₦airaland Forum

Dudu_Negro: Ptolomeus,

There is no single book out there that has yet gone into the depths and unveiled the mystery of the narration on Oduduwa's beginnings. This is not to say that there no people that understand or know this mystery. . . but I believe there is good reason why it remains veiled.

I would like for you to read http://www.sacred-texts.com/afr/ife/index.htm. Let's talk afterwards.

All the publications on Oduduwa talk in exoteric terms, to understand who Oduduwa was you need to dive underneath and study Yoruba esoteric.

Dear friend:
Your input is invaluable. It is a pearl that I thank you heartily.
I totally agree with you: we can not see this, no esoteric content! One thing is inseparable from the other!.
Everything is very symbolic and deep. I understand that esoteric and creational explain events with historical events. Am I correct?
I confess I had never seen the name "Aramfé" ... I guess it's a way of naming Oloorún. Am I correct?
I have read about a certain situation which occurred in Orisa (Orishanla? Obatalá?)) and palm wine, which required the intervention of Oduduwa ...
But possibly a different version.
Your sporte is extremely valuable! I am deeply grateful!
I would very much like to continue this dialogue with you.
I have much interest in maintaining the link with you ...
Cuante you with my unconditional friendship, for all that you deem appropriate.

If pastors allow the use of trousers for women, women find their heads, wear long, flowing hair, very short skirts ..
Pastors know that's not of God, they know also that collect tithing is a sin ... but they do.
Use deception, change the word of God, misrepresent the biblical sense for them to benefit, as did the Levites ...
God will be inflexible with them, and unfortunately those who have supported this false church.

. Dup .

I do not understand.
ccording to some, when the biblical God asks sacrifices of virgins in his honor, or when he orders razing a village and kill everyone, or when he orders to cut hands, or when he annihilates all the Deluge creacióin or he sends pest thousands ...... always say that's something metaphorical ...
But when God blesses you, or says "Love one another" .. is literal ...
I see a very biased in that.
I do not know if cutting the hands is something literally or metaphorically ... But not all the terrible acts that led Javeh were metaphorical.

Let's see.
Beyond the cutting of the cake ...
In a wedding party,
1. is celebrated with joy the event. Dance, and music.
2. Food is consumed, which is also a desire of abundance for the new couple.,
3. At the end of the holiday sweet foods are consumed ... This expresses the desire for sweetness ... always firing someone with a sweet food is a desire for sweetness.
They are a series of symbolic acts, desires are expressed through acts ...
Honestly I do not see any of that macho ... anything that denigrates women, on the contrary!
But also ... us analyze a little ... We are judging the cutting of the cake, and no one has asked "why is there a cake?"
Warm greetings to all, dear friends!

tintingz: Christianity is a religion with different doctrines and paganism act

The difference between a religion and a cult, is a sect born of the root of religion.
I am not demeaning to Christianity when I say that Christianity is a group of sects, I do not contemptuously, but on the basis it is not a pure religion, but a division of another religion before.
I am absolutely agree that Christianity is a summation of pagan worship ceremonies.
My respects.

Christianity is not a religion. Christianity is a SECT.
The original religion was Jewish, and she fell off Catholicism.
Catholicism (which is also a sect), came off Christianity.
Therefore Christianity is a sect what was born from another sect.
Besides being a cult, Christianity is spiritist, it is based on the worship of the spirit of a dead man.

After reading this, I think Christians who remain chaste and pure They who argue that sex is a sin! ...
And really I can not stop laughing!

@ Ayomivic
is true. All are wrong ... the only smart you are.
This shows God is unjust ... to you God gave a lot of intelligence and he gave me so little
I would like to be as smart as you ...

buzugee: you know the lord does want you to have some fun. he is not a party pooper. here watch this PSALMS 91 VS 11[b] and wine to gladden the heart of man[/b]
GENESIS 24 VS 67 And Isaac brought her into his mother Sarah's tent, and took Rebekah
SEE THATS WINE AND S-EX. WHAT ELSE DOES A MAN WANT ?

Hahahaha! Really, not all solemnity and sin!
A hug dear friend!

Best in what sense?
That makes more tithing?
He who has the newest car or plane?
He who invents different interpretations on the same Bible passage?
Who has invented the best story about how he was destined to become a pastor?
He who lies more originality?

Image123: i am not basing my answers on reason

Dear Friends,

After that ...THE FLOOD!!

OLAADEGBU: The thread is about reasons why Obama could not possibly be a Chistian. Why then would you expect "good Christians" to vote for him?

Dear friend Olaa:
The problem is that you have the idea that Obama is not Christian or not a good Christian. I can assure you that Mr. Obama is anointed, he is the perfect Christian.
I know you, friend Olaa, is a very good Christian therefore you will vote for Obama, or his successor, as are the candidates of Christ.
Obama is very good Christian, he does not enjoy the Arabs tortured in Guantanamo, nor the abuses of the American army in Iraq, or anything like that he does it with great sacrifice and Christian sense.

When I read posts by some fans, who say that all is sin ... I think the best solution for them.
God supposedly gave them a body that they despise, then not a bad idea that they changed the work of God.
"For Rent knife"

@ 401kk What is a "sin""?
@ Heathen: is mass-produced like toilet paper
@ logicboy Because woman not was created from a rib.

Please you have pity on me! ...I'm going to die laughing!

Dear friends.
For several days I have problems with the anti-spam.
I have a nick only, and always write from the same computer.
The blocking and deletion of my post, it occurs in the first post that I make.
There is no doubt that antispam is malfunctioning, but I think not just about that. You can not not be able to post in some threads. It is not about multiple posts, but only one, and it happens the lock.
I have noticed that it is impossible to post in certain threads, because to do so immediately blocking occurs.
I have contacted some moderators, who always treated me with a lot of friendliness and efficiency, but the problem persists.
Actually, this is still a major problem.
I have a great interest in continuing in the forum, I met wonderful people, but this problem makes me hesitate to intervene.
There may be a solution?
I thank you for the care and kindness they have always had with me.
You are all very friendly.
Ptolomeus.

I put as your consideration, two versions of the Yoruba mythology with respect to Oduduwa.


In the first interpretation found, the great god Olorun asked Orishala to come down from heaven and the first earth crease in Ile-Ife. Orishala was delayed and Oduduwa was his brother who turned this task. Fortunately, later sixteen other orisha came down from heaven to create human beings and live with him on Earth. Among them, Obatala, one of the most important gods to the Yoruba, Obatala is the creator of the human body, in which his father introduced Olorun soul. Tradition also states that the descendants of each of these deities (Orisha) who were responsible for spreading the culture and the main elements of the Yoruba religion for the rest of the Yoruba.

In the second version, Olorun, the god of the sky, threw a chain from heaven into the ancient waters. That chain Oduduwa descended his son. In Oduduwa brought with him a handful of earth, a special chicken fingers and a five seed and a chameleon. Oduduwa then threw a handful of earth on the original water and put the goose five fingers on the earth, the hen started to scratch the earth and spread and spread until it formed the first space of dry land. In the center of this new world, Oduduwa founded the magnificent kingdom of Ife and planted the seed that grew into a great and large tree with 16 branches, symbolizing the 16 sons and grandsons of Oduduwa.

An article that I think interesting is in English.
http://www.raceandhistory.com/cgi-bin/forum/webbbs_config.pl/noframes/read/2312


I hope that my English translation allowing an understanding.


@Negro_Ntns:
Dear friend.
My mood is not to argue, but to provide some information which might help us all.
Originally, the cult Yemoja performing at the Ogun river (there was his temple), and that Orisa was not related to the sea or the ocean, but with the river, fresh water (sweet gater).
You asked about some authors. As already mentioned Dr. John Henrik Clarke, you can add Dr. Ivan Van Sertima, and Leonard Jeffries. To investigate the adaptation of African traditions in Brazil, see the works of Pierre "Fatumbi Verger, and in Cuba the various works of Nidia Cabrera.

Hope this helps.
My respects!

alj harem: Much respect and appreciation. I enjoyed the discussion with you because it is rare to see like of you with this sort of calm nature.

BTW, Egun is different from Egun(Ogu)

Egungun which is short for Egun means masquerade - I think

Egun can also mean Bone

The Egun I am talking about is an ethnic group from the ewe family which is part of the larger Yoruba group. The actual name is Ogu but most other yoruba would not understand thus the use of Egun.

to better understand this I would try to explain.

The yoruba ethnic group itself is a group of nations and in these nations, they are further ethnic groups in them. Ok for example I would use my ethnic group.

Awori-Ogu have both Awori and Ogu people. In Awori we have Brazilain Awori, Egba Awori, Ogu-Awori, etc

In Ogu we have Badagry, Igbogbele, Rapoji, Agbojetho, Kweme, Aivoji, Iweseme, Ajesin-Ogu (benin).

Ok another example would be the Ilajes

In Ilaje we have other subgroups like Ugbo, Mahin, Etikan and Aheri.

I hope you see where I am coming from. Understanding yoruba government is very very interesting to me as well. Although we in Nigeria call ourselves yoruba but those in other countries call themselves their different group name.

BTW Awori-Ogu, Ilaje and Itsekiri are the coastal yoruba groups found in Nigeria.

Dear friend.
I'm really excited about our exchange. Are you a good person. It is difficult to find someone as educated and willing to explain things. It's hard for me to express the magnitude of my gratitude.
I have studied much about the Yoruba. This is a topic that I love. But obviously I'm far away geographically, and it is very difficult to learn.
I've read about the cult Egun as ancestor worship (presumably to tribal or ethnic ancestry).
I understand that the Yoruba, historically there were several kingdoms, in language, traditions, religion and common past. In the beginning, with a central government (political-military) in Oyo, and other cultural and religious in Ile Ife.
I have some material written in Yoruba, that here in Uruguay has remained since the days of slavery, transmitted orally from generation to generation.
It is to Orisa aduras. I would be very interested in you see them, and give me your opinion on the correctness or otherwise of the same and the type of variety used.
If you do not consider it disrespectful to me I would be interested to maintain contact with you.

wise_many2k: The traditional institutions don't work the same way as the political institutes in Nigeria. And the Oba of Benin is amongst the top 10 monarchs (by my own verdict) in Nigeria. I heard (rumour) at the time of the suspension, that the Esama was portraying himself in the public as equal to the Oba and after several warnings, the Oba wielded the big stick on him. The Oba is more feared in benin than the Governor himself.

Thank you very much dear friends and ifyalways Wise.
I ignored the political system of Benin ... Sorry I did you a silly question ...
Also in Nigeria there are other Oba, is not it?
If there are less power than the Oba of Benin?
Or locally is the same power?
Anyway, it is very interesting to receive this information, because I may learn.
Thank you very much for the kindness!
I am grateful to both.
Warm regards!

alj harem: No one is offended. You have every right to ask questions if you are unsure of something because no one knows it all. I still learn a lot on Nairaland every single day that is why I am a bit addicted to this site.

For your question,

My opinion is that you are very correct. Although due to the fact that I don't want to give too much info about myself I would give some details though. Again I am not sure how correct this assumption is.

I was brought up in a royal household in Lagos. I am from the Awori-Egun clan in Lagos state and originally Lagos was a mangrove swampy land with different tiny Islands but 3 main ones. This according to my assumption would have made burial quite difficult give that fact it is water logged. I assumed we most likely took the dead to the inland areas like Ikeja (another awori settlement) etc.

Just to show you what I am talking about, here is one of the many villages Aworis can be found called SAGBOKOJI Island. Notice that there is no land, people are just living on the Ocean

https://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/small/8102039.jpg


Awori-eguns(Ogus) can be found in Ogun state and benin republic thus those Awori-egun there would probablly have buried their dead in their backyard or something. A visit to those area suggest so, also along side other yorubas would have done the very same thing of respecting the dead by having a proper burial site.

My sister, I am not Awori-Ogu expert but from my theories and assumption I made those up. I hope Tpia can shred more light to it

Dear friend:
His explanation was excellent, very valuable.
In addition you have been generous in sharing mujy knowledge.
On investigation, many times we must unite loose threads ... and not always doing so we were right.
I thank you for your valuable input.
I have some reference ... to egún worship (Egúngún?) is very interesting!
Few people in the forum have your spirit of reciprocity and respect for the past.
Admirably!

OLAADEGBU: You have not answered my questions. Are you a good Christian?

I said:
All good Christians should vote for him
That has to do with me?
All good Christians should vote for Obama ... he is a Lord's anointed!

Are you a good Christian?

alj harem: Ok I would try and answer your question. I hope it helps since I am not an expert in yoruba tradition.

I am not aware of people being buried in balconies but I know of the burial in backyard. In my great grandmother's house ( died last year at age 125 years but no birth certificate to prove), I notice the same occurrence at the back garden. Most likely that the burial spot of Great grandfather. From this knowing full well she was born in the late 1800's I would suspect there was no cemetery dedicated for the dead unlike this days thus in other to honour the dead they did that back then. I am not sure if they still do it now (I mean it was only one person that was buried there as far as I am aware and she was not buried there).

I hope I have answered your question, again knowing full well that I am not a yoruba expert but using real life circumstances to say what I know and how I arrived to the conclusion.

Lastly, That is not Yoruba tradition !!!!

My compliments, dear friend.
What you say is more accurate. According to my information, there were burials in the rear (the back) of the houses. I had never heard it do that on the balconies.
I said that this was part of the Yoruba tradition, but you may (as you say) it is a necessity, given the lack of cemeteries.
I can be wrong, but I've played that beyond that there were reasons to do that, I suppose, given the great respect that the Yoruba professed their ancestors, that also could be related. What is your opinion of that?
My question is this:
If there were no cemeteries, burials could be in a forest, right?. I sense that there might be some question on that affective and respectful. I do not say this, but I'm asking your opinions.
I hope nobody is offended, it is just an opinion.
Please accept my best regards!

Mr. Globe:
I just think it has to do with insecurity to those who dont understand we are all learning one or two here

Excuse me my previous attitude. I was really upset about the unfair criticism of that other member. My only intention is to exchange information. I do not pretend to know more than anyone else ... how I could know more than you that lives in Nigeria? I just try to explain what I have learned, in the success or failure. But my intention is not to attack anyone.
Warm regards!

moshoodn: I'VE NEVER HEARD AN IDEA SO DISTORTED AND PHONEY.
YOU CLAIM TO KNOW ABOUT YORUBAS AND YET YOU DO NOT KNOW NIGERIA.

GO GET A LIFE DUDE, AND BURY YOUR LIES.

CASE CLOSED, MR!

You have not agreed to discuss with me ...
I regret that although I do not know Nigeria, I have more knowledge of Nigeria that you, as you live there.
That should embarrass you. Learn to write in lowercase, not rude.
Case closed? Ok. Do not forget to take your things when you leave, get a history book and study of Nigeria.

(not trip when you exit.)

My respects dear friend.
I live in South America and I am not aware of the details.
But strange to separate someone from office without giving the reasons officially ... It is strange that after four years to lift the suspension, without further explanation.
The people do not deserve to be informed of what happens in government?

alj harem: What is wrong with that ?

Is it something bad or out of the extraordinary ?

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. They are traditions, and also have a reason, no doubt a Yoruba can explain. Who will judge something like that is ignorant, and unaware that each nation has its traditions, its culture and history.
My respects.

The Jewish-Christian worships God punish their children.
He killed all of humanity in the flood, swept entire villages, spread plagues and famines ... sadistic ... that God is women virgin asked sacrifices of ... There may be many religious fanatics in Nigeria ... people who collect the tithe ... false prophets .... and, as I said earlier, the Jewish-Christian god loves to punish innocent.