₦airaland Forum

Matthew 5.44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?

47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?

48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

If you love me, you don't block me on Facebook and cut me out of your life.
You don't stop communicating with me, trading with me, living with me

achorladey:
That was what Max placed before you because you decided to see the reason behind why JWs OSTRACIZE people who no longer holds same belief as the JWs again.

I was only asking how can you move forward in discussing with Max when he already says you have a BIASED mindset about the issue already.

Since whatever you say is classified as BIASED

My man I have no bias this is the first time I would be hearing of this strange JW doctrine.
I am igbo and I see it's just copied from the Osu playbook. A tradition that has brought pain to many.
Today's world i's all about breaking walls. Opening up to others and acceptin others could be different from us

Any doctrine that encourages us to stop loving others can't be right. 1 corinthians 13.8 8Charity never faileth.
Even when we have fallen away God never stops loving us.
The father of the prodigal son never stopped loving his son.
We don't stop to show love for the purpose of religion.
Our religion is love

achorladey:
The handwriting is on the WALL. You have a BIASED mindset. Oga how will you solve that in the cause of the discussion?

I am the one that those not believe in treating people like shit even after they left your church how can you say I have a biased mindset.
My mindset is all about treating people with respect and dignity even when you no longer hold the same religious beliefs.
Please tell me how can that be biased.
I actually though it was not a church policy. That maybe some members just decided to block a formal brother on their own accord. But the more we discuss, the more it is looking like a JW commandment to stop showing love to anyone that leaves their faith.
I never attack any church. I rather discuss the doctrines whether right or wrong

Kobojunkie:
Let God be true and man be a liar... Even Paul gave you that advice.
Who is the Truth of God? Jesus Christ
And who would man be? Paul or John or James... Or your pastors

Oh you read the words of Paul? Do you believe them

Kobojunkie:
I believe you know what I have stated but you a having a hard time letting go of what you have instead become used to. Look at your retort for instance... You are still trying to use the words of Paul to counter Jesus Christ's own commandments to all of His followers as if to say there indeed exists a way different from that which Jesus Himself taught His followers.

Even after you refuse to answer my questions, you say you believe I know what you have stated.
Well I don't know what you have stated.
You need to tell me if you believe the apostles of Christ or not.
If you dont, I have no problem with you, I can't make you believe. But if you do then it would be easy for you to understand what I have been saying all day

achorladey:
That means if such a person was in a community with only JW members, he would starve to death.No one would sell or buy from him. You don't need to read the Bible to know that this is wicked

To the above you never see anything. I told they have EVIDENCE of parents should not even pick the calls of their son or daughter who is DISFELLOWSHIPPED or DISASSOCIATED or COMMUNICATE via e-mails

You see how they skip questions raised based on the scriptures they cited? Na the policies and procedures of the organization dey belong they follow. Disagreement with what their Governing Body says is as good as APOSTASY even when it's clear the GB don't disseminate "PERFECT SPIRITUAL FOOD". In reality in the world of JWs you get ostracized for doing the right thing

If true, this is scary stuff. I never knew this.

The Apostles led the church after the death of Christ are you saying that they did not have the authority to do so?
If yes then you are implying that they were frauds who claimed a position that Christ did not call them to.
Also are you saying that the bible basically ends at the gospel of John?
Please be clear. Explain yourself very clearly

Kobojunkie:
My point is that Jesus Christ is the contract by which anyone can come to God.. Jesus Christ is the way, the Truth, and the Life..we have as a result of that Covenant..... Peter, Paul, James and the others were themselves just contract signers like you and I....fallible till death. They are sleeping in their graves waiting to be judged just like you and I, as depicted in Matthew 25 vs 31 - 46 says.

I really am not getting your point, are you saying that the apostles served no purpose?
Ephesians 2:19-20

19 Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.

Kobojunkie:
Jesus Christ had before that statement prepared breakfast for, and fed His sheep with Bread and fish, right before He gave Peter that commandment. So what do you think Jesus Christ meant when He said to Peter, right after a hearty breakfast, to feed His sheep?

Jesus literally meant that Peter should give food to those of His flock when they were hungry, and drink when hey were thirsty. When Jesus Christ commanded, "Take care of my sheep", He meant that when any of His sheep was naked, Peter should cloth such a one, when one was homeless, Peter should home him, when sick, Peter should care for Him and when in prison, Peter should visit him. Those are the same works of righteousness that Jesus Christ commands of everyone of His followers who intends to make it into His Kingdom when He returns. It is there in Matthew 25 vs 31- 40.

Those who refuse to literally feed His sheep and take care of His sheep,have no place in the Kingdom of Heaven by the way.

So you point is that Peter and the rest of the apostles are frauds and all their teachings and admonitions are fake.
In fact after the book of John, we should stop reading the bible as everything after did not come from Christ?

Kobojunkie:
Where did Jesus Christ tell you this?

Jesus Christ told Peter to feed his Sheep. He gave his apostles power and told them that they would do greater things than him.
He left his church in there care.
I believe you know the bible well so I don't need to quote verses for you.
Are you saying that you don't belive the words of Peter and Paul and the others called to lead the church?
You think they are some kind of fraud right?
It's only the word's you hear directly from Jesus mouth that you believe right

Kobojunkie:
Remember, Jesus Christ is the example you are to follow, not Paul or Peter who were just men like you and I. Jesus Christ is the Teacher by who's words and I will answer to....not the words or suggestions of James, Paul or Peter who remained fallible until their death.

Jesus Christ, the New Covenant, was clear on what His followers would do- He didn't mince words about it - and His teachings are believed to be documented in the gospels for all to read. That Paul suggested pastors, evangelists and the lot to you....does not in anyway mean the teachings of Jesus Christ are to be changed to suit Paul's supposed suggestions. No, the truth of God is everlasting.

As I said earlier..

You follow Jesus Christ when you follow his chosen servants.
Jesus Christ called these men for a reason.

DappaD:
Sir there's no need to get emotional or to pull up the “Humanity first before religion” card . Just know that your viewpoint and that of the Bible are in sharp contrast because most people who claim they believe in God would argue that some parts of the Bible are incorrect and that's the mindset you're exhibiting now. 2John 9-11 says not even to greet such a person who has willfully violated God's standards and has also rejected help to change his thinking. James 5:14

P.S.: Do your best to quote me well without messing up the whole thing.

I am not sure the bible comanded that we block formal members on social media.Now let's be honest. If such a person was your boss, would you stop greeting him?
If it were your son, would you chase him from your home?

Kobojunkie:
There is a reason I stayed clear of the OP, and that reason is none of what was stated had anything to do with what Jesus Christ in fact commands His followers.
According to Jesus Christ He and He alone is to be Teacher, Counsellor, Comforter, Guide, Commander, Helper - everything - to each and every one of His sheep, and so when people speak of consulting Pastors and Prophets for prayer and revelation, there is nothinh much to tell them since that practice is itself against Jesus Christ's own teaching.

Now, I came in when you suggested that Jesus Christ Himself offered something you assume to be similar to this idea of spiritual bathing, which I hope you now realize is not.

God will not go against His own word(Jesus Christ), not will He issue a command that is antichrist in nature. Remember, Jesus Christ said that the Spirit of God will take from what belongs to Him(Jesus Christ's own Teaching included) to give to us).

I never suggested anything you are implying. I simply stated that it's not impossible for God to ask a man to bathe, he had done it before and other things like unto it.
Now, you are wrong to imply that we no longer need the counseling and prayers of our church leaders
Ephesians 4.11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
James 5.14
14Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
CHrist parting words to Peter was "feed my sheep."
We still need our pastors

[quote author=DappaD post=97629499]You would do yourself a lot of good if you read 1Corinthians 5:11,6:9-10; Galatians 5:19-21 from your Bible and ask yourself if you would allow a person who practiced such vile things to be your closest companion.

Jehovah's Witnesses hold to high moral standards in liaise with the Bible and if someone has come to terms with Biblical standards and later decides to break them, the overseers in the congregation will attempt to readjust him after a number of times(Galatians 6:1), if he doesn't feel sorry about the wrong he did and doesn't change his ways, the disfellowshiping arrangement comes to the fore and is usually the last resort.

Tell me, if such disciplinary action isn't taken, don't you think the unrepentant wrongdoer will feel okay with what he did and that the others who are aware of his sinful conduct might think it's now okay to practice such things?

Discipline is painful but in the end it yields beautiful results when the wrongdoer changes his ways after reevaluating himself. Hebrews 12:11

Also, for your information, Paul expelled unrepentant dissenters from the Christian congregation. 1Timothy 1:20 see 1Corinthians 5:5[/quote)
I really don't have any issue with church discipline but with the members taking it on to blocking the person on social media.
If it can get that far, something is terribly wrong.
Imagine if that guy was employed by a member does that mean he would loss his job?
Church matters are now being taken to the work place, social media and community
Its wrong.
If it was a Muslim that does such we would all condemn his action.
Every church is free to punish it's members according to their laws but we are now justifying the Ostracizing of a fellow human being.
That means if such a person was in a community with only JW members, he would starve to death.
No one would sell or buy from him.
You don't need to read the Bible to know that this is wicked

Kobojunkie:
Look, God's commandments are explicitly stated - Read the Gospels to learn of them. Those commandments are what God expects of everyone who follows Him. His personal commands to individuals...rest, bath, go grocery shopping, pray for that man sitting there etc. - are just that commands He gave those particular individuals and not to become ritual for anyone not even the one who was pcommanded.

This was the question..
"Please is it biblical if a pastor/prophet after counselling and praying for you told you that based on what he/she saw/revelation that your matter entails that you should do bathing"
My anewer is, it's not beyond God to do so. He had done it in the past.
But your answer isn't clear. Can God command such or not?

[quote author=Kobojunkie post=97628874]Look, God's commandments are explicitly stated - Read the Gospels to learn of them. Those commandments are what God expects of everyone who follows Him. His personal commands to individuals...rest, bath, go grocery shopping, pray for that man sitting there etc. - are just that commands He gave those particular individuals and not to become ritual for anyone not even the one who was commanded. [/quote ] I am not sure I understand you. You seem to be saying God cannot command a man to bath and in the very next sentence you contradict yourself.

[quote author=Kobojunkie post=97624634]God telling a single individual to take a bath is not spiritual but God commanding obedience as He has in every wise. You, on the other hand claiming that because God commanded a person or more to take a bath implies there is something "Spiritual" about bathing is nothing but the same Spiritual bullsheet that Christianity is today littered with....meaningless doctrines and traditions..lies that have absolutely nothing to do with God or anything He called His followers to.[/quote

I never made such implication. I only say, you and I have no right to question such a command.
I do not claim that God has commanded the bathing but I am simply saying you and I have no right to say God cannot do such. He had done it in the pass. He does not change

MaxInDHouse:
Just try to work on your biased mindset!

Next time you want to talk about people, try not to be easily carried along with the crowd {Exodus 23:1-2} make sure you stand out as a unique observer!

Meanwhile what do you think about the practical application of those two Bible verses. {1Corinthians 5:12-13; 2John 10-11} remember it's not written in your copy of the Bible by JWs so tell me what do you think about it?

From the thread, we learnt that JW members blocked a formal member on facebook.
I asked for a reason and you gave me these 2 scriptures.
I imagined how the world would be if every church applied same rules.
Families would be broken up. Communities would be spilt in two.
Catholics would block all protestants.
You seem to forget that Facebook isn't just about religion. There is s much we can share outside our religious beliefs.
The very same thing happened in Igbo traditional religion. That was how Osu was born.
Christianity should stand out.

Kobojunkie:
Jesus Christ never said what He did was "spiritual bathing"... Where it was recorded that a woman washed Jesus's feet with her tears, wiped it with her hair and perfumed it afterwards... Was that also spiritual bathing?

My point is that in the bible, both old and new testament, a lot of washing was done so to outrightly condemn bathing might not be right.
Naaman was comanded to bath 7 times.
Christ commanded the blind boy to wash his eyes.
Christ feet was washed and he also washed the feet of his disaples.
Hence if one is commanded by God to bath, I wouldn't see it as wrong.
If you read the scripture, you would find out that many miracles were wrought through various strange means.
The Lord something's directs us to do so called strange things.
Foe example, Jesus Christ told Peter to go and fish in other to find money to pay tax.
The Lord has his ways. Usually they are not our ways

[quote author=MaxInDHouse post=97617757]I think this question should be forwarded to the first century Christian congregation! 1Corinthians 5:12-13 compared to 2Johm 10-11
Wow... I think this is teaching religious intolerance. Hopefully the apostles did not mean that we ostracize our fellow human beings.
Learning to show love to even the hopeless sinner i's the way of Christ.
Religious intolerance has not made the world a better place
Something I have come to learn is we can justify evil practice using the scriptures.
There is so much good about JW but religious intolerance and exclusion cannot be right.

achorladey:
Even as far as don't pick a call from those disfellowshipped or communicate with them via e-mails. Ask the JWs to give you evidence. They will.

It's more like nothing should be an opportunity or excuse to communicate with a disfellowshipped or disassociated person

Ask the poster above, what is the name given to disassociated or disfellowshipped person by his taskmasters which he later brought to this platform of which creating a thread for?

If this is true, then I think they need to make major changes. Hate the sin not the sinner

iamloyalty:
He didn't block you because he was inferior. He did that because he knew you are an apostate (ex jw that were disfellowshiped due to wrong doing that refused to repent).

Don't quote me cos I don't read/reply apostates.

Please add to our knowledge. Do JW treat disfellowshiped members as outcast (Osu)?

John 13:1–17 Jesus wash the feet of his disaples .

ichuka:
Christ came during the time of the the Law,so all the miracles He performed before His Resurrection was in line with the Jewish Law,did He spit in any one eyes/asked any to go and wash in the river after His Ressuretion?or did Paul/Peter asked any of the early Christain to go and wash in the river to be clean?
Any spirit that tells a Christain to go to any river to wash inorder to be clean is simply not from God Period!!

Your point is, Jesus Christ asking a man to watch his eyes became wrong after the ressurection?
Or that because Paul and Peter did not do it, it is wrong what really is your piont.
Are we following the examples of Paul and Peter or Christ examples
When Jesus was on earth he was not about living the Jewish life. He was about living the perfect example for us to follow.
He went about doing his father's will not doing the Jewish custom.
Please let us not second guess Christ's earthly life. He did not come to live like a jew but to be the son of God

2nd kings 5. Naaman was asked to bath 7 times in river jordan.
John 9. Jesus Christ heals a blind man by commanding him to watch mud off his eyes.
I don't have an answer to your question.
Maybe there are things we don't fully understand yet

I would love to hear different opinions please.
How did the new year prophecies of 2020 shape your year and what impact will the 2021 prophecies have on your life?

pepperdemzombie:
ALL boarding schools go on one week mid term break, very obvious she didn't come for the boy. Open day, you will ask your child questions one on one about his needs then question teachers. Obviously she wasn't there too. If she had been there, this case shouldn't have degenerated into this. She should have connive with the school to get the accused red handed.
Principal was suspended because she was supposed to expel the boys earlier on, seems they were reported earlier. NOBODY caught the accused red handed and you can't just sanction someone without a vivid evidence. That's the issue. The accused now are denying, so they can't be sanctioned. The parents can sue the boy and mother if they are exposed as culprits.

My point is, this is the time for the school to do all they can for the boy and family.
They should show love and sympathy to the family.
That political open letter written by the school was needless.
A boarding house is supposed to be a second home. Kids are supposed to feel safe clearly the school failed in that.
An open apology would have shown great humility.
What happened to the boy could happen in any school and when it does it is up to the school to make amends and seek the parents forgiveness.

Obagreatdatoye:
The girl no fine at all

Its a marriage not a beauty pageant.
Marriage is for everyone, the models and the not so fine

Janosky:

Bros, This statement:
"In the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost",
Do you realize that no baptism was done in the holy Scriptures where the statement was made?

I was only quoting Jesus Christ in Matthew 28.19

VeeVeeMyLuv:
Don't mind them, with Thier stubborn human nature. With all the holy bible they have been reading, they can reason well to apologize!


And some people here are already playing DEVIL'S ADVOCATE!

It really pains me.

MaxInDHouse:
Please can you expatiate on that PURPOSE?

I thought I was clear enough. When a Christian is baptized, it is done in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost.
The 3 together work to lead all souls back to God.