₦airaland Forum

Flomidtravels: Just weird and crazy reading a blog like this on a sunday morning.....I belief this happen everywhere, we all need to be careful.. For the girl in question, its high time girls have to be careful because most time they even tend to tempt this men of God with their notice me attitude. God safe us

Of course the woman has to be the temptress. Why didn't this "man of God" resist? From her account, it looked like he was the tempter. I think he is wealthy enough to make his own bookings.

Image123: i do not agree, neither does the Bible, nor was it implied that God's flood made no difference. Making a difference is not the same as wiping away evil. At least you know that it made a difference in census

Actually, it is implied that God's flood made no difference with respect to evil. You're clearly being facetious here because we've been talking about making a difference with respect to evil. Pointing out that God killed a lot of people isn't a point in God's favour you know. Yet you laugh.

Image123: Do you think that criminals should not be punished because they would not change? please answer, you have been avoiding my questions. i'm trying to help you think. Like if you met a serial r.apist or murderer for instance, and he told you he is not going to change, or you somehow know that he is not going to change. Is it better to leave him unpunished, since it would not 'make a difference'?

I never said criminals shouldn't be jailed. Which of your questions have I been avoiding? You should first help yourself think before trying to help me. Where have I said that e.g sending someone to jail makes no difference? Your assertions here are merely based on your strawmen.

Image123: Hehehehehe, you threw back my question to me. God is good. The Bible is my base.
Psa 25:8 Good and upright is the LORD: therefore will he teach sinners in the way.
Psa 34:8 O taste and see that the LORD is good: blessed is the man that trusteth in him.
So, what is yours? BTW, good acts are relative, one man's poison may be another's food.

I know I did. This God that commands that children be killed for their parents crimes is good and just? Then you're subscribing to a perverted sense of justice but are refusing to see it.

Mine is based on moral reasoning. You've just admitted that morality is relative and cemented it with that aphorism. Based on that, God is in no position to judge since as you've pointed out, one man's poison may be another man's food.

Image123: Nope, God's plans for giving babies is not to have them killed. Someone who killS children is not fulfilling the purpose of God. God has put man(all humans) on earth to have dominion and to glorify Him. Babies are supposed to grow into godly men and women, showing forth the praises of God and fulfilling purpose. Like Jesus and Paul said, "I have finished my course". There is work to be done. It's like plucking off a fruit before it ripens so that you avoid disease and damage for the fruit. The purpose why it was planted is then defeated. It is meant to ripen and then be very useful.

How do you know that is God's plan? After all, he has had babies killed in the past and that was fulfilling his purpose. Who are you to now declare what his real purpose is? Are you God?

Image123: you implied that it is wrong to inherit things. Again you avoided my question, do you have a next of kin? Perhaps you saw what i was getting at. i said it is God's nature and character, and even nature's character, to reward children with what their parents have done, whether they did well or not. God rewarded Abraham's children for instance, for deeds Abraham did. Same goes for David, and others. These are popular and easy examples that i gave. But we know that there is a clause which i showed you in Ezekiel. If a good person's children are bad, the chain of reward is cut, and vice versa. This helps us to logically conclude that Amalek's children did not change or repent. If they did, God would have spared them. A poor man passes on poverty to his children, so also does a rich man pass on wealth to his children. If you think that is unfair, well i wonder your basis for that. But the poor man and rich man's children can still manage one way or the other to influence and change things. All through scriptures, Amalek is in bad light, busy warring with and seeking to destroy Israel. they didn't change. If you know the story well, of King Saul's encounter with them. They had a evil king Agag. He had a descendant Haman who tried to exterminate the Jews in the book of Esther.
Jdg 3:13 And he gathered unto him the children of Ammon and Amalek, and went and smote Israel, and possessed the city of palm trees.
Num 14:45 Then the Amalekites came down, and the Canaanites which dwelt in that hill, and smote them, and discomfited them, even unto Hormah.
Jdg 6:3 And so it was, when Israel had sown, that the Midianites came up, and the Amalekites, and the children of the east, even they came up against them;
Jdg 7:12 And the Midianites and the Amalekites and all the children of the east lay along in the valley like grasshoppers for multitude; and their camels were without number, as the sand by the sea side for multitude.
Jdg 10:12 The Zidonians also, and the Amalekites, and the Maonites, did oppress you; and ye cried to me, and I delivered you out of their hand.
1Sa 30:1 And it came to pass, when David and his men were come to Ziklag on the third day, that the Amalekites had invaded the south, and Ziklag, and smitten Ziklag, and burned it with fire;
1Sa 30:4 Then David and the people that were with him lifted up their voice and wept, until they had no more power to weep.

These are different instances and generations where the Amalekites were a continually pain in the neck for Israel. God was unhappy with other nations too, even with Israel, but if they repented, He always forgave them. So, they inherited a debt of punishment from previous generations, and they themselves were wicked, Agag their king being chief. They were not the innocent folk you portrayed them as. They had long being under watch before their punishment came.

Frankly it looks like you're not even reading what I'm writing while you ask irrelevant questions. Where did I imply that it was wrong to inherit objects? Which question did I avoid? Does having a next of kin mean that this next of kin can be killed if I commit a crime? It looks like you're the one who is merely confused about what is at stake here.

Let me state it clearly. Inheriting objects is different from punishing one person for the crimes of their parents. Or to rephrase, inheriting a shoe is different from a 6 month old baby being killed because their father killed another person. Hopefully, you can see the difference between these two events.

Image123: See, you said NO. You realise the difference between a judge/executioner and other humans in serving judgment. But you refused to see the difference between God(the Judge of the whole earth) and every other person.
Like i've explained to you, God did not just kill them for what their ancestors did, but for what they themselves did. And with the foreknowlegde and omniscience that they were due for judgement and hopeless.

I said no because your question was irrelevant to what is being discussed. What has a 6 month old baby done that it deserves to be killed? That is the question you're supposed to answer. Claiming that God decided that with his foreknowledge and omniscience means we can also question whether or not God actually wanted the other numerous genocides to occur. Otherwise you're merely making a fallacious argument from ignorance. If you do not know why God ordered that these children be killed, then you cannot say that he gave that order for a good reason.

Image123: i have also emphatically told you that God would not say so?

How do you know he won't say so? He has said so in the past. Or has God changed?

Image123: i have explained to you that He is not bound in the sense that He is Judge. just like the Judge is not bound in punishing an offender, as other citizens may be bound.

For a judge to be just, he is bound by the concept of justice. For a person to be moral, he is bound by the concept of morality. Judges are in fact bound to be just. That is why we can say that a certain judge's actions are unjust or immoral.

mrlycan: I am a member of Coza. I have been attending for over 6 years and a worker. For someone to come up with this kind of writeup,then she must be good. If you are a worker,to see reverend B is not that easy let alone have all the access to him and in his hotel. Ok,listen to this. I believe this girl must have been paid to do this job but she fumbled in one of her sentences. Since the inception of our new base in Abuja,we have not had a second service. Its always a one service sunday. Help me ask her where she attended her second service. Ask anyone who is a member. She did not do her homework very well. I have seen neighbouring churches luring our organist and drummer to leave coza and join them with the hope of getting paid monthly. We have one of the best instrumentalist and they work for.God for free. Pure envy and hatred. With so much been said abouy Rev B been the proud type. I once ushered.with some workers where he went to preach to a congregation of less than 100. He has been to bahamas,france,uk,US. If he will fall for flesh,he wont do it with a member ,not alone a worker. He can order for d best of ladies. What everyone sees is that his fame is soaring like virus. My message for Walter Ese,your generarions will suffer for this you have done. Its not a curse.

Why shouldn't the instrumentalists be paid? Isn't the church getting money? Isn't the pastor getting paid? Do you think that his extensive travels (yet unable to pay instrumentalists) means that he hasn't been doing the same thing in all those places? After all, you may be right in that he may not have been having these affairs with workers in his church.

For some reason, rather than people like you to actually ask questions, you automatically believe that because this man claims to be a pastor sent by God, then he surely cannot do any wrong.

Where were these carriages made? And can Nigeria produce them?

As usual, many refuse to blame the pastor. At least the lady wasn't married but he was.

frosbel: Any Pastor who lives in luxury and opulence while his church members are broke and struggling to make two ends meet, is in great danger of damnation.

A Pastor who flies in a private Jet worth millions , while a church mother cannot afford to feed her kids has lost the plot and might be a charlatan.

Any Pastor who lives in a mansion worth millions , while a father in the church cannot pay his house rent and bills has to be a charlatan.

Any Pastor who calls poverty a disease instead of an opportunity to do charity is a crook.

Any Pastor who preaches on Money more than any other subject is definitely a crook.

Any Pastor who abuses , bullies and intimates his broke members because they cannot pay tithes should be arrested and charged with extortion.

Any pastor who keeps the books to himself and team , despite the money belonging to the church members, should be asked to show transparency in all matters of finance , if he refuses, he should be investigated for fraud.

Any Pastor who asks you to hope for Money instead of working for Money is a rogue.

Any Pastor who is close friends to politicians and dubious business men is a compromiser and Demas.


Be warned !!

I can't help but agree with frosbel on this one.
The scales and beams must fall from the eyes of believers to enable them assess the deeds of these so called prophets and ministers.

A comatose man is said to be fully resurrected. How does this make any sense?

If this man somehow magically regained his strength and declared that God had spoken to him and he was now the final prophet sent by God to save the world, would he be believed?

Image123: Like it or not, i am only trying to help you.God is not on trial. i have not, neither do i intend to say " God just wanted to kill a lot of people despite the fact that it won't do anything about evil. i.e he wanted to kill people for the sake of killing them." You are imagining things. It is neither according to the Bible or me. You are yet to show the basis for your unguarded statements. You can't just say that i am the base, or the Bible is the base. You will do well to SHOW how.

I've already shown you what you and the Bible are saying. You both agree that God killing all those people won't make a difference yet he did it anyway. That is just God being an uncaring killer.

Image123: You can always ask questions instead of making idle assumptions. What is good, and what is your base for your definition of good?

What is good and what is your own basis for your idea of good?

Image123: i did not understand how your OP relates to anything, neither did i know what i am expected to do with it.

It shows that according to your God and the ideas you're presenting here, someone who kills children is an altruist.

Image123: i'll say again "Children get to inherit something from the parents, whether good or evil, in form of genotype, heredity, behavioural traits, strengths and weakness, and some physical property, parent's name."
You were telling us that it is wrong to inherit things whether good or evil, and that your generation knows it is wrong. i have simply shown you how normal and real it remains to inherit. Do you have a next of kin? i need an answer please.

I didn't say it was wrong to inherit things, I said it is wrong to deliberately punish children for their parents crimes. e.g it is wrong to kill a 6 month old child because their father killed someone else.

Image123: If an executioner kills a murderer under judgement, would it be right for anyone on the street to do the same to the murderer? a yes or no would help.

No but this is irrelevant. Let me make it even simpler. I said if God is killing children for what their parents did, why is it wrong for humans to kill children for what their parents did?

Image123: Actually, you are the one confusing God's judgement with human depravity. i am simply showing how you cannot ALWAYS tie down every action as good/evil. An action may be cheating, or it may be studying for an exam, or simply learning. It is the same action, but having different perspectives based on the TIME that the action is carried out. You do not have to be narrow minded as to box it under being subjective. i have said that children do suffer or enjoy from the actions of their parents. That is reality, that is the way the world works. What you need to do is not feel cheated, but work in a way that the rules favour you. Know the time that you are in, and work with it. Like in a soccer game, there is a time to score in the left goal post. If you score in the same goal post 50mins after the match begins, it will not be counted the same way. You can begin to argue about subjectivity or objectivity or play by the rules to win. You can score a goal after the whistle has been blown, and it would be illegitimate.i have said that God judged those folks by killing their children and it is not wrong, because it is God. Would the same God kill in the same way today? NO. This is clearly stated in His Word. this is what i have said,get your acts together.

I'm sorry but all you're showing here is that you have no idea of what the discussion on morality is. You're basically saying that it is right to kill a group of children if God says so.

Image123: He is a being, but not a human being. You can only know as far as you know, i guess it is not far enough.God is not bound like a human being is, much like a police man/judge is not bound like every other citizen. The judge has authority to do things that others cannot do. others cannot take the law into their hands.This is supposed to be like basic knowledge, how do you manage not to get it?

What I'm wondering is how you manage not to understand what the idea of morality entails. You say God is a person who is moral but isn't bound by the idea of morality. This is just self contradictory because for him to be moral, it means that he is bound by the ideas of morality.

Uyi Iredia: Begging the question. So you say God is evil, despite his good because you can, or as you say, because that is how we you judge people's character. What is the basis for this judgement of the things God did ? You'll note that this just rehashes my former posers. Umm, do you judge yourself that way (as evil for doing evil things). By your logic, of course, a very good person who does something bad is bad. 5 evil people, sure: thehomer, Alfa Seltzer, Evil Brain, Satan and Westley Allen. Now why do I have a sneaky feeling you'll pick the first one down ?

The basis is what God did according to the Bible. If I did what God did then yes I would judge myself that way. According to your own ideas here, are these people actually evil if they do something good?

Uyi Iredia: Well r@pi$t murderers can change, moreso since they weren't born rapist murderers, of course this is debatable. I think you naively polarize God's morality and deem it evil, despite clear distinctions like whether God is a human that can be charged to court. Could you summarize why your case that God is evil is the more reasonable stance ? Ladies first. I'll answer next.

The court doesn't determine what is moral. Or do you wish to make that argument?
I already summarized it in my OP. It is simply the fact that this God of yours commanded a genocide. He specifically ordered that his minions go out and deliberately kill children. People who order others to commit heinous crimes like deliberately killing children are evil people. If you agree they're evil people, then I really don't see what argument you're trying to make.

Uyi Iredia: Not some good acts, since, within the Christian worldview, all good we experience in life is as a result of God's creation, your claim is flawed, not to mention I haven't made a claim as regards ALL mass murderers. Your answer once again begs the question my question was 'Why is God said to be evil despite His good ?'
Yes, he commanded evil and he is judged for it, the question is why is he judged for this evil despite his good.

Because that is how we judge people's characters. If you disagree, can you name 5 evil people? And I will show you that based on what you're saying here, you would consider them to be good people. What we then end up with is you saying that there are actually no evil people since those evil people were good to at least one other person.

Uyi Iredia: I am arguing to see if you can defend your stance of dismissing God as evil, and unworthy of worship. Now if this murderer, is a very good and kind person who happens to have killed 20 kids, why will you say he is evil ? If a very bad person, a daredevil robber, rapist and killer, repents and does good, why will one say such a person is good ?

That's just it. We will say it is a bad person that is now doing something good not that the rapist murderer is now a good person.

Uyi Iredia: Why is God said to be evil despite his good ? So far you've not questioned the good things I ascribed to him.

That is because we judge people's characters based on the evil they do. He is said to be evil because of the heinous evil he has commanded otherwise according to you, all mass murderers should be considered as being good because they did some good acts to some people. Are you willing to defend such a claim?

Uyi Iredia: I see. So why shouldn't the muderer be called a good person ? If he happens to be a very kind father and husband and very polite otherwise to other people, is murder sufficient to write him off as evil ? Claiming that God is bad for his murders makes no more sense than a good wife who ends up killing her little children is bad.

Here it looks like you're just arguing for the sake of argument. A murderer goes out and kills 20 children but because he provides his children with three square meals you're seriously willing to defend his character as being a good person?

Image123: i would not exactly call what i am doing "defending God". Defended from what? i'm trying to help you understand. Now, i didn't say God didn't want to wipe out evil, he just wanted to kill a lot of people knowing that it won't make a difference. You said that.
in your prior deduction, you had deduced sanely that
" According to the Bible in Genesis 6, God wanted to kill all animals and people because "the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time". You managed to deduce that. Now you come up to tell me that i am saying. Where have i said? i am getting you to think, but you seem so lazy, you run off to your vomit asap. You have been unable to show us your base or foundation for uttering crass statements that God didn't know that His actions would not wipe out evil. You first tried making the Bible your base, now me? Mba, not your lucky day.

What you're doing is defending God whether you like it or not. Well what exactly are you saying? According to the Bible, and you if you accept it, what you're saying is that God just wanted to kill a lot of people despite the fact that it won't do anything about evil. i.e he wanted to kill people for the sake of killing them. If you're saying something else, I've not seen it on this thread.

Image123: Rubbish, you say He is bad/evil because you grew up with Him, right? you can use the Bible as proof, but i can't? Your lack of a moral base is indeed not helping you.

Rubbish. Would you say that someone who commands 10 soldiers to go out and kill 100 children is good? Have you considered that the Bible doesn't actually know what good is? After all, you'll say that killing people for changing their religion today is bad but if it were done on God's command, it is good.

Image123: Just saw your thread, couldn't really make head or tail of the first page, sorry.

What did you find confusing in my first post there? Or are you just unable to deal with well laid out arguments?

Image123: Well, that's reality staring you in the face, so deal with it. It's all over nature. Children get to inherit something from the parents, whether good or evil, in form of genotype, heredity, behavioural traits, strengths and weakness, and some physical property, parent's name. People get help because of their father's name, or what the father/mother had done for the benefactor in time past. It happens all the time. Humans are not islands, others actions affect them one way or the other. if you think that is unfair or evil, mars is available and uninhabited.

Is evil inherited genetically? Is that what makes it right to kill the 6 month old child of a killer because their father killed someone? You really must be joking.

Image123: Don't outrun yourself. Are you God? i have severally explained context to you. If an executioner takes life, it is not murder. If i take life, it is murder. And even life has context as taking the life of an insect is different from that of a human. Even taking the life of a chicken, it would depend on if i own it or not before it can be considered right or wrong. So, there are many factors and context to be considered. It's not just a bigoted and narrow thinking of just the action of 'taking a life'.

Stop confusing yourself. If God killing children because their parents did something wrong is good, then there should be nothing wrong for humans to do the same. Saying otherwise means you have no idea of morality.

Image123: no no no. Read again, i gave you the illustrations to inform.remind you that some questions may not best be answered with just yes or no. Some actions are not good all the time or wrong all the time. Perspective, time, and context have to be taken note of.
If i have an exam in one hours time, jotting and reading from my note is okay before and after the exam. The same action of jotting and reading from my note is not okay during the exam. If you name that subjective morality, well. I've also given you the judge/executioner and the common man scenario to help you see why you cannot only base right or wrong on just action but you need to consider context and time. i once told you how in some street, motor bikes are not allowed between 8pm and 7am for instance. The action of riding through that particular street could be okay or could be a crime/offence, depending on time. Expanding the context might even produce why it would be okay for a policeman at all times, and yet an offence for the common man. These are instances of fellow humans even, not to mention God your Creator.

You simply don't have any idea of what you're talking about. You're confusing cheating with studying for an exam. What you're trying to say is that morality is subjective. Once again, understand what I'm saying and what you're saying. I'm saying killing children for the crimes of their parents is wrong. You're saying it is sometimes okay to kill children for the crimes of their parents.

Image123: You bound Him? God is not a human being like you, do i still have to say that yet again?

Is he a person or not because as far as I know, all people are bound by morality.

Uyi Iredia: Read properly. I said no then stated that your question is what I implied initially.

What question is being begged?

Uyi Iredia: To the question: No. Given your criteria, why would you castigate those who judge God as good for the best he has done ? They are applying their subjectivity as much as you and as such all WE are left with is arbitrary opinions on the morality or not of God.

In case you've not been following this thread, those supporting this God are saying that what he did is good. Since you've said that what he did is evil, what exactly is your point here? Claiming that the "best" he's done means he is good makes no more sense than saying that the murderer who kills 20 children while ensuring that his own children have three square meals a day is actually a good person. Would you say that such a murderer is a good person?

Image123: Hopefully, you understand that the statement "God wanted to kill all animals and people because "the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time" IS DIFFERENT FROM "God wanted to kill all animals and people because He wanted to wipe out evil". To help you two steps forward, it was a measure of punishment/judgement. You can also compare it to an amputation of a degenerating sore part of the body.

This is the sort of empty response I've come to expect from people defending this God. You're saying God didn't want to wipe out evil, he just wanted to kill a lot of people knowing that it won't make a difference.

Image123: i didn't just say that God is good, the Bible says so. That is what is right before our eyes, which you ironically failed to see. As to God killing children for the crimes of their parents, it has a multifaceted defence. God is their Owner and has all the right, moral and legal, to do what He deems fit with them. God in His omniscience can choose to kill someone as young and innocent, hence saving him from an eternity in hell, than have such person grow up to inflict pain to many and glorify evil worse than his progenitors. Take some measure to educate yourself on God's character using this passage below please.
Eze 18:2 What mean ye, that ye use this proverb concerning the land of Israel, saying, The fathers have eaten sour grapes, and the children's teeth are set on edge?
Eze 18:3 As I live, saith the Lord GOD, ye shall not have occasion any more to use this proverb in Israel.
Eze 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
Eze 18:14 Now, lo, if he beget a son, that seeth all his father's sins which he hath done, and considereth, and doeth not such like,
Eze 18:17 That hath taken off his hand from the poor, that hath not received usury nor increase, hath executed my judgments, hath walked in my statutes; he shall not die for the iniquity of his father, he shall surely live.
Eze 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
Eze 18:21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.
Eze 18:22 All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live.
Eze 18:23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live?
Eze 18:32 For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn yourselves, and live ye.

Also, if you would study God, you would consider that He blesses/rewards the child for the father's goodness. Is this right in your eyes? Should a son be honoured or rewarded for his father's goodness?

And you agree with the Bible so you also say he is good because you've read it in the Bible. Based on your response here, you should see this thread I created on killing children in order to save them from hell. Since we're asserting ownership, then I declare that Zeus owns everyone and everything.

No the son should be honoured for what he does not for what his father did so your God is still wrong on that. Even we mere humans have figured that out.

Image123: Nope. He owns me and my suit. He owns the whole world.

If I do it it is wrong if God does it, it is right. Therefore if God commands you to kill 10 children, it is the right thing to do.

Image123: No, i did not say that there are no objectively right or wrong actions. i said that some actions may be considered right at a time, and may be considered wrong at other times.i gave you the illustrations to inform.remind you that some questions may not best be answered with just yes or no. Some actions are not good all the time or wrong all the time. Perspective, time, and context have to be taken note of. God is not a man like you.

Saying that something was morally right before but morally wrong now means morality is subjective. Saying that if God does something and it is right but if someone does it, it is wrong, means that such an action is not objectively moral or immoral. You need to get these ideas clear in your mind. Sure you say God is not a man but according to you believers, he is a person and people are bound by morality.

Logicboy03: The Homer has really suffered. Arguing with 3 dummies that hate to reason and use logic.

Just even look at your reply. Nonsensical.

"Evil people are unworthy of worship"
^^^^
The above quote is what you have a problem with. How foolish. How can you even argue against a very simple fact? You must have your brain on temporary suspension or something

You see what I have to endure just to show them the ridiculousness of their ideas.

Uyi Iredia: Your first reply begs the question. Unworthy presumes an evil that needs explanation in the question (of contadiction) I asked. To your poser: No, I don't but that itself even begs the question I'm asking.

You've started running round in circles again. Is someone who commands the killing of children for the crimes of their parents evil or not?

Uyi Iredia: You are skilled at turning questions back at opponents whilst being woefully lazy at answering. In any case being good stems ONLY from conscious mind, what is deemed good is a matter of one's arbitration. That said, why do you ignore God's good, you didn't deny them_sensibly_so I wonder whether you factor it in b4 concluding God is evil.

Once again, you come with your childish snide remarks making me wonder whether you're fit for serious conversation. If that is how you'll continue on this thread, I'll just leave you rather than sinking to your level.
My answer there won't be as helpful as yours if you actually know what you're talking about. Note that I'm inviting you to apply whatever notion of good you wish to use in defending this God because he obviously doesn't fit mine.
What you're saying means that goodness is subjective and based on one's judgement. If that is your position, that is fine. But based on that position and your own judgement, do you think that someone who orders the killing of children is good?
You're wondering why I focus on God's evil rather than what you consider to be the good he's done? Well that is how I judge character. I judge it based on the worst that someone has done.

Image123: You ask if i do not ead my bible. Are you insinuating that you saw ths your claim in the bible? You are being shy oh, don't be shy. Just tell us where you saw this your claim, what is your base or foundation for it, or is it baseless and unfounded?

According to the Bible here:

NIV Genesis 6: 5 The Lord saw how great the wickedness of the human race had become on the earth, and that every inclination of the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time. 6 The Lord regretted that he had made human beings on the earth, and his heart was deeply troubled. 7 So the Lord said, “I will wipe from the face of the earth the human race I have created—and with them the animals, the birds and the creatures that move along the ground—for I regret that I have made them.”

God wanted to kill all animals and people because "the thoughts of the human heart was only evil all the time".

Image123: As to your confusion, God is not a man. He is the owner of every man and has the right to do to each as He pleases. How that is so hard to understand for you is stunning. If you took your best suit and burnt it or even wore it, nobody will question you . But if i took your best suit and burnt it or even wore it, that would be a crime with multiple charges. Same action but the difference is ownership. What God can do without fault, you or me might do and its wrong.

Once again, you're failing to see what is right before your eyes. You say God is good. Yet we see him killing children for the crimes of their parents. Is that what good people do?

If God took your best suit and burnt it or gave it to someone else to wear, would that be a crime?

Image123: Another instance is time. An action may be right or wrong depending on time.The same action of asking my friends may be a wrong action that can result in failure or expulsion if done during some 2hour examination period. Sleeping is right, but it is wrong in the office. S.ex is good but there are some people that you cannot have it with, like family. When one has a moral base, all these are better understood, unlike thehomer who lacks a moral base. ALL of God's actions remain good having been done at the times that they were done, and not shying away from the fact that He has clearly given us a certain code and standard for this time.

I hope you realize that what you're saying here is that there are no objectively right or wrong actions. Since according to you there are no objectively right or wrong actions, then neither you nor God is in a position to judge anyone.

truthislight: Which part of that post ^ is not understandable or incomprehensible

Is it the scriptural references or what ?

Can someone help me out hear ? Maybe, just maybe, i am extremely slow. I need help !

Take the time to read what I actually wrote about your post. I said it was rambling. If you wanted to be serious, you should have simply given a summary rather than just rambling.

Bidam: Lol,why are you hyperventilating over this guy.If God does not come down to answer his questions,no one can.

Did God come down and answer your questions? Or did you just believe what you were told?

Image123: There you go again. You made a presumptuous fallacy, i just answered your question. You didn't like my answer neither are you happy. And you are yet to tell us the basis for your assumption. i'm almost certain you'll go again like a robot to ask what assumption? So much for free thinking, more of cheap thinking imho. Did God appear to you in your nightmare to tell you that His purpose was to wipe out evil? Have you not been hasty as is your hobby?

What is wrong with you people? Don't you read your Bible? If his purpose wasn't to wipe out evil, what then was the purpose of him simply killing everyone except Noah and his family? Did he do it just for the fun of it?

Image123: I've just shown you two instances in the bible that state that God is good. It shocked you so much that you called it rubbish and the result of drunkeness. Obviously, you do not want to hear anything else. It is rubbish when the Bible says God is good, but it is perfect and full proof when passages like the OP are presented. You need a life, your faith is being misused.

And I've shown you instances of that God simply killing people for crimes he knew they didn't commit. Do good people kill others for crimes they didn't commit? Yes the Bible says God is good. It also says sacrificing your child to God is good, it says killing someone for picking sticks on the Sabbath is good, it says killing someone for changing their religion is good. Do you think killing people for those actions is a good thing to do? That is what you need to first think through before wailing that God is good because it was written in the Bible.

An excellent piece.

Uyi Iredia: Why ?

Because evil people are unworthy of worship. Or do you think evil people are worthy of worship?

Uyi Iredia: He does good eg giving life, beauty, wealth etc >>> BTW, what does it mean to be good ? >>> Try to answer the question without resorting to circularity.

Why don't you tell me what it means to be good? After all, you're the one trying to defend the one who gave the command while you're at it, let me know how his command to kill children meets that idea.

Logicboy03: Enigma and co, are just spouting crap out of butthurt....probably because they see a growing atheism on Nairaland.

It is really unsurprising that they're in so much pain. They're used so used to just having their beliefs accepted that any challenge looks like oppression.

@ truthislight

I really don't see the point of your rambling. Please try to write concise responses.

Image123: Mr rigmarole, the onus is on you. You have been told to show why your statement that God "didn't know drowning everyone except Noah and his crew won't end evil" has a base or foundation. Don't be shy. Tell us why? Did you read it somewhere, or you heard it in a dram, or it dropped from your mouth? Why do you claim that God know that drowning everyone except Noah and his crew won't end evil? i want to know your reason or support for such a statement, else it remains unfounded and baseless. As to your question, the answer is a big YES. Now do the honour of answering/telling us your basis, before further questions.

What is wrong with you? Are you high? Or just drunk? Did you read my previous posts? You're confirming that God knew his flood won't wipe out evil so why did he then send the flood? You've just demonstrated the sort of God you worship. You worship one who knows his actions will fail and cause lots of suffering with its failure but he goes on to do it anyway. What a joke both of you are.

Image123: Do you speak french? i just explained how you are not interested in hearing. When you say that it is a bad idea to try to get you to appeal to God's laws, it means your mind is already made up. i do not know what you mean by "destroyed every single response", perhaps its a phrase for saying that you have quoted every response of mine. You sound as childish as logicb, who comes and says stuff like "debunk" like that is a punctuation mark. God is good all the time, do you need scriptures that say that, so that you can say you have been shown?
Psa 34:8 O taste and see that the LORD is good: blessed is the man that trusteth in him.
Psa 118:1 O give thanks unto the LORD; for he is good: because his mercy endureth forever.
i doubt that you are happy now.

You just have to be smoking weed and crack while drinking 3 litres of 100 proof vodka to be spouting the sort of rubbish I'm reading here. Please wait until you're fully detoxed so you can write a more sensible response.

As usual, there's nothing of relevance from the faith heads flooding this thread.

Uyi Iredia: Would God be God if he is held accountable to His actions whether he contradicted them or not ?

He would be unworthy of worship.

Uyi Iredia: @ OP: God is good in spite of the patent evil he has done, does, or will do.

Then you're merely confused with regards to what it means to be good. If someone keeps on perpetrating evil, why would you say he is good?

Until trains connect that part of Lagos, things will remain difficult.

Image123: of course, the baseless assumption is the number 3, don't yu think?

Obviously, you're the one not thinking.

Since you think it is a baseless assumption, please answer this simple question. Did God know that drowning everyone except Noah and his crew will not end evil? Please answer with a yes or no.

Image123: i was being general about the red herring, not referring to any in particular but to your penchant. When you say, ' trying to get you to appeal to God's laws is not a good idea', then what is the purpose of inviting anyone? The statement shows you are only interested in being heard, you are not interested in hearing. Playing the pity card would not suffice.

How am I not interested in hearing? So far, I've destroyed every single response you've posted. And I suspect that is why you've now shifted to whining and crying about hearing and being heard. If you're unable to show how your God is good with what the Bible says he has done, then don't blame me, blame your God or the Bible.

Image123: You said "God has foresight and hindsight yet he didn't know that drowning everyone except Noah and his crew won't end evil."
Such statement is said to be wild and unfounded and an assumption when it is poorly thought out, overwhelmed by emotion, not supported by evidence or fact, and a conjecture/guess without proof. i am still waiting for your proof for this baseless assumption.

What was the baseless assumption?
1. That God has foresight?
2. That God has hindsight?
3. That he didn't know drowning everyone except Noah and his crew won't end evil?

Image123: okay, i recall you actually started the thread. Your penchant for red herrings is really affecting you. You tend to pull out some stuff from nowhere that we now have to discuss and settle, while we leave what we were actually discussing. Now, here you are telling us in other words that you are not here to discuss or accept anything other than your views. You are only here to show us/shove your views on us. It's not a good idea to show you that your OP is wrong. Now, what more do you want to be said?

How is it a red herring to show through the Bible the fact that your God is not moral? What exactly did I pull from nowhere? I'm not shoving anything on you. You're welcome to ignore this thread. I won't print it out and leave it in your room. Neither will I send it to your e-mail account. If you're afraid of really discovering your God, please say so and avoid this thread.

Mr anony: In what ways exactly are His laws immoral?

From my OP

NIV: NIV 1 Samuel 15:

1 Samuel said to Saul, “I am the one the Lord sent to anoint you king over his people Israel; so listen now to the message from the Lord.

2 This is what the Lord Almighty says: ‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt.

3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy[a] all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”

They're immoral because it is immoral to kill children and infants for the crimes of their parents.

Your turn. Is it moral to kill children and infants for the crimes of their parents?

GeneralShepherd: I am a christian,I find it Ridiculous to say God is objectively good. He is God he can do as He likes doesn't make Him good. My 2kobo

Fine. But why would you want to worship such a capricious God?