@Bernimoore,
you make me laugh.  It's a pity that despite spelling it out for you, you still say Abraham made a 'mere vow' regarding tithing. Since you still cannot see that Abraham tithed WITHOUT making prior a vow to tithe, then let's let it be. No need for argument.

@garyarnold,
I have said that I have reached my conclusion. Deduce what you can from my post since spelling it out plainly to you is not sufficing.
I maintain that the spoils were for Abraham. If not he would not have said also that the king should let the 'men that went with me take their portion'. The men were his servants and as part of the victors, rightly had a portion of the spoil, understand.

Your analogy of giving a tenth to the king as a custom is skewed. The king of Salem (Melchizedek) was not mentioned as part of the kings that came together. We hear of him after the victory, so based on the custom, who of the kings should have been given the tenth? Remember, there were alot of kings mentioned.
I guess you should stop making assumptions, it was mentioned he was the Priest of God, that was for a purpose.


And as I've pointed out earlier a 'mere' tenth is the beginning of giving and not the end. Even per OT, the people gave 'far far far' more than a mere tenth in totatality. Not to talk of present days where giving tithes, offerings, various gifts/vows, giving to church projects, giving to the poor, needy, motherless etc are very common.
Hence your giving a 'mere tenth' is just as should be.
Cheers.

@Bernimoore, pls when you confirm that you misquoted the bible by saying Abraham made a vow to tithe and that you confused Abraham forcing Melchizedek to receive tithe then we can proceed.

'Abraham SAID to the King of Sodom that he (Abraham) made a vow to GOD not to take anything from the King of Sodom so that the King of Sodom will not say he (king of Sodom) made Abraham rich.'
Do you see that Abraham did not 'vow to tithe?'. Agreed?


Besides, all the scriptures i showed will more than inform a sharp eye what i've been explaining on tithe.

@Bernimoore,
I say again:
1. Abraham did not make a vow to tithe. He made a vow not to take anything from the spoil with reason. Gen. 14:22-23. Stop getting confused.
2. The king of sodom negotiated with Abraham for the people while he told Abraham to take the goods. These were now property of Abraham since he recovered them from battle.
I just hope you are not mixing King of SODOM with King of SALEM (i.e Melchizedek, priest of the most high GOD).

Let me know when you 'untie' yourself from this seeming 'knot' of confusion.


@garyarnold, to each his own. As I said, my previous response to you shows my conclusion.

garyarnold:

Are you saying every law & commandment per OT are done away with?

YES. Only that from the OT that is repeated in the New Testament is meant for Christians. The substance of nine of the Ten Commandments are repeated in the New Testament.

For those who just can't get it through their heads, the word "tithe" in Genesis is a mathematical term that means a tenth part. HOWEVER, God, not me or you, defined His tithe in Leviticus 27:30-33. Either accept God's definition, or admit you are using man's definition.

Abram did not "tithe" per the meaning that GOD gave to the term "tithe."

GOD'S tithe came from GOD'S increase, not man's income (increase). To give a tenth of your income to the church and call it "tithing to God" is an insult to God.

As per saying the last statement, please just be ready to defend that to GOD and man.


From your first statement, I have reached my conclusion then. Thanks.
I can see you have also understood the substance of
1 Corinthians 9:11-14 now.
Cheers.

Pleased to meet you Minister Gary.
However, we still learn from each other, you talk like you are an authority that cannot be wrong.
It's not a matter of 'assuming'. Matthew 23:23 affirms that tithing ought to be done as well as mercy, faith.
I asked earlier that are mercy & faith done away with but you are yet to answer that.

Are you aware there are universal laws? Are you saying every law & commandment per OT are done away with?
May be you enlighten me on how mercy and faith are mosaic laws.

If tithing was not condemned by Jesus, then tithing is valid.
Hence tithing by Abraham is not condemned. (As I said earlier, only one account is given of Abraham being met by the priest, so your saying it is 'one-off' is based on the circumstance) Luke 18:12 shows tithing on all as well.

No one is keeping you on the thread but the fact that you are trying to prove a point. Since you say you have overstayed, you have a choice to leave or remain.

@Bernimoore, I can see U are mixed up. Seriously. You said tithe and tenth are different, didn't you?
And I said no rigmaroling, they are the same. Read Heb. 7:2 and compare with Heb 7:6. Tenth & tithe are the same, agreed?

Please where was it said in the bible that Abraham made a vow to tithe? Are you mixing it up with Jacob's vow to tithe? May be you should read the passage again.

Also nowhere was it stated that Abraham 'forced' the tithe on Melchizedek or that Melchizedek refused the tithe. Are you for real?

For your information, the spoils of war is the property of the victor.
Abraham's possessions were not plundered, it was that of Sodom where his nephew, Lot, was in that was captured and taken away. He went to fight to save Lot and also won the battle so the spoils of war where his and that was why the king of sodom tried to negotiate with him because the loot was Abrahams.
It was an 'increase' to Abraham and his vow not to take it so that the king of Sodom will not say 'I made Abrahamm rich' confirms it.

On the story of the rich young ruler, he said he kept God's commands from his youth. That settles it.

@Bernimoore,
Tithe & Tenth are one and the same, we do not need to rigmarole on this.
Tithing is still in force and that is what is in Matt 23:23 & Hebrews 7.
Also scroll up and read up the other scriptures posted. I asked you to tell me what you think 'robbed other churches' and 'power over you' meant in the context of the scriptures but you are yet to answer.

In Matthew 5:20-48, Jesus gave superior commandments over a mosaic one. It is too long to post but read it up.

However in Matthew 23:23, Jesus said neither mercy, justice and faithfulness nor tithe should be neglected.
As I said earlier, He need not have said so if He was against it unlike in Matt 5:20-48.

We are still saying the same thing on the scriptures you quoted. Giving to the poor is part of giving, as well as to family and to the gospel.

The rich young ruler said he kept God's commandments from his youth, there was no doubt about that.
His selling all his possessions and giving to the poor, as directed by Jesus, hence was in order as well. They were his possessions already (we do not know whether or not he had tithed on whatever increase he had but we know he kept God's commandments which included tithing). However note that the question was 'What do I need to do that I may have eternal life'?

I am against any form of compulsion or threats from anyone who claims to be of God but that does not mean I will deny God's word either.

garyarnold:

Snowwy,
What does tithe of "all" or "everything" mean?

Does it mean everything in the world?
Does it mean everything he owned?
Does it mean everything he brought back with him?
Does it mean he actually worked out a tenth of all the spoils BEFORE he even met Melchizedek?

Use some common sense here.  He gave a tenth of all HE HAD WITH HIM AT THE TIME.  Read the story.

The Holy Bible, New Century Version
Genesis 14:20 (NCV)  And we praise God Most High, who has helped you to defeat your enemies.”  Then Abram gave Melchizedek [i]a tenth of everything he had brought back from the battle[/i].

Adam Clarke's Commentary on the Old Testamen
14:20
And he gave him tithes—A tenth part of all the spoils he had taken from the confederate kings.

I'm not dodging any questions.  It's way past my bedtime.  I will answer your other questions tomorrow. 

Seems you are getting confused.
You just affirmed what I had been saying. Ofcourse, Abraham tithed on all he had brought from him at that time to the priest who met him on the way, Isn't that all we have been saying?
It's you that has failing to see what I had been telling you, did he think he would meet Melchisedek on the way? Not sure but it was what he had he tithed on? Agreed? Agreed!
It was an 'increase' to him (whether he decided to keep it or not) and he tithed on all! Simple.

When you have the time, probably, when you wake up tomorrow, please show me where Jesus made a statement that was made void after His death, till you answer that, is there any further need for discussion on this thread?

@garyarnold,
Answer my questions now, quit dodging.
1. Abraham gave a tithe of everything to Mechizedek, based on the account, when he was returning from war, we cannot say if that was before or after his men had eaten from it but it was clearly stated a 'tithe of everything'.

2. Abraham was a man of faith and he gave a tenth to the Priest whom he met once and he did that on his increase as well. Whether he decided to keep it or not, is not the issue.

Too bad if you have an issue with it.

garyarnold:

@Snowwy,

I don't have time now to find scripture where Jesus made a statement that was made void due to his death.
As far as Matthew 23:23, as I have said before, Jesus said they ought to tithe as they had ON THE HERBS, but Jesus never said they ought to tithe on their income from their professions as teachers and lawyers. Don't take things out of context. Furthermore, Jesus referred to the tithe as MATTERS OF THE LAW.

But you have time to argue tithing? If Jesus says do not leave it UNDONE, then sorry that is what I am doing. If you have an issue with it too bad.

As was said earlier, tithe was on ALL/EVERYTHING, increase etc, I am not taking it out of context, it is you that has an issue with it.
As you said, since Jesus said tithe was a matter of the law, He also said so was mercy, justice and faithfulness.
If you tell me that mercy, justice and faithfulness has been done away with then I will know what I am contending against.

garyarnold:

Do you see that all these scriptures show that it is a duty to support the work of the gospel and it's ministers? We also have the duty to help the poor and family. None negates the other.

No argument there. And Paul makes it clear that we should give from the heart, NOT under compulsion. Paul NEVER says we should "tithe."

Thanks that is all that is required. We are to give by faith and not under compulsion too.
So I can give tithe (just as it was not condemned by Jesus) and still make other givings.

Oh, I forgot to add, please show me anywhere in the account of Jesus that he made a statement that was made void due to his death?

garyarnold:

@Snowwy,

We know of only ONE instance of a tithe to Melchizedek. Only ONE.
And that ONE tithe was not on income, but rather war spoils. Abram had already made a vow that he was going to keep NOTHING from the spoils. Abram merely divided the spoils - a tenth to the king-priest, and the balance back to its original owners.
We don't know ANYTHING about how tithing would have worked under Melchizedek. We don't know if tithing was limited to war spoils, whether it was also on crops and animals, whether the poor benefited from the tithe, etc. etc. So it makes absolutely no sense to try and use Abram's one-time spoils tithe as an example or justification to tithe today.

The Biblical tithe was on the NET, not gross, and NEVER on anyone's income.

Being Spirit led, I find myself giving far more than a mere tenth of my income.

@garyarnold,
You still have not answered my question.
However, I picked some of your quotes as seen above  to respond to.

1. We only know of an instance of tithe to Melchisedek as there was just an account of Melchisedek and Abraham met him just once. Agreed?
2. Why did Abraham make the vow, so that the King od Sodom will not say 'He made Abraham rich'. See the context? And Abraham still gave a tenth of this, agreed?
3. The tithe was obviously based on what Abraham had with him at that time which were the spoils of war? Agreed?
4. Please quote in scripture where tithe was on the NET not on GROSS for my learning.

5. Tithe is part of giving, right? So since you give far more that a 'mere' tithe, that is what is required of you as a Christian in the first place (early Christians gave their all) and that was what even happened in the OT. They gave tithes, offerings, firstfruits, various sin/atonement offerings (It is even a surprise that they even had anything left) so I do not see what 'excess' you are giving that is making you feel happy.

BERNIMOORE:

[b]@snowwy,


PERMIT ME TO BORROW SOME  LEGAL POINT OF VIEW.

'IF THERE IS NO LAW,THEN THERE IS NO CRIME. BUT AN OFFENDER BECOMES AN ACCUSED IN THE EVENT OF BREAKING A PARTICULAR FORBIDDEN LAW.

THAT WHAT ABRAHAM DID WITH THE SPOILS WHEN HE GAVE A TENTH PART   ''PREDATES THE LAW'' GOES TO NO ISSUE AT ALL, SINCE IT WAS LATER  INCORPORATED AND PRACTICED IN THE LAW COVENANT BEARING THE NAME 'TENTH PART'.IT WILL BE WIPED OUT ALTOGETHER WHEN SAME INCORPORATED LAW IS ANNULED.
 
THE FACT THAT ABRAHAM GAVE A TENTH PART OF SPOILS TO MELCHIZEDECH,HE DOES NOT FOLLOW A PARTICULAR PATTERN, AND THEN CANNOT ASSUME A SEPERATE  IMMUNITY OR STAND OUT UNANNULLED  IF HAVING BEEN INCORPORATED INTO AN EXISTING LAW, IT WILL GO AWAY OR CEASE TO OPERATE IF THE LAW IT WAS INCORPORATE ALONG SIDE WITH WAS ANNULLED OR DISENGAGED.

Can you explain further what you feel about 'robbing other churches' in relation to 'tithe', and can you support your strong conviction tied with scriptures that directs christians to tithe, as a standard?
 


[/b]

@BERNIMOORE,
We are still going round in circles but see my response to garyarnold.

As per 'explaining further' what I meant by 'robbing other churches', I wonder where you gave any explanation at all. You did not even mention it at all but I was browsing on my phone then so let me paste the scriptures I quoted:

1 Corinthians 9:1-15
1Am I am not an apostle? am I not free? have I not seen Jesus Christ our Lord? are not ye my work in the Lord?
2If I be not an apostle unto others, yet doubtless I am to you: for the seal of mine apostleship are ye in the Lord.
3[b]Mine answer to them that do examine me is this, [/b]
4Have we not power to eat and to drink?
5Have we not power to lead about a sister, a wife, as well as other apostles, and as the brethren of the Lord, and Cephas?
6Or I only and Barnabas, have not we power to forbear working?
7Who goeth a warfare any time at his own charges? who planteth a vineyard, and eateth not of the fruit thereof? or who feedeth a flock, and eateth not of the milk of the flock?
8Say I these things as a man? or saith not the law the same also?
9For it is written in the law of Moses, thou shalt not muzzle the mouth of the ox that treadeth out the corn. Doth God take care for oxen?
10Or saith he it altogether for our sakes? For our sakes, no doubt, this is written: that he that ploweth should plow in hope; and that he that thresheth in hope should be partaker of his hope.
11If we have sown unto you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we shall reap your carnal things?
12If others be partakers of this power over you, are not we rather? Nevertheless we have not used this power; but suffer all things, lest we should hinder the gospel of Christ.
13Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?
14Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.
15But I have used none of these things: neither have I written these things, that it should be so done unto me: for it were better for me to die, than that any man should make my glorying void.

Please note the bolded. I think the scripture is explanatory enough. The only reason why Paul did not use this 'power' was because of them that were 'examining' him so that no man will make his glorying void.
May be you can explain what this 'power' means.


The second scripture quoted:

2 Corinthians 11:7-9
7Have I committed an offence in abasing myself that ye might be exalted, because I have preached to you the gospel of God freely?
8I robbed other churches, taking wages of them, to do you service.
9And when I was present with you, and wanted, I was chargeable to no man: for that which was lacking to me the brethren which came from Macedonia supplied: and in all things I have kept myself from being burdensome unto you, and so will I keep myself.

1 Timothy 5:17-18
17Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine.
18For the scripture saith, thou shalt not muzzle the ox that treadeth out the corn. And, The labourer is worthy of his reward.

Galatians 6:6
6 Let him that is taught in the word communicate unto him that teacheth in all good things


2 Timothy 2:6
6The husbandman that laboureth must be first partaker of the fruits.

Do you see that all these scriptures show that it is a duty to support the work of the gospel and it's ministers? We also have the duty to help the poor and family. None negates the other.

Now, I will like you to please look at the above scripture and explain based on your understanding what this means to you as you seem to know alot about the NT.

garyarnold:

@Snowwy,

Christ's priesthood is similar to Melchisedek's who received tithe from Abraham before the law.

Only similar in ONE respect - neither Melchisedek's nor Christ's priesthood was created by law. There are no other similarities.

Hebrews 7:18 tells us that Numbers 18 was disannulled. Therefore, the Levitical priesthood (including all it laws, etc., including tithing) was disannulled. It is treated as though there never was a Levitical priesthood. Therefore, the priesthood of Christ follows that of Melchisedek; thus, in the order of Melchisedek.

You are right, Christ's priesthood was not created by the law of course just like Melchizedek's wasn't, buth tithe was received by Melchisedek, right? Right!

Hebrews 7:6-8:
6But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.
7And without all contradiction the less is blessed of the better.
8And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.

So if the priesthood of Christ is similar to that of Mechisedek, thus in order of Melchisedek, who received tithe of Abraham, why do you still have an issue with tithing?
Especially since Jesus did not condemn tithe in Mathew 23:23, ? If Jesus said it should NOT be left undone but the weighthier matters like mercy, justice should also be upheld, what exactly is the issue?

@Bernimoore and garyarnold, thanks for the expose. However, it still shows the chapter is talking about the change of priesthood and referenced tithing according to the law and before the law. Christ's priesthood is similar to Melchisedek's who received tithe from Abraham before the law. (Remember it was recorded that Abraham met a priest only once on his way back from war with his loot, ofcourse that was why he could tithe from the loot only). Jesus wasn't against it but rather said it should not be left undone (he didn't need to add this statement if he was against it).
In other NT books, Paul references OT, uses words like 'power over you' 1 Cor 9:1-13, 'robbing other churches' 2 Cor 11:8. It depends on your conviction but I have a strong conviction on it based on faith, scriptures. To everyone his own.

@ Bernimoore,
Tithing has been expounded on other topics so really there is no need for me to dabble into the subject again however I noticed you quoted Hebrews 7:12 and then jumped to verse 18.
Verses 13 to 18 say:

13For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.

14For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood.

15And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,

16Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.

17For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

18For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof. '

Please notice the bolded, are you saying that the annulment of the commandment was of verse 5 (edited) or of verse 16 as I noted you neatly did not mention verse 16?

Also, Heb 7:28 below also explains verse 18 in my opinion:

  28For the law maketh men high priests which have infirmity; but the word of the oath, which was since the law, maketh the Son, who is consecrated for evermore.'

Could you explain the bolded verses and how they relate to the disannulment of the commandment going before of verse 18?

Congrats Jo!
This award must be truly deserved since you have won again.
Keep preaching Christ and His love and work out your salvation with fear and trembling.
Do not descend to the level of those who know nothing but throw insult, 'sling mud' and slander especially without proof.

Also know that they will keep wondering how you keep excelling.

Remain your respectable self and have a great year 2012.

Whenever you think you want to give something extra valuable, in this case your virginity, please ensure you both have a contract signed at least.

The contract?!

Marriage of course.

It is well OP. Stand up, dust yourself and move on with the leading of God and from His word.

@Pastor Kun,
You keep saying you have no issues with people tithing or you have no issues with 'tithing per se', however, your posts constantly reflect that to you tithing is an evil shackle, scam even when it is obvious the person is tithing from the heart or is asking a candid question relating to tithing.
In as much as you are entitled to your own opinion, you keep affirming you have nothing against 'tithe per se' yet you have even said tithe originated from a pagan culture until you were proved wrong.
If you have a fight against mandatory tithing, you will not be going against the act of someone tithing until you confirm he is tithing without understanding, based solely out of fear and compulsion.

@wordtalk, you gave a good summary. I hope the learning will be taken and guide future discourses.

At all Pastor Kun,
people are learning what tithing is all about and how to tithe genuinely from the heart, that is all.
It is all those that do not tithe that see tithe as a shackle. Those that do have no complaints, ok?
Enjoy!

At all Pastor Kun. Even the first poll is proof enough as against what you have thought and I won't be surprised a lot of known tithers here did not even vote.
Also tithing is not a shackle, it is only seen as such for those who do not practice it. Enjoy!

^^^^^^
Actually, the result shows a lot more people believe in tithing.
The word of God is the final say, no poll result will change that.

Pastor Kun:

@anonimi
Good point there, I am yet to see one single person condenm giving of tithes,

Pastor Kun, We both know that this is not true. You are very against anything that has a hint of 'tithe' mentioned in it ('voluntary or not). I am surprised you are even saying this now after our previous discourses.
However, it is possible you have had a change of heart. I take you by your word, once again.

No need to cry foul garyarnold,
if there is anyone to claim being misquoted it is me.
I said the 'use of the word 'asset' was your own making', not 'asset was your own making'.
Obviously you did not create the word, i meant the 'use' of the word asset, obviously in this context.
Scroll up and quote me where i said 'asset was your own making'.

I however do not expect you to respond based on your last post, let's see how you will at least stand by what you say at least this once.

@garyarnold,
you initially claimed the use of the word 'asset' in this context was not your making, that pastors on youtube use it, so in other words, you got it from there, now you say you have figured it out before then.
Do you enjoy 'tying yourself up in a knot'?

I can see your boast in your accounting 'knowledge' and all, not an issue, however you are yet to show how this whole arguments relates to what you figured out.

The amazing thing is that no one has any issues with the percentage, amount you decide to give, it is you making a whole law case about it.
It is you trying to act all 'good'.

Since you claim the use of the word 'increase', 'income' might not be the same in today's context, please provide a shred of evidence to back that up, but please and please do not 'force' us to accept your unsubstantiated claims.
Assets or not, however, like i said earlier, does not help your 'baseless' (until proven) arguments.

garyarnold:

However thanks for admitting your use of the word 'asset' was your own making,

My making? There are pastors who teach that the Biblical tithe was on ASSETS. I've seem it on youtube.

I didn't make up the word asset(s).

Also, definitions of words change over the years, so for someone to say that the Hebrew word for increase also means income can be in error when you apply TODAY'S definition of income.

It's really so simple, but there will always be those who want to complicate things. And there are those who have such big egos that to say they tithe just plain makes them feel so good!

Game playing is what is going on in this blog.

So you basically 'lifted' the word for what a 'pastor' said and you have been running with it like your life depends on it?
Is that not what you have been preaching against?

It is you I see trying to act superior since you 'give far far far more than a mere tenth'

@garyarnold,
let the independent mind draw their own conclusions.
However thanks for admitting your use of the word 'asset' was your own making, therefore please do not force it down our throats esp since the biblical word is available.
I can see however you are now preaching 'compulsory' 'do it only my way' giving. You claim to give far far far more than a mere tenth, let those that give the biblical tenth as well as other givings do so as persuaded in thier hearts, after all is this not what this is all about?

Seriously is there more to Wordtalk than we know?
I wonder how you expect others to take a stand with you when you keep shifting,
You have said you will not have a dialogue with him anymore because he is this and that, yet you keep surrounding your conversations around him.
Pls make a post without mentioning him, you are acting petulant.

@wordtalk,
its uncalled for to start using such words, please people are meant to learn from what is posted.

@garyarnold,
what will we call the land in which the crops were planted too?
If you say crops and animals are (current) assets, money falls into this category too so I think you are still saying the same thing then. I don't think this helps better the argument.

Enigma:

OK, you win! Happy now?

I am happy by the belief I have, so it's not what transpires on this forum that should make me happy like it seems it would for you.

It's not all about win or lose for me.

However, the same cannot be said for you, really, can't understand why you are so restless over this issue even after everyone seems to have had some understanding.

I also wonder why you can't even keep to your words of 'ignoring me' despite not directly referring my post to you
However, enjoy!

This desperation is amazing.
As if it is not obvious that it is all about winning or losing for some.

debosky:

Interesting view. You have said you've given 25% of your income in the past - since the bible does not explicitly say 'you can give 25%' then your giving is not biblical.

Can you see the folly of your assertion?

10% is completely biblical as long as the giver has decided in his heart to give 10%. 2 Corinthians 9:7 makes it biblical because that verse instructs the individual to decide how much to give in his heart, be it 10% or 25%. If you are unhappy the person is calling it tithe, that is simply your own problem. It remains completely biblical.
Unless you are saying giving 10% is expressly prohibited in the bible (while other percentages are allowed) then you are wrong on this count.

Giving any percentage is in 'accord with the bible' as your definition states - there doesn't have to be an exact exemplar of that practice in the bible for it to be 'in accord with the bible'.

QED!
The observation here makes a lot of sense and it's unfortunately some can't see past their noses.
That is the issue those that hate tithe will keep having.
Tithe is a tenth and Christians joyfully do it, As such if you decide to give more, all well and good, let others do as they purpose in their hearts.

This thread, anyways, is a real eye-opener showing that even some of those that vehemently opposed tithe are even beginning to be careful with their choice of words.
In all, let us tithe as we purpose in our hearts, give to the poor as we purpose in our hearts, give offerings (whether 'free-will offerings' coined from the OT as the anti-tithers love to hear rather than tithe ) all to the glory of God.