₦airaland Forum

Maynman:
If they had freewill, why can’t they use it?

They did.

Courz:
All of them. All their doctrines that distinguishes them from Christianity. In fact, all of the foundation of the Cult, everything upon which the Cult was built upon, all their claims of being selected, everything I don't believe in. Their foundation upon which the Cult was created is False. Their Founder being a Freemason just made the Fraud they are committing very obvious.

These are my reasons. They are not Christians as they have claimed not to be part of Christendom. They redefined Christendom to mean False Christians but the dictionary tells us Christendom is the whole of Christianity. So, is the dictionary wrong and is Watchtower right? No where will you ever see such made up definition of Christendom. It is just a Watchtower thing. And they are correct to say they are not Christians because it is a Masonic Cult. Their founder was a Freemason and there are Freemasons amongst them that they know as Anointed. Their alienation from Christianity is a Red flag. Rutherford their former president used to talk about the downfall of Christianity happening in the year 1918 when Armaggedon happens. That tells you they are not Christians.

If they are truly Christians, then why is Jesus Christ not the central part of their doctrines? A Christian is a follower of Christ. Christian is derived from Christ. The New Testament is about Jesus. Why are they allergic to Jesus? Jesus is the Way, The Truth, and the Life. No one comes to Almighty God except through Jesus. Why is this not emphasised in JW? Instead of Jesus being the Way, The Truth and the life, The organisation Watchtower is being taught to be the Way, The Truth and the life. A Business Corporation is the Way, the Truth and The Life. If a religion claims to be Christian but doesn't bring you closer to Jesus whom they are supposed to represent, that's a red flag. So, Watchtower has replaced Jesus in the lives of JWs. Watchtower is always called The Truth. During the time of Rutherford, they were very open to say they are the Christ by saying the Christ is made up of Jesus and the 144,000/Anointed. Now, they don't say this directly but they do indirectly by saying that JWs need to obey the The Anointed /144,000 in order to have Salvation. Jesus is also not the Mediator of the JWs, but only for the Anointed/ 144,000. You can see a very obvious attempt to replace Jesus in JW. Now, they say their Governing body is the voice of Jesus.

In the beginning of the Cult when Joseph Rutherford was their President, they kicked against Religion as a Whole. You will find many of their publications and even audio talks of Rutherford saying this. They never identified as a Religion. When they used to preach back then, people will ask them are they christians? They identified as an organisation. This means that they were very open about being a Book Publishing Business Corporation. Their founder Charles Taze Russell made it explicitly clear in a Watchtower document to their Shareholders that Watchtower Bible and Tract Society is not a Religion but a Business. Rutherford said Religion as a whole is a Snare and a Racket. He spoke against Religion. Their history will tell you all you need to know as to why you should never take their doctrines seriously. They change their identity every few years. One time they are a Business, another time they are a religion. One time they said the Faithful Slave in the Bible is the Governing body and the Anointed JWs. Now, they say it is only the Governing body. They are a very confused people that are pathological Liars.

When I woke up from the Cult, It became very obvious what Watchtower is trying to do as a Freemason Cult. Freemasons don't believe in Jesus. JW doctrines push them completely away from Jesus Christ which in turn makes them have no relationship with him. Even mentioning Jesus when discussing with them irritates them. Therefore, I saw the need to drop all their beliefs and read the Bible alone all over again. I needed to reformat my Brain, drop all the deceptions and Whatever I read from the Bible that obviously contradicts their teachings, I stick to it because the Bible is supreme. Since they have their own Bible that is deliberately made to tweak and twist Bible verses with some words added and removed, I needed to deprogram myself to remove all their Mind control experiments in my Brain. Being a JW means to be willing to undergo Mind Control Programming /Experiments. I was able to deprogram myself by researching their history, their dirty laundry plus scandals and just by reading the Bible alone! An Ex illuminati Member turned Christian once said, you will know an occultic religion or when a religion is tied to the Occult when they tell you Not to read the Bible Alone. Charles Taze Russell who was a Freemason said that if you read the Bible alone, you will fall back to the beliefs of Christians. This means that he doesn't regard the Bible as supreme. You need other books to help you which is just a ploy for a religion to formulate their own beliefs outside the Bible. The Bible is not difficult to understand when you are bestowed with the Holy Spirit. Jesus knew this or else he wouldn't have said he would send the Holy Spirit to his people in order to understand the Bible.

You seem too furious about them. But take it easy. They are christians. They just understand the bible different from others.

Freemason? No no. They're not occult. Haba guy. I don't agree with their theology nor agree that they were chosen as they paint in their history, but they are not any cult.

I do love the way the church, along with The Chosen church, Mountain of Fire dress and groom. Although they do go to extreme, but it's good news that they don't go along with popular views. How does your church make that happen?

Do you enforce a fine or excommunicate members who don't dress as your church teach or what? Why do many of your members stick to that value?

Do you excommunicate and shun like JWs?

Do your church view yours as the only true church and that other church will head for hell fire if they don't follow the teachings of your leader?

If I become a member, can I hold another theological view apart from what your leader teach?

How will I be viewed if I'm your member and also attend Christ Embassy, Redeem etc? So do you view other men of God as true men of God or only those in your church?

I will ask more, let's start from there. If possible, give a link to your website where the specific questions above are answered.

Myer:
Rom.5.12 - Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned-

Thanks for sharing.
Can you explain why?

Adam and Eve had freewill. They could have chosen to follow what God said and remain alive.

WipKnot:
Now this is for those who seek the truth about the WORD of God, and not in any way to argue with JW.

The scripture has already written about JW in
2 Timothy 3:5-7 King James Version
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,

7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth

Now back to topic
The Holy Bible says, God is not a man that he should lie.

Genesis 1:26
“And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.”

Genesis 1:27
“So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.”

God said let US create man in our image,
and God created man in HIS own image.

Does it mean Gód has cheated the others. Impossibility

In Exodus 3:14 - And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM

In John 8:58 Jesus said, Before Abraham was, I AM.

Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ has claimed equality with God Almighty.

Why, because, Jesus Christ is God Almighty.

God was evidently talking to Jesus.

Myer:
This is a very sensitive topic that I perceive needs to be discussed and addressed.
May God grant us all answers.

Feel free to share your personal opinion without feeling pressured to sound religious please.
And feel free to share your religion's position as well with references please.

cc jesusjnr
kobojunkie
maxinthehouse
righteousness69
seun
mods

Man... Rom 5:12

Like Deeperlife, JWs feel the same way. Will I say JWs are the worse in their view of other denominations. To them, all others are false from A to Z. They almost view them like idol worshipers. They've got so much pride I never see.

A situation where you think that another person who believe in God and has faith in Jesus is much like an idol worshiper, may God forgive you.

FreedomfromtheT:
Nonsencical comments born out of ignorance and envy.

He said the truth. Deeperlife started with a lot of pride. But now they are changing things.

brocab:
Now if Max didn't write this: I suppose many would believe you that the Jehovah witnesses don't deny Christ. As soon as you refuse Christ as our Lord and savor- and calling it a blind belief you have denied Christ.
There is no where in the bible where we read Jesus is "Just" a son of God-No Jesus is "THE" Son of God, NOT A SON.
He is not one of the angels, nor is He Lucifer's brother.
{1 John 5} Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the father loves his child as well. This is how we know that we love the children of God: by loving God and carrying out his commands.
It say's God Love's His Child-Jesus is "THE" Son of God.
I will say it again "As soon as you refuse Christ as our Lord and savor- and calling it a blind belief you have denied Christ.
We obviously don't worship the same God-so to answer your misunderstanding of the Word of God-Yes God does show us in Word: who's saved: One must be Born again before he can enter into the Kingdom of God.
{Matthew 28:19} “Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit.”
Do the JW believe in baptism? Baptism is a requirement for being considered a member of Jehovah's Witnesses-after reading some documents on line about the Watchtower: it is now said: the Jehovah witnesses refuse to be baptized in the Holy Spirit, but rather be baptized under the Watchtower organisation "So by Max's comment, it is very unlikely you are saved in the Name of Jesus Christ.

I always advise that one should criticize constructively and truthfully. You can't lack the basic understanding of JWs beliefs and criticise them constructively. You will just be attacking a straw man.

JWs believe in Jesus and their lord and savior. They do baptism. That is the basic thing. It is true they require you cover a certain book, but they still baptize. That's the important thing.

It's obvious you just want to force them out the equation even when it doesn't balance.

Kobojunkie:
But what he said from the beginning is wrong so how can he be spot on? For one Jesus Christ never said He would return after some supposed seven years of tribulation.

I don't agree with that part. But some scholars hold to that opinion. I haven't research it myself. Thanks for pointing it out.

Ihedinobi3:
I don't know any part of the Bible that teaches anything about a rapture. Of course, the Latin translation of 1 Thessalonians 4:17 uses the word from which "rapture" is derived to translate the Greek for "caught up," but that does not really mean that there will be any stealing away of human beings from the earth by the Lord. It only means that at the Resurrection, all the saints will assemble in the air with the Lord before He begins His vengeance on the armies destroying Israel at the time of His Return.

Everything I have ever read in the Bible from Genesis to Revelation speaks to the fact that the Lord Jesus will return at the end of the seven-year Tribulation (the second 3.5-year half of which is called the Great Tribulation) to resurrect the Church. That is what I believe and teach.

It is at that Return and after He has resurrected all believers, that is, given them new glorious and eternal material bodies to live in with Him forever that He will enter into battle against the Antichrist and all the armies of the earth that will be at Jerusalem at that time (Matthew 24:29-31; Zechariah 13:7-14:21, cf. Ezekiel 5:1-4).

Eschatology is a very large subject. In fact, it uses and requires a solid understanding of all the teachings of the Bible, so getting into it can be pretty challenging for both of us, not to mention the various erroneous and emotionally charged interpretations abroad that would probably continue to require address just to get them out of the way.

Suffice to say that the war between Satan and God that led to the destruction of the first perfect universe and the creation and fall of man will finally enter its last legs in the Tribulation. Since being a believer makes any human being a member of God's Army on earth, it is really ridiculous to think that we will not be here to fight at that time. We will be. After the intense seven-year battle that will result in the apostasy of a full third of the Church and the martyrdom of another third, the Lord Jesus will return to resurrect all those who believed from Adam and Eve until the last one to believe just before His Return. Then He will destroy the Antichrist, his armies, and all those who took the mark of the Beast.

There will be very few human beings left alive (compared to the billions living now) after the war of Armageddon (an inspired puzzle that refers to Jerusalem).

The Lord Jesus will then renew the earth. For example, the Dead Sea will be made fresh again. The mountain on which Jerusalem stands will be elevated to be the highest mountain on earth. Deserts will become lush forests. Animals will cease to be wild and dangerous. Even natural carnivores like lions will feed on plants. The very seasons will change, reverting to the time before the Flood when there was no cold winter or hot summer. There will be no more weapons and standing armies on earth. Nations and languages will continue to exist, of course, but now they will operate in a more harmonious and more peaceful manner. All disputes between nations will be settled by the Lord Jesus Himself.

It will be the most prosperous, most beautiful time that humans have ever had on earth, not counting the Garden of Eden before Adam and Eve sinned. The spiritual kingdom ruling over the world at that time will be the Kingdom of Heaven headed by Jesus Christ and administered in varying degrees and various capacities by the resurrected saints of the ages before that time. That is, after the Church has been resurrected and, as one of the seven Thunder Judgments (Revelation 10:3-4; not the right medium here to explicate these judgments) to be administered, they have been evaluated according to their works of faith, each one will be given their position in Jesus's worldwide government in the Millennium with some earning a much higher rank than others.

It is the saints then who will rule over the earth with the Lord Jesus, not Satan and his demons anymore.

There will still be unbelievers in those thousand years, and some of them will break the law, but the punishment for disobedience will be so severe (death, in fact) that very few indeed will dare to test the Lord Jesus like that. If a nation refuses to send delegates to the annual assemblies at Jerusalem, for example, they will suffer droughts until they repent (Zechariah 14:16-19). Suffice to say that it will be as perfect a world as it can get with human beings who still have a sinful nature living in it. There will be very few deaths too (Isaiah 65:20). Many of those who start the Millennium will actually live through it, just as it once was before the Flood, only better.

At the end of this time, Satan will be released from the Abyss to test humanity again. In short order, he will foment a rebellion against the perfect government of Jesus Christ. That will result in the destruction of this universe. Then there will be a final Judgment of Millennial believers and then of all unbelievers from Cain until the last unbeliever to die.

After that Judgment, the Lord Jesus will create a new Universe to which the Father will return to live with all believers and elect angels forever. All unbelievers along with Satan and his fellow rebel angels, on the other hand, will be thrown into the Lake of Fire to suffer there eternally.

In short, yes, it is after the Great Tribulation that the Lord Jesus will return to rule over the whole world. But, no, there is no such thing as a rapture.

Spot on.

brocab:
So if they refuse Christ: then they don't follow Christ. So "they are not Christian, they don't work for Christ they work for Jehovah. And they don't see Christ to be the only true God and creator of all creation.

Jehovah's witnesses don't refuse Christ. Where did you get that from? If you want to criticize, do so constructively, don't import lies just to discredit them. Different denomination with there differing understanding of God word.

JWs see Jesus as a son of God, and that he is not equal to God. Although majority of scholars would say Jesus and God are the same, there is a strong argument against that, and I am yet to see any scholar who has settled this arguments without any plausible objection.

What should be paramount is that we all worship the same God. Unless God directly tells you that your position is correct, don't feel you are above others in God's sight. No one has monopoly over truth.

1. Jesus instructed his followers to preach the gospel--> Unlike other churches who oly broadcast on TV or have their member go in packs on the streets distributing church invites, jehovahs witnesses are the only group of christians who still patiently o from house to house teaching people

2. Celebration of pagan holidays- christs' date of birth is not recorded in the bible, and he never instructed that we help him celebrate it, amongst many other pagan holidays.. And jehovahs witnesses are he only people who dont celebrate these pagan holidays.

3. Non-request or tithe- jehovahs witnesses dont ask their members for tithe, instead they donate undisclosed amount out of freewill.

non-segregation of members- unlike most churches where the big men sit on comfy chairs while ordinary members sit on plastic chairs or where titles such as most. reverend, senior pastor, his holiness, and many others.. jehovahs witnesses either adress each other by name or add the prefix brother or sister.

I will agree with you on the last point. While not insulting the true men of God out their, I don't like the segregation in churches where people are treated on how fat their pocket are.

They probably don't have a sacred cow especially when the sin is public knowledge. We want to be careful here though since they do a lot of cover ups.

2. Yes door to door has been their most effective way. That is commendable although we can't be sure if all who engage in it do so whole heartedly. There is a lot of pressure from the leadership to move people to do it. But it's a plus. They aren't the only ones doing it anyway, but they come prominent.

But don't think that televangelism, crusades, market or street evangelism isn't a good method of preaching. No, I am not with you on that. The churches are doing a great job on that. They need to be commended as well. Whichever method any church chooses, God can bless it. Especially when these evangelism is backed by miracle they have huge fellowership than what a JW can get while doing door to door.

3. JWs are the ONLY ones who don't celebrate this pagan holidays. Really? No. I would rather say that they are among the few that don't celebrate pagan holidays. Altho their restriction on birthdays is laughable. But pls don't judge others on this. Christ might view things differently. I think christians shouldn't celebrate Christmas but I am careful not to judge.

4. Yup. They don't tithe or obligate members to bring money. That's a huge plus if you ask me. Many churches have turned themselves to business houses. It is sickening.

Does that then mean that they are the only true Christians? No. I mean don't be funny. You can say God is PROBABLY happy with them and yes, individually some faithful persons their could be saved by God since they believe in Jesus. But the only true Christian religion? I don't even see how that is remotely possible.

First, they are not the first Christian church nor do they have link to the first christians.

Secondly, assuming God has changed His mind on the church that has such link, they haven't produced any supernatural or divine miracle from above to show that God has made such a change. So it's very risky to think they are the ONLY true Christian church.

Can't we judge it by few positive attributes they have? No. If you read the bible, you will see countless, I mean countless errors made by the Israelites, who were God's chosen people. Now, you can't because of such idolatry and great moral decay say that God had rejected the Jews. If you do that, you would err. However it was until when God did show that on Pentecost that we know God had changed from using the Jews as a nation.

JWs can't wake up and then claim God has chosen them and you fall for that. Don't be gullible. If I will be kind enough, I will say wait and see if God will pure out his spirit on them to show divine approval. Even at that, they won't be the ONLY ones. Others have received such divine approval. Don't judge other churches based on there few mistakes as imperfect humans. God's view do sometimes differ from what we think.

Yes, give them their plus where they deserve but don't think they are the ONLY Christian church.

jesusjnr2020:
The idea fit not bad but the purpose might be another thing altogether, because if na to advance their heretic antichrist doctrines, like to say Jesus na angel Michael, Hell fire no exist, etc., then plenty comma dey inside.

Doctrine apart, this is a giant stride. We want to commend what is good. Since they believe in Jesus and teach that faith in his name leads to salvation, that is a basic truth. We should take it easy on any who have faith in Jesus cos you may not know how God sees him or her.

Kobojunkie:
1. The great multitude along with that is written of the actual identity of the 144,000 who were marked and sent out almost 2000 years ago, will be revealed when Jesus Christ returns to rule over the world with them from Jerusalem where they will all be gathered back to at the time of the resurrection.

2. Again, the 144,000 has nothing to do with any religious sect out there as they are instead of the 12 tribes of Israel as explained by John in his revelation which corresponds with that explained by the prophets —Isaiah 66 vs 18 - 23. Yes, the 144,000 were sealed meaning they will all make it into Heaven at the end, but the multitudes are not necessarily all sealed. Instead, they are all born-again, but not all sealed, the seal being the Spirit of Truth which was promised by Jesus Christ Himself only to those who truly belong to Him.

I don't see how what you said relate to the comment.

You may refer to the op to understand how I reached my conclusion.

MaxInDHouse:
Number already complete, newly chosen ones now serves as replacements for those who lost the privilege!

We're saying the same thing. The number is yet to be filled up.

Dtruthspeaker:
If they are greater than 144000 then how did you come to say "My submission is that the 144000 evidently refers to all true christians"

Clearly this statement does not mean more than 144000!

Literally, no. But symbolically, yes.

When I say "144000 evidently refers to all true christians". I mean that 144000 is a symbolic number referring to all christians.

Dtruthspeaker:
You say
"My submission is that the 144000 evidently refers to all true christians"

Yet you say

"If you did understand my position, you will know that I was not saying that only a literal 144000 will be saved."

And you don't see nothing wrong with this 2?

No. I don't see any contradiction, because all true christians will be greater than 144000 in number.

Janosky:
Whenever you add "technically", it's obvious that your claim is spurious.
"Technically" is another word for lie lie.
IYKYK.

The "other sheep" or Great crowd" are Jehovah's servants with the hope of everlasting life in God's earthly kingdom.
Jesus referenced them @ Matthew 5:5 & Rev 21:3-5.

I don't know when you will learn.

Dtruthspeaker:
Not after you said this.

"My submission is that the 144000 evidently refers to all true christians "

May I ask what is wrong with that?

Dtruthspeaker:
Some tribes? Is 1200 times 12 not 144000?

Not all the tribes of Israel are mentioned there.

Janosky:
Revelation 7:9-10 says no. JWs are right.
If your claims were true, you are inferring that the Great Crowd who owe their salvation to the God & to the Lamb would be destroyed (harmed) because they are NEVER sealed .

Fair question. Let's consider the timing for the great crowd.

They are shown AFTER the Great Tribulation. If this GT refers to final consummation (which JW agree), it then means that John is still seeing this same 144000, but this time AFTER the Great Tribulation while verses 4-8 see the same group before the Great Tribulation.

Your comment however, clearly shows the unlikelihood of the JWs understanding. Because as the great crowd is not sealed, according to JWs, then they will be harmed. That's why that understanding has an issue.

Revelation 7:9-10 says not only 144,000 would be saved.

The sealing of 144,000 is guarantee of their heavenly calling to rule with Christ as "kings and priests", Revelation 1:5-6., Revelation 5:10

If you did understand my position, you will know that I was not saying that only a literal 144000 will be saved.

Dtruthspeaker:
Don't you people see when you read? The Bible clearly said 12000 from each of the tribes in Israel and Isreal is not the whole world.

It is clear and some tribes of Israel are mentioned. However, to get the meaning, you would need to compare what else is said of that same group in another scripture.

Kobojunkiee:
First things first, the 144,000 are all Israelites. This from the context of the very same book of Revelation where you claim to have gotten your information from. Second, they all have the mark of God, and according to scripture, those who were marked by God were instead those sent out into the world to bring back their brothers and sisters — Israel — from all the ends of the world - Isaiah 66 vs 18 - 23 meaning these are people who were sent out from the beginning of the march to gather the lost sheep of Israel, and so are not of this age.

If you're saying that the 144000 are Israelites, and that these Israelites are the marked ones sent out to gather their brothers, Israelites. Hmm.

Verse 18 says:

18For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory. 19 “I will set a sign among them, and I will send some of those who escape to the nations—to Tarʹshish, Pul, and Lud, those who draw the bow, to Tuʹbal and Jaʹvan, and to the faraway islands—who have not heard a report about me or seen my glory; and they will proclaim my glory among the nations.

From that verse, it is clear that those who get the message are people of the nations, not Jews. Am I missing something?

Secondly, remember that those exempted from the "hurt" of Rev 9:4 are those having the mark only. Meaning that others get hurt. Our interpretation should therefore encompass all through christians as God can't smite His own faithful people right?

From your understanding those whom the message is declared to as in verse 19, will be hurt.

MaxInDHouse:
Both means the same thing!

Another error. The other sheep and Great crowd do not technically mean the same thing.

MaxInDHouse:
NO!

Like seriously? God is not omnipotent and omniscience?

Before you come online to defend JWs, you should thoroughly know there teachings.

The research I have done on this subject produced me with different understanding as to whom this group refers to. This post is not to mock any differing view, since the bible didn't explicitly provide the answer as to who this group is, one doesn't need to be dogmatic on this issue.

scholars are divided as to the identity of this group. Some say it literally refers to the Jews while others say it refers to all genuine christians. Deeper Life sees this group as referring to Israelites at the time of the end.

Jehovah's witnesses think the group literally are those going to heaven. They feel that the number started to be gathered from first century and would continue to the end of this world.

There is a good reason to see this 144000 as referring to all true christians at the time of the end.

First, the timing of the event.

Rev 7:3
2 And I saw another angel ascending from the sunrise, having a seal of the living God; and he called with a loud voice to the four angels to whom it was granted to harm the earth and the sea,
3 saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we shall have sealed the servants of our God on their foreheads.

This shows that the event was still future, it will happen before the final destruction of this world. This shows that the 144000 will be available on earth close to the end of this age. So the understanding by JWs that the counting starts from the first century is wrong.

2. Execution of those not marked.

This will help us put a meaning to whom this 144000 refers to. At Rev 9:4, we read:

"And it was said unto them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree, but only such men as have not the seal of God on their foreheads."

Here shows that those to be spared are only those with the mark on their foreheads. This refers to the 144000 mentioned at Rev 7:3,4. This would mean that the 144000 are all true christians, because it would be unthinkable that only a literal 144000 would be spared from the wrath and the rest of the faithful christians punished.

My submission is that the 144000 evidently refers to all true christians during the period close to consummation of this age.

OLAADEGBU:
1. We don't have the originals of the New Testament, and most of our copies come from more than two centuries after the New Testament was written: While this statement is technically true, it doesn't actually say anything useful to the discussion.

In fact, it barely says anything meaningful at all! The New Testament has been copied non-stop for almost 2,000 years. We're still copying it today. Of course, most of our copies come from after the first 200 years. How could they possibly have made more copies in just the first two centuries than people would be able to make over the next eighteen centuries? It's just common sense that most copies would come later.

The fact is, however, that the New Testament was written in the mid-to-late first century AD, and by the end of the third century AD (or within just over 200 years of the time of the New Testament writers), we have surviving manuscripts from almost every book in the New Testament.³

For many New Testament books we have quite a few! For example, we have 16 manuscripts of the Gospel of John within that time-frame, and for Matthew, we have 12!⁴ When dealing with literature so ancient, this is a vast wealth of early testimony. There are also a fairly large number of other Christian writings whose earliest manuscripts date back that far.⁵ Many of these manuscripts contain quotes from the New Testament, adding even more confirmation of what the original text said. The truth is that we have diverse examples of the New Testament text from very early on, and they all use the Greek word "Kurios" rather than the proper name YHWH. We never once find Jehovah in the New Testament.

http://ow.ly/nZ6b50M7U23

This is the best rebuttal on Jehovah's name in the New Testament I have ever seen. I used to believe that the name should be there following the JW argument, but this site has changed that belief.

"The following year, 1963, an enlarged application of “Babylon the Great” was presented.c (Rev. 17:5) A review of secular and religious history pointed to the conclusion that the influence of ancient Babylon had permeated not only Christendom but every part of the earth. Babylon the Great was thus seen to be the entire world empire of false religion. An awareness of this has enabled Jehovah’s Witnesses to help many more people, from diverse backgrounds, to respond to the Biblical command: “Get out of her, my people.”—Rev. 18:4." - Jv chapter 10.

JWs see Babylon the Great of Rev 17,18 as the world empire of false religion. In other words all religions except the JWs are known to them to be among Babylon the Great.

Pls my work here is not also to educate you and then disprove you. You should know your doctrine well. And be humble to be civil. You curse and then don't even know your doctrine. Nawa for you guy.

Janosky:
Pinkylovely Carry this GIBBERISH outta here.

Are you sure you are really a Jehovah's Witness?

So if someone asks you, what is Babylon the Great, you will start to answer that is an ancient literal city in Babylonian Empire?

Inspite of your lack of knowledge you still insult? Seriously, you have a problem. No person should discuss with you about the witnesses because it is either you're not a witness or you didn't even study before you baptized or you studied but your teacher didn't do a good job or he did a good job but your head doesn't grasp points for long.

Janosky:
According to the screenshot PROVEN you have a lot to learn or continue typing GIBBERISH.


Kpele

This guy sef. Hmmm, and you think you just said something?

The witnesses say that Babylon the Great in the book of revelation stands for all false religions. In other words, all religion that is not Jehovah's witnesses are under the title Babylon the Great. They say these because the bible condemn Babylon for their spiritistic practices.

However, see the clear meaning at Rev 17:
18 And the woman whom you saw means the great city that has a kingdom over the kings of the earth.”

Simply put, it means the the Great City, but this city has a kingdom over the kings of the earth. It is not even a world empire as supposed by the witnesses. It is a city. It is possible that a city can have influence over other nations. Was it not what the ancient city of Babylon did? Mind you, Babylon was still standing as at this time John wrote this. How do you know if this verse is not about Babylon? There is admittedly differences of opinion here. Many scholars see this city as Rome. Some say it's Jerusalem. Iam not arguing for anyone. We can't be dogmatic.

When arguing Rev 20;13-15, the witnesses usually says that Lake of fire means the second death because that is what the verse said, but they now came to Rev 17:18, they saw means, they gave it rather another meaning when the bible has already told us the meaning.

If you want to teach another, no wahala, but don't just keep condemning other religions for your imperfect doctrine. You may just be wrong and you don't know.