₦airaland Forum

desiredhome:
The church is the people, the money the church have is contributions from the members and not for them to live in luxuries while the members can barely eat...

So if for example the church Builts a school from the contribution of the members and at the end, over 70% of the same members cannot attend that school? how has that church now benefited the members, or the society?
Mind you this members are also the society......
Meanwhile that same school can only be accessed by the rich and even the unbelievers/politicians who are not even members of the church.....
Of what use is their schools/hospitals if over 70% of the society can not access?

LOL.. Im a covenant university student and can boldly say that more than 70% of the students there don't come from wealthy homes.

MANY students in that school are under scholarship from guess who? Bishop David Oyedepo.

And please don't add sentiments to things. The school wasn't built for church members. And even if that was so its still you people that will come and criticize him for doing so.

With all the facilities and privileges there (24hr electricity, WiFi, and other maintenance costs) why won't the school be expensive?

And mind you, the school didn't start out as being expensive.. Various factors like growth and inflation (which our gov is to blame for) have influenced the prices overtime.

Why should the pastor be responsible for the people's poverty? Isn't it up to them to work? Abi how will God multiply their money if they are not working to earn something?

The current prosperity you see the bishop live in did not come at once, mind you. He invested the salary he has earned from the church overtime and worked hard in various sectors of the economy to amass the wealth he has today.

So please know the facts before you accuse.

And who told you they don't provide food for those who have nothing to eat? Don't you know that they give employment to all who attend their church who are willing to work?

It's for people with a POVERTY mindset.

Only such people would be willing to go on national TV and do shameful things all just to make money and achieve fame.

chiommy123:
I think the issue some Christians have is their over emphasis on tithe leaving out the most important aspects which is teaching us how to live a faithful Christian life

If you're talking about Oyedepo, that's not true.

LOL.. You really think he stands on the pulpit every Sunday or Wednesday talking about tithe?

You know God holds teachers to a higher standard than followers and they will undergo a stricter judgment.

Most people criticizing Oyedepo have never even attended one of his sermons or don't even attend his church.

Maybe some attended one sermon where he talked about tithe and used that to form their opinion of him.

True they may be some that do such. I don't know of them sha.

Romangalactic:
I bet she will reply & tell u u need a theological degree plus knowledge of Hebrew and Latin before u will know anything abt d bible.

LOL.. You don't need any degree. There are Hebrew dictionaries everywhere to buy, Latin self.

There are commentaries to download for free online.

desiredhome:
Pastors are called by God to preach and save the souls from damnation, what we see today are completely different from what pastoring is .... Today all sorts of people are opening Church for for money..... today church business is all over the places, thus the more there are churches everywhere the more evil are being committed in the society.....
You can't continue in evil for so long.....

Just because some are false doesn't mean all are. Like in America for instance, just because some police men are racist doesn't mean all are.

My point is for those who are prosperous, people make the mistake of ignoring all the good contributions they've made to society and focus solely on their lifestyle and criticism them for it.

They do many things the government is suosed to be doing. Building houses, hospitals, roads, schools, etc.

We should at least cut them some slack knowing that even though we don't agree with certain aspects about them, they've done some things that deserve our gratitude.

ggirl4real:
Everyone should be economically productive, Pastor or not.

Abi does the Bible clearly forbid the Pastor from working and not depend on the members for survival?

I think it's a win-win if the Pastor can work and earn his own money to lessen the financial burdens on the customers, sorry members.

No adult should depend on another adult for survival.

The country is hard. Everyone should hustle.

LOL.. Sorry o.. Oya go and sleep.. E don do..

daddytime:
Hmmm

LOL.. You really think our colonizers wanted us to have religion? Really? Lol..

Christianity coming into Nigeria has nothing to do with colonists. Yes they took advantage of it in enslaving peoples minds, but it came to Nigeria the way it came to Italy, Rome, America, India, etc..

And mind you Christianity is not American in origin. American was once colonised too in case you didn't know.

LOL... Funny guy.

The person you are quoting is the person trying to force people to worship him in his country. Lol

Hathor5:
I am also interested in what qualifies them to claim expertise on the contents of the Bible.

Uhmm... They've read it? And read it over and over? They've gone to seminary? They are anointed to preach? Etcetera..

Besides if not for people's laziness, we are not supposed to be dependent on Pastors the way we are. We all are supposed to know God for ourselves.

If people actually read their Bible's and didn't depend on Pastor's prayers and teachings things would be very different.

tobechi74:
Pastors should publish their financial statement of account for all it's members

A Pastor's personal financial information is no one's right unless he chooses to reveal it himself.

However, the church as a non-profit can be requested to do so by it's partners, members or government.

ggirl4real:
I only have problem with Pastors who do not have any other source of income aside from the church.

I mean, how can you depend on struggling customers, sorry members, to fund the flamboyant lifestyle of your family?

Everybody needs to be economically productive.

Read galatians 6:6 and 1 cor 9:14. Pastors are SUPPOSED to be given money by those they teach.

Those who are taught by Pastors are supposed to WILLINGLY share all good things that they have with them.

The Bible instructs those who preach the gospel to live off it.

Where an issue comes in is where Pastors guilt-trip people into doing so, or motivate them into doing so by promising returns (which is a valid promise according to scripture, but an invalid motivation to give according to scripture).

Why do people focus mostly on one aspect of Nigerian Pastors which is their prosperity and ignore the other aspects of these people?

People criticize them for collecting tithes and offerings ignoring the fact that it not only is a command in the Bible with promises attached and warnings attached also Gal 6:6, 1 Cor 9:14 (among many others) and any serious Christian should live by the Word and also the fact (which these critics fail to mention) that these funds are used for the following:

1. Salaries to Pastors and all other workers within the church. How do you think the Word of the Gospel is spread? How are the cleaners, electricians, etc cared for?
2. Outreaches to various orphanages, prisons, hospitals, etc.
3. Maintenance of church facilities.
4. Provision of food to those who have nothing to eat.

Why not be thankful to the likes of Bishop David Oyedepo for the fact that his churches and schools have created massive employment (both passive and active) to lots and lots of people (which our government has failed to do).

Why not be thankful for all the agberos, robbers, cultists, rapists, that these churches have taken off the streets? These people have been rehabilitated and are being used to impact society. I have heard some testimonies of drug dealers, cultists, etc whose lives have been transformed by the Gospel and are now useful to society.

What about the hope that the churches have provide to people all around the country? Whether you believe in God or not is not the issue here, but we all need a reason to go on, we all need hope and that is the one thing the Gospel represents.

What about the various miracles, bondages broken, experienced by the churchgoers? Of course those of you who don't believe in such may call them "audio miracles" but that doesn't take away the joy and hope gotten by those who testify of such. I have seen people healed of HIV, blindness, delivered from bondage to pornography, healed from cancer, raised from the dead, etc. (I personally once prayed for a lady who wasn't having her period. Immediately after I prayed for her she started having menstrual cramps and by the time she got back to her hostel she had her period)

Most of you people criticizing these Pastors are no better than them, of course. After all as Jesus said, let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

You comfortably insult these Pastors while hiding being your mobile devices. Is it because we don't know you? Are you any better than them? What have you given to society on such a large scale as them? Is it because we don't know about the money you may have stolen in the past, or the girl you raped, or the person you killed, or the home you've broken, or the frauds you've carried out, or the money you've stolen from your company, or whatever dirty laundry you may have?

Yes I get that there are many false teachers, which the Bible warns against severally in both testaments. But just because some of them are like that is not a reasonable premise to judge all of them as being like that.

And by the way, many of you critics don't even do so based on solid facts and evidence, but simply based on a "feel among" mentality. You just criticize them because others are doing so.

Most of the privates jets you see them use are gifts from people.

And please don't tell me you ACTUALLY believe that David Oyedepo survives on church money? I can't speak for the rest but I know David Oyedepo has FAR passed the level of surviving on tithes and offerings.

You don't know the whole story, so please don't be so quick to judge.

Thanks for reading.

oluwarichie:
Nigeria holds the biggest churches in the world, the richest pastors in the world such as Oyedepo, Yet we top the list when it comes to poverty.. Please what is Oyedepo doing with 4 private jets? all bought by people tithe and offerings .....In this day and age if you still believe all this so called "Men of God" ... You're completely lost fam ... God Bless Daddy Freeze

That's unfair and biased. You talk about his prosperity and fail to talk about the impact he has made and is making in society.

Three private universities which have brought development to many states around the country.

Various primary and secondary schools which are educating kids and bringing development.

What about the various charity outreaches carried out by the church? The orphanage homes catered for, the hospitals reached out to, the hospitals built?

What about the miracles, the lives transformed, the bondages broken, the hope given to all who attend living faith church?

You criticize them for accepting tithes but fail to mention that there are many workers in the church that need to be paid salary, the buildings need maintenance works done regularly, among other things.

I get that they do some things that you don't agree with but don't let those things be the only things you look at and base your opinion on them off of.

And by the way do you seriously think bishop David relies on tithes and offering for survival? I laugh you.

Alennsar:
Firstly I don't believe the above words. Secondly Jesus is the messenger of God not the son of God.
Thirdly you have to accept and follow the rules of the prophets of God before you can know God

LOL

21void:
I know gay couples who have stayed married for over40 years, if that love is not pure, I don't know what it is.

I didn't say its not love. Yes they may love each other, but the devil has deceived them to think it is right to do what they do, but the foundation of homosexuality is Lust. Believe it or not.

Leonardemma1:
i am still yet to understand how the death of Jesus can actually be called a sacrifice when he knew he was going to resurrect after three days. to my understanding sacrificing means doing away with something valuable often with no expectation of getting it back

You have a little understanding of His Sacrifice. Back then people sacrificed lambs and goats to be made right with God, for Him to forgive their sins. Those animals were mortal, and once they died their sacrifice only has power until the person sins again. They could only cover a specific number of people at a time.

But Jesus, being God, was sacrificed for the sins of the whole world. He is immortal, and so His Sacrifice covers more people and is everlasting unlike the former.

So, because of Jesus's sacrifice, people are made right with God forever, forgiven of their sins continuously, and declared rrighteous and justified by Him.

By Love God made all those things available, and it an be yours if you receive it by faith.

Danhumprey:
"......scripture says...." which "scripture"? Oh! Never mind. It's the Jewish scriptures, the Hebrew and Greek scriptures use by Christians. Because of course the Christian scripture is the one true scripture, the one true words of God.

And which God? When you religious folks say "God", perhaps, be specific which of the gods you are referring to. There are so many gods, so it's important to be specific.

But clearly you're referring to the Christian God here. So, let's see. How did you come about your knowledge of this God? How did you get to know about this God? Huh?

Through reading the Bible, eh? A book with questionable origin and authenticity? Or through hearing voices in your head? A clear sign of schizophrenia?

Tell me, how exactly did you come about this God you hold so dear?

Faith is simply the suspension of reason, the suspension of knowledge.

If I begin to point out the numerous logical fallacies that litters your comment, eh!

You got the faith part right. As I matter of fact, I don't have any facts that God Is. I can't go up to heaven and take a selfie with him and bring it to show you.

But scripture says they that come to God must do so with faith (not reason), and He rewards them that continuously seek Him.

Truth be told I choose to believe in this unreasonable God. I choose to put my faith in something above myself cuz that makes life meaningful for me. ..

I don't have all the answers, I'm still growing daily myself, but I choose to believe in Him and trust that He is able to fulfill His Promises.

Danhumprey:
They are telling you "atheism" is the lack of belief in a deity, you're arguing blindly something else.

Atheism is a clear lack of belief in the existence of a deity due to a conspicuous lack of sufficient, empirical, factual proof. How is that difficult for your brain to even grapple?

You mentioned about how we shouldn't try to reason God because of our small brain, but if this deity, who we have been told created us and imbued us with brain, exists, it won't disapprove of us at least making an attempt to reason things out, including it's existence.

It won't have any problem with critical thinking.

If something is real, you won't need to "believe". Instead, you will "know".

1. Atheism is a belief in an opinion that there is no God, so it is a belief anyways.

2. Before you come to the point of knowing something due to undeniable facts, you must first believe in it.

Before you know that a chair can hold you up when you sit on it, you first believe without proof that it can, before what you believe is confirmed by you sitting on the chair. Even if youve seen that same chair holding other people up, you still exercise faith when you want to sit on it, sometimes you do this even without knowing.

3. God doesn't disapprove of you using your brain to reason, after all that's what He gave it for, but depending on your brain all the time, however....

4. Atheism is a wrong concept in itself. Atheism is lack of faith in God's existence, but God from the concept of faith doesn't EXIST, He Is. He's an Everlasting Being that never knew a beginning and will never have an end. So if an atheists say they don't believe that God exists, with the understanding of what the word exist means, they are inversely saying they believe that God Is. So, they are double deceived.

5. God can't be understood by reasoning. You approach Him by faith and then everything begins to make sense without you even reasoning. Our reasoning was supposed to point us to God and from there our heart was supposed to take over, but in the case of atheists the devil has messed up their reasoning which is now pointing them to themselves instead of God.

Danhumprey:
Funny how you consistently used the male gender pronoun "He","Him" when referring to this God.

Pray tell, how exactly did you arrived at the conclusion that this God has a gender? Have you seen this God before to be able to ascertain its gender? Or you're merely parading around what you read in that Christian folklore called Bible where God is addressed as a "He"?

A book written by goat herders, who of course were males, in an attempt at explaining what they didn't understand about how the universe works, about certain phenomenon they struggle to understand.

How did you know that for sure God is a "He"?

God could even be a "She" or even "genderless".

But because man created God in his image, from his delusions, he ascribed human qualities to this God and because the Bible was written and compiled by men, they ascribed the male gender pronoun to God and present him as masculine.


I won't be surprised if you've never actually read the Bible before personally and with an open mind, but instead merely depends on "spiritual conmen" to read and interpret the Bible for you.

God made man in his image and likeness. Man is a spirit being in a body and there is no such thing as gender in the spirit realm. So God is neither man nor woman.

When we refer to ourselves as men and women that only applies to our physical attributes. Our bodies are different. The person inhabiting the first type is called man, but the person in the other type is called woman.

Each spirit possess different attributes of God's personality and this manifests in their bodies. Men possess His hard side (like might) , women possess His softer attribute (like being emotional, being caring)

I believe God did this for the purpose of reproduction. He gave us different bodies with different attributes that could perform different things and He put in us natural desires for each other which is for the purposes of fellowship and reproduction.

Both men and women can be collectively referred to as mankind or man. After all, the body type we know as woman, was gotten from the rib of man.

Man is the first manifestation of His image, because males are referred to as He, so is God. If a woman was the first representation of His image, then God would be referred to as She.

Capisce?

21void:
and how is being in a gay relationship demeaning and abusive? Can you kindly explain?

Gay people claim to love each other, but what they think is love is not love but Lust.

Love is a divine quality. Love is pure. If they understood what love is then they wouldn't be in such a relationship with each other.

If a man claims to love his fellow man then he shouldn't desire to have such a vile relationship with him.

Being gay is unnatural, its evil, there's nothing positive about it.

And that's the truth.

janettee:
Atheism is the lack of belief. I don't appreciate this long epistle man, because you are not making sense.

Nah, atheists believe there is no God. They believe He doesn't exist due to lack to substantial evidence.

Atheism is a belief system, like it or not.

I just want all of you here to know that God Loves you.

I won't try to stoop down to your level and reason out God, because if faith could be reasoned, then it would be science not faith.

Its pointless arguing with atheists.

Scripture says that anybody who comes to God MUST BELIEVE that He Is.

Atheism is the belief that God does not exist. That's very true.

God does not exist, GOD IS. The very fact that you say something exists implies that at some point it didn't. But God always has been. He is eternal. Had no beginning, has no ending.

All these things aren't logical, I totally understand you, but you not believing in Him doesn't mean that He isn't.

God wants us to believe. Our human brain is too small to begin to reason out God.

Judging from all the memes and pictures posted here its obvious that all those atheists had zero understanding of scriptures and they interpreted what is written to suit their skepticism.

The primary purpose of going to church is to fellowship with people of like-minded faith and enjoy God's presence.

So it doesn't matter if they call themselves pentecostal, full gospel, Roman catholic, Anglican, etc.

What matters is that we all understand the founding pillars of the new covenant, which are Love and Faith. John 3:16.

As a believer, your faith should be in God's Love and Ability, not your church or pastor.

Know your Bible for yourself and cultivate your own personal relationship with God so that when one false prophet who you have put your faith in falls your hand you won't come here calling Christianity a scam.

God is not relating to us based on our church, but based on Grace which works through faith.

Merry Sunday!

tunde4top:
Because our God is a just God.
There is what we call "the law of procreation" in Genesis 1 and 2 which states that everything God creates will automatically recreate itself in its likeness. But when Adam and Eve fell and earned the title of a sinner, they automatically subjected all humanity to that likeness based on the law of procreation.


Romans 5:12
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned

John 3:18 whoever believes not is condemned already.

So before we were born, we already earned the title of a sinner and condenmed/judged to perish. Is that fair to you?.

So because our God is a fair and just God. He applied the same principle through Jesus.

Romans 5:19
(Good news translation)
And just as all people were made sinners as the result of the disobedience of one man, in the same way they will all be put right with God as the result of the obedience of the one man.

(New King James version)
For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.

Clear?

Roger! Thanks.

Enjoy your Sunday.

Seetto:
The fact that you see someone committing sins, you shouldn't speak against it so that you will not be termed hypocrite, I think you need serious flogging,
If you died and found yourself in hell fire, Jesus sacrifice on the cross is useless.

Your point?

Seetto:
I am not judging bobrisky, he has already judged himself, I am afraid he became a bad influence to many young people, this your irrational thinking is the reason why things are getting out of hand.

How does my thinking affect bobrisky?

Seetto:
But why will God sacrificed his only son for the sins of mofos the like of bobrisky and many more, by now Jesus will be highly disappointed for God putting him on that filthy cross to be disgracefully stripped unclad with unending floggings and castigation from people whom end up in the act of gay, prostitution, corruption, unending drug addict, rituals, fornication, adultery, homicide, murder, kidnapping, fraud, envy....etc.

God did it because of love, the great love He has for all of us, not because He knew that all will take advantage of it, but because He wills and hopes that all will.

1 Corinthians 13:4-8,13
[4]Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous or boastful or proud
[5]or rude. It does not demand its own way. It is not irritable, and it keeps no record of being wronged.
[6]It does not rejoice about injustice but rejoices whenever the truth wins out.
[7]Love never gives up, never loses faith, is always hopeful, and endures through every circumstance.
[8]Prophecy and speaking in unknown languages and special knowledge will become useless. But love will last forever!
[13]Three things will last forever—faith, hope, and love—and the greatest of these is love.

2 Peter 3:9
[9]The Lord isn’t really being slow about his promise, as some people think. No, he is being patient for your sake. He does not want anyone to be destroyed, but wants everyone to repent

John 3:16
For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life

Romans 5:6-8
[6]When we were utterly helpless, Christ came at just the right time and died for us sinners.
[7]Now, most people would not be willing to die for an upright person, though someone might perhaps be willing to die for a person who is especially good.
[8]But God showed his great love for us by sending Christ to die for us while we were still sinners.

And you judging the likes of bobrisky and co are you innocent? Or don't you know that Jesus died for your sins too? And you are just as unworthy of the blood of Jesus as they all are?

Alennsar:
What kind of love is that

The kind that passes all understanding.

Ephesians 3:19
[19]May you experience the love of Christ, though it is too great to understand fully. Then you will be made complete with all the fullness of life and power that comes from God.

Alennsar:
But why did your god allow his only son to be sacrificed for others sin. I taught the Bible said the father will not bear the burden of his son sins and vice versa.

You: Why did God allow His only son to dies for the world's sins?

Me: Because, Love!

Hallelujah!

unstoppable51:
My heart just warmed up with joy reading this your comment bro. This is indeed the Gospel summed up!

Praise God!