₦airaland Forum

Donmeca:
Me too oooo. @Kobo.

How much is it the bribe dollars?

Per delegate, It's enough to build one extra class room in each Local Government, buy elementary math textbooks and pay a math teacher for one whole year. multiply that by 4999

BTW, 4999 because one delegate collapsed and forfeited his share.

Good job chris.

Slightly off topic wondering, I can't believe Tony Anenih is still alive issuing his usual threats, I thought Oshiomole rid us of that national bully?

^^Haha, I think Aigbofa is MENSA o! I only rep the Irunmoles, I no sabi Mensa smartness.

Good decision on our "sister" from another mother!

Tunmi:
See, you learned that in Uni, I moved when I was in JS3. I am not faulting you for anything. Rather, I fault Nigeria's education system. Students in the States know their rights by secondary school. We were never taught that in secondary school. And apparently, they don't go into that until SS or UNI.

And no, I do by believe anything without crosschecking. So I did lazy research, google alone, but I do have my facts. Also please know that the United States is not populated by the white man alone. And please do not question my love for Nigeria. Studying abroad has been the best thing for me, and I highly recommend learning in a different environment. The US is ideal in that you get to learn about so many cultures and civilizations and apply that to the betterment of Nigeria. So, no, I do not plan to follow in the steps of our past politicians. I would not sell Nigeria, sorry.

And what I learned about Nigeria was not taught to me. My African-American history classes only mentions the kingdoms--Benin and co., and the slave trade. I read books and had go resort to Nigerian forums and news to gain a better understanding of Nigeria. So please do not be so quick to judge.

I do not illiterates as representatives. This is the 21st century. It is a shame that these people cannot read and write in the, fine, government language. These are the people we trust to ensure to create laws for a safe and healthy nation. If we can set the bar so low that an illiterate can gain the position of delegate, then what's the point of an education. I fault PDP for welcoming delegates with no credentials. Illiterates are free to vote in the general election, but there must be a standard in order to become a delegate--a reresentative, of a political party.

There is something extremely cute about your response [I hope you will not read that as sexist] I just find your response heartwarming. Fstranger, abeg no yab our sister again o! I'm no longer interested.

I agree with some of your points,  I disagree with others.

First, I'll offer my perspective on the official language issue:

The Nigerian Constitution in article 55 has English as the Official Language but also mentioned the "Trio" Hausa, Ibo and Yoruba as languages we can conduct Legislative businesses in. My opinion is that the writers of that section were trying to be clever and probably did not want to alienate those who might see the non-inclusion of Native languages as a cop-out. I welcome other perspectives


On illiteracy, voting/democracy and our educational system;

I will caution that we need to define illiteracy before we apply that description to our people;

If you can read and write in Yoruba, but not in English, are you still an "illiterate"?

If you cannot read and write in any language but you can think, farm, raise children, argue and basically apply "wisdom" in your day to day activities (mentally stable) shouldn't you be allowed to vote and decide who your leader should be? even though you are an illiterate?

If this news report is true, then it's a sad commentary on our priorities. Illiterates are not Nigeria's problem, the same way an hillybilly West Virginian miner w/o an high school diploma is not America's problem.

A party delegate does not need to be educated in a western styled school to know the kind of leaders she wants, maybe she joined politics to push a single issue that does not require Western styled literacy( e.g voter information in Oral Yoruba for those who don't want to speak English or embrace Western cultures) We ought to allow that kind of self determination.

Our main problem, in my opinion, is that we have a society that cannot rally around some basic ideals, unlike the days when we were guided by naturally evolved societal norms and rules -good or bad- that were created by us for our own use, what we have now are LEARNED ideals that are more cerebral than they are emotional, I believe we humans need that emotional connection to an ideal, for us to embrace and practice it effectively.


Tunmi, What we currently have is a confused society. A society without a coherent set of ideals that majority can emotionally rally around. We are not sure if we are Africans or Westerners, we are not sure if we like western styled individual liberty or a traditional communal collective system. We are not sure If we like OBJ/Abacha like Strong-arm rulers or self-appointed representative leaders.

We also lack a coherent national identity (I partly blame that on our unfortunate history) due to the humiliating effects of forced amalgamation and forced servitude. Yes we were not enslaved like African Americans but our 1914-1960 ancestors were not exactly treated as equals by their British Lords-. I'm sure that had an effect on our psyche

I think all that confusion contributed to the state we are currently in and probably led some folks to view those who cannot write or read ENGLISH as not worthy enough to vote,  the same way Black-Americans were forced to take literacy tests before voting in Jim Crow law days.

Further thoughts on Education and Language:

We don't emphasise the teaching of civic rights and responsibilities enough in our high schools, of course smart-$ss students like Fstranger will get the little hurried lesson and read up on the rest,

But, from my own experience and in comparison to US schools, I'll argue that we don't emphasise those things too well in Nigeria. I'll also blame it on the lack of a societal emotional connection to those ideas. I welcome other perspectives.

Also, our people are largely ignorant of the rights and liberties guaranteed by our western styled constitution. I blame all that on the stuff I mentioned earlier. As a society, it's hard to teach what we are not emotionally connected to, especially in a foreign language.

Which is why I kinda sympathise with those who want the adoption of our native languages as the language of instruction, while I recognize the difficulties, I still believe we cannot go too far without changing our language of instruction to something more native, more accessible.

G8; France, Britain, USA, Japan, China, Russia, Germany, Canada, Italy -- they all use local languages, I fail to see how we can get there with a borrowed language that is so alien to our culture. So for me, the issue is not English literacy it's way deeper than that.

Eku_bear don join

@bear, I don't think he hates whitey, i think he's just very protective of Nigerian culture, ideas and worldview, fstranger, is that a fair assessment?

^Onisekuse ni bobo Fstranger yii sha

fstranger1:
Roger that!

Hopefully, the conversation ends up in my bedroom

Ashewo! Go on soun!

For some weird reason that is cannot fully explain,  I want the conversation between Fstranger and Tunmi to go on for a long time, 20 pages maybe.

LOL @ GNS class.


*Subscribed*

9ijaMan:
An elected leader will sure;y need a significant amount of popularity if he is to achieve anything, be it positive or negative reforms. GEJ's initial popularity gave him the impetus to continuously loot Nigeria dry. If, I pray he wins, Buhari wins without being popular, he'll not last 6 months as the corrpt politicians will not find it difficult to impeach him out of office.

In order for any president to carry out the kind of reforms needed to transform Nigeria, he certainly has to be popular with the masses, otherwise he'll fail. The alternative is for such a leader to be absolutely authoritarian, which is exactly what may not be possible in a democracy.

I agree. I will blame my "popularity" usage on poor word choice. I was essentially referring to the negative kind of popularity that deifies and props up a leader without allowing room for critical opposition or dissent, not the type they earn due to their insiprational abilities.

Mr Bifani explained that he has committed no offence. He said he has been reading the reports as well and that this is all based on an “old matter” which he’s happy to say has been resolved. He said Professor Ndibe’s passports would be given back to him and that he can assure him that he would not be stopped at the airport anymore or picked up. He went on to say that[b] this whole problem was based on the action of a previous government that have put Professor Ndibe’s name on a list of persons they should be questioning,[/b] but that the present government is not interested in pursuing this

Oyb, you better go and check if your name is on that list

Our gopament don graduate to keeping list of public critics shey?

^^I have to admire your optimism about Buhari, I will still choose him over a GEJ/PDP ticket. But my sentiments are for an ACN/Buhari alliance

The man is not that popular, in my opinion, and chances are that he is more likely to make more enemies than friends, if elected.

Your statement there is heartwarming to me, I do not want a leader we have to worship, Our people are quick to glorify leaders. I hope a lack of massive popularity and a strong opposition will keep Buhari and whoever wins in check. That, I can live with.

oyb:
even more shocking when you consider the fact that 99% of them were born into dirt poor backgrounds

Hmm, Interesting. I will like to read some research into the relationship between poor background and leadership qualities.

You would think a poor background will make one an empathetic leader.

Rousseau, in his book Confessions, wrote about an European princess who when she was told that the peasants had no bread, responded: "Let them eat cake."

At least that was a rich ruler, born into riches, we won't expect her to know how it feels to be poor.

oyb:
nooo. gowon didn't say those words, but some twats in power did david mark if i recall, and some other dude

i'm just highlighting the callousness of the idiots running this country

even more shocking when you consider the fact that 99% of them were born into dirt poor backgrounds

Oh my mistake then. I must have confused him with whoever said;

"Nigerians are not poor because they are not eating out of the dustbin" Umaru Dikko?

Still despicable.

oyb:
telephone is not for the poor

nigerians are not poor as they are not eating out of dustbins

doesn't look like thewilight zone to me

I read Gowon said those words too, SMH,  they never fail to hide their disdain for their own people. Absolutely disgusting.

Kobojunkie:
I am not really interested in knowing who killed Dele Giwa -- not sure why you can't do that all on your own.

I tried, I just can't find the Truth. You know how hard it is to rely on all these Nigerian newspapers and their "out of the world" investigations.

Thanks anyway, I thought you might be able to help  

Kobojunkie:
Well, I think I would like to do my own investigative research to find out if any of the above is even remotely true.

Kobojunkie, You really can do that kind of investigative research on your own? Swell!

Can you also help us find out who really killed Dele Giwa? I will appreciate.

Great. . . I guess after adopting every American fad we can find, from dumb reality TV shows to Cheeseburgers, It will not hurt to add some discontinued Jim Crow laws to our collection.

I hope they will add a grandfather clause in there to exempt loyal Eleweomo-like illiterates.

oyb:
this is the real reason why the shells of this world have so  much confidence, they know our leaders will sell nigeria down the drain when push comes to shove
i'm sure all those who tried to resist were disgraced out of office

i have always seen all this ethics blah blah that company ceos blather as bs

lets hope this story balloons beyond naija

pfizer will end up paying up all that money and more

kudos to next and assuage

Exactly.

Few weeks ago wikileaks revealed Shells opinion about our leaders through their EVP Ann Pickard's comment:

The Ambassador asked what Shell's thoughts were on any
potential for a coup. Pickard answered that there is little
intellectual capital to plan and execute a coup and Shell sees little
potential for one

.

"Little intellectual capital" Although she was talking about military leaders(the children Gowon raised) I'm sure she has the same view of our political leadership. Gowon proved her right here again. SMH

@Kobojunkie, I was young during his regime, I have beef with all of our former military rulers Buhari included, but that is just me. I remember some of what you wrote about, but some of us are not sure he will not have dictatorial tendencies,( I worry same about a strong Ribadu).

I understand Idiagbon was the one behind the disciplinarian policies of that time though, true?

I also worry about his commitment to a secular Nigeria. He's got many people saying he's pro Sharia, i'm not sure about that, I guess you've seen some of the links on here too from Jakumo and co. I Think he has a lot of convincing to do, but I'll pick him over GEJ/PDP.

^^I kinda agree with your thoughts. Let me summarize mine:

I sympathize with a Ribadu ticket, I'm not crazy about ACN as such but I want a stronger opposition than we currently have, I dislike how PDP seems to have so much power and influence and I do not want our political class to be continually united in corruption. So an ACN/ Ribadu ticket might allow for some kind of needed albeit imperfect opposition to the ruling PDP or at least a check on their power and reach.

I'm worried about the new alliances they are forming with disgruntled Former PDP members, but I also realize we can't get perfection in our politics before April. I'm not opposed to an ACN/Buhari alliance BTW.

^^Madam, You are funny still. . . BTW, Do you still support Buhari

Kobojunkie:
I am just going by your post there. . . cause I have seen your comments on other threads . .  this particular one seems targeted more at the man, than your belief there that it is all Psyops of some kind.

What "comments on other threads"

I'm sorry you feel that way about my opinion of the man and his analysis, I thought I presented an explanation for that, but you know I can only try  BTW, I did not say ALL diplomats use Psyops( which is more military that civilian)

I mentioned that I'm wary of American foreign policy experts. I have no way of knowing know if they all use the same methods at all times and in all cases. One instance is enough to make me worry though.

Which other comments Madam?

Kobojunkie:
You are definitely entitled to your opinion fears. Only the more you reveal of these supposed fears, the more I get the feeling this has more to do with John Campbell himself than it is about any/all diplomat(american or otherwise). I am almost tempted to ask what the heck the man did to you personally . . . lol

You are really giving me too much credit if you think I have something to do with Campbell personally, I appreciate the compliment though.

Madam Kobo, you are funny o! 

^^ abi o!

asha 80:
that statement by[b] yakubu gowon sounded like someone steeped in inferiority complex or 'uncle tomisim'.[/b]

Ain't they all? From Shell, oil deals to Pfizer, it is obvious to the discerning observer that we and our leadership suffer from some massive inferiority complex, it forces us to negotiate against the interests of our own people.

Even wild animals tend to defend their own better.

Kobojunkie:
What exactly worries you of his writings and analysis?

I believe I already replied that; He is an America foreign policy analyst whose allegiance goes to the USA, given America's historical interaction with lesser nations I find his analysis and predictions suspect. I do not care if they favor me or not. I'm wary of American foreign policy experts.

Ever heard of Psyops? or the principles of public diplomacy?

These American experts understand the craft of influencing foreign public opinion and they do not shy from it.

Campbell is entitled to his opinion and analysis, opinion his other colleagues like Ambassadors Jeter and Sanders found issues with

http://allafrica.com/stories/201009300275.html Jeter's thoughts on campbell's analysis

Campbell's blog: http://www.cfr.org/publication/23398/nigeria.html

You can read more about Psyops and Public diplomacy in the link below if you so wish, it is an academic website and it contains a wealth of info on declassified official US documents, make some coffee and use the search tool. . .

http://www.gwu.edu/%7Ensarchiv/

I do not know If Campbell is trying to play some Psyops game on us or if he is indeed trying to influence the opinion and actions of the POTUS, Nigerian citizens, stake holders, troublemakers and others. Whatever his intentions are, I'm wary of him and his analysis.

He's entitled to his opinions, I believe I'm entitled to my fears, no?

Kobojunkie:
It would have been nice to get access to the real source of this report. I read the last wikileaks reveal on this. Is there another one on the very same?

According to 234next it's their own investigative reporting, I'm not sure if they got stuff from wikileaks though.

@Eku_bear, yea I can't seem to stop reading that allegation myself, yes it is sickening but, as a follower of Nigerian History I'm not all that amazed.

"Mr. Gowon, who was representing Pfizer which earns over $18 billion annually in profit, worked hard to secure a paltry settlement. He is quoted as telling negotiators that the worth of the life of a child born and bred in Kano cannot be compared to that of a child born and bred in the United States"

^^^^^
SMH

I this report is true, I will have to commend the efforts of 234next's reporters. It will be further evidence that we are our own worst enemies and our leadership deficiency will kill our people faster than an Atomic bomb.

Gowon and Bayero worked for Pfizer
By Nicholas Ibekwe

January 9, 2011 01:23PM

As the opportunity for the victims of the 1996 Pfizer clinical trial in Kano of getting satisfactorily compensated continues to hang in the balance, a NEXT investigation has uncovered the despicable conduct of prominent Nigerians who sold their conscience to partake in what the late President Musa Yar’Adua described as “Pfizer’s blood money”.

In 2007, 11 years after the Trovan trials, the federal government and the Kano State government finally woke up to their responsibility of holding Pfizer accountable for using Nigerian infants as guinea pigs. Two separate suits, civil and criminal, were filed against the company. Pfizer, which had earlier approached a suit filed by the victims with levity, apparently realising the issue was no longer child’s play, decided it was in its best interest to reach a negotiated settlement.

Clandestine negotiations

NEXT investigations show that George Bush, the former president of the United States, sent his Secretary of State, Condoleezza Rice, as well as former diplomat, Thomas Pickering, to establish contact with late president, Umaru Yar’Adua, with a view to reaching a settlement.

Apart from the Kano State and federal government officials, as well as senior Pfizer employees and counsels who made up the committee, NEXT can exclusively reveal that Pfizer also secured the services of prominent Nigerians for what was termed “extensive informal contacts and understandings.”

Commenting on the manner in which Pfizer approached the negotiations, SimmonsCooper Partners, the law firm that acted as external counsel to both governments (Kano State and Federal Government), said “Pfizer adopted tactics that included using political or non-legal initiatives to engage the two Governments involved into accepting its terms.”

In the letter, sent to NEXT by SimmonsCooper Partners, it was stated that Pfizer “employed lobbying tactics, while appearing to also discuss the issue in the context of a legal matter.”

As part of Pfizer’s “lobbying tactics”, it secured the services of a former head of state, Yakubu Gowon, and the Emir of Kano, Ado Bayero (represented by a senior traditional ruler), amongst other unnamed political elites especially in the North who, NEXT discovered, were instrumental to influencing the Kano State government to significantly reduce its claim.

“Meetings were protracted, complex and frustrating, and the negotiating process adopted by Pfizer greatly undermined the committee and government representatives by also reaching out to influential persons that they believed could seal the terms in their favour,” said Simmons Cooper, in a corroboration of what our source told us.

The significance of the influence exerted by Mr. Gowon, the representative of the Emir of Kano, and the other influential Nigerians employed by Pfizer as lobbyists, is better appreciated when one considers the fact that the Kano State claim, which was initially $2 billion dollars, was drastically reduced to $150 million, and finally to $75 million.

Pfizer, in an apparent attempt to justify the role played by politicians and traditional leaders in their getting what is literally a slap on the wrist, had stated through its attorney, in a letter seen by our reporter, that “informal contacts and understandings” are common in multi-faceted negotiations of this nature.

[b]Gowon’s derogatory statements

One of the prominent Nigerians employed by Pfizer, Mr. Gowon, was apparently so determined to get a favourable settlement for Pfizer that he, against what must have been his better judgement, let his tongue loose.

During one of those meetings where terms of settlement were being negotiated, Mr. Gowon, who was representing Pfizer which earns over $18 billion annually in profit, worked hard to secure a paltry settlement. He is quoted as telling negotiators that the worth of the life of a child born and bred in Kano cannot be compared to that of a child born and bred in the United States. This was apparently in response to entreaties that Pfizer should pay the same rate of compensation it would pay had the trial taken place in the United States.

This comment, NEXT gathered, generated deep anger and criticism among those at the meeting and the former head of state, sensing he had overstepped the mark, quickly apologised and begged that the comment not be repeated outside the meeting room. A source present at the meeting, who wants to remain anonymous, confirmed that Mr. Gowon actually made these comments attributed to him.[/b]

Lukman Ishola, counsel to the victims of the Trovan trial, described the role of the Emir of Kano and Mr. Gowon as shameful.

“What Gowon did was like asking Bill Clinton to negotiate on behalf of Al-Qaeda. What Pfizer did in Kano is not short of terrorism, because they had a prior knowledge of the harm the drug is capable of causing, yet they deliberately administered the drug to sick infants,” Mr. Ishola said.

It is not clear how much Messers Gowon and Ado Bayero got paid for working (lobbying on behalf of Pfizer) but our research indicates that lobbyists in America, Pfizer’s home country, make between N1.3 billion ($9 million) and N10.5 billion ($70 million) a year.

However, Pfizer spokesperson, Chris Loder, said in response to our enquiry that “any suggestion that Pfizer has made improper payments to government officials or anyone else is false.”

Mr. Gowon has not responded to an email enquiry we sent to him as at the time we went to press. Our efforts to reach Mr. Bayero for his response to these allegations were also unsuccessful. His secretary insisted he would not talk to our reporter on the phone. He also did not respond to text messages asking if our Kano reporter can visit him to hear his side of the story.

Aondoakaa was involved too

Our investigations further uncover various underhand dealings that led to the final settlement between Pfizer and the government. The multinational drug manufacturer employed both inducement and subtle pressure on political and traditional leaders. Pfizer officials at various times used a Wing Aviation chartered flight to travel from the Murtala Muhammed Airport Lagos to Kano. During those trips, bags which are suspected to have contained money, exchanged hands.

NEXT investigations also reveal that apart from official meetings held in Dubai and London to negotiate a settlement (which we learnt was funded by Kano State government), other clandestine meetings were held in London, where participants were paid handsome honorariums by Pfizer, which, we also gathered, paid all the bills accrued from the trips.

Another person who played a pivotal role in letting Pfizer get away with what is no more than a symbolic settlement was former attorney general, Michael Aondoakaa. Despite his saying that he did not know anything about the settlement, that he was already out of office when the settlement deal was signed, NEXT investigations have categorically found that he was the mastermind of the settlement deal.

“I don’t know about this money you are talking about. I didn’t touch a kobo. The lawyers were dealing with Pfizer directly and the matter was still on when I left office,” Mr. Aondoakaa had told our reporter in a previous interview.

But according to SimmonsCooper Partners, the federal government “is primarily represented by the AGF, and Aandoaka served as the lead counsel on behalf of the federal government. He in fact held meetings with and concluded the discussions with Pfizer for the FGN, in our absence,” the lawyers said.

A family affair

Mr. Aondoakaa, we gathered, invited his cousin, Paul Orhii, now the director general of National Food Drug Administration and Control (NAFDAC), to join the negotiation team, describing him as an “expert” on such matters. Protest by members of the government negotiation team that Mr. Orhii, due to his relative inexperience as a lawyer may not be equipped to handle such a high profile and sensitive case fell on deaf ears, as the former AGF insisted on having him in the team.

Eventually, our sources say, members of the federal government negotiating team were sidelined and Mr. Orhii, together with the former AGF, took charge of talks with Pfizer. A reliable source who was fully in the know about the negotiations told NEXT that Mr. Aondoakaa was so determined to mastermind the proceedings that he stopped consulting counsels to the government when important decisions were made. Our investigation also reveals that Mr. Aondoakaa only sent the final settlement papers to the government lawyers for their signature after the decision on a settlement had been reached.

It is still not clear if Mr. Aondoakaa got any pecuniary benefit in the Pfizer deal, but NEXT did confirm that contrary to what has been set as standard procedure where all parties, Federal lawyers and Kano State lawyers were always present at all negotiations with Pfizer, Mr. Aondoakaa did hold at least one clandestine meeting in Dubai with Pfizer representatives.

It isn’t clear what was discussed at the meeting, but according to our source, it came as quite a shock to government lawyers when they realised the man who had essentially employed them to act on his and government behalf was now holding direct calendestine meetings with Pfizer.

Bello Adoke was not candid

NEXT investigations also reveal the Attorney General of the Federation, Bello Adoke, was less than straight forward when he told our reporter in an interview we did in November last year that the Pfizer settlement had nothing to do with him.

“He (Mr. Aondoakaa) is the person who decided the issues of the case before I came here as the AGF. As for the terms of the settlement, what I am told is that the case was settled under a non-disclosure legal term,” Mr. Adoke had said.

However, our investigation shows that as at the time the negotiations were underway, Mr. Adoke was working for Pfizer. Indeed, he attended every meeting held both in Dubai and London. On one of such meetings held on March 5, 2008 at the office of the AGF, Mr. Adoke was listed alongside Damian Dodo, Anthony Idigbe, Sam Nwakohu, and Ebelechukwu Egeonu as Nigerian counsels to Pfizer. So while he may not have been Attorney General at the time, as a Pfizer lawyer, he was fully conversant with the case.


NEXT WEEK, IN THE THIRD PART OF OUR EXCLUSIVE INVESTIGATIONS INTO THE PFIZER TRIALS, WE EXAMINE THE INFIGHTING BETWEEN LAWYERS TO THE VICTIMS OF THE TROVAN TRIALS AND GOVERNMENT COUNSELS, AND THE IMPACT THIS HAD ON THE CASE

http://234next.com/csp/cms/sites/Next/News/Metro/Crime/5662185-146/gowon_and_bayero_worked_for_pfizer.csp

Kobojunkie:
All he said was that Buhari(possibly he admires the man on some level) is likely to win if we have a free and fair election next year. Nothing really of those we have in leadership now, except the part about free and fair elections.

Yea i agree that was all he said this time. I'm less concerned about his specific comment this time, I made that short statement to "Wittingly" express my wonderings and worry about his writings and analysis over the years.