₦airaland Forum

huxley:
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Almost all the misdeeds of the religious in Dark Ages Europe is happening today in Africa, viz witchhunts, children accused of witch acts, religious exploitations by venal Christian Pastors and Ministers, religious wars (Muslim vs Christians),  degradations of educations as students pursue salvation, etc, etc.

Did you watch the Nigerian child witch film?  Does any of this bode well with intellectualism.  By what epistemic  justification would a Christian have for condemning these venal ministers?

Have you read about the deploration state of education in Nigeria universities?  Does this bode well with a match towards intellectualism?


I submit that I have made my case and the facts speak for themselves.

To say that Africa is not dying today because of our extremist religious beliefs is to lie to our selves (by the way we are very good at lying to ourselves).  Africans, are taught outrageous beliefs by religion and superstition to fear too many things. Witches, angels, the Devil or Satan, thunder, lightning, nocturnal birds are all objects that generate fear every where you go in Africa as a result of the outdated and impotent religious beliefs that have continually to make us a shame to the rest of the world. While students are learning how to create or invent things in Europe and America, African students are busy waiting for Jesus, Allah or the spirit of their ancestors to come and take them to Heaven.

According to the late Dr. Solarin "blacks hold onto their God just as the drunken man holds on to the street lamp post--for physical support only."

The worst bane of African non development is chronic dependence on the deity to solve all earthly problem. Any thing man has to do must be done by man himself, no deity can ever make Nigeria or Africa progress no matter how people keep praying or hoping for their various Gods to come and rescue them. Africans must be educated to stand on their feet and leave religious superstition alone. If the white people had held unto their once extremist religious beliefs they wouldn't have been where they are. Any body that says other wise is a liar. Africa is presently in the position the Europeans were in the 12th- 17th century before they decided to abandon all those  useless religious beliefs and help themselves move forward.

dalaman:
there seems to be increasing evidence that the universe could not be as it is were it not for a supreme creator. .

You believe that the universe is created the way it was described in the book of genesis? by the way which of the creation stories in genesis are we supposed to believe in? since there are 2 different creation stories in the the 1st and 2nd chapters of genesis. Did the bibleGod really create tigers, lions, polar bears, and cheetahs as vegetarians despite their carnivorous dentition? Is the earth the centre of the universe ? the bible says it is. Is Adam the whole of humanity of just one man? Do you believe in the tower of babel story? is that how differences in languages really come about?

Since I know I can not make you guys see any good reason to believe in the bible since most of you ridicule and make fun of the bible on a daily basis I will like to know how this belief system you have adopted helps in enhancing who you are and the society you live in?

We always ridicule the bible because it contains fables that only deluded freaks believe in it. Fables like the Noah's story that some Christians now admit is an allegorical tale because deep inside they just can not accept the story any more so the excuse is to say it is an allegorical tale but it was reported as a real event in the bible to their shame. Did they Israelites really travel from Egypt to Canaan in 40 years?(such a journey even at that time would have taken less than a month) Why did the bible good all of a sudden loose all his powers? why don't we have stories of people surviving inside the belly of fish for 3 days or surviving hot furnaces like the story of Shadrach and his other two friends any more? what about talking snakes and donkeys? Why is the bibleGod unable to kill off the enemies of his "chosen people" as he is found of doing in the old testament?

where do you guys think morality comes from?

And what morality is there to learn in the bible? killing of gays, disobedient children? (A child who hits or curses his parents must be executed. 21:15, 17), stoning to death of some one because he disobeyed a law as trivial as picking up sticks on a Sabbath? what moral is there to lean in this story? The Ark of the Covenant was a sacred item. The ancient Hebrews commonly believed that God played a part of a genie by residing in the ark on occasion. so he killed 70 people just because they looked into the ark what is the moral of this story? Uzzah’s instinctive, split-second decision to prevent God’s home from falling angers God enough to kill him despite the fact that he was trying to prevent the ark from falling (2 Samuel 6:6-7). this action by the bibleGod made David angry with him , Women are relegated to the background by the bibleGod in the old testament.

1Sa 15:2 This is what the Lord Almighty says: 'I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt.
1Sa 15:3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy [fn] everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.' "

Deuteronomy 20:16 "But of the cities of these peoples which the LORD your God gives you [as] an inheritance, you shall let nothing that breathes remain alive,

God sends forth two bears to kill forty-two children for making fun of Elisha’s bald head (2 Kings 2:23-24). Why would the omni benevolent God feel the necessity to have two bears viciously maul little children for acting like children?

1ki 20:35 By the word of the Lord one of the sons of the prophets said to his companion, "Strike me with your weapon," but the man refused.

1Ki 20:36 So the prophet said, "Because you have not obeyed the Lord, as soon as you leave me a lion will kill you." And after the man went away, a lion found him and killed him.

The bibleGod sends a lion kill a man because he refuses to hit someone

When people worship other Gods the bibleGod sends "his chosen" to kill them instead of giving them the chance to repent and serve him. If the Israelites his "chosen people" turn their backs against their God he allows their enemies to kill them off. He punishes innocent people for the "sins" of their parents. The bibleGod advocates slavery, sharing of war booty, accepts human sacrifice. Strongly advocates tribalism, racism and segregation. Go read up the bible all those vices are there for you to see.

"The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty, ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticide, genocidal, pestilential, megalomaniac, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully"

There is no morals to learn out of the bible God. The basic law of doing unto others as you would like them to do unto you does not require any belief in any God.

I believe in Jehovah the God of the bible, I also believe that he is the only Supreme Being who created the whole universe and actively takes part in it(there are stories and testaments of his goodness and blessing every where)

As for the testament of the goodness of the bibleGod, let me give you a short story of what happened last week. I went to Jos and spent about 10days with my cousins, it happened that we were all going to Abuja on the same day with my 3 cousins. I travelled with my boss (where I am presently doing my NYSC we came to Jos together to do a project), while my cousins used the the family car. Before my boss came to take me, I went into the room to pack up my things when my aunt called us all to come and pray, I told them to go ahead and pray while I pack my things up. My aunt became furious and started shouting telling me to come and pray because prayer is much more important than what I was doing. She almost embarrassed me. To cut a long story short I came out and they began to pray. In the might name of Jesus bla bla bla Jesus may you be the drive,God may you cover the car with the blood of your son Jesus Christ, may armed robbers be blind folded when the see the car passing by, may their guns become a dud. You shall be the driver, and you shall give my Children a safe trip to Abuja bla bla bla bla bla. After she finished praying my aunt now said I am free to do what ever I want to do but I should always remember to put God first, because he is the only person that grants journey mercies. My boss came and then we took off I and him in his car while my cousins followed us about 20 mins later, when we got to karu my cousins called me and told that they just had an accident in Akwanga (Nassarawa state). A reckless driver was trying to over take another car so they had to stay of the road so as to avoid a head on collision with the reckless driver, they went into the bush and their car collided with a tree. They all hit their body parts but they were lucky nothing serious happened to any of them. Now they are organizing a thank giving service on Sunday to give money to the church(money they would have used to repair the car) and thank God for allowing them to have an accident. They prayed passionately to God to protect them from any form of accident but he didn't , now its time to go and thank him in a grand way in the Church for not protecting them and allowing them to have an almost ghastly accident, do you see how senseless this whole belief is? people just believe in things even though it doesn't make any sense. They believe in God but they are always making excuses for him, always apologizing and explaining all these actions that they attribute to their God that he always refuses to live up to.

dalaman:
I can see that there are quite a handfull of atheist here,I'm very curious as to why you guys have chosen to accept this belief? there seems to be increasing evidence that the universe could not be as it is were it not for a supreme creator. Since I know I can not make you guys see any good reason to believe in the bible since most of you ridicule and make fun of the bible on a daily basis I will like to know how this belief system you have adopted helps in enhancing who you are and the society you live in? Without purpose and ultimate consequence, where do you guys think morality comes from? I believe in Jehovah the God of the bible, I also believe that he is the only Supreme Being who created the whole universe and actively takes part in it(there are stories and testaments of his goodness and blessing every where).

I am an atheist as a result of a very lengthy personal and philosophical search. Atheism isn't really a belief, it's a lack of belief in God. So I do not choose to believe in God because I have yet to hear an account of God or a God that has any evidence or internal consistency.
The fact that we were all brought up with the belief in one deity or the other doesn't make it true. Its all about purpose and we all make our own purpose.I feel this lack of belief allows me to make judgments free of superstition but based on facts.
Even those that believe in God are making their purpose regardless of whatever their religion says they should make it some religious people turn their back on the prescribed purpose to do other things they find more interesting to them some discard what ever the see as an outright contradiction to the personality they have come to attribute to their God. As for the bible you have it to read for yourself and let us know how you believe that it is infallible and the word of a perfect God. I don't like discussing God out side the bible or the koran and since you are a Christian I will like you to see all the attributes assigned to the bibleGod and tell us if it you can reconcile it with what you see happening in the world today.

And as for morality there is very little morality to be learned in the bible, Pls read the old testament and tell me what kind of morality is there to be learned in that book. My morals stem from empathy and logic. If you feel for other people, you will personally feel bothered if you were to steal something from them even though you might not express the feeling. If I do good to others, it is more than likely that they will return good in kind. If I do evil to others, the opposite holds true. Since I'd much rather that people are good to me, it is in my best interest to do good to them. Fear of punishment or expectation of reward in an afterlife is not necessary to encourage moral behaviour in human beings. We have the impetus right here in the life we're living on this earth. Empathy is a trait most of us have which causes us to feel badly if we cause harm to others. The development of empathy can be accounted for by evolution. The basic philosophy in life with regards to morals is very simple. Do not do to others what you do not want to be done to yourself. If everyone could simply practice that. The world should be a much better place. You don't need any God to practice that.

Jesus is coming back to Judge ONLY the 12 tribes of Israel. So you Nigerian Christains should go and begin to look for sango, or Omadiagbo to judge you guys.

And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. --Matthew 19:28

I don't see any Nigerian or african tribe listed amongst the 12 tribes of Israel.

Luke 2:25-32
25 And behold there was a man in Jerusalem named Simeon, and this man was just and devout, waiting for the consolation of Israel; and the Holy Ghost was in him.

26 And he had received an answer from the Holy Ghost, that he should not see death, before he had seen the Christ of the Lord. 27 And he came by the Spirit into the temple. And when his parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him according to the custom of the law, 28 He also took him into his arms, and blessed God, and said: 29 Now thou dost dismiss thy servant, O Lord, according to thy word in peace; 30 Because my eyes have seen thy salvation,

31 Which thou hast prepared before the face of all peoples: 32 A light to the revelation of the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel this was an Israelite, a rabbi in the temple speaking about Jesus, so the Jews knew exactly what the messiah was to do. He was not just to be a messiah to the Israelites but to the world. The problem with them is that they still maintained that the gentiles were to become Jews, subject to the law of Moses. They killed Jesus because he seemed to be challenging Moses, even though he was not.

The Jews knew what that the messiah was not meant to be a messiah to the Israelities but to the whole world according to your Christain bible or theirs(Hebrew bible)? By the way no where is the story of Jesus'death ever reported as it was reported in the bible, there are no records to show that the Jews or Romans killed Jesus as it was reported in the bible but that is a different argument entirely.

Acts of the apostles 1: 8 But you shall receive the power of the Holy Ghost coming upon you, and you shall be witnesses unto me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea, and Samaria, and even to the uttermost part of the earth[/b]this is Jesus speaking right before he was taken up to heaven. The apostles were to preach to the ends of the earth. This is before Paul

If you read my post from the begging I said that the writers of the Gospels and the book of Acts did not bother to read and compare there works. Here is the verse you quoted from in full context.

Act 1:5 For John baptized with [fn] water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit."
Act 1:6 So when they met together, [b]they asked him, "Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?"
Act 1:7 He said to them: "It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority.
Act 1:8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth."
Act 1:9 After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.

They will be his witness in Jerusalem, Judea, Samaria and to the ends of the earth that he died and rose up. This part is ambiguous and could be taken to mean a lot of things, He only said that they will be his witness, he didn't say that they should go and preach to the entire world about him according to the passage but when Jesus was telling his disciples to preach about the kingdom of heaven that was at hand he said it in unambiguous terms that they should not go into the cities of the gentiles. He also said that he was sent only to the lost tribe of Israel. He did not want to heal the child of the gentile woman because he believes that it was wrong for the gentiles to enjoy what was meant for the children of Israel alone.

Stephen the martyr was killed because the Jews accused him of changing the laws of Moses, this was before Paul. The same message that Paul preached was already being preached. Infact Paul killed him because he was preaching that same message.

Acts 8:5 And Philip going down to the city of Samaria, preached Christ unto them.
remember Christ had already told them not to go to the city of samaria to preach, if we go by your interpretation of that verse, then Philip was already not listening to Christ. This was before Paul.

Of course he was not listening to Christ? Why did Jesus say that he was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel? Why did he refer to the gentiles are "dogs" for wanting to partake in the Food(Miracles and healing) of the people of Israel? Why did he never say that he was going to Judge the Jews and Gentiles in any of the Gospels? Why did he say that he was going to Judge only the 12 tribes of Israel?

Ok. John 3:16 For God so loved the world, as to give his only begotten Son; that whosoever believeth in him, may not perish, but may have life everlasting. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world, to judge the world, but that the world may be saved by him. 18 He that believeth in him is not judged. But he that doth not believe, is already judged: because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19 And this is the judgment: because the light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than the light: for their works were evil. 20 For every one that doth evil hateth the light, and cometh not to the light, that his works may not be reproved

This are not the words of Jesus but the words of the(unknown) writer of John.

Matthew 28: 19 Going therefore, teach ye all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost

Nations here mean the 12 Nations of Israel. The word "nations" in greek(Which the original new testament was translated from) is the word ethnos, which also translates as ONE Race / ONE Ethniciy, or ONE Tribe, or ONE People. The word "nations" is the Greek word Ethnos, which occurs 164 times in the New Testament. Throughout the entire text of scripture this word refers to the people / ethnos of the covenant seed of Abraham, Isaac, and Jaccob. Notice the bible speaks specifically that the literal flesh of Abraham is called the (NATIONS) "ethnos" or "goyim" in Hebrew. (Gen. 12:2; Gen. 17:4-6; Gen 17:16; Gen 18:18; Gen 22:18; Gen 25:23; Gen 35:11; Gen 48:19; Jer. 31:36). keep in mind the other commandments, and that Jesus Christ would not contradict his other commands. In Matt 10:5-6 He commanded the disciples to not enter cities that weren't of the lost sheep of the house of Israel. In Mat 15:24 He answered, "I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel."

The commandment to teach ALL 12 nations / tribes of Israel was given to the disciples to move beyond the house of Judah to the other 12 tribes of Israel. All the nations were to be ministered to and not only the pureblooded house of Judah.

~Lady~:
You do know that the Church is Israel right?
In one of the above passages you showed where Jesus is saying they shouldn't go to the samaritans, and yet he went to the samaria and was talking to a samaritan woman, and even offered her to drink from the living water (himself).
Also samaria is considered a lost sheep of Israel. If above in the passage Jesus was including samaria as a gentile nation (which rightfully it is), then he was including the gentiles when he made that offer to the samaritan woma

Israel is now the church?  the extent to which you guys will go to rationalize you delusion is really funny. What does the Church mean according to the bible?I thought it meant the Body of Christ, If the Church which is Israel is now the body of Christ as you have said then what now happens to your argument in favor of the gentiles? What has Jesus talking to one woman from samaria got to do with him warning his disciples not to go to the cities of the gentiles? He told them categorically that he was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel(Israel here is not the Church as you will want us to believe). If  Samaria is considered among the lost sheep of Israel why did Jesus not say so? He told his disciples no to go into the lands of the gentiles and samaritans but to the lost sheep of Israel. Show me a passage in the bible where Jesus went to the land of the canaanites and offered a single person salvation.(without them coming to him). Remeber he was reluctant and did not want to heal the child of the canaanite woman because he said that it was not right to take what belongs to the children(Israel) and give it to their dogs(Gentiles).

If Jesus was trying to exclude the gentiles then why did he offer the gentile woman salvation? In the above passage, it was not yet time for his disciples to go to the gentiles, they first had to preach to the Israelites who then refused his message, before going on to the gentiles.

If he was trying to include the gentiles why did he tell his disciples to stay away from the gentiles when preaching that the kingdom of heaven is near? why did he say that he was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel? Why did he say that he was going to judge only the twelve tribes of Israel?

Matthew 10: 16 Behold I send you as sheep in the midst of wolves. Be ye therefore wise as serpents and simple as doves. 17 But beware of men. For they will deliver you up in councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues. 18 And you shall be brought before governors, and before kings for my sake, for a testimony to them and to the Gentiles

What does this passage tell you? All you did was just copy a part of it that agrees with your thoughts and present it as Jesus telling his disciples to preach unto the gentiles but you have it all wrong. Here is Jesus in his own words from the beggining when he was sending his disciples out to preach about the kingdom of heaven that was at hand.

Mat 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: "Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans.
Mat 10:6[b] Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel.
Mat 10:7 As you go, preach this message: 'The kingdom of heaven is near.'
Mat 10:8 Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy, [fn]drive out demons. Freely you have received, freely give. [/b]
Mat 10:9 Do not take along any gold or silver or copper in your belts;
Mat 10:10 take no bag for the journey, or extra tunic, or sandals or a staff; for the worker is worth his keep.
Mat 10:11 "Whatever town or village you enter, search for some worthy person there and stay at his house until you leave.
Mat 10:12 As you enter the home, give it your greeting.
Mat 10:13 If the home is deserving, let your peace rest on it; if it is not, let your peace return to you.
Mat 10:14 If anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, shake the dust off your feet when you leave that home or town.
Mat 10:15 I tell you the truth, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.
Mat 10:16 I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves.
Mat 10:17 "Be on your guard against men; they will hand you over to the local councils and flog you in their synagogues.
Mat 10:18 On my account you will be brought before governors and kings as witnesses to them and to the Gentiles.
Mat 10:19 But when they arrest you, do not worry about what to say or how to say it. At that time you will be given what to say,
Mat 10:20 for it will not be you speaking, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you.
Mat 10:21 "Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; children will rebel against their parents and have them put to death.
Mat 10:22 All men will hate you because of me, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved.

Here is the whole passage in its full context, all you did was cherry pick what made sense to you to prove your point.

;d ;d ;d ;d

The day you tell him the truth is the day your marriage will end.

Its their money, isn't it?

Alam-Tara:
@bindex @ dalaman @Ndipe

Hello house I it is like we are all enjoying the discussion so much that we have forgotten what brought us here. Hey, WHO CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION?

Christians please help me. Answer the question. If no one can answer the question it means that "In Truth Jesus did not Die on the Cross" and that means they have been lieing to the world for over 2000 years.

Hasn't Islam been shamelessly lying to the world for the last 1600 years? See this deluded slave of a killer God calling the kettle black when his own beliefs are more nonsensical.

Alam-Tara:
@ Bindex Yes yes the fire in hell will be quenched with your piss. I agree. Just answer the question. Yes Dalman and Ndipe I accept all that you have to say. Please answer the question. WAS JONAH DEAD WHEN HE WAS INSIDE THE BELLY OF THE WHALE?

What is this? Are you asking me to tell you what happened to Jonah when he was inside the belly of a fish? Such myths only exist in the pages of the bible, koran and other religious text. Hug your Koran and go play with the killer Whale lets see if you will survive for 3 days inside its belly.

olabowale:
@Bindex: « #8 on: Today at 09:16:41 PM »
The Virgins: not yet. Isa bin Mariam and Asiah, the wife of Fir'awn are going to be part of the wives of the Messenger and Prophet (AS). Mariam never had a husband. Asiah, as a believer needs a believer. Muhammad (AS) is the best of men. He should get the best of women, who are not related to him.


@dalaman: Our Isa bin Mariam, binta Imran, ukti Harun (AS), did not die. Rather, he was protected from dying by crucifixion. But your Jesus which you worship, was a man born, along with the mess of after birth,, , and died afterward. Is a one that succumbed to death worthy of being worship?

You sir, (Bindex), gets nothing. No reprieve in hell. You better come back home, man.

Olabowale are you sure you are OK? Isa bin Mariam and Asiah, the wife of Fir'awn are going to be part of the wives of the Messenger and Prophet ? Is Mohammed gay? . Mohammed is the best of men? .

You sir, (Bindex), gets nothing. No reprieve in hell. You better come back home, man

I said that I will use my urine to quench the fire that burns in Allah's hell. I am way too big for your imaginary Allah. I practiced Islam before and there is nothing to gain inside apart from the unnecessary fear of an imaginary deity that is completely impotent.

~Sissy~:
says who, i heard he personally wrote his speech on race, his camp wanted to write it but according to them he refused and he wrote it by himself, and he is really smart to do so

This is very true. He has written two very interesting books, so writing is not a very difficult thing for him. I heard that Sarah Palin wants to write a book. I just wonder the lady from Wasilla is going to write about apart from moose hunting and ice skating. You betcha  .

Kai Hamas

This is VERY great, thats if the story is true.

Where is Mr President? . Kai Nigeria

@ Alam-Tara

Did prophet Mohammed ascend into heaven(to enjoy his share of the heavenly virgins) at the site of the Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem (Al-Aqsa Mosque)? Deluded slave of Allah.

davidylan:
Unfortunately i do not belong to the school of christians who feel the need to ALWAYS explain biblical principles to those whose hearts are seared with the rod of iron that they shld believe a lie. If you dont understand the bible or detest it, simply ignore it period.

Why not rod of wood? Remember the bibleGod loves wood so much. He once lived inside a wooden ark created by the ancient Jews
Of course you can not logically explain principles that are false can you(Jacob' "genetic engineering" model)Apart from always shouting miracle (as the lame excuse) What else do you have?

~Lady~:
there is no confusion about the early christian history and if there is it isn't from acts. Acts was written by Luke, the same one who wrote the gospel. so it isn't a far off book for the bible. it is the second writing by luke. In that book, before the conversion of Paul, Peter spoke about the gentiles, and their receiving the gospel. actually the gentiles were already receiving the gospel before the conversion of Paul, it wasn't at the rate that paul spread the gospel. Paul also didn't formulate his own gospel to preach, he received it from Peter. Paul spent at least two weeks with Peter learning from him after his conversion.

Peter preached the same thing that Paul preached, he was wrong when later he wasn't living by his preaching and Paul rebuked him for that.

So no Paul didn't try to change Jesus' teaching, he learned his teaching from the apostles and mostly from the Chief apostle, Peter. Paul was commissioned by them to spread the gospel far and wide.

You need to read paul's letters once again. Paul commissioned himself to use Jesus' messages and Ideas to make a name for himself.

~Lady~:
Paul never changed anything around, you're interpreting it wrongly.

Paul who was never with Jesus when he was alive according to the bible changed every thing Jesus said. Jesus warned his disciples never to preach to the gentiles but paul changed everything.

chukwudi44:
bindex i thought you are an atheist.What are you trying to achieve?Do you now agree that God exists?

I am an ATHEIST, all I am doing here is showing you blind people what is really in your bible and how some of the stories or words were delibrately mistranslated to create the new God (Jesus) by Paul, the Romans, Greeks and some of the early Christian founders. The Prophecy in Isaiah 7:14 does not support Matthew's claim that Isaiah is referring to Jesus' virgin birth. It should be said at the outset that the word "virgin" does not appear in the seventh chapter of Isaiah.  The author of the first Gospel deliberately mistranslated the Hebrew word ha'almah as "a virgin."  This Hebrew word ha'almah does not mean "a virgin."  It means "the young woman," with no implication of virginity.

"…I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles. … and the isles shall wait for his law. … for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles…"
Isaiah 42:1-7.

This verse is completely mistranslated from the original hebrew bible go and read the JPS or Stone edition of the hebrew bible and you will see what I am talking about. The early Christian founders took the Hebrew text and created a new God(Jesus) out of it, but unfortunatly for Christains Judaism is still around to show all the lies and delibrate mistranslation of the original hebrew bible (tanakah) by the Christains. Jesus is a new God that was created by Paul and the rest of the gentiles out of the original hebrew text.

~Lady~:
bindex, the passage about the canaanite woman is wrongly interpreted by you, you failed to go to the end of the conversation with her. that was a test of the woman's faith, when she passed the test, Jesus granted her request. If he wasn't including gentiles in his ministry then he wouldn't have healed her, but not just that he also wouldn't have accepted the samaritan woman.

I agree that the story was portraying how the woman had faith in Jesus, but to say anything other wise is to lie about what Jesus has said so many times. Again here is your Jesus in his own words.

Mat 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: "Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans.

Mat 10:6 Go rather to the lost sheep of Israel.

Mat 10:7 As you go, preach this message: 'The kingdom of heaven is near.'

Mat 10:8 Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy, [fn]drive out demons. Freely you have received, freely give.

Mat 10:9 Do not take along any gold or silver or copper in your belts;

Mat 10:10 take no bag for the journey, or extra tunic, or sandals or a staff; for the worker is worth his keep.

Mat 10:11 "Whatever town or village you enter, search for some worthy person there and stay at his house until you leave.

Here you have Jesus in the bible telling his disciples not to go any where near the gentiles when preaching about the kingdom of God that is at hand. There you have it. More from Jesus in the bible.

Mat 15:24 He answered, "I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel."
Mat 15:26 He replied, "It is not right to take the children's bread and toss it to their dogs."

And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. Matthew 19:28

Even when he was talking about Judgement he only mentioned Israel, he never said he was going to judge the gentiles.

also in John 10:16 Jesus said "I have other sheep that do not belong to this fold. These also I must lead, and they will hear my voice and there will be one flock, one shepherd.

The other sheep that do not belong to that fold (israel) are the gentiles. the fold he talks about is israel, the other sheep are gentiles. so he did say that he came for them too.

You just took an ambiguous statement from Jesus and interpreted it to mean what it never meant. I have other sheep does not mean gentiles in any way. He might have been talking about the other lost tribes of Israel. Jesus told his disciples in clear terms not to go to the cities of the gentiles to share the message about the kingdom of heaven because as it is written in the bible he came only for the lost tribe of Israel. If there is anywhere in the bible where Jesus himself said he came to save the world(Jews and Gentiles) in the bible pls go ahead and show me.

Image123:
The gospel writers wre present.I doubt if Josephus was a christian and he was not present,

They were present but still manage to write what Jesus did in when he was alone in private? How did they know when it is written in the bible that all the so called eye witness were all asleep? And as for Josephus Christians are quick to shout Josephus mentioned Jesus in one of his writings but when confronted with the fact that Josephus who wrote very extensively about Herod never said anything about Herod ordering the killing of babies at anytime throught out his reign they shout Josephus was not an eye witness. 

huxley:
Mired in cognitive dissonance, I wonder. If not, can you explain the bizarre "genetic engineering" model that Jacob used to breed sheep/goat in the light of the science you seem to be an "advovate" of.

Miracle of Jehovah is always the lame excuse.

Another mistranslated passage in the Christain bible that is completely different from the Jewish bible is Isaiah 42:1-7.

In the Septuagint it reads

"…I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles. … and the isles shall wait for his law. … for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles…"
Isaiah 42:1-7

while in the original Hebrew bible Isaiah 42: 1-7 is translated as:

1. Behold My servant, I will support him, My chosen one, whom My soul desires; I have placed My spirit upon him, he shall promulgate justice to the nations.
2. He shall neither cry nor shall he raise [his voice]; and he shall not make his voice heard outside.
3. A breaking reed he shall not break; and a flickering flaxen wick he shall not quench; with truth shall he execute justice.
4. Neither shall he weaken nor shall he be broken, until he establishes justice in the land, and for his instruction, islands shall long.
5. So said God the Lord, the Creator of the heavens and the One Who stretched them out, Who spread out the earth and what springs forth from it, Who gave a soul to the people upon it and a spirit to those who walk thereon.
6. I am the Lord; I called you with righteousness and I will strengthen your hand; and I formed you, and I made you for a people's covenant, for a light to nations.
7. To open blind eyes, to bring prisoners out of a dungeon, those who sit in darkness out of a prison.

This is god speaking about Israel (Jacob) and is part of the "Songs of Isaiah" which in original Hebrew are neither numbered nor does Hebrew have any capital letters.

Rabbi Tovia Singer states: These four "Servant Songs," which are found in Isaiah 41-53, are so called because throughout these soothing chapters, the prophet foretells the glorious redemption of the righteous remnant of Israel who is repeatedly identified as God's servant. Isaiah 53 is the culmination of Isaiah's narrative which describes the Almighty's servant-nation who, after a brutal and seemingly endless exile, is elevated and redeemed in the eyes of her former oppressors -- the gentile nations.

So the bottom line is that the Romans took the Jewish text edited it and created a new God out of the already existing Jewish God. They changed this new God completely and made him acceptable to every body. They then decided to call him Jesus.

Now on to another mistranslated messianic passage from the OT.

Isaiah 7:14 does not support Matthew's claim that Isaiah is referring to Jesus' virgin birth. It should be said at the outset that the word "virgin" does not appear in the seventh chapter of Isaiah. The author of the first Gospel deliberately mistranslated the Hebrew word ha'almah as "a virgin." This Hebrew word ha'almah does not mean "a virgin." It means "the young woman," with no implication of virginity. Most modern Christian Bibles have corrected this erroneous translation, and their Bibles now correctly translate this Hebrew word as "the young woman." If Isaiah had wanted to spefically say virgin, he would have used betulah, a common word used in other areas of the OT that only means virgin.
Isaiah 7:14.

The seventh chapter of the Book of Isaiah begins by describing the military crisis that was confronting King Ahaz of the Kingdom of Judah. In about the year 732 B.C.E. the House of David was facing imminent destruction at the hands of two warring kingdoms: the northern Kingdom of Israel and the Kingdom of Syria. These two armies had laid siege to Jerusalem. The Bible relates that the House of David and King Ahaz were gripped with fear. Chapter seven relates how God sent the prophet Isaiah to reassure King Ahaz that divine protection was at hand. The Almighty would protect him, their deliverance was assured, and these two hostile armies would fail in their attempt to subjugate Jerusalem. In Isaiah 7 , : "Let us go up against Judah and provoke it, and annex it to us; and let us crown a king in its midst, one who is good for us." So said the Lord God, "Neither shall it succeed, nor shall it come to pass . . . ." ' " The Lord continued to speak to Ahaz, saying, "Ask for yourself a sign from the Lord, your God; ask it either in the depths, or in the heights above." Ahaz said, "I will not ask, and I will not test the Lord." Then he said, "Listen now, O House of David, is it little for you to weary men, that you weary my God as well? Therefore the Lord, of His own, shall give you a sign: Behold the young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and she shall call his name Immanuel. Cream and honey he shall eat when he knows to reject bad and choose good; for, when the lad does not yet know to reject bad and choose good, the land whose two kings you dread, shall be abandoned."

It is clear from this chapter that Isaiah's declaration was a prophecy of the unsuccessful siege of Jerusalem by the two armies of the Kingdoms of Israel and Syria, not a virgin birth more than 700 years later. If we interpret this chapter as referring to Jesus' birth, what possible comfort and assurance would Ahaz, who was surrounded by to overwhelming military enemies, have found in the birth of a child seven centuries later? Both he and his people would have been long dead and buried. Such a sign would make no sense.

We see, in II Kings 15-16, that this prophecy was fulfilled when these two kings were suddenly assassinated. With an understanding of the context of Isaiah 7:14 alone, it is evident that the child born in Isaiah 7:14 is not referring to Jesus or to any future virgin birth. Rather, it is referring to the divine protection that Ahaz and his people would enjoy from their impending destruction at the hands of these two enemies, the northern Kingdom of Israel and Syria.

Some Christians argue that this is a double prophecy. That it was fulfillied twice, once as I stated but again 700 years later with Jesus. If Christians argue that the word ha'almah means a "virgin," and, as they insist, Isaiah 7:14 was fulfilled twice, who was the first virgin to conceive in Ahaz's time? Were there two virgin births? That is to say, if these Christians claim that the virgin birth of Isaiah 7:14 was fulfilled twice, who then was the first virgin having a baby boy in 732 B.C.E.? Bear in mind that Christians insist that the word ha'almah can only mean virgin. Are they claiming that Mary was not the first and only virgin to conceive and give birth to a child?

Finally, if Isaiah's words are the substance of a dual prophecy, at what age did the baby Jesus mature? Which were the two kingdoms during Jesus' lifetime that were abandoned? Who dreaded the Kingdom of Israel during the first century when there had not been a Kingdom of Israel in existence since the seventh century B.C.E.? When did Jesus eat cream and honey? Why wasn't Jesus named Immanuel?

Image123:
I've told you times before,you do not understand simple simple bible.
Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

The problems is that you really don't know what you are talking about. The 12 tribes of Israel are also regarded as the 12 nations of Israel so many times in the bible. The word "nations" in greek(Which the original new testament was translated from) is the word ethnos, which also translates as ONE Race / ONE Ethniciy, or ONE Tribe, or ONE People. You dont have to use a hebrew or greek dictionary in order to find the definition of the word. You can simply let the bible be it's own lexicon and give you the definition of the word.

The word "nations" is the Greek word Ethnos, which occurs 164 times in the New Testament. Throughout the entire text of scripture this word refers to the people / ethnos of the covenant seed of Abraham, Isaac, and Jaccob. Notice the bible speaks specifically that the literal flesh of Abraham is called the (NATIONS) "ethnos" or "goyim" in Hebrew. (Gen. 12:2; Gen. 17:4-6; Gen 17:16; Gen 18:18; Gen 22:18; Gen 25:23; Gen 35:11; Gen 48:19; Jer. 31:36). keep in mind the other commandments, and that Jesus Christ would not contradict his other commands. In Matt 10:5-6 He commanded the disciples to not enter cities that weren't of the lost sheep of the house of Israel. In Mat 15:24 He answered, "I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel."

The commandment to teach ALL 12 nations / tribes of Israel was given to the disciples to move beyond the house of Judah to the other 12 tribes of Israel. All the nations were to be ministered to and not only the pureblooded house of Judah.

Jesus came revealing his will first to the Jews then to the others(Gentiles).The Jews had priority because they had an established covenant with God

Do you know what you are talking about? The Jews do not believe in Jesus because he was not the messiah that was promised to them and they have their hebrewbible to prove it. The requirements for the messiah are as follows ( as per the Jewish bible.) Not your own bible( Septuagint which is the the oldest Greek version of the Old Testament) that was edited so many times and is filled with mistranslations but the original hebrew bible(Tanakh) either the Stone edition or JPS (they are pretty identical and most Jews accept either edition as accurate).

1. He must be from the seed of David through Solomon
2. He will be anointed King of Israel (the word messiah means anointed, nothing more and nothing less)
3. He will return the Jewish people to Israel
4. He will rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem
5. He will bring peace to the world and end all war
6. He will bring knowledge of god to the world

All of the authentic Jewish messianic prophecies are empirically verifiable. The entire world will be able to see and verify the above.

Some things he will not be:
He will not be a deity
He will not need 2 visits to accomplish his mission
He will not die for our sins
He will not be pierced ( in reference to the mistranslation of Psalm 17 explained below)

Sources for the messianic criteria are from Isaiah 11:6, Talmud Yad, Melachim 11:4, Num 24:17, Deut 17:15 Lev 24:10 Ezra 10:2,3 Gen 49;10 Num 1:18-44 24:14 and Lev 24:10

About Jewish tribal law:
If your mother is Jewish, you are Jewish
If your father was a Kohen (Priest), you are a priest (birth only, no adoption allowed)
If your father was from the tribe of Judah, you are from the tribe of Judah (birth only, no adoption allowed).

For my reference to the messiah not needing to be pierced, I refer to Psalm 22:16 (17 in Jewish bible)
Dogs have compassed me; the assembly of the wicked have enclosed me; they pierced my hands and my feet. KJV
Dogs have encompassed me. A company of evildoers has enclosed me; like a lion, they are at my hands and my feet. JPS

Notice that when the original words of the Psalmist are read, any allusion to a crucifixion disappears. The insertion of the word "pierced" into the last clause of this verse was created by deliberately mistranslating the Hebrew word kaari as "pierced." The word kaari, however, does not mean "pierced," it means "like a lion." The end of Psalm 22:17, therefore, properly reads "like a lion they are at my hands and my feet." Had King David(the alleged writer of the palm) wished to write the word "pierced," he would never use the Hebrew word kaari. Instead, he would have written either daqar or ratza, which are common Hebrew words in the Jewish scriptures. Needless to say, the phrase "they pierced my hands and my feet" is a Christian contrivance that appears nowhere in the Jewish scriptures.

Bear in mind, this stunning mistranslation in the 22nd Psalm did not occur because Christian translators were unaware of the correct meaning of this Hebrew word. Clearly, this was not the case. The word kaari can be found in a number of other places in the Jewish scriptures. Yet predictably, the same Christian translators who rendered kaari as "pierced" in Psalm 22 correctly translated it "like a lion" in all other places in the Hebrew Bible where this word appears.

olabowale:
Get used to long hours of lock down. It will be a long, long lock down in Hell Fire.

You wish, I am too big for Allah and his imaginary hell. I will use my urine and quench all the fire that is burning in there. In fact I am too big for you Imaginary Allah, tell him to come and kill me for mocking him. Stupid fraud of a killer God.

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@bindex
you're very funny and confused.You don't believe the Bible,then you believe the writings in Matthew are the words of Jesus then the words in John are not the words of Jesus.Get a life

Its very true that I don't believe in the bible, all I am doing here is showing you how contradictory the bible is. Christains keep saying that Jesus was sent to the whole world to "save" every body when there is no place where he said any such thing himself in the bible if there is then go ahead and show me. Christains quote from the koran when trying to show moslems that their religion is false don't they? I am just showing you what Jesus said about his mission before the Romans decided to change everything about him and his message(that's if he ever existed anyway). Here is Jesus in his own words for those of you that believe in the bible

Mat 15:24 He answered, "I was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel."
Mat 15:26 He replied, "It is not right to take the children's bread and toss it to their dogs."

And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ,ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

--Matthew 19:28

It didn't say Judging the whole tribes of the world but the 12 tribes of Israel. You are not a member of the 12 tribes of Isreal are you? Here are the 12 tribes of Isreal during the time of Jesus(I don't see any african or Nigeria tribe amongst them)

EPHRAIM (Son of Joseph)                     
MANNASAH (Son of Joseph)                   
REUBEN
SIMEON
ZEBULON
ISAACHAR
DAN
GAD
ASHER
NAPHTALI
BENJAMIN
JUDAH

earTHMama:
No shit; They've been warned. I just hope they warn them to stay away from our money unless they want to die.

They have been stealing our money immediately after Nigeria got its independence so it nothing new. I doubt if they will ever stop without the people revolting in one way or the other.

olabowale:
To have locked you up at 7.00pm, must be a mother, man. I wonder why you haven't told them that you have no religion and therefore to a neutral beat? LOL. Don't get crazy and do that because I suggested it. I don't wanna anybody to say that I egg you on.

There was curfew in Jos when I was there because the bastard slaves of you dangerous and killer God went on rampage and decided to kill off all the enemies of Allah in Jos as commanded in the book of death(Koran). I had to be indoors by 7pm when I was there because of your imaginary fraud of a God (Allah) and his stupid and hopeless slaves. No matter how crazy I become I dont think I can be more crazy than Allah and his stupid slaves.