₦airaland Forum

rugged7:
LISTEN little biiiitch...

Of all the south africans here, u are the one i have the least respect most contempt for...

And you are the one with the smallest dick, that's why everything is a pissing contest to you.

And i've WARNED YOU before, stay the hell off my fuqqing timeline...KAPPISH?

"you must have a small dick"
"you care about my opinion of you"
"I shall issue e-threats in an attempt to intimidate you"

What are you? 12?

You buggers started this nonsense, so dont go about complaining when some heat got sent your way. No need to behave like a child.

rugged7:
Is there a reason these fuqqing south african thrash are trying to derail this thread with abuse

Where is seun, lalasticlala and co

Abeg, my 9ja peops, make una leave these saffers.
Deir talk is just getting tiring and inconsequential.
Dem no reach.
Dem still dey learn work.
Make we focus on this thread pix, videos and analysis abeg.

- Nigerians start flinging poo
- Complain when they get thrashed

Dont throw a punch and then complain when you get your ar.se beat

Henry240:
You dumb-Fvck!

A surveilliance system is only part of the Navy's wider Regional Maritime Awareness Capability initiative.

We can all clearly see a Digital C2 system in the photos i've shared.

No, I can see a digital surveillance system.

So apart from the fact that you are talking about the Navy when we are talking about land operations... what evidence is there of net-centric warfare capabilities?

Dude, you arent even on the same page here.

And again, go look up the definition of C2 - a general and a radio constitute C2.

agaugust:
Call me a mo...ron and get 5 of your friends to like your comment. It won't stop me from speaking for the general good of Africa.

Strategic what? You think the 5,000 man AU force will all fight one single battle in one area of operation together as a 5,000 man brigade?

Do you know the universal rules about intervention forces and general military deployment rules?

1. AU force of 5,000 will be able to deploy only about 2,500 in a country at a time, or else how will they do troop rotation every 6 months if all 5,000 men deploy in one country at the same time?

2. AU force may need to intervene in more than one country at a time, e.g Cameroon, Libya, and Somalia needs urgent help now. Means maybe 1,250 men only will be deployed in each country if AU chooses two out of the three that needs help.

3. AU force of 1,250 troops in say Somalia, and El-Shabbab attacks two different cities in east and west Somalia. Means about 500 troops will respond to each area of operation while the remaining 250 will garrison the AU base. God help AU that it is not aBoko Haram type of asymmetric and highly mobile warfare where 500 Bokos will each attack 5 different towns in one week spread over a battle space the size of Scotland.

4. Your big strategic size 5,000 troop AMANI force will end up in reality fighting as detachments of small sized tactical units of about 500 men in reality of todays kind of asymmetric war threats ravaging Africa !

You still think I am a m...oron ?

After reading your post I KNOW you are a slowpoke

1. All 5000 can be deployed, rotated through units in donor nations armies

2. Speculation, it may only deploy in one country at a time - thus it could deploy with 5000 men

3. 5000 men, so 1500 attack each and you are left with 2000 to defend. Again, you are speculating

4. You think that is a new thing? Solved by
- CAS
- Airmobile QRF
- Motorized infantry (ie: what you saw in the demonstration)

High mobility insurgency warfare is now over 115 years old (Anglo-Boer War) nothing "new" or "modern" about it. You also forget that the SANDF we see today is the result of lessons learnt fighting a 25 year long insurgency that saw high mobility COIN, high mobility LICW, high mobility conventional warfare, urban combat et al. And the men who fought in that war and achieved a military (not political) success were trained at Lethola.

agaugust:
Chief, stop speculating as if AMANI involved some secret super training like USA Navy SEALS and US Army Rangers.

Show us photos of what AMANI involved that was different from a whole 3 hour video that has shown us what they learnt. FLINTLOCK showed us the various things they did in open field and sub urban built up areas, we saw all photos. Show us anything from AMANI training in a battle space with mock buildings for mock urban warfare, or is AMANI a top secret society operation that the world must not see ?
.

So you admit that you actually have no idea what happened during AMANI?

If you dont know what happened, how can you criticize?

agaugust:
[s]Nigerian army has C2....Command & Control....that is the meaning of C2....

Nigerian army for a long time operates one major central C2 base in Abuja for national defence command and control, and a brand new C2 was recently opened in Maiduguri 2015 for battle theatre epicenter command and control.... C2

"From Maiduguri, Colonel Sani Usman, acting director of public relations for the Nigerian army, said, “The president, during his inaugural address…made mention of relocating command and control center to the epicenter of the war front.”

He said the center will serve as a forward command base.

“Essentially, it is an elaboration of the already existing army headquarters command and control. Invariably, the fight against terrorism and the insurgency will be monitored, coordinated and controlled from this center."

http://www.voanews.com/content/nigeria-boko-haram-8jun15/2812139.html

Yes, but you dont have:

1. An integrated data-link
2. Battle management software

I think you should look up the defenition of what "C2" actually is.

Command and control is the exercise of authority and direction by a properly designated individual over assigned resources in the accomplishment of a common goal - NATO

ie: A general and a radio

Nigeria does not posses the capabilities required for net-centric warfare (confirmed by you), SANDF does.

Simple as that

Henry240:
This is the integrated digital C2 system that some mor.on is referring to as just a surveilliance system.
They want to tell us what we have or don't have. I mean, such authoritative ignorance.

Its in your source:

Henry240:
system
"the installation of a [b]new surface
surveillance system, under its Regional Maritime
Awareness Capability initiative. The surveillance system,
which is a United States Navy-inspired coastal surveillance
programme, uses an automatic identification system and
ground-based radar and sensors to enhance awareness of
maritime activities".
[/b]

Also, look up the definition of C2

Upon reading what C2 is, you should be embarrassed

agaugust:
Namibia builds MRAP...so what's the big deal about MRAP?

Super powers have stopped buying South African MRAPs long ago, USA, UK, now build better MRAPs than South Africa, go see the Couger MRAP. Also check out the Wildcat MRAP from Israel. Even Israel and Saudi Arabia make better MRAP than South Africa today, the world has overtaken you while you were busy boasting !

You mean the Saudi MRAP designed by a South African company and sold under a joint agreement?

How are they better?

Fact is we have sold to super-powers and our exports are doing as well as ever

Nigeria has yet to produce anything that competes with 1970s era Casspir let alone our latest generation Rg series

Stop talking about America and Israel we are comparing Rsa to Nigeria

agaugust:
United Nations buying made in Nigeria LAV is hurting you guys badly in South Africa....we are taking UN market from you soon, as well as AU market....watch out for out coming MRAP and tracked IFV.

Meanwhile, enjoy proudly made in Nigeria LATV....Light Armoured Tactical Vehicle, the first one is being made to have amphibious version, the second one to favour special forces or regular forces patrol ops....ALL PROUDLY MADE IN NIGERIA by black Nigerians making world class equipment that United Nations is happy to buy as world class quality....we don't have a defence industry owned by Europeans....like SA depends on foreign companies.

Proudly Nigerian !

You are comparing that trash to what we build?

Lol, Syrian rebels build the same equipment!

Which foreign companies build Maps for us?

How many have you sold to the UN? How are they world class?

Henry240:
No, it wasn't.

What is it then?

stillchris:
South Korea

Iraq

Afghanistan

UAE
http://archive.defensenews.com/article/20131125/DEFREG02/311250020/US-Firm-Aids-UAE-Military-s-Transformation

I have more proof if you want

Saudi Arabia
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/dod/usmtm.htm

Yemen

Failed Syrian rebel assistance program

You want more?

How was Korea w failure?

Also - do you need me to explain the problem with Arabs again?

South Africa showing off advanced training equipment, world class gear.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNo6axEV-6U

rugged7:
Odawise dem go just spoil dis fine thread.

Yeah, this is all totally because of us South Africans

It was totally us who made it an issue of national pride

We totally had our judgment blinded by national bias

agaugust:
I believe AU did not do a good training worth the effort in South Africa, AU problem, but the host should have provided an adequate battle theatre that reflects current African needs.....or are they only going to intervene in open land desert wars?

agaugust:
Nigerian, Ugandan, Kenyan army do not train like that. Nigerian director, but he is compelled to act out a 100% South African style written training script.

Who does not know how artillery works? SANDF you mean? They have not fired artillery in combat since 20 years ago.

agaugust:
The battle theatre provided by South Africa is grossly inadequate in terms of today's African conflict realities.

You boys jumped to quick conlusions, judged an entire 5000 man 3 week AU exercise based on a ~2 hour display by ~400 men and proceeded to heap insult upon insult upon South Africa.

So you spewed some nonsense and got annihilated.

Dont start fights and then pretend you are a pacifist.

You boys started it, we ended it.

Now, lets move on shall we?

Henry240:
This is a silly question.

So I take it you cannot make one based on a Toyota

Henry240:
It is purely economics. Russia doesn't buy Nigerian oil, the west, and the U.S in particular used to be the main buyer of Nigerian oil. It's just the politics of business.


U.S training is no good, I mean, we've been here before, we've seen it. The stats are there to show that U.S trained forces do not make the cut.


It's not all bad with the Russians though, as they would be building our nuclear power plants.


Let me ask though, Do we actually buy from Russia?

What stats show they dont make the cut?

stillchris:
I always hear the Nigerian government giving props to US and western nations and not mentioning Russia when talking about those who stood by us.

While the Russian trained commandos seem to perform better than the US trained ranger battalion.

The Same thing happened during the civil war. We were abandoned by the west while the soviets backed us only for the war to end and we forgot about them.

Now this.

Ranger battalion never finished training - US/Nigeria pulled aid halfway through

Henry240:
Me no go yarn on this matter again. I jst sy mak I clear dem doubt rapidly on this matter, that idea of wanting to dey feel say na dere own no good, na em make I say I must clear dem doubt by fire by force.


We no dey find prsn wey go lik us. Infact, me wan always want mak dem show dem true colours, so tht we go put dem 4 dem level. See as Agaugust say mak em yarn em mind as d matter use touch am 4 chest, na em all of em come just pounce on am like village dog wey see shit.


I wan put dem 4 dem level, make e pain dem well well.... Dem don mad finish. Carry old schl tactics come dey train 4 2015 come dey expect sy make we dey clap 4 dem.


Wetin dem get sef wey persn no go gree hear word again, shuuuuu!! Tht na a similar system wey our navy don use tey tey, since 2011. Comprehensive Digital C2, and na even naija company wey develop am, still install am 4 our navy sef.


Initially I sy mak I jst bone d matter, sy dem no reach, but d way dem carry agugaust matter for head like say na government work na wetin mak me para.... I say mak i treat dem Fvck-up, put dem 4 dere place. If I jst keep quiet dem 4 just continue still dey mumu.

Proclaiming victory when you have admitted you do not even know what you are talking about?

Ignoring South African posters because they ask questions you cannot answer?

AND STOP CALLING A SURVEILLANCE SYSTEM A C2 SYSTEM

This is beyond ludicrous, Nigerian hubris at its finest

Henry240:
Oga,

The truth is we did not learn anything from Amani Africa. The maneuvers and demonstrations seen are scenarios used in the 70s or the Nigerian civil war.


I mean, how do you attack Gwoza or defend maiduguiri with Armoured vehicles sitting so close to each other. You don't even attack Sambisa that is riddled with bobby traps, IEDS and VBIEDs that way.


The maneuvers used in Amani Africa are obsolete, archaic and have no place whatsoever in the modern battlefield. Name just one engagement that the Nigerian army has been involved in, in the last 25 years that have required us to use maneuvers like those we saw in Amani Africa, I dare you to name one?

Have you even taken the time to look at how the French fought in Mali ? It was street level, then operations were taken to the mountains.


The scenarios presented in Amani Africa are all from the 70s. There is something very wrong with fighting like you are in the 70s in today's modern battle-space

According to this guy modern armies don't ever:

1. Assault the enemy
2. Conduct combined arms operations
3. Engage in low intensity conventional warfare

I can name plenty times that these operations have been done - the war in Somalia is a prime example.

south Africa has plenty of urban warfare training facilities, if they were needed they would have been used

The INABILITY of the Nigerian army to conduct such operations is not valid evidence that such operations are obsolete.

Henry240:
Oga,

The truth is we did not learn anything from Amani Africa. The maneuvers and demonstrations seen are scenarios used in the 70s or the Nigerian civil war.


I mean, how do you attack Gwoza or defend maiduguiri with Armoured vehicles sitting so close to each other. You don't even attack Sambisa that is riddled with bobby traps, IEDS and VBIEDs that way.


The maneuvers used in Amani Africa are obsolete, archaic and have no place whatsoever in the modern battlefield. Name just one engagement that the Nigerian army has been involved in, in the last 25 years that have required us to use maneuvers like those we saw in Amani Africa, I dare you to name one?


I'm not saying that Amani Africa should just be held in built up areas, I'm saying Amani Africa should be a representation of the scenarios modern African militaries ( Nigeria, Algeria, Egypt, Ethiopia, Kenya, Uganda) have faced and continue to face in their various theaters of operations.

Have you even taken the time to look at how the French fought in Mali ? It was street level, then operations were taken to the mountains.


The scenarios presented in Amani Africa are all from the 70s. There is something very wrong with fighting like you are in the 70s in today's modern battle-space. If Nigerian forces used these tactics against Boko-Haram, they would be severely ra.ped every time.


I don't see how the military can attack or defend Gwoza, Mubi, Potiskum, Gombe city, Madagali with tactics used in the 70s.


The only area Amani Africa delivers is on cohesion.

So despite admitting that you have no idea what was done during the 3 week exercise

You are still telling us about it?

Dude, you are a fakking idiot

Henry240:
I've provided the state-of-the-art C2 system the Nigerian Navy has integrated into it's various vessels and units. The Navy is part of the Nigerian military.

What exercises were carried out through out the 3 weeks, why don't you begin by telling us.

Like i said, the Nigerian military learnt absolutely nothing new from Amani Africa. All exercise scenarios and systems have been used or deployed in one form or the other by the military.

Flintlock, Obangame, etc etc are amongst joint training exercises carried out yearly in partnership with other west-African Nations.


If the exercise doesn't deal with contemporary African problems (Terrorism), then the exercise is in futility. Amani Africa is only good for the cameras and threads like this.

So, you:

1. Say your men learnt nothing
2. Admit that you dont know what happened at the exercise

How can you say your men learnt nothing if you dont know what happened at the exercise!?!?!?

Seems to me that all you are trying to do is defend your boy augbugug.

And yes, the 2 hour demonstration is good for cameras because... they specifically saved that part of the exercise FOR THE PRESS. Probably because IT WAS A FVCKING PRESS DEMONSTRATION. Get that into your head.

Jesus, this guy speaks authoritativly about a 3 week 5000 man exercise and the only thing he knows about it is what he saw in a ~2 hour press demo that involved about ~400 men.

Henry240:
Ever heard of Network Enabled Combat Capability?


As i have provided, the Nigerian Navy operates a system that is significantly better.

Uh no you dont

You operate a surveilance system

Facts are this:
1. Nigeria has no intergrated data link
2. Nigeria has no combat managment system

Henry240:
point is, Nigeria operates a Digital C2 system which provides real-time tactical information, surveillance/tracking and networking capabilities which allows the Nigerian Navy to better protect her EEZ.

Thats cool

But its not a battlefield management system

agaugust:
You quote Beegeagle when it suits your wish, but when it does not, you say Beegeagle is a mere blog and not a reliable source

Is Augustine a Nigerian armed forces General to know all types of communication technology the military has?

I am not quoting beegeagle.

I am quoting YOU

YOU SAY that your military lacks it

Henry240:
Are you drunk or just plain silly?

Is Augustine in the military or is he the military that confirms they can share real-time data/video with their COBR facility in Abuja?

That is not a proper data-link - can you share data and radar from multiple platforms (say, a ship, jet, plane helicopter and ground elements) view the data from multiple locations and share data between platforms and employ battle-feild managment technology remotely?

Can one platform "hand-over" targetting data to anothe for example?

Henry240:
Are you drunk or just plain silly?

Is Augustine in the military or is he the military that confirms they can share real-time data/video with their COBR facility in Abuja?

That is not a proper data-link

[size=15pt]that fellow augustine on beegeagles blog has some really complimentary things to say about South Africa

He must be a truly intelligent man[/size]

also Henry120- augustine confirms Nigeria has no datalink

[reffering to what should be purchased from india] Tactical data link for all 3 armed forces to be on one network of secure and real time communication.
https://beegeagle./2015/10/24/nigerian-troops-dislodge-boko-haram-from-kerenowa-chikun-gudu-5-brigade-destroy-over-20-well-fortified-camps/

So that is another thing your blokes would have been learning about

Henry240:
-The first photo is a toyota based Light armoured personnel carrier.

- Second photo is Unimog based Mine Resistant Ambush Protected vehicle.

One vehicale is blatantly inferior to the other.

Anyone can weld some steel onto a chassis and say "look its an LAV"

It takes real skill to develop a proper armored vehicle

rugged7:
Illogical reasoning again
ANC built up weapons in south africa under the noses of the south african army able to engage SA- a perceived apartheid superpower, IRA built up weapons and took over neighborhoods under the nose of the british army, Algerian militants took up swathes of land under the algerian army etc etc etc
It's still difficult to make out your locus standi for these arguments short of spite...
I see you chaps from down under just love abuses, slights and fact misrepresentations just for the hell of it.
I'll just leave u all to play ur little games...

ANC was never a major insurgent force in rsa - most of the action was done by the common man on the street

You cannot compare civil unrest to what BH is doing

For example, which towns did the ANC capture and hold? Which parts of rsa saw full scale military action? Which parts of Rsa was the army expelled from? Did ANC have tanks/arty and technicals? When did the ANC put the army into retreat?

You want to compare boko to a south African conflict? Compare them to PLAN during the border war - and again, we set a world wide example in that conflict (in military terms, don't bring politics into it)

Henry240:
Nigeria did not learn anything from Amani. There is nothing new to learn. Are you r3tarded? ......... Nigeria's C2 infrastructure includes a state-of-the-art COBR facility, what can be more advanced than that?

Since 2011 the Nigerian Navy has always operated an advanced Digital C2
system
"the installation of a new surface
surveillance system, under its Regional Maritime
Awareness Capability initiative. The surveillance system,
which is a United States Navy-inspired coastal surveillance
programme, uses an automatic identification system and
ground-based radar and sensors to enhance awareness of
maritime activities".


According to NN authorities, such technology has become
necessary due to the need for timely and accurate
dissemination of information during operations. The NN says such application of information and
communications technology will definitely enhance
command and control and ICT will play a very important
role in tackling some contemporary challenges.
The system also assists NN authorities in enforcing




The Nigerian military conducts more regular trainings than any country in Africa. Trainings are regularly scheduled(Kontagora, Jaji, Kachia) to deal with Nigeria's and Africa's contemporary threats, size does not matter you fool.

No, combat does not play out like that. As we've seen in Nigeria, there are multiple occasions where you have to take on the enemy in towns, and cities or defend a towns, cities or villages.




* Pic related, Nigerian Navy's state of the art Digital C2 center installed by Davoize Networks Nigeria Ltd.

1. That is not a battlefield management system, you do not operate one nor do you know how to.
2. You do not hold regular brigade sized maneuvers - size does matter
3. Amani Africa's role was not to teach your men how to do their job, it was to teach them how to fight TOGETHER

It's your job to make sure your men know how to FIBUA or fight in various terrain types

And again, I would like to point out that you are basing your opinion on a PRESS DEMONSTRATION (3 hours out of a 3 week exercise) and not THE ACTUAL EXERCISE ITSELF

What is your problem? You think all the generals of Africa made this huge mistake and that only you and August know the truth?

*what is more advanced than your naval surveillance system? link-ZA and the Chaka battle management system!