₦airaland Forum

tctrills:
oga please read. A thousand years is not the eternal shame.

You only need to correlate what God said in the beginning with whatever you later find in the Bible otherwise you will just hing onto what has no bearing on the Bible as a whole!

Eternal shame goes to those who lived for a thousand years thinking nothing could kill them again but later found out that death still has power over them!

jaephoenix:
What does life truly mean?

From God's standpoint life means a healthy living where there is no suffering, pain, death, sickness, oldage, deformities, disasters (natural or unnatural)

That's why Paul urged his Christian brothers to get a firm hold on the REAL life which we are hoping for in the nearest future {1Timothy 6:19} not this one where we just have to manage whatever we get due to Satan's rulership! 1John 5:19

jaephoenix:
So what about Christians that are poorer and sicker than atheists? What went wrong there? Did Yahweh lose his shit?

Jehovah never promised His worshipers anything apart from life saving informations and wholesome brotherhood everything others experience they will also experience.
There are atheists who are rich and many are poor, there are atheists who are sick and many are healthy, the same applies to people having faith. The only difference is wisdom {Proverbs 2:1-5} and a global family of peace loving worshipers {Mark 10:28-30} that's what atheists can never ever have!

jaephoenix:
So a baby that dies goes to hell?

Yes! They return to the dust for dust they are and to dust they shall return {Genesis 3:19} the word Hell means Grave where they are covered to decay!

jaephoenix:
Answer the question sir. Who created Satan?

Answer mine first after all i've been answering your always!

tctrills:
You are wrong
Was Daniel, not a prophet? He spoke about eternal shame for the wicked. Can a dead man feel shame?
Ecclesiastes says no activity for the dead not for the resurrected.

So it means those that will face eternal shame failed woefully that's what you supposed to know. They will be brought back to life and live for a thousand years as youths then in their own eyes many will continue living while they are exterminated just as it occurred in the days of Noah!

tctrills:
Daniel 12:2
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

A dead man feels no shame and contempt. It is impossible to die and at the same time have everlasting contempt.

If i tell you the meaning of what Daniel is saying you'll be shocked but because of anyone who may be interested:

Daniel is talking about the endtime which begins when John the baptist started calling Jews saying "the kingdom of heaven is at hand" {Matthew 3:2} one of the foremost prince of heaven (Michael) was transformed into an embryo and he became a man he is the one called Jesus of Nazareth and he came for the salvation of God's people so it's him that will bring back to life all those who are sleeping in death (not all the dead) and many will be tested for their faith so that some may gain eternal life while the rest return to grave permanently! Daniel 12:1-3

That's the import of what you just quoted nor that dead people will be somewhere roasted alive! Jeremiah 7:31

tctrills:
Did you even read the verses I quoted?
So you seem to mix the whole thing up. Jesus Christ was not talking about people gnashing their teeth at him. please read carefully.
There will be weeping there, and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but you yourselves thrown out. He was talking of a future time after the resurrection.

And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Jude 1.7 Speaks of eternal fire.

Again you messed up your translation of Revelations 20.10

10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
it clearly says they shall be tormented day and night. please learn to read before commenting.

Ọmọ God's word doesn't contradict itself there is no activity for the dead! Ecclesiastes 9:6

So if Jesus never came to contradict the laws and the prophets {Matthew 5:17} then it means those translators have done a poor job!

tctrills:
So, every word has a history. That's why words have multiple meanings. So debating on the first meaning of a word really means little. Jesus Christ makes it clear that hell is a place of torment. Its more important to understand the sense in which Jesus Christ used the word.

And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:

48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

These are the very words of Jesus Christ

Jesus was talking about GEHENNA not the grave (hell) it's confused translators that mixed it all up!

There are two Hebrew words that most Bible translators mixed together:

Sheoul (Grave) ~ place where the dead are COVERED to decay from the sight the living.

Gehenna (symbol of eternal damnation) ~ a valley behind Jerusalem where their refuse and carcasses of dead animals are thrown. In this valley fire is kept constantly due to the sulphur added to consume the refuse and worms there do eat the bodies of dead animals. The Jews believe in the resurrection of faithful servants of God so they treat their graves with respect {Joshua 24:32 compare to Act 7:15-16} but criminals and blasphemers aren't treated the same way rather their carcasses are thrown in Gehenna.

So when Jesus spoke of Gehenna his listeners fully grasp what he was saying that just as they often throw the carcasses of unwanted things into that valley that's exactly how God will treat unbelievers God will completely forgotten never to be remember during the resurrection of the dead! Compare to Psalms 9:17

tctrills:
I have taken the pain to give you all these verses from the bible. Hope these help answer your question.
In the bible, Jesus Christ used Hell to describe a place of torment in Luke 16.33.

Here Jesus illustrated what Jews does to the carcasses of unwanted things as they throw it into GEHENNA!
[quote author=tctrills post=122437664]In Revelation 20:14, Death and Hell are to separate elements. Not the same thing

Of course death differs from grave nah. People do die but it's when they can't be raised that we leave them in the Grave {John 11:44} so both have different meanings!
[quote author=tctrills post=122437664]Matthew 25.46 Talks about the wicked going into eternal punishment where there shall be weeping. Not death.
Jude 1.7 speaks of eternal 🔥fire

Jesus was talking to the Jews who were gnashing their teeth at him that it's in Gehenna that their gnashing of teeth will lead them not that dead people gnash their teeth (bones) in their graves.
Jude is talking about Gehenna there is no activity after death because death is the ultimate punishment for sin! Romans 7:6

tctrills:
Revelations 20.10 And the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

Just as we continue to remember Sodom and Gomorrah as if fire is still falling on the cities the same way we will forever remember all the pains Satan, human government and false religionists caused innocent people when they were operating not that they will be somewhere alive!

tctrills:
Revelation 14:11
And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.”
Mark 9.47 47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:

48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

Mark 9:43
And if your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than with two hands to go to hell, to the unquenchable fire

Matthew 5:22
But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother will be liable to judgment; whoever insults his brother will be liable to the council; and whoever says, ‘You fool!’ will be liable to the hell of fire

Daniel 12:2
And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.

Matthew 24:51
And will cut him in pieces and put him with the hypocrites. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth

The fearful reminders of evildoers will continue to linger in the hearts of billions who survived into everlasting life not that God will keep them somewhere to be roasted alive! Jeremiah 7:31

tctrills:
Please read my last post to see how the bible describes hell ok. I quoted more than 10 verses for you.

Let us first conclude on the original meaning of the English word "Hell" before going into the works of mistranslation by those who have translated what Jesus said in Hebrew to English!

tctrills:
Please quote the encyclopedia and link to it.

Webster agrees that the Old English origin of the word means cover. This word had nothing to do with a place of punishment or eternal torment. Those connotations came much later, just in time, we might say, to be corrupted by organized religion into its present form.

Google (What is the ORIGIN of the English word Hell)

tctrills:
Hell has several meanings. Do you want to use the dictionary?

Check an encyclopedia not the opinion people later circulated.
The original meaning of Hell according to God's word is grave that's why all servants of God in the Bible (including Jesus) are said to be in hell at death {Act 2:31; Job 14:13} but since the religionists have a contrary opinion their opinion was later added to dictionaries.

So check what the Bible said is the original meaning of hell not what churchgoers think!

oteneaaron:
Lol
It is so funny seeing the JW's on this thread trying so hard to defend their doctrine.

On the contrary Sir!

Many who aren't members of JW organization have stepped forward and agreed with Stephen Leth on the topic.

Shame on you!

Continue dancing around my comments!

brocab:
Below: A change of heart from Max, could this mean he now believes Jehovah witnesses are no longer the real soldiers for Christ? But in the mean time Max admits he is a murder from the beginning-murdering and slaughtering Christians before and after he joined ISIS Now we all know what mediums are: God warns in the Bible against turning to astrology, the occult, mediums, divination and sorcery, witchcraft / witches / warlocks, fortune-telling and necromancy, these are all Satan’s counterfeits to holy spirituality.
Max you say: you visited a Medium to convince you Jehovah witnesses are the true followers of Christ?
Do you know: God takes witchcraft very seriously. The penalty for practicing witchcraft under the Mosaic Law was death {Exodus 22:18; Leviticus 20:27} {Leviticus 19:31}
“Do not turn to mediums or necromancers; do not seek them out, and so make yourselves unclean by them: I am the Lord your God.

Thought provoking question!

Janosky:
I have one question for Mr Spiritual:
Which babies of Evildoers did your own God save when your God destroyed the evildoers with the Flood @ Genesis7:21-23?

bobestman:
you are too small. Go and break the chains your satanic organisation used to bound your brain.

You simply lack critical thinking skills so you're not intelligent enough to answer the question!

Simple answer: all babies are God's enemies that's why He destroyed them along with their evil parents!

oteneaaron:
He can't break those chains because he still hasn't realized that he is a captive of a concept.

That's what Jesus turned anyone who believes in him: a captive of a concept!

“If anyone wants to come after me, let him disown himself and pick up his torture stake day after day and keep following me." Luke 9:23

So we are glad to be slaves to the concept of Christ!

bobestman:
They are suffering from dunning-kruger effect

Why not agree with your friend on the God to be worshiped if the both of you are sane?

He doesn't believe in the God of Abraham and he doesn't even believe in the existence of any god apart from himself you claim you believe in the God of Abraham there's no agreement in what you two think about the true God.

So first agree before thinking of how to win JWs over to your line of thought nah!

bobestman:
I can't be arguing with a dimwit who is brainwashed with his organisation's doctrine. May God save your soul

If you're not brainwashed oya explain why the God of Abraham destroyed millions of babies in Noah's days nah!

Abraham said it's unthinkable for God to kill the righteous along with the wicked {Genesis 18:25} Jesus said the same thing will still repeat itself {Luke 17:26-17} so if babies aren't God's enemies as the man in the video said why didn't God separate the babies so that they're not destroyed along with their evil parents?

tctrills:
The wicked shall be turned into hell, and all the nations that forget God.
Let me explain it with similar scriptures
John 5.29 ... and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Luke 13:28

28 There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, and all the prophets, in the kingdom of God, and you yourselves thrust out.
So God is telling us the faith of any individual or nation that forgets him.

"The wicked shall retreat to the grave (hell) and all the nations that forget God"

So if you don't know the meaning of the old English (Hell) i have simplified it for you now go ahead and explain!

bobestman:
@Maximus i pity your soul. It is obvious that what you teach are what your cultist organisation has programmed into your brain. This is why i warn ppl against religion. Many things they teach are doctrines of men not God. They tie you down with false teaching and you will be fighting for them like zombies. I am not religious, neither am i a churchgoer. I am spiritual! Hope you know that what i said is a reference not my words. But you said its not necessary. How jw interpreted it for you is what is important. I told you what God and his son said about babies but you ignored it and sticked to how jws taught you. May God save your soul. Now i ask again, what is sin? It is the transgression of the law. What is the law? It is the do's and don't given to moses in mount sinai. Now can children do the do's and don'ts as stated in the law? NO. It means babies are innocent. May God save your soul. I don try my best

Next time Bible believers are talking unbelievers like you ought to keep quiet.

You've admitted you don't believe the entire book so there's no need commenting because we believe the Bible from cover to cover that's why we can correlate what is written in all the 31,200 verses of 1189 chapters of our book.

So go and find your type that will cherry pick verses we know everything as the word of our God that must be fully understood for the benefit of all it's adherents {Isaiah 48:17-18} as one big and happy family of peace loving worshipers! Isaiah 2:2-4

tctrills:
First, I am ready to explain any verse you quoted so go ahead and quote.

Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
I'm not teaching you again since you want to explain.

Oya start with Psalms 9:17

Janosky:
So, nah now day break?
Achorladey is telling Nairaland he has been stupid for his MUMU RANTS that Jehovah is not God's name.

The matter vex Achorladey well well, that Achorladey said God has no name.
He said so on this forum.
...

He is ready to continue arguing with you even though he has nothing tangible to say!

tctrills:
Guess work religion. You claim the willfully practice after knowing God's words pls proof with scripture

Our God doesn't kill without a warning so all our great grandfathers and great grandmothers who worshiped idols but lived as prisoners of conscience will be remembered {Romans 2:14-15} it's whatever they choose to become after the opportunity to meet JWs in Paradise preaching and teaching in their neighbourhood that will determine their final judgement! Revelations 20:13
Just humble yourself and learn!

tctrills:
So you want us to believe in your category doctrine and not the bible that teaches that all would resurrect right?

Prove you understand the Bible by explaining what those verses i quoted means!

tctrills:
Question 2
Using your bible, can you tell us the faith or the judgment of those in each category? Make it simple. For those in category A, what will be their judgment? For those in categories B and C, what would be their judgments too?

Category C has been judged already but A & B will survive into Paradise where Jesus will rule for a thousand years. A limited number will be taken to heaven to rule with Christ this ones are saved completely but billions will live on planet earth during Christ's reign.
It's after Christ's reign that they will be tested to prove faithful to all the things they've learned during Christ's reign that's why John said second death could still catch up with many who live on planet earth! Revelations 20:5-6

tctrills:
Question for you sir.
What Category, A, B, or C would you place these people?
Revelation 21:8
8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone
: which is the second death.

Note: Idolaters are basically pagans

Category A and B are faithful people either in God's righteous standard or faithful to what they know while their conscience is working like compass.

Idolaters in this case are people who wilfully practice idolatry even after knowing what God said not people who had no opportunity to knowing God's word.

All these people are judged directly by God based on what they deliberately chose to do after knowing God's standard so they're category C!

tctrills:
What does this have to do with the topic on the ground? Please let's not distract ourselves. Jesus Christ said children would inherit his kingdom. He is not unjust or stupid. We can take his words to the bank

No wahala he said sheep will also enter while goats are condemned so don't expect to eat isi-ewu in God's Kingdom!

tctrills:
From the verses you wrote its clear it make this up. Now, Jesus Christ said all would resurrect not category A, B C. the faithful and the evildoers. Please read John 5

You misunderstood him because he clearly said some people's judgment will be worse than those in Sodom and Gomorrah that means unlike the inhabitants of Sodom and Gomorrah whose time, places and those related to them were remembered due to Abraham's story and Lot's the places they live, the time period and those related to them will be wiped out completely from human history after their death! Psalms 9:17

So they will not be remembered at all during the resurrection.

Janosky:
Useless , invalid question.
Do I have to remind you that the flood of Noah's day was a punishment the God Almighty executed against evildoers wickedness at that time?

Ọmọ they don't know the difference o.

Na style you go take teach them whether they like or not at least you have played your part!

tctrills:
You always get yourself confused.
Now you said only the faithful would resurrect. But now you change the goalpost.
Now are these your definition from the bible or dictionary or did you just make them up as you always do?
Finally which verse in the bible speaks of the first second or 3rd category?
Are you saying that the scriptures are wrong for teaching that all men would be resurrected?
Do I believe you or believe the word of God?

That's what you supposed to ask instead of arguing blindly!

Category A
All ancient faithful servants of God have built a solid relationship with God so their names are in line for the RIGHTEOUS to be remembered! Hebrews 11:4-12:1

Category B
Pagans who lived by conscience have proved that their God's given conscience is working in them like a compass so during the resurrection they will be remembered! Romans 2:14-16

Category C
Apart from Adamic sin which leads to death of all humans whether righteous or unrighteous many have rendered their conscience dead.
Some even knew God's standard but defied it while others deliberately chose to be evil not minding what their God's given conscience say so at death they've been judged no resurrection for them! Psalms 9:17

tctrills:
Jesus Christ never said that his mother and brothers would be destroyed again sir you are off-point. Please come back to the topic

Well for your information that's what he meant by calling those having the same line of thought with him his family. Matthew 12:46-50 compare to John 17:22
All those that has different opinion from Jesus are damned! John 3:16