₦airaland Forum

If you don't want to learn please stop mentioning my name asking questions when you refuse to quote what you're saying is stupidity!

elated177:
Maxindhouse, there is nothing like "damaging" aspect in the will of our Father in heaven. But, more on that later.

tctrills:
When did Judas become a devil? Was it before or after he betrayed Jesus Christ?

You can continue with your arguments i didn't come here to address you.

When did Peter become Satan? Matthew 16:23

I already told you Judas Iscariot was a good man who allowed Satan to use him but regarding what Jesus said about a devil among his disciples that is what the scriptures foretold which Jesus knew must come to pass!

Hmmmmmmm so what matters to you is how the message got to you shey?

Well in that case you can continue your arguments with those churchgoers who likes arguing aimlessly the truth is nobody was there when God created the heaven or earth yet the books you and i carry says a lot about these things and you never cared to ask if its writers were eyewitnesses!🙂

Explore2xmore:
Explaining how the New Testament was compiled is not the same as proving the compilation itself was divinely authorized or that every included text is infallibly from God. Describing the historical process explains preservation, not automatic divine validation.
That is precisely why the question about it's authority, canonization, and authenticity makes the subjects of discussion here.

What is the evidence that the author of the book is not devil himself?

So if the book is from God it should be able to unite its adherents there is no sense claiming a book is from God when adherents of the book can't cohabit peacefully among themselves.

honesttalk21:
So now the book is the powerful not the one communicating through the book? Please. Without books weren't people gathered before?

God promised a new covenant {Jeremiah 31:31-33} it will be written not in what could be seen rather in the hearts of adherents and the one who is coming to teach people will be called a Wonderful Counselor {Isaiah 9:6} that's why Jesus was saying "you have heard that it was said but now i'm telling you this is what you should do" Matthew 5:21-48

So Jesus knew since he never wrote any book rather taught them through words and actions they needed reminders that's why he told them:

“I still have many things to say to you, but you are not able to bear them now. However, when that one comes, the spirit of the truth, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak of his own initiative, but what he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things to come." John 16;12-13

Surely they are to pen down what Jesus taught them and take it to all the nations! Matthew 28:19-20

That's what brought about a covenant that differ from the first covenant!

Explore2xmore:
Still not getting me, did Jesus hand over a book be it Gospel, new testament or other to people or instruct them to compile/collect one? Where is the proof for that more so that you now say the old testament was for Jacob's descendants then the new covenant for all faithful? Question is aren't a good part of the faithful also descends of Jacob?
Hold on with your references to books in the new testament as it's still being reviewed.

Explore2xmore:
Tell then what is the purpose of the new testament even when Jesus didn't instruct it's collection/production?

The Old Covenant (Old Testament) was meant for Jacob's descendants only but the New Covenant (New Testament) is for all faithful and obedient individuals throughout the world who may decide to become worshipers of the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.
With the New Covenant faithful people from all the nations will form one big and happy family of peace loving worshipers {Isaiah 2:2-4; Micah 4:1-3} and there will be understanding among them {Zephaniah 3:9} but the rest will be blinded by Satan {2Corinthians 4:4} fighting and killing themselves despite claiming they are for the same God! Revelation 6:3-4

Jesus never mentioned any name he is speaking with a view to what prophecies regarding his betrayal said that one of his closest confidants will betray him!

tctrills:
So you mean that when Jesus said, One of you is a devil, he was not being honest?
Are you saying that Judas had not committed the sin yet so Christ was wrong in calling him a devil at that time
Are you saying that Christ should have said, one of you will be a devil?
Is that your point?

dalitigator:
what about those who knew no sin but died. How do you answer that. So, no heaven?

All humans were born with inherited sin {Psalms 51:5} so whoever chose evil is only making his or her chances of survival harder because apart from the inherited sin such ones are complicating issues for themselves.

God didn't create heaven for humans to live it's the abode of spirits so that is where God Himself lives with his spirit sons (angels) Psalms 115:16

People who died due to their sins are in three categories:

RIGHTEOUS: They know God and does His will so God will bring them back as they deserve to live forever. Job 14:13-15

UNRIGHTEOUS: They don't know the true God that is why they can't do His will but they lived by their God's given conscience so God will bring them back to life. Romans 2:14-15

WICKED: They may know God and they may not know Him but they have killed their God's given conscience or rendered it useless so they don't care whether their words or actions affects anyone as long as they have their way it means nothing to them. Such ones will not be remembered during the resurrection of the dead! Psalms 9:17


That's why God's word said there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous {Act 24:15} but as for wicked people they have had all their share in life they are never coming back!🙂

tctrills:
Jesus knew one of the 12 was a devil and He was very good at recognizing a devils.

Through the thoughts and actions not while there is no sin yet!

First of all there is no predestination in evil doing and secondly hell simply means grave everyone who dies goes there and lastly death is the ultimate punishment for sin so at death all the sins of a sinner has been fully paid for by his death there is no punishment after death for previous sins!

dalitigator:
So should they be punished in hell if it was predetermined that some shall surely act in a particular manner even before being birthed?

The damaging aspect of this idea is that the wicked person has been predestined to be wicked so it's God's fault not theirs!😟

dalitigator:
Absolutely true. Even Judas knew before Christ exposed him. Right?

Jesus knew through the words thought and actions not before choosing Judas!

elated177:
Maxindhouse, tctrills is actually right. Yahushua the Messiah knew who was going to betray him from the outset. The Scriptures didn't mince words in that regard.

John 13:21 After he had said this, Yahushua was troubled in spirit and testified, “Very truly I tell you, one of you is going to betray me.”

22 His disciples stared at one another, at a loss to know which of them he meant. 23 One of them, the disciple whom Yahushua loved, was reclining next to him. 24 Simon Peter motioned to this disciple and said, “Ask him which one he means.”

25 Leaning back against Jesus, he asked him, “Lord, who is it?”26 Yahushua answered, “It is the one to whom I will give this piece of bread when I have dipped it in the dish.” Then, dipping the piece of bread, he gave it to Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot. 27 As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into him. So Yahushua told him, “What you are about to do, do quickly.” 28 But no one at the meal understood why Yahushua said this to him. 29 Since Judas had charge of the money, some thought Yahushua was telling him to buy what was needed for the festival, or to give something to the poor. 30 As soon as Judas had taken the bread, he went out. And it was night.

The apostles didn't understand till after the event had taken place.

John wrote this after all the events not before!

tctrills:
But John 6.71 specifically said Jesus was talking of Judas not Peter or the other apostles and at that time, Judas was already a devil.
So let me get you, are you saying that Peter and the rest of the Apostles were also devils?
Remember, Jesus Christ made it clear, one of you is a devil not two not all of you.

Message loud and clear!🙂

Lovelink1991:
Christianity is not for the normal people

It's wise to ascertain before we believe any information {1Thessalonians 5:21} but when you don't know the purpose of such info then it's meaningless trying to raise questions based on what you choose against another.

For instance what is the purpose of the Quran?
What exactly did Allah promise that will be evidence for Muslims to rely upon?

It's hypocritical pointing to small pimples in someone's face when you have huge boils all over your face!😟

Explore2xmore:
Questioning religious texts is reasonable.

Jesus knew very well that one of his closest confidants will play the devil since that is exactly what the scriptures said before him {Psalms 41:9} so he is closely watching them to know who will be the one that's why he could call any of them Satan or devil whenever any of them takes such step.
Judas used to steal from the money box kept with him {John 12:3-6} that is a sign that the man is spiritually sick when it comes to materialism, Peter is spiritually sick when it comes to fear of men and majority of the twelve are sick spiritually when it comes to racism.
So Satan can seize these opportunities to gain control over the heart of anyone but one thing is certain it's one of Jesus' closest confidants that Satan will use since such a person must lead the Pharisees to wherever Jesus will be on the night of his arrest!

tctrills:
Please explain the relationship?
Are you saying that Peter was the devil spoken about in John 6.70?
Please kindly explain how what you've quoted above show that Jesus did not beforehand know that Judas was a devil.

tctrills:
Jesus Christ already answered that.
I choose you but one is a devil. He is telling you that He knew He chose a devil.
It is already figured out.
If Judas became a devil much later, then it would be wrong to say "one of you is a devil"
He would have said,
"One of you will become a devil."

Jesus told Peter:

“Get behind me, Satan!" Matthew 16:23

Was Peter Satan?

What we need to figure out is whether Jesus chose a devil as an apostle or the once friendly disciple allowed Satan to use him!

tctrills:
Where did John state what you are saying.
Instead, he clearly says that Jesus Christ was referring to Judas. Please let's not add to the scripture.
It clearly says,
He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon.
Now, are you saying that Jesus Christ did not know that Judas was a devil?
Remember, Jesus Christ said, one of you is a devil not one of you will be a devil so it's clear that at that time, Judas was already a devil and Jesus Christ could identify him.

honesttalk21:
I think the OP is referring to a book ( Gospel/New testament)

Books are useless if users aren't doing what the book was meant for.
The Bible was meant to help gather peace lovers throughout the earth and make them one big and happy family of peace loving worshipers. Isaiah 2:2-4

So if that has been achieved then there is no need arguing about it's authenticity definitely it's God's word!

tctrills:
Actually, the very next verse confirmed it was Judas He was referring to.
Let's read it.
71 He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.

Here John is telling readers of his gospel that Judas is the one who later fulfilled that part not that Jesus knew the person before choosing him.

tctrills:
Now, what do we learn from this? 2 things.
1. Judas was a devil even before he betrayed Christ.
2. Jesus Christ knew he was a devil prior to choosing him.
Question to you,
From the verses above, when did Judas become a devil?
Was it before or after betraying Christ?

The scriptures teaches us that Satan only seize opportunities when a sinner ignores divine guidance.

It happened to Cain before he killed Abel {Genesis 4:6-7} it happened to Peter who wanted to advise Jesus to go against God's will {Matthew 16:21-23} so Judas wasn't a devil incarnate but allowed Satan to use him due to his love for money! James 1:13-15

tctrills:
Yes I can
Let's begin with Christ early in His ministry telling His apostles that one of them was a devil. John 6.70.
So it's clear that Judas was a devil long before he betrayed Christ and Jesus Christ knew this

Jesus answered them: “I chose you twelve, did I not? Yet one of you is a slanderer.” John 6:70

This hasn't confirmed that it must be Judas Iscariot rather Jesus believes the scriptures that it's one of his closest confidants!

Even the man at peace with me, one whom I trusted, Who was eating my bread, has lifted his heel against me. Psalms 41:9

So while teaching them Judas Iscariot wasn't satisfied with spiritual food {Luke 4:4} that is what led Satan to enter him {Luke 22:3} due to his love for money! 1Timothy 6: 10; Matthew 6:19-21; James 1:13-15

tctrills:
It couldn't have been anyone. Jesus Christ knew who it would be even before choosing him.

Please can you quote this in the Bible?

Are you saying this must happen even if Judas Iscariot wasn't a lover of money?

Jesus knew by the actions and of course reading the thoughts going on in the minds of his followers so it could have been any other close associate of Jesus who loves material things.

SEPARATION!
The man/woman needs to pick her things and stay away from the violent spouse until he/she realizes the value of their marriage so there shouldn't be any extramarital intimacy outside their marriage because the faithful mate will file for a divorce.

DataDoc:
This your freemium ChatGPT. Lol
You need to give it the correct prompt.

No matter what prompt you give it will still tell you that such a thing is against the ethics of the police force globally!

dalitigator:
From your explanation, do you think this was replicated to correct the scenario at the Garden of Eden?

This is what the Bible teach:

When under trial, let no one say: “I am being tried by God.” For with evil things God cannot be tried, nor does he himself try anyone. But each one is tried by being drawn out and enticed by his own desire. Then the desire, when it has become fertile, gives birth to sin; in turn sin, when it has been carried out, brings forth death. James 1:13-15

So the first couple CHOSE to be rebels!

Which religion taught you this?

No be that religion wey dey ment?🙂

CJStarz:
Still, that doesn't make Him a sadist such as He's been portrayed through this hell fire lies. God does not derive joy in people's cry of anguish.

The scriptures didn't mention any name so it could be anyone close to Jesus who can lead the Pharisees to arrest this man whose face they don't know.
Judas put himself in that condition due to his love for money {1Timothy 6:10} he used to manipulate others to keep whatever they get in the purse of their group which is with him and then steal the money for him own personal use. John 12:3-6
This takes us back to what Jesus said about those listening to him:

“Therefore, everyone who hears these sayings of mine and does them will be like a discreet man who built his house on the rock. And the rain poured down and the floods came and the winds blew and lashed against that house, but it did not cave in, for it had been founded on the rock. Furthermore, everyone hearing these sayings of mine and not doing them will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand. And the rain poured down and the floods came and the winds blew and struck against that house, and it caved in, and its collapse was great.” Matthew 7 24-27

Judas failed to keep Jesus' sayings that's why Satan who is seeking anyone to devour could make use of him! 1Peter 5:8

So what happened to Jesus could have been someone else not necessarily Judas and of course only a close associate of Jesus could identify him!🙂

AntiChristian:
Who is the only true God according to Gospel of John where Jesus was alleged to have said:

Now this is eternal life, that they may know You, the only TRUE God, and Jesus Christ, whom You have sent. John 17:3

So who is the only true God herein?

A. Jesus.

B. The father.

C. The Holy spirit.

D. All of the above.

E. None of the above.

What is the greatest commandment?

Jesus answered:

“The first is, ‘Hear, O Israel, Jehovah our God is one Jehovah (YHWH), and you must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind and with your whole strength" Mark 12:29-30

And in the Bible book of Psalms 83:18 we read:

May people know that you, whose name is Jehovah, You alone are the Most High over all the earth.

So apparently Jesus was talking about Jehovah (YHWH) who sent him (Jesus)

Explore2xmore:
Do you prove following by argument or just follow regardless? The point still is who sanctioned the compilation of the new testament? Why when Jesus never asked for it or physical handed over such? Can you trust those that did when Jesus as recorded in this same compilation points at many who will falsely claim coming in his name/commission and aren't?

Honestly nobody cared about books in all the nations of the world in ancient times they naturally believed in the existence of God or Gods therefore if someone now comes with books claiming it's from God or servants of God and it has been widely accepted as truth you can't stand out to challenge such claims with the excuse of who are those behind the compilation of these books. Our ancestors who welcomed both the Bible and Quran never did that, they only submitted out of fear because the pioneers of these religions came with destructive weapons capable of wiping out our ancestors that is the reason why they submitted to these religions otherwise our ancestors have their own religions and their religions never taught them to be evildoers.

So what could be the sound reason for questioning the authenticity of these books?
First of all that should be when there is no more threat to the lives of whoever criticize these books which came about by Americans who declared freedom of speech expression and worship otherwise you dare not question the British who brought the Bible and said it's God's word neither can you question the Fulanis that brought the Quran claiming it's God's word.

So my friend to be honest the questions that should come to mind is:

What betterment these books will bring to our lives as adherents of a new religion?
Weren't our ancestors worshiping God before we know these books?
What good or humane rules are the adherents of these new religions practicing that makes them better than us or our ancestors?

Please questions regarding compilation of these books is another tactic to stop you from asking the more important questions so it's coming from the same oppressors who doesn't want you to think in the right direction!😟

It's false religions claiming Christians that attacks other religions who aren't using the same scriptures with them in true Christianity we only set matters straight with those who claims they are following what our book says as for any other religion that's not using our book we have no business with them.

To illustrate imagine someone claiming he has a father and describing his own father please will you start arguing with him?

Of course not!

Because he is talking about his own dad not yours but what if someone who lives in your dad's house claiming your brother starts talking about the old man who lives in your own house and saying that's his own father but then saying the opposite thing about your old man surely you will tell him he is wrong.

So what concerns Christians with your Quran or prophets since you have your own book?🙂

honesttalk21:
What is your point with this and why take on what they will never agree openly as truth? It isn't best embarking on challenges that encourage their ill conceived mischievous attacks on Islam.

Explore2xmore:
But scholars like Bart Ehrman repeatedly point out that abundance does not mean purity.

Purity is measured by the fulfillment of prophecies.
Whatever anyone says shouldn't be the yardstick but visibility.
So when we see hundreds of thousands of different religions claiming they believe in God/Jesus/Allah/Quran what any wise individual should focus on is not how sound their arguments are but what their faith has achieved so far!🙂

Of course all dead people whether good or evil are all in HELL (GRAVE)🙂