₦airaland Forum

PhysicsQED: What's wrong with you?

Stop trying to give me lectures on history you've read nothing about.

I don't get my history from summaries on random blogs. Read Alan Ryder's book Benin and the Europeans if you want to understand what went down between the Portuguese and Benin. That's a professional study that goes into far more detail than that blog.

And no, there was not really a "fort" at Ughoton, though there was a trading station, nor was there a school built in the palace. And what was written there about the desire for firearms only confirms my point earlier. As I said earlier, lots of meaningful commerce was carried on without western education.

For the last time, leave Benin history out of your pitiful trolling.

Must u show ur ineptitude all because you are ignorant of basic facts?I reply u without having to throw insults at u yet u show how bad-tempered u are.
Now listen:Those professional nonesense you read were part of the HAMITIC HYPOTHESIS which were formulated by racists and quack historians.
I had my Bsc in University of Benin and all students in year one take some basic courses including history and culture of Nigeria.
The history department in Uniben wrote å book titled"Nigerian Peoples and culture"It was written by Professor (Rev) Å.D Nzemeke and others in d history department.
All the lies just like d one you are propagating were debunked,exposed and d truth written.
So dump all those crap u may have read and simply go to Benin and read any of d books written by d University of Benin.

They were once å children,now an adult,and now they are bombing women and children,making some Children å widow....Courtesy of Patience Jonathan.

Idowuogbo: Yeah friggin rite! Y'all shud keep kissing d blackest part of my anuz for all I care.

errr...there u go again...I remember d other time u said that u got hot red arse.
Now u are saying ur anuz has å very dark part.
Are u saying that u gat å multicoloured anuz?

Abagworo: I'm starting to doubt if you are really from Ika. Most Igbos know that Idumu and Ogbe is used in Western Igbo with some infilteration into the Riverine Igbo(my own part). It is normal to borrow words and practices from a neighbouring ethnic group . You can also compare this with eastern Igbo where Yakur and Ibibio words are interchanged and appear in their various dialects. All Igbos at different angles have infuence of the cultures of their neighbours,


Now look at this traditional ruler of Onicha-Enugu and tell me he is not Igbo because they share names, culture and words with Igala.


http://ensmcm.org/ONICHA.html

His Royal Highness Igwe James Ojobo Idoko, the Ochemba I of Onicha Enugu Ezike. James Idoko hails from Umu Ona Nweze of Umueze Nweye extended family of Umu Owaya clan.
He was born about 1942 of the family of late Mr Idoko Ona and Mrs Amujiri Eze.

The world will be å better place if we let others share their opinions,see their points,make our own before we judge what is right.
I really appreciate your maturity on this thread so far and I will say that's å plus on ur character.
The only thing I will like to add is that the reason igbos are claiming IKA as ån igbo sub-group is based on similar cultures and nothing else.You have forgotten that Ika's culture is partly similar to igbo and partly similar to bini.Now how do we know d culture that was borrowed?Will u say Ika were Bini from origin but were influenced by igbos or they were igbos from origin but influenced by bini?
If d only reason ŵĥŷ Ika is igbo is because of similar culture,then the Binis can also do
d same.
If u go back in history to search the Ika ruling class,u will be amazed that they had predominantly Bini names.This is d basis of my argument.

*shakes my head*This Lady is just moving higher and higher oooo.
Is her numerous grammatical blunders responsible for her recent miraculous promotion in Leadership positions? Congrats to her shaaaaa

Abagworo: Idumu, Ogbe, Ama,Mgbu and Ezi are interchangeable according to dialect. A shift towards the Western side of Igbo "Idumu". Is used which actually is a borrowed word from Benin which means "quatres" or "area".

Visit http://www.ikaworld.com/index.php?mod=article&cat=IkaHistoryamp;Tradition&article=207

Abagworo:
Idumu, Ogbe, Ama,Mgbu and Ezi are interchangeable according to dialect. A shift towards the Western side of Igbo "Idumu". Is used which actually is a borrowed word from Benin which means "quatres" or "area".

Visit http://www.ikaworld.com/index.php?mod=article&cat=IkaHistoryamp;Tradition&article=207

Learn a little more about yourself.

Learn a little more about yourself.

What do u mean by western igbos?Are d binis now western igbos? Thanks for agreeing with me that d prefix "idumu" is å Bini word meaning "area" and not an igbo word.
Yet u read the other poster clearly asserted that ťĥĕy ŵėřē all igbo words used in denoting places and they could be recognised by all ibos.
You cannot take away the Bini roots from ika just as I cannot deny ibo's influence as well.But claiming Ika to be igbo is an offence which in my opinion deserves capital punishment.

ghostofsparta: Because you dont understand something doesn't give you the right to parodize it.

IFA says: Odudua atewon ro i.e. it that descended through a mystical chain. Odudua didn't FELL like those 'fallen angel' you have in semitic religion

Oh!sorry for using d word "fell".
Seems u know much about this theory.Pls elaborate on how Oduduwa climbed down with å chain from d sky?
Who made d chain?
Where was d chain hooked when he was climbing down?

PhysicsQED: You already gave some information about where you're from - an Ika person living in Lagos.

1st, no school was built in the palace. That is not at all a fact. That's a conjecture from you that has no backing from anywhere else. I have read what was actually written about what was supposed to have been built in the city and it is not this.

2nd, the Oba of Benin went with Christianity at that time in order to try and get guns. Nothing lasting came of that though since the effort to proselytize failed so the Portuguese continued to hold out on the sale of significant amounts of cannon. The guns they did get were only a brief blessing and in one instance some people had to hijack a ship just to get cannon. Also, some Benin tradition holds that the attempt to Christianize caused a controversy among some nobles and palace officials that were opposed to it. So when the proselytizing effort died out soon after it began, nobody really missed it.

3rd, meaningful commerce went on throughout Benin's history without Christianity with a host of different foreign groups - Dutch, English, etc., not just the Portuguese, and without Western education. If you were not ignorant of what an ozedu of the palace was, you would understand why this was the case.

Like I said earlier being ignorant of facts do not make them false.
There was no how the portuguese would have sold arms to d Binis without d Oba accepting d primary condition that they should accept christianity/western education.
Someone who travelled all d way to Portugal must have received western education.
I remember first reading this at John Harris Library in University of Benin.
Now I just stumbled on this again,pls go through and learn

Benin, Empire: Oba Ewuare, Trade with the Portuguese

The kingdom of Benin, situated in the Yorubaland forest in present-day southwestern Nigeria, reached its zenith in the fifteenth and sixteenth centuries under the reigns of the oba (king) Ewuare (r. c. 1440–1473), his son Ozolua (r. c. 1481–1504), and his grandson Esigie (r.1504–1547).

Ewuare relied on his subjects’ belief in the divine nature of kings to consolidate his power. The king was believed to influence the weather, fertility, harvests, and social harmony; he was sacred and feared. On this basis Ewuare instituted reforms aimed at diminishing the power of the uzama, hereditary chiefs who traditionally participated in the selection of the oba. He enacted a rule of primogeniture to eliminate their role in the process of succession to the throne. In time, the chiefs themselves adopted this rule, thereby impeding the development of large lineage support groups and further strengthening the oba. Ewuare, however, needed chiefs to supervise the day-to-day administration of the kingdom and to collect the tributes from villages, which constituted much of his revenues. To further dilute the uzama’s authority he appointed additional “town” and “palace” chiefs, directly beholden to him.


The degree of the king’s authority fluctuated for a century. However, palace skirmishes had little effect on the expansion of Benin’s empire. During the dry season Ewuare and his successors regularly undertook campaigns to extend Benin’s frontiers eastward to the




Benin Kingdom, fifteenth-eighteenth centuries.

Niger delta, southward to the sea, and westward into Yoruba country. These conquests have earned Ewuare the title of “Ewuare the Great” and his son that of “Ozolua the Conqueror.”

During the century of expansion, the vitality and stability of the kingdom were displayed in many ways. Eware rebuilt the capital Benin City, dividing it into two sections—the larger for the bulk of the town’s residents and the smaller for the royal palace and the elite. He also improved communications by ordering construction of broad avenues and smaller intersecting streets. In the sixteenth century, Benin was a city 25 miles in circumference, protected by walls and moats. The arts flourished. As trade brought more copper and brass into Benin, craftsmen refined casting techniques. They produced not only palace art and elaborate altar pieces, but also bronze bas-reliefs, representing the oba, his court, and his contacts with the Portuguese. As a historical record, these are reminiscent of Western Europe’s medieval tapestries.
Tradition, perhaps alluding to Ruy de Sequeira’s trip to Africa in 1472, credits Ewaure with having been the first oba of Benin in contact with the Portuguese, who were then exploring the region. It is likely that European goods reached Benin prior to the arrival of the Europeans themselves. It is known from writings of Portuguese eyewitnesses that upon arrival in Benin they found a large centralized state already involved in political and commercial relations with several—sometimes distant—areas.
The Portuguese were then the only Europeans seeking trade in the region. By the 1480s their policy was to make trade with the Guinean coasts a Portuguese monopoly. Their forts and ships in the region were meant to keep other Europeans out as much as to control Africans. The Portuguese thought that an alliance with Benin would offer them sizable markets for their own goods. Benin traded with Europeans to obtain guns, powder, metals, salt, and cloth in exchange for palm oil, ivory, cloth, beads, pepper, and slaves. Except for slaves, a natural by-product of the wars waged by Benin, the other exports do not seem to have come from local sources. Apparently one of the keys to Benin’s wealth was its location at a junction of east-west and north-south trade.
Little of what Benin was exporting went to Europe: there was pepper at first (until the Portuguese succeeded in establishing their spice trade with Asia), and small numbers of slaves. Beads, cloth, and slaves the Portuguese also initially exchanged in African ports along the Gulf of Guinea for gold—the west African product they sought above all else at that time. However, the Portuguese interest in slaves grew steadily throughout the sixteenth century, first to supplement the labor force of Portugal itself and then to work in the newly developed Portuguese plantations on islands off the west African coast and in the Gulf of Guinea; but Benin never became deeply involved in the slave trade.
For the Portuguese, trade with Benin was complicated by the fact that the kingdom lay about 50 miles inland. In 1487 they built a fort at Ughoton (Gwato), which was as near as their ships could get to Benin City. To get there, they had to travel about 40 miles from the sea up treacherous rivers and could still reach the capital only by traveling 19 miles overland. Benin controlled river and land routes. Authority here depended on labor; the Portuguese were few and had to rely on local inhabitants for military support, fresh water, and provisions. They could trade at Benin only with the oba and his accredited agents on terms laid down by him. After about 30 years they found the oba’s conditions, particularly the new ban on the export of male slaves, too onerous, and abandoned Ughoton. Later trade was conducted mainly by individual Portuguese merchants from Gulf of Guinea islands.
However, relations did not end when the Portuguese left Ughoton. It seems that both Africans and Europeans were investigating what they could gain from each other. In 1514 oba Esigie sent a delegation to Portugal, complaining about Portuguese slaving activities, but also asking for a Christian mission and firearms. What Benin needed from the Portuguese was, above all, firearms. King Manuel I was, however, reluctant to sell weapons to pagans. This request seemed to the Portuguese to be the opportunity they had been waiting for. Actually the oba was far less interested in Christianity than he was in obtaining firearms, and though he learned to speak Portuguese, permitted establishment of a Christian mission, and allowed his son Orhogba and some officials to be baptized, he did not accept baptism himself. By the middle of the century the Portuguese had virtually no contact with Benin.

http://neutralanalysis..com/2011/07/great-leaders-in-nigerias-history_8727.html

bright007: are u sure?
Ok wat is d meaning of "idumu-oba" in igbo language?
Pls tell me d meaning of all d places with d prefix "idumu" in igbo language.

answer this and stop playing to the gallery.

PhysicsQED: Can you please keep the Binis and your conjectures about the Binis out of your trolling?

If you feel for whatever reason that you absolutely must troll and get a rise out of people, you should leave non-Ika, non-Igbo groups out of it.

Simply because u are ignorant of those facts up there do not make them conjectures.Simply grow up and learn.
You don't where I âm from,so don't tell me to stop saying what I know about my history.

9ja voice: Ika North East:
Cities, Towns and Communities
-------------------------------------



Any igboman even in the village can spot for you that all the names of the villages here are igbo. what are we arguein about.

are u sure?
Ok wat is d meaning of "idumu-oba" in igbo language?
Pls tell me d meaning of all d places with d prefix "idumu" in igbo language.

9ja voice: But assuming Crowder alone brought the gospel to igboland, are you insunuating that igbos are inferior or backward or what is your point with that assertion.
The man who rcv the gospel first does it determine who gets to heaven and who knows bible better. just a matter of time?

As soon as yorubas if concern they are not this debate topic, or are they?
But somehow am insunuating you are yoruba or beni am sure you are not from IKA-IBO.

So run away from this trade.

If only u can pay attention to details.Go back to my post and u will see where I stated dat "Townsend" was part of d mission.If u have been following this thread,u will know dat d first time I mentioned Crowther,someone countered my point that Crowther never built any schools in Igboland.

How can u be this ungrateful?
Crowther spent more than 5 years at d school in Onitsha and even left words of wisdom/guidelines as an experienced Revd on what Taylor should do to succeed.You come here and display ungratefulness.

9ja voice: Clearification before answer:
Crowther was selected to accompany the missionary James Frederick Schön on the Niger expedition of 1841. Together with Schön, he was expected to learn Hausa for use on the expedition. The goal of the expedition was to spread commerce, teach agricultural techniques, spread Christianity, and help end the slave trade. Following the expedition, Crowther was recalled to England, where he was trained as a minister and ordained by the bishop of London. He returned to Africa in 1843 and with Henry Townsend, opened a mission in Abeokuta, in today's Ogun State, Nigeria.

Answer:
by 1841 christian mission starts in igbo land when all our grand fathers including igbos,yorubas,binis are yet in darkness.
yet igbo slaves don't wait but venture into salvaging their father land with the gospel.
I hope you are tru on this.

Here u go again with another blunder.The Binis were actually d FIRST in present day nigeria to become christians and western education was first in introduced into Nigeria by d Portuguese who visited Benin in d second half of d 15th century.
According to Hubbard(1948).ťĥĕ second half of d 15th century saw d arrival of d Europeans in Benin,d portuguese.These visitors realised dat in order to engage in meaningful commerce,d people had to be given some rudimentary education and christianity.they thus regarded education as of fundamental importance to d spread of christianity.So,at about 1535,some catholic Priests arrived Benin and set up å school with d permission of d Oba,in his palace for d teaching of his sons and his chiefs.It ŵăš through this medium dat some Benin sons were first converted to christianity.During this period,an ambassador was sent from Benin to Portugal.when he came back he could speak portuguese language fluently.
So don't come here blabbing because there were å lot of missions by d europeans that failed but it is d one dat succeeded dat we are talking about here.the 1841 mission was one of such failed missions as there was no evidence of christianity/formal education when Crowther and Co arrived.

@physicsqed:Well in as much as u and d other guy ar derailing this thread,I âm learning from ur discussion.
But I beg to disagree with u on ur earlier post emphasising that the relationship resulting from d contact of the Portuguese with d Binis and other groups in pre-historic times was more or less the same.
Do u know dat
(1)Bini land was d first to be visited by d europeans(portuguese) as early as 1472.Ruy Sequeira in 1472 in Ewuare's reign and Affonso de Aviero in 1484 in Ozolua's reign
(2)The bini knigdom was also d first to in d Coast of West Africa to exchange ambassadors with å major european power(portuguese)
(3)At about 1535,some catholic Preists arrived Benin and set up å school with d permission of d Oba in his palace for d teaching of his sons and chiefs,and that it was from this school dat some Bini sons first converted to christianity.
if u read more about d contacts Bini had with d europeans in pre-historic times,u will agree dat they had more than just ån economic relation with d europeans.I even read that one of d Obas could speak portuguese fluently in d course of this relationship.

@physicsqed:Well in as much as u and d other guy ar derailing this thread,I âm learning from ur discussion.
But I beg to disagree with u on ur earlier post emphasising that the relationship resulting from d contact of the Portuguese with d Binis and other groups in pre-historic times was more or less the same.
Do u know dat
(1)Bini land was d first to be visited by d europeans(portuguese) as early as 1472.Ruy Sequeira in 1472 in Ewuare's reign and Affonso de Aviero in 1484 in Ozolua's reign
(2)The bini knigdom was also d first to in d Coast of West Africa to exchange ambassadors with å major european power(portuguese)
(3)At about 1535,some catholic Preists arrived Benin and set up å school with d permission of d Oba in his palace for d teaching of his sons and chiefs,and that it was from this school dat some Bini sons first converted to christianity.
if u read more about d contacts Bini had with d europeans in pre-historic times,u will agree dat they had more than just ån economic relation with d europeans.I even read that one of d Obas could speak portuguese fluently in d course of this relationship.

BlackPikiN: You have to make your research before you come to spew rubbish.

Not discreditting Ajayi Crowther works but He was greatly assisted by Igbo slaves/scholars from Sierra Leone.

You can see Aboh and Bonny division were also said to be an Igbo country.

Read and make reasearches before you become mumu wey go dey deliver fake stories to your people.

Why has hatred become your surname?Read through my other post and I believe I didn't write anything contradictory to what u just posted.All I was emphasizing was dat Crowther was d fore-runner of this mission of CMS in Nigeria .I know he must have been assisted by other workers.Remember he first went to Abeokuta den left to Onitsha before going to d North where Islamic education already has its roots.He simply made sure things were working b4 he left.

Point number 2
Where did igwes,Obis and red-capped chiefs all in igboland descend from?When did we start hearing Obi of Onitsha?
It seem u guys are either stack illiterates of ur history or very lazy to do å research so dat u can come out of ignorance.
I never read history in d university as å course but have always used every opportunity I have in reading history books in order to get basic knowledge required of å literate person in other fields.if u guys don't clear d air on this issue,I will assume u found out d truth and decided dat "discretion was d better part of valour",hence u guys decoded to feign dumbness.

Abagworo: I believe you grew up among people who were either envious or ignorant of Igbos and their history and fed you with every wrong stereotype of what they believe should be Igbo. For the records Imo my State still has the highest number of graduates in Nigeria both male and female and with a wide margin. Igbos not being noticeable in the 90's in the formal sector was as a result of the war kids who missed school and had to resort to trading and manual jobs. Today the story has changed greatly as most young enterpreneurs and bank managers are Igbos by ethnicity. By young I mean people below 45 years. With this trend and without a quota system, we might end up with 80% control of the formal and informal sector by Nigerians of Igbo ethnic group in the next 20 years.

Why do u guys chicken-out of debates when u are being told d truth?
If u read my post and understood what I wrote,it was about the history of how Revd Ajayi Crowther introduced formal education to igboland which d other igbo guy declined.Are u also saying this is false?If it false,pls come out with d facts about the history of formal education in igboland and who pioneered it,shikena.

@poster $ others:I would like to know d origin of kings (igwe,obi and d red-capped chiefs)in igboland.
From where did they descend from?
At what time did we started having kings in igboland?
Am asking this in å good way.

Question:what makes å car bounce?
Answer:When u carry an åsss weighing more than d car.The car will bounce even more when u are working on d asss yourself.

Going clubbing without your hubby and you are pregnant?
My advice:I will not advise u to go because majority of people dat go clubbing still have this wayward or street attitude in them.If u really wanna dance to keep fit,I will implore u to do so at home (hope u doctor recommended dat?don't give your baby undue stress)
What if u go and something awkward happens?Night clubs are usually crowded with smokers,robbers,area boys who fights at d slightest provocation.
Religious wise(don't know if u are å christian or muslim),u should know u shouldn't go.Some pregnant women have invited familiar spirits into their unborn by d activities they do
during pregnancy and even after.
If å mother clubs,drinks,smokes etc during pregnancy,the probability dat ur child will do d same wen he/she grows up is high.Also,I remember somebody who I look up to for advice once told someone I know dat å pregnant woman should try to avoid nightwalking.

Is there anything like Bini state?

[quote author=Efemena_xy]Jackpot & Bright.

When is all this hating going to stop? E never do una? [/quote]Efe,nobody is hating anybody here oooo.Its just part of d joke.

Odenigbo Aroli: CMS was already in Igboland by 1857. Anyway,you are definitely not Ika and I am done with you. You dudnt come here to have a civilized interaction but to throw insults to the Igbo and I am too busy for weak line arguements. I see you are also on other Igbo thread running wild like a loose woman which you have been address with. Well,like someone said, you qre not ready or interested in learning. Your motive here is very clear.

Let me bother myself with ur first sentence.
You said CMS was already in igboland by 1857.By who?
You don't just come here and run your mouth as if everyone is å dunce like u.
Revd samuel Ajayi Crowther ŵăš one of d sold salves during d slave era.He was one of d human cargoes in å ship heading for the new world that was intercepted by the British Naval Squadron on d high sea and had its "cargoes" discharged in Freetown.It ŵăš in Freetown dat he was educated and ordained å priest by d Church Missionary Society (CMS) He eventually found his way to Nigeria where he contributed to immensely to d educational and missionary activities in Nigeria.
The CMS mission was led by Ajayi Crowther and Revd Townsend.They first started their missionary work in Abeokuta.At this time your grandfathers were still hunting lizards,rats,snails etc.
It was in 1858 that he moved to d eastern part of Nigeria and settled at Onitsha where he built å school for girls(this was d first FORMAL SCHOOL IN IGBOLAND).He built d school for girls because your grandfathers were not ready to learn(bush mentality was at its peak)
According to him (Ajayi Crowther) "the boys like to move about in plantations with bows and bamboos pointed arrows in their hands to hunt for birds,rats and lizards all day long without success,but now and then.half å dozen or more would rush into d school and proudly gaze at d alphabet board with an air of disdain mimic d names of d letters as pronounced by d school masters and repeated by d girls ,as if it were å thing only fit for females and too much confining to them as free rousers of d field"
POINTs
(1)It was å yoruba man that introduced formal education to Igboland
(2)The females were d first to be educated in igboland (eastern part of nigeria) and this education was by d CMS mission brought by Revd Ajayi Crowther and Revd Townsend.
This trend is still prevalent today as most male igbos don't like formal education,instead they go into business.Having said this,I would not be taken aback if u sell pirated Cds at Alaba or sell Okrika at Super and maybe u sell spare parts at Ladipo all in lagos.

Odenigbo Aroli: CMS was already in Igboland by 1857. Anyway,you are definitely not Ika and I am done with you. You dudnt come here to have a civilized interaction but to throw insults to the Igbo and I am too busy for weak line arguements. I see you are also on other Igbo thread running wild like a loose woman which you have been address with. Well,like someone said, you qre not ready or interested in learning. Your motive here is very clear.

Let me bother myself with ur first sentence.
You said CMS was already in igboland by 1857.By who?
You don't just come here and run your mouth as if everyone is å dunce like u.
Revd samuel Ajayi Crowther ŵăš one of d sold salves during d slave era.He was one of d human cargoes in å ship heading for the new world that was intercepted by the British Naval Squadron on d high sea and had its "cargoes" discharged in Freetown.It ŵăš in Freetown dat he was educated and ordained å priest by d Church Missionary Society (CMS) He eventually found his way to Nigeria where he contributed to immensely to d educational and missionary activities in Nigeria.
The CMS mission was led by Ajayi Crowther and Revd Townsend.They first started their missionary work in Abeokuta.At this time your grandfathers were still hunting lizards,rats,snails etc.
It was in 1858 that he moved to d eastern part of Nigeria and settled at Onitsha where he built å school for girls(this was d first FORMAL SCHOOL IN IGBOLAND).He built d school for girls because your grandfathers were not ready to learn(bush mentality was at its peak)
According to him (Ajayi Crowther) "the boys like to move about in plantations with bows and bamboos pointed arrows in their hands to hunt for birds,rats and lizards all day long without success,but now and then.half å dozen or more would rush into d school and proudly gaze at d alphabet board with an air of disdain mimic d names of d letters as pronounced by d school masters and repeated by d girls ,as if it were å thing only fit for females and too much confining to them as free rousers of d field"
POINTs
(1)It was å yoruba man that introduced formal education to Igboland
(2)The females were d first to be educated in igboland (eastern part of nigeria) and this education was by d CMS mission brought by Revd Ajayi Crowther and Revd Townsend.
This trend is still prevalent today as most male igbos don't like formal education,instead they go into business.Having said this,I would not be taken aback if u sell pirated Cds at Alaba or sell Okrika at Super and maybe u sell spare parts at Ladipo all in lagos.

All this igbos who say they are d lost tribe of israel(Never go to israel and claim this because,u will not live to tell d story)
The most shameless group of people along d niger.
Your obi's',eze's' and red-capped chiefs of today are å progeny of d warrant chiefs appointed during d British colonial era.You guys don't seem to find your bearing especially when it relates to history.
If not for d british,igbos will still be in d bush hunting lizards,rats and snails while other groups like d Edos,Hausas,Yorubas would have become your colonial masters(which if critically examined,is happening today in Nigeria government)
When last did an igbo man dream of power in dis country?
Remember d nigerian civil war?How u guys almost got wiped off d face of mother earth?
Remember how u guys resulted to cannibalism to feed?
Now u will come here and blab about igbo being rubbish.

Igbos are the most confused set of people in d niger area.They want to claim everything on their path.They have forgotten dat language alone cannot be used to identify d true root of å group of people.

Odenigbo Aroli: So,are you saying ajayi crowther introduced education to us? I want to be sure of the point you are trying to make before I swing into hardcore facts! You see,I addressed every point you made here,exhaustivelly but you havent replied the question I threw at you.

Well most of d so-called point u made up there were just from your opinion e.g the cultural aspect.So I decided not to respond to them because I term those points "gibberish"

Now going back to what I analysed earlier,
Talking about Å.Crowther bringing education to igboland,I gave u d date,his mission,what happened when he came and his own account of what happened back then.So pls counter this argument with facts and not lip-service

(2)The second point was about d titles depicting royalty in igboland.
I want one of u to give me an example of å notable "Obi", "eze" in pre-colonial times.
This is Because there were Obas,Emirs/sultans before the europeans came,so it was not d British dat appoointed them.
But for the igbos,most of d red-capped chiefs,Obis and other title hoders they have today were the ones appointed as warrant chiefs.Most of them were betrayers of their various groups.They sold their people to d whiteman who in turn appointed them as leaders.The Obis we have today in various parts of igboland are progeny of those appointed by d British.
PLEASE counter this argument with facts and not lip-service.

Abagworo: Most things in this world do not originate at the same time but are acquired and molded into our different versions. Even the Yorubas were never known as Yoruba. There was no Igbo nation and no particular trait that characterized it as you seem to believe. Agbor and Owa saw themselves differently and so did Aboh and Onitsha. The groups which were later regarded as Igbos mainly because of similarity in language comprised of people who had influence from different cultures and behaved differently. However the colonial years saw the molding process of various Nigerian groups for the purpose of political relevance and Ika your ethnic group was very elastic because of the inter-mingling of different cultures but while some leaders felt embracing the Igbo identity would make them relevant, others felt it would drown the uniqueness of your culture hence the divide in some calling themselves Igbos and others rejecting it. It was same across various Igbo clans until the civil war finally shaped things up. The reality is that Igbo is still in the same process of ethnic formation up till this day because of our loose nature. I believe whole heartedly in the Igbo project but what some of my fellow Igbos have failed to notice is that we have not formed yet. An Ngwa man can get up one day just like Ikwerre and decide not to be part of the Igbo and cite enough reasons why he is unique and differs greatly from others. Same applies to Abiriba, Ndoki, Owerri or Onitsha. It is same with Ika. If you go through this thread you will notice some bonafide Ika who believe in being Igbo and still cite their own reasons.

It is only d igbo group that has this unique feature of fragmentation and segmentation which in part in part added to why they their history seems to be very shallow.
Observing this,one should know that d term "igbo" refers to å group of people tied with d string of similarity in Language only because no other thing can be used to represent d majority of d igbo group esp in pre-historic times but this was not the case as seen in other groups like d Yorubas,Hausas,Edos,etc because there were obvious traits in this groups in pre-colonial times that distinguished them from other people.infact they established great empires that where known even abroad.
It was only d igbo groups(emphasis) that did not have this trait.
It is this same similarity in Language that d igbos want to use in dragging IKA into d igbo nation which IKA strongly resists.This is because the Ika as å group in pre-colonial times were more of an EDO origin than igbo.This can be seen in every aspect of her culture e.g language,names,festival,style of government etc.

Abagworo: Be careful the way you thread. That "you" is it in reference to the entire Igbo nation or a particular section? Igbo is too diverse to be generalized. Obi, Igwe and Eze were Igbo words for royalty and divinity from pre-history. The problem that less exposed people have is that they sit down in their enclave and live in a world of their own. Try to be friendly and take a journey to Afikpo and listen to them speak, then you will be amazed. This is nothing to throw insults for..

Like other groups in nigeria,d igbo group is diverse.But my post above refers to å larger percent of d igbo nation as it was known then( not now).The igbo nation as it was in pre-colonial times was composed of å group of acephalous,segmentary and fragmentary people.There were no centralised government known.There were no professional historians as there were in Benin and Oyo.Equivalent of Oba,Alafin and Emir were missing in MOST part of igboland

Abagworo: Be careful the way you thread. That "you" is it in reference to the entire Igbo nation or a particular section? Igbo is too diverse to be generalized. Obi, Igwe and Eze were Igbo words for royalty and divinity from pre-history. The problem that less exposed people have is that they sit down in their enclave and live in a world of their own. Try to be friendly and take a journey to Afikpo and listen to them speak, then you will be amazed. This is nothing to throw insults for.

I do not have any issues with ethnicity one chooses but do not ignorantly assume or lie to substantiate. After all the Ika, Igbo and whatever are nothing but a very recent identity taken by our immediate great grandparents. Ethnicity has more to do with "consciousness" than merely language and cultural practice.

Bros,titles are created to be bestowed on people
If Obi,Eze,Igwe where words used to depict royalty from prehistory as u claim:Then I would like u to give me some specific and notable examples of places in igboland where it was used and the name of d king in these Pre-historic times.