics and proper infantry support.

Difrence is wether the cre lives or not. I know of a case where a Ratel was ambushed by at least 4 RPG teams and other AT wepaons such has rifel grenads. Though the ratel was lost people where able to extract them selfs and wounded. The commander died rushing back trying to pull more people out.

BMPs are so small that ammo and fuel are carried in the troop and fighting compartment and are not armoured.

agaugust:
Normal, even main battle tanks have far less armour on the sides and thicker armour on the front, check out most heavy tanks.

Then the frontal BMP-2 protection is against 23mm not 20mm, the same 23mm will tear all SANDF Ratel and Badger IFV into pieces.

You did't know that before you started writing garbage about BMP-2 armour. Fool !


http://www.armyrecognition.com/russia_russian_army_light_armoured_vehicle_uk/bmp-2_ifv_tracked_armoured_infantry_fighting_vehicle_data_sheet_specifications_pictures_video.html



.

Actualy combat experance has had the BMP pentrated on the frontal arc by 12.7mm fire.

There is a add on armour kit for the ratel that gives the frontal armour protecstion of up to 23mm

Face it the BMP serries is crapp. They get slaught in every war they fight in.

agaugust:
BMP-2 has superior 5.5 km range 9M133 Kornet missiles, Ratel gets killed from distance
.

Yet it sees 4000m

MikeCZAR:
The Super Lynx has laser range finder, data links, radar.

Don't forget the FLIR. And it is cleared to use the mokape ATGM.

NAF and SAAF A109 LUH

https://oi49.tinypic.com/w0j5w.jpg
https://www.aircraft.co.za/GalleryImages/4/normal_1573.jpg

agaugust:
ATR-42 radios your precise GPS coordinates to artillery and you are near your expiry date already.

And your 2 ATR will do this how. It will be under constined EW attack and attacked by gripens. All so it uses a sea survalnce radarfinding a G6 or G5 at max radar range will be imposbil.

You milltary spends all it's effort fighting rebels. SA trainins to fight nastions.

agaugust:
BMP-2 will use ordinary 30mm cannon to wreck your Ratel before after using smoke dispensers to waste your laser guided Ingwes.

The missile on BMP-2 has longer range than Ingwe missile on Ratel
.

You need to move after deploying smoke. And the ratel ingwe can riple fire Ingwe. All so the 20mm on ratel witch has a higher rate of fire than your 30mm(due to fumes) can pentrat a BMP at the same range it can penrtat a ratel


Since when does 4km beat 5km

agaugust:
It is ISR by manufacturer spec data sheet. It can lock on target and relay its full location data to an attacker platform.

"Target acquisition is the detection, identification, and location of a target in sufficient detail to permit the effective employment of lethal and non-lethal means. The term is used for a broad area of applications" Source -Wiki

An ISR that can lock on target and keep relaying it's location accurately is doing Target Acquisition and its ISR becomes ISTAR.

NAF ATR-42 is an ISTAR aircraft along with NAF Beechcraft 350ER ISTAR aircraft, the ATR-42 is multi-role ISR, ISTAR, and MPA all combined
.

the atr has no means to proscute targets are provide guidance for a third part they can look but not touch

agaugust:
@THIZA has posted photos of ordinary gun armed Ratels with NO missiles, most of the photos in the world prove that SANDF has mostly gun armed Ratels, we see that from free internet photos. SANDF website simply used the best photo to represent other Ratels, and to close the case finally, your own respected South African source Defenceweb says you have ONLY about 50 Ratel ZT-3, even a fool will laugh at you, or you want to tell us defenceweb posted fraudulent numbers of Ratel ZT-3 ?

Butt Hurt




Like DENEL manufactured Mokopa missile which SANDF refused to order because the missile is useless. LOL
.

Does not mean any thing really. We no the true numzbers and rang and so do you. You just don't want to accept the truth

Sa is still planing on buying Mokopa

agaugust:
LOL, your own favorite Scorpion jet purchase interest source quoting NAF Air Marshal Ojuawo, he said ATR-42 is doing ISTAR operations. Your favorite source, LOL.

Does not mean it is a ISTAR platform.

celeron40:
Sorry to poke pls..any news on the BMPs? Have they been confirmed? also, will BMP-2s be effective against highly mobile 23mm BH technicals?

A 23mm round will rip through a BMP2. But a BMP2 can accuritly hit a techincal from 4KMs away. Personaly I don't like the BMP2. They to small and cramped inside and not built for people my hight (1.8ms tall). Of course if you want a tracked IFV for cheap there are only so many opstions. You all so got to pray no one hits you with a RPG. Because the RPG is so small the chance of hitting the fuel or ammo is high and they not stored in armoured lockers. Basicaly a RPG or even a 23mm round could cause the BMP2 to either explod or burn. Either way bad for those inside.

But if Nigeria uses them right and gives them proper infantry support the BMP2 will be deadly.

EVarn:
catfish.a few F7s would r@pe your fleet into the ground,and bottle the juices.

More like 2 gripens would be enough to fend you off. The F7 is not that good.

agaugust:
European air forces are desperate to buy it
.

Witch airforce. Some x USSR state that has no airforce?

EVarn:
havent we trashed this already.i've lectured you so many times that our F7 jets can discharge a barrage of missiles enough to pulverize south african into a cornflakes republic.

2 drop tanks and 2 AAMs and the F7 could not even reach waterkloof if it took off in cape town.

The F7 has no guided weapons for ground attack, limmted air attack.

patches689:
You said the whole vehical was protected against 23mm (never heard of a 23mm cannon before )



This is false, frontial arc only offers PARTIAL protection against 20mm

Welded steel armor of the BMP-2 provides all-round protection against 12.7-mm rounds. Front arc of this IFV offers partial protection against 20-mm ammunition.
http://www.military-today.com/apc/bmp2.htm

Yeah, maybe you should take some of your own advice and use that free google thing

ZSU23mm. It a russian AAA

They tried to make the BMP2 proofed all round to 12.7mm. But actual combat has shown this to be somthing a AFV weighting only 14 tones can not do. I have the brocher of the russian arms company that sells the BMP2. They only list it has protected against small arms. Same has our casspir and mamba.

The BMP2 is a down grade frome a ratel

Ratel 20 has better protecstion and moblitie BMP2 has better fire power. The ratel 90 is better in every way.

agaugust:
LOL ! You go read pages of this thread from last week, your countrymen were boasting here that South Africa is begging Russia to sell spy satellite to you and build new nuclear reactors for you.... I though Soweto lazy parasites living permanently on ANC government cash donations are more intelligent than Russian scientists in Moscow!
.

We buying a spy sat with our money and the nuke deal is a offer, france, UK, US and others where offerd the deal to. No purches had been made.

Again no begging was done at any time.

agaugust:
BMP-2 is 33mm frontal armour, google is free for your use, stop sending me on foolish errands, use your own time to google stuff
.

Only the gun mantel. That is a very small part of the turet witch is it's self very small.

agaugust:
If you have excuses for SAAF crashes, we too have excuses for NAF crashes. Equation balanced.

Anyway, NAF flies 100 times more than SAAF, you have ZERO jet combat sortie in 20 years !
.

When we aske for proof you can not show any reported flying hours. Yet it is a fact SAAFs budget is higher than NAFs. So how do you fly more hours?

agaugust:
You compare South African army to Russian army? LOL....the same Russians you run to for military equipment and scientific help? Clown
.

What milltary equpment do we have that we bought from russia and when have we asked them for technical help?

patches689:
BMP-2 only has limited protection against 20mm on certain parts of the front of the vehical. It does not have the same protection on the sides or rear.

BMP-2 is also not land-mine protected.

BMP has also performed terribly in every single war it has ever fought in.


And now the killer blow: Nigeria does not have any BMP-2's. I find it to be hilarious that you have to invent new weapons to have a chance against us.

Only the gun mantel (where there is 33mm of armour) can stop a 20mm round. Though real live has shown 12.7mm fire can get through and knock out the engien. The ratel is immune to 12.7mm fire from the front.

The other big difreince is what happens when the BMP's armour fails. If the round is incendury or exsplosive, then every body dies. Fuel and ammo is kept in the troop compartment. Comparied to the ratel where one was ambushed at least 4 RPG teams and a bunch of rifel grenads. The ratel was lost but there where both crew and passengers who where able to escape. A BMP 1,2 or 3 will just blow up. Hence people ride on top and not inside them. All so the BMP 2 only carries 7 people in very cramped condistions with no where to keep stores or supplies.

[IMG]http://www.defenceweb.co.za/images/stories/LAND/gamer_sim_trg_400x300.jpg[/IMG]
2014


The use of simulation as a cost-effective training aid in the landward arm of the SA National Defence Force (SANDF) is moving forward with the acquisition of a GAMER Manpack live simulation system with support from Armscor.

“The system is a force-on-force live simulation one and is a solution for smaller instrumented force on force training in open environments as well as in enclosed areas such as buildings and ships. It is a man-portable, speedily deployable control and evaluation system based around small arms laser transmitters. Other elements are personal detection devices on battle jackets and helmets, a ruggedised laptop computer and a portable communication system,” said Kuben Thaver of Armscor.

The system now is use by the SA Army and field-tested for the first time during a mission readiness training exercise outside Bloemfontein.

The training and simulation team utilised the locally developed BattleTek Constructive Simulation System, IMPI Blue Force Tracking and associated software systems during the Command Post- and Commander’s Field Exercise to assist in declaring 5 SA Infantry Battalion “mission ready” for deployment to the DRC.

Manpack was fitted to 52 soldiers (own and opposition force members) and was successfully deployed during the Commander’s Field Exercise over a period of two days. The system’s value came to its full right at the After Action Review (AAR) where all senior officers and other military members present acknowledged the value the system added value to military exercises.

It was also in action during Exercise Young Eagle for airborne elements of the SA Army and planning is for it to be deployed again in planned landward force exercises.

Thaver said the acquisition was one which would increase the Army’s training capacity significantly without extra spend from an already constrained budget.


http://defenceweb.co.za/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=37132:simulation-boosts-sa-army-training-capacity&catid=111:sa-defence&Itemid=242

agaugust:
Chief, The BTR-3U Nigeria has now, are not able to engage Boko Haram 23mm cannon Toyotas, they will tear our BTR-3U into pieces.

BMP-2 IFV has 3km max range 30mm cannon, Nigeria will now have firepower equal to Boko Haram's 23mm and 14.5mm guns.

Balance of power will change if Nigerian army buys 200 units of cheap BMP-2 IFVs cheap second hand from Russia that has thousands in storage reserves. Price for upgraded/modernized second hand should be around $1.5 million per unit.

BTR-3U has tyres/wheels and will get stuck like Cobra in the muddy areas close to Sambisa forest, BMP-2 will use tracks to navigate the heavy muddy terrain.

Worse for Boko Haram is if Nigerian BMP-2 all come upgraded with night vision equipment and anti-tank missiles, they will change the balance of power in this war, even if NAF is not working. T-84 Oplot-M or T-90SM main battle tanks will be the expensive high tech weapons to wipe out Boko Haram from Nigeria

.

The BTR3 beats the BMP in maintance, troop transport, speed. They match each other in armour and fire power. They use the same 30mm in both IFV. Since you all ready have BTR3s more would of been a better opstion. A mixed force is wors than a uniformed one.

AugustineAgain:
LOL, Nigerian army's new amphibious BMP-2 IFV has 33mm armour, even a 23mm cannon CANNOT penetrate it.

https://www.armyrecognition.com/News/March_2004/BMP-2_Infantry_Armoured_Vehicle_India_02.jpg

Show proof
By the way, what is the armour thickness of SANDF dry land only Ratel, Rooikat, and Badger in millimeters ?

Cuban girls were using 12.7mm guns to eat up your Ratels while your men were screaming for help, getting killed by teenage Cuban girls in Angola war


.

Show proof of 33mm. At 33mm it would be to heavy to float.

Ratel is 20mm don't know the others of hand.

mzilakazi:
My i-phone told me there is no single source to substantiate that claim. However, I will consult SIPRI which normally record such sales. Anyways, BMP-2 IFV is not a big deal because Ingwe ATGM will consume all of the stock you bought in just few minutes.

I work close to a school of Armour and I know how well they respect ingwe ATGM.

Could use a 12.7mm on a BMP2.

patches689:
Not to mention that the back doors contain the fuel tanks

Take a hit there and all the infantry are trapped inside.

They normaly fill it with water or sand though. Thuse it's actual max range and paper max range are difrent.

ehemwhy:
Oga Henry can one of these be retrofitted into Bombers ?

You could could push bombs out the back. But why?

patches689:
There is a reason why Russians chose to ride ontop of the BMP and not inside of it

Yep. It all so got very thin armour. Max is 13mm. That means it not like it will stand up to much fire. Those BH 14.5mm MGs can still get through that armour.

AugustineAgain:
.

.[size=16pt]Nigerian Army Again !!!!

Powerful BMP-2 IFV now in Nigerian army bases for battle.

Russian weapons keep pouring into Nigeria secretly, the list is endless

Photos soon, new tanks, new IFVs enter service with Nigerian army.

South Africa fears and trembles again, afraid of the Giant Naija !

.[/size]

Since when is the BMP2 mighty and powerfully? Since when would that worry us one tinny bit. I mean go look at angola and see how many BMP2s thaey have and for how long they have had them. I mean please bragging about a BMP. You desprate now.