₦airaland Forum

qstar: I've been withholding mine since. All through my Christianity era, i never tithed.
Still wondering why god didn't strike me down.

Good for you, tithing is a scam

If juju was really portent enough to affect the world around us, our ancestors would have colonised the world, the disgraceful and dehumanising trade of slavery woud not have been part of our history.
Juju does not work, whether here at home or abroad. The babalawo/pastor/ alfa is only interested in the fees he can extract from you for being stupid enought to believe he has otherwordly powers.

thorpido: They were.The bible did not record every event they took part in the focus was more on spreading the Gospel.The story of Ananias and Sapphira gives us an idea that Simon Peter played the role of a priest.

Rev 5:10 says 'And He has made us unto our God Kings and priests,and we shall reign on the earth'.

But it wasn't tithe that Ananias and Sapphira witheld and revelation was talking about pastors.

Tannie: Tithes is not for Charity, church is the appropriate place to give your tithe. Don't forget that Levites were priest in the temple of God, therefore, pastors, priest , rev etc are the Levites of today.

But none of the first century christians were priest. Can you show me from the bible where any of the apostles collected tithe?
Like I said before, only levites can collect tite, and you can only be a levite by birth.

thorpido: CHURCH
You can choose to give money to charity but what you give to charity is not your tithe.
Some don't believe in tithing and don't pay it.It depends on the individual understanding of Scriptures.

What you give to church is not tithe either because only a levite can receive of which your pastor is not.

striktlymi: Secular countries do not make Religion a must in public schools. Turkey does this. Though they may say they are secular state but the truth is that Turkey is an Islamic state. One of the reasons they were having a had time joining the EU.

But Turkey is officially a secular State, however if your argument is that they are not one hundred percent compliant with your ideal definition of a secular state, I would grant you that. Name any State that is governed by sharia, and I will also name that State as an example of a State without the basic protection for human rights and rights of minorities.

striktlymi: Why can't it protect their rights? A country like Turkey should be an example of a country that is trying to harmonize democracy and Religion without hindering the inalienable rights of the minority.

Turkey has been a secularized country since 1924 guaranteeing freedom of religion to all within its border. Though of recent many muslims have been calling for the reintroduction of sharia law which minorities claim will restrict their rights.

striktlymi: The choice may be wrong but that's is the beauty of democracy. Allowing the people air their opinion, such that the choice of the majority prevails at the end of the day. It would be nothing short of dictatorship if a people are forced to make a choice they don't want.

You or I may not like it but that really is immaterial because it is about the majority with very reasonable respect for the freedom of the minority. Democracy is democracy irrespective of whether Religion and State are separated or not.

A true democracy does not give room for the strong to prey upon the weak, unreasonably. The right to life, right to reasonable association and the many other rights that are not subject to any constitution or system of Government must be upheld in a democracy.

My point is that a democracy that is subject the the religious laws of the majority cannot protect the rights of the minority. To be able to protect the rights of minorities, religion and State has to be two separate entities.

striktlymi: I believe firmly that there should be a clear delineation between Religion and State but despite this belief I don't subscribe to a situation where the West dictates this for everyone because that in itself is the very antithesis of democracy.

The majority of people in a Country should determine for themselves whether they want this separation between Religion and State such that, irrespective of the decision they make, the inalienable rights of the minority are protected.

The choice of allowing the majority of people in a country to determine for themselves whether or not they want a separation between Religion and State such that that can offer a measure of protections to the rights of the minority is a false choice because, a democracy that is subject to religious laws like the Sharia can never be able to protect the rights of the minority, so unless the people chose to separate religion from state, you will be restricted from practicing your religion openly should you be in the minority.

Those of you applauding this contraption should think objectively for a moment and ask yourself the following question in order to determine if this guy is either a fraud or an idiiot.
Why hasn't he shown a video of the car in motion?
Why is there a total lack of specification of the car such as the output of the solar panel and wind turbine, the electric motor and the top speed obtained?
Why did he not provide a log of the number of kilometers covered by his car?
If you have asked yourself these questions and still believe that there is something to this contraption, then I can assure you that I have a bridge to sell you in Lagos.

The religion of peace does not believe in freedom of choice.

Spewing toxic lies that can cause the death of anyone with HIV gullible enough to believe it. It will not end well for you.

Thanks for your input, but contrary to you think a lot of us have have carefully considered that possibility and rejected it.

tpia1: The question was asked by a poster on another thread.


He wondered why unbelievers are more prosperous than believers.

Will search for the link

What is your opinion the poster's question, do you think that the bible teaches that christians are supposed to be wealthier than non christians?

winner01: you are helpless mate, I help people even more than you do, I doubt if u do except to mock on nairaland,....and I also keep paying tithes and last time I checked, I don't pay your money....my hope for you is that you don't head into destruction.

Is this your best defence? I will not be drawn into a boastful match of who has more money or help others more than the other. suffice it to say that I am self sufficient in my needs, and even if I wasn't, tithing would only make things worse.

winner01: You should really think about who is in a religious bondage here ,kiddo.

Your willful blindness to the overwhelming evidence given on this thread against the payment of tithe by christians from the bible suggests to me that you are a tithe recipient. I find it hard to understand how vultures like you could say with a straight face that people should show their love for God whom they have not seen by tithing while they pass their fellow neighbour or family member with real needs without lifting a finger.
So stop kidding us that your support for tithing is in obedience to God's word when we all know that you fight to propagate this falsehood in order to protect your filthy source of income. You are a modern day pharisee. Stop being a parasite and get a real job.

penmate101: Your point being.....?

The wealth promised to believers in the bible has nothing to do with silver and gold, if it did, Peter would not have told the lame beggar that he did not have silver and gold to give to him. The modern day pentecostal teaching that promise believers devine material wealth is very false, it is unsupported by the bible. Even Jesus said that the poor will always be with us, he never said that the road leading to salvation is paved with gold.

penmate101: I do not believe religion condems one to a life of poverty. If it does, how will you follow the Gods commandment to help and provide for the needy. A lazy man is a lazy man, religion or not. There are wealthy atheists who live morally upright lives, far better than most religious icons like pastors priests imams etc.
Religion is no excuse for poverty and laziness. Pastors are not poor. Why should you be?

Christianity does not condemn one to a life of poverty, neither does it teach that being a christian would open doors to material prosperity as it is being taught by modern day pentecostal churches.

When the issue of tax payment was brought up to Jesus, he asked them; whose face is on this coin? And their answer was; it is caesar's. Then Jesus told them that they should give to ceasar what belongs to caesar, and to God what belongs to God. The thing you should realise from this answer is that Jesus' kingdom is not of this world, so while he was in the world he was in subjection to the authorities of the world.
Now, as far as I know, God doesn't print money, so being a christian should not count as an advantage in getting money compared to non christians. For example, if you have two farmers with one of them a christian and the other a non christian, if the land they plant upon are of the same size and equally fertile, with the same amount of rainfall, what do you think would determine the size of their harvest?
If the christian farmer spends all his time asking for divine favour to have bountiful harvest and the non christian farmer used his time to learn about irrigation, and how to use fertilizers to boost his crop yield. Who do you think will make it to the market with extra baskets of farm produce of the two farmers?

Azboy34: Where are d Christians on NL? u nah never hear am? A student of Redeemer University Killed z 60 year father. He went 2 an extent of slaughtern z father lyk a Cow. U never commented on dat issue. had it been it was a Muslim hmmm...

The student did not do it in the name of his religion, that is what makes his crime different from boko haram's that bless every atrocities they commit in the name of Allah and his messenger Muhammad.

alexleo: Sins were forgiven in the old testament when those animals were sacrificed as instructed by God. The bottom line is that God forgave them. I'm not comparing the blood of animal with the blood of Jesus.

Can you compare your statement to what is written in Heb 10:1-4 10 "The law is only a shadow of the good things that are coming—not the realities themselves. For this reason it can never, by the same sacrifices repeated endlessly year after year, make perfect those who draw near to worship. Otherwise, would they not have stopped being offered? For the worshipers would have been cleansed once for all, and would no longer have felt guilty for their sins. But those sacrifices are an annual reminder of sins. It is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins."

alexleo: I know that the highest sacrifice for sin remains that of Jesus. But at least God still acknowledged the other provision he made in the old testament. You can also make contributions on the other issues raised here. I like learning.

Those other provisions were just tokens, and as you read in the bible, sin could never be forgiven on the basis of animal blood. The reason it is important that we get all this little details ironed out is because I do not agree with some of the things you said, but for my own explaination to make sense to you, we must first tackle these seemingly tangential issues.

alexleo: Atonement were made for sin with the sacrifice of animal in the old testament. Am i wrong?

You are right in the sense that sin offerings were made using animal blood in the old testament, but it was only a token, not the actual price for the sins of those men. Sin was never actually forgiven on the basis of animal sacrifice. Read Heb 10:1-4, it is self explanatory. If you can, read up to verse 13'

This is no doubt a tragedy for the family and a great cause for sadness to all their friends. My heart feels a deep sorrow on account of this senseless death and I pray that God should give them the strength to persevere through this crisis.
My one question which I would like some serious answer to is this: Should the protection money (in the form of tithe) along with partnership fees and offerings which the father has been paying to Daddy G.O Adeboye be returned to the family with interest given that the G.O was unable to stop the tragedy from happening or even foresee it?
I can still remember all the sweet things that Daddy G.O said will happen to his church members this year, and the assurances he also gave that no tragedy shall befall their household, but in this case I am very doubtful that the Ajayi family will agree with him.

alexleo: But before Jesus came people's sins were forgiven in the old testament.

Have you read in the bible where Jesus said that he is the way, the truth, and the life, and no one comes to the Father except through him. -John 14:6
Compare the above scripture with Romans 5:12-18 with particular attention to verses 12,18 and 19. What is your take on it with regards to your statement that people's sins were forgiven in the old testament?

It is not just Islam that is dying, it is all religion that is being affected. And I see the religious intensity of southern Nigeria christians slowly waning as the competition among pastors for capturing new souls and retaining old ones continue to heat up just as the people are gradually wising up to the fact that their pastors are only interested in all the fleece they can get from the sheep along with some skin from the very unlucky ones that are too docile to resist or to stupid to even know that some skin is being harvested from their body along with their precious fleece that is supposed to keep them warm in the coming winter.

alexleo: Your points are good. Now my question is-
If angels have free will, why didnt God make provision for forgiveness or salvation for them as he made for man who is also a free moral agent? And the scripture said that our redemption plan was made from the foundation of the world(which means at the very beginning). This could mean that God knew that man being a free moral agent could choose to sin therefore he made a way of salvation for us. But he never made such for angels, which could also mean that angels were not meant to choose like man. Or could it be that lucifer took God unawares?

Nowhere did the bible indicate that Adam and Eve were given the provision for forgiveness or salvation, God passed a judgement of death to them. Just as Adam died, every child belonging to him was also condemned to die until Jesus used his life as a ransom sacrifice to adopt us as his children to give us life when he prevailed over death. Satan along with the unfaithful angels angels will soon meet their death in the lake of fire. It is important to note that from the moment we begin to exercise faith in Jesus christ, we are no longer part of the Adamic family that is doomed to death, our father becomes Jesus in whom there is life in abundance.

The reason why we are able to ask for forgiveness is because of our imperfection, it makes us susceptible to sin. Think of it this way, if you are seriously overweight and doctors tell you that you really need to reduce your weight or you will die. But despite your gallant effort you could not stop yourself from eating the junk food that is making you fat, not because you did not believe what your doctor said about being seriously overweight, but because you found it virtually impossible to fight your overwhelming craving for junk food. Compare it to another person that doesn't have this kind of craving for junk food but decides to be gorging himself with junk food in an attempt to prove to the doctor that it cannot do harm to his body. That is how it is with perfect people when they sin, it is totally willful. Adam could have resisted the devil had he wanted to but he chose to embrace the devil instead. Whereas an imperfect man is constantly trying to do what is right but keeps finding himself doing wrong from time to time.
It is as a result of the weakness, brought about by our imperfection that God made the provision for us to be forgiven and saved, it has nothing to do with free will.

ebenice: You see what i did? I made it so clear that you wunt ask me the silly question of where, when or how it happend, hence i was so specific, but no matter how u make maths simple, people wey go fail go stil fail. U saw me wrote the venue and period it happend i made it so clear and obvious so u can verify 4 urself and cum bak to tel me it didnt hapen or it did. Instead u chose the usual NL athiestic aproach.. But anyways i was there it wasnt dem say dem say it hapend beside me live. It regrew bro. God stil does miracle

You are yet to support your claim with any evidence to give it credibility. Chachanga Mina is a vague location, and 94' is a vague date. If you really want your story to be verified, you should provide us with the full name of the person that received the miracle to enable us search for the person online and most importantly a photo or video evidence of the crusade because I could not find any such video or story in the Deeper Life website.
You made the claim so it is up to you to prove that it is not a lie.

ebenice: Mr man, i've seen an amputee leg re.grow at a deeper life crusade in chanchaga minna niger state in '94 during pastor kumuyi prayer session.. God is not limited. God stil does wonders may be u are not exposed to a true bible base miracle church service, but hey! I'm a living witness of solid awesome miracles, i've seen aids get cured, breast cancer got healed, mental ilness made whole, bed riden sicken people rise to full heathy Life by The Power in the name of JESUS. No jokes Gods is watching me if am lying, its the truth . Miracles are real. U need to experience one to know. Stp doubting God

Why must you tell lies? Don't you know that it makes you a child of the devil in doing so? It would have been better to just say that you were at a crusade where it was claimed that an amputee was healed. But to have said that you saw the leg grow, is a blatant lie.

The bible did not say much about heaven and its spirit inhabitant but it made us aware that satan was created perfect and later became disobedient. That to me is an indication of choice, would you not agree?
It is late now, I will reply the rest of your post tomorrow.

@ alexleo, If angels do not have free will how did the once perfect and obedient angel chose to rebel against God, along with the myriads of other angels that sided with him? I think that it is the gift of free will that qualifies us and the angels as sons of God and separates us from lower animals that are incapable of choosing whether or not to follow the will of God as Jesus did when he was on earth.
The beauty of free will is that it creates a matrix of choices that is infinitely long and infinitely wide leading to infinite possibilities. You should look at it from the point of view that for every possible action that we might chose to take, God already have a solution such that his ultimate purpose in creating us will not be derailed and His judgement is just one of his solution to some of our choices.
Satan in rebelling against God was not trying to fulfilling God's purpose, he was trying to thwart it, but because God already have a solution in line with his ultimate purpose, no matter the choice we make, it will always branch back to God's purpose.