frosbel:

Thank God for universities like these !

Do you know that many of these universities offer scholarships and financial assistance to students from poor backgrounds ?

I used to think like you , until I saw it first hand.

Also they will educate your child while providing them with the moral guidance they need to cope during their working life.

frosbel: This article is misleading.

Besides the ministries help poor students with scholarships and bursaries - Fact !!

So the rich pay so that the poor can learn - Fact !!!

Have I spent so long away from Nairaland that I am shocked to see Frosbel defend anything church like this?
Frosbel, is this really you?

@OP,
I used to be amazed too that people find it easy to pick calls during service or sometimes you call someone and he/she says he/she is in church with the sermon going on.

Many genuinely don't see anything wrong with it but it just indicates that it has become a major distraction.
The youths especially who are easily bored take to this in church..just engage them constructively and tell them besids this being disrepect to God it's indiscipline.

Wondering thoughts too is another thing which we should bring under subjection through Christ. May we received God's enablement and strive to maintain focus.

We should be careful not to become so 'comfortable' and 'familiar' with God that we begin to take him for granted.

The 10 Commandments in your own language.

1. I am the Lord thy God, thou shalt not have any other gods before me .
God should be number one. Look unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith. Nothing should seperate us from God.


2. Thou shalt not have any graven images
Don't bow down to anything but God. Words like...'Oh she is my Idol' looks harmless but is not right. Don't hold anything higher than God. Graven images could be one's work, possessions etc.


3. Thou shalt not use the name of the Lord thy God in vain
Don't use your lips to dishonour God. No swearing using God's name either. God's name should be held sacred.


4. Remember to keep the Sabbath day holy
Don't neglect the things of God. Rest in God.

5. Honour thy father and thy mother
Loud and clear. Treat your parents as you want your children to treat you.

6. Thou shalt not kill
Do not murder. Don't hate. Murder isn't just physical...one can murder in ones mind and it starts with hate.

7. Thou shalt not commit adultery
Adultery forbidden. Also adultery of looking at someone who isn't even your wife or husband with sexual thoughts. Constantly bring into captivity every thought that tries to exalt itself against God is needed. Whatsoever things are pure...dwell on it. Need to renew the mind with God's word.

8. Thou shalt not steal
Don't be a thief. A lot to be said here. Don't cheat.

9. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy brother as well.
Don't be a liar. Simply said

10. Thou shalt not covet anything that belongs to thy brother.
Don't want what others have. Be content with what you have, try to always outdo yourself by doing things better. Don't use man as your yardstick.


Love........explains this. Love God and your neighbour.


I am yet to see how a 'waffi' man would try to understand these commandments. Who can 'interprete' in waffi.

OLAADEGBU:

I guess the hood language is more appropriate. Do you know how it will look like in pidgin English?

Do you want to give a teaser?
Preaching in the language to be understood by the hearers

Great!

^^
Hmmmmmm,
Indeed 'in the hood' language.



@Goshen,
You have now been sucked in to the group of the mockers and actually banter with some professed unbelievers and God haters on God's word.
I would just advice you to be careful. It may be funny now...however you are answerable only to Him.

I have wanted to ask what made you come up with your choice of username.

hisblud: reading your post makes me wonder whether who is greater Sin or Jesus? Christianity harps so much on sin as if Christ did less than adam!

It's whoever one makes great of the two in one's life.
Do you magnify Jesus in your life or sin?

Well Jesus had to come into the world to save us from our sins as He became sin for our sakes and is our advocate in Heaven now, that is why anyone who believes he has no sin will never value Jesus Christ.

@OP,
I have learnt a lot from a number of posts here however if we look at the great wise one in the bible, he said:

Eccl.9:11
11I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but time and chance happeneth to them all.

I think poverty can be a choice but at the same time it might not be a choice.
Some people chose poverty unconsciously by their actions, some make such faulty choices yet it turns around to favour them.

Some make all the right choices yet it doesn't just work out all the same.

I believe there is a time for everybody and opportunity (chance) that could be taken that would launch one into a whole new world.

Hard work and wisdom is important to snap out of poverty, however sometimes that perfect timing or great chance may be all that is needed to move one out of poverty to wealth.

Also poverty is a thing of the mind just as many people said...some may not have all they need but know they are wealthy because the supply of a need comes at the nick of time.

A 'poor' man may not have all he needs now but he knows what to do to meet that need and gets what he wants.
In summary, I believe Godliness with contentment is great gain.

@Jesoul,
I have no issues with anyone being on the forum, however, to be fair, the yardstick used on the muslim section should be used on the general religion board.

However, you have proven two salient points:

1. Aethism is a religion afterall
2. Islam is not tolerant esp. With what we have seen in the world and Nigeria.

I just needed the clarity.
Thanks and weldone.

JeSoul: Pls see my reply to Italo. The religion section is an umbrella section for all things related to religion - and atheism obviously is. Are we only to be tolerant of views and opinions that we agree with? is that how we will make a difference?

@Jesoul, your response to Frosbel shows that atheist should not be welcomed on the religious board as well as it is a place to 'share our belief in God...or any higher powers'. These atheists claim not to believe in God or any higher power. Therefore it is one of two things:

1. The MODs are allowing this slip
2. The atheists actually believe in God but use the cloak of the privacy of the internet names to masquerade as atheists.

I chose the latter though.

Please sign up for this kind of love for God that is not conditional. It is the way to get everything, more than a thousand fold from God

True! If Job could say the below in:

Job 13:15 (KJV)
 15Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him: but I will maintain mine own ways before him.


It shows our love and service to God should not be conditional. May God help us faithfully trust and love Him and may nothing seperate us from His love.

Indeed this is very sobering.
May we not undermine God's grace in our lives. Amen.

logicboy:



Are you forcing me to believe in God or what? "God forbid" is just an expression.


You need to chill

Naaaaa...no one can force you to believe in God that you already believe in but refuse to admit it.

Yeah, God forbid is an expression...IN THE BIBLE!
Romans 6:15.
Jesus loves you...no matter how far you run...he loves you ok?
Goodnight.

@Frosbel,
On the post you copied and pasted up there, are you saying it is wrong to preach against abortion to a crowd at a wednesday night service?
So because they are in church it means that some amongst them do not commit abortion or do not plan to?

Or you say preaching against immodest derssing to people seated modestl dressed?
Seriously, so because they wore their sunday best to church, it doesn't mean they dress immodestly outside?

Please did you even read what you pasted up there before you even copied it?

So it is you to define what is to be preached in church again?

So left to you, once someone looks like a 'non-sinner', you should just pat him on the back? You look at the outward appearance as I can see as if a church crowd is not made up of saints and sinners.

I am amazed at your piece!

logicboy:


Christianity makes people foolish. Has christianity made you dumb enough to forget the meaning of a common phrase. If I say "good morning" does that mean that the morning is good or that I'm greeting you?

But you say there is no God.
You believe in 'good' don't you? So your analogy above doesn't cut it.

Funny you are trying to defend the indefensible.
You say there is no God then next thing you say 'God forbid'. The very fact you are on a religious board speaks volumes. You do believe there is a God you just don't want to admit it.

'It is hard for thee to kick against the pricks'- Acts 9:5.

What I am trying to bring out is that the devil is always ready to attack and of the ways we see such attacks is when we allow the devil through sin to get to us and when God allows it as a trial of our faith.

@Frosbel,
Really great word there.

hisblud: Mr fros then how do you differentiate between "God trial" and satan attack?

@Hisblud,
Please let me give a response to your question to Frosbel.
I think sometimes God will permit the devil to 'attack' to try you just like in the book of Job where the devil attacked Job only up to a certain point which was not to take his life. Job 1:12

However God in His intimate mercy and love still helps us by making a way of escape and also ensures we are not tried beyond what we can bear. I Corinthians 10:13.

The trial of our faith works patience and promotes us in the Spirit. James 1:4

I also think that when we sin, we create an avenue for the devil to attack as we ourseles created the crack in the wall through or sin.
Besides the punishment from such sin can be done by the devil. 1 Timothy 1:20; 1 Corinthians 5:5. This is so the persons spirit is saved.

logicboy:

Would you like to be the grandfather of a rape child if your daughter is raped? (God forbid)

I am not supporting abortion and neither am I against it. I am just neutral

Reminds me of the headline I saw:

‘Oh God,’ atheist Richard Dawkins says when stumped in debate with Church of England priest.

Aethism is just a bunch of people who TRY to believe there is no God. He couldn't even control what he said.
Isn't this obvious that there is more to that statement.


@Logicboy,
Did you actually say this. Waow...see you can't run from God. He loves you boy.


On the topic, it is a pity people try to justify murder in anyway. Though shall not kill. Love your neighbour as yourself. May God help us.

The day I learnt that eternal life actually begins for a believer from when he accepts Jesus as Lord and saviour and receives the holy spirit then he starts living in the kingdom of God (righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Ghost), my whole view of Christianity changed.
It was truly an awesome day.
That is why one cannot afford to live an apologetic Christian life and one should enjoy God in all areas.
Thanks Newmi and Mabell for the re-emphasis on that word.

@Jem1,
Just to add as I was done here already.
On Enigma's comment...follow the link and see if I ever said Abraham tithes on all his possessions.
That is why all this cut and paste is dubious.

My next comment after his post was I wasn't referring to Abraham, Luke 18:12 was my reference which has been explained.
I only added that yes Abraham tithed on the spoils (which were his possessions being the victor). The 'all' stated in Hebrews that Abraham gave tithes of was ofcourse all the spoil...which was beyond produce.

There was only one record of Abraham tithing and it was on his way from battle with HIS spoils (he fought and got it and were rightly his) and he gave a tentht to Melchizedek the Priest.
I have asked if there was another record of Abraham seeing a priest and no one answered.
So saying Abraham tithed once is because he had the opportunity once as recorded. We can only use this IF there were other opportunities which he didn't tithe.
That is my conclusion.

Jem1:

@Snowwy, I believe I addressed that in 676

Well you said it yourself...it did not say what was contained in 'all I possess' so if you have a differnt view that is your opinion.

Clearly he said he tithes on all his possession and as such if you decide to read a different meaning to it, why do you have issues with those who see the clear meaning of what 'possessions' mean?

From the other scriptures we see that tithe was on all and as simply as it is stated...whatever views you have does not matter...they are your views shikena.


I am speaking based on the bible, whatever a pastor decides to command, is not the issue here as I am not a pastor so you can go ask your pastor that question.

The frequency of the tithe should not be the issue because as long as you have something to tithe, you tithe, be it every week, every month etc.

So whatever you decide then do it...others tithe based on the understanding of the word both in the OT and NT.
Therefore let all be persuaded....finito.

@Jem1,
We still await your response on Luke 18:12. The pharisee gave tithes of all he possessed (these were those who knew the law to the letter).

You claimed the Pharisees only tithed per Leviticus so why the difference?

All the tithe in Israel were for the ministers. Tithe of all, tithe of all things, Abraham gave tithe of all, no issues. However it is understood is left to the reader.

God said a tithe from the land and of herds are holy to Him yes and also said He gave ALL the tithe in ISRAEL to the Levites...I do not see that as just herd and crops else why the seperation in 2 Chron 31.

2 Chron 31 talked about tithe of ALL THINGS as well. It
Whatever you term that to mean is left to you.

The pharisee gave tithe of all he possessed...so may be you can link that as well.

In all, the tithe is not relegated to just farm produce, we have enough examples to read from OT and NT.
I Corinthians 9 is also another proof of this.
All is to be done in faith and with thanks cheerfully.
Other givings are also very important.

Therefore all these back and forth is just suspect for people who claimm to be givers.

@Enigma,
Whatever you say is your opinion.
I have provided the scriptures above, if you are not ok with it that is your cup of tea.

Enigma:

The above was expected of course. NID

But let us see what Jesus said about the person who says "I give tithes of all I possess"

Luke 18



So according to Jesus a "sinner", a publican, was justified and not the one boasting "I give tithes of all I get."

Additional considerations

1. Assuming he did really tithe all he "possessed", would he also have tithed slaves? Would a person who "possessed" slaves have also tithed slaves?

2. Do today's "tithers" really tithe all they "possess" or is it another case of selective application ---- the same way they ignore all the other forms of tithing commanded in the Bible --- like the one for family jollification?

3. In any event there was NO obligation on any Jew of the age to tithe all he possessed; God did NOT give any such command or direction. Scholars have noted that some Pharisees did do so in order to show off that they were "righteous" but we have seen Jesus say it did not even give them any particular "righteousness" and even a sinner who did not pay/give tithes was justified rather than the tither.

4. Some scholars have queried the rendering "possess" arguing that a better translation would be something like "acquire" or "increase" --- leading to a reading like "I give tithes of all I acquire (or of all my increase)"

@Enigma,
As you can see, my response was to add to Jem1's scriptures. The last scripture was said by a Pharisee as well since Jem1 said the pharisees only tithed 'farm produce'.

If you have a problem with Luke 18:12 (as always) ask for the Holy Spirit to guide you...that is why the scripture says the letter killeth but the Spirit giveth life.
Next time study in context, Jesus spoke here for people 'who believed they were righteous and despised others'.

The pharisee did not come to pray but to boast and despise his fellow man and that was simply what Christ was against.
However, as usual, I understand you guys will pick what was not meant because you are looking for 'holes'.

Giving and other good works do not justify.....no one ever said it does, Christ justifies and saves and then your good works will be praiseworthy....as simple as ABC.


@Enigma, if you have been lying in wait for me, you are wasting your time. Tithe has been dicussed fully on NL...so I won't be drawn into any other dicussion with you (or your scholars), go back and read what has been said before.


The funniest thing that you guys who speak just of 'farm produce' fail to note that almost all blessings of obeying God's commands in the OT has to do with blessings of the field, of rain, of increase of the ground, of the winepresses being filled, of the vine not casting her fruit before its time, of increase of animals etc.
Your anology proves that all other occupations did not get blessed by God in the OT.
Today, I hope you guys do not also go back to the OT and quote all those blessings 'figuratively' for yourselves.

All the tribes of Israel (apart from Levites) had land as inheritance, therefore even if they had other occupations, they still farmed. That was their major substance.

@Jem1,
Other scriptures I thought you would add:

Numbers 18:21 (KJV)
 And, behold, I have given the children of Levi all the tenth in Israel for an inheritance, for their service which they serve, even the service of the tabernacle of the congregation

2 Chronicles 31:4-5 (KJV)

4Moreover he commanded the people that dwelt in Jerusalem to give the portion of the priests and the Levites, that they might be encouraged in the law of the LORD.

 5And as soon as the commandment came abroad, the children of Israel brought in abundance the firstfruits of corn, wine, and oil, and honey, and of all the increase of the field; and the tithe of all things brought they in abundantly.

Luke 18:12 (KJV)
 12I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

FXKing2012:

OK. . .thanks.

I did not do anything beyond re-echoing what you yourself had already said.

^
@KamiLara,
Waow...rev...never looked at it that way.
Indeed Christ was again forming the eyes of the man to replace the sight he had lost just as God formed man from the dust.
Thanks...it is awesome.

@Goshen,
I would rather we give room for the main topic well except the OP sees this a reference point to the main topic.
However let me attend to a few things you said:

Goshen360: Thanks bro Snowwy,
"For he will be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink. He will also be filled with the Holy Spirit, even from his mother's womb. Luke 1:15 nkjv

And it happened, when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, that the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit. Luke 1:41 nkjv

Now his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Spirit, and prophesied, saying: Luke 1:67 nkjv

Jesus HAD NOT BEING BORN IN THESE VERSE AND YET IT WAS RECORDED THESE PEOPLE HERE WERE "FILLED". I want us to shew some heavy stuffs here. Are you ready? So if these verse are considered NT but Jesus had not being born yet but it is recorded that they were "filled". I thought it should be that the Holy Spirit "CAME UPON" them. What is your take on these verses since it is the Outpouring of the Holy Spirit that "filled" a believer and also remember, these people above are NOT yet born again but yet "filled".

The family of Zechariah were so blessed/priviledged for each and everyone of them to have been filled with the Holy Spirit. (Father, mother and child)
I said in my previous post that IN THE NT (where the book of Luke was also recorded) you hear more of being 'filled' with the Holy Ghost...so I do not see what you mean by asking why it is not 'came upon'.

Besides there are actually records of the spirit 'coming upon' also in the NT but you read more of being filled.
In each case of 'being filled' or the 'Holy spirit coming upon', there is always a manifestation: either they speak in tongues or prophesy or sing praises or do the 'unusual'.
One thing is distinct (except proven otherwise), the record of being 'filled with the Holy Spirit' occured in the NT except for Ex.31:3 (where God filled Bezaleel with the spirit [note the small 's' same as in Ez.37:14-which could mean 'breathe'] of God IN wisdom, knowledge etc.)

Also, the outpouring of the Holy Spirit on the day of pentecost showed such a large number of people receiving the Holy Spirit(as promised by Jesus) at a time. This was where the ministry of the Holy Spirit to all men was launched.
In this case, anyone who desires the Holy Spirit can be filled.


On 'receiving' the Holy Ghost, I noticed that there was no statement of a manifestation until the Holy Spirit actually came upon them. Acts 19:2,6; 8:17-19; John 20:22.

Waow, this topic is great...makes you study the word more and get insight.

Success or prosperity to me is fulfilling one's purpose in life. If you know why God created you and you are fulfilling that calling, that is true success in my humble opinion.
God blesses us all because for the fact you are even alive is a blessing...what you now do with that blessing in line with God's purpise for you is what will determine your success.