₦airaland Forum

What is progress?

Tsunamis and volcanoes are earth forming processes. They can work on their own, or can be used by us or against us. There was a time lightning was useless to man, there was a time crude oil was useless, a time electric current, nuclear energy, radioactivity had no positives for man. Nothing's wrong with fire if it's under my pot of rice to cook it. But that same fire can destroy a house if not monitored, it can burn my food if chanced. It's about a similar stance with what you call natural disasters. God can use them, and satan can. i understand you don't believe any of them exists. And just like a money spinning gas station can cause a city wide fire if carelessness is introduced, in same vein, sin and corruption introduced on earth have unleashed the 'badside' of 'natural disasters'. It has brought in imperfections like the OP questioned.
"They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: ALL THE FOUNDATIONS OF THE EARTH ARE OUT OF COURSE." (Psalm 82:5).

Noah's flood was not a natural disaster. It was divine judgement that God has promised never to repeat. When the police arrest or chain a convict, it's not assault. If i kill a convicted terrorist, it's murder. If the executioner kills him, its judgement. PERSPECTIVE.
"And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually." (Genesis 6:5).
Noah's flood was a result of man's sin and corruption, it was judgement.
Man was created with dominion and potential to rule his world. He lost that in 'the fall'. The resources on earth are enough to sustain us all, plus we are not limited to earth. Man's thinking of going to live in the moon, God already has plans for us to come live with Him.

A man with an experience is not at the mercy of the man with an argument. Why does 'sleep paralysis' flee at the mention of the wonderful name of Jesus?

A fool is a fool imho, the fool has said there is no God.

8e). It's taught by many that we can now give tithes to ourselves. We no longer have to go to Jerusalem(the city God has chosen) to give the tribe of Levi or house of Aaron. We are now all qualified priesthood and kings under the new covenant. Christ has qualified us, you don't have to be a first born or a Jew, in Christ Jesus, we are all kings and priests. This of course does not erase order in the body of Christ, neither does it neglect spiritual leadership.
We are to remember them that have the rule over us and obey them. And submit ourselves so that they can do the work with joy. ibelieve that's in the Bible somewhere. We are to communicate to them in all good things, and by God, tithe is a v.very good thing.
"Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel." (1 Corinthians 9:14).
Check out our duty below,
"It hath pleased them verily; and their debtors they are. For if the Gentiles have been made partakers of their spiritual things, their duty is also to minister unto them in carnal things." (Romans 15:27).
"If we have sown unto you spiritual things, IS IT A GREAT THING if we shall reap your carnal things?" (1 Corinthians 9:11).
To tithe givers, it's not a big deal, and as i've said, nobody is going to hell for giving abi na paying tithes whether as money, animal or spoils of war.

Some things are simply more needful than others. Sin has grade, works have grade, faith has grade, tithes iwouldsay has grade.
8d). Levi paid tithes in Abraham, how would you say Levi never paid tithes? It's not recorded whether Melchisedek paid tithes, i would not say he never paid tithes or that he paid tithes. I'll stay where the Bible left it, Melchisedec received tithes of Abraham. We're not priests in the same way or kings in the same way that Jesus is or that Melchisedec was. Our own kingship does not receive worship, but instead gives worship to the King of glory. Our priesthood offers up spiritual sacrifices to God by Jesus Christ. Christ our high priest lives and receives our tithes. We're priests in the sense that we can now offer sacrifices to God without the use of an intermediary human priest as obtained in the OT. The vail has been rent. The principle of sustaining the clergy remains, and it's wisdom profitable to direct, to understand our responsibilities instead of shelving them under titles.

8c). Which of the tithe is actively practiced and encouraged in the Bible? Definitely, the temple tithe takes priority. Once you understand the principles and Spirit behind the commands of God, you'd have less problem. It's like the burden the Jews forever have with the Sabbath day. We (most of us) worship on Sunday instead. Most of us buy and sell, travel, work on any day of the week. It's due to the understanding of the Spirit of the Sabbath. We can on the other hand be under the letter and law of the Sabbath. What's the purpose of giving a tenth to the God? It is to consistently take care of God's workers that serve in the tabernacle. What's the purpose of taking another tenth and sharing it with others? It is to inculcate a sharing spirit, generosity. As long as generosity and the spirit of sharing is encouraged, it's very fine. It's hard to see people faithful to the number 1 tithe, people would even evade tax if possible. To ask or request an additional tenth, making 20% of all the congregation(to me) may be quite tasking. Not everyone loves to give. We encourage others to give. i see pastors teach giving, sowing, charity all the time.

When you give your body to God, you make it holy unto God (Romans 12v1,2).
8b). You're free to follow Abraham's example of tithing if you choose. The mainpoint though from abraham's tithe is that tithe is a practice that precedes the law or levitical priesthood. Numbers 31 was so particular it didn't even apply for the same Israel in their subsequent wars. There were wars they were told to destroy everything and take nothing. It's shameful of you to pick it and call it the law. You've cherry picked again. There are lessons to learn from the passage if you want us to delve into that, but it's not in anyway an all time law even for the Israelites. It's not even an individual increase. The soldiers took it as individual and brought ALL 100%. But Moses and co divided it amongst everybody as commanded by God.

@Goshen
At last, i thought you had 'run away'.
8a). Yes, the would have been holy tithes(whatever that means, antitithers and their vocab sha). It may be more helpful though if you read the whole chapter i.e verses 1-24. Holy is not exactly some mystery, holy basically means sacred or separate. Whatever you seperate is holy,
For example, before you go excuse say i no put Bible verse.
"And WHEN A MAN SHALL SANCTIFY HIS HOUSE TO BE holy unto the LORD, then the priest shall estimate it, whether it be good or bad: as the priest shall estimate it, so shall it stand." (Leviticus 27:14).
You see, a man can decide to make his built house holy UNTO THE LORD. It simply means it's dedicated, given to God. i make my money holy unto the LORD all the time.

BERNIMOORE: @image123
you see, the joy of these is that 'the scriptures states' what people dont like to hear,below (bolded);

Repetition of vacuous points would not cut it for christians that are not tossed by every wind of doctrine. Winds like continually stating [size=14pt]that everything associated with the law has been done away with[/size],

it has been pened down for more than 2000 yrs ago in sacred scriptures,its not me or anyone exercising 'faith' that wrote it, at least for emphasis sake read it from your own bible again there with you,

Galatians 3:19,24.

19 Why, Then, Was The Law Given At All? It Was Added Because Of Transgressions Until The Seed To Whom The Promise Referred Had Come. The Law Was Given Through Angels And Entrusted To A Mediator.

24 So The Law Was Our Guardian Until Christ Came That We Might Be Justified By Faith.

[size=14pt]Colossians 2:14,

14 Having Wiped Out The Handwriting Of Requirements That Was Against Us, Which Was Contrary To Us. And He Has Taken It Out Of The Way, Having Nailed It To The Cross.[/size]
it doesn't hurt to read inspired scriptures,of course its obvoius,

so dont personalise it as if it was ones opinion but 'a God breath and inspired written statement of fact.

thanks.

i don't get this your post o, me sef sabi quote Bible o, you just quoted a couple of passages and said thank you.

@Jem1
Today, everything applies to me by God's grace. God blesses my basket and storehouse aplenty. He makes me to lie down in green pastures. You need to take a chill pill and appropriate the Word of God into your life. You can't be talking from both sides of the mouth saying the law has to go and its associates. It's major weightier associates according to the Law-giver are mercy, judgement and faith, not mere tithes. If the Law has been abolished according to you guys, let's do a thorough work of abolishing faith, mercy and judgement the bigger weightier percent, not just abolishing tithe a minor. Are you a bully?

Jem1.
where do you get the idea that the commandment must be kept by following the letter? The pharisees followed the letter and Jesus was continuously correcting that we follow the Spirit, not the letter. Jesus told the Jews "none of YOU keeps the law". What are the holy items you keep talking about? There is no 'holy item' anywhere. What you give to God is holy, holy basically means separate. Stop all this unbiblical mystery about holy items and holy lands. Jesus was talking about scribes, not about farmers. This is what forever debunks assertions that fishermen and co cannot give tithes. The economy was largely agrarian and wealth was measured in agric produce. Today, wealth has surely changed, and there is ABUNDANT grace for tithe payers and givers like me.

Whinings, perhaps if Jesus tarries, and you've suffered needless heartaches, we'll read logicboy was atheist for 30years. It's a hard knock life out there in satan's kingdom.

Righteousness is anything God wants i.e God's standard like we have quality standards, engineering standards. Jesus Christ is righteous.

Enigma: Addendum

I do not know the position of his "church", Deeper Life, on this kind of thing; but it won't be a bad thing if he is asked to step down or "take leave" as a "pastor" ---- even if only temporarily (initially) until the matter is decided.

Well, it sounds good and commendable to step down, but it's not compulsory especially if it is false accusation. Imagine Jesus stepping down because of His various accusers, OR Paul the apostle when everyone was crying that he's not fit to live. ithink it's good to wait for the LAW and investigation to take full course, instead of banking on gossip stories.

Huxley, hmmm. i remember that guy for asking a dozen questions and running away. He came to pass, upcoming atheists should learn from his sorriness.

Repetition of vacuous points would not cut it for christians that are not tossed by every wind of doctrine. Winds like continually stating that everything associated with the law has been done away with, WHEN WE KNOW THAT FAITH, JUDGEMENT AND MERCY ARE THE CORE OF THE LAW. It only goes to show that you don't know what you're doing.
"Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment HOLY, and JUST, and GOOD." (Romans 7:12).

Who is a christian? It's not everybody named Moses or Patience, or born in a particular denomination that is a christian. Let's not confuse issues please.

ithink the point being made by pastorChris(at least he managed to make this one) is that most of our general sicknesses are caused by THE devil, and that God does not want you sick. Most of the passages quoted 'against God' are judgement passages. God can act as a Judge, satan is not a judge, that's the perspective.

Ptolomeus: Excuse me dear friend, but there is nothing to prove ...
1. Incompetent? If created Lucifer and all the legions of demons.
2. Almighty? Of course not! Just remember how Jesus humiliate and kill ...
I do not want to make an endless list of examples ...
There is nothing to prove.

Does this person understand english at all? We're saying the same thing. THERE IS NOTHING TO PROVE, THEY ARE ALL USELESS ATTEMPTS BY THE FRUSTRATED OP.

Goshen360: Oga mi Image123, Mi o ti understand yin ni o. E je ka so ni tiwan tiwan. Nigba te s'ope Abraham le yin n t'ele, Abrahamu nigba to fun Melkizedeki ni idamewa, o da ogun oba sodomu pada, nje eyin na le fun gbogbo owo osu yin fun oluso agutan yin?

Goshen, when you speak in tongues, please be ready to interpret. i believe you should address/read more the post addressed to you instead of this one you go carry. Are you deliberately ignoring this or it's satan? Where is question 8 abi question don finish ni?

Image123: @Goshen,
i hope i don't need to translate what i've said in yoruba? I said Abraham paid tithes of the spoils, possessions of the defeated 5kings and their armies. The 5kings and their armies had possessions, plus the spoils they got from victory over other cities apart from Sodom. Abraham gave Sodom his property, not the property of the 5kings and other defeated kingdoms and their armies. Is this a problem of comprehension or can satan also be at work here. i do hope it's just the first.

BERNIMOORE: @image123

c'mon pls, try and focus on building mature conversation and not insults,its a sign of weakness. an unpurpular way of bullying,even the person you are insulting is not replying you,isn'nt that noteworty,now you jump to the conclution of 'satan at work' when you insults the person? this attitude should not be encouraged.




Abraham gave a tenth sir, not paid a tenth, show us where Abraham was alleged to have 'paid tithe',and lets start the full debate,if you are ready,
thanks

i'm not insulting Goshen, and it's lying to state that he's not replying me. It seems you've not been following the thread, just posting long speeches. Paying tithes and giving tithes is the same thing, it's used interchangeably in scriptures, do we really need all these word jangle? Gosheni, question 8 oh, you don run?(like you'd ask if na you).

[quote author=i.chuka]Jesus saith unto her,"Touch me not;for I am not yet ascended to My Father;but go to my brethren,and say unto them,I ascend unto my Father,and your "Father";and to My God and Your God...Jhn20:17.
Sir, God alone is our FATHER...Period!!!
The intermediary priestly class of Judaism was abolish 2000years ago.[/quote]Stop being stubbornly religious.
"Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?" (James 2:21).

@Goshen,
i hope i don't need to translate what i've said in yoruba? I said Abraham paid tithes of the spoils, possessions of the defeated 5kings and their armies. The 5kings and their armies had possessions, plus the spoils they got from victory over other cities apart from Sodom. Abraham gave Sodom his property, not the property of the 5kings and other defeated kingdoms and their armies. Is this a problem of comprehension or can satan also be at work here. i do hope it's just the first.

Dlyna: Pls what are u saying? Please I am a SHE.

Callot is a possessed and deranged hallot with internet access. That's why it's better to go to a Bible church and see the pastor on issues like these, instead of a forum

ea7: go ahead. Punnonline, im a truth seeker.

Heheheheyayoyo, wetin we no go hear for nl. Truthseeker, what is truth?

punnonline: just get yourself a job so'll u have better things to do.
Your thoughts are yours alone am sure if u had a good job the last thing on your mind would be disputing God you are nothing before him and can never change his person no matter d forums you post this rubbish.

Yeee, no make me loose my decorum hahahaha.

@debo
i like the part where you wrote 'part of'. That's mission accomplished for me. To other issues, in war the winner takes the spoils, they are legally his. Abraham had already purposed to return Lot and Sodom's goods for personal reasons. It's a personal reason, but by usual practice, the victor legally owns the spoil. Go into war history research my dear, i wouldn't spoon feed you on that. The properties of Chedorlaomer, the other kings and their armies were the increase of Abraham. They were his gain, abi na loss you wan call am? That's what he gave tithes of. He did not take a thread not to mention a tenth of Sodom's goods. That's written in english in my Bible o, how don't you still get it.
You may also ask Kunle about supporting priests, he seems to have copied and pasted something about it. He should be of help ihope, else you're on your own o, go research.

Bernimoore.
Your posts are too long, don't let nuclear accuse you of long speeches o! Oops, go ahead, you're not under nuclear's radar. To them, anything anti-tithe is divine and holy.

Anger and impatience, can a man hide fire under his clothes? Nuclear, you have bigger issues than tithes, i tell you as a brother. Don't just always allow the muddy waters to settle, you need to take the mud out of the way by His grace/cross.