₦airaland Forum

gohf:
Repent from misleading others into error

You can point out the misleading/error in my post.

Heb.1.2 but in these last days HE(GOD) has spoken to us by his Son, whom HE appointed heir of all things, and THROUGH whom HE(GOD) made the universe. (NIV)

So, was the Son not there BEFORE UNIVERSE was created according to this verse?

Jesus said remove the log from your own eyes first

Which log?

gohf:
what was the word of God doing? The word of God was being used by God to create just as stated in the Bible.

Good!

Which means The Word of God is also ETERNAL as God Himself.

So is the Word of God CREATED?

gohf:
lol so if to you misquoting rev3:14 Jesus is the source of all creation what then is Father God?

I misquote Rev 3:14 ke

The Father, Son and Holy Spirit are the Source of Creation.

Rev.3.14 "To the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God's creation.

The point here is that Rev 3:14 doesn't mean Jesus was the FIRST CREATED BEING. As the translation you provided put it. Jesus is the RULER of God's creation which reinforced my point.

I know you won't answer just like you avoided the question if firstborn means ruler then is God also a firstborn

No word used in the Bible has its origin from me.

The word translated as FIRSTBORN in Col 1:15 has its meaning you can check it and provide where the word means FIRST CREATED.

That's simple.

Janosky:
Matthew 24:36, we know the mind of Christ

Christ doesn't know the mind of God.

But Holy Spirit knows the MIND OF JEHOVAH.

True or False?

Christ received that holy spirit.
You that received the same holy spirit that knows the mind of God.

What is he saying here....just disjointed words

The HOLY SPIRIT knows the MIND OF JEHOVAH.

That's the point.

Oga,do you know the mind of God?

No!

Does Holy Spirit know the MIND OF JEHOVAH?

Yes/No

Oga, go & study your Bible @Genesis 22;16 & Hebrew 6:13.

If I didn't study my Bible I won't be able to destroy your lies.

Do you study your own Bible?

Pls stop deceiving yourself.

Who is deceiving you?

Janosky:
No sir.
Jesus is archangel Michael, Martin Luther your reformist mentor knew that.
Jesus is the angel of the LORD Yahweh.

Jesus the Creator of ALL THINGS

Show me one single verse where Michael created anything.

That means Martin Luther has the truth.

Wonderful.

Jesus is the Arkhe (Greek746 & Greek 1078) "Beginning ,Origin of the creation by God.

Greek 747 Originator is NOT @ Revelation 3:14,Jesus is NOT originator...

Just see how you shot yourself in the leg.
As you can't refute the meaning of the word Arché being ORIGIN you have to find a way to lie to yourself.

ORIGINATOR is from the word ORIGIN.

So, Rev 3:14 proves Jesus is The ORIGIN/SOURCE OF ALL CREATIONS.

Revelation 3:14 is NOT Acts 5:31,Hebrew 2:10.
Screenshot evidence.

Keep jumping from verse to another.

Rev 3:14, Heb 1:2 & John 1:3 all point to Jesus as the CREATOR of ALL THINGS including Michael your god.

Emusan, stop deceiving yourself.

Who is deceiving you?

Janosky:
Oga,Is holy spirit Jesus?
No.

At least you answered the question by yourself.

You don't understand Corinthians 2:11 until you study 1 Corinthians 2:12.

This is 1 Corin 2:12 "And we have received God’s Spirit (not the world’s spirit), so we can know the wonderful things God has freely given us."

So, tell me how this negate that The HOLY SPIRIT doesn't KNOW the Mind of God.

What did Jesus teach you at Matthew 24:26?
Jesus said:
"No one (Greek lexicon 3762,Oudeis meaning nothing,no person) knows the day nor the hour but only (Greek 3441 monos,meaning single, solitary) the Father knows.
You pretend as if you know spiritual matters more than Jesus.

So the Bible is wrong in 1 Corin 2:11 or it doesn't align with your doctrine?

@ Hebrew 6:13, did Jesus & holy spirit swear alongside God Almighty Yahweh ?
No.

Where did Yahweh appear in that Hen 6;13?

Oga, stop deceiving yourself.

Then who is deceiving you?

Janosky:
1 Corinthians 2:16

"For who has known the mind of THE LORD JEHOVAH that he may teach him? But we do have the mind of (Christ) The Messiah".


Oga, stop deceiving yourself.

But Holy Spirit knows the MIND of The Lord Jehovah.

That is a proof that The HOLY SPIRIT is a person and fully God. 1 Corin 2:11

Janosky:
Arkhe @ Genesis 1:1 @ Job 40:19, @ Revelation 3;14, @Mark 13:19, @Mark 10:6.@ Mark 1:1.,Greek 746 Arkhe is Beginning NOT Originator.

Those who don't love the Bible truth espoused in the biblehub screenshot of the Greek word for word translation of Revelation 3:14.

Oga,stop deceiving yourself.

You haven't proved that Arché isn't ORIGIN

Very funny reason why you couldn't provide the same screenshot from Biblehub

Well let me help you.

So, Rev 3:14 Jesus is the ORIGIN/SOURCE of all CREATIONS.

Jesus created Micheal your god

Janosky:
John 1:3. NLT,Trinitarian translation.
"God CREATED EVERYTHING through him (Jesus)."

Hebrew 1:2,
" God CREATED the universe NOT his son Jesus"

The Greek word DIA (THROUGH) meaning Instrumentality.

"THROUGH" is the word you are giving a very wrong meaning to deceive yourself.
Emusan stop deceiving yourself.

Which means Jesus was there and played critical role when UNIVERSE was being created.

Jesus is the Creator then.

Courz:
Thank you jare. The guy blocked me before. I don't understand his presence in this thread. Goes to show he can never keep to his words to avoid me.

It's already proven that he can't keep to his word. I think he knows the damage such a thread like can cause to the organization, so he is afraid and the need for him coming here to divert attention is necessary.

Janosky:
"God created the universe NOT his son,Paul said.
Oga, continue to pretend you don't understand that statement.
Stop deceiving yourself.

And you're still dodging the question.

What was the Son doing when God is creating the Universe?

Jesus is the Creator because "All things came into existence through him(Jesus), and apart from him not even one thing came into existence." - John 1:3 NWT

Even NWT perverted translation couldn't touch this verse because the statement is too glaring to temper with.

Jesus is your Creator

Believer wey pretend as if Hebrew 1:2 is not in his Bible.

I've said, Heb 1:2 is also a confirmation that Jesus is the Creator I never denied it.

because Heb 1:2 says the UNIVERSE came into existence THROUGH JESUS.

"He is the beginning of God's creation, Job 40:19 & Revelation 3:14.
The same statement,the same context.
Same meaning-Job 40:19 & Revelation 3:14 refers to Creatures . Jesus is a creature

Still couldn't refute the meaning of Arché with any screenshot

This shows that you're just lying.

Jesus is the ORIGIN/SOURCE of all CREATIONS.

Supported by Heb 1:2 & John 1:3

Trinity doctrine is man made invention.

Proof that Arché doesn't mean ORIGIN first, nobody asked you to jump like kangaroo

if you get mind put Originator at Job 40:19.
KJV ,INT,NAS,your Trinitarian Bible translations didn't put "Source" @ Revelation 3:14.

Olodo Job was written in different language and where did Job talks about ORIGIN?

Many translator put Rev 3:14 this way:

CSB: “Write to the angel of the church in Laodicea: Thus says the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the originator of God’s creation

CEB: “Write this to the angel of the church in Laodicea: These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God’s creation.

CJB: “To the angel of the Messianic Community in Laodicea, write: ‘Here is the message from the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the Ruler of God’s creation:

CEV: This is what you must write to the angel of the church in Laodicea: I am the one called Amen! I am the faithful and true witness and the source of God's creation. Listen to what I say.

GW: “To the messenger of the church in Laodicea, write: The amen, the witness who is faithful and true, the source of God’s creation, says:

GNT: “To the angel of the church in Laodicea write: “This is the message from the Amen, the faithful and true witness, who is the origin of all that God has created.

Do you need more Trinitarians translations?

Courz:
There is another Talk by Joseph Rutherford and the Venue of this talk was placed on a Banner to advertise to the public. The Venue was still a Masonic Lodge. I found it on a video sometime ago. I will try to find it and post it here.

Keep the fire burning.

That fake elder didn't block you?

His post above shows your thread is hitting the right place.

kingthreat:
The founder of the movement was known to be a freemason. That I have known for a long time.
But so far I have nothing against the JWs, neither do I see it as a cult. They are just a set of christians with different understandings of the doctrines of Christianity. To be part of God's kingdom, you have to believe that Jesus is the son of God and this they believe so I let them be.

When you say different understanding, we can further ask some serious questions.

1. Where does this DIFFERENT understanding originated from?

2. For which purpose does this DIFFERENT understanding come?

If you read the history of Watchtower, you'll understand those questions.

Despite the claim from their founding founder till present day leaders that they have been under Jehovah, Jesus & God's Holy Spirit direction.

Yet there have back and forth teachings from inception.

Is that how God works?

Definitely Not.

Janosky:
Is Greek word for SOURCE @ Revelation 3:14?
Definitely not.

But the meaning of Arché which your own translation translates as BEGINNING also means ORIGIN.

Thanks be to God you haven't refute that.

@ Mark 10:6 "the beginning of creation" ,according to Emusan meaning 'the Source of creation?'
Definitely not.
@ Mark 13:19,"the beginning of creation" ,according to Emusan meaning 'the Source of creation?'
Definitely not.
@ Mark 1:1,
@Mark 1:1, "the beginning of the gospel" ,according to Emusan meaning 'the Source/ruler/authority of the gospel?'
Definitely not.

Olodo...if every words are used like that, just imagine how chaotic the Bible will be.

@ Revelation 3:14,"the beginning of creation" ,according to Emusan meaning 'the Source/ruler/authority of creation?'
Definitely not.


Emusan, stop deceiving yourself

Can you imagine that.

Not according to me rather according to the same Bible concordance you always screenshot and the reason why you can't be so bold to provide the Interlinear verses screenshot of Rev 3:14.

The word translated as THE BEGINNING is Arché

Does it also mean ORIGIN/AUTHORITY?

Capital YES!

Refute this first with concrete evidence.

Janosky:
Did Paul say that?

Yes! Paul said that.

Definitely not.
Hebrew 1:2, Paul wrote:
"God created the Universe" NOT his son.

So answer my question, what did the Son do when God was creating the Universe?

Why are you dodging this question since?

Oga, go write your own Bible.
Stop deceiving yourself .

You have your own Bible through Watchtower

Jesus used this expression:
" the beginning of Creation" @ Mark 10:6,@ Mark 13:19 ,@ Revelation 3:14 to prove his Father Yahweh is the Creator/the Source @ Mark 10:6,@Mark 13:19 ,@ Revelation 3:14.

That's why I showed you the meaning of arché

ORIGIN/SOURCE

Jesus is the ORIGIN/SOURCE of ALL CREATION.

Meaning He is the Creator. John 1:3

Therefore, Jesus is the beginning of Creation.

SOURCES/ORIGIN of Creation

(just as Paul proved God created the Universe).

So what was the son doing when God was creating the Universe?

Oga, you have more knowledge than Jesus the beginning of the creation by God?
Definitely not.

Jesus Himself is the Wisdom of God.

Which your gods can never attain.

Answer my question if you get mind

achorladey:
Jesus Christ stated in Matthew 12: 37.....The words you say will either acquit you or condemn you.”

Does the words of Watchtower acquits or condemn the establishment regarding the 1975 saga of the world coming to an end? Read what follows as explanation given over the doctrines related to 1975 and the massive disappointment and exit of members in the year that follows.....



Two points:

1. Alright God's word do not fail or deceive

2. The Governing Body teach their followers wrong premises and make their followers understand, believe and trust the Bible on wrong premises called spiritual food at the right time that fails, leads to disappointment and definitely meant to deceive to keep people captives of the religious organization.

This is not how God works throughout the history but people who'll allow themselves to be deceived will still be on earth.

On one thread about the failed rapture that was predicted last week, their online elder said and I quote "Hope no one will call this one Jehovah Witness"

Which means he knows only Jws capable of making false predictions yet still blindly praising them.

Janosky:

Hebrew 1:2 "God created the Universe"...
Meaning God Created the Universe NOT his Son.

Emusan stop deceiving yourself.
You can't CHANGE Hebrew 1:2.
Oga,go and write your own Bible.

You can't answer the simple question e get why

So, what did the Son do?

At least you agree that the Son was there when the UNIVERSE being created.

And if the Son was there when the UNIVERSE was created, can the Son be also be part of the Universe?

Let John 1:3 knock sense into that empty skull again.

Janosky:

@ John 1:1 ,@ Revelation 3:14,@ Mark 10:6, @ Mark 13:19,@Genesis 1:1, @ Genesis 49:3, "Arkhe" (Greek lexicon 746) "the Beginning" does NOT mean 'source'.
Biblehub screenshots evidences,
Examine the same Greek rendition of Mark 10:6,Mark 13:19,Revelation 3:14.

Emusan ,stop deceiving yourself.

The Greek word "Pege" (Greek lexicon 4077) & another Greek word "kephale" (Greek lexicon 2776) meaning "SOURCE" is NOT in any Greek manuscript of Revelation 3:14.
John the apostle says Jesus "is the beginning of the creation by God."

Emusan stop deceiving yourself.

No wonder you can't provide the screenshot of the Rev 3:14 Interlinear verses

Arché is the word translated and see the meaning below.

arché: Beginning, origin, ruler, authority, principality

Since Heb 1:2 already proved Jesus is not part of the UNIVERSE then it means the beginning (even when used) shouldn't be understood as part of Creation but the right rendition is ORIGIN, RULER OR AUTHORITY.

come with another lie.

Janosky:
God is your throne meaning your throne is given by God.

"God is your Strength" meaning your strength is given by God. (this popular expression we use almost everyday)..

Emusan stop deceiving yourself.

Still lying and defending NWT deception.

Janosky:

ALL firstborn in your bible are Creatures.
Firsborn of every creature means the first in the sense of being born or created.
Emusan , please use your Bible provide evidence ,which verse is Yahweh the God Almighty called firstborn?

Emusan stop deceiving yourself.

He can't provide just single screenshot

That is the evidence that you're lying.

Toredola:
This is a good trend for couples...it will help stabilise marriages

So it's intimacy that will help to stabilize marriage and not the understanding of marriage by both couples.

That's strange

Janosky:

Emusan ,stop deceiving yourself.
God is your throne means "your throne is given by God."

'God is your crown' is in your Bible too.

Can you imagine this broad day lie.

Just because NWT already gooff you want to change the narration.

Ko le work...

I won't change Hebrew 1:2
"God created the Universe through His son..." , Hebrew 1:2.

Good! Which means His Son is the Creator.

Or what will you call His Son?

Oga,go & REMOVE Hebrew 1:2
OR
continue WAILING & deceiving yourself.

I've told you several times that I don't have the evil mind to edit God's word like Watchtower did to support their doctrine.

In fact, Heb 1:2 is one of the Bible verses that proved Jesus to be the Creator because Jesus was before THE UNIVERSE. So, all creatures fall within the creation of the universe.

Janosky:
Because Jesus said @Revelation 3:14 , Jesus is "the creation by God. "

No translation has that, lying liar.

Rev 3:14 Jesus is the SOURCE OF ALL CREATION.

If you get mind, provide the screenshot from your darling Biblehub and other sources as you always do

As Paul added that Jesus is the firstborn of every creature by God.

Oga,go & REMOVE am

Firstborn never equates FIRST CREATED

I challenge you to provide the screenshot as well

gohf:
Did Moses record that in the beginning God first created the heavens and the earth or did you read that the first thing God created was the heavens and the earth?

I know it's hard for you emusan to be honest but try and answer honestly please

So it's Moses that recorded that "In the BEGINNING God created the heavens and the earth" not that God inspired Moses to write that "In the BEGINNING God created the heavens and the Earth"

Genesis 1:1 is still very much alive in every version of the Bible and God who can't lie inspired Moses to write that, if anything was created before Heavens and the earth. God who can't would've inspired that.

Now turning the table around.

Are you saying God wasn't the one who inspired Moses to write that "In the BEGINNING God created the heavens and the earth"?

2mch:
Being a part of an association is not the same as a Union.

So what is the full meaning of PENGASSAN?

Dhury:
when drivers and okada riders is crying in the hands of pharaoh aka union leaders no body Care, now is get to company level, soon general public will feel the heat.union operate as a terrorists, they claim to be fighting members welfare but non of their members that is benefiting after several illegals heavy taxations . Union in Nigeria is a definitions of monkey dey work baboon de chop

Exactly! The double standard in this country is too alarming.

The question is, can someone open a big Hospital or law firm without dealing with NMA or NBA?

If this isn't possible, how then can Dangote operate his refinery without the body in charge of it?

Westman001:
So who pays between these entities you mentioned. Is it the association or the company. Who should have a say on the staff policy?

I guess you couldn't refute my post you have to come up with question.

Both pay.

because the company is there to make progress through the staff while the association is there to protect the staff welfarism and professionalism.

Should we be clamoring for the disbandment of all ASSOCIATION in the country just as some people are doing for PENGASSAN now?

FOLYKAZE:
This is becoming messy.

Dangote should tread carefully. These guys are ready to fight dirty than stay out of business.

We just need to grow out of this Aluta, scatter everywhere mentally, if things doesn't work out way. Government should please disband NUPENG and their sister union PENGASSAN. You cannot just force private business hands to do what and whatever in their business. If you want to dictate, start up your own refinery, then you can control your staff remotely how you want. This madness has to just stop

Yet you people will be claiming to be educated.

So, I can wake up one day open a big Hospital and started receiving patients without having my Hospital workers to be part of Medical Association of Nigeria (MAN) or a random person can just wake up and open a law firm without being part of NBA.

This double standard is what will continue to hurt the growth of this Nation.

gohf:
exactly as proverbs 8 puts it, he was the first of God's creation, first work brought forth by God

But God who can't lie says "In the BEGINNING, God created the heavens and the earth"

Why will God say this if Jesus was the FIRST TO BE CREATED?

Janosky:
Hebrew 1:8 was copied from Psalms 45:6.
Your quote of Hebrew 1:8 is not correct .

You can't alter the original Psalms 45:6 screenshot evidence.

Revelation 3:14, Jesus is the creation by God.

No wonder you always ashamed to quote your Translation

"God is your throne forever and ever;..."

Watchtower has altered the Original Psalms 45:6 and you still agreed with them.

Jesus still The Creator of Heaven and Earth if you like hit your head on the wall it won't change God's word.

MaxInDHouse:
Since nobody knows the name of your church it's OK i just hope no one comes to say this one is a JW!

Guilty conscience at play here because you know JWs are famous for such predictions and failed.

Don't forget to click the block button

DeepSight:
You know what you did. You deliberately twisted even the little you brought.

I twisted something you read in plain English.

Wahooooo

Here it is again but let me highlight some key part

Ps 2:7 “The Lord said to me, ‘You are my son. Today I have become your Father.'"

Heb 1:5 - For God never said to any angel what he said to Jesus: “You are my Son. Today I have become your Father.” God also said, “I will be his Father, and he will be my Son.”