₦airaland Forum

Ubenedictus:
personally i hate it when someone shows that he cannot learn. ignorance is not a problem but when a person refuses to learn it is just sad.

in John 16:13-16 , John went on to refer to the Holy Spirit as a HE masculine even though in greek spirit has the neuter gender.

I even went to the trouble of giving you the greek text yet you decided to be stubborn in ignorance and called me a liar over something you clearly do not know.

now try and learn something.

ὅταν δὲ ἔλθῃ ἐκεῖνος, τὸ Πνεῦμα τῆς ἀληθείας, ὁδηγήσει ὑμᾶς εἰς τὴν ἀλήθειαν πᾶσαν· οὐ γὰρ λαλήσει ἀφ’ ἑαυτοῦ, ἀλλ’ ὅσα ἀκούει λαλήσει, καὶ τὰ ἐρχόμενα ἀναγγελεῖ ὑμῖν.

then first word there is ὅταν translated as when, the fourth word there is ἐκεῖνος, and it is translated as He with the masculine gender,

that sentence reads thus:

when however might have come HE the Spirit of truth He will guide you into the truth all....

All that masculine he which i emphasize comes directly from the original Greek, the Holy Spirit is addressed in Masculine third person singular by Jesus himself. And as u can see I am not talking about Paraclete.

Bros, your claim is SPURIOUS..
Does Jesus mean that the finger of God is a person?
Personification abounds in the Bible & in statements of Jesus Christ.

Bros, juxtapose Luke 7:35 & John 16:13, your claim is akin to saying because @ Luke 7:35, Jesus says that "Wisdom is vindicated by all her children" ( Greek feminine pronoun) therefore Wisdom is a person

achorladey:
Here is one below.......

“Keep in mind that Satan does not want you to think clearly or reason things out well. Why? Because propaganda “is likely to be most effective,” says one source, “if people…are discouraged from thinking critically.” (Media and Society in the Twentieth Century.)
(ws17 07 p. 28)

Those with a background knowledge of JW thinking will quickly see why the ellipsis was needed to hide the inconvenient elements of this expert’s findings:

“Therefore, it is likely to be most effective if people do not have access to multiple sources of information and if they are discouraged from thinking critically. Michael Balfour has suggested that the “best touchstone for distinguishing propaganda from science is whether a plurality of sources of information and of interpretations is being discouraged or fostered.” (Media and Society in the Twentieth Century. – page 83)

They picking what will dance to their TUNE and should the need to manipulate is required. They will do it

Ubenedictus:
see as you take put yourself for trouble.

Yes in Greek, Spirit has a neuter gender, but he is the interesting thing, In the new testament particularly in the Johanine text, the MASCULINE gender is used to denote Holy Spirit not the neuter gender.

John 16:13-16

But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. 14 He will glorify me because it is from me that he will receive what he will make known to you. 15 All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will receive from me what he will make known to you.”

so even those spirit has a neuter gender John went out of his way to give him a masculine gender so that someone like you will have no argument to bring.

in Greek this is what was written
ὅταν δὲ ἔλθῃ ἐκεῖνος, τὸ Πνεῦμα τῆς ἀληθείας, ὁδηγήσει ὑμᾶς εἰς τὴν ἀλήθειαν πᾶσαν· οὐ γὰρ λαλήσει ἀφ’ ἑαυτοῦ, ἀλλ’ ὅσα ἀκούει λαλήσει, καὶ τὰ ἐρχόμενα ἀναγγελεῖ ὑμῖν.

shadeyinka:
See how you are confessing like a witch. I didn't ask you any questions: did I?

Tcwork:
Oga each time it was an angel, the bible clear stated it and when it was Jehovah himself, the bible equally stated it

Tcwork:
Oga each time it was an angel, the bible clear stated it and when it was Jehovah himself, the bible equally stated it

Nicenancy:
John 14:8-9
[8]Philip said to Him, “Lord, show us the Father, and it is sufficient for us.”

[9]Jesus said to him, “Have I been with you so long, and yet you have not known Me, Philip? [/b]He who has seen Me has seen the Father; so how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’?

John 20:21 & John 14:9
According to your False claim, if Jesus Christ is the Father, therefore every disciples is Jesus Christ .

John 20:17, our heavenly Father, Jehovah sent His Son, Jesus. In turn Jesus taught us & sent us to continue the preaching work before the end will come" (Matthew 24:14. John 7:16)..

Tcwork:
1kings11.9
Jehovah became furious at Solʹo·mon, because his heart had inclined away from Jehovah the God of Israel,+ who had appeared to him twice
I would love to see how you would explain this. Here no angel is involved. I really want to see how you would explain this

Tcwork:
Please what do you mean by Angels are Elohim?
Each time an angel represented God in the bible, it was clearly stated. When it was Jehovah himself, it was equally stated

Nicenancy:
The Gospel make us understand understand that Jesus Christ is currently seated AT THE RIGHT HAND OF GOD/POWER/THE MAJESTY

See Proof:



Luke 22:69 ESV / 56 helpful votes Helpful Not Helpful
But from now on the Son of Man shall be seated at the right hand of the power of God.”

Romans 8:34
Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died—more than that, who was raised—who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us.

Colossians 3:1
If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God.

Hebrews 12:2
Looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God.

Matthew 26:64
Jesus said to him, “You have said so. But I tell you, from now on you will see the Son of Man seated at the right hand of Power and coming on the clouds of heaven.”

The above plus a host of other verses establish this fact.

My Question again: Is there a smaller throne just beside the THRONE of God on Which Jesus sits in Heaven ? If there is no small throne beside the THRONE of God , then it means Jesus Himself sits on the throne of God. If Jesus sits on the THRONE of God, then Jesus is God Himself!

Let's have your say

DappaD:
Good evening my brother! Thanks to Jehovah we’re still thriving. I trust that you and the family are doing okay as well.

Tcwork:
Do you want me give you a list from the bible of everyone that has seen God in the bible?

Tcwork:
Like I said it is not in doubt that Jacob fought wit a messenger neither is it in doubt that he saw God. Unless u think he was lying or drunk.

Tcwork:
If you want, I would give you a list of many others who saw Jehovah. So if the case of Moses is not so clear to you just let me know so I can give u many other references of men seeing Jehovah

Tcwork:
Since the begin of this thread, I have depended on the scriptures for all my teachings. Not on logic

Tcwork:
Please that was a different time. Moses and the congregation were not privileged to see Jehovah's face everytime but the few times he was seen, it was clearly recorded
Genesis 32.30
30 So Jacob named the place Pe·niʹel,*+ for he said, “I have seen God face-to-face, yet my life* was preserved

Maamin:
You are doing the same thing that you dont want another to do to you

Tcwork:
Please that was a different time. Moses and the congregation were not privileged to see Jehovah's face everytime but the few times he was seen, it was clearly recorded

Tcwork:
How can't the most high God have a father. In fact why shouldn't he have a father? You need to ask basic questions first. What does it mean to be a God? What does it mean to be the most high God

Tcwork:
I really love the simply way you see life. Anyone that does not agree with your line of reasoning is against Christ..
And it's funny than whenever we come up against what we can't explain we end up saying "You can't understand."
Who told you it is about me? This is a forum. Explain yourself. Even if I am so stupid that I can't understand. Someone else would.
Now you are claiming monopoly of understanding, go ahead and let's hear from your immense knowledge. Tell us, did Moses see Jehovah or not
.

Tcwork:
Oga that is the most plain scripture even for a child. Why don't we accept the scriptures without creating human interpretation.
Face to face does not mean an intimate communication it mean face to face.
And how does judges 6.11-22 have to do with this discussion. Gideon saw an angel, that was well documented and Moses saw Jehovah, equally well documented. And please everyone knows the meaning of face to face no need to twist the bible

Tcwork:
Yea the trinity doctrine is not based in scriptures but you don't seem to get it. On the other hand the scriptures teach that Jehovah of the old testament is Jesus Christ

reubenobi:
truely, you are so funny. So Jesus Christ was king in heaven 1914 and Satan came to earth same year? Can you just listen to your self! May God Almighty deliver you and your gb!

KNOWMORE56:
The only thing that makes me know and understand something as original and true is its features and characteristics...

Can/will you please give me the features of your true God?

Let me cross check it, compare and contrast.

Emusan:
Just as your demonic organization distorts People's published works and materials.

Here is the evidence

JW quote from should you believe in Trinity

Justin Martyr, who died about 165 C.E., called the prehuman Jesus a created angel who is "other than the God who made all things." He said that Jesus was inferior to God and "never did anything except what the Creator . . .willed him to do and say."

Provide us with the book where Justin Martyr said the above statement.

Maamin:
Still from that verse 36 of Acts 2 you just quoted did you see where it says God has made that same Jesus , whome you crucified, both Lord and Christ?

Surely God the father(Jehovah) made the son both Lord and Christ (anointed one)

They are not the same entity as you have said in your thread

Tcwork:
Please I would love any of you to address this

shadeyinka:
It seems they just paid part of your alawi. Your saviour (Watchtower Organisation) will not forget your labour of love.

Guilty conscience!

KNOWMORE56:
I still maintain it even in this post you are replying...

If the Son = the Father, and the Father= Jehovah, then, the Son is = Jehovah✓

Emusan:
He said this to your lying face!

"and next time u want to quote the encyclopedia do it in context, quote d full stuff"

Can you imagine, which is the way your demonic organization usually does.



Scripture says:
1. Holy Spirit has MIND
2. Holy Spirit has WILL
3. Holy Spirit KNOWS

Now back to my previous question you stylishly boycotted.

Can you show us a PERSON who doesn't have all these

Lying liar JWs like your father the Devil.



Jononsense the greatest liar after his own father the devil.

Ubenedictus:
my brother,
you are quoting the source half and half, that is my problem with you. if you want to show what the catholic encyclopedia says then at least quote the full thing.


the encyclopedia actually claims that the person of holy Spirit was gradually revealed. In the old testament is was first conceived as the power of God doing what God does and not as a distinct person. The jews always thought of the Holy Spirit as simply God's power not as a distinct person. that is a clear idea from Judaism and they are able to interprete all personification of the Holy Spirit in none literal ways.

In fact the encyclopedia you are quoting presents many ways the Holy Spirit is interpreted in the old testament.
1. As a power affecting man's mind.
2. A morally effective force
3. God's Power.

But the encyclopedia goes on to state that in the teaching and ministry of Jesus, the DEFINITE PERSONALITY of the Holy Spirit is CLEAR and it goes on to say how a gradual revelation of the person of the Holy Spirit has taken place in the bible.

You purposely decided to skip the whole context so you can further your own belief.

The Catholic claim of " gradual revelation in the new testament (portion marked "B" is spurious. Where in your Bible is holy spirit sitting at God's left hand?