₦airaland Forum

@ joagbaje, nice article.

@ okeyxyz, love your write-up, it's so real and apostolic. However, Joe's article is different from what you're saying. You and Joe are right but I think you're more deeper with your response but Joe also teach Grace in the past and he's not for the law either. Ya both keep it up.

This topic CAN NEVER be treated biblically because it's already on the FRONT PAGE.........I'm out of here!

Image123: hahahahaha oya goshen wear those pants now. it's one thing to be caught pants down, it's another thing to stay pants down. You're getting old, lolololol. And don't call my name any kain how, you hear my friend.

Okay, me pants dey down shey....so what? You wan look ni..... . There's nothing down in my pants bro. You and anukulapo are on the same page that's why you're both acting up. I don't have problem with that - at least we are in fellowship with one another.

anukulapo: Dear Bro Goshen,
I hope i am quoting you right. if yes, Please allow me to answer you in your way of response from this thread https://www.nairaland.com/1155998/restitution-christs-teaching-church-old/2

Answer the question I asked you and stop being sentimental playing pranks about the issue.

Regards.

I don't understand pranks playing here as there is none. You have answered my question BUT I'm giving you a second chance to CONFIRM your answers before I say what I want to say, that's all and I advised if you wish to call your friend for help to confirm your answers or use other available options. That isn't pranks playing, just say if that's your final answer to my question in which you said a woman still have to wear or put on scarf or not to cover her hair. That's all.

anukulapo: Okay, should a woman put scarf on or not....to cover her hair?

A direct answer to your question as pasted above is [size=20pt]YES![/size], a woman should put scarf on (as you and see evidently in all the C1 churches around you.)

Is this your FINAL ANSWER or you want to call a friend (In this case, your friend Image123 but we are all friends, brothers and sisters in Christ anyway but Image123 knows I'm never afraid calling his I.D anytime, even bold it, that's the reason I'm being specific about your friend in this case... ); you want to ask the audience; you want to use the lifelines or you want to use your 50/50 chance which is still available for you to re-think your answer. FINAL ANSWER or you want do any of the above

I will attend the rest of your questions after you make your choice on the above.

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Logicboy03: Typical christian; will approve of lies against an atheist.

.....in addition to trolling......so christlike

...and it not Athestistical to fruitlessly attack on Religion endlessly. You spend 19 to 22 hours of your daily life on Nairaland creating useless multiple threads and looking for Christians and Moslems to attack, at the end you have "not a single convert to atheisim" to show for it.

Then the kweshion was..............Are you jobless or what? No be me ask am oooo...

^^^

First, your advice is Christ-like and matured. Thank for those words. However, I don't want you to see it from the perspective that I'm trying to change or judge what people believe in as it relates to this subject. My emphasis are crystal clear - correction! The corrective surgery sometimes doesn't go down well with us. Many of us will always want to react in some ways or the other. Either way, I will try see if I will adopt another way of teaching to make it look more of corrective than it looking like I'm judging. Thanks once again for your advice, God bless you bro.

Lovethywilbedon: That does'nt happen here in Nigeria. If you think so, can you give us one example (preferably in Christianity) that you didn't make up by yourself. By the way when will you fruitless attack on Religion end. You spend 19 to 22 hours of your daily life on Nairaland creating useless multiple threads and looking for Christians and Moslems to attack, at the end you have "not a single convert to atheisim" to show for it. Are you jobless or what?.

I'm Goshen360 and I APPROVE this message!

aletheia: Happy New Year, my brother. May the Lord grant you more grace and power to do His will.

AMEN bro. I receive your Apostolic prayers in Jesus Name! Yes, I was studying something about being a "servant or slave or (bond) servant/man of Jesus Christ, in trying to fine tune and update/upgrade some information on my commentary in the Epistle of Jude. Your words on "power to do His will" so hit me like a new and fresh word from above. Thank you and God bless you always. You are a blessing to me on this forum I must confess.

anukulapo: We that believe the bible says men should not have cap,we don't put it on while you that says otherwise have not been putting it on--so why do you think we are wrong? You don't practice what you preach so...

Okay, should a woman put scarf on or not....to cover her hair?

Logicboy03: Please add more bible quotes

You, Logicboy, version 03..........Remember now your Creator in the days of your youth, while the evil days come not, nor the years draw near, when you shall say, I have no pleasure in them - Ecclesiastes 12:1


Old Testament right ..........

@ My dearest brother aletheia,

I love you soooooooooooooooooooooo much! The way you rain down scriptures as I have watched you in the forum proves you are properly grounded in the word of His Grace. Keep doing the sound doctrine brother. I have had course to deal with that boy called Logic in the past. Sometimes, I'm just weary of him.

Thank you once again. God loves you and so do I.

wpope: its true that name matters by reason of spirits that back certain names...but i know that name has nothing with eternity and please salvation is for all regardless of tribe or name.I believe that the effects of names apply only on earth and as long as one is alive.

Eternal blessings be your portion in Jesus name......can I hear you shout AMEN!

Lovine: ...and Christians are instructed to do the same thing in the manner/way? If you are a female, (which I don't know anyway) don't tell me you don't go to worship place or gathering when you have your monthly discharge.....
(Quote) (Report) (Like)

No Christians don't observe that law it was for Judaism, Judaism is not Christian

Thank you! You have spoken the eternal truth. God bless you! In fact, you are already blessed!

Lovine: But why do the Muslims wash their heads, ears, eyes, even their privates before prayer? And also they shout every morning?

...and Christians are instructed to do the same thing(s) in the manner/way If you are a female, (which I don't know anyway) don't tell me you don't go to worship place or gathering when you have your monthly discharge.....

Lovine: There's no particular way to pray. As the spirit leads my dear

But not as if you are praying to the air, but not to a living God. Sometimes prayers can go like that but [size=20pt]not a custom.[/size]

....of shaking one's head.

highyo: I so much agree with what you said it "doesn't matter to my new status in Christ"
so I do not see any reason why God should change Abram to Abraham, Isach to Isreal, Saul to Paul
or why should God do that, when your name have nothing to do with your status in christ
you may want to say Sarah, Jacob and Abraham are is old testament. What of Paul
There is no need for arguing, let what belong devil be returned and reject, and focus on God and things of Heaven
Pray to God to review the truth to you, Child of God dont Argue, but seek the truth from God

Okay, I hear you but does the name changed useful to enter heaven or written in the book of life or useful for this earth? The OP says such name MAY NOT ENTER THE BOOK of LIFE. Is it by names changed that one's name is written in the book of life or by our deeds? I do not wish to argue this but we bear in mind that when we bear the mark of Christ in us AFTER being in Christ, the rest is a function of our mind.

Joagbaje: .

The question first is what do you understand by anointing? Did you ask them what the programme is about. Don't judge a book by the cover

I don't have detail I formation about this programme you're talking about. It's not wise to speak audaciously of what you have little or no information about. But I can help you with this.
If you have ever cast out devils from people ,you will know that destiny doesn't get fulfilled automatically .there are deeds that can hinder destiny. There are devils that can hinder destiny. There are decisions that cn hinder destiny. Wrong choice of marriage partner can block fulfilment of destiny.So if a man of God comes up with a programme to help people fulfill destiny. You should rather be concerned about what he sees that you don't see, and what he knows that you may not know.

Joe my brother. I'm sorry if I offend you and 'some' of these preachers. I do not intend to argue if we can't talk scriptures. You and I have argued these demon casting of a thing in the past. Are you still telling me/us that Christians are possessed by demons? or those who haven't come to believe in Christ? Why do you tie many unfulfilled destinies to demons and those things you mentioned. Do you even understand that EVERY Christian in anointed in their own proportions and according to how the Spirit wills?

You said I should be concerned about what he sees that I don't see. Okay, this I agree with you! However, whatever he sees cannot be outside God's word else anybody can come to Christians claiming they see something. What I'm simply saying is, there's nothing like ANOINTING for DESTINY. Besides, you asked me what I understand about Anointing. I think you shouldn't ask that but rather what scripture says it is - It is the enabling Power of God by or through the Holy Spirit to function in the Spiritual gifts.

Now, my question, if Christians need anointing for destiny or whatever, what then is the anointing that Christian had already received meant for when they came to Christ? And by what anointing are those who are not Christians doing what God had created them to do?

@ OP,

There is nothing like NOT entering book of life because I bear certain name(s). Do you know my name or lastname? Okay, to give you a clue, my last name carry something similar to 'ifa' in it and it doesn't bother me and I never asked my parent the meaning of the name because it doesn't matter to my new status in Christ - If any man be IN Christ, he is a NEW creature.

Emylexray: bro, i've observed most of your posts and teachings carefully and i can say you base your explanations solely on the NEW TESTAMENT thereby undermining the teachings and doctrines of the OLD TESTAMENT.

My teachings are MOSTLY, NOT SOLELY on the New Testament. I teach and quote from the Old. I just quoted from the Old Testament now up there from the book of Psalms. Now, many people don't understand me nor my teachings 'probably' because of denomination syndrome. I'm not saying that's the only reason but perhaps.

What you called the teachings of the Old Testament ARE ALL REVEALED and FULFILLED in the New Testament. How did I know this? Let's get into the word because that is our standard of interpretation and explaining scriptures with scriptures.

New Living Translation (©2007)
Then Jesus took them through the writings of Moses and all the prophets, explaining from all the Scriptures the things concerning himself. - Luke 24:27

From this scriptures, we can explain that the Old Testament - Moses and ALL the prophets are ALL pointing to Christ. We can also explain that the NT was buried in the OLD? How? Using scriptural equation as follows:

Moses = Genesis to Deuteronomy........equation (1) For law was given by Moses. (John 1:17)
Prophets = Joshua to Malachi..........equation (2)
Jesus = Grace and Truth...............equation (3) Grace and Truth came by Jesus. (John 1:17)

Now flip your bible to Hebrews 1:1-2, to solved the equation:

Before that, don't forget Jesus already explained in Luke 24:27 things that were buried from Moses to ALL the prophets concerning him, that is all pointing to him. Now, Hebrews 1:1-2 confirms that with Christ's word,

In the past [Long ago] God spoke to our ancestors [forefathers; fathers] through the prophets [/b]many times [or [b]in a fragmentary/partial way;  in many parts] and in many different ways.

But now in these last days God has spoken to us through his Son [or a son; 1:3] God has chosen [appointed] his Son to own [be heir/inheritor of] all things, and through him he made the world [universe; ages;  comprising both space and time; John 1:3].

The NT is the Old fulfilled. The Gospel was buried in the Old. My teachings doesn't mean or say anywhere that we can't quote or teach from the Old Testament - I never said anything of such because ALL scriptures (old and new) are given by the inspiration of God and it is used for teaching, correction etc. So, don't misunderstand my teachings, it's good you asked. My emphasis on the NT is simple on Christ and Paul's teaching,

Expanded Bible (EXB)
He made us able [adequate; competent] to be servants of a new agreement [covenant] from himself to his people [covenant; Jer. 31:31–34; Luke 22:20]. This new agreement [covenant] is not a written law [ of the letter], but it is of the Spirit. The written law [ letter] brings death, but the Spirit gives life. - 2 Corinthians 3:6

If Christ ALREADY MADE us ministers of the NEW and the New is already fulfilled in Christ, it therefore means the purpose of the Old had been completed. ALL TRUTH and REVELATION is NOW completed in Christ. Remember, Moses and ALL the Prophets ONLY gave fragment/portion/partial of God's revelation according to Hebrews 1:1 as quoted above BUT the COMPLETE truth and revelation are NOW in Christ. I hope I'm not confusing you here.

Emylexray: I can remember vividly when you said "tithing" had been abolished in the old testament, are you implying that the doctrines of the OLD TESTAMENT are no longer valid in the mordern day christainity?

Actually I said, tithe had been abolished in the New Testament, NOT in the Old. It's a simply equation deduced from the word of God and here is it but I don't want to derail this thread into tithing thread but since you asked,

Hebrews 7:5 says

Now the law says [authorizes; commands] that those in the tribe [ of the sons/descendants] of Levi who become priests must collect a tenth [tithe] from the people—their own people [ brothers (and sisters)]—even though the priests and the people [ they] are from the family [are also descendants;  have come from the loins/body] of Abraham.

This verse simply says, the tribe of Levi have authorization or COMMANDMENT or COMMANDS to RECEIVE TITHE, right. Okay. Please bear this in mind.

Now, verse 18 of Hebrews 7 says,

The old [former] rule [commandment; regulation] is now set aside [nullified; abolished], because it was weak and useless [ineffective].

Now the question is, does this old or former rule/commandment/regualtion include tithe or not? Does it include the commandment or authorization to take tithe by the tribe of Levi according to verse 5 of same chapter 7 This question need answer and you be the judge.

Emylexray: That aside you said spiritual battles can only be fought spiritually, how do you mean? Are you implying that the physical man must turn to a spirit before he can tackle spiritual things? I believe the physical controls the spiritual. When we pray in the physical, it affects the spiritual.

No, it does not imply we should turn to spirit. When scriptures says,

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. - Galatians 5:16

Does it mean we should turn into spirit and start walking? NO! It means live by the Spirit of God; be guided by the Spirit etc. Spiritual warfare are fought in our human body, we don't turn spirit to fight spiritual warfare but we do it in the spirit and by the Spirit of God and one of the manifestations or fruit of same Spirit of God is SELF control. When everybody begins to shake their heads like lizard, we are out of control and not be in the Spirit. It is not the Spirit that makes people shake their heads uncontrollably but religious spirit.

Bidam: Manifestations of God's Power

When observing, ask yourself:

1. Is Jesus being lifted up?
2. Are the Scriptures being elevated as the truth and pure Word of God?
3. Is the Spirit manifested bringing truth and greater Spiritual values?
4. Is the Spirit manifested destructive to satan and his kingdom?
5. Is the Spirit manifested leading people to love God and each other more?



God is coming out of the boxes we have placed Him in and doing what He wants to do - God is God and we're not!
God will choose to offend our minds in order to reveal what is in our hearts.

Manifestations:

1. Falling on the floor - (being slain in the Spirit)- Resting in the presence of God. Something tremendously important is being done within you (deep inner healing, preparation for ministry, physical healing, receiving of visions, feeling the love of God. )

2. Laughter - The medical profession has discovered health and wholeness comes through laughter. Healing can come through laughter.

3. Shaking ( head, hands, feet, and body ) - Sign of a much deeper happening. Not just the body is shaking, but there is a Prophetic shaking. This is often a type of intercessory prayer. People who shake are often used Prophetically. God will shake the status quo and our agendas, plans, complacency, and the theology that says God only works "this way." Everything built on sand will be shaken.

4. Deep bowing - The Jewish people who worship at the wailing wall do so with deep bowing. This manifestation is usually seen in intercessors.

Again, I don't want to start analyzing your statement because God doesn't contradict his word. Go straight to the point bro.

Goshen360: I can't comprehend this my brother. I'm sorry. You need to talk in scriptures - that's the only language I understand. I don't want to start analyzing your statement one after the other. Talk scriptures please. God cannot contradict His word. When you say things outside scripture, I don't have obligation to respond to you.

Pangea: Alright you pray, good,
May I correct you that prayer is not talking to God alone?

What! Where did you get this from? You mean NOT ONLY God we talk to in prayer? You will need to show us from scriptures where prayers are directed to men/man.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
O you that hears prayer, unto you shall all flesh come. - Psalm 65:2

Pangea: Prayer can be vertical, like you mentioned, that is talking to God, you can do that within your
heart, without your lips moving, etc

This is scriptural BUT you didn't mention shaking heads inclusive because I believe it's nowhere to be found in scripture.

Pangea: Prayer can also be horizontal, that is prayers of spiritual warfare, that can't be done quietly!

Where did you get this from? Did you import this into God's word or what? If prayer can ALSO BE HORIZONTAL, then God alone is NOT to answer prayers. Besides, how does casting out demons by the word of God and authority of God/Christ's name EQUAL horizontal prayer of spiritual warfare? When you engage in spiritual warfare, you TALK to them BY THE WORD OF GOD, NOT PRAY to them; you command them out; you rebuke them and you cease their operations. That's spiritual warfare, you can't pray to spiritual forces. Shouting and shaking head can't speed up results, it is not shaking head that guarantees our victory in spiritual warfare - it is effect use of the weapons of our warfare listed in Ephesians 6.

Pangea: What are you on about?
Normally I don't respond to people that believe that they are the master of all things scriptural, I allowed them to stew in their ignorance!
But in this case I will make an exception for the benefit of the simple minded folks here in this place who are impressionable.

Calm down and discuss scripturally, maturely and like a Christian. Nobody is master of all except Christ and the complete word of God we have with us now. Let's get into the word.

Pangea: Like I said previously, Prayer is communication with the spiritual, and you asked how you can do that by getting physical? The question you asked actually betrayed your ignorance if you are a christian, I will answer it too by asking you these questions:
Do you pray at all?
If you do, how do you do it?
Do you turn yourself to a ghost to do it, or you do it with your physical mouth?

Okay, I asked a question and you asked me question in return. That's okay by me even though you didn't answer. Don't get too emotional now, okay.

Do you pray at all? - Yes, I do pray.

If you do, how do you do it? - I do by talking to God, with my heart and with my mouth. That's being physical right? Yes, shaking my head to get answers? NO

Do you turn yourself to a ghost to do it, or you do it with your physical mouth? - Answered in (2) above....and you read my answers doesn't include SHAKING MY HEAD because it doesn't speed up my answers to prayers.

Pangea: You mentioned the issue of Jesus sweat as thick as blood, and you made allusion to it, my friend don't say what you dont know, the word of God with the help of the Holy spirit brings illumination, I'm amazed you don't know these! The scripture is filled with truths that will astound you if you allow the Holy spirit to minister to you. The bible says in 2 Corinthians 3:6 “who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life"

Thank God you desire to talk scripture and not just talking scripture; you want to the Spirit and life realm of the word for the letter kills but the Spirit gives life. I'm happy with this part.

Pangea: And concerning Elijah, are you now saying he is not relevant in the matter under discussion?
Smh

You see why I laugh at people like you. You should have understood that during the time of Elijah, the revelation of God's word was IN PARTS or PIECES. The complete REVELATION is in CHRIST. Elijah called fire, NOT Spiritual fire now we talking about o, but physical fire. The fire was visible according to scriptures not spiritual fire. Does the NT tells you to call fire on people physically today and the NT has a scriptural way to bring FIRE ON YOUR ENEMIES.

akagaba: Thank u great man of God, u truly hav d spirit and knowlege of God. If ther was anythng higher than d jets, i wud only recomend it 4 pastors and children of God. Those who criticize pastors of havin private jet ar not only sufferin frm ignorance bt frm "poverty mentality". So disapointed at Goshen360, used 2hold him in high esteem bt he's just told me dat he d oposite of wat i used 2thnk abt him, tu fia kwa. Hosea 4 vs 6 said it all.

My sister, you don't have to bring sentiments and emotion into the word of God. First, I'm not poor neither do I have poverty mentality. As a matter of fact, (without boasting) I'm rich by God's Grace and I'm not just talking about spiritual riches or being rich by 'faith'; I'm rich in materials blessings. I believe in wealth and riches but the life of a man is not in the abundance of his riches. Thanks for holding me to high esteem but first, your focus should be Christ, not me nor any man.

That being said, my stance on private jet is en-capsuled in these words,

Zikkyy: A space ship to mars is a necessity cos there's no other way to getting there (unless you know how to disappear and appear at any location you so desire). a private jet is an avoidable luxury at this time and it is not a necessity. owning a private jet is not bad, but timing is an issue. a pastor owning a private jet when a much larger percentage of the people around him cannot afford one good meal in a day shows a pastor that is not sensitive to the plight of his people. If you ask me, it is an un-Christlike behavior. It is not a reflection of a man with a conscience.

Bidam: God is coming out of the boxes we have placed Him in and doing what He wants to do - God is God and we're not!
God will choose to offend our minds in order to reveal what is in our hearts.

Manifestations:

1. Falling on the floor - (being slain in the Spirit)- Resting in the presence of God. Something tremendously important is being done within you (deep inner healing, preparation for ministry, physical healing, receiving of visions, feeling the love of God. )

2. Laughter - The medical profession has discovered health and wholeness comes through laughter. Healing can come through laughter.

3. Shaking ( head, hands, feet, and body ) - Sign of a much deeper happening. Not just the body is shaking, but there is a Prophetic shaking. This is often a type of intercessory prayer. People who shake are often used Prophetically. God will shake the status quo and our agendas, plans, complacency, and the theology that says God only works "this way." Everything built on sand will be shaken.

4. Deep bowing - The Jewish people who worship at the wailing wall do so with deep bowing. This manifestation is usually seen in intercessors.

I can't comprehend this my brother. I'm sorry. You need to talk in scriptures - that's the only language I understand. I don't want to start analyzing your statement one after the other. Talk scriptures please. God cannot contradict His word. When you say things outside scripture, I don't have obligation to respond to you.

Joagbaje: What is wrong with anointing for destiny. Do you even understand what his programme is about? . How much information do you have to criticize another ?

Anointing for destiny? Where do you find such in scripture? That a Christian need anointing to fulfill destiny or what does it mean? If anointing is needed for destiny to come to past, then I think you should start questioning the Bible itself because scriptures says, God gives to ALL MEN without finding faults. Then those who are not Christians and have fulfilled their destiny will be asked what anointing they got for destiny.

Well, I know Bishop Wale Oke more than you think.

Joagbaje: Jude 1:10
But these speak evil of those things which they know not:but what they know naturally. . .

This scriptures should be directed at people of its context. You know what I'm taking about. I don't want to generate another controversy by calling names.

Yooguyz: smh, am very disappointed, you are the last person i expected to type this
so you are among the people who bring down men of God?

Bring down men of God? How? God's word is NO respect of person(s). Tell me how my post brought him down

God2man: I am with you 100%, the bible says we wrestle, wrestling match is dangerous, your hand, leg, head, every part of your body must fight or else you become a casualty.
You have not yet resisted unto blood striving against sin.

God bless you.

God2man.

I know very well you are vast in SPIRITUAL WARFARE. How did I know that? From many of your post. Now, when scripture says we 'wrestle' does it says it is PHYSICAL? and does it say your legs are inlvolved Where the heck did you get that imported into scriptures Sometimes you say things that I begin to question 'some' things about you. How do you fight a SPIRITUAL warfare with LEGS, HEAD, HANDS AND EVERY PART OF YOUR BODY MUST FIGHT. Okay, now lemme take you into the Spiritual warfare stuff - when you engage in warfare which the Bible says its SPIRITUAL, meaning the forces you fight against are NOT SEEN by the natural eyes and yet, it is called SPIRITUAL warfare, then it follows that it is with your spirit that you engage in such warfare. Why? Because the deep calls unto the deep. In that case, you walk in the Spirit and by faith (SPIRITUAL FORCE) and NOT by sight (PHYSICAL SENSES).

A Shepherd is first a sheep before he becomes a Shepherd; that way he understands the Sheep and their actions. When I was a young Christian, I attended a church where in prayer warrior, we do such things as shaking heads. When I began to look into the mirror of the word, I realized it has nothing to do with the Spiritual warfare, it's just a religious sentiments. Well, I'm not saying people shouldn't shake their head when they pray but does it align with scriptures and it is make it a right prayer practices? They can shake their heads for all I care, it's not my head, it's theirs. Don't just make a case for it proving that is the right thing to do.

Emylexray: haaa! Oga goshen! You too!

I have always respected you for your sound knowledge of the Bible and your unbiased way of addressing religious matters, but this comment of yours depicts how "unspiritual" you are bro. What happened to warfare prayers?

First, DO NOT look unto me as a man, look unto Christ and If I teach what aligns with scriptures, follow it but if I err, follow Christ. In all, study the word for yourself to learn the truth for yourself.

Second, being Spiritual doesn't make you loose your mind especially when it comes to things of God. Like I said earlier, one of the fruit of the Holy Spirit is SELF control. You control yourSELF which includes your body and parts of your body. The Nigerian version of Christianity, actually its churchianity not Christianity because the early Christians prayed and got extra ordinary result and we're NOT told shaking their heads were part of their prayer exercise.

Emylexray: Genesis 32 vs 24 : and jacob was left alone and there "wrestled" a man with him until the breaking of the day.
25. And when he saw that he pravailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh. . .AS HE WRESTLED WITH HIM.

In the above bible verses, Jacob wrestled with an angel in prayers. "Wrestled" in that context connotes "violence". So what are we saying? Shaking the head while praying indicates violence or "holy anger" as some may term it. Na wa o!

When you say Jacod 'wrestled' with a man, what was it? Physical or invisible man? Today, our warfare is NOT physical but spiritual (Eph. 6:12). How do you wrestle with invisible forces if it is physical? Jacobs' case is a type of the NT spiritual warfare. In Jacob's case, it was physical but in the NT, it's spiritual and the Apostle say, our warfare is NOT with FLESH AND BLOOD but against SPIRITUAL wickedness....

You said, ""Wrestled" in that context connotes "violence". So what are we saying? Shaking the head while praying indicates violence or "holy anger" as some may term it".

I can't believe this! Well, you said it all as you rightly said..."as some may term it", NOT what scripture says neither did scriptures term it so. wrestled doesn't = violence and shaking head while praying is just a religious add up to the things of the Spirit, it does not indicate violence. Jesus cast out demons BY HIS WORDS, not shaking his heads and screaming and sweating. Well, you may not buy into my teaching but study the scriptures for yourself and in the mirror of the word, let God show you how Spiritual things are done. Things of the Spirit are done in the ways of the Spirit not in Nigerian way.