₦airaland Forum

Thanks for sharing dear friend.
What peace and harmony in this story!
How far we are from all that!
Paradoxically, we read in some threads that those responsible for the backwardness of Africa are their traditions, religion, and even the Orisa ,
All that changed with the legacy of Europeans.
"They brought the Bible, they took everything of value (almost everything, could not take the traditions and the desire for freedom) and we condemned to live as slaves"
the price of this Bible has been too high.
My fraternal greeting to all!

red jasper:
In many cases yes the systems have been bought and sold as mere products but the forces behind the systems can only be summoned for purpose, they can never be bought or sold. After I had started the path in america I became increasingly upset at some of the various houses I went through, it was all about 'money and ego' I came to see. There were white 'converters' in some who took the craft more serious than their black counterparts, behind closed doors I witnessed this, they had no problem following the calendar and led some of the best rituals! Whites recognize the value we both should definitely agree on that whether it's capitalistic, spiritual or otherwise.

The person who summarizes them as primitive is actually correct our systems were the first of their kind and didn't derive from anything but the Gods themselves! The trouble is that many from the outside don't have a clear picture of what really transpires inside the systems many are even under the impression of the tradtional path being polytheistic, failing to realize the role of the forces within our galaxy playing to that of the 'supreme' force. If such people began to look at what they considered 'witchcraft' through more of a scientifical lense instead of the status quo religious dogma it would better their understanding of the philosophy behind the native beliefs. The base of much confusion I think lies where many see fit to have a keen grasp on the manipulation of force while prematurely disregarding other aspects, ancient Khamit it took long years to truly master this stuff, like any other science in that if you aren't a devoted practitioner of the field you'll have limited understanding of it. I would ask those same people 'how do aircraft fly' and if not put into exact terminology I likewise would dismiss it as witchcraft!


The rear end.

I agree with you.
There is talk of witchcraft without knowing what is witchcraft.
Witchcraft has its origin in Africa but in Europe!!
Let us open our eyes ,
Here in America we say:
"Europeans arrived, they left us the Bible and took the gold and silver , "
The reality of Africa is no different. The Europeans brought their god, your bible , took almost everything (everything but the culture and the desire for freedom). To assert dominance spoke of "uncivilized" traditions treated as "witchcraft" , when the uncivilized and witches were, are and will be them ,
If the Catholic God really exists, the Inquisitors, slave owners and operators have booked their place in the hell that is not African, but Judeo-Christian.


Dear[b] Mrs. emöfine:[/b]
Thanks for your sweet words.
You may have noticed that my English is bad, and is a great effort to step in and read.
His words are of great value to me.
You're a very intelligent, measured, and friendly.
You can count me as a friend unconditionally.
Thank you!
Best regards!

I am so sorry and so little analysis fanaticism ,
I regret that in defense of the Catholic god change the words of the Bible ,
I think that many who cite the Bible have not read a single word of the Old Testament, and are based on texts adapted doubtful that even changing the original version ,

Pastor AIO:
yes, Ifa deals with all the forces in the world. As eleri ipin, that is witness to creation, he knows what each aspect of creation needs for sustainance etc.

So a Ifa querent can be advised to go and make an offering to Oshun, or even to go and become an oshun devotee.

You're right, one of the most beautiful things about Ifa that really struck me was the beauty and depth of the philosophy. Having studied comparative religion I am struck by how it uniquely portrays those themes that can also be found in other faiths around the world.

First of all, I appreciate your inervenciones.
Indeed, the cult IFA is related to the cult of Orissa. I dare say there could be Ifa worship, not worship of Orisa.
But possibly one of the big differences between a cult and another (IFA and Orisa) is that the cult of Orissa (at least in Africa is specific, ie each cultùa ONE Orissa temple and the priest of the Orisa known specifically rationale is that Orisa) the cult of IFA contains all cults, Egungun, Iyámi Osorongá, etc, etc.
AOI Dear Pastor, I do not try to teach or lecturing, just expressed something to contribute , if it is wrong please let me correct.
I have great respect for you and other colleagues in the forum.
Best wishes!

FXKing2012:
@Mabel had already started a thread with this exact question and we addressed and rested the issue, so why bring it up again?

Anyway just so u know, in those days only male children were named as heirs so there is hardly any mention of female children. Go and read Genesis chapters 4, 9 & 10, only the male children were mentioned laving out the female children.
So even though the Bible only made mention of Cain and Abel (even though Gen 4:25 states that Adam and Eve had another child after Cain was banished whose name was Seth), there could have been - and must have been - other female children born to Adam and Eve but there was no mention of them due to my earlier explanation.

So this puts this question to rest - permanently!

Right.
Then discard that Cain had sex with his mother Eve.
But as you say, it would have had a sister.
I insist that the Bible is llema of incest and marital deceit, which were viewed favorably by God , Abraham just read!

PAGAN 9JA:
the versions practiced in South America and Haiti are mixed with christian elements. it is not the pure form.

Dear friend.
It's true what you say.
Do not forget that African cults in America were created by slaves, under very adverse conditions. Their language, their traditions, their beliefs were banned , In this context, at the time was necessary to resort to syncretism.
In America, there syncretic cults with a greater degree than others, for example because, in Santería the Orisá are called "saints" as it is called Osun idistintamente by name or as "Our Lady of copper" (nuestra señora del cobre) But not all African cults in America have such a high degree of syncretism.
I can assure you that at least in Brazil (Candomblé) and Uruguay (Batuque) there are strong movements to push syncretism and are very important groups of people.
We must also remember that in the times of slavery in America, not only bans forced to make adjustments, as there were not all necessary materials for worship, nor priests had come all the Orisa, the number of practitioners did not allow make an exclusive cult , etc. ONE Orisá. etc.
Anyway, I think it was heroic to keep alive the flame of tradition in such circumstances and in the midst of terrible persecution ,
it is true what you say, but that is changing.

Consequences brought slavery in America and also in Africa, we should not forget that some African kingdoms were literally wiped out as the case of Ketu. Its inhabitants were killed, or moved to America, and the cult Ossossi in Africa almost disappeared. I know who have made ​​great efforts to recover the foundations of that Orisa in Africa.

I send warm greetings!

Michelly:
Ola

Prazer em estar com vocês.
Eu vivo no brasil em cidade de São Paulo
Aqui neste país prezamos pelos ensinamentos de Ifa, sejamos negros ou brancos
Neste momento ocorre uma grande festa popular que chamamos de carnaval onde várias divindades são homenageadas : Olorum, Orunmila, Esu, Sango, Oba, Ogun, Oya, Osun, etc, etc

É uma grande festa em todo país onde cantamos e louvamos os orisas, nossa verdadeira religião que aqui chegou através dos yorubás !!! Beautiful, maravilhosa festa!

Ire o

vejam: ileaxecontatos..com

poemas e previsões odu ifa

Dear friend.
Save Maracatú, I see no relationship between Carnival and Orisá worship in Brazil.
In fact, the houses of Cadomblé, Batuque, Sango (in Recife) closed the vast majority in Carnival.
In Brazil every Orisá has its day, but none matches the carnival.
We should not mix so the worship of Orisá with what may be the "samba enredo" of different "escolas do samba"
An affectionate greeting.

Let's try to analyze it seriously.
The logical possibilities are:
1. Cain had sex with his mother. That would not be surprising. The Bible details many cases like this for example Abraham, husband of Sarah, who at 100 years old had a child with his maid named Agar.
2. In the case of Adam and Eve had had more children (the Bible does not say so) the other remaining possibility is that Cain had sex with your sister ,
Well, whatever , not something to recommend to the Bible do you?

One possible explanation is that perhaps Adam was working away from home, and Cain spent time only with Eve.

OLAADEGBU:
I agree that God is a tri-une God. The diagram below explains it well.

Exactly!
This diagram is in Corinthios 12:42 ,
A=B, B=C then A=C
(There are some exceptions)

Yeah, yeah ,  what you say is true ,

Rossikk:
brainpulse said

Far from 'keeping us in the dark', it was practitioners of African religion that invented writing, architecture, medicine, astronomy, the arts, and the sciences. The Africans who pioneered these areas thousands of years ago, worshipped God the creator as manifested in the African experience and consciousness, not as forced upon them by foreign invaders.

The deities you ignorantly refer to as 'idols', are, in African religion, seen as individual expressions and manifestations of the power of the Creator, who has been worshipped in Africa for 50,000 years minimum, long before the creation of the white man and the invention of 'Jesus'. So, Africans do not worship ''idols''. Go and learn and understand what African religion is before condemning it. If Africans fell behind in technology and came to be exploited by foreigners, that had to do with geographical and political factors that have nothing to do with whatever religion Africans practised. It's as silly as blaming your fate on the type of food you eat, or the colour of your eyes.

Excellent response
Only he who is ignorant may say that African religion has just 1,000 years ,

My respects

Dear friend ghostofsparta
Very interesting your post. I agree with many things.
But I've been pondering a question: we speak of polytheism; of "gods", however, Orissa (as you say) would be humanized representation of certain natural forces Olorún fumes. I understand (please correct me if I'm wrong) that Orisá is not a god but an intermediate stage between men and God only creator. This being so, it would be a monotheistic religion, and the statement that was polytheistic could have been born the wrong concept of the first European researchers ,
I would like to know what you think about it ,

Dear friend PAY 9JA
I agree with you that there is some parallelism between the cult of Orisá and many religions as the Roman, Greek and Norse for example. Add to your examples to Esú (Eshu or if you prefer) with Mercury and Hermes , I think there are many other examples ,

Dear friend Rossikk
I do not know if the best solution is to burn the churches , The blasphemies and falsehoods that claim on Orissa nobody can believe, even they believe them.
The fruit falls from the tree by its own weight.
Our mission is to show that it is not.
At least here there is much lack of religious culture in our media, it must be changed, demonstrate that we are educated, intelligent, honest, good neighbors. I can be wrong, but at least it would be a first step.

Warm regards to all!

lepasharon:
^
'omi didun to n fo okuta'

Thank you dear friend
You have been very friendly!
I am extremely grateful!

Dear Friends,
Can you help me with the Yoruba translation of the phrase:
"sweet water that breaks the hard rock"
From already thank you very much everyone!

Dear friends emöfine and Pagan 9ja

I understand that both are saying the same thing. Possibly what is in the methods differ. I understand and support both positions.
I think it's much more positive rescueing the ancient traditions that embrace alien beliefs, which are not more civilized, on the contrary ,
It is possible that many Africans still do not have any awareness of the great cultural treasure they have.
I respect them both very much.

frosbel:
You obviously skipped over the huge number of verses I quoted above, which are enough proof of the divinity of Christ.

Dear, I did not come to this.
But you still insist on quoting the Bible, specifically the Old Testament and does lying. Since you say you are a Christian, should know that lying is a sin for Christians, basically lie about the bible.
Just one example:
You say "Revelation 1:17-18, Revelation 2:8 - (Jesus is the First and the Last)"
That is absolutely FALSE, and you know it. There are no quotes Jesus but God.
You should also know that the name "Emanuel" is one of the names simply to have Jews call God (not Jesus).

frosbel:
I called you blind because the bible says that you are

"The god of this age ( SATAN ) has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God." - 2 Corinthians 4:4

ou are very rude.
I regret that their parents have taught him to speak with respect for others and no offense.
You still lying about what the Bible says.
What the Bible says is that he who lies is a sinner.
I'm sorry you dropped your mask ,
I beg you in the future be more respectful.
Thank you.

numo86:
frosbel, there is something Jesus is that shows he is not d almighty God & d almighty God cannot be described with such expression,
Jesus is a morning star,
Almighty God can never be the or a mornin star

I hope u know who morning stars are?

Sweetnecta:
them born frosbel god.
Who born am? a young virgin.

A child is born means god of frosbel "is" born.
Can the Creator be born?

He will not understand. He will not want to understand.
frosbel already participated and open different threads with this topic.
He has already published the video several times
Then when someone tries to explain something, he gets angry.

frosbel:
How will you understand, seeing that you are blind to the things of God and need your eyes opened for the great God to ransom your soul  from the chains of darkness.

I am very positive he is able to do it, if you humble yourself, not as you prostrate in the mosque, which is a waste of time, but a real humility of heart and crying out for mercy.

Announced.
Now frosbel calls us blind, chained, and tells us to humble ourselves ,
He is a true light ,
I'm out.

9jafreak:
Bless your heart for this revealing post! My respect for the Dim soared upon reading this! That's how we got it wrong!

Excellent thought.
Hopefully reading this will open some minds
Thanks for sharing dear friend!

Image123:
When someone's shot you on the head with all due respects, and warm greetings. So much for being politically correct. I'm aware of the council of Nicea. My convictions on the Trinity are before my knowledge of such council, and firmly rooted in the scriptures, not in church Fathers and politics. I'm not offended BTW

I'm sorry you felt that you've shot to the head just to give my opinion, and make available the reasons and documents that support it. I do not usually shoot anyone, so do the fans who only want to impose their ideas. That is not my case, I am a man of peace.
I agree that you are convinced of something different to what I documented. Everyone has right to choose.
I have given dates and historical documents endorsed by the Catholic Church.
You say that "I'm convinced otherwise" ,  Well, there are different ways to expose.
But again I say that nobody here is imposing his idea, but giving information.
Sorry if you felt hurt, and if you think of my disagreement "politically incorrect". Thank you for your interest in educating me and explain things that are right and which are not, but I have been educated and have educated my children who fortunately are people known for their sense of ethics and morality.
I do not feel offended
Best regards!

plappville:


1John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

No other spirit should be worshiped, the bible is clear enough for us.

Dear friend.
We talked about the same.
I'm not doubting that there are good and bad spirits.
Which raises my confusion is that some people say they worship evil spirits is something, I understand that even the Bible says in some parts ,
Also defined as Spiritualism or Animism all cult worship of spirits yields.
A That's what I most respectfully I mean.

Excellent exposure dear friends!
For some people, everything that comes from outside is better ,
Even think they see progress and civilization in what actually caused the enslavement of their ancestors.
IFYALWAYS: Exactly , that reasoning is simple: White is good, black is a devil , "Our God is good, your gods are devils"
Cause much pain that some Africans have no memory, and embrace the beliefs and traditions that were the cause of Africa bled, and that still bleeds.
These attitudes (my humble opinion) are the no-progress to Africa, and will turn against themselves.
Africa suffers from an identity crisis caused by the Europeans, has always marked the territories, separated ethnic groups, enslaved, killed , and his great goal has always been this: to destroy the identity and traditions , A people without identity always be a slave.
I wonder: If the African gods were indeed (as some say) the cause of the deterioration in Africa, the new Western God has something better?
The enemies, who enslaved and enslaving Africa are not African gods nor ancient traditions ,
Are those who have always exploited the penetration African military, economic and cultural.
To destroy these traditions is easy , to rescue the ancient African ethical values ​​is the big challenge.
Please excuse my bad English
I hope I have offended anyone
I express my profound respect for all.

brainpulse:
This are idols that have kepi us in the dark for more than 1000years and never added anything Good to our lives why keep them?

Dear friend.
You disagree with an idea does not justify destroying anything.
With this approach would also justify other destroy what you defend and that's not something civilized is not worthy of a tolerant society.
It is possible that some beliefs have not allowed the growth of Africa, but I doubt that others have contributed in some way.
Give others the same respect we demand for ourselves.
My respectful greeting

frosbel:
^^

Anyway , carry on with your 'intellectual research'.

frosbel:
^^
God does not work with human logic but with divine inspiration.

I understand dear friend.
According to their reasoning comes down to faith, to what you think.
They are not important or historical documents nor the Vatican itself.
To you it has no value, "is all about faith."
Understand that in those parameters there is no place to dialogue to the mutual enrichment.
For my part I terminated the discussion, but not before expressing my respect.

frosbel:
You obviously have very little knowledge of the bible, and seem to be repeating what you heard.

I can quote dozens of verses to prove that Jesus Christ is indeed GOD , but what's the point, many on this forum are set in their ways and even if you shoved the truth in their face they will still accept a lie.

Do some study pal.

I apply my knowledge of the Bible where applicable. Not in this case.
You judge me without knowing me, I regret that my comment has bothered him much.
You do not want to understand that if the Bible had spoken of trilogy, or Constantine, or the Catholic Church have bothered to declare that change. Read about the council.
Learn. It is good to read something other than the Bible, even if the Vatican document.
You see, I would not disqualify you, but simply express my arguments.

Enigma:
Jesus' disciples believed Him to be God and belived in God as Trinity loooooooooooooooong before the Nicene Council.

Again as the misinformation about the Nicene council has come up, I refer people to following link and maybe it will help to disabuse their minds of the misinformation.

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-497445.64.html#msg7181702

Dear friend.
After Jesus died, his followers split into several groups fighting among themselves for supremacy. This is a historical fact that no one can deny.
Do you think the Catholic Church and Constantino bother to make a council to declare something that was accepted from more than 300 years ago?
It was not until 381, with the Emperor Theodosius, who officially accepted the trilogy.
Contradictory is not it? .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Nicaea
My respects.

Unable to answer "no" to everything.
I believe in a god, but do not think it so elaborate that god who created the Catholic Church, a god called in the Old Testament animal sacrifices and tithes, then rejects them, and finally becomes a trilogy.
The trilogy was invented by Constantino in 325.
It would be nice to read about it to end this issue.
Not a cuesstión of opinion, but documentation.
My greetings to all

Image123:
Act 10:25 And as Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him, and fell down at his feet, and worshipped him.
Act 10:26 But Peter took him up, saying, Stand up; I myself also am a man
Col 2:18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshiping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,.
Matthew 14:33 Then they that were in the ship came and worshiped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.
Matthew 28:9 And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshiped him.
Mat 4:10 Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.

Deuteronomy 33:27 The eternal God is thy refuge, and underneath are the everlasting arms: and he shall thrust out the enemy from before thee; and shall say, Destroy them. FATHER
Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. SON
Heb 9:14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? SPIRIT

The Father, The Son, and the Spirit have an EQUALITY of function like no other. It is in the beginning God, God there been 'Elohim' which is plural of the Supreme being, and appearing hundreds of times in scripture. It is God that made the heaven and earth. It is God that raised Jesus, it is God that spake to the prophets, yet they are so interchangeably and seemlessly ''substituted'' for the other all through scriptures.
Matthew 1:18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.
Christ is actually the Son of the Holy Ghost, who is God the Spirit.

2Corinth 3:17 Now the Lord is that Spiri[/b]t: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

John 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshipers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
John 4:24 [b]God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Gal 4:6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
1Peter 1:11 Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.

Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,
John 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
John 5:23 That all men should honor the Son, even as they honor the Father. He that honoreth not the Son honoreth not the Father which hath sent him.
John 17:10 And ALL mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
Joh 16:15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall show it unto you.


2Peter 1:11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

1Corinthians 10:9 Neither let us tempt Christ, as some of them also tempted, and were destroyed of serpents.
Isa 63:10 But they rebelled, and vexed his Holy Spirit: therefore he was turned to be their enemy, and he fought against them.

1Cor 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
1Cor 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghos[/b]t which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
1Cor 3:16 Know ye not that [b]ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
1John 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.
Rev 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
John 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.
1Th 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Heb 13:12 Wherefore J[b]esus also, that he might sanctify[/b] the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.
Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; Eph 5:26 That he might sanctif[/b]y and cleanse it
Rom 15:16 That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God, that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable, being [b]sanctified by the Holy Ghost.
i should not be giving scriptures for that, i hope?
Isa 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and[b] his redeemer[/b] the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.
Isa 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no savior.
Matthew 21:5 Tell ye the daughter of Zion, Behold, thy king cometh unto thee, meek, and sitting upon an Bottom, and a colt the foal of an Bottom.
Titus 2:14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
Phi 3:20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Savior, the Lord Jesus Chris[/b]t:
Rev 22:13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, [b]the first and the last.
Time would fail me to continue to list these things so evidently set in scriptures, yet a mystery.

Etc. etc,
Respected friend:
If you had read my post, had understood that I put at the disposal documents of the Catholic Church, showing that the divinity of Jesus as God, did not happen before the year 325. The passages you cite (Peter, Mattheus, etc. etc.) are much older, do not tell us that Jesus is God, Jesus never said that, neither did his disciples, and the Bible never considered him a god or the old or the new testament.
I would like a commentary on the Council of Nicea.
Maybe then we would talk about the same.
I hope you do not feel offended by my comment.
A warm greeting!

Being Jewish does not mean being better or worse than anyone. For the simple fact of being Jewish is not more nor less intelligent than others.
The intellectual level is personal, not owned by an ethnic group or race.
There are good Jews and bad jews, smart jews and dumb jews , As with all nationalities.
It is not good to spread such myths.
My greetings!

Dear friend.
Could anything be more explicit in your question?
My English is not good, and they do not understand if you are referring to the African Traditional Religion as a tool for getting a job ,

Jesus never spoke of the existence of a trilogy.
Nor did his disciples.
The concept trilogy (Father, son, and holy spirit) starts to apply in the Catholic Church in 325 after the death of Jesus, to be held in the Council of Nicea. In the council convened by Constantino, discussed the "Arrian controversy" that is, the possible divine origin of Jesus.
This is not my personal opinion, but what is accepted and documented by the Vatican.
I recommend reading on this subject, as the trilogy is very long after the death of Jesus, so that biblical quotations that have been published on this subject, are absolutely wrong and misleading.
I do not mean to offend anyone, simply provide documentation to clarify the issue.
My respects.