₦airaland Forum

AntiChristian:
Same way you need the the HOLY SPIRIT (that was absent when the Bible was written) to interprete the Bible that was written independenly then later selected and approved by some trinitarians!

CreativeOrbit, you sabi waste your time o!

TenQ no be person you fit reason with on an intellectual level!

so are you equating the Holy Spirit mentioned in the bible to Tafsirs, Asbāb al-Nuzūl, Hadiths, and other islamic books?

JimRohn:
Your

2. Hubal = Allah? Absolute Nonsense.
Hubal was just one of 300+ idols placed around the Kaaba. Allah had no image, no idol, and no association with Hubal. Even pre-Islamic Arabs distinguished between Allah (the supreme creator) and lesser gods like Hubal. Qur’an 31:25 literally states: “They will surely say, ‘Allah created them.’” Hubal was a local idol—not a “visible form” of Allah. You clearly don't understand the religion you're trying to criticize.

are you now saying that the same idol worshippers who say that Hubal is the highest God and who say that Allah created them, are confused if it is said that Hubal and Allah are the same to them. Because frankly Allah means the god and it's not a name like how Hubal is.

JimRohn:
2. Qur’an 5:51 – “Awliyaa” means allies, protectors, patrons—not mere “friends” as you claim. Again, context: it was a time of political tension, not Sunday brunch. But you ignore scholarly consensus and linguistic depth because it suits your agenda to oversimplify.

3. Qur’an 1:6–7 – You're stretching now. That verse is a prayer, not a doctrine of exclusion. Interpreting "those who earned wrath" as all Jews and "those who are astray" as all Christians is your own projection, not a universally held or mandated interpretation.

Another response agreeing that Muslims are taught not to ally themselves with Jews and Christians even though they claim they serve the same God.

Jimrohn I would have believed it was tenqs own projection but a quick research on what they text means is stated to be that Muhammad taught that those whom God is angry with are the Jews and those went astray are the Christians.

The translation should have been sinners and those who do evil, it amazes me that majority of us didn't know that this is what Muslims pray early 5am in the morning loudly and five times a day. I am not even sure some Muslims are even aware of this.

But it makes us ask, why the consistent mention of Jews and Christians, was Islam created to fight them?

CreativeOrbit:
2. Qur’an 5:51 – The word “awliyaa” in Arabic has a range of meanings: allies, guardians, political protectors—not casual friendships. The context was the betrayal by some Jewish and Christian tribes during the Prophet’s time, not a ban on coexistence or friendship. Qur’an 60:8 literally states: “Allah does not forbid you from being kind and just toward those who have not fought you.” But of course, you left that out—because your argument falls apart when the full picture is presented.


Your final claim—that Muslims marginalize others—is sheer hypocrisy.
gohf AntiChristian TenQ

Creative I know I am cutting out from your words to tenq but it is mind-blowing what you have written here.

Putting this into the Nigerian context, a Muslim could rightly say they have the right to be unkind towards the igbos who fought them in the civil war.

I think I am beginning to understand why some igbos in the north are wary of the Muslims, such reaction isn't one you expect from those who are welcomed. I have not experienced such marginalization and I have had some "good" Muslim friends but don't you think it's wrong to call those who have or may have faced such hypocritical?

CreativeOrbit:
2. Qur’an 5:51 – The word “awliyaa” in Arabic has a range of meanings: allies, guardians, political protectors—not casual friendships. The context was the betrayal by some Jewish and Christian tribes during the Prophet’s time, not a ban on coexistence or friendship. Qur’an 60:8 literally states: “Allah does not forbid you from being kind and just toward those who have not fought you.” But of course, you left that out—because your argument falls apart when the full picture is presented.


Your final claim—that Muslims marginalize others—is sheer hypocrisy.
gohf AntiChristian TenQ

Creative I know I am cutting out from your words to tenq but it is mind-blowing what you have written here.

Putting this into the Nigerian context, a Muslim could rightly say they have the right to be unkind towards the igbos who fought them in the civil war.

I think I am beginning to understand why some igbos in the north are wary of the Muslims, such reaction isn't one you expect from those who are welcomed. I have not experienced such marginalization and I have had some "good" Muslim friends but don't you think it's wrong to call those who have or may have faced such hypocritical?

TheJustPath:
On Qur’an 5:51
You mistranslate “awliyaa” as simply “friends” to support your narrative. That’s dishonest. The term refers to political allegiance and protection—particularly during wartime treachery. If you actually cared about the Qur’an in its totality, you’d cite Qur’an 60:8:
"Allah does not forbid you from being kind and just to those who have not fought you or driven you from your homes."
But that verse doesn’t serve your agenda, so of course you skip it.

so not only creativeorbit but another one shares the teaching to be not about "friends" but about politics.

Where do you find ourselves as Nigerians when a major religious group teaches themselves to not support non-muslims or Jew or christians in politics.

Now thejustpath, not sure quoting Quran 60:8 supports a peaceful Muslim or why you quoted it, because in the case where it can also be interpreted as giving them the right to be wicked to anyone who offends them, it supports a self justified radical group that believes they have been fought or stolen from.

CreativeOrbit:
2. Hubal and Allah Are Not the Same

The claim that Hubal is another name for Allah is historically inaccurate. Hubal was a pagan idol placed in the Kaaba by the Quraysh. In contrast, "Allah" was known before Islam as the name of the supreme Creator God—even among pagan Arabs.


gohf AntiChristian TenQ honesttalk21

Allah means the God, so you are saying that the God was the name of the supreme creator God?

Now I want you to read something;
In pre-Islamic Arabia, the Kaaba housed a statue of Hubal, a deity revered by the Quraysh tribe. Hubal was a prominent god, with his idol placed inside the Kaaba, sometimes above the dry well, and his position near the Black Stone suggests a connection between the two, according to Answering Islam. Some scholars, like Julius Wellhausen, suggest the idea that Hubal may have originally been the Black Stone itself, or even an early form of Allah.


Is this historically a lie, because even till date Muslims venerate the black stone and kabba, to you it maybe for a different reason, but are both structures not man made and the same

CreativeOrbit:
4. Qur’an 5:51 – 'Do not take Jews and Christians as awliyaa'

The word awliyaa has various meanings: protectors, political allies, guardians. It is not a blanket prohibition on friendship. Many scholars agree that this verse refers specifically to political alliances in contexts of conflict, where loyalty to justice and ethical conduct must not be compromised. The Qur’an elsewhere encourages kindness and justice toward non-Muslims who are not hostile (Qur’an 60::

"Allah does not forbid you from being kind and just toward those who have not fought you because of your religion..."

now tenq gave the interpretation to be that Muslims are taught not to be friends with Jews and Christians. Now you creativeorbit gives us a different interpretation, now my question is, are you saying that Muslims are taught not to vote for non-muslims, or to be specific are Muslims taught not to take Jews and Christians as their guardians, protectors nor support them political?

So I came across an interesting debate here on Nairaland between tenq and creativeorbit concerning Hubal and his three daughters, at first I ignored it, but in an attempt to Google if some of the info was true I came across this.



It is an undeniable fact of history that before Muhammed was born, the moon god "al-Ilah" (Allah) had three daughters named al-Lat, al-Uzza and Manat. The first two were even named after their father. Each daughter had a separate shrine near Mecca, where Allah's shrine was located.
As Muhammad grew weary from evangelizing his new religion with little success, he was tricked by the devil into adding a verse in the Koran that commanded Muslims to pray to Allah's three pagan daughters Lat, Uzza and Manat. The pagan female trinity was immediately accepted without dissent and the passage was considered part of the revealed Koran. However some time later, Muhammad got a revelation from God that the verse should be removed. After repenting of the error, Muhammad was comforted by God.


Now Muslims believe that Quran is perfect and infallible, and is given authority to correct the errors of the Tanakh and the Bible which they believe has been corrupted.

It brings a lot of questions and more doubts concerning Muhammad and the Quran when Muhammad claims to have been deceived by the devil

AntiChristian:
What questions?

read the post I quoted and you will see the questions

TenQ:
Can you see that your bias has made you unable to comprehend even simple conversations.
I never claimed even once that theft in mosques proves a deficiency in Islam. Check again.
Instead, I showed that even though the church and mosques are supposed to be holy places, people come there to steal. And I used footwears and phones as examples in mosques and churches.
But your bias made you see otherwise .
You need to read again and comment on exactly what I wrote not what you felt I said. The summary is that the behaviour of one or two thieves in a church or mosque make us behave with caution even though the thieves are minorities. Hence my argument is that as long as there are a few minorities of Muslims with the radical interpretation of Islam, can we as Christians take them for granted?

Cool down bro! I am not your enemy!


As far as Jesus is concerned, no one gets to paradise without Him. Meaning that Muslims will go to hell because they have not received the gift from Gospel of Salvation.

On the other hand, for you Muslims, we have a contradiction
1. Allah says that Christians, Jews and Sabeans will enter paradise.
2. You Muslims say the Jews are cursed and the Christians are Mislead.
How then can the cursed and the mislead enter paradise?
3. The Sabeans worship the stars/constellations and a sect of them worship satan directly. How did Allah say these will go to paradise? Is it because they claim John the Baptist to be their prophet?

Your claim that
The Quran acknowledges that salvation is open to righteous Jews, Christians, and Sabians before the message of Islam was completed (Quran 2:62). is complete falsehood as Allah nor your prophet never said that.

Do I have to remind you that the condition of Quran 2:62 are
a. Belief in God
b. Belief in the last day
c. Doing righteous deeds

I challenge you to give me where Allah says the condition is before the message of Islam was concluded.

It seems you forgot that Islam was the religion of Adam, Abraham, Moses and Jesus! LOL!



You just buttress my point.
The paradise of Jesus is DIFFERENT from the paradise of Mohammed.

It's not the same place.

If the Paradise of Jesus is NOT your paradise, you may have some rethinking to do o.

Your paradise seems to be a place of debauchery: your scholars say that nothing is sin in your paradise.

Your paradise seems more like a Temptation rather than reward for obedience to the God of the heavens and the earth.



There is n contradiction between the Torah and the Gospels, what exist is a REJECTION by the modern Jews of the message of the Gospel. You forget that the Tanakh is the Old Testament of the Christians. LOL!!

What is the original message of the Torah and Injeel?
Do you have them or you have manufactured conjectures as usual?

Unfortunately, it is worse that this as it seems that you know better than Allah.

If the Torah, Injeel, Zabur and others not mentioned by name in the Qur'an are the words of Allah and non can change Allah's words, tell me if you aren't going against your God!

Secondly, Allah asked us Christians to judge by what he has revealed in our Injeel: Is Allah asking us to judge by that which is corrupted?

DidnI not remind you that even in the Qur'an, Jesus made lawful things made unlawful for the children of Israel?

Allah would be wrong or ignorant if indeed the Torah and the Gospel are corrupted or you know better than Allah as your God NEVER claimed your insinuations about our scripture

Who is wrong then between Allah and you?


Are you aware that if you are correct, then Allah would be either Ignorant or Wrong because Allah attests to our scripture. Your prophet also attests to our scripture 600AD.

Was your your prophet telling lies when he said he believes in the Torah and the one who sent it or was that Taqqiya?


See how you conjectures scattered like a pack of cards! LOL!!


Talk is cheap!
You are manufacturing conjectures again
Can you show me exactly where Allah or your prophet said anything about what the Messiah is for his prophecy is all about the Torah you claimed has been corrupted.



But Jesus wasn't created by the word be!
Have you forgotten that Jibril was Sent to BLOW into the Farjaha of Mary!?
You forgot that Jesus was a spirit from Allah cast down to Mary?

Do you know any man who bears the title of a Spirit from Allah and his Word apart from Jesus?

Don't just repeat your scholars consensus, give me evidence from Allah or your prophet!

You seem to forget that in your deen, there are just two spirits. One is Jibril and the other is Jesus (even though you don't even know what a spirit is)



Why are you muddling two different things
1. Are you saying that John the Baptist was filled with Jibril from the womb?
2. Let me remind you of the significance according to your prophet.

You didn't answer the question!
Why was it that only Jesus and Mary satan did not touch at birth?


Is it untrue that just as Allah molded clay into Adam, Jesus moulded clay into a bird?
Is it untrue that just as Allah breathe into the moulded clay of Adam, Jesus breathe into the moulded clay of the bird?
Is it untrue that just as Adam came to life, the clay bird came to life?

Have you forgotten that Allah gave a challenge about gods who cannot even create a fly?


Qur'an 22:73
Those on whom, besides Allah, ye call, cannot create (even) a fly, if they all met together for the purpose! and if the fly should snatch away anything from them, they would have no power to release it from the fly. Feeble are those who petition and those whom they petition!


Why is Jesus the only co-creator of life with Allah?


According to Islam, Jesus did NOT die. He is ALIVE with Allah. Do you know anyone in Islam like this?

Prophets are supposed to be in the graves doing salat but Jesus is different. He is with Allah!

The Question is why?



LOL!
How is Jesus being born from a virgin a sign? A sign to who? Who were the witnesses for it to be a sign?

Why was it even necessary that Jesus comes through a virgin?

I asked you to give theological answers from Islam to my questions but all you were doing was to negate divine nature of Jesus. Unfortunately, my questions wasn't to prove the devine nature of Jesus, NO! It was to make you see the uniqueness of Jesus who you depreciated for your prophet Mohammed!



When you don't have answers, come to the people of the book to show you rather than cooking up conjectures.
Unfortunately, you won't.

This same Jesus that Allah invested everything he gave no other human being was the same one Allah destroyed his ministry by creating Christianity.

Allah deceived the Jews that they killed Jesus
Allah deceived the Romans that they killed Jesus
At the same time
Allah deceived the Apostles of Jesus that Jesus was crucified and died.
Allah then deceived Mary the mother of Jesus that Jesus was crucified and died


Allah followed up this deception with the Disciples burying Jesus
And Allah showed them Jesus resurrecting on the third day and showing Himself to the disciples
Allah showed Jesus going up to heaven in the presence of all his disciples in Galilee.

Allah then waited for 630 years to tell the Christians that ALL was an Elaborate LIE

Tell me, is this your God?

I wish you are on clubhouse. I wonder what creativeorbit and Antichristian answers to these questions are

AntiChristian:
Jesus will follow Muhammad.

lol the one who will judge will follow the one who is among the people. 😂 😂. Why not just make Muhammad the judge or appoint him to a higher position

CreativeOrbit:
Thank you for your comment. Let me address your concerns directly and respectfully.

In Islam, Jesus (peace be upon him) is indeed the Messiah, but this title refers to his unique mission—not divinity or superiority over other prophets. His return before the Day of Judgement is to fulfill a role decreed by God: to uphold justice and rule by the Shariah revealed in the Qur’an, not to bring a new law.

Regarding your question about Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) being under Jesus' judgment—Islam does not see it as a matter of hierarchy after death. Prophet Muhammad’s mission is complete; he delivered the final revelation. Jesus, upon returning, will follow that final revelation—the Qur’an. This does not make Jesus superior to Muhammad; rather, it shows that Jesus himself will confirm the truth of Muhammad’s message.

No prophet is above God’s law. Prophet Muhammad lived by the Qur’an, and Jesus will judge by it. This reflects continuity in divine guidance, not a competition between prophets.

Therefore, the Islamic view maintains respect and clarity: each prophet serves his divinely appointed role, and Jesus’ future role will affirm—not override—what Prophet Muhammad brought.

lol you are still avoiding the subject of the matter by repeating your many words.

Let me repeat it, divinity is not in question, overriding is not in question.

The question is will Muhammad submit to the rule and judgement by Jesus, yes or no?

Are you afraid of what your answer may imply, don't be afraid of the truth and be honest.

CreativeOrbit:
In Islam, Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) is regarded as the final Messenger and Seal of the Prophets (Qur’an 33:40). Jesus the Messiah (peace be upon him) is also highly revered as one of the greatest prophets, but not divine. According to authentic Islamic teachings, Jesus will return before the Day of Judgment to fulfill specific roles, including restoring justice and correcting misbeliefs about his nature.

focus on the subject of discuss, which isn't about if Jesus is divine or not. You made mention of Jesus being the Messiah without explaining what that actually means, neither are you stating the specific roles that you say Jesus will fulfill at his return before the Day of Judgement. Do you even know what it means to call Jesus the Messiah not just a prophet or an anointed person, but the Messiah. Do you know what it means or you are just posting information.

However, it is not correct to suggest that Prophet Muhammad will "submit to the judgment of Jesus" in a way that implies superiority or hierarchy after death. Prophet Muhammad has completed his mission and passed away, having fulfilled the final revelation—the Qur'an—which is the standard of judgment for all people, including Jesus upon his return.

to you it is incorrect to suggest that prophet Muhammad will submit to God's will of giving judgement to Jesus? Meanwhile I am asking you all a question not making a suggestion. Now you seem to have a need to establish or imply the superiority or hierarchy after death by stating again that Muhammad brought the Quran, how does that nullify or answer the question. If Jesus is the anointed one to judge by the standard of your Quran will Muhammad submit to his judgement? Is this question too hard, or you cannot just accept that Muhammad will follow a judge appointed by God? And if you cannot accept that, the question is why?

When Jesus returns, he will follow the Shariah (law) of Muhammad, not bring a new law. This is supported by Hadith, such as in Sahih al-Bukhari and Sahih Muslim, where the Prophet said Jesus will "break the cross, kill the swine, and abolish the jizya," and that he will rule by the Qur’an and Sunnah, not the Gospel.

here again you are not following the discuss, there wasn't a mention of Jesus bringing in a new law, but using your very believe that Jesus would judge with that your shariah law and rule by the Quran. Answer the question will Muhammad be under that same rule, that Jesus will rule by with the Quran.

So, in Islamic belief, Jesus (peace be upon him) will be a follower of the final Prophet, Muhammad (peace be upon him), upon his return—not the other way around.

gohf AntiChristian

I can see why some people have problems with some of you Muslims, how did you come about this conclusion. So to you Jesus who will rule and judge others with the Quran will be a follower of Muhammad, okay please explain to us why that is the case.

And don't say something silly like because God gave Muhammad the Quran, did God giving Muhammad the Quran mean he is above the ruling of the Quran?

Note Antichristian you have still failed to answer the question, will Muhammad follow Jesus, yes or no?

AntiChristian:
The Prophet (salallahu alayhi wasalam) said if Moses (Alayhi salatu wasalam) were to be alive he'll have no choice but to follow him.

So it's clear even Jesus will follow Muhammad when he comes back.

so in truth you do honor Muhammad more than Jesus even though you claim to believe that Jesus is the Messiah, the king of God's kingdom and the one to judge. At first may you deny you do but then you justified yourself by claiming it's because Muhammad is the last prophet so you honor him more than Jesus the king of God's kingdom that you are supposed to be lead into by prophet Muhammad.

Okay, explain to us how God's anointed king and judge would follow Muhammad who is "supposed to submit to God's judgement", how? because it's sounds like Muhammad is boasting that Moses will follow him and you all believe that.

Tell us what Muhammad role in God's kingdom is supposed to be

Is prayer not supposed to be personal and private not a public announcement?

Are you praying for the salvation of his soul?
If so praise God, if not, then what?

Well I pray that you are not been misguided though, 👍🏾👍🏾

Anyone who wants to be holy just wants to be persecuted by the world. You think this weak willed pleasure loving badst***Ds would want to endure such, to pick up their cross and follow God who ain't their servant to grant their every wish and whimps?

The love of many has waxed cold, how many even have true faith..

The man who should see this message won't repent is probably having a big congregation service somewhere in South of Nigeria and giving glory to God for the income for the week.

Anyway maybe some would read this and avoid false men who blasphemy against the Lord Jesus Christ, son of the living God.

HolinesstodLord:
Well said, we are called to be saints, perfecting holiness in the fear of the Lord. When you are perfected in holiness, you won’t be praying for forgiveness of sin anymore. You can’t sin, you don’t sin. It’s all by the power of the Holy Spirit of God.

With man it is impossible but with God all
Things are possible.

thanks for the well said but I don't know where you got I won't be praying for forgiveness of sin anymore when Jesus, James, John taught us to confess, repent and ask for forgiveness. We are not perfect that's why we need to ask for forgiveness and also because we don't love sin and are not workers of Iniquity.

Some question turned to a simple debate where some questions were answered and some weren't but one that hasn't been answered by Muslims who share the view that Jesus is the Messiah is, will Muhammad follow and submit to the judgement of Jesus the Messiah. Seeing as none as said that Muhammad is another Messiah or a replacement Christ.

https://www.nairaland.com/8421569/make-sense-number-things-heard


I also still want a clear explanation as to how Muhammad is the last prophet and not claims or declarations.

AntiChristian:
It was revealed to Jesus by Allah that Prophet Ahmad will come after him. Jesus had nothing to suggest!

okay if it was not a suggestion then you have empirical evidence or book chapter verse that shows that Jesus actually said so and it is recorded and written down. If not, shouldn't we all see it as a false claim?

All Prophets are superior people of their respective time. As for the message the Injeel contains, that's not our business to know since we already said the message was particularly for the children of Israel which Jesus was sent to! It wasn't sent to us. The core message is that it brings people back to the sole worship of Allah and relaxed the otherwise harsh commandments from the earlier scriptures.

so a message which is none of your business is one in which you can infer the core message of it. Isn't that a contradiction? A false statement isn't only an assumption but also manipulation, you first wrote that messengers are superior to prophets but you have changed the basis of your comparison to being that prophets are superior to people which wasn't the basis of the enquiry, this isn't the first time you have done so. So it is deliberate or you don't understand the question? Repeating harsh commandments without specifying or giving one example of one harsh commandment. But would you be able to do so when you have said you do not know what the gospel says.

Let me strongman your point by assuming you mean that the good news to Israel is that they no longer has to follow certain laws of moses and freeing them from . But the question is how can you come to such a knowledge without knowing what the gospel says?

Now note that Jesus didn't preach against the commandments of God like you seem to suggest was the good news, but the answer I am getting from you is that MUHAMMAD DID NOT KNOW WHAT THE GOSPEL IS YET HE MENTIONED IT.

What Muhammad taught is the Qur'an and his tradition. What Jesus taught was the Injeel. Allah did not include the Injeel in the Qur'an for us. Injeel is for the children of Israel and is what Jesus preached and taught while on earth. It was never in a book form.

so what you are saying is that God did not give you guys the good news that He promised in the Tanakh is for all nations, Israel and others?

I can't even ask you what you think is the purpose of the good news, seeing as you said Muslims don't know.

Now the gospel not being in book form is obvious, seeing as it announces that the kingdom of God is here, a part fulfillment of God's promise in the Tanakh that a written proof of the said promise. It's one thing to say you don't know what the igneel is, but then all prophets that Muhammad claims to associate with knew the promise. Now does Muhammad know the promise, or did he teach God's promise.

Now if the Tanakh and new testament teachers both speak of this promise, does Muhammad teach concerning it as well and what does he teach concerning it. Look out discuss concerns the salvation of souls right, so this answers can save a soul

This was my question "so when Muslim Jesus comes back with his rule and destroys Christianity and antichrist, will Muhammad follow him? It's a simple question yes or no."

I already answered this. Our believe about Jesus the son of Mary is that he never died at all and will come back shortly before the world ends. He will destroy Christianity and the antichrist and judge with the Shari'ah of Islam.

you claiming you have already answered it doesn't stop you from writing yes or no. Neither did I ask you if you believe the resurrection of Jesus, I didn't disagree with what you wrote, Now this antichrist and Christianity destroy Jesus who comes to judge with shariah of Islam will Muhammad follow his judgement and submit to it? Yes or no. Or is Muhammad going to rebel against Jesus the just judge?

Offpoint1:

How the whites successfully made us believe these things 😂

I wouldn't blame our ancestors, as of the time of invasion, most if not all were illiterate, so the minds was easy to penetrate.


If religion was a solution, your slave masters wouldn't had given it to you.

so your ancestors were illiterates and also foolish?

When will Eneche listen to the truth and repent from collecting tithe and letting his wife tell people they will return to zero if they stop tithing. When will he repent from his gospel of lies.

AntiChristian:
Adam had a sinful nature as well as a tendency to do good! Just as his generations too. Why do you guys emphasize only on sinful nature; is there no "good deed" nature in your dictionary? I thought everything your God created was God! How come Adam became bad if he was created good! Adam was created with freewill. Just like Satan and his Jinn-kind.

don't know why you seeing my mentioning a sinful nature which you seem to also agree to, as emphasizing but the reason isn't as you assume, it is not because there is no good nature okay. If any reason it explains why men go against God and you agree we all have a sinful nature

Adam sincerely asked for forgiveness and Allah forgave him. Any Muslim could do same and repent sincerely and Allah forgives whoever He wills.

so God can forgive anyone as long as they sincerely repent or they have to first convert to your religion before they can ask for forgiveness and be forgiven?

The essence of having a revealed scripture is to be guided. So believers now have the Qur'an and the traditions of the Prophet salallahu alayhi wasalam. These scriptures will always be in vogue till the day of resurrection for all mankind and Jinn. And Muhammad is the last Prophet of Allah in fact he's the seal of all Prophets. The last Prophet also means the last messenger since a messenger is a subset of a Prophet. So all believing people will have to follow the Qur'an and the traditions of the last Prophet till the world ends!

All is understandable here!

now when you mention revealed scripture and is purpose is to guide. First issue is compared to the commandments that was publicly revealed to the people of Israel and the Torah that in the sight of Israel Moses had to ascend and receive to confirm that it was inspired by God. Muhammad is said to have had a private encounter and though some mention 2 witnesses or so. How valid is the Quran which contradicts somethings mentioned in the Torah which was given publicly followed by acts of God. One has to be wrong when both contradict each other, don't you agree.

When you call Muhammed the last prophet, is it a claim he made or a public declaration by God. Is that what Islam teaches.

Now comparing your response to why Muhammad is the last prophet to the reason why Jesus is the only Messiah, it is more reasonable to believe that Jesus is the only way to God. You are making claims with no clear explanation as to why Muhammad is the last prophet, it's either you don't know why or you there is no why because he isn't.

All believers now have the Quran, all of them have to follow it, it's like a programmed reason which doesn't answer the question why is Muhammad the last prophet.

Muhammad can't be the last prophet to unbelievers because his message and outreach didn't reach unbelievers, especially some of the Islam doctrines or practices towards said unbelievers.

Muhammad can't be the last prophet to Israel because he was never sent to Israel.

Muhammad wasn't even an Israelite yet he associates himself with israelite prophets and claims to be the last of them, so he can't even say he was the last israelite prophet.

What is the basis for this claim

AntiChristian:
Adam being removed from garden can be said to be God fulfilling His intention of creating a vicegerent on earth! And if you regard it as a punishment then it's a lesser punishment. For example, when a man steal he is punished in Islamic law. After that punishment the culprit still needs to seek forgiveness from Allah for the sin commited or else he'll be punished again in the afterlife. Adam was forgiven so he inherited no sins and won't be punished for the sin in the afterlife!

We believe in the torah revealed to Moses, the Zabur revealed to David, the Injeel revealed to Jesus, the scrolls revealed to Abraham and the Qur'an revealed to Muhammad. All these scriptures are the word of Allah for the people at the respective times of the Prophets. Only Muhammad was sent to the world of mankind and unseen Jinn!

A Prophet is sent to a believing people by Allah!
A messenger is sent to a disbelieving people by Allah!
If God were to be speaking to every Tomiwa, Dike and Haruna, then what's the essense of the scripture in the Qur'an.

Muhammad is the last Prophet of Allah! There are no more Prophets nor scriptures to be revealed till the world ends!

May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon all of them from Adam to Muhammad!

now I didn't say Adam inherited any sin, except you are saying Adam didn't have a sinful nature and didn't pass such nature to his children then you would have to explain how Adam sinned and why his descendants also sin if they don't have a sinful nature in them?


Now you didn't not answer nor affirm this question

So Adam didn't have to perform religious deeds to be forgiven he just had to believe in God's mercy and seek God's forgiveness right? And is this the process of obtaining God's mercy that the Quran teaches? That all you need is to ask God for mercy and believe in God's mercy.



You explaining what a messenger is and a prophet is, didn't answer the question or are you saying there are no more believing people and there are no more unbelieving people. Well you didn't say last messenger, so Muhammad was according to you God's last prophet to his believing people?


Like help others understand why you say and believe he is the last.

So AntiChristian

It is Injeel because that is the scripture given to the Israelites at the time of Jesus! The difference is that it relaxes some of the earlier laws for the israelites! And And all Prophets essentially preached the same core message i.e. to worship Allah alone without partners! All Prophet have their levels. In Islam, the category is divided into Prophets and Messengers! A messenger by virtue of the message sent to be delivered is superior to a Prophet! All messengers are also Prophets but not all Prophets are messengers! Adam was the first Prophet, while Noah was the first messenger. All Prophets are like brothers of the same fathers with different mothers! Each have the demography he was sent to! The foremeost of them are Noah, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad! May the peace and blessings of Allah be upon them all! When i say something is believed, it means that makes one who refuses to believe such is a disbeliever in Islam!

This question, "Why did Jesus according to you suggest that Ahmed would be the last prophet?" Wasn't answered.

Now I asked you what the message contains, and not to whom the message was given. What is the good news. Now you are saying well Jesus is a prophet and a messenger, my question remains what was his message. You can't keep saying all prophets were told to tell people that they should believe in one God, of messengers are superior like you wrote then what made Jesus superior, what was his specific message.

Now I have asked you what Muhammad taught, or are you saying that two messengers from God cannot teach the same message or that Muhammad did not know the message given through Jesus?

We honor Muhammad and pray for him to earn more rewards from Allah! We honor Jesus and other Prophets too! But they were not sent to us. If Jesus were to come back today, we'll follow him as he would be using the Shariah of Islam to rule and judge! When Jesus comes back he will destroy Christianity as well as the antichrist! He will live his life fully and die a natural death as Muslim.

All Prophets and messengers were Muslims. And all those who follow them were Muslims too. Allah mentions the disciples of Jesus in the Qur'an and they were Muslims. Only those from the time of Muhammad need to follow him to be Muslims! Those who followed Jesus during his time were Muslims! Those who followed Moses during his time were Muslims! so when Muslim Jesus comes back with his rule and destroys Christianity and antichrist, will Muhammad follow him? It's a simple question yes or no.

Emusan:
I guess you meant "EXCEPT" here!

What do you mean by this statement?



Jesus never said in "He is God" but all the criteria that made God to be God was used for Jesus.

For example!

John 1:1 says "The Word was God"
John 1:3 says "Without The Word NOTHING was Created that have been CREATED" Which means Jesus isn't part of creation.
Phil 2:6 made it clear that "Jesus EXISTS IN THE NATURE OF GOD and He is EQUAL TO GOD"
LASTLY, Jesus Himself said in John 5:23 "so that everyone will honor the Son, JUST AS they honor the Father. Anyone who does not honor the Son is certainly not honoring the Father who sent him."



You can highlight the lies in my post.

So the criteria according to you that made God to be God are
1. The word was God
2. God used the word to create all things
3. Jesus having the nature of God
4. Honor the son as you honor the Father

Here is your first lie, none of this is what makes God God.

The only truth you wrote is that Jesus never said He is God.

You said I should highlight your lies

John 1:1 Kai theos en ho logos
theos there is not object, but is now the subject.

In John 1:1 John is revealing the source of the word, the logos which is revelation. So in the beginning was the revelation and that revelation was with God... And then John us was the revelation was about. God was the revelation. God was what the word was about. And that's why I say the word was God's word about God. Was being used there is an imperfect verb meaning you can't change it to mean God is the word.

Verse 2 speaks about Jesus being with God in the beginning.

So the revelation was with God and Jesus was with God in the beginning and through Jesus all that was made was made. Which clearly means Jesus was the the means God used to create.

You lie because you fail to realize that Jesus is the foundation of the world, the very being God used to hold the world together like the foundation that holds a house.

Phil. 2.6 who being in God's form did not consider equality with God something to be desired or grasped but instead, verse 7, took himself as a servant. You can lie or believe a misinterpretion and lie against a verse but it doesn't change that Jesus was and is humble and didn't consider himself to be God nor equal to God.

John 5:23 is not the beginning of a sentence
John.5.22-23 And the Father leaves all judgment to his Son, so that everyone will honor the Son, just as they honor the Father. But if you refuse to honor the Son, then you are certainly not honoring the Father who sent him.

Does this mean that the son is equal to the Father, you would have to be a deliberate and wicked liar to say it does. When it clearly shows that the honor of being the judge is given to the son, that is God has granted that honor to Jesus by making it that the honor that would come to the judge would go to the Jesus whom he has appointed as the judge. So just as we would have honor God as judge, we should honor the son as judge appointed by God.

It doesn't say honor Jesus as God. One of the duties of an anointed king, the Messiah is to judge. That's why in revelation Jesus is honored and praised for redeeming us and declaring God's judgement upon the world.

Emusan:
You have it written plainly in John 1:1 "...and the Word was God"

wait you don't know what scripture is and who God is?

Emusan:
@underlined - you're wrong it's not people who tried to make Jesus equal to God or a god but it was The Word of God that revealed that Jesus is God and equal to God.

expect Jesus stopped being called the word of God, tell us where he said he is God and is equal to God. Or stop deceiving yourself and lying against God's word