₦airaland Forum

Dulcet7:
Questions? Comments? Complaints?

I have a question. Pls how can I attach videos from my laptop to my post? Its for a thread and I want to create a series of posts - 24 videos, each 220Mb. I want it to play directly on the Nairaland page rather than uploading anywhere else. Some forums have media plugins for this but I cant find here. Thanks.

Attaching videos from your laptop . . . hmm, I don't think you can do that as NL does not exactly have the capacity for uploads of that size. I think you'll have to post on youtube first. I will ask the admin for you . . .

Uyi Iredia:
now to more productive stuff >>> what are the mods doing about Search >>> using the function is a bore for the simple reason that >>> search results aren't as concise (especially when I consider Google) >>> why not use Google ? as the search provider for this site *i hope i got the terms right* why  Yahoo ? >>> i ask this since i prefer to use Google to search threads instead of using this site's search !

i await your answers

it is a google search at the bottom (is that your question?), and I just used it to find this old thread as I have actually asked about the search function before . . .

Why Does A Forum Of NL's Status Not Have A Sophisticated Search Function? https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-369934.0.html

mudley:
thanks. still awaiting the unbanning of my original id tho

I'm sorry mudley but your '313' id is on a permanent ban and will remain there for now. Even if you feel you did not deserve a ban before, you certainly more than earned it by your behavior/posts yesterday.

I've asked Mukina to unban the other id. That is the best I can do for you.

no problemo. but you have to caution your e-christian soldiers as well; either they have something tangible to contribute when they stop by my threads or keep it stepping--like i see you advice them. like they say, if you cant take the heat, get out the kitchen. apart from that, im all for according one another mutual respect in here

You do not have to worry about any christians bothering you from now on, you have my personal guarantee. Open your threads and carry on, but make no mistake, if you post any topics that I deem offensive and/or I receive complaints about from other members, I will take action.

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  To all, I have deleted all the posts that have anything to do with personal attacks/insults - take note for the future.

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As a side note, please folks take it easy with the requests on Mukina. She has a life, job, family like the rest of us so you cannot expect she be at your beck and call 24/7. She will get to the questions/complaints when she can. Thanks.

^funny thing is, I didn't even offer him any 'counsel'. I simply told him to trust in God as he searches for the truth.

Read his post again. He is not losing faith in God - he is losing faith in the man-made systematic, business, money-driven operation of 'churches' today. He knows what should be Christ-like and he is seeing a disconnect with how his church operates. As far as I'm concerned this is a fantastic thing.

A "distracted" person? far from it! on the contrary, he's paying enough attention to notice that there is something wrong with naija 'christianity'. And to that, I wish him plenty of "losing of faith".

Oga Jo, please oh, na your thread now. Na you suppose give us orders self  please do contribute.

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and oh Dulcet, I promise I have no ulterior motives. I just like to 'interview' people and understand how others approach a subject that is of great importance to me. You may notice I don't add too much of my own thots - because I am not interested in my own thots. So thanks for your patience!

Dulcet7:
I do not know about these claims. Can you please provide references that show the Bible saying it has an exclusive monopoly on truth? I guess it states it is the Word of God but does it say it (the Bible) is the only one?

My bad, I should've been more clear.
Jesus said no one could get to the father except through Him. That's what I meant by a 'monopoly'. And going by your already expressed understanding on who Jesus is to Joagbaje, I already have an answer. Forgive the redundancy.

The Great Commission:
Mat 28:19  Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
There is nothing here about spreading knowledge of his death and resurrection but rather to teach them to observe the things he commanded (the things he taught us by his own exemplary lifestyle). This is the exact thing I already explained about the nature of the journey of salvation. Or maybe there is something I didn't understand about your question?

Nah you did it good justice Dulcet .

-from your personal understanding, what do you think was the purpose (spiritual/physical) of Jesus dying and resurrecting?
the bible teaches His blood is what washes away sin and that His death was necessary, a propitiation. What are your thoughts?

Jesus never commanded anybody to convert to his religion but rather he taught us to live ~ in a way that pleases God and is in peace and love with men ~ and then commanded us to teach others too. The "religion" in all that Jesus taught was theism just like I advocate and likewise perceive - divine teachings about God, how he relates with us and how he expects us to relate with one another. A careful study of Jesus life can create a profuse spark of salvation in one who desires to live for God. As he himself said I am the way the Truth and the Life; I am the Door. He referred to his eternal identity ~ as the the epitome of love ~ as Sun of God ~ that identity is the final point for anyone on the journey of salvation.

Thanks!
-what is your approach/thoughts/understanding on the relevance of the OT? in regards to us, and in regards to Jesus as well?

Definitely a personified form of evil exists ~ and it is sufficient to call him the devil (as i said previously, words forms and ideas can hardly convey true spiritual meaning but we can manage). Just like perfection of love flows from God towards whoever desires to be filled by it, perfection of wickedness flows from an evil one (who we can call the devil) towards whoever desires [/b]to be refilled by it.

However I do not understand evil to be like the way many people see it. I see evil to be like friction. It is undesirable but NECESSARY because without friction there will be no motion. This is why even Jesus (Buddha too) had to be severely tempted by evil, and he experienced expressions of evil flowing towards him from outside-in, right from Herod's massacre straight to his own crucifixion. [b]My views on evil may be controversial so I think I need to cap it there.

There's no level of controversy this section has not seen sir

 I don't think at the heart of your views, it is that drastically different from others. The bible does teach that persecution, trials (or for you -friction) is necessary to produce the kind of refined people God wants us to be. I am curious though, what is your take on spirits, demons, possession etc . . .

I believe teaching/tenet/belief/practice may be referred to as doctrine and yes I concede it is possible ~ absolutely speaking ~ for a doctrine to be wrong. This is because doctrines are dynamic in nature ~ ever changing ~ and whoever is the pointman of change can manipulate the doctrine to their taste. At that state, the doctrine is not much more different from the heart of that pointman. When I first said doctrines are not right or wrong, I confess I wasn't considering it absolutely.
I believe religious doctrines are of three types:
[list]
[li]the exoteric (commonly known) doctrines on relating with God[/li]
[li]the exoteric doctrines on laws, principles and conduct among men[/li]
[li]the esoteric (hidden) doctrines[/li]
[/list]

In each category it is possible for a man who has been placed in a key position to manipulate the religious adherents into unknowingly satisfying esoteric (secret) doctrines that he believes in by making them engage in some exoteric practices that have been extrapolated - or else to advance some personal vendetta. So the masses move along like pawns in a war front.

Not a problem sir. I knew you were speaking in more general terms and I understood what you meant. Your breakdown explanation is on point and answers more than satisfactorily. Thanks.

I believe the ultimate goal of mankind is to reunite with purpose of walking in love, whether its Christians or Muslims. I have not once read where Jesus condemned a [b]religion or another. Rather he condemned wrong motives and intentions, wrong hearts and deceptive manoeuvres.[/b]

I believe you are right here . . . I think in general, Jesus was not in the business of condemning particular actions, He focused so much on the heart and motives, rather than the ritualistic following of laws. I can think of nothing more liberating than the way Jesus set before us to follow.

AKHOZEM:
What kind of counsel is that. You ask a distracted person to continue in distraction just because her pastor ask her to buy a sermon? You should have ask questions rather . How much is the pamphlet . 50nairra or 100? Are they selling it for the money or to ensure members discipline themselves to study it for their growth. My pastor once mandated all of us leaders to get study bible by force. And we were glad because we were careless . We buy shoes and expensive things without investing in our spiritual life. A good pastor is a coach. Pls avoid dangerous counsel. Paul had books he reads and he encourage Timothy to study. They didn't get those books free. We invest in our growth.

Akhozem, what is your definition of a "distracted person"?

Why are you (and others) so afraid of people asking questions? does not the bible teach us ask questions and test everything? Are you afraid they might actually open their eyes and learn for themselves instead of relying on a "pastor" to teach/tell them what is truth or godly or biblical?

Jesus said "my sheep hear my voice and they obey it". I am not worried about any person "asking questions" or "losing their faith" . . . because it means they are actually searching and thinking for themselves - as opposed to the multitudes of zombies occupying churches these days that think they're going to heaven just because their pastor told them so, and because they 'pay' their 'tithe' and offerings.

mudley:
i said link, not what 24/7 online toba quoted. okay, i admit i did that but quickly deleted the post after realizing my folly, but i was just irked by orwellian "some are equal but some are more equal than others" treatment that was being meted out to me on these forums. posting on NL is not that important to me but being treated unjustly/unfairly is something that really is hard for me to fold my arms and stand for. so, on that, i sincerely apologize
well, you never see me make a fuss out of a ban before. but this particular case was just too glaring to see who the actual perpetrators were and how they were apparently the FAR WORSE culprits in the use of vile and benign language and unwarranted personal insults which we purportedly got banned for only for mr. atheist mudley313 to be handed the harshest punishment

anyways, all that na tory. so can you pls find it in your kind christianly heart to unban my mudley313 id and let by-gones be by-gones? lets not allow what is supposed to be inconsequential internet beefs over religious differences override our affinity to being fellow nigerians or seem more serious than its suppose to be

Okay Mudley.  ____ I'm sure you understand my anger and I appreciate your taking it back. Let me also apologize if my handling of your matter came across as biased and high-handed, that was certainly not my intention at all, and I dare-say is not my track record of moderating in this section.

I will try better to see things from your perspective and I ask you to extend the same respect to others, christians, that you would like them to show you. And furthermore the differences are not 'religious based' as I am buddies with atheists, deists etc here and even ogaga the satanist - we never clash or fight - its all about respecting one another inspite of those differences. You will almost always get harsher treatment because of your track record - that is your own fault and responsibility. Toba, like many other christians here are my good friends, we've been here on NL for years now. I cannot help or apologize for that. I do chastise them off-NL and via private messaging on NL that you or others cannot see, so don't think I let them off the hook when they go wrong.

I will put in request to unban your other ID. But oga if you misstep, the gavel will come down. Rest assured. Thanks.

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Edit: Uyi, I just saw your question. Toba was banned along with yourself and inesqor - your bans were hourly bans which is why he was back 'so quickly'. Bans are given based on the current issue as well as history/past behavior.

Re: I am losing my faith in "christianity".

Poster, I may be the only one on this thread that thinks that this is a great thing for you. Perhaps if you lose this 'christianity', you may find Christ and if you lose this 'religion' you may find God. I encourage you to continue asking questions, God will guide you if you put your trust in Him. Godbless!

ogajim:
My sister this thing tire person no be small[b], The one that got me was the part that we should "pray for long life for prominent Nigerians",[/b] someone needs to explain why to me. Can't we pray for all Nigerians why only the "prominent" ones?

Ehen now . . . he doesn't want the biggest sources of offerings and tithes to be cut off now who be mugu? lol.

So if these predictions don't come true, what would be the excuse? We didn't pray enough?

Dulcet, thank you so much for the reply and sorry I'm just responding. You may not know where this is "really" heading because I honestly have no agenda per se. I will be back to give the proper and full attention those lovely answers deserve. Thanks again sir!

[quote author=isale_gan2 link=topic=582073.msg7511223#msg7511223 date=1294777998]I just posted it because it interests me. The human behavior part of it. Also, the story of he poor taxi driver that was initially described as "a person of interest."

Have you seen the shooter's most recent picture? If you looked up "Crazy" in the dictionary, that's what you expect to see. The earlier pictures of him with the big bouncy "afro" hair is like a totally different person![/quote]I know oh o jare. I hate to sound so cold, especially if his mental disease turns out to be a legitimate one (imho they're usually not).

I just looked up the pictures. You're right, it does look like 2 different people. All this hot political air we've been blowing on this thread . . . the police have not given an official report on what his motives were.

^I hope all this is not the defense setting up for a mental-disorder case which will prevent him from getting the needle.

99% of people who commit crimes obviously have 'mental disorders'.

macIB:
bro whichever ways, your best is still a filthy rag
God just needs you to be good to yourself and neighbours,

Have you done that?

Ouch!!!

^^because as much as the country (and by the country I really mean the media) are trying to whip up a storm now, the truth is incidents like these are very rare - and that's the honest truth.

It's not about equivalence Omofat. The media is trying to make us think there's this sudden wave of politically-motivated violence fueled by our leadership when there just isn't. If there's a greater % of violence, I'm sure its across the board and not restricted to politics - unless I'm wrong.

As long as I have been paying attention to politics, the[b] talk is no more caustic today that 10yrs ago[/b]

the ONLY difference -

[b]is that we're on a 24hr news cycle that bombards us,[/b]information is dissipated quicker and with more frequency, drumming it into our psyches. Such that soundbites from 1999 can be culled out in 2 seconds, amplified and then made to sound more sinister than it actually was.

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And who's dat calling omofat a leftist troll?

^^thank you for the excellent guestimated reply . So I don't end up making the posts/points all disjointed and stuff, I'll let us stay on and finish the salvation/religion part and then move on. I will come back to that post soon.

Dulcet7:
Yes Ma'am. This is my persuasion and belief.
I spoke about religions being akin to means of transportation in the journey of salvation. Each means of transportation has its own risks, merits and demerits but whatever the means you take - there is an experience in which you are allowed to grow (in love towards salvation).

The teachings, tenets, beliefs and practices of each religion are what makes the religion what it is, the same way jet fuel cannot be fed to a horse. In a journey of salvation, imagine A chooses a train, B chooses a jet and C chooses a horse. The jet may be fastest, the train may be slow and the horse-rider may enjoy more scenery and freedom to explore; but if a heavy thunderstorm befalls them - the jet might crash because of visibility, the horse and its rider will be heavily drenched but the rusty old train will plod along safely till the storm clears. In other conditions, another means of transport may seem to be better but it goes to show: no means of transport is perfectly right or perfectly wrong.
I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favor to men of skill; but time and chance happens to them all. - Ecclesiastes 9:11
You may have noticed I love quoting the Bible. I find a lot of wisdom in it.

Very interesting. And I'm glad you like quoting the bible it gives us (including any silent readers) plenty of common ground. And sorry I am just full of questions . . .

-So you believe that they are advantages and disadvantages to every religion. What are your thoughts on the bible's claim to a monopoly on the truth? About the purpose of Jesus' death, and about His great commission to spread His gospel of death and resurrection and convert as many as possible?
    if all religions have merit, why would Jesus command to convert to His "religion"? (I know you're not a christian but please indulge me )

-Do you believe in the existence of a devil? the personifcation of evil? or do you think evil is simply the sin manifested in our wicked actions?

The teachings, tenets, beliefs and practices of each religion are unique to that religion - and they are an integral part of the religion. I will go further to say in my understanding, none of them are right or wrong either. It is their application [/b]by a human being that will tend towards either love (holiness) or wickedness (i.e. sin).

This is because the teachings, tenets, beliefs and practices of a religion are [size=13pt][b]AMPLIFIERS [/size]for that religion. They will simply [b]increase [/b]whatever is already in the man's heart to do within their walk of love or wickedness. In addition, these [b]amplifiers [/b]are often controlled by people in that religion who have chosen to use the common man in that religion as a pawn - if they are not able to discern for themselves. I will not list examples but this is glaring in today's experiences among many major religions ~ perversions of teachings and practices to deploy and finance personal ambitions and political outlooks. The common man is often ignorant of this.
Yes I believe we are born sinful and we walk towards salvation as we grow in love. Man is naturally selfish, greedy and wicked ~ even if he is not taught as a child ~ but sin is part of the plan - it is the starting point ~ and gradually towards salvation, the heart is emptied of all that wickedness and replaced with love.

. . . Application. Amplifiers . . . you're assaulting us with verbs Dulcet lol. There is plenty of meat in what you have said. Thanks.

-Do you think a teaching/tenet/belief/practice of a religion can itself be wrong? and not necessarily be based on how it is applied? If a belief teaches

-Would you say the ultimate goal of ex. christianity is the same as islam? how so?

This, I believe is true. Their hearts can never lead them aright but it is not an irreversible thing (which is why our duty and purpose is to help them in love).

Many people have lost their consciences and the discernments of their hearts. Such ones who have become corrupt are essentially walking in perpetual wickedness and their hearts cannot lead them aright. That will be like the dead candle I illustrated earlier ~ it will need to be lighted by a living flame on another candle.

This very point that you have pointed out is the secondary reason for the walk of salvation ~ you will be compelled to reach out to those walking in perpetual wickedness i.e. inside-out (i.e. they have wrong hearts hardened against conscience and it had colored their lives and actions) or else experiencing wickedness i.e. outside-in (these are they that are victims of an act of wickedness or a lack of love of another human: abandoned widows and orphans with no relative or good neighbour to cater for them; the poor, the hungry or socially disadvantaged; the robbed traveller on the way from Jerusalem to Jericho ~ saved by the Good Samaritan, etc)

I said and quote:
The journey of salvation discovers love for you as you advance, and also compels you to jumpstart a fellow man on his own road to discovery, and to help others who are (ahead or behind you) in this journey of salvation ~ no matter their religion.

I say a big amen to that.

[quote author=omo~fat link=topic=582073.msg7510090#msg7510090 date=1294766733]JS, this is where I take issue with your suggestions. This isn't a "sudden", retrospective judgement agaisnt Palin and the right. Sane people have been warning against this repeatedly. For instance, when the Palin gun sights first came out people complained, the same imagery appeared on the washington post, again people complained, then all the tea party vitriol and the language during the healthcare debate and people complained. I can't count the number of times these people are warned to tone it down whenever they pivoted towards the absurd. Please don't fall for this "the liberals are taking advantage of a tragedy" nonsense.

If you spend 3 years warning about the dangers of playing with matches near a fuel depot, I think you've earned the right to scream your lungs out when the depot then blows up and the innocent workers all die. Meanwhile the silly match box fiddler (1) manages to escape the tragedy and then (2) starts to insinuate that well shebi the other guy there too plays with sticks.

The general point about both sides using inflammatory rhetoric is a red herring. Any time a dem steps out of line, the comments are usually roundly criticized and walked back. Alan Grayson said some pretty rubbish things about his opponent the last time round and Anderson Cooper roundly and robustly called him out on it. Somebody brought up Obama's remarks earlier and the guy apologised for his choice of words and offered up what was a more civil representation of what he meant to say. The republicans simply deny any existence of foul language and huddle up together in their gang formations. Nevermind that Mr Ailes is now urging dialing back on the rhetoric. A republican comes out with silly racist inflammatory jargon and it's all fine because the other guys do it too?[/quote]Call me crazy, but I could almost swear that this is the same allegation Republicans constantly levy against the Dems all the time. Who is right Omofat? Everyone needs to look in the mirror and see the problem.

Like I said to pres, maybe I'm naive or don't pay enough attention, but I don't think either left or right is winning in the category caustic rhetorical language. We tend to see less wrong in the side that we take - and I am learning this of myself too.

It's always one crazy loon; incident after incident and the same apologists come out and say its just one crazy loon. Please tell me the last time in recent history that a republican politician got shot in the head?

I don't want to go down this path . . . but what are the statistics? how many republican political figures have been physically assaulted vs. democrat? I think Tayo touched on this earlier.

Yes there are crazies on both sides but should the leadership be feeding them? - Prez keeps asking how a normal somebody can compare the actions of a dem pollster with a leader in the republican establishment ? - where are the grown ups ?

And this is where I think there is a disconnect. You see a severe problem with republican leadership - because you are liberal/democrat . . . think you not that the opposite is also true? that republicans see a severe problem with words coming from the democratic leadership? There's two sides to every coin.

If all you're saying is all leadership needs to be more responsible with their tongue, then I salute you completely sir. But if you're trying to say this is a trend unique to only the right, then I must rescind my salute oh. Personally I think politics is politics. It will get heated and passions will run high - I personally do not have a problem with tough language - a crosshair is just a cross inside a circle - to rational people. A lunatic will be a lunatic with or without the 'aid' of crosshairs - I believe this not just in regards to politics but also other aspects of life. But I make this concession, that if this is the new climate we live in today, then political leadership should adjust accordingly.

And I agree, pointing at the faults of others does not excuse your own. Saying "well democrats do it too" does not exculpate the republicans - and vice versa. Me my own be say I see all of dem are spewing the same ol' stale kool-aid - donkeys and elephants alike.

dancewith:
@ Poster

Your lawyer and partner are right. you need to come home and seek a spousal visa (or whatever they call it there). You cannot continue to be an illegal forever

Follow your lawyer's advice and all may be well

Goodluck

Yup, absolutely right. Poster, that is really your only option. I'm not sure what the percentage of success is for those who do this but I'm sure its pretty high if you follow through with all the right documents and proof and attitude. Goodluck!

Dulcet7:
Salvation is progressing when the person gets more exempted from wickedness. This does not mean wickedness does not flow [/b]from outside-in, but it doesnt [b]flow [/b]from inside-out. [b]Flow [/b]meaning a consistent and continuous pattern. Outside-in e.g. "bad things" happening in the world to "good people"; "Inside-out" e.g. thoughts, intentions and actions that are not in line with love. Your outside-in experience of wickedness is someone else's inside-out manifestation of wickedness. It is outside-in because it comes from the outside of your heart and attempts to harden your heart against love and become wicked like it.

[b]God's concern is not in the outward actions of people but in their inner world, the impulses that lead to those actions. God's concern is the heart of a man and not his/her religion. It is the impulses coming from inside-out that comprise aspects of his salvation and that is what God wants to know about.

During salvation, wickedness in the heart is continuously replaced by love and there will always be traces of wickedness left but the love will cover it up unless the person deliberately decides to frustrate his own salvation by emphasizing the wickedness. Wickedness is like poison - just a little in a heart filled with love - if emphasized upon - can ruin the entire heart.

May Godbless you for that line!

Dulcet7:
If you recall in school - if you studied or are studying in the sciences - when you write a paper there are "method marks" and there is the final "answer mark"? So in mathematics if you dubbed the answer its easy to know because your method is inconsistent? Also, you may get the wrong final answer [/b]but your [b]methods [/b]will still get you an A?

[b]I believe in religion there is no answer mark. There are only method marks - and these marks are evaluated by the one who set the "exams" - God the creator and original designer - and your salvation is being marked each day of your life - judgment day is every day - and just like how students defend their thesis at the end of their course before a board of professors - someday we will be ready to receive our "degrees" for everything in this life and we will all explain our choices and the reasons why we used whatever methods we used in our walk of salvation.

That's all for now, madam Jesoul. I hope it is sufficient?

Beyond sufficient and so timely for this season for me. I am blessed Dulcet, I hope I don't come across as flattering you, but I honestly do thank you for sharing. You have a real gift with analogies that make very good sense.

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Once you've had the time to address the couple questions above, I'd like to continue on the route Joagbaje started, on the "physical" man of Jesus. I'd like to understand any deficiencies or concern you may have with the literal interpretation of the biblical narrative of Jesus as a man on earth.
Thanks!

Dulcet7:
Religion is like various means of transport to explore a land. Some people have horses, other have trains, planes, cars, others are strolling on foot, some are jogging. When you are travelling to a destination and the destination matters, then speed or transport method will matter. But when you need to explore, you can go slowly or speed thru - your means of transport does not matter - everyone has a chance to enjoy the exploration one way or the other. It is not how fast you get there - in fact there is no "there" to go to in the experience of salvation - it is the experience itself that counts - so this is why I said on another thread that there is no RIGHT religion and there is no WRONG religion. All we have are right hearts and wrong hearts. Compassionate hearts that predominantly love inside out and selfish hearts that are predominantly wicked inside out. Some religions create fanatics out of people and they start focusing on the religion rather than their salvation within [/i]the religion - which is the most paramount thing. One should never allow his or her views on religion to harm another person or distract or destroy their own walk of salvation.

People say - I was born into this religion and they have some wicked doctrines so I dont have a choice, I have to be like them - but this is not true! People are born into Nigeria every day and some of them manage to distinguish themselves worldwide that the world does not see them first as "one of those corrupt Nigerians" but rather as Nigerian citizens worthy of emulation. And if the person is not satsfied, he/she can always nationalize to another country. So you see, salvation is a re-orientation of the soul from focusing on the selfish desires to the loving inner man.

The journey called Salvation means an exemption. Exemption from what? From [i]wickedness. Wickedness is the only form of evil that exists. It manifests in various shades: greed, jealousy, hatred, envy, pride - all boil down to wickedness and the only cure to all of them is love - when applied to the person from inside-out till salvation begins in that person too.

. . . there is no right or wrong religion, there are right or wrong hearts.

^A very heavy statement.

-I'd like to go a little deeper and ask you specifically about the teachings or tenets or beliefs or practices of a religion. In your view, where do these fit in in the big picture?

-And as a side note/question, what is your take on the inherence of sinfulness in man? that we are born sinful.

-Furthermore, the bible teaches that our hearts are deceptive and it is possible for our consciences to become corrupt or be cut off entirely. For people in such predicaments, how can their "heart" lead them aright if it is wrong/corrupt?

Lemme just say that I am thrilled with this discussion.

Dulcet I want to thank you for the time and heart that you've invested so far, as you can see it is already bearing some good fruit. I hope I have not bitten off more than I can chew though

Dulcet7:
My views about the full import of salvation
Salvation is not an event, it is a discovery, an experience that spans time. It is a journey that reunites man with purpose: and this purpose is to jumpstart his fellow man on the road to their own salvation. The journey is a discovery of love - becoming a love filled individual, a true paragon of loving virtue.

Salvation begins with a spark of discovery - of love - then continues into an experience. The "love of God" is a catalyst that makes that experience move along faster from the moment that spark happens.

For some people, that spark is "confessing Jesus as their Lord and Saviour" as Christians do (since it makes them - SOME of them - reflect on true love as a gift from God - and makes them want to apply it to fellow man) but that spark is not enough (even Jesus never mentioned confessing trust in his sacrifice as the final requirement for salvation - besides saying the prerequisite that he would be lifted up like Moses' snake for people's sins - please correct me if I am wrong - he actually said its not all who call him Lord that are his own people) which is why the same Christians are yet told to work out their salvation with fear and trembling.

A Muslim might receive such an enlightenment spark while doing one of his 5 required pillars of faith and suddenly finding out the secret truth that may escape many other Muslims - those pillars are symbolic - and stumbling upon this symbolism he finds a spark of salvation that leads him on a brand new journey - still in Islam - but now on the way to assured salvation.

For an Eastern mystic, it might be a moment of meditation which enlightens them about a duty of love to fellow man.

For others, it might be a neighbor's kind gesture - clothes or food when you were in need - the giver was undergoing salvation and you were in their path to help them get there - it is like using a candle to light another candle - both now have the light but the first one didnt lose anything. Whatever the spark was, from whatever religion, grow the spark and experience the journey of salvation.

I read this quote 3 times. I cannot tell you how much this blesses me at this particular point in my walk. It must have been the spirit that nugded me to reach out to you because this blesses me immensely. Thank you so much.

I do however have questions on the above, but I will get to them in the subsequent posts. . .

Tayo, I haven't had the chance to greet you properly . . . oga Happy New Year oh! I hope our family is fine and doing exceptionally well . Please greet them for me.

[quote author=Tayo-D link=topic=582073.msg7507810#msg7507810 date=1294747559]@topic,

All these depressed Leftists are back! Having received their marching orders from base, they cannot retreat even in the face of logic. Political opportunism has become the order of the day on the Left.

After a highly placed Democrat called for an Oklahoma City bombing (with the consent of Chris Matthews if I may add), we have had such incident as the Major Nidal Hassan rampage in Fort Hood as well as the failed Times Square bombing. If the Right were as desperate and devoid of intellectual honesty as the Left, we would have tied the Democat rhetoric to the incident. I am glad that such base political opportunism is the sole preserve of the Left. Thank God Americans have seen right through them. The process of consigning all of them to the dustbin of history has already begun.

Onwards Conservatives, No Retreat, No Surrender! We shall not Retire, we shall instead Reload and Refire!! No, I did not just say that!! [/quote]ROTFLOL . . . I cannot even laugh again.

Omofat and Prez,

Do you both honestly believe that only the right is guilty of otherwise innucuous catch-phrases and buzz-words that suddenly seem 'vitriolic' when something tragic happens? Only the right employs the use of lingo of this nature?

Please do not reply yes. Because I may be forced to deploy Dr. Dre and his entourage to force feed you both with a strict regimen of concentrated doses of reality.

---

And pres calling Palin a gangsterB . . . no matter how 'offensive' you may find another politics, going personal like that is never justifiable - and this is the what we're seeing in today's political climate. Has Palin ever stolen your lunch money that you insult her on a personal level? You proselytized earlier on this thread on the feverish consumption political controversiality by the country . . . look no further than yourself to see one of its biggest consumers - and victims. I mean, what else would inspire you to call her a bee?

Go to the corner and kneel down.

Ibime:
Shaaarrraaaaaaaaap!!!

Lol. This is why I just adore you 

Perhaps if that Jared guy had access to free mental health, he would not have shot dem people the other day!

Perhaps if that Hitler guy had access to free mental health, he would not have shot all dem people the other holocaust!

What does Jared have to do with the fattest bugger in your country? we're not talking about denying care to people who need it, but rather putting some kind of accountability into place on those who bring it upon themselves. Mental illness is scarcely anywhere close to wanton, self-inflicted, record-setting obesity.

Siddon there with your rolled up newspapers & stale kool-aid

---

On a seperate note, how have you been? I trust you have been making and giving trouble wherever your tent is currently pitched. I would expect nothing less  . Happy new year sir.

ilosiwaju:
I hereby seek your permission to make use of some of your exciting posts and arguments on a website am working on which will also be accompanied by a radio show(website name and show title to be announced later). The website is one that is meant to promote thinking in all ways and not a tool to enhance my point of view.

The idea is not to say(for example) that some people are like this and some like that but rather an opportunity for both sides to present their arguments but not in a reply-me-sharp-sharp like NL. Please hit me up if I have your permission.


If there is another copyright angle to it which I don’t know(perhaps NL policy), now will be a nice time to enlighten me on that as am not a lawyer. Moderators pls?
I don’t mean for religion only, am only dropping this here because some of my favorite writers are here.

Similar requests have been made on other sections apart from religion as well as on other forums am part of. Wherever used, the authors will be fully credited.

I will also be happy to conduct interviews(over the web) for all interested. Some of those interviews will be displayed on the website and some with better audio quality downloadable as free podcasts(at the consent of the voice owners of course).

And oh, it’s a non-profit project.
Again, if interested in writing new articles, they are NOT limited to religion alone.
_{ilosiwaju@ymail.com}
Thanks guys.

Hi Ilosiwaju. I don't think it should be a problem. NL is afterall a "public" forum. Your referencing should be sufficient I think. I'll ask the admin for you.

[quote author=pres-elect link=topic=582073.msg7504650#msg7504650 date=1294697241]Pelosi my 3rd wife   You smoke ganja? Who are the first two? This is vitriolic statement.  I'll sue you for character assasination. That is what you just did.[/quote] no vex now. Correct catch like you, I couldn't assasinate your character with a 10-guage shotgun at point blank range . . . sorry for any imagery that may be offensive here. [/pun intended]

Seriously, I have always criticized the left, when I believe they didn't go left enough.

Lol. This is why I like you. When they didn't go left enough abi? Is there any leftist philosophy that is not a cozy bed-time story for you? ehn Prez? you dey dear me small.

But free speech has made dome talk show guys get crazy. When beck constantly compares Obama to Nazi regime, what do you think it can do to a wacko half educated Jew? But what I can't get is why people live in denial. Palin knows she went overboard. She took down the crosshairs . O'reilly has hardly spoken of abortion since the assasination of Dr Tiller. These people understand that thier words may have led to dire consequences.
This is simple. But everybody on the right seems to be denying it. You are the only righty to "reluctantly accept that palin was a little bit overboard" other righties don't even accept she used horrible communication. Even after she took it down immediately following the shooting. Just like some people still beleive Obama is a m.uslim even after the debacle of Jeremiah right?

Its easy to make statements after the fact Prez. A cross-hairs image is relatively innucuous (esp in politics) until someone gets shot. In hindsight, its in poor taste. If a politician gets run over with a car, ads his opponent had involving riding in cars and driving over bills they want to get rid off will suddenly be in poor taste. Though I admit guns/targets is stronger.

  You have heard me say I disagree with some of Palin's methods and statements in the past - I think she's too divisive though I like her. But I just feel there's a partisan mob wave now to want to hijack this terrible tragedy and ride it all the way to Palin's house in Alaska. I dunno.

---

and btw, I'm not a "righty"

^^  

What! Isale, you mean DR is not a fine boi! you say it ain't so!  

[quote author=pres-elect link=topic=582073.msg7504488#msg7504488 date=1294695440]Jesoul Jesoul Jesoul!!!!!!
When did I say Billy the clown was responsible for the death of the abortion Dr? Jesoul na wa o. (this is part of the vitriol I'm talking about. O'reilly fan can come for me tomorow )[/quote]Well you 'insinuated' it  which is why you suppose talk correct and don't leave the door open for honest misinterpretation jor. Carry go one side jor lol.

funny girl. Who is Dennis Rodman?

You know Michael Jordan? then you should know Rodman now.
Prez, meet Dennis Rodman. Isn't he pwetty?
https://www.asternwarning.com/images/stories/dennis-rodman-hair.jpg

And who is Stern?

This is why when Montelik will be bringing names and quotes from 2006, 2007 you will be saying what You know the names and birthdays of right wing talkers but not left?

do you really think if you get a liberal that says things that may suggest extreme violence I will support the liberal? Or defend him/her? You think I'm one of those right wingers ( one of whom made a silly post in this thread) who can never see anything wrong in goddess Sarah? Have you read me criticize Obama whom I admire? I come down hard on him when I think he's wrong.

I dunno Prez. We tend to see less bad in the things/people we support - and this goes both ways. Some people think Pelosi is Palin - just on the other end. Yet you're ready to make Pelosi your 3rd wife  . Objectivity is hard and takes effort, especially for those of us who believe strongly about one thing or another.