₦airaland Forum

toba: Im sorry for u. dem go soon ban u for slander

No they wont.

vedaxcool: A simple yes or no would simply answer this question, but in a mind where electricity was invented and a armed robber would have to chant armed robber armed robber for us to be able to rightly identify him would this question be gordian knot to crack. It seems NL atheist really are the intellectually weak or how else can we explain the above phenomenon.

Hey, dont insult all atheists because one made a blunder.

Should I use any mistake that Tbaba made to generalise about NL muslims?


btw please address my latest thread;

https://www.nairaland.com/933858/real-top-5-false-things

AgentBling: It's important to understand issues like this biblically before speaking about it. Just as there Ȋ̝̊̅§ the gift of speaking in tongues, there's also the gift of interpretation. Most times while praying, Ʊ bust into tongues. Satan understands other languages but he doesn't understand tongues. Had like to add that the Gospel Ȋ̝̊̅§ a declaration and Ω̶̣̣̥̇̊oτ̣̣̥ a debate so stop arguing.

You must be on some hallucinogenic

tbaba1234: There is no need for more discussion on the issue....

You see why i say you are not smart... you forgot that each one of them were qualified;

Even the earliest commentaries show the understanding of the scholars.... yet you people seem to want to teach us about our religion without the slightest knowledge of Arabic....

It seems it is Christians and Atheists that tell us what our religion says nowadays....

What ignorance....

Yes, I am not arguing with the qualifications or anything. The translations are clear put them up again for everyone to see. The are cearly translated. I am not teaching you your religion. You and LagosShia know what the translations say, yet you act like they should be ignored.

vedaxcool: At the end I tend to and I believe thaba and lagosshia would agree with this scholarly position, never argue with someone with lower intellect than you or . . . Else you would find it difficult even agreeing on the basic common sense. And funny this just reminds me of OBJ statement when replying IBB, can't recall everything but it goes like this " I was confused on reading Psalms as it reads never argue with a fool lest you become one then the same Psalms says argue with the fool lest he thinks himself wise" in summary can we really say NL isn't just a joint where fools argue buy I guess Psalm saves the day it. NL can also be seen as a place when you argue with fools so they do not think they are wise.

What is wrong in asking to put the translations up? If you are honest you will tell them to do it.

You say that I'm a fool and arguing with me is foolish. Have you forgotten the long argument we had on one of my previous threads, HYPOCRITE!

The Koran is there. Put the English translation of that verse. Put the 5 best scholarly translations and let everyone see the truth. I am not asking anybody to argue. Just put the translation forward.

Joagbaje: It doesn't have to be a known language. It's. A spiritual communication. Speaking ith tongues has to do with speaking to people. But praying in tongues has to do with talking to God. Ask yourself , why Would I need to speak hausa to God ,when he understand. My English. Why don't I just speak english to him. It's only for men we need to speak earthly language. Pentecost experience is for a specific purse just or that day.

You are a liar. The bible clearly shows that speaking in tongues is speaking in another earthly language.

a) In the pentecost, there were witnesses who heard their own language

b) Paul talked about an interpreter who should interprete what the speaking in tongues is saying.


It has to be a known language, according to the bible.


I'm an atheist but this is funny how people are ignorant of their own religion yet the want me to convert back to christianity. Dummies

PAGAN 9JA:
its not exactly that. their concept of the supernatural is very different. they concentrate more on the forces. it may be noticed that most Buddhists also follow the traditional religion of their ethinc group. Eg. Tibentans - Bon, Chinese- Chinese Trad. & Confuionism, Japanese - Shinto, etc.

It is exactly that. Many dont even believe in the supernatural at all. They are only bhuddist or shintoist due to tradition. 64% say that there is no God. End of story.

Martian: Dude, are you an atheist or just an emotional christian that's mad at his god? First you say the bible lies, then you cite a different section of the same bible to prove your point. Do you now believe that adam and eve are historical people? Do you believe cain spoke to "god"??

I am an atheist. I was assuming that you're a christian and so I used your bible to explain the point so that you could understand.


If you're not a christian, the point still holds people already know that it is bad to kill without external influence. Even cannibals do not eat their friends or families, they eat enemies of the society

italo: Don't just make bogus and senseless claims. Where's the proof?

And what about Nigerian scientists?

What about all other scientists around the world? Are they mostly Atheists? If they are, show me proof!

Scientists and atheism in US
http://freethoughtpedia.com/wiki/Percentage_of_atheists#Among_scientists

I hope you know that America is a religious country when it comes to numbers of people who are christian


What is special about Nigerian scientists? Do we even have proper statistic on Nigeria? Abeg sharaap


As for around the world, you must be mad. How easy is it to collect such data?

Martian: I don't have to stretch your words because they are already ridiculous.

Show me one ridiculous statement that I have made or shut up!

italo: Not all "individuals" think killing is bad. So what if I felt that it were right for me to kill you because you are a nuisance, would that be okay? What about someone like Hitler who felt justified in killing the Jews in their millions? Was that okay?



There are families that kill and teach their Children to kill their rivals in business, relationships etc, for example, The Mafia. Would that make it right, for children of such families to kill?



What about those people from communities where they kill seven people as part of the ritual to bury a king? Is it right then, since they learnt it from "environment", "culture"?



Do we not know many governments like The Gaddafi government that encouraged killing of innocent citizens? The Taliban is also another government that legalized killing of innocent people. Do you think such killing is okay, only because its backed by government "law"?



The Bible didn't lie! You lie!.. And I have proved that in this post. Now do you agree that you are wrong on who you say defines what is good and bad? Meaning you cannot know what is good and bad.

My God, you are really foolish! When did I ever imply that any of those 4 levels are perfect? I was explaining how human beings decide what is good and bad. Good and bad evolve over time but certain things are constant.

Do you also know what you did that was foolish? You started attacking each level as if they are not interconnected. It is the interactions within and between these levels that give human being an idea of god and bad.

Not all "individuals" think killing is bad. So what if I felt that it were right for me to kill you because you are a nuisance, would that be okay? What about someone like Hitler who felt justified in killing the Jews in their millions? Was that okay?

Are you saying that there are people who do not know that murder is bad? Are you really that dense? Were Adam and Eve killing their children before the 10 commandments came? Even Cain knew that what he did was bad and that why he denied it when God asked him.




Do you also know what you did that was foolish? You started attacking each level as if they are not interconnected. It is the interactions within and between these levels that give human being an idea of god and bad.

The bible lies. It says that aheists are corrupt and do no good. Everyone knows that atheists can be good and can be bad.

Why are you guys avoiding my new thread;

https://www.nairaland.com/933858/real-top-5-false-things


It is a reply to Tbaba's thread on 5 thins about Islam

tbaba1234: Destroyed who?? Please do not piss me off...

It seems you are not very smart or just very dull...

Why don't you make a comment on this thread? https://www.nairaland.com/932160/husband-condemned-reading-rights-books

You started a thread; where all your points were dismantled.... yet you still talk nonsense...

My only conclusion is that you are either a child or not very smart...

You did not dismantle anything. What did 3 out of 5 translations say? They said beat/strike/hit.


I am not going to comment on that thread because I never said that muslim husbands like to beat their wives. I am debating what is in the Koran.

You and LagosShia can try to sidetrack but I will always remind yo to put the translations up

LagosShia: and i presented to you a link with different views and ideas IN ENGLISH,because the translations you are asking for do not do justice on the topic.



listen my friend.the problem with you is that you do not want to read.or you read half way and stop.i would summarize the points raised in that thread on verse 4:34.but still i advice you to go through that thread and read all the posts.

let me summarize for you on this issue:

the hadiths that are found telling us of "beating lightly" or that the Prophet (sa) hit Aisha or pushed her are not reliable and are reports that are isolated and not widely transmitted or heard of.

the hadiths where the Prophet (sa) and also the Imams of the Ahlul-Bayt (as) discouraged a man hitting his wife are more reliable and in agreement with the morals of the holy Prophet (sa).


the word "darab" can mean different things:to strike,part,hit,separate,e.t.c.there exist a hadith from the Prophet (sa) that says do not strike your wives with your hands but with hunger and na.kedness(i.e. not providing sustenace to the rebellious wife).now this hadith recommends that a man strike his wife using a different mean than violence or the hand.

also,the verse in question does not encourage men to beat their wives even if we take the literal meaning "to beat".the verse said a man should admonish his wife,then separate bed and then "strike" if the woman becomes unchaste.clearly,if you find your woman cheating or being unchaste,the Quran actually restrains you from beating her until after you follow the 2 other steps,if we are to take the verse literally.

also,the context of the verse which seeks reconciliation between husband and wife does not support a literal interpretation because there is no way beating someone can bring reconciliation.another verse of the Quran (2:231) clearly says we should not transgress against our wives.another says God has made mercy between the husband and wife so they co-habit in tranquility.in the light of all these explanations,it only make sense that we do not take a literal interpretation.

Blah, blah, blah.....I am not going to read anymore of your link. I read a whole page of islamic apologetics and critics on a subject that needs no further interpretation.

I will not get into this argument with you. Just put the 5 best translations of that verse. You can try and avoid putting the translations but you only make yourself look decietful.

Kudos to Tbaba, he at least put the translations up in another thread. Are you ashamed of your Koran? Put the translations up, let everybody see how your muslim scholars interpreted the verse

LagosShia: there is no need to put forth any english translation when there is the arabic and i can read it and comprehend it very well.

so please,i am not here to destroy you nor to be destroyed.

i do strongly recommend you read the thread from another forum i presented you with if you are sincerely interested to know the views of muslims and also their ideas-both those who support the literal interpretation of the word "daraba" to mean "beat" and those who oppose it and present other meanings.when you are done reading the 2 pages,tell me what you have gained.i am very sure you will gain alot.you spend much time online.sacrifice an hour to review that thread.it will stand to your benefit.




i will contribute there.but you should have made it part of this present thread.

This is the problem with Islam; NOT EVERYBODY FREAKING SPEAKS ARABIC AND THAT IS WHY I ASKED FOR ENGLISH TRANSLATIONS!

Your link still says the same thing. Some people say it means beat, some are saying it doesnt. Some use a prticular hadith to say that wife bating is a llowed and others say in another hadith, Muhammad didnt agree with the beating of the wife.

I am a strict Koranist because I dont like hearing excuses that "this hadith is fake" or "Shia do not use this hadith". Please, put the 5 translations

LagosShia: the word neither means "hit" nor means "tap lightly".

let me present to you a very beautiful thread from another forum where Muslims discussed verse 4:34 of the Quran in all honesty and all parties put forth their own ideas and thinking.you'd see that 4:34 wrongly referred to as the "verse of beating" does not actually say we should beat or tap our wives.the thread is very beautiful that i have saved it for future reference on verse 4:34.i advice you find time,or take your time and read it from the beginning to the end.the entire thread with steaming ideas and facts is 2 pages!there are many ideas in it that i cannot summarize all of the points raised.so i advice you go through it:

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/index.php?/topic/234979873-wife-beat-verse-434nothing-to-with-beating/

I destroyed Tbaba on this issue already. But I see that you are begging for intellectual punishment as well.


Please put the 5 most respected English translations of that verse to solve this disagreement. Let's see what they say.

I dont want links just pure translations on this thread for everyone to see. Then they can judge.




Err, please take a look at my latest thread on Islam on another different issue
https://www.nairaland.com/933858/real-top-5-false-things

Image123: i just said it man, i don't have it because of Jesus. i've had it before, but never again since God took charge. You still have it though, sorry you, got them filthy devils menstruating all over you.

So, people that have natural problems are having them because they dont have Jesus in their lives?

Thank you, I now know that these people have the devil in their lives;

[img]http://1.bp..com/-madSv-ZNuJY/TyHR6jOno7I/AAAAAAAAAN4/JTvvEook_No/s1600/africa_poverty-383x4801.png[/img]

https://www.thezenapproach.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/insomnia-quotes1.jpg

ckkris: Logicboy,
Its good u haven't taken the deadly irrevocable oaths. Then you're free to seek and receive FREEDOM. WHEN you see the resurrected Christ Jesus, you don't have to take any oaths, but may willingly choose Him, and receive the ENABLENENT to begin to enjoy your education, and whatever righteous resources u possess. And its only Jesus that answers all kinds of questions, patiently, without upbraiding the inquirer. May you be blessed into the glorious liberty of the sons of the Most High God.

You realise that christianity is a cult. A huge cult.

I cant be a hypocrite anymore;


Majaze, shut up and accept that you're wrong. All this contortions you are doing is not helping you. Electricity was not invented. We know the meaning of invented. Stop it!

Just stop abeg. You are not much better than the christians who twist "slave" to mean "bondservant" or the muslims who twist "hit our wife" to "tap lightly"

Deep Sight: @Logicbiy, your reasoning above is just embarrassing to all common sense. Come on. Even if religion does indeed make people si.lly, such rabid anti-religionism as you display, which has led you to a cocktail of some of the most astonishingly ignorant claims ever made on this forum, is just as si.lly.

As I told you before, you really need to calm down.

I am not religious myself, having abandoned religion in my early twenties. I am mid-thirties now and have never looked back. True, I have done my fair share of religion bashing on this forum, but there is much much to learn. It is a path that bears little wisdom in it. I will give you an analogy. What would you think about a person who forms an opinion about a book without reading it? I personally would not countenence such an opinion. I will countenance the opinion of he who has read the book, and better still, he who has read many similar books on similar matters and can therefore compare between views intelligently.

What this means is that your opinion on religion would be on much firmer ground if you take the time to thoroughly study the deepest tenets and traditions of most of the world's major religions. I would like to see you having a grounding in pure buddhism, and the underlying philosophies of the various strands of Hinduism. I would like to see you study the way of Tao, and other such. You would then at first make a distinction which I will not mention here and now, but which we hopefully will discuss one day. When you do these, your rejection of religion, if it remains, will be on even firmer footing.

Alot of people cannot distinguish between the fallacies of some aspects of religion and the pure question of the origin, meaning and purpose of mankind's inner being. I am sorry if I have assumed you have not studied extensively on these matters: but it just does not come across that way. Frankly you sound like an excited new athiest who just discovered athiesm yesterday. This matter is more profound than that dear.

Please take this in good faith.

Tata.

Sharaap there.


Show me one of my embarassing reasonings. Your boy martian likes to stretch my words to ridiculous lenghts. Show me one statement that I have made that you can prove 100% wrong

Calm down, the title is to get your attention! I am just copying Tbaba's style; https://www.nairaland.com/933520/top-five-false-things-about


Okay, so I want to mention 5 things that really affect Islam negatively;

1) Isolationism; I can say that there will NEVER be more muslims than christians in the world with absolute certainty. Islam always put muslims before unbelievers at a cost. I believe muslims can learn something from how American christians operate. If America wants to destroy a muslim leader, they first send their reporters to find negative things about the muslim regime and then use it to gain support from buddhist China (generalisation) and atheist Europe (generalisation). They gather support from other faiths before attacking. Muslims on the other hand, are struggling with dawah. Just look at the other religion section on NL, for every atheist question, there are 20 christians ready to blast you with quotes and explanations from the bible. Everyone needs friends or allies.


2) Arabic langauage; I have tried and given up about learning islam in English. I dont know Arabic and so, learning about Islam is limited. I actually know more about Bhuddism and Judaism because these religions have enough resources in English. Even when you go to an English muslim site, there are quotes in Arabic.
People fear what they do not understand. How is your religion to survive if most people have to stress themselves to understand your religion?

3) Blasphemy laws; This is the best motivation to troll. Being a troll sometimes myself, (Yes, I am not ashamed of my addiction to derailing religious threads, especially christian ones), I can tell you that there is ultimate satisfaction when a religious person whines like a crybaby when their religion is criticized. You can not legislate the internet and free speech (No, hate speech against islam is not free speech). You can not have blasphemy laws to punish people for insulting Allah because;

a) Allah is not a human being. He has no human rights
b) You will have the problem of defining what constitutes an insult against allah; as an atheist, are you going to arrest me for saying "Allah doesnt exist" or arrest christian for saying "Jesus is the ONLY real God"
c) Criticism and asking questions is neccesary for the development of human beings
d) Silencing people with genuine intentions will cause anger and retaliation because they will feel cheated. "Draw Muhammad Day" started because of the banning of the south park episode with Muhammad. In America, comedy doesnt really have much limits and can make fun of anyone.
e) Many countries dont have blasphemy laws and the internet is global. Therefore, your religion can be insulted from another country with the troll protected by his country's law.

However, please note that I support fair criticism and not hate speech aginst muslim. I am not supporting statements like "All muslims are terrorists" or "Muhammed is a rapist" etc I support fair criticism. For example; this is how I trolled my muslim girlfriend- "how do you stop fasting during ramadan if you're in a country that doesnt have sunset because of midnight sun"

4) Sex; I trolled some Saudi's on the train the other day by squeezing my girlfriend. They were horrified at the sexual touching. I did it because they were already giving me nasty looks because they clearly were not happy that an Arab girl is with a black guy (I dont know if they knew I wasnt muslim). The hot slap I received from my girlfriend when we got home was worth it! I got troll satisfaction from the Saudi's horrified and disgusted faces.

Look, I get it. Islam is chaste and has rules on relationships and sex. However, your haraam doesnt apply to me or other atheists/non-muslims. If two people are kissing, why not let them be? Do you know why Thailand and Malta are better than Nigeria? Sex. Sex is power and money. People from US and Europe go to these poor countries to party and have sex. Sex and alcohol boosts economies.

The main point to be taken from number 4 is that sex makes the world go round and non-muslims like me just feel that Islam should chill and be more accepting of our differences on sex/sexuality. The Olympics brings money to host countries. Seriously, look at the olympics, do you think people watch volley ball or gymnastics just for the sports? Does islam approve of the outfits/uniforms;


5) Pigs; Yes, muslims dont eat pork. But does that apply to playing with pig toys? One of my muslim friends (a grown man) said that he didnt like my pig toy (which was given to me by my neice) and didnt want his daughter to play with it. Also, are muslims not allowed to touch pork? There was a story my cousin told me that he didnt like the the way a woman in Burkha (Who was the sales attendant at the counter in the supermarket) packed his items. She threw the pork sausage as quickly as she could into the plastic bag but was cool with the other items.

How can someone hate my pig from "angry birds"?

https://gadgetsin.com/uploads/2010/12/angry_birds_green_pig_plush_toys_1.jpg


So, what do you think?

(please do not go down the route of saying that I am trolling/insulting islam, these are things that affect our everyday lives when muslims and non-muslims interact)

LagosShia: Alhamdulillah!

it is pleasing that for once you have found what you are looking for.



if you read well in my post before this,you will get the idea that Islam can make you a better person when you have the fear of Allah (swt) and do thing accordingly for His sake and not out of fear of punishment or the hope for reward.it is an attitude issue.

also,there are many factors that can make Muslim children do what Muslims are not supposed to do.there is peer pressure.there is the environmental factor.also the upbringing matter.you don't teach Islam to children with the cain like many Muslim children in yoruba-land are taught.you have to teach them Islam through understanding,reasoning and persuasion in order that they do not later on go astray.

i can simply say that Islam can make an impact in your life,when the attitude and will is there.

The problem is that you cant see islam from the eyes of a non-believer. Islam is too strict. A grown man can not be left to regulate himself. Also, islam like other religions, is not fair towards the unbeliever. How is it that muslim women are not meant for me? There are many muslims that are disgusted with my girlfriend that she is moving with an unbeliever. She has to lie that I'm converting

Ptolomeus' English isnt very good. If you take time to analyse what he is saying, he is a smart guy

vedaxcool: ^
Can we likewise say you claiming that electricity was invented is a atheism speaking? And atheism spreads ignorance?

Enough with the electricity and coffee inventions.


Fact remains that Islam has problems with free speech. Infact, christianity and Judaism have problems with free speech too. Islam is just the strictest.

100% agree!

May Oyedepo give me the strength to slap any winch for speaking in tongues!

Martian: So are laws concerning technology/medicine/science the only ones that matter?



People have expertise in different fields so you can't put certain people on a pedestal and say they are the smartest. Some people are adept at managing money/companies, recession or no recession( Buffet ) and some can give you E=MC. Some can give you The general theory of money,interest and employment while some give you the theory of evolution. Saying one is smarter than the other is purely subjective so you can't place scientists on top of the food chain.

Think about this. Which one of your organs is the most important?

Religion makes you stupid end of story

Karl Mark was right on many things about the society.

Religion is really the opium of the masses

Martian: You and your putrid logic.

I wonder who will wrte the laws so the scientists' work can be protected. I wonder who will run the business if the scientists work is put to market. I wonder who will manage the scientists money. Being a smart scientist doesn't mean you cant be clueless about accounting. Vice versa

Nicolas Tesla was one of the smartest scientists who ever lived but he couldn't manage his money to save his life. He invented the radio but hardly saw a penny for it.

Another "smart" scientist who invented the iPod died of cancer that was curable. He would still be alive if he wasn't a Buddhist who believed magical thinking applied to medicine.

You do realise that the lawyers consult the scientist before enacting any law that affects technology/medicine/science, dont you?


Managing money doesnt equal intelligence. Gambling can be an addiction. There are many reasons people can go broke. Heard of recession?


See what religion can do to a smart guy? Steve Jobs was smart but magical thinking destroyed his health.

ckkris: Logicboy,
I perceive a sincere spirit in you. If u haven't already pledged your soul to secret societies, I beg you on my knees, please make sure u don't ever make such a pledge. Then as u seek the truth, u will definitely find Him. And u will be very, very satisfied, and CONTENTED, wherever u are, no matter your status. But please, keep searching, and keep asking questions. Even seemingly hostile, or useless questions.

Secret societies?

Did you hear me mentioning any cult?