₦airaland Forum

gohf:
so the answer is that you haven't so why then do you expect others to "Just imagine it in the line of your spirit and soul and body."

So you are saying the very veil that Jesus removed to reveal God to us, is still intact as people cannot see God even if their hearts are purified, they cannot know Him nor draw close to Him because they are limited and finite according to you so impossible to reach

You don't event understand the scriptures!

Why did Paul say "That I may know Him..." Is it because the veil is still in tact?

MaxInDHouse:
You have not answered the question.

Are you saying all these people arguing and insulting themselves are right one way or another?

YES or NO?

Do you agree with any of them? No! You're therefore part of the argument!

LordReed:
LoLz. Is it not you who is blind calling 2000 years "coming soon". Bwahahahahaha!

Laughing at your ignorance. 2,000 years coming soon? Lol.

MaxInDHouse:
So in a nutshell all these people arguing and insulting themselves are right one way or the other shey?

The finite cannot comprehend the infinite. If your god is comprehensible, then it's a fake god created by finite humans.

LordReed:
The delusion one here is you who believes a storybook is real life. LoLz.

It's okay. Time will tell.

The blind man is free to call a skyscraper a storey building.

Nachmonides:
The thing is, it's not even about what God has revealed or not, it's us, humans.
We could never fully comprehend in our humanity, our current framework is limited.

Even if God were to reveal something new, we would still not be able to comprehend in our humanity. Our purview is limited; if truly God is God; infinite.
A finite creature/creation could never fully grasp his revelation.

Absolutely correct!

Janosky:
Which one of your 3 deities is "Himself" /"He"?

We have only one God.

LordReed:
LoLz. The storybook proves the storybook is true.

I weep for you. No need to tell you anything. Just keep wallowing in your delusions.

DaddyCoool:
But nowhere does it say it. God is God because He is eternal and everything is from Him. His Godship is NOT dependent on his knowing everything every moment or his knowing time of second coming!

Absolutely correct.

No one says His Godship is depended on His omniscience. But since Omniscience is an attribute of God, it should be found in Jesus too if indeed, He is the same God we're talking about.

MaxInDHouse:
Na wah o!

Please if i may ask:

Truthseeker10
Steep
DaddyCool
Nachmonides
Gothamcities

Do you all agree on TRINITY?
If so why all these arguments?

Because the knowledge of God is infinite. You cannot completely know God. You can only know the little He has revealed to you about Himself.

gohf:
you debunked your head, because it's your imagination you're responding to

This is what I wrote in passing among the words "So is the devil also god or he didn't come from ancient times?"


What does God having no beginning have to do with Jesus you claim is God because you only accept the interpretation of that verse has Jesus came from everlasting.

Wait you would have said God Almighty Creator of the heavens and earth came from everlasting, you will now explain to us what everlasting is that God came from.

God is from everlasting to everlasting, He is the beginning and the end.

God is the Beginning and the End, so is Jesus. This makes God and Jesus the same person.

God is from Everlasting to Everlasting. So is Jesus, according to the verse I quoted in ny OP.

"I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End."

(Revelation 22:13, NIV)

This verse is spoken by Jesus Christ Himself, where He identifies Himself as the Alpha and Omega, the Beginning and the End, emphasizing His eternal nature and divine authority.

gohf:
have you ever communicated with your soul before?

God is not limited by man's limitations.

DaddyCoool:
Where in the Bible does it say God must know absolutely everything every moment?

As I said, my sister, we know God's qualities from studying the scriptures. Most times, not by direct quotes. You know, it's a kind of knowledge that comes through relationship. Studying the scriptures is one way of relating with God.

Here are some scriptures that suggest God's omniscience.

Psalm 139:1-6 (NIV)
1. You have searched me, Lord, and you know me.
2. You know when I sit and when I rise; you perceive my thoughts from afar.
3. You discern my going out and my lying down; you are familiar with all my ways.
4. Before a word is on my tongue you, Lord, know it completely.
5. You hem me in behind and before, and you lay your hand upon me.
6. Such knowledge is too wonderful for me, too lofty for me to attain.

Isaiah 46:9-10 (NIV)
9. Remember the former things, those of long ago; I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like me.
10. I make known the end from the beginning, from ancient times, what is still to come. I say, ‘My purpose will stand, and I will do all that I please.’

1 John 3:20 (NIV)
20. For whenever our hearts condemn us. For God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything.

gohf:
🤣🤣
Don't try and comfort yourself take correction and let the Holy Spirit comfort you

No matter how you want to deceive yourself it is written

Mic.5.4 And he will stand to lead his flock with the LORD's strength, in the majesty of the name of the LORD his God. Then his people will live there undisturbed, for he will be highly honored all around the world. (NLT)
Mic.5.4 And He shall stand and feed His flock In the strength of the LORD, In the majesty of the name of the LORD His God; And they shall abide, For now He shall be great To the ends of the earth; (NKJV)


The scripture was written for even the simple to gain understanding from and for the humble to become wise with.

Why are you confusing yourself? What exactly are you hitting at using this scripture?

DaddyCoool:
You quite welcome. And I appreciate your Christ-like-ness about it. That's what Christianity is all about. NOT some arcane debate as to whether He knew everything. What the heck do we know about the true characteristics of God? Is it not US that decided what should be the qualities of God??

No, we didn't decide what should be the qualities of God. We know of God's qualities from reading about Him in the Scriptures.

gohf:
but it is you that refused to answer my questions and it is you that assumed that because Jesus came from everlasting that he is God, so answer are all things that come from everlasting gods?

It's a simple question, or are you saying nothing else came from everlasting

Because we know that God created the heavens and the earth and let me give you a hand 😊, God called forth light from where?

I didn't see any question that I've not answered. Your question was premises on the devil coming from everlasting which I already debunked.

God is the only person who has no beginning in the entire universe. So what are you questioning again?

gohf:
always together? Yet the Holy Spirit was sent to us?

Do you understand that when John wrote they are one, he didn't mean in the same place nor did he mean they are one person, he was referring to being witnesses that agree together and testify about the same thing without disagreement but in agreement.

My sister, they're the manifestation of the same Person, God. You can't say God knows and Jesus does not know. They're not independent of each other. Just imagine it in the line of your spirit and soul and body.

gohf:
wrong that eimi means present, exist,

Before Abraham was I existed, I was present before Abraham was

John.8.58 Jesus answered, "The truth is, I existed before Abraham was even born!" (NLT)

John.8.58 "Believe me," said Jesus, "I am who I am long before Abraham was anything." (MSB)


But here you are claiming that Jesus was claiming to be God before Abraham


This was the conversation that was occuring
John.8.54 - Jesus answered, "If I am merely boasting about myself, it doesn't count. But it is my Father who says these glorious things about me. You say, 'He is our God,'
John.8.55 - but you do not even know him. I know him. If I said otherwise, I would be as great a liar as you! But it is true--I know him and obey him.
John.8.56 - Your ancestor Abraham rejoiced as he looked forward to my coming. He saw it and was glad."

You did comprehension while in school

This was what Jesus said that brought about the whole Abraham talk

John.8.51 - I assure you, anyone who obeys my teaching will never die!"

And they responded
John.8.52 - The people said, "Now we know you are possessed by a demon. Even Abraham and the prophets died, but you say that those who obey your teaching will never die!
John.8.53 - Are you greater than our father Abraham, who died? Are you greater than the prophets, who died? Who do you think you are?"


Are you greater than Abraham

And Jesus answered I was even before Abraham

The writer(s) of Hebrews who associated Jesus with Melchizedek and not God, wrote that the greater blesses the lesser

Even you don't understand what Jesus said, ask the Holy Spirit to help you

John.8.56 - Your ancestor Abraham rejoiced as he looked forward to my coming. He saw it and was glad."

That verse has the right to be translated as "Before Abraham was, I am." Yes or no? By virtue of Micah 5:2, Jesus was I'm existence at a time in past with no beginning.

Nachmonides:
It's difficult (not impossible) to comprehend the idea of the trinity.

Absolutely correct.

Humans can only understand what they can relate with by experience. God is nothing like what we have ever experienced as humans, so understanding God can be difficult but not impossible. Another problem arises when you come to understand a little about God - you don't have the accurate human vocabulary or grammar to describe Him.

DaddyCoool:
All these long theses and epistles!
Christ simply said He did not know the time, that only the Father knew. Elsewhere He said He only said what the Father TAUGHT him. He never said He already knew everything the Father knew but decided not to know so that the Father would then teach Him!

He knows Everything in the Father and not in Himself.

gohf:
The Greek eimi means I exist and can also be used to mean I was. So you are wrong

All translations, translated it "I am", so you're wrong.

DaddyCoool:
#bolded, WRONG! I corrected you first - before Steep even posted anything on this thread:

https://www.nairaland.com/8308121/ot-verse-strongly-proves-jesus#133568561

Okay, I appreciate your correction.

gohf:
so Jesus is not fully God but a partial some knowing God?

Even when all revelation has been given to him and through him!

The Trinity is fully God in the Father, Son and Holy Spirit because they're always together. They're One.

gohf:
Whether is it Olam or qedem, whether you take it as everlasting or ancient times

My question for you, so Jesus is God because he came from ancient times and from everlasting.

So is the devil also god or he didn't come from ancient times?

Why are you treating Jesus coming from everlasting like it's something different from Jesus coming from God? Where in micah 5 was Jesus referred to as God?

No use story answer me please

The devil had a beginning. He didn't come from everlasting. It's he Bible that said Jesus came from Everlasting. Not me.

DaddyCoool:
What else do you want Him to clarify?
He just explicitly told you, without mincing words, that He did NOT know everything

In Acts 1:7, He clarified but you ignored and decided to maintain your faulty stand. Is that right?

You thought He didn't know everything but after He's clarification, you could see He knows everything as the Father. He is the Word of God and the Wisdom of God, how can He not know? You're mixing clearly defined roles and responsibilities with ability.

DaddyCoool:
Na wa for you o.
What have we been discussing all this time??

Matthew 24:36 New International Version (NIV)
"But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only"

No matter semantic tricks you try, you can't read that and still honestly say the Son was all-knowing at that point. Simple

After He said that, did He clarify the reason?

DaddyCoool:
Meaning?
Christ said simply that he didn't know the date of the second comming, NOT that he could know but chose not to. If he wanted to say that he would have - there was no limit on the number of words he could use!

Quote the scriptures where He said He didn't know.

DaddyCoool:
Ok, since the father is in him when he was crucified was the Father also crucified? Was the Father not in heaven?

Do you want to contrast something physical with something abstract?

DaddyCoool:
Semantics. If someone doesn't know something, he doesn't know it - regardless of whether it is ability or responsibility. If you then go ahead to say the person knows everything, you're being economical with the truth

I disagree with you.

It all lies in whether the person can know it but decides not to know it because as a matter of rule, that knowledge is the responsibility of someone else.

This means the person is not limited by ability. You can't start casting aspersions on Him as being limited in ability just because He decides to abide by the rules of the game.

Jesus is in the Father and the Father is in him. Hence, how is He limited in knowledge?

DaddyCoool:
I think this is clever semantics. I think the simple and honest thing to say is that AT THE POINT Christ was saying he did not know everything, he indeed did not know everything.

Where are the semantics?

Did He not clearly say that the Father has this particular issue in His Power? In His Authority?

Except you're viewing God as humans. That's the only reason you may not understand these concepts.

The knowledge of something can be compartmentalized as far as God is concerned .

Jesus clearly said the Father has that issue in His power - that is within His defined roles as Father. He didn't say the Father knows because only the Father can know. That would then mean Christ cannot know. Christ can know but it's not His responsibility to know. It's the Father's.

DaddyCoool:
I don't think so. Just as the Father can do anything but cannot be the Son - yet God can do anything

No.

We're not talking in terms of ability but responsibility.

Knowing all things is ability. Being the sole knower of a particular matter is responsibility and not ability.

God knows all things but the knowledge of the second coming is the Father's responsibility, not ability.

DaddyCoool:
??

Trinity is singular BTW. See below

Yeah, you are correct. Pardon my English.