₦airaland Forum

petra1:
There are different kinds of givings in the Bible. To parents ,to the poor, to strangers ,to man of God , to brethren , to God etc. One does not supplant the other. You can't say because you gave to your parents you have given to God and you can't say because you gave yo your parents you are excused from giving to God

petra1:
Mark 7:11
11 But you say it is all right for people to say to their parents,
‘Sorry, I can’t help you. For I have vowed to give to God what I would have given to you.’

See , we don't try to cut corners in giving. We do all.

petra1:
Not at all except you just refuse to see or acknowledge it.
Types and shadow of Christ is seen from genesis to malachi. Christ fulfill those. He fulfilled offering for sin, he fulfilled circumvision

petra1:
But he didn't fulfilled personal commitment in worshiping of God

petra1:
He didn't fulfil tithing nor offering unto God.
Neither did he fulfill personal prayer, so the fact that such things are mentioned in the law makes no difference. They are principles

petra1:
Sharing among one another Philadelphia is different from giving to God.
There's difference between giving to brethren and giving to God

petra1:
Then there's no point anybody keep bringing up the issue of circumcision.

UNIQUEISRAEL:
2Cor.9:7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.

Will somebody please show me where in the New Testament we can find any of the believers paying tithes, or any of the Apostles asking for tithes?

The epistles are full of discussions about giving for the support of preachers, teachers, and the poor: but no where do any of the Apostles ask for tithes or remind anyone to pay tithes. And, how can it be said that a man is not giving of necessity if he is obeying a LAW of tithing?

How can it be said that a man is not giving of necessity, if he is convinced that he will be cursed with poverty if he fails to pay those tithes?

Certainly, if the Apostle Paul thought he was authorized and obliged to demand tithes, he would have brought it up in 1 Corinthians chapter nine,
where he asserts that he has a right to receive financial support from those he preaches to!
Why doesn't Paul remind them that they are obliged to pay those tithes, and that he has a right to receive those tithes?

plainbibletruth:
Like the OP wrote above:

None of you is able to answer because you've decided to blind your eyes to the plain truth.

damagepbuh:
Ok

damagepbuh:
As i said before most monikers behind these posts are Muslims and atheists and their mission is to set christians up against themselves.
If u want to win over Muslims and unbelievers preach d love of christ and not criticism. Dats wat d apostles did. People has been discouraged from going to church all because of all these criticism. And d best way d devil can get u to backslide is to isolate u from d gathering of d saints

damagepbuh:
People who pay tithe pay tithe because they believe it secures their finance and if it doesnt work for dem they wont continue.

damagepbuh:
No pastor and i repeat no pastor will ever preach pay ur tithe or go to hell

damagepbuh:
Since tithe or no tithe is not a pre requisite to enter God's kingdom, its best to drop d matter and channel our strength to winning souls for Christ. I wont want to argue on tithe or no tithe i only tell people to develop a very close relationship with God, they will find answers to the questions that bother their mind

petra1:
TITHES AND OFFERINGS ARE ETERNAL PRINCIPLES
The church doesn't need a command to tithe it was already a principle in the kingdom of God.
Just as other biblical principles such as prayer, fasting, worship, honoring your father and mother, alms to the poor etc.
These principle existed before the law came .
TITHING EXISTED BEFORE THE LAW

Hebrews 7:6
But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises

petra1:
JESUS ENDORSED TITHING
Matthew 23:23 (NLT)
. . . . You should tithe, yes, but do not neglect the more important things

petra1:
Matthew 22:21
. . . , Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's.

petra1:
THE APOSTLES ENDORSED
It's through tithes and offerings the workers of the terbernacle and temple get their welfare . And the apostles used it as illustration here.

1 Corinthians 9:13-14
13 Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?
14 Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

damagepbuh:
Just for d sake of killing d argument i told u i drop d word tithe
but in truth i am ardent believer of tithing but no argument will either change me or you

damagepbuh:
I will want to drop the argument

damagepbuh:
but read my last post.

damagepbuh:
And stop helping muslims and atheist achieve their aims of bringing up these posts.
Instead of criticizing what you dont believe about Christianity, why dont you preach wat u believe and win souls

damagepbuh:
How will condenming tithing help win souls for God

Sarassin:
I'm in the sunnier climes of the west coast although the time zones are doing my head in

Sarassin:
Hehehe....if you say so

Sarassin:
I appreciate that you are more than savvy enough to pull me up on that verse, but I did not quote that verse in error

Sarassin:
and there is nothing humorous about the last stages of achieving clairvoyance by piercing the Veil

Sarassin:
I believe that you know fully that the depiction of the veil in the Hebrew Bible is rooted in Jewish esoterica, particularly Qabalah.

Sarassin:
Therefore its use in the Pentateuch can only be highly allegorical. The true meanings of the allegories of the Hebrew Bible are lost to Christians because they define these by events in the New Testament (in my view)

Sarassin:
On the Tree of Life, the crown of which is a direct emanation of the Divine, the Veil is placed on the Sephira that is Yesod, which is more to do with sexual proclivities. The allegory here is deep and profound and I haven't even scratched the surface

damagepbuh:
I appreciate ur criticism.

damagepbuh:
Ok let me stop calling it tithe let me say I give 10% of my income to d work of God

damagepbuh:
I hope dat is not a new wine in an old bottle

damagepbuh:
I negotiate with my God. Hannah negotiated with God, Jabez did it, Jehoshephat did it, Hezekiah did it

damagepbuh:
God told the Israelites "come let us reason together".

damagepbuh:
The Syrophoenician woman negotiated with Jesus she didnt just take Jesus' answer when Jesus told her dat u cant give d food for the children to the dogs

damagepbuh:
Yes I negotiate with my God wen i render argumentative prayers

damagepbuh:
On whether to respect d annointed or not.
I go by the words of the high priest Ceiphas he said "leave the apostles alone, if their works be not of God, it will surely fail, but if it is of God then we might be fighting God. They said they are annointed and as long as their works has not failed, they still preach d gospel, heal d sick, give and support d poor, lead people to christ i will always respect the annointing in dem. Until their works fail

Sarassin:
Thanks for your comments

Sarassin:
I quite like the meme of old Idi Amin Dada, a nice touch, he was many things but nobody ever accused him of great intelligence....

Sarassin:
You take issue with the biblical comparisons I made

Sarassin:
I am always amazed that biblical scholars never cease to impress on we heathens the allegorical nature of biblical writings (straight from the school of Origen) yet when it suits them, the writings are of course....literal

damagepbuh:
I believe in tithing not because its a sin not to tithe nor will u go to hell if u dont tithe.
It is a personal thing to me

damagepbuh:
I tell God watever u give in a month i will give u one tenth of it, so if u want me to give u more, bless me more. Also since i sponsor ur works with ten percent of my earnings i know u wont allow anything bad happen to my source of income

damagepbuh:
Its a personal decision if u believe in it do it but if u dnt believe in it dont do it.
Its not a pre requisite to make heaven every pastor will tell u dat.
If u dnt believe in tithing pls stop criticizing it d way u do, as a Christian its very wrong to criticize some pastors d way u do no matter wat

damagepbuh:
IF they claim they have d anointing pls respect d anointing even if they dnt actually have it.
It will make d annointing work for u

damagepbuh:
Pls dnt qoute me if u believe u came from a big bang or if u slap ur head on d ground 5 times because am not referring to u

HenryDion:
Yes...thinking about resuming cause ever since I stop, my life feels incomplete. I became vulnerable to attacks cause I'm no more ignorant of the other side

HenryDion:
This time around, i pray i won't be over obsessed.
I wonder if my guide will be able to accept me back. I really said bad words to her in other to make her leave.
She was my friend but i turned my back on her. She usually come in form of a cat because i love cats a lot, and that time, i saw so much sadness in her eyes.

Sarassin:
The last stage before true clairvoyance occurs is the removal of the veil which is not in the public domain.
The veil is a mystical term denoting that at death or in meditation the consciousness expands and recalls what the soul knows.

Traversing the veil means penetrating the fabric between the living and the deceased in order to see them with open eyed clairvoyance.
The deceased walking around us far outnumber the living.
This veil is the etheric force that blocks the view of the astral planes around us.

Therefore, as the mystic opens the eye to clairvoyance it can be said the veil is being removed. It could feel as strongly as something being pulled off the eye, it can feel subtle like an eyelid touching the eyeball ever so slightly or it can be felt like a ripping sensation.

Clearly, comparisons abound in the Christian Bible;
Exodus 34:34
But whenever Moses went in before the LORD to speak with Him, he would take off the veil until he came out; and whenever he came out and spoke to the sons of Israel what he had been commanded.

Job 22:14
Thick clouds veil him, so he does not see us as he goes about in the vaulted heavens.

malvisguy212:
longest time bro.

brocab:
MuttleyLaff looking at the old woman's story, I never really seen it the way you had pointed it out to me, to be honest it was quite interesting
Her faith was their-than 'so was the tithers greed..

brocab:
This is why I love the Lord bro, He speaks to us all, so we all understand Him the way He wants us to understand His word.

Interesting

brocab:
Thanks brother

TPAND:
False teaching. Ten commandments is our guide not grace. Mods please take this topic of the frontpage. It is completely false

petra1:
Tithes and offering and alms and worship will always be principles in Gods kingdom

analice107:
Thank you.
And the Part which was fulfilled has to do with the sacrificial laws, which concerns atonement for sins by shedding the blood of an animal in the place of Man's sins.

Jesus became that lamb. But what about the moral laws, do they also needs be fulfilled?

The only part of the law fulfilled, is the part that concerns sins

petra1:
Beautiful

Goshen360:
Lol....you people are throwing too many questions at me at the same time but lemme give short and straight forward answers to your questions:

You don't need the 10 commandments to tell you to love your God before you love. Under the new covenant, you can't love God because the 10 commandments told you to, you love because the the of God is put in you and you express it out to God and to your neighbors.

2. You love not because you as human is capable of loving but because he, God FIRST LOVED YOU.

3. You don't need 10 commandments to know that killing is bad. You don't need the 10 commandments to tell you fornication, adultery, lying, bearing false witness etc is bad, where was 10 commandments before Joseph ran away from Potipher wife and didn't commit fornication? How? The Spirit of God teach you and tells you it's not good NOT the 10 commandments.

Under the new covenant and AFTER BEFORE the law, it is the REIGN OF THE SPIRIT OF GOD

blueAgent:
I don't understand you are you saying the law has been abolished?

Goshen360:
The simple answer to the OP is YES! The new covenant abolished 10 commandments

Goshen360:
Delusion? U being STUDYING or READING your bible or JUST LISTENING TO YOUR PASTOR? Lord help us!

Splinz:
Why don't we study it together? Where are your proofs that the Ten Commandment is no longer binding

Goshen360:
@ Splinz,
Do you agree to the above ^ ^ ^ or disagree to the above that the 10 commandments are part of the old covenant? Let's take it step by step

Splinz:
Very poor attempt as usual. That the Ten Commandment was given in the Old Testament does not in anyway nullify its validity in the New Testament.

Have you not seen how Jesus even went further in strenthening the Ten Commandment in the New Testament? What about the apostles? I keep on asking you why a Law described as "holy, righteous and good" should be abolished. Of course, you're turning a blind eye to it!

When I say you do not know what was abolished in the Old Testament, it is indeed a true saying. When you say the Ten Commandment was part of the Old Covenant and the old is done away, do you also mean the whole of Old Testament writings are abolished too

I do not agree with you not just because I want to disagree, but because the Scriptures itself disagrees as well!

blueAgent:
The Old Testament always informs us through
the prophets as to what changes are coming in
the future. Note the following scripture. Amos 3:7“Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the
prophets.” So what did the Old Testament say about the New Covenant? Jeremiah 31:33 “But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.”
Does this verse say God will put a “new” law in
their hearts? Or does it say His law “except” His Sabbath being the fourth Commandment? No! The law that God said He is going to write into the hearts of His people is “His law” as it exists in the Old Testament! Hence God is saying that there is going to be NO change to His law with the New Covenant.

blueAgent:
Some trying to avoid God's law have said that
the Old Covenant was made with Israel and so the Ten Commandments were only for Israel. But note that the New Covenant was also made ONLY with the “House of Israel.” This is covered in detail in is the Sabbath for Israel only but in the meanwhile know that the Bible tells us that if we are Christ's then we are Abraham's seed and “children of Israel” or the “House of Israel.” Honestly, how could any sane person think that God would expect one group to obey His law and allow everyone else to sin? (1 John 3:4) Paul elaborates further on the purpose of the law, “What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. No, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, You shall not covet.” Romans 7:7

Below is the New Testament fulfilment of Jeremiah 31:33 in regards to the New Covenant. Hebrews 8:6-10
“6But now has he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.
7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.
10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:”

God made a covenant with His children when He lead them by the hand out of the land of Egypt. (verse 9).
The Bible tells us that Christ came as the Mediator of a New Covenant (verse 6) The belief that the New Covenant abolishes the Ten Commandments reflects a misunderstanding of both covenants. God tells us that He altered the original covenant and made “a better covenant, which was established upon better promises” (verse 6).

blueAgent:
But as we have already seen, it was not established on different laws. The law stayed the same.
There was however a weakness or fault in the original covenant. That fault was with the people, NOT with the law.
“For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:” (verse 8.)
It was “because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.” (verse 9).
In the Old Covenant God wrote His Ten Commandments on tablets of stone. It was external and not part of the thinking and motives of the people. It was in their literature but NOT in their hearts. In the New Covenant God writes His law “into their minds, and writes them in their hearts.” (verse 10).

To enable people to internalise His law, to love it and obey it eagerly and willingly, God makes this promise,

Ezekiel 36:26-27
26“A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.
27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and you shall keep my judgments, and do them.”
See also the two Covenants

plainbibletruth:
Be Wrong Or Give Wrong And Your Tithing Is Still Zero!
God has his system of doing things under each dispensation he sets up. Before Israel God had a way he wanted believers to relate with him. When Israel was created God set up a system through which his people were to relate with him and live their lives.

If anyone in Israel, for example, chooses not to follow God’s established system for his time but chose to run his life by the system of the previous dispensation, the fact that it was a God-established system will not make it right. As long as he is not following the prescribed protocol for his time God will consider it wrong. Many examples abound in Scripture on this.

In 1 Corinthians 13 we are told that a GOOD thing done in a WRONG way becomes zero. We are told here that one can give everything including one's body to be burned but if it is not done in love, such acts profit NOTHING.

The motivation for doing a thing MUST be right for it to be acceptable to God. The story Ananias and Sapphira in Acts 5 readily comes to mind. They gave money, perhaps a large amount, but their motivation for giving was false and wrong. As a result God’s disapproval was shown in their being struck dead. God does not accept any offering or giving that is not given with the right spirit or from anyone whose lifestyle is not right with God. (Malachi 1:10, Amos 5:22, 1 Cor. 13).

Today’s TITHING is improperly motivated because people are TAUGHT to GIVE TO GET. The motivation for Christian giving should be a grace response to the marvellous grace of God. God has done so much for us that we can really do NOTHING to reciprocate what he has done for us. What God calls for us to do is live a life of gratitude for all he has done for us.

The self-righteous TITHER will do well to look again at Luke 18: 9-14 where Jesus taught against wanting to be JUSTIFIED by what we do. If you tithe because you want to go back to a system instituted under a previous dispensation, you are doing it wrongly and that would be unacceptable to God. If you tithe because you want to ESCAPE some repercussion you have been threatened with you are doing it with a wrong motive. If you tithe because you hope to get from God your intention is equally wrong and before God such giving is zero – wood, hay and straw.

“It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.”
Galatians 5:1

brocab:
It's not that I would like you to repeat your beliefs to me again, I was only trying to be nice.

brocab:
Well I do see it-but not in a way you expect me to see it, we all know the story about Jesus preaching to the scribes and the Pharisees going into house holds devouring the widow's taking everything they had. We just need to read {Matthew 23} to receive the in's and out's about the Pharisees and the scribes

brocab:
To be truthful {God see's what man don't see} and Jesus happen to be there after He spoke to the Crowd wasn't a accident, He knew what He wanted to see, but the scribes, didn't need to prove it to Jesus, the problem is, is Jesus seeing what you see-or did Jesus see something completely different?

brocab:
Am I reading this right
-you believe The scribes made it a point to set up Jesus to watch a little old lady put in all she had. "Interesting"

brocab:
If this is the case
-and you believed the scribes set this up
-then it's pointless to believe she put in all she had by faith?

brocab:
Lets try and start again
- we have started off on the wrong foot.

brocab:
This is right, there isn't any % on giving, but I didn't give a % in the first place-this was your own opinion, you attack me on.
But I will try in future to explain my pages more clearly. No problem.
But for the tithers greed, there is a %-and I have already told you I am not a tither.
Abraham gave everything that didn't belong to him, which really isn't giving, Abraham is returning.
But does anyone see this scripture, the way I see this scripture?.
I agree with you, God loves a cheerful giver, the old lady's story I see her heart bro in faith more then I see, her just giving two mites-the rich I see everyday.
We have all read the percentage story, and certain farmers and ranchers believed God to tithe their shocks and crops they supplied the needs to the levites, and in return God supplied the farmers and ranchers needs with rain and keeping the insects away.
This story had never changed..

brocab:
Firstly This story of the widow's mite can actually teach us something, God see's what man over looks, the big gifts in the temple were surely notice by the people, that is probably what the disciples were watching.
But Jesus saw what no-one else did, He saw the humble gift of a poor widow, that was a gift Jesus thought worthy to comment, this was the gift the disciples needed to be aware of.
The other gifts in the treasury that day made a lot of noise as they jingled into the receptacles, but the widows mites was heard in heaven.

Second God's evaluation is different from mans, the widow's two mites added up to a penny, according to man's tabulation.
But Jesus said that she had given more then anyone else that day {Mark 12;43} One must ask how can this be, when many rich people through in large amounts {Mark 12:41}?
The differences is one of proportion. The rich were giving large sums, but they still retrained their fortunes, the widow put in everything-all she had to live on {Mark 12:42} Hers was a true sacrifice, the rich had not began to give to the level of her sacrifice.

Thirdly God commends giving in faith" here was a woman of receiving charity, yet she had a heart to give. Even though the amount was negligible-what could a widow's mite buy? She gave it in Faith that God could use it. The widow's faith is also evident in the fact that she gave the last of her money.
Like the widow of Zarephath who gave her last meal to Elijah {1 kings 17:7-16} the widow in the temple gave away her last means of self support. {Does that mean the widow left the temple completely destitute, went home and died for starvation?} "No" The bible teachers us that God provides for our needs {Matthew 6:25-34}
God provides for the widow in Elijah's day and also in Jesus's day.
Yes and just before Jesus commented on the widow's mite, he commented on the scribes who devour widow's houses {Mark 12:40} The religious official's of the day, instead of helping the widows in need, were perfectly content to rob them of their livelihood and of their inheritance. {This is the same today with the tithers greed} And again God loves a cheerful giver {2 Corinthians 9:7} And God is faithful to take care of His own..

Well if you aren't trying to teach me than why the long pages of report? How you see things-and how I see things-your corrections is teaching. I am not looking for another teacher-I have a teacher man couldn't buy.
If you don't see the story's about faith-then we aren't reading the same bible, the bible is all about faith. We live by faith. [/color]
It doesn't matter how small or how large either you give all you don't, God loves a cheerful giver, and this story of the Old lady, isn't about the money-this is about her faith, she gave, because she believed..God see's our faith, Jesus pray's for our faith now, like He did back then..
And without faith we wouldn't be having this conversation.

brocab:
Again you aren't understanding me,
if a tither is to tithe
-I said give "all" how Abraham and the old lady gave
-meaning their is no % on their given

brocab:
If you didn't understand my last page

brocab:
-Listen bro you aren't teaching me nothing - the hole bible is all about Faith
-but if you trying to call it something else I am not following you. Teacher...

Seun:
If it happened, then surely there are people on Nairaland who possibly would have attended that amazing meeting.
People like Donnie, Gombs, and Petra1 ...

brocab:
Thanks for your teaching for today's message?

brocab:
But I already understood the message about the old ladies story, it isn't about money, its about our faith-and how much faith are we giving to God-she gave all she had-and the rich gave as they walked past the treasury, Jesus pointed this out-are we to follow the lady's league, or do we give less of our time to seek after God's treasury, which is the word of God.

brocab:
And if you understood my tithing comment in the first place, "all" does not mean tithe

brocab:
And of course I was only having a crack at the tithers, and if you had read my comment from top to bottom you would have seen that

brocab:
But of course you didn't.

brocab:
So thank you teacher and may God bless you with His abundance in word and in truth

petra1:
If I need likes. I can get over 50 likes for every post. Truth is not by the number of people cheering you on

Gombs:
Abi o... More than 50 likes sef....

petra1:
I'm sure the admin can verify that. Pls let it be investigated

Gombs:
I support your claims of him asking the admin to verify.
One can't just lie against someone and still put up a defense

plainbibletruth:
You seem to look for ways to belittle others and divert attention from main issues at hand.
Yet you'd be the one to be quick at calling others 'carnal', blame them for slander, wonder if they are sane, even when you do the very same things

Gombs:
Not every one is like you na

Gombs:
Quit such petty slander on people

petra1:
If I need likes . I can get over 50 likes for every post. Truth is not by the number of people cheering you on.